From: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (aml-list-digest) To: aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: aml-list-digest V1 #576 Reply-To: aml-list Sender: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-aml-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk aml-list-digest Thursday, January 17 2002 Volume 01 : Number 576 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 01:37:05 -0700 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [AML] Roger ZELAZNY, _Damnation Alley_ (Review) Kumiko wrote: > Reviewed by Preston Hunter So how do you get "Kumiko" out of "Preston Hunter"? > _Damnation Alley_ is probably not Roger Zelazny's most widely read novel. > Among SF/F readers Zelazny's classic Hugo-winning novels _This Immortal_ > (previously titled _. . . And Call Me Conrad_) and _Lord of Light_ are more > widely read. I've only read a limited number of Zelazny books. Among them, _Lord of Light_ was best. It's an exciting adventure romp mixed in with some very clever religious treatment, in this case, Hinduism. _Doorways in the Sand_ was my second favorite, with another well-constructed Zelazny character. _Isle of the Dead_ was also pretty good. _Damnation Alley_ so so, nothing special. (The movie was horrendous.) I hated _This Immortal_. Why it won a Hugo I'll never understand--it bored me to tears. - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 08:19:54 -0700 From: Kathy Fowkes Subject: Re: [AML] Annual Movie Tabulation On Wed, 09 Jan 2002 14:19:25 -0700 "Eric R. Samuelsen" writes: > SAW AGAINST MY BETTER JUDGMENT > Pearl Harbor (Mindbendingly predictable plot, utterly uninteresting > characters, a complete travesty historically. About the only thing > it had going for it was that the actual attack was pretty cool > looking, if you can live with yourself for being entertained by a > reenacted massacre. And then it had to give us a nice jingoistic > semi-happy ending. Worst movie of the decade.) It isn't a "this year" movie, but just on the basis of worst movie of the decade, my vote is on Titanic. Far worse than Pearl Harbor, for possibly all the same reasons you're disgusted with PH. Kathy Fowkes Mesa, AZ ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 13:07:29 -0800 From: "Richard R. Hopkins" Subject: Re: [AML] Annual Movie Tabulation True, and Commodus was the son of Marcus Aurelius. Richard Hopkins - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Parkin" To: Sent: Monday, January 14, 2002 7:12 PM Subject: Re: [AML] Annual Movie Tabulation > Eric R. Samuelsen wrote: > > >>>Okay, there was no actual Roman emporer with the unfortunate name of > Commodus...<<< > > Actually, there was. But his history is quite different than the one > presented in the film. Right time, right job. Very different situation. > > For what it's worth. > > Scott Parkin > > > > > > -- > AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature > - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 13:27:40 -0700 From: "Peter E. Chamberlain" Subject: RE: [AML] Ayn RAND, _Atlas Shrugged_ I read this book while riding the bus to my first job out of college. At the time I was dealing with the Federal Highway Administration (FHWA). I had requested some design information on a disk in order to speed up my estimating process. We were able to use the information on disk with a new computer program that we had purchased. I was told by the government representative that I would not be given the disk because it would be unfair to the others that did not have the same program. It proved to me just how true the theme of Atlas Shrugged was, even seventy years later. As a confirmed and rabid capitalist, I loved Atlas Shrugged as well as Fountainhead and Anthem. Peter Chamberlain Senior Estimator Westcon Microtunneling 800 South Main Pleasant Grove, UT 84062 Pchamberlain@westcon.net - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 20:54:12 GMT From: cgileadi@emerytelcom.net Subject: RE: [AML] Life in Mormon Culture Jacob writes: Certainly people exist who cling fast to what they know never looking for what they don't. That's sad, but hardly universal and probably not even wide-spread in the church. My experience has taught me otherwise. I've lived in Utah most of my life (came here at 17) and most Mormons I've met assume that we have THE truth, that every question can be nicely answered within that truth. Even with the inactive? Jack? what do you call them? Mormons I deal with every day in my work, they still struggle with the possible immorality of having a Tarot reading! Or a psychic reading. They feel they can't because early in their lives, they had a patriarchal blessing! I suggest to them that there are many avenues to a good outcome. As a fledgling "sidekick" (that's what my kids call me--I do medical intuitive work sometimes), I KNOW that there is much information outside the pat answers. I imagine that an ideal society, a Zion society, embraces much much more than what we cling to as Mormon culture. I imagine that our understanding of doctrine is fractional compared to what doctrine is in the eternities. And lately I've been trying to imagine--as in fiction--how to write about that stuff. It would be a dynamite book. Cathy Wilson - --------------------------------------------- This message was sent using Endymion MailMan. http://www.endymion.com/products/mailman/ - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 15:57:51 -0500 From: "Quinn Warnick" Subject: Re: [AML] Reading Programs Jana Remy wrote: | Pick up a copy of Clifton Fadiman's _Lifetime Reading Plan_. A warning about Fadiman's _Lifetime Reading Plan_: If you try to buy this book, you'll likely find _The New Lifetime Reading Plan_, cowritten with John Major (not the former British Prime Minister). Fadiman's original _Lifetime Reading Plan_ (published in the 1950s) is now out of print, but definitely worth finding. The newer version includes authors and books from around the globe, while the original version sticks to the Western tradition. Depending on what you're looking for in a reading plan, I can see the value in both books. But I think the new edition eliminates some great books in favor of increasing the diversity of cultures and authors. It took me a few months to find a copy of the original in good condition (check eBay and Amazon), but the wait was well worth it. My wife and I are both trying to plow through Fadiman's selections. We keep reminding ourselves that this is, after all, a *lifetime* plan... Quinn Warnick - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 15:02:57 -0700 From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: [AML] re: Life in Mormon Culture >I >just wish Sunstone and the AML had youth programs . . . " >What a great idea! I'm serious. How about a youth chapter of the AML? = >We >really ought to be doing more to encourage our young people to >consume = and >produce quality literature. This is a great idea. Right now, I'm teaching playwriting and screenwritin= g at BYU, and sometimes we get talking about LDS culture, and I'll suggest = to them that they read some good LDS literature. And they don't know what = I'm talking about. So this semester, I'm assigning them to read and = report on an LDS novel. If they won't do it voluntarily. . .=20 Eric Samuelsen - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 15:04:53 -0700 From: "Paris Anderson" Subject: Re: [AML] _Don Quixote_ (was: Must-Read Lists) > not to dispute what Paris said about it being the first one, but ya'll > should read _Tales of Genji_ for exactly the same reason). I made this claim because Don Quixote was the first novel that contained a protagonist that grew and changed through the action of the novel/ Don Quixote starts out as a philanthropic dreamer who believes the vain imaginations of his heart. He is a noble warrior who believes in the goodness--and spark of divinity--that exist in ALL people (an evolved consciousness). In the end he is a crushed man who no longer believes in others and much less in himself. Cervantes also creates secondary characters that grow and change--Sancho Panza and Dulcinea. Perhaps, we have the beginnings of an e-rumble. Nothing civilized--OK. Paris Anderson - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 13:05:43 -0800 From: Julie Kirk Subject: [AML] Odd Nerdrum Art Show For the interest of anyone in the LA Basin who has a fondness for contemporary figurative art, I thought I would post to the list that Odd Nerdrum is having a show at the Forum Gallery at 8069 Beverly Blvd. The opening is this Friday, Jan. 18, I believe from 6pm to 8 pm. For those of you not familiar with the Forum - This is probably the foremost figurative gallery in the country. Up until last fall they only had the gallery in NY, but finally opened one in L.A. - so that says something about the strength of figurative art, and the people who love it, out here in the "out of NY, NY art scene" west coast. All of us outsiders were thrilled. They represent some really incredible artists right on the cutting edge of realism and figurative work. And for those of you not familiar with Odd Nerdrum - well, if you do not like dark and disturbing, save yourself the trip. However, for the record, I will state that he is simply one of the best artists in the world technique-wise, that an entire generation of figurative painters have been influenced by what he does and so in that wise, he does hold some importance. I'll admit, I keep the Nerdrum books on the shelf when I have church people over to visit (my husband really blew this on time though, and now I have no clue what the rest of the YW presidency thinks of me), but I love the sense of isolation and beauty in his paintings. He is from Norway, still lives and paints there, strongly inspired by the landscape of Iceland, and artistic inspirations would be derived from Caravaggio, Rembrandt and Goya (his Pinturas Negras) to name a few. I find inspiration in what he does because his painting is so much about the natural state of man, the overcoming of isolation and living in a hostile environment - the themes I work with now are more hitting on the eternal nature of man, the idea of foreordination and our strengths and failings, of why we make the choices we do and their long term consequences, and how we figure out who we are and what roles we play. It should be a good show - it runs until Feb. 23. There is more info on the gallery and the artists they represent at http://www.forumgallery.com Julie - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 15:15:09 -0700 From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: [AML] Re: Moulin Rouge (was: Annual Movie Tabulation) Re: Sex in Moulin Rouge >Then my 17 year old daughter said some of her friends from school >saw it and they said there was so much sex in it it was overwhelming >(remember, this is coming from a 17 year old - but it did make me kind of >think I wouldn't bother). >So, maybe I'll see it at some point. But what did you guys think? What I >mean is, did you think the merit outweighed the sex scenes, or do you = >think >the 17 year olds overreacted. =20 Depends on what you mean by sex. If by sex, we mean naked writhing = bodies, then there isn't any. If by sex, we mean people in love, that's = the whole movie. If by sex, we mean suggested sexual activity, well . . . Moulin Rouge is basically Camille. Beautiful doomed courtesan in love = with struggling artist. She thinks True Love is a luxury she can't = afford; sex is bought and sold. He thinks that without True Love, life = isn't worth living. He's right, she's wrong, she admits it, and then she = dies. Heroically, of consumption. (Consumption be done about it? Of = cough, of cough.) There's a scene where he goes to see her, and she thinks he's her latest = client. She's trying to be as provocative as possible, and since it's = Nicole Kidman, that's pretty provocative. But he wins her over (by = singing an Elton John tune!), and it ends innocently. There are Folies = Bergere style song and dance numbers with lots of sexy dancing; again, no = nudity and the music, you come to realize in astonishment, includes = Nirvana's Smell's Like Teen Spirit, and Madonna's Material Girl. (This, = in a movie set at the turn of the century). Again, though, Ewan McGregor's= wide eyed innocence trumps it all.=20 That's why I love Moulin Rouge. Like 19th century melodrama, it's = completely, unabashedly sentimental. It's innocence in a corrupted world. = And so there are certainly sexual innuendos (corrupted world) but = ultimately, it's a movie about Truth, Beauty, Freedom and, of course, = Love. I generally eschew sentimentality, and I don't often care for melodrama, = and I mostly teach Camille so I can make fun of it. But this movie is so = over the top, it won me over. Eric Samuelsen - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 15:30:02 -0700 From: Barbara Hume Subject: Re: [AML] Voices and Stories in Our Heads At 05:13 AM 1/11/02, you wrote: >Does this happen to other people? I got to bed late, slept for a short >time and then kept coming to with dialogue and story ideas popping into >my head and refusing to go away. The characters wouldn't stop talking. >I finally got up and wrote some of it down in an idea book I have. I >hope it will make some sense when I look at it in daylight. Again, I >ask, in my zombie-like state, does this happen to other people? Or am >I insane? Wait, don't reply to that last part. Doesn't happen to everybody. Only to writers. Barbara R. Hume Provo, Utah - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 15:42:55 -0700 From: Barbara Hume Subject: RE: [AML] Annual Movie Tabulation At 03:45 PM 1/11/02, you wrote: >Lovely, lovely film with >a wonderful moral, entertaining heroine, and a great adaptation of >regency (was Austen Regency? I can never remember) privileged society. Yes, Austen lived during the Regency. She died in 1817. The Regency was from 1811 to 1820. Barbara R. Hume Provo, Utah - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 15:37:06 -0700 From: "Todd Petersen" Subject: RE: [AML] Life in Mormon Culture I've been lurking around, listening to this Mormon Culture discussion with supreme interest. I recognize that lots of people love the church and its culture. I think that it's important to have such feelings. That said, Mormon culture is boring, and it's supposed to be. Individuals might be exciting, but in general, things are boring in our world. My mother, for example, who is not a member of the church, used to complain about the public radio station coming out of Ricks. She loves NPR but can't handle the conference broadcasts and devotionals. She said they were dangerous because the monotone voices made her drowsy while driving. Mormon theology excites me and so does the temple. I love the scriptures and studying for lessons, but the contemporary culture is boring. It is not the stuff of literature, not without some tweaking, which is true of most middle class existance. Now, pioneer Mormon culture and the culture of the early church WAS exciting and dramatic, that's why we're always talking/writing about it--ad nauseum. The boredom for me comes from some basic issues. 1. In America, LDS culture is (in a lot of cases) middle class, and I don't really share those values. The food is boring, the fare foisted upon children is boring (I know this because I teach primary and I am not the only bored one in the room during sharing time ). Ward activities have, in large part been boring games and cough medicine-tasting root beer foam floats. I love talking with the members of my wards, finding out their loves and interests. One of the people I home teach recently found a dinosaur track on a family outing--that's kind of cool. But the activities themselves are kind of stupid for the most part. 2. I have different tastes. I don't like what most of the people I go to church with like, so as a consequence, we don't always have a lot to talk about. I don't hunt, I don't like sports, I don't read Orson Scott Card, I don't have a boat, I don't like the buffets in Mesquite, NV, and I don't like Keith Merrill. This only relates to LDSness, in that I am expected to relate to and have relationships with my ward members, and quite frankly, I'm often more interested and socially attracted to people who aren't LDS. The conversation is generally a bit more broad. 3. I didn't grow up in the church, so I have no fond memories of mutual activites, seminary primary songs, watching Johnny Lingo, and that sort of thing. All this stuff quite simply means nothing to me because I have no context for it. I didn't do it. I grew up doing and liking other things, having breakfast with my family in a wonderful little cafe in Northwest Portland on Sunday mornings for example. With the exception of the sacrement, I value that much more than anything that happens in a ward building on Sunday. So, if Todd Petersen, a person who loves the gospel and the Lord, gets bored of most things in the LDS world, how bored to you think someone who doesn't share our beliefs might be? I think they'd be tremendously bored, and this is why our books don't always play well to general audiences. We need to soup things up, just like everyone else had to--Jane Austen, Tolstoy, whatever. Dutcher did a pretty dang good job of it in BRIGHAM CITY, which is much more about Utah than Mormonism in my opinion. The regular world has done this with crime and sex and so forth, but as soon as an LDS writers do this, then all the good LDS folks don't want read it and all the regular folks are dismayed because there's not more smut. I say that good counsel to LDS writers would be to try and write something non-LDS, just for the practice and the empathy that would develop. I think we should all step outside out comfort zones, the zones of our immediate knowledge. The worst advice any writer could be given is to write what you know. I say write what you'd like to know, what you'd like to understand better. Writing is a kind of seeing, a method of learning. If you write only what you know, you'll end up boring yourself, and if you're bored, everyone else will be too. - -- Todd Robert Petersen - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 16:06:12 -0700 From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [AML] Trent HARRIS, _The Beaver Trilogy_ (Film) Center for the Study of Ethics Utah Valley State College February 28 The Beaver Trilogy A film by Trent Harris 7-9 PM, CS 404 The Los Angeles Film Critics Association presented its 2001 Independent/Experimental Film and Video Award to The Beaver Trilogy, directed by nonpracticing Mormon filmmaker Trent Harris. Set in Beaver, Utah, the film consists of three shorter films that each retell the same story with different casts and techniques. The film's stars include Crispin Glover and a young Sean Penn. Harris is best known for his low-budget 1994 film Plan 10 from Outer Space, a science-fiction comedy about a Utah Mormon who discovers the "Plaque of Kolob" and uncovers an alien plot to use the LDS Church to take over the world. For more complete information call David Keller (222-8503) Or visit our new website @ www.uvsc.edu/ethics [Forwarded by Chris Bigelow] - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 16:14:43 -0700 From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: RE: [AML] Reading Programs Apropos of this thread about managing our reading, have a look at the following from this past Sunday's _New York Times Book Review_: It's O.K. to Hate Your Books By JUDITH SHULEVITZ http://www.nytimes.com/2002/01/13/books/review/13SHULEVT.html Tasty tidbit: The novelist Nicholson Baker once tried to categorize his books in such a way that they themselves would nag him to read them: "I bought some Dennison stick-on dots. Books that I'd hardly read got a red and a blue dot, books I'd read but hadn't finished got a blue dot only, and books that I'd finished had no dot at all. . . . Once read, their dots would go away -- I would peel them off. So I was progressing in the general direction of dotlessness, as if recovering from the chicken pox. But I only followed the system for a few weeks, and eventually many of the dots fell off by themselves." Chris Bigelow - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 16:38:38 -0700 From: Mike South Subject: Re: [AML] Reading Programs Amy Chamberlain wrote: > I only have one, simple rule in my reading schedule. I go back and forth: > one "heavy" book, and then one "light" book. Then a "heavy" one again. I thought I was the only one who did this. Over the last couple of years, I've attempted to broaden my reading by making every other book a "classic". More often than not, it turns out to be _every other_ every other book, plus I often take a break in the middle of the longer classics to read something lighter. Still, it has lead to my reading several books that will always stay with me. Okay, time for my Books-That-Stay-With-Me-So-I'm-Glad-I-Read-Them list (in no particular order): My Name is Asher Lev, The Gift of Asher Lev (Chiam Potok) To Kill a Mockingbird (Harper Lee) Les Miserables (Victor Hugo - since I don't read French, I recommend the translation published by Penguin books (can't remember the name of the translator off-hand)) Moby Dick (Herman Melville) Mere Christianity, The Screwtape Letters (C.S. Lewis) Pride and Prejudice (Jane Austen) Angela's Ashes (Frank McCourt) Perfect Agreement (Michael Downing) The Amazing Adventures of Kavalier & Clay (Michael Chabon) Seventh Son, Folk of the Fringe (Orson Scott Card) His Dark Materials trilogy (The Golden Compass, The Subtle Knife, and The Amber Spyglass by Philip Pullman) Good Omens (Neil Gaiman and Terry Pratchett) The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy (Douglas Adams) About a Boy (Nick Hornby) any Calvin & Hobbes collection (Bill Watterson - while not actually books in the regular sense, I've certainly internalized the characters) The Elements of Style (Strunk & White) Great Expectations (Charles Dickens) Now, here's an idea for a new list: if you're like me, you have a pile of books next to your bedside that you intend to read any moment now. The list of books currently piled next to my bed is below. What's next to your bed? Animal Farm (George Orwell) The Two Towers (J.R.R. Tolkien) Huckleberry Finn (Mark Twain) In the Eye of the Storm (John H. Groberg) The Prince and the Pauper (Mark Twain) King Rat (China Mieville) A Heartbreaking Work of Staggering Genius (Dave Eggers) Bird by Bird (Anne Lamott) - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 16:51:52 -0700 From: "Marianne Hales Harding" Subject: Re: [AML] Christian literature (was Jericho Road) [MOD: This comment is an appropriate extension of the discussion as it's gone so far, but if anyone wants to respond to this, let's move back to a literary connection, okay?] >How have the Evangelical Christians gotten away with redefining the >parameters of the word "Christian" until it includes only themselves? They >have ruined the connotation of the very word for me. >I think they need >tokeep the descriptor rather than imply that they >are the only >Christians--but perhaps they believe they are I had first hand experience with this in cyberspace when the website I am a writer for started a message board for Christian parents. From the start the Evangelical Christians and the Catholics clashed over the term "Christian," even to the point of it being suggested that there be a "Christian Board" and a "Catholic Board" (there were only 2 Mormons on the board so I guess we weren't threatening enough to get kicked off). The consensus among the Evangelical Christians was that even though the Catholics professed a belief in Jesus Christ (which, in my mind, makes someone a Christian), their religious practices were so different (from the EC's) that they couldn't be termed Christian. The argument was bitter and got me soooo mad. I have to admit that it has really colored my view of EC's too and has almost entirely killed the joy I had in reading the Left Behind Series because instead of just being able to let religious differences roll off my back as I read, I think of those "Christian" ladies who want to keep Christ all to themselves. Grrrrrr. Marianne Hales Harding _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 15:23:10 -0900 From: Stephen Carter Subject: RE: [AML] Christian literature (was Jericho Road) >How have the Evangelical Christians gotten away with redefining the >parameters of the word "Christian" until it includes only themselves? They >have ruined the connotation of the very word for me. I think they need to >keep the descriptor rather than imply that they are the only >Christians--but perhaps they believe they are. Come to think of it, I know >Mormons who think we're the only ones God concerns himself with. Wouldn't >it be nice if Christian literature broke down these barriers rather than >putting them up? > > >barbara hume > > This discussion reminds me of that transcendent book "The Sneetches." By Dr. Seuss. I think the moral of that story is not that everyone should treat each other nicely, but that people who refuse to use their imagination and who are always bemoaning their fate are destined to be bored and unhappy. The Sneetches without the "stars upon thars" had every bit as much opportunity to put together their own clam bakes and whoop it up without the stars upon thars. But the only thing they seemed to do together was stare longingly at the parties they were not invited to. So I guess I agree with Barbara. If we aren't invited to someone else's party, we should throw our own. Maybe ours will become interesting enough to attract a few "Christians." Stephen Carter Fairbanks, Alaska - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 12:40:14 -0500 From: "robert lauer" Subject: Re: [AML] Moulin Rouge >Julie Kirk wrote: > >>So, maybe I'll see it at some point. But what did you guys think? What I >>mean is, did you think the merit outweighed the sex scenes, or do you >>think >>the 17 year olds overreacted. I've seen MOULIN ROUGE about a half dozen times (not unusual when I like a film--and this was my second favorite film this year). Since the plot was a re-working of CAMILLE, the story involves a woman forced to prostitute herself and finding out in the end that she would have been happier if she had not done so and been true to her real convictions and values.However, there is no "sex scene" in the film. There are "Sexual situations"--particularly one scene in which the heroine thinks she is supposed to give herself to the hero. But there is no nudity and no actual sex because the situation is comedic, involving a case of mistaken identity. This is not a kids film by any stretch (kids being those under 14, in my estimation), but I think it's perfectly acceptable for those in their mid-teens and older. The tragedy of the story stems from a young woman's mistaken notion that she must sacrifice herself sexually in order to further her career and artistic aspirations. This film is "high romance" at it's highest. The message is stated blatantly again and again throughout the film through the use of "Nature Boy," the old Nat King Cole song from the 1950's: "The greatest thing you'll ever learn Is just to love and be loved in return." In my own opinion there is nothing in the least bit morally offensive about a film that proclaims this as it's ultimate message. ROB LAUER _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 20:41:15 -0700 From: "K.D. Enos" Subject: Re: [AML] Voices and Stories in Our Heads My husband doesn't understand all this, but I think my 10 year old will be published someday (I believe I already said that it runs in my family, she's part of the next generation). Konnie Enos - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 20:32:18 -0700 From: "K.D. Enos" Subject: Re: [AML] Annual Movie Tabulation I haven't seen Pearl Harbor yet and one of the reasons I haven't is because I had a great uncle survive that attack. When I in high school I had to interview someone that could remember WWII so I interviewed my grandmother. First she told me that she was pregnant with my dad the day Pearl Habor was hit (a fact I could have figured out since he was born the following Feb.) then she told me that her brother-in-law, my grandpa's brother, was thrown off one of the ships by the force of the attack that day. He's lucky to be alive. If anyone on this list knows a Claude Westover somewhere in California, well, he was there, ask him. Anyway I just don't think a fictional account of what happened that day is something I want to see. At least it doesn't appeal to me right now even if it's the best movie ever. Konnie Enos \ - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 13:35:11 -0700 From: "Annette Lyon" Subject: [AML] Tonight's Jeff Savage Presentation I hope it isn't too late to get this out today, but I just now read caught up reading everyone's posts today (including Chris's request for more information). Here's what we (meaning the chapter board, consisting of me, the president, and my secreatary) sent out to members--and the public is welcome, by the way. Annette Lyon *** We'll start the year off hearing about creating conflict and suspense in your work with Jeffrey S. Savage, author of the high-tech thriller _Cutting Edge._ Savage has spent over twelve years experiencing the dramatic up and downs of the high-tech sector. Most recently the CEO of an Internet start-up, he brings to life the thrills and perils of this exciting world. He grew up in the greater Bay Area before it was known as Silicon Valley, and recently moved with his family to Spanish Fork, Utah. Savage has published a computer newspaper and been the host of a weekly radio show. He currently sits on the Board of Directors of two companies. His second novel, _Job_ is scheduled to be released sometime this spring. Join us at the Provo Library at Academy Square on Wednesday, January 16, at 7:00 p.m. in room 201 of the main building. [Annette Lyon] - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 19:13:44 -0900 From: Stephen Carter Subject: RE: [AML] Life in Mormon Culture >===== Original Message From "Jacob Proffitt" ===== >Any Mormon who is afraid of learning new things doesn't >understand their faith very well. >And I never had the feeling you describe of being >afraid to explore. If >that is the message you received, then you got the wrong message. I'm >saddened to hear that. But that is hardly the message we are teaching >universally as a people. > >Jacob Proffitt Ironically, that is probably exactly how I would have responded to myself, had I read my post, though I would have sympathized with me a little more. Though I went through all that time believing something that Jacob Proffitt finds it hard to believe that I could have believed, I have come to believe that "all truth will be circumscribed into one great whole." And I think I will find that the period I've been complaining about has actually been helpful to me. It has certainly instilled in me (by way of reverse psychology) a strong thirst for truth and exploration. One friend of mine was writing a paper arguing that freedom is the unobstructed path toward self-actualization. I proposed to him (mostly just to have an interesting discussion, though later I starting thinking about it more seriously, though I still disagree with me in a way) that perhaps freedom is the obstructed path to self-actualization. Perhaps this obstruction was the very thing that ignited my passion for truth. I needed something to push off of. That's what Ingmar Bergman said about his childhood, come to think of it. He wrote that he appreciated the strict religious upbringing he had because it gave him something to push against. (Gee, maybe I should make movies.) Another friend of mine has often admonished me in the distinctive language of the ex Army man, "Free your mind, your ass will follow." And that's what I've been trying to do. Stephen Carter Fairbanks, Alaska - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 04:18:14 -0700 From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: [AML] Significant LDS Authors I am in the early stages of putting together an Internet site about LDS art, and I could use your help. Right now I'm working on authors. I've made a sizeable, but incomplete list of authors who seemed for one reason or another (to me) to be significant. I can't possibly maintain a comprehensive list, and besides, Gideon Burton is developing a comprehensive database at BYU that I can just link to. The help I could use from all of you is: 1. Do you think I missed someone who should be considered significant (I'm sure I have), even if it's you? Or perhaps you even think I should drop someone from the list. 2. If you are on my list, would you help me set up your page by providing me the following information: a. The address of your website, if you have one. b. Your real name, pen name, and any pseudonyms you use. c. A biography of some kind. d. A comprehensive bibliography, including which publishing genres each entry falls under. e. A JPG photograph of you. f. A contact e-mail address that you would like to be made available to the public g. If any of this is available on your website, and you'd just like me to use what's there, a statement of permission to use it on my website. Also, if you don't have a website and would be interested in having my page about you BE your official website, let me know and we can make some kind of arrangement. Thanks for your help. Send all responses to dmichael@wwno.com If you're a musician, playwrite, or filmmaker, I'll be asking the same things from you at a later time. Here's my list: Adams, Linda Paulson Allred, Lee Anderson, Lavina Fielding Arrington, Leonard J. Bell, M. Shayne Bennion, John Brown, Marilyn Card, Orson Scott Carter, Ron Collings, Michael R. Duncan, Thom England, Eugene Evans, Richard Paul Farland, David Gardner, Lynn Glenn, Sharlee Mullins Gray, Darius Aidan Groberg, John H. Heimerdinger, Chris Hilton, Joni Huff, Kent W. Hughes, Dean Kemp, Kenny Kidd, Kathryn H. Kirby, Robert Lund, Gerald N. Markham, Tony Mitchell, Alan Rex Moon, Elizabeth Nelson, Lee Nibley, Hugh Nunes, Rachel Ann Parkin, Scott Parkinson, Benson Y. Pearson, Carol Lynn Perry, Anne Peterson, Levi S. Plummer, Louise Quinn, D. Michael Randle, Kristen D. Ritchey, Michael Rowley, Brent J. Savage, Jeffrey S. Snow, Edgar C., Jr. Stansfield, Anita Tarr, Kenneth R. Udall, Brady Van Wagoner, Robert Hodgson West, Julia West, M. Brook Weyland, Jack Williams, Carol Lynch Williams, Terry Tempest Wolverton, Dave Yorgason, Blaine M. Young, Margaret Blair - -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 10:59:21 -0700 From: "Eric R. Samuelsen" Subject: Re: [AML] Annual Movie Tabulation >Though I agree entirely with Eric S. on the quality of Pearl Harbor, I=20 a big emotional attachment to the story: my father was in the Navy in=20 >WWII and arrived at PH just two hours after the bombing, early enough = >to=20 >see all the carnage. He can't talk about it to this day without = choking=20 >up. The film came out the exact month of my dad's 80th birthday and I=20 >had planned on taking him to see it until I learned he had already = gone=20 >and then walked out when all the fighting started because it brought=20 >back painful memories. This is a terrific commentary on the subjective nature of all art works. = I have a student who was very badly abused as a child. She simply cannot = tolerate violence in media. I don't mean she can't watch Natural Born = Killers; she can't watch Roadrunner cartoons. She becomes physically ill. = And I remember vividly a wonderful classroom discussion with her, in which = she asked, in all sincerity, how anyone could find the Three Stooges or = Laurel and Hardy funny. To her, violence could not be funny, ever. This = was a bright, educated, liberal, funny, open minded woman, but her = background made certain works of art impossible for her to watch, let = alone appreciate. =20 Now this isn't anything new, of course; we all acknowledge the subjective = nature of our reaction to works of art. But what makes Thom's comment so = interesting to me is that he was deeply affected by a work of art that he = also acknowledged wasn't very good. I had the same reaction to Pay it = Forward. Yes, it was manipulative; a button-pushing piece of sentimentaliz= ed rubbish. And I wept, and spent the next week trying to be nice to = people. That impulse passed, thank heavens, but for a second there, a = movie got to me emotionally, even while my rational mind was saying "Bah, = humbug." Eric Samuelsen - -- AML-List, a mailing list for the discussion of Mormon literature ------------------------------ End of aml-list-digest V1 #576 ******************************