From: buffy-owner@xmission.com (buffy Digest) To: buffy-digest@xmission.com Subject: buffy Digest V1 #129 Reply-To: buffy@xmission.com Sender: buffy-owner@xmission.com Errors-To: buffy-owner@xmission.com Precedence: buffy Digest Monday, June 9 1997 Volume 01 : Number 129 In this issue: BUFFY: Re: Gender Survey BUFFY: Random Thoughts on H-Mouth...(some spoilers) BUFFY: (no subject) BUFFY: (no subject) BUFFY: voting and mrshowbiz Re: BUFFY: Buffy in Village Voice Re: BUFFY: Angel's soul thing BUFFY: songs Re: BUFFY: songs BUFFY: Hell Mouth Opening/SMG in US BUFFY: GASP & US Magazine Re: BUFFY: GASP & US Magazine BUFFY: Giles Age Re: BUFFY: Re: Slayer in a White Dress Re: BUFFY: GASP & US Magazine Re: BUFFY: Giles wealth Re: BUFFY: Re: Angel Tattoo, Etc... Re: BUFFY: can angel read? BUFFY: ANGEL'S TATTOO Re: BUFFY: Re: Slayer in a White Dress Re: BUFFY: can angel read? Re: BUFFY: Giles wealth Re: BUFFY: ANGEL'S TATTOO Re: BUFFY: PROPHECY GIRL: Quibbles & Nits (and Nits and Re: BUFFY: SGM screams Re: BUFFY: PROPHECY GIRL: Quibbles & Nits (and Nits and BUFFY: Vampires and education Re: BUFFY: SGM screams Re: BUFFY: CPR on Buffy Re: BUFFY: CPR on Buffy Re: BUFFY: CPR on Buffy Re: BUFFY: can angel read? Re: BUFFY: SPOILERS: Give in to the Dark Side, Buffy... BUFFY: Angel and the Sun Re: BUFFY: can angel read? Re: BUFFY: CPR on Buffy Re: BUFFY: SGM screams Re: BUFFY: Giles wealth BUFFY: Re: Angel LOVEs Buffy BUFFY: Re: Angel LOVEs Buffy Re: BUFFY: SPOILERS: Give in to the Dark Side, Buffy... See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the buffy or buffy-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 14:47:22 -0600 (MDT) From: C Qin Subject: BUFFY: Re: Gender Survey Sorry about the delay in the "survey" I tried to do, but I've been rather busy lately and all of a sudden my mailbox got swarmed with a few hundred messages. Well, from the portion of the people who did respond to me, I got these results: Well, despite the impression of being female-dominated, the list is actually very evenly-distributed in terms of gender. Out of 57 members that I surveyed, 28 were female and 29 were male. Well I don't know about you, but for me, this is pretty rare in most mailing lists. (or it might be just that I haven't been going to the right mailing lists. :) I guess the appearance of so many women on the board is because women do the majority of the postings. (especially the ones about Angel/Buffy) Oh, well, back to the regularly scheduled program. - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Over its bloated, corpulent body, the creature known as Santa Claus drapes a tunic the color of fresh blood. - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 13:57:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Sonja Marie Subject: BUFFY: Random Thoughts on H-Mouth...(some spoilers) As it relates to the whole season. 1. I've noticed that some ppl commented about how in NKAB.. Buffy and Giles killed the supposed annointed one by putting him in the crematory, saying they didn't think that would kill him, but in Welcome to the H-Mouth Buffy tells Xander while they are on their way to save Jesse that Fire is one way you can kill a vamp. 2. We didn't really know that Angel was a vamp when this ep aired so it didn't seem odd at the time that he would be in the mausoleum during the day to tell Buffy not to go to the Master's Lair, but in retrospect shouldn't the sunlight that was filtering in affect him? 3. H-Mouth gave us a big clue to where the opening might be, Angel tells Buffy to go East towards the school cause that's where she would probably find them. Over and out! Sonja Marie - The White Rose @--'->-- http://www.eskimo.com/~whtrose/sonja.html Co-Pres. of the Jeff Fahey IFC - http://www.eskimo.com/~whtrose/fahey.html Paul Wylie Fan Pages - http://www.eskimo.com/~whtrose/pwylie/pwylie.html Owner of the Jeff Fahey Mailing List & The Paul Wylie Mailing List Pres. of Giles Appreciation Society Panters -GASP!- Keeper of Giles Coats&Ties "Because I'm English, I'm Strange Anyway" - Anthony Stewart Head (Giles - BTVS) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Jun 1997 17:08:58 -0700 From: Tom Hawkins Subject: BUFFY: (no subject) Sarah's hair is naturally dark brown! Twig-E ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Jun 1997 17:16:46 -0700 From: Tom Hawkins Subject: BUFFY: (no subject) I went to the CD place and asked for Sprung Monkeys.Can you bellieve they aughed in my face!Does NEbody know where I can get it and the names of the other CDs? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Jun 1997 17:21:09 -0700 From: Tom Hawkins Subject: BUFFY: voting and mrshowbiz Sorry for responding so much but I read there is something about SMG on mrshowbiz?Yes! I wrote them like 20 times and told them to put something about her in it!Also I have a question about this pole stuff.Where do I vote and who will be called the name? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 17:31:46, -0500 From: GSSM83C@prodigy.com (JOSEPH NORTHCOTT) Subject: Re: BUFFY: Buffy in Village Voice >Sarah Michelle Gellar's improvement on the movie Buffy starts with >the physical contrast, since Kristy Swanson was one of those vigorous >California blondes who look perfectly capable of decking most men with >one punch. Her TV successor is petite and prepossessing, which gives >an exhilarating extra charge to Buffy's whirligigs of martial-arts I actually didn't think the Village Voice article was incredible or anything, but this excerpt really hit the spot. That is exactly the difference between the movie and the series. The movie Buffy looked like a slayer, special powers or not. The tv slayer blends into the high school crowd. There's more to her than just being the slayer. A vampire wouldn't just instantly pick her out in the middle of the Bronze. (Angel excepted.) :) Ted, thanks for sending the article to the list. :) Joseph ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 03:03:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Lisa Rose Subject: Re: BUFFY: Angel's soul thing At 08:55 AM 6/6/97 -0400, Jesse Jou wrote: >Darla chides him to embrace his vampire heritage by killing >"mangy humans."...for Darla to endorse killing is nothing, for she >has no soul to begin with; however, for Angel to kill humans... >is for him to ignore the dictates of his conscience...Aren't human >monsters scarier than soulless ones? Darla's talk of "mangy humans" reminds me of the talk of many *humans* I've met (when they speak of animals, or worse, races they consider to be inferior). So either these humans I've met have no souls, like Darla. Or they're ignoring the dictates of their consciences. Some speak so guiltlessly about such things that I figure it's the former, they have no souls, like Darla. What would happen if Darla "made" one of these people? With no soul to lose, would there be little apparent change except the growth of fangs and photosensitivity? And who is scarier? At least a being (vampire or human) with a soul has something you can appeal to, whether it chooses to hear the appeal or not. But beings (again, vampire or human) *without* souls might be a tough sell! Lisa "Slay bells ring, are ya listenin?...What a beautiful fright we're having tonight, a slayin' in a winter xanderland." -- from the Little Buffy Christmas classic "Winter Xanderland" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Jun 1997 14:37:19 PDT From: "Maddy :)" Subject: BUFFY: songs No answer on my last post so I will try again. Does ANYONE know the name or artist that did the song for when Buffy is in her room and looking at her photo album???? Maddy:) Check out my ULTIMATE BUFFY KEEPER'S LIST Page for lists for each character. AT www.internet2k.com/keeper KEEPER OF Angel's Unseeable reflection Buffy's White Prom Dress "I think I speak for all of us here when I say, HUH?" ~Buffy Summers, Invisible Girl GASPer, Slayerette #38, (Mailing List)Slayerette(??), Buffy's Little Slayer~Cordelia Role Profiler, Slayer's Legion (waiting on that one)Member of Angel's Loft - --------------------------------------------------------- Get Your *Web-Based* Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - --------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 16:48:19 -0500 From: hyphema@webtv.net Subject: Re: BUFFY: songs maddy, don't get maddy (sorry). the song playing when buffy was looking at her photo album was "inconsolable" by jonatha brooke (it's on her album "plumb"). hyphema:-[ hyphema@webtv.net ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 17:58:12 -0400 (EDT) From: "Marcus J. Baker" Subject: BUFFY: Hell Mouth Opening/SMG in US I thought it was sort of funny, a little bit after I saw the season finale, some tabloid's cover page was about earthquakes everywhere opening up some gate to hell, releasing demons. Maybe already mentioned here, but did anyone else see the two pages on SMG in US magazine? The first talked about Buffy. "Only the shallow know themselves." --Oscar Wilde Marcus Baker, mbaker@mbhs.edu ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 17:13:54 -0500 From: "Kristy" Subject: BUFFY: GASP & US Magazine I keep seeing "GASP" or "GASPer" in people's sigs. What is this? Also, which issue of US is SMG in? Kristy rhammack@why.net Keeper of Angel 's Secrets ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 15:21:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Sonja Marie Subject: Re: BUFFY: GASP & US Magazine GASP stands for Giles Appreciation Society Panters, a group of fans who like Anthony Stewart Head and/or Giles. We are the official keepers of Giles' stuff. Email me PRIVATELY if you are interested in joining. On Sun, 8 Jun 1997, Kristy wrote: > I keep seeing "GASP" or "GASPer" in people's sigs. What is this? > Kristy Sonja Marie - The White Rose @--'->-- http://www.eskimo.com/~whtrose/sonja.html Co-Pres. of the Jeff Fahey IFC - http://www.eskimo.com/~whtrose/fahey.html Paul Wylie Fan Pages - http://www.eskimo.com/~whtrose/pwylie/pwylie.html Owner of the Jeff Fahey Mailing List & The Paul Wylie Mailing List Pres. of Giles Appreciation Society Panters -GASP!- Keeper of Giles Coats&Ties "Because I'm English, I'm Strange Anyway" - Anthony Stewart Head (Giles - BTVS) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 09:14:15 -0400 From: Laertes@webtv.net Subject: BUFFY: Giles Age Hi, I noticed at least one question on Giles age at least being 30. The actor playing him Anthony Stewart Head is 43 until contradicted on the show i think it is safe to assume Giles is 43. Dan T Fan of Buffy, the Vampire Slayer Fan of Celine Dion "Love Doesn't Ask Why" (Celine Dion) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Jun 1997 15:31:39 -0700 From: "Mary's kids" Subject: Re: BUFFY: Re: Slayer in a White Dress Surya Sen wrote: > > With regard to wearing a long white dress and pumps to fight the Master: > > Buffy felt that she was fated to perish in her fight with the Master. I don't think Buffy was planning on fighting the master at first. She was trying on her dress when Willow came over. When she saw how troubled Willow was after seeing her friends dead, I think she wanted revenge. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 18:37:06 -0400 (EDT) From: "Marcus J. Baker" Subject: Re: BUFFY: GASP & US Magazine On Sun, 8 Jun 1997, Kristy wrote: > Also, which issue of US is SMG in? I think it's the latest, July 1997, with George Clooney on the cover. SMG is at the beginning of the "Hotzone" section, pages 35 and 36. "Only the shallow know themselves." --Oscar Wilde Marcus Baker, mbaker@mbhs.edu ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Jun 1997 15:44:45 -0700 From: Jennifer Hawthorne Subject: Re: BUFFY: Giles wealth At 02:51 PM 6/8/97 -0500, thus sprake Kristy: >:In the real world, school >:libraries have been known to be attacked by censors for having >I don't think it's so hard to believe that the library wasn't censored. I second that. I think the vast majority of that kind of behavior comes from Bible Belt areas, which California is definitely *not* ;) Although Sunnydale seems to be a smallish town, it doesn't seem to be particularly rural or religious. Ergo, not a likely place for a book-burning party. (Lest anyone think I'm knocking rural/religious areas, I hail from a tiny town in Michigan and went to a public high school where the librarian expressed shock when she saw me (a junior at the time) reading Jean Auel's "Clan of the Cave Bear" because it had sex scenes in it...of course, I hadn't checked the book out from the school library but had bought it on my own. So I know whereof I speak, to a certain extent.) - -- Maytree - ------------------------------------------------------- Jennifer Hawthorne :: jen@pacwest.DIESPAM.net [To reply to this message, remove DIESPAM from address] - ------------------------------------------------------- I believe in making the world safe for our children, but not our children's children, because I don't think children should be having sex. - --- Jack Handey ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 18:59:57 -0400 (EDT) From: JaLyLa41@aol.com Subject: Re: BUFFY: Re: Angel Tattoo, Etc... In a message dated 97-06-06 14:13:12 EDT, you write: << What do you think about Angel's tattoo? It kinda reminds me >of a Druid symbol >> A few months back someone took the time and realized it was a Phoenix w/ the letter "A" imbedded in it. Ravenhawk ALS/Slayerette (club) Keeper of Buffy & Angel's love ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Jun 1997 20:13:49 -0400 From: Crimson Dream Subject: Re: BUFFY: can angel read? > > That's an interesting point. It would make sense if Angel can't read, > because he is a vampire, and why would a vampire want to learn the human > way of gathering info? After all, in Buffy Land they look upon us mere > mortals with such disdain. On the other hand, he has tried to "humanize" > himself as possible, so maybe he did learn to read, just to fit in more... > > Who knows? > Kristy If you saw the Angel ep. When Buffy went to her room to bring him food she asked what he did and Angel said "I did a little reading." and she thought he read her diary. So he can read. Naja ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 19:04:01 -0500 From: hyphema@webtv.net Subject: BUFFY: ANGEL'S TATTOO for the record, TODD MCINTOSH ("buffy" make-up guy) said that ANGEL's tattoo was (quote): "A Celtic cat motif with the paws framing an A." hyphema:-[ hyphema@webtv.net ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 20:38:51 -0600 From: "Gina" Subject: Re: BUFFY: Re: Slayer in a White Dress On 8 Jun 97 at 15:31, Mary's kids wrote about Re: BUFFY: Re: Slayer in a White Dr: > I don't think Buffy was planning on fighting the master at first. She > was trying on her dress when Willow came over. When she saw how troubled > Willow was after seeing her friends dead, I think she wanted revenge. That, *and* I think Buffy wanted to make sure the world - even if it had to go on without Buffy - was safe for Willow, Xander, Giles and her friends. I don't think until then, she'd let it really sink in what it would mean if she *didn't* try to stop the Master. Gina ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ justgee@navix.net  a usual suspect  <*>  Woo hoo? DFW & DFWGPADC  Member, Innerpeace  Jonesing for Angel AGA - Keeper of Angel's Pillows  Adopter of Luke (BtVS) JFIFC Co-pres  List Goddess, JFFIC-L ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Jun 1997 21:29:47 -0500 From: "Brian Lewis" Subject: Re: BUFFY: can angel read? On 06/08/97, at 06:29 PM, Crimson Dream wrote: >> >> That's an interesting point. It would make sense if Angel can't read, >> because he is a vampire, and why would a vampire want to learn the human= >> way of gathering info? After all, in Buffy Land they look upon us mere = >> mortals with such disdain. On the other hand, he has tried to "humanize= " >> himself as possible, so maybe he did learn to read, just to fit in more.= .. >> >> Who knows? >> Kristy In the season finally one of the reasons Giles calls Angel is to help him w= ith the translations. And from the look of it when Buffy caught them it ap= peared that he was reading it. Brian ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 22:36:28 -0400 (EDT) From: TCNXFILE@aol.com Subject: Re: BUFFY: Giles wealth with respect to the library, IVe noticed that not many people go into the library and it seems to me that there are many many stacks in there so in all actuality giles may have his books placed in the far areas of the stacks and the administrators may not know about it just my .02 cents sincerely james binder keeper of willows cool shoes from pg ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Jun 1997 21:35:44 -0500 From: "Brian Lewis" Subject: Re: BUFFY: ANGEL'S TATTOO On 06/08/97, at 07:23 PM, hyphema@webtv.net wrote: >for the record, TODD MCINTOSH ("buffy" make-up guy) said that ANGEL's >tattoo was (quote): "A Celtic cat motif with the paws framing an A." > >hyphema:-[ > >hyphema@webtv.net > I have a question for you. Angel being a vampire has incredibly healing ab= ilities, right. Well all a tattoo is an image carved into the skin. Shoul= dn't Angel's healing ability make it dissappear or something. Brian ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Jun 1997 22:36:22 -0400 (EDT) From: Jonathan Schiz Subject: Re: BUFFY: PROPHECY GIRL: Quibbles & Nits (and Nits and On 03-Jun-97 JOSEPH NORTHCOTT wrote: >I'll also bet that another girl in Cordelia's clique will get a >recurring role All together now: "Harmony! Harmony! Harmony!..." ;) (A couple of weeks ago I posted something about how they should make a show around Harmony and what it's like to be "the shallow groupie". As I was testing a new mailer, I don't know if the post made it.) J. Schiz - Keeper of Harmony's white T-shirt Scully 3:16; BUFFY is YFFUB ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 18:25:25 -0700 From: "Wien Huang" Subject: Re: BUFFY: SGM screams > Fans of the WB series Buffy the Vampire Slayer will be thrilled to hear > that star Sarah Michelle Gellar is in final talks to co-star in Scream II. Filming is set to > begin June 15. june 15 this year or next year? Lily Keeper of Angel's Dresser (i'm waiting for his new fall wardrobe. maybe next season he'll add some color!) :) "i'll just go home, lie down, and listen to country music...the music of pain." -Xander, BtVS ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 09 Jun 1997 00:02:56 -0400 From: Crimson Dream Subject: Re: BUFFY: PROPHECY GIRL: Quibbles & Nits (and Nits and > >I'll also bet that another girl in Cordelia's clique will get a > >recurring role > > All together now: "Harmony! Harmony! Harmony!..." ;) > > (A couple of weeks ago I posted something about how they should make > a show around Harmony and what it's like to be "the shallow groupie". > As I was testing a new mailer, I don't know if the post made it.) > > J. Schiz - Keeper of Harmony's white T-shirt Speaking of Harmony I relized she was in the secound Addams Family movie "Addams Family Value." She played a snotty rich girl at a summer camp that Wednesday had to go to. Wednesday had her roasted alive. That's my girl:) Naja ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 23:03:42 -0400 From: Laertes@webtv.net Subject: BUFFY: Vampires and education Vampires are supposed to be very intelligent creatures. Vampires of all the evil creatures are the closest to humans. I would find it astonishing if being literate was not a goal of all vampires. Being able to read would help them understand the nature of humanity and to know how to exploit them. Also i will go back to time on their hands argument. Lets suppose that a typical vampire slays one victim a night. Humans are not that hard to find and corner. Hunting humans for a vampire should be like a person fishing in a barrel it is not tough. Alright feeding would take 45 seconds and the hunt about 30 minutes that means they have about 9 more hours to waste. Even 3 victims would be at most 3 hours. They have time on their hands i would seriously doubt if they waste it. Also in literature Dracula was well educated, just about every vampire movie the vamps tend to be well versed also Rice's vampires are well educated. Dan T Fan of Buffy, the Vampire Slayer Fan of Celine Dion "Love Doesn't Ask Why" (Celine Dion) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 23:19:37 -0400 (EDT) From: "Marcus J. Baker" Subject: Re: BUFFY: SGM screams > Fans of the WB series Buffy the Vampire Slayer will be thrilled to hear > that star Sarah Michelle Gellar is in final talks to co-star in Scream > II. Lovely, does anyone know whether or not there are plans for her to also be in Scream III? "Only the shallow know themselves." --Oscar Wilde Marcus Baker, mbaker@mbhs.edu ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Jun 1997 22:32:03 -0500 From: Tim Holdener Subject: Re: BUFFY: CPR on Buffy On Fri, 6 Jun 1997, Robert Huff wrote: Here's a common sense reason the CPR looked fake. If Xander had performed true CPR on Buffy, Sarah Michelle Gellar would be in real pain and probably would have some internal injuries. Those chest compressions have the unhappy side effect of cracking some ribs. Actually the more common injuries inherent to CPR are bruising or breaking of the sternum or breaking off the xiphoid process. Most of the scene cut away while Xander was doing chest compressions, going to a closeup of Buffy or going to Angel. The main problems that I saw were: 1) Not removing the clothing (a plastic bra hook to the sternum wouldn't feel to good), but being realistic here, they couldn't do that for public T.V. 2) Not rechecking his hands to resume the chest compressions. Here is where the breaking of ribs can occur, plus breaking off the xiphoid process. All things considered though, they didn't do a bad job of it. BTW Angel said that Xander would have to perform the CPR because "he had no breath". If he has no breath, technically he shouldn't be able to speak either. Muscles open and close the vocal cords. Sounds are created as air is forced past them, making them vibrate. These vibrations make the sound. The vibrations of air are then shaped by the tongue and muscles of the mouth to form understandable speech. Not that any of you care,including me, it's a mute point. "Denn die Todten reiten schnell"-- "For the dead travel fast." ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 20:40:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Sonja Marie Subject: Re: BUFFY: CPR on Buffy On Sun, 8 Jun 1997, Tim Holdener wrote: > going to a closeup of Buffy or going to Angel. The main problems that I > saw were: What about Xander not cleaning the passage way or tilting Buffy's head back or holding the nose? Sonja Marie - The White Rose @--'->-- http://www.eskimo.com/~whtrose/sonja.html Co-Pres. of the Jeff Fahey IFC - http://www.eskimo.com/~whtrose/fahey.html Paul Wylie Fan Pages - http://www.eskimo.com/~whtrose/pwylie/pwylie.html Owner of the Jeff Fahey Mailing List & The Paul Wylie Mailing List Pres. of Giles Appreciation Society Panters -GASP!- Keeper of Giles Coats&Ties "Because I'm English, I'm Strange Anyway" - Anthony Stewart Head (Giles - BTVS) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 23:45:09 -0400 (EDT) From: "Marcus J. Baker" Subject: Re: BUFFY: CPR on Buffy Well, Xander never said he was _good_ at CPR. "Only the shallow know themselves." --Oscar Wilde Marcus Baker, mbaker@mbhs.edu ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 8 Jun 1997 20:47:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Lisa Rose Subject: Re: BUFFY: can angel read? At 04:29 PM 6/7/97 -0500, Kristy wrote: >That's an interesting point. It would make sense if Angel can't read, >because he is a vampire, and why would a vampire want to learn the human >way of gathering info? I'm getting to this thread late. Forgive me if I repeat things previously suggested. In 1757, Ireland was already transitioning from Gaelic to English. And if Angel could read English as a human, he should still have that memory as a vampire. As Giles said: A vampire...may have the movements, the memories, even the personality of the person it took over. But it's still a demon at the core. Besides, of course, Angel *said* he could read while talking to Buffy in her room: Buffy: So, what'd you do all day? Angel: Uh, I read a little and just thought about a lot of things" And why would he have all those books in his apartment if he couldn't read? For the pictures? How would he know which book was the Codex to give to Giles if he couldn't read it's cover? And didn't Giles even want help in translation? (Angel may have been swimming in Latin and Greek the last hundred years out of sheer boredom). Vamps without souls like Luke or Darla could perhaps care less about reading. But I think Angel reads. (He *must* read because I think he's hot, and generally I don't find illiteracy attractive. So there, that's our proof!). But I know you all know all this already too, so maybe I'm just missing some part of the thread here.... Lisa Buffy: Can a vampire ever be a good person? Couldn't it happen? Giles: A vampire isn't a person at all. It may have the movements, the memories, even the personality of the person it took over. But it's still a demon at the core. There's no half way. Willow: So that'd be a *no*, huh? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 00:00:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Jill Gillham Subject: Re: BUFFY: SPOILERS: Give in to the Dark Side, Buffy... On Thu, 5 Jun 1997, Lisa Rose wrote: > > There's gotta be a mythic archetype here somewhere. > Has anyone got their Joseph Campbell handy? > My memory ofarchetypes is pretty rusty. Who's the trickster? Giles, Xander or Angel? Jill Gillham jilkey@grfn.org jillmari@aol.com http://members.aol.com/ferndock2 - -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 GG d s+ a-- C+++ U P+ L E--- W++ N+++ K+ w--- O M+ V PS++ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5+++ X R tv+ b++++ DI+++ D--- G e+++ h--- r+++ x+++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Jun 1997 23:07:00 -0500 From: Tim Holdener Subject: BUFFY: Angel and the Sun Sonja Marie wrote: > > 2. We didn't really know that Angel was a vamp when this ep aired so it > didn't seem odd at the time that he would be in the mausoleum during the > day to tell Buffy not to go to the Master's Lair, but in retrospect > shouldn't the sunlight that was filtering in affect him? > In most literature you'll see a common trend, the older the vampire the longer they can stay in the sun. Granted a vampire couldn't walk around in broad daylight, but because of his age, Angel could withstand the sun for a bit. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 08 Jun 97 22:57:36 PDT From: "Amy Clayborn" Subject: Re: BUFFY: can angel read? And, Angel *is* a vampire, yes, but he is a vampire with a human conscience, according to the gypsy curse. What else would he have to do but read? I am new here, BTW... Amy (aclaybor@busprod.com) Gossamer X-Files Fanfic Specialty Archive http://www.busprod.com/aclaybor Lovers of Mulder in Glasses http://www.geocities.com/televisioncity/1577/LOMIG.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 00:25:33 -0400 (EDT) From: Monet Subject: Re: BUFFY: CPR on Buffy On Sun, 8 Jun 1997, Sonja Marie wrote: > On Sun, 8 Jun 1997, Tim Holdener wrote: > > going to a closeup of Buffy or going to Angel. The main problems that I > > saw were: > > What about Xander not cleaning the passage way or tilting Buffy's head > back or holding the nose? YES! That is the ULTIMATE boo-boo I have seen in most TV shows that show CPR on a person. I can understand everything else with not doing certain things as not to injure Sarah, but I don't think tilting of the head will do much damage, yet is essential to the procedure. Sorry, I don't usually nit-pick that bad, but when you know how certain things are, you tend to :) G :) ==================================================================== "I think I speak for everyone here when I say, 'Huh?'"-Buffy ==================================================================== monet@arches.uga.edu or gs01gad@panther.gsu.edu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 09 Jun 1997 02:05:22 GMT From: flagg@wwa.com (Flagg) Subject: Re: BUFFY: SGM screams On Sun, 8 Jun 1997 18:25:25 -0700, you wrote: >> Fans of the WB series Buffy the Vampire Slayer will be thrilled to = hear >> that star Sarah Michelle Gellar is in final talks to co-star in Scream >Filming is set to begin June 15. > >june 15 this year or next year? Well, seeing as the movie is set for release next Christmas season, it most likely will be June 15 this year...like next week. - --Flagg and to the person who asks about Scream III...aren't you jumping the gun a bit? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 9 Jun 1997 00:54:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Jill Gillham Subject: Re: BUFFY: Giles wealth On Thu, 5 Jun 1997 Laertes@webtv.net wrote: > With the books that Giles is getting does anyone suspect that he may be > very wealthy. > His library has to contain books worth in the > tens of thousands. Just the age and subject > matter would make them extremely expensive. Maybe he's notpersonally, but I'm willing to bet that by now the Watchers have a good deal of money stashed away earning some nice compounding interest, as well as aquiring the odd account from now slain vampires and ghoulies. Someone in the organization also probably has some pretty high life insurance policies taken out on the current slayer. Jill Gillham jilkey@grfn.org jillmari@aol.com http://members.aol.com/ferndock2 - -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 GG d s+ a-- C+++ U P+ L E--- W++ N+++ K+ w--- O M+ V PS++ PE Y+ PGP t+ 5+++ X R tv+ b++++ DI+++ D--- G e+++ h--- r+++ x+++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 09 Jun 1997 02:37:23 EDT From: funee@juno.com Subject: BUFFY: Re: Angel LOVEs Buffy >From: RAS > >Ok, Ok, Angel LOVES Buffy (I rewatched "Angel" and some other ep's) >Now the question is does Angel think that he is worthy of Buffy, being a >vampire and all, considering the evil he has done. Will Angel step aside to >let a "normal" person (Xander or other) give Buffy a safe relationship. Good question! I kinda feel like you do that Angel isn't right for Buffy. I know, I know all the girls want Buffy and Angel to get together cause they think Angel is so cute. But anyone can see that Angel is not human. Would you approve of a human female having a love relationship with a male ape? Well, maybe some of you might. But think about it -- Angel is of a totally different species now. He looks human, acts human, but he isn't human. So, should Buffy have a love relationship with him? Girls, would you like a guy who has been dead for more than 200 years as a boyfriend even if he was cute? Lets explore this with another example from the male point of view. Say we could create an exact duplicate of Buffy, copied down to every detail with lifelike hair, skin, programmed for feelings, intelligence, etc. Guys, would you want that duplicate Buffy as a girlfriend? A machine so realistically human, yet still a machine? A machine you could program to do ANYTHING you wanted? Hmmmm, better not answer that...ahahahahahah! So what have we learned here? Cute male vampires and teenage girls don't mix? Perhaps, but I think the main lesson is, we're driven by sexual urges and desires that make us a pretty horny race. In the end, it's like Lucy Lawless (Xena: Warrior Princess) told Regis and Kathy Lee: "Skin sells baby!" I guess it doesn't matter if that skin is dead and 200+ years old, as long as it looks good! End of lecture, funee (: He's not human because he doesn't fit the definition of a normal living human being. So, what to do? How bout -- report Angel and Buffy to the Vice Squad for the moral and sexual degenerates they are? funee (: ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 09 Jun 1997 02:42:26 EDT From: funee@juno.com Subject: BUFFY: Re: Angel LOVEs Buffy >From: RAS > >Ok, Ok, Angel LOVES Buffy (I rewatched "Angel" and some other ep's) >Now the question is does Angel think that he is worthy of Buffy, being a >vampire and all, considering the evil he has done. Will Angel step aside to >let a "normal" person (Xander or other) give Buffy a safe relationship. Good question! I kinda feel like you do that Angel isn't right for Buffy. I know, I know all the girls want Buffy and Angel to get together cause they think Angel is so cute. But think about it -- Angel is of a totally different species now. He looks human, acts human, but he isn't human. So, should Buffy have a love relationship with him? Girls, would you like a guy who has been dead for a few centuries as a boyfriend, even if he was cute? Er...well I guess the way some of you are so fanatic about Angel, maybe you wouldn't mind. So, lets explore this from another angle -- from the male point of view. Say we could create an exact duplicate of Buffy, copied down to every detail with lifelike hair, skin, programmed for feelings, intelligence, etc. Guys, would you want that duplicate Buffy as a girlfriend? A machine so realistically human, yet still a machine? A machine you could program to do ANYTHING you wanted? Hmmmm, better not answer that...ahahahahahah! So what have we learned here? Cute male vampires and teenage girls don't mix? No, I think the main lesson is, we're driven by sexual urges and desires that make us a pretty horny race. In the end, it's like Lucy Lawless (Xena: Warrior Princess) told Regis and Kathy Lee: "Skin sells baby!" I guess it doesn't matter if that skin is dead and several centuries old, as long as it looks good! funee (: ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 09 Jun 1997 00:33:48 -0700 From: Jennifer Hawthorne Subject: Re: BUFFY: SPOILERS: Give in to the Dark Side, Buffy... At 12:00 AM 6/9/97 -0400, thus sprake Jill Gillham: >On Thu, 5 Jun 1997, Lisa Rose wrote: >> There's gotta be a mythic archetype here somewhere. >> Has anyone got their Joseph Campbell handy? >Who's the trickster? Giles, Xander, or Angel? I don't know much about Campbell's archetypes either, but the obvious choice would be Xander. Giles is a Mentor/Teacher/Wise Man figure, and Angel's the Daemon Lover (akin to Tam Lin). As long as we're on symbolism, how about Tarot signifiers? Here are my suggestions, keeping in mind that Tarot interpretation is a very individual art, so other people might have other ideas. Maybe even better ones ;) Disclaimer: I don't believe in the Tarot. But the symbology and lore associated with it is fascinating, and an important part of folklore. Thus, I've investigated it a fair bit. Tarot signifiers for people are usually taken from the "Court" cards -- King, Queen, Knight, and Page of any of the four suits. Since our gang are fictional characters, however, they are more archetypal than real people, and thus signifiers from the Major Arcana could be appropriate as well. (Major Arcana cards usually represent fundamental forces instead of people.) So I'll pick one of each. - -------------- BUFFY: Major Arcanum: Strength. Represents strength (duh), courage, fortitude, conviction. Minor Arcanum: Queen of Swords. Swords are the suit of combat. The Queen is a woman who is quick-witted and strong, but she is also a lonely figure. My deck guide says "One who has savored great happiness but who presently knows the anxiety of misfortune and reversal." GILES: Major Arcanum: The Hermit. Represents knowledge, prudence, caution. Minor Arcanum: King of Rods. Rods are the suit of knowledge. The King is an educated, honest, wise, devoted gentleman with a fatherly aspect. XANDER: Major Arcanum: This one's a bit tougher, but I'm going to go with The Lovers. This is the card of love (again, duh), but also trust, honor, deep feeling, and freedom of emotion. My deck guide also says, "Oblivious to possible consequences. The necessity of testing or subjecting to trial. Struggle between sacred and profane love." (I admit my Minor Arcanum: Knight of Cups. Cups are the suit of emotion. The Knight is a traveller who is arriving rather than departing. He both searches for opportunity and brings it. WILLOW: Major Arcanum: The Star. The Star represents faith, hope, inspiration and spiritual love. Minor Arcanum: Page of Pentacles. The Suit of Pentacles (also known as Coins) represents work, the application of knowledge for practical ends. (Rods are the suit of science, while pentacles are the suit of engineering.) The Page is serious student with great concentration, respect for learning, and desire for new ideas. She is a do-gooder and a bringer of news. - ------------- I was fascinated to note, after writing this, that when you look at the Minor Arcana I've picked, the main group of four includes one of each suit (Swords, Rods, Cups, Pentacles), *and* one of each rank (Queen, King, Knight, Page). It's also interesting to note that the two suits usually considered more masculine (Swords and Pentacles) are assigned to the two women, while the two more generally feminine suits (Cups and Rods) are assigned to the two men. - --------------- And just for fun, here's some quicker picks for lesser characters: ANGEL: Major: Judgment. Card of atonement and rebirth. Minor: King of Swords. The King is an active and forceful man. His suit is one of conflict and combat. CORDELIA: Major: The Fool. The card of immaturity, thoughtlessness, and extravagance. Minor: Queen of Pentacles. The Queen is a wealthy woman of luxury, who also possesses grace and dignity. (She's also supposed to possess a generous and noble soul, but oh well. Maybe she'll grow into those virtues.) MASTER: Major: The Devil. Means what you think. Minor: King of Swords, inverted. A cruel, selfish, and sadistic person. Dangerous and wicked. (Note that the upright version of this card is Angel's signifier...) COLIN: Major: Death. The card of transformation, of abrupt change of the old self into the new. Minor: Page of Rods, inverted. The Page of Rods is the card of the Herald, the bringer of news. Inverted, he is the bringer of bad news. MS. CALENDAR: Major: The High Priestess. Card of widsom, foresight, intuition, practical self-reliance. Minor: Queen of Rods. An understanding and knowledgable woman, friendly and practical, possessing charm, grace, and a sincere interest in others. - ---------- Well, that's it. Gotta run off now to do my shift at 1-900-PSYCHIC ;) - -- Maytree - ------------------------------------------------------- Jennifer Hawthorne :: jen@pacwest.DIESPAM.net [To reply to this message, remove DIESPAM from address] - ------------------------------------------------------- "I'm in the middle of fifteen things, all of them annoying!" - -- Ivanova, "Babylon 5: Midnight on the Firing Line" ------------------------------ End of buffy Digest V1 #129 *************************** To subscribe to buffy Digest, send the command: subscribe buffy-digest in the body of a message to "majordomo@xmission.com". If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe "local-buffy": subscribe buffy-digest local-buffy@your.domain.net A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "buffy-digest" in the commands above with "buffy". Back issues are available for anonymous FTP from ftp.xmission.com, in pub/lists/buffy/archive. These are organized by date.