From: owner-buffy-digest@lists.xmission.com (buffy-digest) To: buffy-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: buffy-digest V2 #609 Reply-To: buffy@lists.xmission.com Sender: owner-buffy-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-buffy-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk buffy-digest Saturday, December 12 1998 Volume 02 : Number 609 In this issue: BUFFY: Questions for The Wish BUFFY: Questions for The Wish BUFFY: the wish: TIME?! Re: BUFFY: the wish: TIME?! BUFFY: time debate BUFFY: X-Posed Cover Story BUFFY: The Wish re: BUFFY: *My* Wish Re: BUFFY: magazine note Re: BUFFY: Lover's Poll BUFFY: Buffy the Vampire Slayer tv soundtrack Re: BUFFY: Buffy as Lara Croft? Re: BUFFY: *My* Wish BUFFY: Winamp Skins Re: BUFFY: Hellmouth hath no fury like a Cordy scorned **SPOILERS** BUFFY: "The Wish" comments BUFFY: Any New Buffy Websites? I'll Link Them! BUFFY: The Wish See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the buffy or buffy-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 15:00:41 -0500 From: genevieve@gist.com (Genevieve Faulkner) Subject: BUFFY: Questions for The Wish Jamie asked... >I had some questions ( a lot) -what was with Buffy's scar on her face?, what >happened to the Annointed one?, why was Buffy in Cleveland?, why was Giles >still there?, is Oz still a werewolf?, who the heck made Willow/Xander vamps? As many people have said, The Wish seems to have taken place in season one. This means that Oz was not yet a werewolf. Giles was there because he had been called there to wait for Buffy (like Angel). Some glitch put Buffy in Cleveland (can't say what). The Master probably did not bother with the Anointed One, because he had already risen and the slayer was not in town. The scar? Your guess is as good as mine, but when you look at how little she cared about her looks (clothes, hair), she probably did not work so hard at keeping her face out of the way. People have asked where Jesse was. He was only vamped to be bait for Buffy, so he was probably just killed this time. All of this is just my opinion, Genevieve I'm a Buffaholic, I'm a Cordy Girl, "Tact is just not saying true stuff. I'll pass."(KBD)-- My new motto to live by. Love ya, Cordelia! Guardian of Cordelia's Homecoming dissapointment, and heartbreak (two defining moments in Cordy's life) I'm Spike's slave--and proud of it! I'm a GASPer, keeper of Giles' "Burt Reynolds"-like status - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 13:45:56 -0700 From: "Doyce Testerman" Subject: BUFFY: Questions for The Wish >>I had some questions ( a lot) -what was with Buffy's scar on her face?, what >>happened to the Annointed one?, why was Buffy in Cleveland?, why was Giles >>still there?, is Oz still a werewolf?, who the heck made Willow/Xander vamps? > >As many people have said, The Wish seems to have taken place in season one. Dunno. It looked to me like Larry was in touch with his softer side on the 'wish world', which didn't happen til season 2 -- actually the same episode Oz got vamped -- it's a horrible stereotype, but look at his hair on the Wish World -- not a typical Larry 'do. A Perm? >This means that Oz was not yet a werewolf. Giles was there because he had Acutally, Oz was turned into a werewolf when he was out of town visiting relatives. I just figured that with all the death and so forth going on in SunnyHell, he never had time to visit family, and so never got bit. I imagine this has been asked, but I missed two weeks of list mail. Is the girl who was part of the whitehats someone who just doesn't exist on the 'normal' side of reality, or someone I don't recognize? - -- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ LOVE THIS SHOW! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ bear@bears-cave.com {} -= Doyce =- {} www.bears-cave.com/btvs/ - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 13:12:22 -0800 From: alanazar@jasper.uor.edu Subject: BUFFY: the wish: TIME?! > As many people have said, The Wish seems to have taken place in season one. > I disagree with this--Cordelia was put into another dimension--not through time travel, or anything like that. She went into a parellel dimension-- so it must have been in the same time. - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 14:22:54 -0700 (MST) From: Mel Walker Subject: Re: BUFFY: the wish: TIME?! On Fri, 11 Dec 1998 alanazar@jasper.uor.edu wrote: > > As many people have said, The Wish seems to have taken place in season one. > > > I disagree with this--Cordelia was put into another dimension--not > through time travel, or anything like that. She went into a parellel > dimension-- so it must have been in the same time. I think people are being far too sci-fi-ish. It was a wish -- we don't have any definitive answer as to whether or not it was the same time or not. Besides, why should a parallel dimension or universe run at the same rate of time compared to ours? We do know one thing: Buffy's "Home" reality no longer existed in any useful sense: the "New" reality was the "real" reality after the wish was made. The demon said as much, if I recall. - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 13:31:53 -0800 From: alanazar@jasper.uor.edu Subject: BUFFY: time debate > I think people are being far too sci-fi-ish. It was a wish -- we don't > have any definitive answer as to whether or not it was the same time or > not. Besides, why should a parallel dimension or universe run at the same > rate of time compared to ours? > I don't think I'm sci-fi ish. I'm not even into sci fi. It had the same rate of time because it was the same universe with the exception of Buffy's absence in the town of Sunnydale. World history was intact... etc. We're talking about a difference in the past three years, that's all. I don't see any evidence of it being a different time... or maybe I missed a great argument for this theory. Enlighten me. What makes people think this??? Autumn - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 17:16:18 -0800 From: "jim r." Subject: BUFFY: X-Posed Cover Story Hello all, I just went to the mall today and I looked at the Magazine rack in Waldenbooks, looking for some Buffy stuffs when to my complete and utter shock the cover of X-Posed has the whole cover of Buffy, a new season three picture! They all look great. Just thought some of you guys might want to go and pick it up. It has a couple of small pics all throughout the mag as well. Definitely a good buy for any Buffy fan. Jill Keeper of Buffy's goodbye note Keeper of Xander's concern for Willow's health - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 19:10:24 -0500 From: TedJMill@mindspring.com Subject: BUFFY: The Wish A thought: could you read vampires and vampirism in "The Wish" as a metaphor for AIDS? It would offer insight into the people who didn't move out of Sunnydale: "Why should we move? Sure, some people have been killed by vampires, but it's their own fault; they're asking for it with that lifestyle of theirs, staying out late and wearing flashy clothes and all. Decent, moral, God-fearing people don't get bitten by vampires." (or conservatives can read the people who stay in Sunnydale as metaphors for gay people who fail to change their lifestyle despite AIDS). The monthly memorial services represent memorial services for AIDS victims, Larry's presence on Giles' anti-vampire team takes on added significance, etc. Probably not an intentional metaphor, since the metaphors on BtVS tend to be more explicit, but interesting. - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 17:13:02 PST From: "Elizabeth Tuckwood" Subject: re: BUFFY: *My* Wish Mickie Erickson wrote: >The one that shocked me for some reason, was Buffy staking Xander without >a second thought, 'Just another Vampire' Yes, that caught my attention: her facial expression, like she was just as soul-dead as any vampire. No personality left, just a killer. Impressive. Elizabeth ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 20:11:13 EST From: Vass99@aol.com Subject: Re: BUFFY: magazine note In a message dated 12/10/98 4:23:41 PM Eastern Standard Time, monet@arches.uga.edu writes: << Of note: There is a new magazine (name escapes me) where it has like the 20 Hottest Guys and has David Boreanez on the cover with a three page artcle inside. I think the pics are also new. Nicholas and Seth are part of the 20 but David is number 1. >> i think the magazine being referred to here is called Teen Celebrity, and if not its still a good magazine to check out cause David is on the cover and there is a good article on him along with a "say what" section in the back about buffy and pictures of nick and seth. Amy - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 20:04:54 EST From: Vass99@aol.com Subject: Re: BUFFY: Lover's Poll In a message dated 12/9/98 11:06:36 PM Eastern Standard Time, DaniLynn27@aol.com writes: << this time last year, Bad Eggs, Cordelia didn't want to be seen in public with Xander but certainly found him useful for making out in private utility closets. And now guys don't want to be seen in public with "Xander Harris's castoff", but they're perfectly willing to spend time with her in private. >> Speaking of bad eggs, I was watching it last night and in the beginning when cordy and xander are in health class, Xander in a round about way refers to cordy as Vapid. I'll quote "What about having to fein (proly spelt wrong) in her vapid little chit chat just to get some touch" I thought it was wierd. I'm proly the only one though. Thanks for letting me ramble Amy - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 21:53:29 EST From: JNordheden@aol.com Subject: BUFFY: Buffy the Vampire Slayer tv soundtrack TVT records has tentatively scheduled the official soundtrack for a 4/20/99 release. No word yet on any track listing. Back to lurking, Jack Nordheden JNordheden@aol.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 01:09:03 -0500 From: "D. Gottlieb" Subject: Re: BUFFY: Buffy as Lara Croft? On the topic of Buffy's possible connection with video games, has anyone else heard about the new "Resident Evil" movie that's in the works? Here's the info I've got on it so far (from Next Generation magazine - December 98): Resident Evil Studio: Constantin Producer: Berd Eichenger Director: George Romero (unconfirmed) or George Sluizer Writer: George Romero (unconfirmed) or Alan McElroy Status: Preproduction Cast: Sarah Michelle Gellar (unconfirmed), Jason Patric (unconfirmed) Release Date: 1999 Anyone else think this could kick ass? Combine a good writer/director of horror stuff like Romero, a good setting like Resident Evil (great horror game for the Playstation), and Sarah... Could life get much better? D dg003e@uhura.cc.rochester.edu Avid worshipper of the goddess that is SMG - - ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 01:36:49 EST From: TknoPagan@aol.com Subject: Re: BUFFY: *My* Wish I think this was basically because Buffy, in the "bizarro-world" was trained by a completely different world. Who knows, her other watcher could have been as blunt andto the point as Mrs. Post. And maybe for the fact that she is in Cleveland had to do with the fact that Codry didnt want her to come to Sunnydale, so whoever had to change everything, Anya or whoever maybe she had to live in another state before so she had no possibility of coming to Sunnydale. Oh well I am going to stop rambling.... Jason TknoPagan@aol.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 02:43:29 EST From: Chewie615@aol.com Subject: BUFFY: Winamp Skins Do any of you know of a website where I could find some good winamp skins of the whole cast or at least cast members other than SMG? I'd like to add to my collection. Thanks a bundle! Mary - - ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 02:12:37 -0800 From: Lisa Rose Subject: Re: BUFFY: Hellmouth hath no fury like a Cordy scorned **SPOILERS** Hey Seanan, I'm still not used to seeing you actually post to the list, you consummate lurker you.... At 12/10/98 02:08 PM , Seanan McGuire wrote: >Thing is, well, 1) you're right. Cordelia _wasn't_ scorned. And at >the same time you have the issue of 2) what exactly did Willow and > Xander _do_? They thought that they were going to die. So they >kissed. Ooooo. Pardon me while I get all offended. Agreed. Even without all the compelling extenuating circumstances, it was still just a kiss. And anyone who is even vaguely poly has got to be asking "what's up with all the guilt and outrage over this?" Willow's line about all her parts being "for Oz only" made me want to barf. What is she, his possession? Are we going to see him locking her in a chastity belt anytime soon? >Yes, he betrayed her trust -- and yes, he's fighting an uphill >battle to get it back. While it doesn't justify his actions, it's still a >fact that he fought his hormones a bloody long time. The bottom line really is though that Oz and Cordy are going to have to accept the fact that the bond between Willow and Xander is older and more powerful that either of them will have with either of those two. W&X have been slated as soulmates by the conventions of literary romantic destiny every bit as much as Angel & Buffy. Even if that doesn't manifest sexually. Oz and Cordy just won't be able to get between them (barring some mauling of the mythos Joss has already set up). >Which is why I have an issue with Anya (and did anyone else keep expecting >her to start singing 'A Rumour In St. Petersburg'?) being the 'patron >saint' of anything. 'Meddling sadistic preyer-upon of scorned women' >seems a lot more likely. Yeah, she must've known what eventually happened to Cordy in the alt-world and she seemed bemused by the cruel irony of it if anything. >> This ep was gripping and fascinating to me (as were the dark alt-worlds >> of "It's a Wonderful Life" and "Back to the Future-II" but I was >Wiping out the world is _fun_. And (if done properly) >without long-term consequence. As depressing as dystopias are to me, they are nonetheless irresistible to watch or read about. Especially when they are alt-versions of decent places (because the contrast is so clear). I still want to see more episodes of the "evil" Voyager crew that the historical-revisionists on that one planet cooked up. That evil Janeway kicked major butt! >> quite depressed afterwards having watched all of the slayerettes >> (my adopted "family") meet such cruel and matter-of-fact ends (in > >I bet they had a bloody lot of fun doing it. Tearing down icons without having to pay for it in the end. Yet we are still stuck with the visceral reaction of watching it happen. >When the Slayer slays alone, the Slayer dies the same way. It's a lesson >that's been driven home time and time again. Empowerment is all well and >good -- the Slayer archetype can't _help_ being empowering -- but it's >nothing if it's power without backup. Yeah, this wasn't "It's a Wonderful Life" where the message was "Your life makes a difference." Because Buffy eventually did show up and did not make a difference (in the long run). The real message was "Don't isolate yourself, fall back on your friends." For both Cordy and Buffy, just as in "WSWB" Joss likes this message. >It's hard not to be low-tech when you've been trapped underground for x >many years. And, like Henry Ford, he seemed to be going with production >above common sense. _Never_ kill your resources! Hey, were Model T's really *that* dangerous? >And where _was_ Jesse, anyway? Does anyone else have this vaguely >disturbing image of him as Willow's first 'toy' after she'd been brought >over? Yechhh, maybe after she killed her family? >I'd think it more likely that she'd have been gathered up as a gift for >the Master himself, bein' pretty and noisy an' all. Although it's always >possible that in the no-Buffy world she just didn't go that night. Or that Anya warped the alt-reality so that Cordy could be present at least at the point she entered it. >This was a Buffy who didn't care -- closer to 'Anne' then to 'WttH.' I'm >glad she's not _our_ Buffy. You and me both. Closest of all the "WSWB" I think in terms of isolationism, with a hefty dose of Faith's self-destructive disillusionment (a far cry from the little val-gal that Buffy had been at Hemery; what a transition! more so than our "real" Buffy!). >It's always the mice that make the most deadly lions, when you give them >the chance. They have the aggressions to work out. Xander pays back all of the school elite who once shunned and mocked him? Then Jonathon would make a hell of a deadly vamp! >Remember Jesse? He lost a lot of dork points after he became a >god/hatrack. Maybe Xander just realized that he didn't have to play well >with others anymore. Yeah, that was the counterexample I was trying to ignore (thanks a lot! *g*). Jesse's transition reminded me of the nerd kid's in "Christine" >Cordy was everyone's old crush. Present company included? Lisa - - ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 10:28:43 -0600 From: "Ryan Reid" Subject: BUFFY: "The Wish" comments Hey everyone!! As i was re-watching "The Wish" the other day, i noticed a few things i thought i would bring up on the list (forgive me if these have been discussed, i've gotten behind in my digests) - -Before the paralell world, willow told buffy that "Amy said she saw Cordy at the mall." This comment raises 2 questions. Sunnydale has a mall? I could see a maybe an outlet mall, but for some reason, i can't see cordy shopping there. And willow said Amy told her, so are Amy (madison, "the Witch" "BBB") and willow friends now? It'd make since, seeing as how they are both witches. As far as things in the paralell world: - -I was kind of disapointed/suprised Buffy was still alive. To me, it seems to be a special thing that she's survived this long, and one of the main reasons for her survival were her great watcher and help from friends, both of which were lacking in cleveland, from what i understood. But i guess it just show's how special Buffy truly is. However, she didn't seem to have much brains, her plan to just march in and kill the master obviously wasn't a good one, i figured her bullheadedness would get her killed long before this. But, now that i think about it, this has already happened (in "Prophecy girl"). - -Giles mentioned Xander and Willow as the masters "most vicious disciples" but why would they be the most vicious disciples? I mean, there are LOTS of other vamps who are a lot older than them, when you think about it, Willow and Xander would just be newbies. It just didn't make much sense to have them as the most vicous disciples, but Nick and Aly played the parts very well. they reminded me a LOT of Spike and Drusilla. - -Also, just a nitpick, when Oz throws Willow up against the wooden cage/stake, the broke off piece that went through here didn't appear to go thru her heart. to me, it looked more like the stomach. and also, if it did got thru the heart, it totally disappeared once she turned to dust. Just me being picky :) All in all, this episode was AWESOME! I loved it! Ryan Keeper of: Joyce's glass she threw in fight with Buffy. Cordelia's yellow backless dress* (Becoming II), flowers from Xander and hospital gown (Lover's Walk). Opening Credits for Season 3. Buffy's acceptance that she "sucks at undercover" (Anne). Buffy's look to Willow when they find out they are playing dodgeball (The Pack). Webmaster of "The Bronze" Keeper Site http://pouncer.simplenet.com/bronze - - ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 08:36:18 -0800 (PST) From: Sonja Marie Subject: BUFFY: Any New Buffy Websites? I'll Link Them! Hi all, I'm updating the Sonja Marie's Buffy the Vampire Slayer Links Page Tues, and Wanted to know if anyone had a new page they'd like to be linked in the update (if they AREN'T ALREADY LINKED. Email them to me PRIVATELY at gaspers@eskimo.com (perferably). NEW LOCATION (make note of it) http://www.planetx.com/~sonja/btvsurls/btvsurls.html Any site I can't view or crashes my browser will not be linked. Sonja Marie - President - Anthony Stewart Head Fan Club (ASHFC) Official Anthony Head WebPage - http://www.geocities.com/TelevisionCity/7728/ Owner of the Jeff Fahey, Paul Wylie, Anthony S. Head, & Buffy-Beta Lists Pres. of Giles' Appreciation Society Panters - GASP!- Keeper of Coats & Ties Anthony Stewart Head (Giles-BTVS) About What Fans Sent Him in the Mail: "Fair amount of lingerie, yeah, all of which I tried, none of which fitted" - - ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 15:07:41 -0500 From: TedJMill@mindspring.com Subject: BUFFY: The Wish Something I thought of which might be parodying "It's a Wonderful Life": In "It's a Wonderful Life" Clarence the angel gets his wings as a result of showing George Bailey the alternate reality. In "The Wish", Anya the demon LOSES her powers and becomes mortal as a result of showing Cordelia the alternate reality. - - ------------------------------ End of buffy-digest V2 #609 *************************** To subscribe to buffy or buffy-digest, send the command subscribe buffy-digest or subscribe buffy to majordomo@xmission.com. You will need to go through a confirmation process, and the listowners have to manually approve your subscription request, so it may take some time. Back issues of this digest can be found at: ftp://ftp.xmission.com/pub/lists/buffy/archive/ For help, contact Jill Kirby (jtkirby@mcs.com) or sah (romana@mindspring.com)