From: owner-canslim-digest@lists.xmission.com (canslim-digest) To: canslim-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: canslim-digest V2 #2787 Reply-To: canslim Sender: owner-canslim-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-canslim-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-No-Archive: yes canslim-digest Tuesday, August 13 2002 Volume 02 : Number 2787 In this issue: RE: Pearl of Wisdom (was [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection) Re: Pearl of Wisdom (was [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection) Re: [CANSLIM] mgmt ownership Re: [CANSLIM] Identifying NEW leaders [CANSLIM] Re: WTW (was: Which One Is Better - Updated) Re: Pearl of Wisdom (was [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection) Re: [CANSLIM] cup-without-handle; "tightness" questions Re: [CANSLIM] cup-without-handle; "tightness" questions Re: [CANSLIM] analysts ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 09:01:35 -0500 From: "Kelly Short" Subject: RE: Pearl of Wisdom (was [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection) Nancy, Believe me when I tell you that your words of thanks are misdirected! = The true Pearls of Wisdom came from several group members- but none of = them by the name of Kelly. I too was the recipient, not sender, of such = wisdom. I believe Winston expelled most of these pearls and I too would = like to know where he would get such information to answer Question #4. = So- not to pass the buck- but..... Winston???? Any other Pearls hiding = beneath the shell? Katherine? Fred? Duke? Tom? The rest of the M.O.B. = Squad? And Nancy- thank you for the praise! It felt great if only for a = fleeting moment! Kelly - -----Original Message----- From: NANCY POLCARO [mailto:zillagirl@msn.com] Sent: Monday, August 12, 2002 6:57 PM To: canslim@lists.xmission.com Subject: Re: Pearl of Wisdom (was [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection) Kelly-catching up on myt mail also-I thought your presentation was = really=20 good-I wish I was that far right now. Can you tell me where you got = your=20 info? IBD? Daily Graphs? Other source? Thanks nancy >From: "Duke Miller" >Reply-To: canslim@lists.xmission.com >To: >Subject: Pearl of Wisdom (was [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for=20 >dissection) >Date: Sun, 11 Aug 2002 09:33:54 -0400 > >Winston, et al: > >I'm catching up with my backlog of CANSLIM list messages, and a thought >just occurred to me after reading Winston's reply to Kelly below. = (Sans >header I would have surely assumed it was Katherine's response!) > >Your point #4 is a true Pearl of Wisdom--I.e., it provokes further >thought, and is what I call an "a-ha". The reason? How bombarded we >are with information and desktops riddled with shortcuts to investment >net "tools." But when it's all said and done--technicals, >fundamentals, charts, ratings, etc.--spending time in thought about how >will the rest of the market...react to the point or issue and how >soon--is what it's all about, isn't it? You can't measure it, you can >accurately predict it, can't touch it, can't feel it. But if the >response to that question is not, albeit in you gut, positive, you >shouldn't touch it, should you? > >Thank you for that. > >Duke > > > -----Original Message----- >From: owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com >[mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Winston Little >Sent: Friday, August 09, 2002 12:15 PM >To: canslim@lists.xmission.com >Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection > > > >Kelly: >My hope is that the note was of some help, but please keep the = following >in mind: >1. The goal is neither to whip or throw you back into the pond. >2. ALWAYS QUESTION anything that is said or stated.... do you agree = with >the point or issue stated or asked? >3. If you agree with the point, then is what is the significance of the >point or issue? The point may be true but of little value. >4. How will the rest of the market traders/investors/or others react = to >the point or issue, and how soon? >Depending on the results of the evaluate the points above (or others), >you may then want to respond and show the other person a different >perspective. > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Kelly Short >To: canslim@lists.xmission.com >Sent: Friday, August 09, 2002 11:22 AM >Subject: RE: [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection > >Winston, > >You give me new understanding of DD. After reading your email I whip >myself for not investigating further before posting. Back to the newbie >pond for me. I feel like those Snakehead fish in Maryland- so close to >making it from the pond to the big river, then the big bad human ("M") >comes and throws me back in the pond. Thanks for your observations- = I'll >keep hacking away. > >Kelly > -----Original Message----- >From: Winston Little [mailto:wlittle1@peoplepc.com] >Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2002 4:31 PM >To: canslim@lists.xmission.com >Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection > > > >Kelly: >A few comments: >1. Chart pattern: >If cup-with handle (start 27 May, end 01 Aug) then the shape is V-Cup >which is not ideal. >2. Handle is 2 days long (minimum desired is five days) on 03 and 05 >Aug. >3. Heavy volume in handle (again undesirable) >4. Breakout volume on 06 Aug was 166% of average daily =3D ok. >5. Debt to equity ratio =3D 4.3 This may be a bit high, as others in = the >top five of the IBD group were at 0.98, 0.18 and 0.83. The one = exception >was the government sponsored agency FRE (Freddie Mac) at 31. >6. Largest concern was roll off in revenue in Q2 of 2002 to $$998 >million, was $1233 in Q1, N/A in Q4 of 200, $1272 in Q3 of 2001, $1234 >in Q2 of 2001 etc. Surprisingly the eps reported in Q2 of 2002 was >highest at $1.48 up from $1.32 in Q1 of 2002. Does this imply there may >be a re-statement in the works as day of reckoning approaches for CEO >and CFO? >CCR is believed to be a sub-prime lender. Does this mean difficulty as >the slow economy persists and consumers start to run out of cash? > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Kelly Short >To: canslim@lists.xmission.com >Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2002 4:50 PM >Subject: [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection > >CCR - Countrywide Cr Inds Inc > >EPS growth could be better but are we more forgiving over the past 3 >qtrs (after all- CCR is positive EPS growth for past 3 qtrs which in >itself is an accomplishment)? Appears to be coming out of CWH formation >(all though not as beautiful a formation as the Mona Lisa or anything >IBD would show us). Thoughts? > > >IBD Ratings >Smart Select 99 >EPS Rating 94 >RPS 89 >Industry Group Rank A >S+P M+ROE A >A/D A+ > > >Technical Rating 98 >Fundamental Rating 96 >Attractiveness Rating 99 >Group's Technical Rating 79 >Group's Fundamental Rating 86 > > > >Rank within Industry Group >Industry Rank (08/08/02) 32 > >Overall 100 >Technical 100 >Fundamental 91 >Attriveness 100 >Top 5 Companies w/in Group > > > >CCR > > > >DORL > > > >NCEN > > > >NDE > > > >FRE >Group % Chg to Date 2% >Group % Chg Last 12 mths 4% >Group % Chg Last 4 weeks 4% > > >Performance > >Up/Down Vol 1.3 >3 Yr. EPS Growth 16% >3 Yr. Sales Growth 25% >EPS Growth (Quarterly) % Chg >Qtr -1 $0.64 5% >Qtr -2 $0.61 8% >Qtr -3 $0.56 5% >Qtr -4 $0.53 8% >Qtr -5 $0.49 0% >Qtr -6 $0.49 > >Revenue Growth >Qtr -1 293,159 3% >Qtr -2 285,799 1% >Qtr -3 283,199 1% >Qtr -4 281,332 3% >Qtr -5 272,860 0% >Qtr -6 272,489 > > _____ > >For your protection, this e-mail message has been scanned for viruses. > >Visit us at http://www.neoris.com/ > > _____ > > > > _________________________________________________________________ Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.=20 http://www.hotmail.com - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. _________________________________________________________________________= ___ For your protection, this e-mail message has been scanned for viruses. Visit us at http://www.neoris.com/ - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 10:24:38 -0400 From: "Tom Worley" Subject: Re: Pearl of Wisdom (was [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection) Kelly, while the market has always been one of the purest forms of supply and demand dynamics, it is first and foremost controlled by human emotion. Systems such as CANSLIM introduce a certain degree of mechanical aspects, but our interpretation of what we see and hear, particularly with regard to "M", remains very human, and emotional in our response. If you have never studied human psychology, then you should, especially Herd Mentality. It is routinely seen in the marketplace. I lost a lot of money arguing with the markets over the outstanding fundamentals of stocks that were out of favor. Bottom line, if the market doesn't like it, then it's not going to perform up to expectations. And that's why looking at trailing PE ratios is a waste of time, they are merely history, no one is likely to react to them. On the other hand, forecasts / projected PE ratios can create a sense of expectation, hence drive the price to where the stock trades at a premium based on that expectation. Right now, with fears of recession, terrorism, economy weak and not recovering, corp profits very weak and may not recover as fast as expected, the "M" is disconnected from its fundies. If the economic recovery, and thereby corp profits, do in fact improve long term, the day will come when the expectations will shift from negative to positive, and the markets will start a new bull market. And that will be because sentiment (human psychology) shifts to bullish from bearish. - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kelly Short" To: Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2002 10:01 AM Subject: RE: Pearl of Wisdom (was [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection) Nancy, Believe me when I tell you that your words of thanks are misdirected! The true Pearls of Wisdom came from several group members- but none of them by the name of Kelly. I too was the recipient, not sender, of such wisdom. I believe Winston expelled most of these pearls and I too would like to know where he would get such information to answer Question #4. So- not to pass the buck- but..... Winston???? Any other Pearls hiding beneath the shell? Katherine? Fred? Duke? Tom? The rest of the M.O.B. Squad? And Nancy- thank you for the praise! It felt great if only for a fleeting moment! Kelly - -----Original Message----- From: NANCY POLCARO [mailto:zillagirl@msn.com] Sent: Monday, August 12, 2002 6:57 PM To: canslim@lists.xmission.com Subject: Re: Pearl of Wisdom (was [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection) Kelly-catching up on myt mail also-I thought your presentation was really good-I wish I was that far right now. Can you tell me where you got your info? IBD? Daily Graphs? Other source? Thanks nancy >From: "Duke Miller" >Reply-To: canslim@lists.xmission.com >To: >Subject: Pearl of Wisdom (was [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for >dissection) >Date: Sun, 11 Aug 2002 09:33:54 -0400 > >Winston, et al: > >I'm catching up with my backlog of CANSLIM list messages, and a thought >just occurred to me after reading Winston's reply to Kelly below. (Sans >header I would have surely assumed it was Katherine's response!) > >Your point #4 is a true Pearl of Wisdom--I.e., it provokes further >thought, and is what I call an "a-ha". The reason? How bombarded we >are with information and desktops riddled with shortcuts to investment >net "tools." But when it's all said and done--technicals, >fundamentals, charts, ratings, etc.--spending time in thought about how >will the rest of the market...react to the point or issue and how >soon--is what it's all about, isn't it? You can't measure it, you can >accurately predict it, can't touch it, can't feel it. But if the >response to that question is not, albeit in you gut, positive, you >shouldn't touch it, should you? > >Thank you for that. > >Duke > > > -----Original Message----- >From: owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com >[mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Winston Little >Sent: Friday, August 09, 2002 12:15 PM >To: canslim@lists.xmission.com >Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection > > > >Kelly: >My hope is that the note was of some help, but please keep the following >in mind: >1. The goal is neither to whip or throw you back into the pond. >2. ALWAYS QUESTION anything that is said or stated.... do you agree with >the point or issue stated or asked? >3. If you agree with the point, then is what is the significance of the >point or issue? The point may be true but of little value. >4. How will the rest of the market traders/investors/or others react to >the point or issue, and how soon? >Depending on the results of the evaluate the points above (or others), >you may then want to respond and show the other person a different >perspective. > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Kelly Short >To: canslim@lists.xmission.com >Sent: Friday, August 09, 2002 11:22 AM >Subject: RE: [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection > >Winston, > >You give me new understanding of DD. After reading your email I whip >myself for not investigating further before posting. Back to the newbie >pond for me. I feel like those Snakehead fish in Maryland- so close to >making it from the pond to the big river, then the big bad human ("M") >comes and throws me back in the pond. Thanks for your observations- I'll >keep hacking away. > >Kelly > -----Original Message----- >From: Winston Little [mailto:wlittle1@peoplepc.com] >Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2002 4:31 PM >To: canslim@lists.xmission.com >Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection > > > >Kelly: >A few comments: >1. Chart pattern: >If cup-with handle (start 27 May, end 01 Aug) then the shape is V-Cup >which is not ideal. >2. Handle is 2 days long (minimum desired is five days) on 03 and 05 >Aug. >3. Heavy volume in handle (again undesirable) >4. Breakout volume on 06 Aug was 166% of average daily = ok. >5. Debt to equity ratio = 4.3 This may be a bit high, as others in the >top five of the IBD group were at 0.98, 0.18 and 0.83. The one exception >was the government sponsored agency FRE (Freddie Mac) at 31. >6. Largest concern was roll off in revenue in Q2 of 2002 to $$998 >million, was $1233 in Q1, N/A in Q4 of 200, $1272 in Q3 of 2001, $1234 >in Q2 of 2001 etc. Surprisingly the eps reported in Q2 of 2002 was >highest at $1.48 up from $1.32 in Q1 of 2002. Does this imply there may >be a re-statement in the works as day of reckoning approaches for CEO >and CFO? >CCR is believed to be a sub-prime lender. Does this mean difficulty as >the slow economy persists and consumers start to run out of cash? > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Kelly Short >To: canslim@lists.xmission.com >Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2002 4:50 PM >Subject: [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection > >CCR - Countrywide Cr Inds Inc > >EPS growth could be better but are we more forgiving over the past 3 >qtrs (after all- CCR is positive EPS growth for past 3 qtrs which in >itself is an accomplishment)? Appears to be coming out of CWH formation >(all though not as beautiful a formation as the Mona Lisa or anything >IBD would show us). Thoughts? > > >IBD Ratings >Smart Select 99 >EPS Rating 94 >RPS 89 >Industry Group Rank A >S+P M+ROE A >A/D A+ > > >Technical Rating 98 >Fundamental Rating 96 >Attractiveness Rating 99 >Group's Technical Rating 79 >Group's Fundamental Rating 86 > > > >Rank within Industry Group >Industry Rank (08/08/02) 32 > >Overall 100 >Technical 100 >Fundamental 91 >Attriveness 100 >Top 5 Companies w/in Group > > > >CCR > > > >DORL > > > >NCEN > > > >NDE > > > >FRE >Group % Chg to Date 2% >Group % Chg Last 12 mths 4% >Group % Chg Last 4 weeks 4% > > >Performance > >Up/Down Vol 1.3 >3 Yr. EPS Growth 16% >3 Yr. Sales Growth 25% >EPS Growth (Quarterly) % Chg >Qtr -1 $0.64 5% >Qtr -2 $0.61 8% >Qtr -3 $0.56 5% >Qtr -4 $0.53 8% >Qtr -5 $0.49 0% >Qtr -6 $0.49 > >Revenue Growth >Qtr -1 293,159 3% >Qtr -2 285,799 1% >Qtr -3 283,199 1% >Qtr -4 281,332 3% >Qtr -5 272,860 0% >Qtr -6 272,489 > > _____ > >For your protection, this e-mail message has been scanned for viruses. > >Visit us at http://www.neoris.com/ > > _____ > > > > _________________________________________________________________ Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. ____________________________________________________________________________ For your protection, this e-mail message has been scanned for viruses. Visit us at http://www.neoris.com/ - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 10:27:10 -0400 From: "Tom Worley" Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] mgmt ownership Ann, I always want management to have a serious stake in the future of the company, and for more reasons than the continuation of their salary and stock options. I want them to share in the ownership, so even with a large mature company I prefer to see at least 10-15% management ownership. It's rare to find it, however, as present management is unlikely to be part of the original founders (MSFT being a rare exception). With a small or micro cap company, present day management is more often the original owners of the company from before they went public. Thus, I expect and demand far higher ownership. - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ann" To: Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2002 9:57 AM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] mgmt ownership Tom, No matter what size of the company? (Or do I assume that you mean micro caps, knowing the stocks you like). WON mentioned 2-3% ownership of the larger companies as being typical (although he didn't say 'preferable'). Ann - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Worley" To: Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2002 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] mgmt ownership : I have owned corps up to 80%, but prefer 40-50% : : ----- Original Message ----- : From: "Ann" : To: "CANSLIM Listserv" : Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2002 9:42 AM : Subject: [CANSLIM] mgmt ownership : : : I can't seem to find a preferable number (minimum/maximum) for management : ownership in HTMMIS (and I can't find my 24 Lessons). He just seems to put : average numbers. : : I did see that ownership is likely to be a smaller percentage for older, : larger cos., because the management has died or moved on! : : What do people use? : : Thanks, : : Ann : : : - : -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" : -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or : -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. : : : : : - : -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" : -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or : -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 10:29:07 -0400 From: Spencer48@aol.com Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Identifying NEW leaders Duke: I'm on vacation and don't always have access to a computer (and never to my notes-which are at home);however, regarding your mention of WON's no handle policy: I believe there was one Investor Corner article recently which warned its readers to be wary of cups without handles. I believe it admonished that cups without handles are not setting up properly. Furthermore, in this market, it added, you want to see break outs from near perfect formations before purchasing the stock. jans In a message dated Tue, 6 Aug 2002 4:12:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, dukemill@tampabay.rr.com writes: > I've been absent a few days from the list, and in reviewing it, I noted someone saying that a particular chart looked pretty good, but it had no handle yet. Then I noted in today's Investor's Corner, it's not totally necessary to have a handle. After thinking about this and reviewing a few "handle-less" charts. All I could conclude is it's really a pattern that caters to good ol' IBD hindsight, right? Buying as the stock breaks out past the left peak of the handle (+ $.10) is > risking that it's just setting up for a handle, right? - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 09:32:35 -0500 From: "Katherine Malm" Subject: [CANSLIM] Re: WTW (was: Which One Is Better - Updated) Hi Mike, WTW didn't have the smoothest base, but it was a 12 week base nonetheless. That's not unusual given the gyrations of the market as it's been groping for this latest bottom. So that you can see my personal take on it, I've annotated the chart at: http://WallStreet-LLC.com/canslim/WTW081302.jpg Gene noted that WTW is also featured in IBD's weblink today. They have also annotated a chart, so you can see their interpretation at: http://www.investors.com/weblink/ Katherine - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2002 8:50 AM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Which One Is Better - Updated Katherine, Can you expound on the statement that WTW broke out? In looking at the chart, I can sorta see a v shaped cwh, but in the handle, the volume did NOT dry up.....what would you say the pivot point was? Thanks Mike Niemotka , PE Sr. Principal Engineer Baxter Healthcare Corporation Route 120 & Wilson Road Round Lake, IL 60073 Tel (847) 270-4075 Fax (847) 270-4525 michael_niemotka@baxter.com "Katherine Malm" To: canslim@lists.xmission.com Sent by: cc: owner-canslim@lists.xm Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Which One Is Better - Updated ission.com 08/12/2002 08:02 PM Please respond to canslim You know, I have a simple solution for this kind of dilemma....don't use the numbers. I know it's tempting to use a number like this, as it seems to "tell you everything" about the stock. But I think once you summarize summary numbers, you're asking for trouble. I rank the composite score as "mildly useful." Here's an example. I'll select a couple of stocks that have come up for discussion here in the last few months: WTW and TOL. Scores? WTW = 96 TOL = 95 Yet, look at the charts. WTW broke out today, TOL is rolling over and playing dead. Doesn't sound like a score of 95/96 "tells" me everything I need to know about the stocks. Katherine ----- Original Message ----- From: Gene Ricci To: canslim@lists.xmission.com Sent: Monday, August 12, 2002 7:41 PM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Which One Is Better - Updated Arghhh! Same definition Same data base Same company different numbers! ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill Triffet To: canslim@lists.xmission.com Sent: Monday, August 12, 2002 6:58 PM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Which One Is Better - Updated Either way, it appears that the IBD data paints a prettier picture of the stocks. -Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gene Ricci" To: Sent: Monday, August 12, 2002 4:50 PM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Which One Is Better - Updated I just had today's update figures for DGO sent to me. The 3 columns are 8/9 DGO data 8/12 IBD readings 30 minutes ago 8/12 DGO just received today's download Hi Katherine, I hadn't checked today and after reading your note, I 'thought' I was in error. However, I just went and checked several stocks: 8/9 8/12 8/12 DGO IBD DGO AAON 85 86 83 AIR 38 55 32 ABCB 89 90 90 ABM 77 85 75 ABN 58 67 58 ACE 69 86 71 ACMR 92 95 92 AES 24 30 25 AFCE 72 79 74 AFL 92 95 91 The first ten (10) I checked showed different numbers. My question still stands, which one is better? Gene ----- Original Message ----- From: Katherine Malm To: canslim@lists.xmission.com Sent: Monday, August 12, 2002 5:47 PM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] Which One Is Better Hi Gene, There seems to be conflicting information on this...See DGO's reply to my recent inquiry (7/31) about the very same thing: Hi Katherine, Thank you for your recent email to Daily Graphs Online. I apologize, but the recent additions to our services have not yet been reflected in our Image Maps resource. We plan on making the update soon. TO address your question, I would like to confirm that the Composite Rating you see on our service is the same SmartSelect® Composite Rating that is provided by the Investor's Business Daily and investors.com. Please write back if you have any questions or need assistance. Best regards, Dan Daily Graphs Online www.dailygraphs.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Gene Ricci To: canslim@lists.xmission.com Sent: Monday, August 12, 2002 4:06 PM Subject: [CANSLIM] Which One Is Better Let's see, IBD provides an Overall Rating and now DGO provides a Composite Rating. Has anyone determined which one is better? Gene The new SmartSelect® Composite Rating in Investor's Business Daily and the Stock Checkup Overall Rating found on investors.com are based on different formulas. The SmartSelect® Composite Rating combines all 5 SmartSelect Ratings into one easy-to-use rating. More weight is placed on EPS and RS Rating, and the stock's percent off its 52-week high is also included in the formula. Results are then compared to all other companies, and each company is assigned a rating from 1-99 with 99 being the best. This rating is designed to help you get a quick feel for how a company's SmartSelect® Ratings compare to all other stocks in our database. This is intended to be an additional tool to help you find the stocks with the highest SmartSelect® Ratings, quickly and easily. The Overall Rating in the Stock Checkup is determined by a proprietary formula incorporating all five of the Stock Checkup ratings. These are the Technical Rating, Fundamental Rating, Attractiveness Rating, Group's Technical Rating and Group's Fundamental Rating. The Stock Checkup uses over 30 different variables including all the SmartSelect® Ratings to calculate the Overall Rating. When using the Stock Checkup, focus not only on the Overall Rating but all 6 of the Checkup Ratings. Also study how the stock compares to its group within the individual Checkup Ratings. - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 08:43:23 -0600 From: "Patrick Wahl" Subject: Re: Pearl of Wisdom (was [CANSLIM] CCR - I offer this up for dissection) I think anyone who is an active investor would benefit from reading the tulip bulb section of "Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds". Read that and you'll be reminded of the internet bubble, telecom, biotech a few years before, etc. etc. Like you said, happens every few years in the market. On 13 Aug 2002 at 10:24, Tom Worley wrote: > If you have never studied human psychology, then you should, especially Herd > Mentality. It is routinely seen in the marketplace. I lost a lot of money - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 10:50:53 -0400 From: Spencer48@aol.com Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] cup-without-handle; "tightness" questions Katherine: Couldn't "churning" also identify a stock which has been weak (ie. in a downtrend), but then does not make any more headway down-and does this on heavy volume. Wouldn't this indicate the end of the downtrend (or at least-the beginning of a consolidation, perhaps leading to the stock garnering strength?). Moreover, as distribution (as you pointed out) is likely at the top (as indicated by the hi volume and stalling); wouldn't accumulation be likely at the churning point in the downtrend (ie. since the stock is not falling anymore and it is not doing it on hi volume-wouln't this signify that someone is buying up all the stock that someone else is selling) I bring up this question because I'm not sure of the answer. I thought WON has said (or perhaps it was in an IBD Investors Corner article) that "churning" can take place on the upside (to indicate future weakness) or on the downside (to indicate future strength). In any event, what is your experience or observation or comments and conclusions on my churning conundrum. jans In a message dated Wed, 7 Aug 2002 11:33:26 AM Eastern Standard Time, kmalm@earthlink.net writes: > Long story short, churning/stalling is in reference to action *after* a > stock or index has been rising, nears its highs, then starts acting odd. > That is, large volume is no longer accompanied by significant upward price > movement. In that sense, it is subtle distribution and is a > sign that the > stock may be topping and/or beginning a consolidating period - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 10:53:45 -0400 From: "Tom Worley" Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] cup-without-handle; "tightness" questions on the downside, often suggests the point where institutional support exists, but only on the larger more liquid stocks. - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2002 10:50 AM Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] cup-without-handle; "tightness" questions Katherine: Couldn't "churning" also identify a stock which has been weak (ie. in a downtrend), but then does not make any more headway down-and does this on heavy volume. Wouldn't this indicate the end of the downtrend (or at least-the beginning of a consolidation, perhaps leading to the stock garnering strength?). Moreover, as distribution (as you pointed out) is likely at the top (as indicated by the hi volume and stalling); wouldn't accumulation be likely at the churning point in the downtrend (ie. since the stock is not falling anymore and it is not doing it on hi volume-wouln't this signify that someone is buying up all the stock that someone else is selling) I bring up this question because I'm not sure of the answer. I thought WON has said (or perhaps it was in an IBD Investors Corner article) that "churning" can take place on the upside (to indicate future weakness) or on the downside (to indicate future strength). In any event, what is your experience or observation or comments and conclusions on my churning conundrum. jans In a message dated Wed, 7 Aug 2002 11:33:26 AM Eastern Standard Time, kmalm@earthlink.net writes: > Long story short, churning/stalling is in reference to action *after* a > stock or index has been rising, nears its highs, then starts acting odd. > That is, large volume is no longer accompanied by significant upward price > movement. In that sense, it is subtle distribution and is a > sign that the > stock may be topping and/or beginning a consolidating period - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. - - - -To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" - -In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or - -"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 09:56:18 -0500 From: jch Subject: Re: [CANSLIM] analysts - --=======17C25DC1======= Content-Type: text/plain; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-7CC03632; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Tom NYSE specialists have a hand in this too--When you experience 7% stop loss execute at LOD 15% loss you begin to look toward Level II trading on NASDAQ where you are under electronic control--no humanoids--read the following: Richard Ney on the Role of the Specialist "The story is told that after he had been deported to Italy, Lucky Luciano granted an interview in which he described a visit to the floor of the New York Stock Exchange. When the operations of floor specialists had been explained to him, he said, 'A terrible thing happened. I realized I'd joined the wrong mob'" (1Ney, 8). It was with these words that Richard Ney began his first of three books on the nature of the New York Stock Exchange. Ney wrote over 20 years ago, a time when a 750 Dow was high and today's volumes were beyond imagining. Some of his material is dated, and must be read in the light in which it was written. But the main premise of his books is still true: that the specialist exists not to ensure the free and orderly trade of stock in a particular company, but to fatten upon the innocence and ignorance of the small investor. The New York Stock Exchange is not an auction market (2Ney, 86), though many investors still hold onto that image. It is a rigged market. Volume is an effect of price. Prices are controlled absolutely by the specialists, the 'market makers' in individual stocks. It was this discovery that led Mr. Ney to eventually give us small investors a priceless gift: enlightenment. "Studying the transactions in each stock, I became immediately conscious that, on too many occasion to be a coincidence, a stock would advance from its morning low and then, often during the afternoon, would show an up-tick of a half-point or more on a large block of anywhere from 1,500 to 5,000 or more shares. This transaction seemed to herald a transformation in what was taking place, for immediately thereafter the stock would begin to drop like Newton's apple. Before I could find out what caused this, another question presented itself: What caused the same thing to happen at the low point in that stock's decline? For it was also apparent that a block of stock of the same size often appeared on a down-tick of a half-point or more, after which the stock quickly rallied. Together these two facts seemed to give a stock's pattern continuity. At the end of several days of investigation, I discovered that these transactions at the top and bottom of a stock's price pattern were for the specialist's own account. ... Clod that I was, I had at last recognized that, although the study of human nature may not be fashionable among economists, it is never out of season" (2Ney, 9)." John Heiman >guess I am too jaded from too many years inside the securities industry, I >am not even shocked by all this, I presumed all of this was still happening, >just like it always has, at the major wirehouses > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Duke Miller" >To: >Sent: Monday, August 12, 2002 4:44 PM >Subject: RE: [CANSLIM] analysts > > >This is incredible. > >I pulled up the story, and was further shocked by this revelation: > >In a discussion with (his boss) Mr. Kim about his progress on the >report, Mr. Boss made clear his doubts on the sector. He said Mr. Kim >began to fret. Mr. Boss, who sat within earshot of Mr. Kim, said his >superior called the investment bankers and discussed the report, but was >careful to do so on his cellphone. Mr. Boss said that Mr. Kim had told >him to be careful to limit conversations with investment banking to >cellphones because Mr. Spitzer's release of the now infamous Merrill >Lynch e-mail messages had been so damaging to that firm. Furthermore, >internal phone lines, which might be taped, were not to be used. > >And near the end of the article: > >"In an affidavit that Mr. Boss submitted to Salomon and the New York >attorney general, he said investment bankers at the firm regularly told >Mr. Kim of pending banking assignments and merger and acquisition >activities involving companies in his sector. "In violation of the >rules, Steve issued favorable research reports on the companies involved >(homebuilders) after he became knowledgeable of the transactions," Mr. >Boss said in his affidavit. > >"Mr. Boss also said in his statement that shortly after the Masco >Corporation, a maker of building products, sold 22 million shares to the >public in an underwriting co-managed by Salomon this spring, and after >Mr. Kim had raised his estimates for the company, Mr. Kim asked Masco >management to help with the installation of a new kitchen in his >Westchester home. According to Mr. Boss's affidavit, Masco spent more >than $10,000 sending materials and two high-level managers from Michigan >to Mr. Kim's home for several days." > >And this is a subsidiary of Citigroup? > >With all that's gone on, these guys are either brain-dead, or totally >brain-washed. > >Duke > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com >[mailto:owner-canslim@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Wahl >Sent: Monday, August 12, 2002 12:05 PM >To: canslim@lists.xmission.com >Subject: [CANSLIM] analysts > > >Well, those Wall Street weasels are still weasels, even after promising >reform. >Here is the link, since it requires registration, some people will >probably not be able >to get there or wish to register, so I've excerpted a couple of >passages below - > >http://www.nytimes.com/2002/08/11/business/yourmoney/11BROK.html > > >The two executives boasted that Salomon, Citigroup's investment bank >subsidiary, had been the first to adopt reforms suggested by Eliot >Spitzer, the >New York attorney general, who is investigating Wall Street research. >They >also proposed additional moves that regulators might take to prevent a >firm's >investment bankers from exerting improper influence on its research >analysts ..... As Mr. Boss tells the tale, in late June, after spending >weeks on a report >analyzing three office furniture companies, he was lukewarm about the >stocks' >prospects and assigned them a neutral and high-risk rating. He argued >that >until the overall business climate improved, demand for these companies' > >products would be lackluster. When two Salomon investment bankers and >Mr. >Boss's immediate supervisor saw the draft report, they demanded that he >revise it to be more upbeat. Mr. Boss refused. A few days later, on June >27, he >was fired. Mr. Boss, 33, was offered $24,230 in severance from Salomon, >which he refused. > >Beginning on June 3, for example, the firm said that any fact checking >by the >investment banking division of draft research reports would be limited >to the >first research written about an initial public offering. Moreover, the >rules said >that any draft research sent to investment banking for fact checking >"must >omit the rating and target price as well as the investment thesis and >valuation >analysis sections." > >According to Mr. Boss, two Salomon investment bankers, Richard Moriarty >and Marc Schneider, flouted those rules the week of June 23, demanding >to >see Mr. Boss's report, which was in draft form on his laptop computer. > >Stephen S. Kim, the analyst covering home-building stocks at Salomon and > >Mr. Boss's immediate supervisor, told him to put the report on the >firm's >internal network so it could be reviewed by the investment bankers. Mr. >Boss >protested, noting the firm's new rules. Nevertheless, Mr. Schneider soon >went >to the research department and reviewed the report on Mr. Boss's laptop. >Two >of the three office furnishings stocks that Mr. Boss had advised >investors to be >cautious of " Interface and Steelcase " had recently issued bonds that >were >underwritten by Salomon. > > > > >- >-To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" >-In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or >-"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. > > > >- >-To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" >-In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or >-"unsubscribe canslim". Do not use quotes in your email. > > > > >- >-To subscribe/unsubscribe, email "majordomo@xmission.com" >-In the email body, write "subscribe canslim" or >-"unsubscribe canslim". 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