From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #320 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Friday, July 2 1999 Volume 01 : Number 320 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 19:03:08 EDT From: Squinty54@aol.com Subject: MtMan-List: Legislation on leg-hold traps Another question, beyond that of enforcement, is how do we get this stricken? Is it too late to beat this bill? "Sickler, Louis L" wrote: > Hey guys, > > Here's the text of that bill.............looks ominous. How the HE** can > they enforce this ???? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 20:55:26 EDT From: Traphand@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Senate Bill S1006 Has the bill been voted on yet.If not when does it come up for vote.Most assinine thing i every heard of.let me know if i can help stop another #$@#$%^&* bill from passing.Their are on the way to take away your gun rights ,trapping right.better stop before i start rolling; rick petzoldt long time ago a.m.m. menber traphand@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 20:35:31 -0500 From: Farseer Subject: MtMan-List: MtMan-List - Joining the AMM - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BEC338.1BA47460 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit How does one go about joining the AMM? There's only a handful of skinners in my immediate area, most folks are Civil War folks. Todd, who don't have a nifty nickname yet. - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BEC338.1BA47460 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IiQBAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYA8AIAAAIAAAANAAAAAwAAMAMAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAAVwAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAGhpc3RfdGV4dEBsaXN0 cy54bWlzc2lvbi5jb20AU01UUABoaXN0X3RleHRAbGlzdHMueG1pc3Npb24uY29tAAAeAAIwAQAA AAUAAABTTVRQAAAAAB4AAzABAAAAHQAAAGhpc3RfdGV4dEBsaXN0cy54bWlzc2lvbi5jb20AAAAA AwAVDAAAABADAP4PBgAAAB4AATABAAAAHwAAACdoaXN0X3RleHRAbGlzdHMueG1pc3Npb24uY29t JwAAAgELMAEAAAAiAAAAU01UUDpISVNUX1RFWFRATElTVFMuWE1JU1NJT04uQ09NAAAAAwAAOQAA AAACARI6AQAAAFcAAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmdbgDdAQ9UAgAAAABoaXN0X3RleHRAbGlzdHMueG1p c3Npb24uY29tAFNNVFAAaGlzdF90ZXh0QGxpc3RzLnhtaXNzaW9uLmNvbQAACwBAOgEAAAACAfYP AQAAAAQAAAAAAAADDAAAAAMAADAEAAAACwAPDgEAAAACAf8PAQAAAFcAAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmd bgDdAQ9UAgAAAABoaXN0X3RleHRAbGlzdHMueG1pc3Npb24uY29tAFNNVFAAaGlzdF90ZXh0QGxp c3RzLnhtaXNzaW9uLmNvbQAAHgACMAEAAAAFAAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAAMwAQAAAB0AAABoaXN0X3Rl eHRAbGlzdHMueG1pc3Npb24uY29tAAAAAAMAFQwBAAAAAwD+DwYAAAAeAAEwAQAAAB8AAAAnaGlz dF90ZXh0QGxpc3RzLnhtaXNzaW9uLmNvbScAAAIBCzABAAAAIgAAAFNNVFA6SElTVF9URVhUQExJ U1RTLlhNSVNTSU9OLkNPTQAAAAMAADkAAAAACwBAOgEAAAACAfYPAQAAAAQAAAAAAAAE56kBBIAB AB0AAABNdE1hbi1MaXN0IC0gSm9pbmluZyB0aGUgQU1NAD0JAQWAAwAOAAAAzwcGAB4AFAAjAB8A AwBTAQEGAAcAAQAAAAAAAAEggAMADgAAAM8HBgAeABQAIAAjAAMAVAEBCYABACEAAAA5QUNFNTE2 ODJBMkZEMzExOTEzRjAwNjA5NzA4MkE2NAD4BgEDkAYAfAQAACMAAAALAAIAAQAAAAsAIwAAAAAA AwAmAAAAAAALACkAAAAAAAMALgAAAAAAAgExAAEAAAAYAAAAAAAAAKvUunHRNtIRkT8AYJcIKmQk RiEAAwA2AAAAAABAADkAwFSQAWLDvgEeAHAAAQAAAB0AAABNdE1hbi1MaXN0IC0gSm9pbmluZyB0 aGUgQU1NAAAAAAIBcQABAAAAFgAAAAG+w2HDVGhRzpsvKhHTkT8AYJcIKmQAAB4AHgwBAAAABQAA AFNNVFAAAAAAHgAfDAEAAAATAAAAZmFyc2VlckBzd2JlbGwubmV0AAADAAYQcbDNBgMABxCHAAAA HgAIEAEAAABlAAAASE9XRE9FU09ORUdPQUJPVVRKT0lOSU5HVEhFQU1NP1RIRVJFU09OTFlBSEFO REZVTE9GU0tJTk5FUlNJTk1ZSU1NRURJQVRFQVJFQSxNT1NURk9MS1NBUkVDSVZJTFdBUkZPTAAA AAACAQkQAQAAACABAAAcAQAAXgEAAExaRnVA141xAwAKAHJjcGcxMjUWMgD4C2BuDhAwMzOdAfcg AqQD4wIAY2gKwGBzZXQwIAcTAoB9swqACMggOwlvDjA1AoDZCoF1YwBQCwNjAEELtcggSG8H4GRv B5ECIOBlIGdvIAGgCGAFQAxqbwuAC4BnIHRoQRZwQU1NPyAYIFRLF7AJcCcWMmx5FrAgIREAbmRm dQMgb2a4IHNrC4AWYBEgIAuAXCBtGQAHcAeAZAcwdCMWcArAZWEsGqBvczMFQAIQbGsEIBuBIEO0 aXYDEVcKwRwzLgqiKwqECoBUBHBkG8B3aLMWoBYAbicFQBEAdhthHiADAAGAGQADAGNrbvJhB4Ag eRFAHcsU8QFACx3jEfEAItADABAQAAAAAAMAERABAAAAAwCAEP////9AAAcwQFiKmGHDvgFAAAgw QFiKmGHDvgECARQ6AQAAABAAAACazlFoKi/TEZE/AGCXCCpkCwAAgAggBgAAAAAAwAAAAAAAAEYA AAAAA4UAAAAAAAADAAKACCAGAAAAAADAAAAAAAAARgAAAAAQhQAAAAAAAAMABYAIIAYAAAAAAMAA AAAAAABGAAAAAFKFAAC3DQAAHgAlgAggBgAAAAAAwAAAAAAAAEYAAAAAVIUAAAEAAAAEAAAAOC4w AAMAJoAIIAYAAAAAAMAAAAAAAABGAAAAAAGFAAAAAAAACwAvgAggBgAAAAAAwAAAAAAAAEYAAAAA DoUAAAAAAAADADCACCAGAAAAAADAAAAAAAAARgAAAAARhQAAAAAAAAMAMoAIIAYAAAAAAMAAAAAA AABGAAAAABiFAAAAAAAAHgBBgAggBgAAAAAAwAAAAAAAAEYAAAAANoUAAAEAAAABAAAAAAAAAB4A QoAIIAYAAAAAAMAAAAAAAABGAAAAADeFAAABAAAAAQAAAAAAAAAeAEOACCAGAAAAAADAAAAAAAAA RgAAAAA4hQAAAQAAAAEAAAAAAAAAHgA9AAEAAAABAAAAAAAAAAMADTT9NwAAbsw= - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BEC338.1BA47460-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 22:28:38 EDT From: GHickman@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: MtMan-List - Joining the AMM farseer@swbell.net writes: << How does one go about joining the AMM? >> Try their web site: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/amm/moreamm.html Ghosting Wolf ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 21:53:36 -0500 From: Jim Colburn Subject: Re: MtMan-List: MtMan-List - Joining the AMM Washtahay- At 08:35 PM 6/30/99 -0500, you wrote: >How does one go about joining the AMM? There's only a handful of skinners in my immediate area, most folks are Civil War folks. Todd, they don't really exist. Its really just two or three guys who came up with this great scheme to drive people crazy-lets PRETEND to start this really neat sounding organization. When people try to contact us to ask about joining, we'll send them to someone else, who will send them to someone else, and so on and so on.... it took a lot of time, writing a lot of letters, making a lot of phone calls, spending a lot of money to travel a lot of miles to meet folks who didn't show up (if they ever existed!) when they said they would before I figured that one out. I'm not sure who the two or three guys are though. One of these days I am gonna come up with some really great trade goods to bribe Hawk or John Kramer into telling me-pretty sure one or the other of them would have some clues. Unless you already have those great trade goods to part with, or a lot of time to waste trying to find the mythical AMM, read Nasitir and Drummond and maybe Anderson's journals-still frustrating at times but the results are likely to be more tangible! LongWalker c. du B. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Jul 1999 00:24:11 -0400 From: Michael Pierce Subject: Re: MtMan-List: MtMan-List - Joining the AMM longwalker dont give the guy such a hard time have him contact me offline best bet is to have him give me a call ---I dont know where he lives - ---but bet i can point him in some direction and get him started in that circle you were talking about that is if he aint a plastic skinner---or a noggie trapper and is really serious about the AMM or as you put it MYSTICAL AMM ie the brotherhood---he might be in cpt lathi general area---right now most of the guys are in the shining mountains or on their way back from the big roo---and gettin fat on mountain air and fellowship and contesting their tallents---as the better half call's the roo's "a darn good excuse for grown men to not take a bath for a week or two" hell I wash up most ever day a bit at least-- and yes I might take some good bribes if they be good ones---some answers come high priced ---at least would give the starving pilgrem a free meal a glad hand a free pull on the jug and invite him into camp for at least a night---a lot as you know depends on the plunder he be toting in his basic kit and how his head is put on----and his deturmination to learn and the principals he is intent to portray and maintain.--"joining the campfire aint a problem staying thru the winter is" a lot will depend on the metal in his blade--- aint that complicated if you use the common sense aproach--- "Hawk " Michael Pierce 854 Glenfield Dr. Palm Harbor, florida 34684 1-(727) 771-1815 E-MAIL ADDRESS: HAWKNEST4@juno.com On Wed, 30 Jun 1999 21:53:36 -0500 Jim Colburn writes: >Washtahay- >At 08:35 PM 6/30/99 -0500, you wrote: >>How does one go about joining the AMM? There's only a handful of >skinners in my immediate area, most folks are Civil War folks. > Todd, they don't really exist. > Its really just two or three guys who came up with this great >scheme to >drive people crazy-lets PRETEND to start this really neat sounding >organization. When people try to contact us to ask about joining, >we'll >send them to someone else, who will send them to someone else, and so >on >and so on.... it took a lot of time, writing a lot of letters, making >a >lot of phone calls, spending a lot of money to travel a lot of miles >to >meet folks who didn't show up (if they ever existed!) when they said >they >would before I figured that one out. > I'm not sure who the two or three guys are though. One of >these days I am >gonna come up with some really great trade goods to bribe Hawk or John >Kramer into telling me-pretty sure one or the other of them would have >some >clues. > Unless you already have those great trade goods to part with, >or a lot of >time to waste trying to find the mythical AMM, read Nasitir and >Drummond >and maybe Anderson's journals-still frustrating at times but the >results >are likely to be more tangible! >LongWalker c. du B. > ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jul 1999 00:37:42 -0500 From: Jim Colburn Subject: Re: MtMan-List: MtMan-List - Joining the AMM Washtahay- At 12:24 AM 7/1/99 -0400, you wrote: >longwalker dont give the guy such a hard time Aw, shucks... I just spent so much time trying to track the AMM down before I realized I had arrived at the gola on my lonesome that I just can't pass up a good chance to tweak 'em a bit! > and is really serious about the AMM or as you put it >MYSTICAL AMM I said myTHical-had enough of that mysticism last semester to make me almost afraid to use the word for fear I might have to go through Mystical Monte's Magical Mystery Tour again. Rather be staked out on an anthill... LongWalker c. du B. Am I the only one reading-or re-reading-Anderson's Journals right now? He makes some interesting comments about the trip to the Rendezvous in 1834 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Jul 1999 09:47:09 EDT From: ElZopilote@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: MtMan-List - Joining the AMM In a message dated 6/30/99 8:41:05 PM Central Daylight Time, farseer@swbell.net writes: << Todd, who don't have a nifty nickname yet. >> hi...nifty zopi ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jul 1999 08:36:19 -0600 From: "Sickler, Louis L" Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Senate Bill S1006 Traphand, Here's the status page for this bill. Looks like nothing has happened yet. This is a good site, all of us should watch it carefully. www.senate.gov Can do a search on bill number or keyword. Especially note the sponsors - a pack of trouble makers for shore Red Coyote S.1006 SPONSOR: Sen Torricelli, Robert G. (introduced 05/11/99) Jump to: Titles, Status, Committees, Amendments, Cosponsors, Summary TITLE(S): OFFICIAL TITLE AS INTRODUCED: A bill to end the use of conventional steel-jawed leghold traps on animals in the United States. STATUS: Floor Actions ***NONE*** STATUS: Detailed Legislative Status Senate Actions May 11, 99: Read twice and referred to the Committee on Environment and Public Works. STATUS: Congressional Record Page References 05/11/99 Introductory remarks on Measure (CR S5052) COMMITTEE(S): COMMITTEE(S) OF REFERRAL: Senate Environment and Public Works AMENDMENT(S): ***NONE*** COSPONSORS(5): Sen Boxer, Barbara - 05/11/99 Sen Feinstein, Dianne - 05/11/99 Sen Kerry, John F. - 05/11/99 Sen Lautenberg, Frank R. - 05/11/99 Sen Schumer, Charles E. - 06/17/99 SUMMARY: ***NONE*** > -----Original Message----- > From: Traphand@aol.com [SMTP:Traphand@aol.com] > Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 1999 6:55 PM > To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Senate Bill S1006 > > Has the bill been voted on yet.If not when does it come up for vote.Most > assinine thing i every heard of.let me know if i can help stop another > #$@#$%^&* bill from > passing.Their are on the way to take away your gun rights ,trapping > right.better stop before i start rolling; > > rick petzoldt > long time ago a.m.m. menber > > traphand@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Jul 1999 22:15:31 -0600 From: jbrandl@wyoming.com (Joe Brandl) Subject: MtMan-List: long, but worth pondering I think this is rather interesting. Long, but keep reading >> >>Charlton Heston, speaking on 'Winning the Cultural War,' Tuesday, February >>16, 7:30 pm, Ames Courtroom, Austin Hall. Sponsored by the Harvard Law >>School Forum, a student organization at Harvard Law School. For almost 50 >>years, the Forum has been bringing to HLS noteworthy individuals from all >>fields to engage in exciting and wide-ranging exchanges of ideas. Forum >>programs are open to the public and generally consist of a speech or panel >>discussion followed by a question-and-answer session. >> >>Mr. Heston >> >>I remember my son when he was five, explaining to his kindergarten class >>what his father did for a living. >> >>"My Daddy," he said, "pretends to be people." >> >>There have been quite a few of them. >> >>Prophets from the Old and New Testaments, a couple of Christian saints, >>generals of various nationalities and different centuries, several kings, >>three American presidents, a French cardinal and two geniuses, including >>Michelangelo. >> >>If you want the ceiling re-painted I'll do my best. >> >>It's just that there always seems to be a lot of different fellows up here. >>I'm never sure which one of them gets to talk. Right now, I guess I'm the >>guy. >> >>As I pondered our visit tonight it struck me: If my Creator gave me the >>gift to connect you with the hearts and minds of those great men, then I want >>to use that same gift now to re-connect you with your own sense of liberty ... >>your own freedom of tho ught ... your own compass for what is right. >> >>Dedicating the memorial at Gettysburg, Abraham Lincoln said of America, "We >>are now engaged in a great Civil War, testing whether this nation or any >>nation so conceived and so dedicated can long endure." Those words are true >>again. . . I believe that we are again engaged in a great civil war, a >>cultural war that's about to hijack your birthright to think and say what >>lives in your heart. >> >>I fear you no longer trust the pulsing lifeblood of liberty inside you . . . >>the stuff that made this country rise from wilderness into the miracle that >>it is. >> >>Let me back up a little. About a year ago I became president of the >>National Rifle Association, which protects the right to keep and bear arms. I >>ran for office, I was elected, and now I serve ... I serve as a moving target >>for the media who've called me everything from "ridiculous" and "duped" to a " >>brain-injured, senile, crazy old man." I know, I'm pretty old ... but I >>sure Lord ain't senile. >> >>As I have stood in the crosshairs of those who target Second Amendment >>freedoms, I've realized that firearms are not the only issue. >> >>No, it's much, much bigger than that. >> >>I've come to understand that a cultural war is raging across our land, in >>which, with Orwellian fervor, certain acceptable thoughts and speech are >>mandated. >> >>For example, I marched for civil rights with Dr. King in 1963 - long before >>Hollywood found it fashionable. But when I told an audience last year that >>white pride is just as valid as black pride or red pride or anyone else's >>pride, they called me a racist. >> >>I've worked with brilliantly talented homosexuals all my life. But when I >>told an audience that gay rights should extend no further than your rights >>or my rights, I was called a homophobe. >> >>I served in World War II against the Axis powers. But during a speech, when >>I drew an analogy between singling out innocent Jews and singling out >>innocent gun owners, I was called an anti-Semite. >> >>Everyone I know knows I would never raise a closed fist against my country. >> >>But when I asked an audience to oppose this cultural persecution, I was >>compared to Timothy McVeigh. >> >>>From Time magazine to friends and colleagues, they're essentially saying, >>"Chuck, how dare you speak your mind like that? You are using language not >>authorized for public consumption!" >> >>But I am not afraid. If Americans believed in political correctness, we'd >>still be King George's boys - subjects bound to the British crown. >> >>In his book, "The End of Sanity," Martin Gross writes that "blatantly >>irrational behavior is rapidly being established as the norm in almost >>every area of human endeavor. There seem to be new customs, new rules, >>new anti-intellectual theories regularly foisted on us from every >>direction. >> >>Underneath, the nation is roiling. Americans know something without a name >>is undermining the country, turning the mind mushy when it comes to >>separating truth from falsehood and right from wrong. And they don't like >>it." >> >>Let me read a few examples. >> >>At Antioch college in Ohio, young men seeking intimacy with a coed must get >>verbal permission at each step of the process from kissing to petting to >>final copulation ... all clearly spelled out in a printed college >>directive. >> >>In New Jersey, despite the death of several patients nationwide who had >>been infected by dentists who had concealed their AIDs - the state >>commissioner >>announced that health providers who are HIV-positive need not....need >>not. . .tell their patients that they are infected. >> >>At William and Mary, students tried to change the name of the school team >>"The Tribe" because it was supposedly insulting to local Indians, only to >>learn that authentic Virginia chiefs truly like the name. >> >>In San Francisco, city fathers passed an ordinance protecting the rights of >>transvestites to cross-dress on the job, and for transsexuals to have >>separate toilet facilities while undergoing sex change surgery. >> >>In New York City, kids who don't speak a word of Spanish have been placed >>in bilingual classes to learn their three R's in Spanish solely because their >>last names sound Hispanic. >> >>At the University of Pennsylvania, in a state where thousands died at >>Gettysburg opposing slavery, the president of that college officially set >>up segregated dormitory space for black students. >> >>Yeah, I know . . . that's out of bounds now. Dr. King said "Negroes." >> >>Jimmy Baldwin and most of us on the March said "black." But it's a no-no >>now. >> >>For me, hyphenated identities are awkward . . . particularly >>"Native-American. " I'm a Native American, for God's sake. I also happen to >>be a blood-initiated brother of the Miniconjou Sioux. >> >>On my wife's side, my grandson is a thirteenth generation native American . >>. . with the capital letter on "American." >> >>Finally, just last month . . . David Howard, head of the Washington D.C. >>Office of Public Advocate, used the word "niggardly" while talking to >>colleagues about budgetary matters. Of course, "niggardly" means stingy or >>scanty. But within days Howard was forced to publicly apologize and resign. >> >>As columnist Tony Snow wrote: "David Howard got fired because some people >>in public employ were morons who (a)didn't know the meaning of niggardly,' >>(b)didn't know how to use a dictionary to discover the meaning, and (c) >>actually demanded that he apologize for their ignorance. " >> >>What does all this mean? It means that telling us what to think has evolved >>into telling us what to say, so telling us what to do can't be far behind. >> >>Before you claim to be a champion of free thought, tell me: Why did >>political correctness originate on America's campuses? And why do you >>continue to tolerate it? >> >>Why do you, who're supposed to debate ideas, surrender to their >>suppression? >> >>Let's be honest. Who here thinks your professors can say what they really >>believe? >> >>That scares me to death. It should scare you too, that the superstition of >>political correctness rules the halls of reason. >> >>You are the best and the brightest. You, here in the fertile cradle of >>American academia, here in the castle of learning on the Charles River, you >>are the cream. But I submit that you, and your counterparts across the >>land, are the most socially conformed and politically silenced generation >>since >>Concord Bridge. And as long as you validate that ... and abide it ... you >>are - by your grandfathers' standards - cowards. >> >>Here's another example. Right now at more than one major university, Second >>Amendment scholars and researchers are being told to shut up about their >>findings or they'll lose their jobs. Why? Because their research findings >>would undermi ne big-city mayor's pending lawsuits that seek to extort >>hundreds of millions of dollars from firearm manufacturers. >> >>I don't care what you think about guns. But if you are not shocked at that, >>I am shocked at you. Who will guard the raw material of unfettered ideas, >>if not you? Democracy is dialogue! >> >>Who will defend the core value of academia, if you supposed soldiers of >>free thought and expression lay down your arms and plead, "Don't shoot me." >> >>If you talk about race, it does not make you a racist. >> >>If you see distinctions between the genders, it does not make you sexist. >> >>If you think critically about a denomination, it does not make you >>anti-religion. >> >>If you accept but don't celebrate homosexuality, it does not make you a >>homophobe. >> >>Don't let America's universities continue to serve as incubators for this >>rampant epidemic of new McCarthyism. >> >>But what can you do? How can anyone prevail against such pervasive social >>subjugation? The answer's been here all along. >> >>I learned it 36 years ago, on the steps of the Lincoln Memorial in >>Washington D.C., standing with Dr. Martin Luther King and two hundred >>thousand people. >> >>You simply ... disobey. >> >>Peaceably, yes. Respectfully, of course. Nonviolently, absolutely. >> >>But when told how to think or what to say or how to behave, we don't. We >>disobey social protocol that stifles and stigmatizes personal freedom. >> >>I learned the awesome power of disobedience from Dr. King . . . who learned >>it from Gandhi, and Thoreau, and Jesus, and every other great man who led >>those in the right against those with the might. >> >>Disobedience is in our DNA. We feel innate kinship with that disobedient >>spirit that tossed tea into Boston Harbor, that sent Thoreau to jail, that >>refused to sit in the back of the bus, that protested a war in Viet Nam. >> >>In that same spirit, I am asking you to disavow cultural correctness with >>massive disobedience of rogue authority, social directives and onerous laws >>that weaken personal freedom. >> >>But be careful ... it hurts. Disobedience demands that you put yourself at >>risk. Dr. King stood on lots of balconies. >> >>You must be willing to be humiliated ... to endure the modern-day >>equivalent of the police dogs at Montgomery and the water cannons at Selma. >> >>You must be willing to experience discomfort. I'm not complaining, but my >>own decades of social activism have left their mark on me. >> >>Let me tell you a story. A few years back I heard about a rapper named >>Ice-T who was selling a CD called "Cop Killer" celebrating ambushing and >>murdering police officers. It was being marketed by none other than >Time/Warner, >>the biggest entertainment conglomerate in the world. Police across the country >>were outraged. Rightfully so - at least one had been murdered. But >>Time/Warner was stonewalling because the CD was a cash cow for them, and >>the media were tiptoeing around it because the rapper was black. >> >>I heard Time/Warner had a stockholders meeting scheduled in Beverly Hills. >>I owned some shares at the time, so I decided to attend. What I did there was >>against the advice of my family and colleagues. I asked for the floor. To a >>hushed room of a thousand average American stockholders, I simply read the >>full lyrics of "Cop Killer" - every vicious, vulgar, instructional word. >> >>"I GOT MY 12 GAUGE SAWED OFF I GOT MY HEADLIGHTS TURNED OFF I'M ABOUT TO >>BUST SOME SHOTS OFF I'M ABOUT TO DUST SOME COPS OFF..." It got worse, a lot >>worse. I won't read the rest of it to you. But trust me, the room was a sea >>of shocked, frozen, blanched faces. The Time/Warner executives squirmed in >>their chairs and stared at their shoes. They hated me for that. >> >>Then I delivered another volley of sick lyric brimming with racist filth, >>where Ice-T fantasizes about sodomizing two 12-year old nieces of Al and >>Tipper Gore. >> >>"SHE PUSHED HER BUTT AGAINST MY ...." >> >>Well, I won't do to you here what I did to them. Let's just say I left the >>room in echoing silence. When I read the lyrics to the waiting press corps, >>one of them said "We can't print that." ''I know," I replied, "but >>Time/Warner's selling it. >> >>Two months later, Time/Warner terminated Ice-T's contract. I'll never be >>offered another film by Warners, or get a good review from Time magazine. >>But disobedience means you must be willing to act, not just talk. When a >>mugger sues his elderly victim for defending herself... jam the switchboard >>of the district attorney's office. >> >>When your university is pressured to lower standards until 80% of the >>students graduate with honors . . . choke the halls of the board of >>regents. >> >>When an 8-year-old boy pecks a girl's cheek on the playground and gets >>hauled into court for sexual harassment . . . march on that school and >>block its doorways. When someone you elected is seduced by political power >>and betrays you . . . petition them, oust them, banish them. When Time >>magazine's cover portrays millennium nuts as deranged, crazy Christians >>holding a cross as it did last month . . . boycott their magazine and the >>products it advertises. >> >>So that this nation may long endure, I urge you to follow in the hallowed >>footsteps of the great disobediences of history that freed exiles, founded >>religions, defeated tyrants, and yes, in the hands of an aroused rabble in >>arms and a f ew great men, by God's grace, built this country. >> >>If Dr. King were here, I think he would agree. >> >>Thank you. >> >> >> > > Absaroka Western Designs and Tannery check out our NEW WEB SITE: http://www.wy-biz.com/absarokawesterndesigns/index.html Call us about our professional home tanning kit-307-455-2440 Lodgepole Furniture - Rawhide - Buffalo Robes - Costumes Metal Art - Custom Tanning - Leather - Gifts ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Jul 1999 00:01:52 -0500 From: Jim Colburn Subject: Re: MtMan-List: long, but worth pondering Washtahay- No, its really not. It pertains to the study of the fur trade how? LongWalker c. du B. At 10:15 PM 7/1/99 -0600, you wrote: > >I think this is rather interesting. Long, but keep reading >>> >>>Charlton Heston, speaking on 'Winning the Cultural War,' Tuesday, February ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Jul 1999 23:39:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Lee Newbill Subject: MtMan-List: Fort Hall (Idaho) and the Mountain Man Museum (Pinedale, WY) Stopped by both Fort Hall and the Mountain Man Museum during my little 2500 mile odessey of a vacation. Ran out of time to see all the other places I wanted to.... Fort Hall. Interesting place. I'd like to hear other's opinions of the replica. I was impressed by the amount of work it took to build it, and it is obviously maintained very well..... but.... it almost seems that it was built, and then forgotten. A gem never cut and polished, no curator(?), no knowledgable guides(?). I couldna even find a printed history of the post at the gift/book store. They do have a nice saddle (Shoshone ?) that I took about 100 pictures of. While it fell short of what I had imagined... overall I think it's worth stopping in to see... probably a lot better on the weekends if you can catch some of the local skinners in. The Mountain Man Museum. I was very dissapointed in this museum. It was broad brush at it's best. A video from the 70's with Charlie Hanson was interesting, but the whole thing seemed aimed more at tourists than the scholar... which I suppose it is. They had one of Kit's later guns there, and some other guns... only one of which was flint.. an old beat up british smoothie in about .72 cal (or so). Also had some nice examples of hand forged traps, and some good examples of moccs. They do not allow any photographs inside the museum though. Think I need to head fer the Dakota's next vacation. Regards Lee Newbill of Viola, Idaho NMLRA member 058863 email at lnewbill@uidaho.edu Keeper of the "Buckskins & Blackpowder!" Webpage http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Gorge/7186 ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jul 1999 05:36:59 -0700 From: Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Fort Hall (Idaho) and the Mountain Man Museum (Pinedale, WY) Lee, Have seen what you mentioned and have never said anything, thinking maybe it was me expecting to much, guess my thoughts were like yours. I thought I was spoiled because of fur trade forts like Bent's Fort, Ft. Union, Ft. deChartre, Ft. Osage, Ft. Charlette and the Museum of the Fur Trade to mention a few, thanks for how you felt on your visits. Our governments will take the time, spend our money and then fall short on the least expensive part, providing educational material and knowledgeable guides. Most folks interested in history, reenactments, etc. would give their "I" teeth to work in these places and have fun doing it. And again we the tax payers take it in the shorts. Later YF&B Buck Conner Jim Baker Party/Colorado Territory Get a subscription to a journal of the fur trade and early history of the times, the one the American Mountain Men read and write. The Tomahawk & Long Rifle 3483 Squires Conklin, MI 49403 ATTN: Jon Link The subscription for the bi-monthly journal is $20 for a year or $35 for two years. Give it a try, you'll blow that much in a couple of stops at 7-11 for junk food. ________________________________________________________ > On Thu, 01 July 1999, Lee Newbill wrote: > > Stopped by both Fort Hall and the Mountain Man Museum during my little > 2500 mile odessey of a vacation. Ran out of time to see all the other > places I wanted to.... > > Fort Hall. Interesting place. I'd like to hear other's opinions of the > replica. I was impressed by the amount of work it took to build it, and > it is obviously maintained very well..... but.... it almost seems that it > was built, and then forgotten. A gem never cut and polished, no > curator(?), no knowledgable guides(?). I couldna even find a printed > history of the post at the gift/book store. They do have a nice saddle > (Shoshone ?) that I took about 100 pictures of. While it fell > short of what I had imagined... overall I think it's worth stopping in to > see... probably a lot better on the weekends if you can catch some of the > local skinners in. > > The Mountain Man Museum. I was very dissapointed in this museum. It was > broad brush at it's best. A video from the 70's with Charlie Hanson was > interesting, but the whole thing seemed aimed more at tourists than the > scholar... which I suppose it is. They had one of Kit's later guns > there, and some other guns... only one of which was flint.. an old beat up > british smoothie in about .72 cal (or so). Also had some nice examples > of hand forged traps, and some good examples of moccs. They do not allow > any photographs inside the museum though. > > Think I need to head fer the Dakota's next vacation. > > Regards > > Lee Newbill of Viola, Idaho > NMLRA member 058863 > email at lnewbill@uidaho.edu > Keeper of the "Buckskins & Blackpowder!" Webpage > http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Gorge/7186 Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jul 1999 08:17:43 -0700 From: Subject: MtMan-List: Re: Joining the AMM-get the journal A good way to get to know the AMM - it's values and what to expect is do as Buck Conner has suggested. Turtle. _______________________ Get a subscription to a journal of the fur trade and early history of the times, the one the American Mountain Men read and write. The Tomahawk & Long Rifle 3483 Squires Conklin, MI 49403 ATTN: Jon Link The subscription for the bi-monthly journal is $20 for a year or $35 for two years. Give it a try, you'll blow that much in a couple of stops at 7-11 for junk food. ______________________________ > On Wed, 30 Jun 1999 21:53:36 -0500 Jim Colburn > writes: > >Washtahay- > >At 08:35 PM 6/30/99 -0500, you wrote: > >>How does one go about joining the AMM? There's only a handful of > >skinners in my immediate area, most folks are Civil War folks. > > Todd, they don't really exist. > > Its really just two or three guys who came up with this great > >scheme to > >drive people crazy-lets PRETEND to start this really neat sounding > >organization. When people try to contact us to ask about joining, > >we'll > >send them to someone else, who will send them to someone else, and so > >on > >and so on.... it took a lot of time, writing a lot of letters, making > >a > >lot of phone calls, spending a lot of money to travel a lot of miles > >to > >meet folks who didn't show up (if they ever existed!) when they said > >they > >would before I figured that one out. > > I'm not sure who the two or three guys are though. One of > >these days I am > >gonna come up with some really great trade goods to bribe Hawk or John > >Kramer into telling me-pretty sure one or the other of them would have > >some > >clues. Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Jul 1999 09:01:52 -0700 From: "john c. funk,jr" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Joining the AMM-get the journal The publication is not bi-monthly, it is quarterly: February, May, August, September......more or less. - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, July 02, 1999 8:17 AM Subject: MtMan-List: Re: Joining the AMM-get the journal > A good way to get to know the AMM - it's values and what to expect is do as Buck Conner has suggested. > Turtle. > _______________________ > Get a subscription to a journal of the fur trade and early history of the times, the one the American Mountain Men read and write. > > The Tomahawk & Long Rifle > 3483 Squires > Conklin, MI 49403 > ATTN: Jon Link > > The subscription for the bi-monthly journal is $20 for a year or $35 for two years. Give it a try, you'll blow that much in a couple of stops at 7-11 for junk food. > ______________________________ > > On Wed, 30 Jun 1999 21:53:36 -0500 Jim Colburn > > writes: > > >Washtahay- > > >At 08:35 PM 6/30/99 -0500, you wrote: > > >>How does one go about joining the AMM? There's only a handful of > > >skinners in my immediate area, most folks are Civil War folks. > > > Todd, they don't really exist. > > > Its really just two or three guys who came up with this great > > >scheme to > > >drive people crazy-lets PRETEND to start this really neat sounding > > >organization. When people try to contact us to ask about joining, > > >we'll > > >send them to someone else, who will send them to someone else, and so > > >on > > >and so on.... it took a lot of time, writing a lot of letters, making > > >a > > >lot of phone calls, spending a lot of money to travel a lot of miles > > >to > > >meet folks who didn't show up (if they ever existed!) when they said > > >they > > >would before I figured that one out. > > > I'm not sure who the two or three guys are though. One of > > >these days I am > > >gonna come up with some really great trade goods to bribe Hawk or John > > >Kramer into telling me-pretty sure one or the other of them would have > > >some > > >clues. > > > > Signup for your free USWEST.mail Email account http://www.uswestmail.net > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Jul 1999 17:31:20 EDT From: LODGEPOLE@aol.com Subject: MtMan-List: Cyber-Skinners' Rendezvous '99 Pix Greetings Folks, I have my pix posted from the Cyber-Skinners' Rendezvous up at Stik Wlaker's. You will find them at: http://metrostlouis.com/stiks/cyber-vous.htm Longshot ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Jul 1999 14:57:42 -0700 From: Barbara Smith Subject: MtMan-List: Canut Du Nord Web site Terry, Yeah, it's a great web site, but where's the sound track of you, Scott and Dave singing the official anthem of the Canut Du Nord? "Men, Men, Men, Men,......" :-) Hope you all had fun at Westerns, put some pix up for us flatlanders, will ya'? YMDS , Tassee (Yer Fort Nisqually Gal) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Jul 1999 23:29:10 -0500 From: John Kramer Subject: Re: MtMan-List: MtMan-List - Joining the AMM Sorry to disillusion you LongWalker but, AMM has something over 500 membe= rs at present, it began with 5 good men. We are approaching 2000 member number= s issued over the years. =20 The information is free, no fine nor fancy plunder is needed. I am disappointed to hear some didn't keep their commitments to meet you, that= is not what we are about. The only way to join is to be sponsored by a party, two bosslopers or one hiveranno. We take sponsorship very seriously, as we are first a brotherhood.=20 Until we've been on the ground with a prospect in all seasons, it seldom happens. We are each personally responsible to all the other brothers fo= r the people we sponsor.=20 There was a time when most anyone could join by asking and that brought a= few problems. Now sponsorship is the only way to join, it is not problem fre= e. Sometimes it's difficult to make location & schedules coincide to where y= ou become well enough acquainted with one or more of us to be invited to joi= n. In some areas there are very active parties and joining up through one of th= em isn't as difficult as happening to know a member and becoming close enoug= h for them to know you well enough to offer membership, and when necessary find you a second sponsor. The best way that can happen is to spend time together o= n the trail. Dean tries to find someone close by to contact when someone requests information about joining. Sometimes that works out and sometimes it doesn't.=20 It is a group of individualists some of whom are pretty set in their ways= .=20 Some winter alone very nicely. =20 To give you an idea of how we're spread out; there is an active party abo= ut 250 miles East of me, there is one other member within 100 miles North, and o= ne more another 100 miles on up the road. Its 300 miles South and 500 miles= West to find more. I don't get to see any of them often. Joining is often no= t something easily planned, those who belong find their way to us sooner or later. =20 John...=20 Hiveranno, #656 At 09:53 PM 6/30/99 -0500, you wrote: >Washtahay- >At 08:35 PM 6/30/99 -0500, you wrote: >>How does one go about joining the AMM?=A0=A0 There's only a handful of >skinners in my immediate area, most folks are Civil War folks. > Todd, they don't really exist.=A0=20 > Its really just two or three guys who came up with this great scheme to >drive people crazy-lets PRETEND to start this really neat sounding >organization.=A0 When people try to contact us to ask about joining, we'= ll >send them to someone else, who will send them to someone else, and so on >and so on....=A0 it took a lot of time, writing a lot of letters, making= a >lot of phone calls, spending a lot of money to travel a lot of miles to >meet folks who didn't show up (if they ever existed!) when they said the= y >would before I figured that one out.=A0=20 > I'm not sure who the two or three guys are though.=A0 One of these days= I am >gonna come up with some really great trade goods to bribe Hawk or John >Kramer into telling me-pretty sure one or the other of them would have s= ome >clues. > Unless you already have those great trade goods to part with, or a lot = of >time to waste trying to find the mythical AMM, read Nasitir and Drummond >and maybe Anderson's journals-still frustrating at times but the results >are likely to be more tangible! >LongWalker c. du B. >=20 If it ain't exactly right, it's wrong. john ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #320 ******************************* - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message.