From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #425 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Thursday, December 16 1999 Volume 01 : Number 425 In this issue: -牋牋牋 MtMan-List: LAST EMAIL..off topic -牋牋牋 MtMan-List: Montana winter joke -牋牋牋 Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) -牋牋牋 Re: MtMan-List: Need black powder rifle info -牋牋牋 Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) -牋牋牋 Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) -牋牋牋 Re: MtMan-List: Need black powder rifle info -牋牋牋 Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) -牋牋牋 Re: MtMan-List: hand stichin.. -牋牋牋 Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) -牋牋牋 Re: MtMan-List: hand stichin.. -牋牋牋 Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) -牋牋牋 Re: MtMan-List: brain tan ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 07:19:56 -0600 From: "John McKee" Subject: MtMan-List: LAST EMAIL..off topic This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01BF4603.9F7BCC40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sorry for the letter to Steve on the list. I thought I was replying off = list. John - ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01BF4603.9F7BCC40 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Sorry for the letter to = Steve on the=20 list. I thought I was replying off list. = John

- ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01BF4603.9F7BCC40-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 10:28:24 EST From: HawkenHunter@aol.com Subject: MtMan-List: Montana winter joke - --part1_0.284c32a7.2587bc18_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I thought everyone out there might get a kick out of this one. - --part1_0.284c32a7.2587bc18_boundary Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-path: BGeng61@aol.com From: BGeng61@aol.com Full-name: BGeng61 Message-ID: <0.b4a8eea6.2587bb17@aol.com> Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 10:24:07 EST Subject: Fwd: The story of our (used to be) new neighbors To: Firemanmjb@aol.com, MicyMan@worldnet.att.net, dschatz@bigsky.net, MPAJG@aol.com, goldah@uswest.net, SLBB4311@cs.com, Montanacbackkid@aol.com, HawkenHunter@aol.com, pbradfield@in-tch.com, COWWEE@aol.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="part2_0.284c32a7.2587bb17_boundary" X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 45 - --part2_0.284c32a7.2587bb17_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit - --part2_0.284c32a7.2587bb17_boundary Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-path: BGeng61@aol.com From: BGeng61@aol.com Full-name: BGeng61 Message-ID: <0.e68f3e26.2587bae7@aol.com> Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 10:23:19 EST Subject: The story of our (used to be) new neighbors To: BGeng61@aol.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 45 AUG 12 Moved to our new home in Montana. It is so beautiful here. The mountains are so majestic. Can hardly wait to see snow covering them. OCT 14 Montana is the most beautiful place on earth. The leaves are turning all the colors and shades of red and orange. Went for a ride through the beautiful mountains and saw some deer. They are so graceful. Certainly they are the most wonderful animal on earth. This must be paradise. I love it here. NOV 11 Deer season will start soon. I can't imagine anyone wanting to kill such a gorgeous creature. Hope it will snow soon. I love it here. DEC 2 It snowed last night. Woke up to find everything blanketed with white. It looks like a postcard. We went outside and cleaned the snow off the steps and shovelled the driveway. We had a snowball fight (I won), and when the snowplow came by, we had to shovel the driveway again. What a beautiful place. I love Montana. DEC 12 More snow last night. I love it. The snowplow did his trick again to the driveway. I love it here. DEC 19 More snow last night. Couldn't get out of the driveway to get to work. I am exhausted from shovelling. Damn snowplow! DEC 22 More of that white crap fell last night. I've got blisters on my hands from shovelling. I think the snowplow hides around the curve and waits until I'm done shovelling the driveway. Jerk! DEC 25 Merry Stinking Christmas! More friggen snow. If I ever get my hands on that SOB who drives the snowplow I swear I'll kill the bastard. Don't know why they don't use more salt on the roads to melt the fricking ice. DEC 27 More white crap last night. Been inside for three days, except for shovelling out the driveway after that snowplow goes through every time. Can't go anywhere, car is stuck in a mountain of white crap. The weatherman says to expect another 10" of the crap again tonight. Do you know how many shovels full of snow 10" is???? DEC 28 The weatherman was wrong. We got 34" of that white crap this time. At this rate it won't melt before this summer. The snowplow got stuck up in the road and that bastard came to the door and asked to borrow my shovel. After I told him I had broken six shovels already shovelling all the shit he pushed into the driveway, I broke my last one over his fricking head. JAN 4 Finally got out of the house today. Went to the store to get food and on the way back a damned deer ran in front of the car and I hit it. Did about $3000 damage to the car. Those fricking beasts should be killed. Wish the hunters had killed them all last November. MAY 3 Took the car to the garage in town. Would you believe the thing is rusting out from that fricking salt they put all over the roads. MAY 10 Moved back to California. I can't imagine why anyone in their right mind would ever live in that God-forsaken state of Montana. - --part2_0.284c32a7.2587bb17_boundary-- - --part1_0.284c32a7.2587bc18_boundary-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 14:12:39 PST From: "Chance Tiffie" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) I am a carpet layer by trade, and still have access to the linen thread mentioned in your post. The thread is already waxed, and quite large. I found it to large for cloth garments, but perfect for leather. It comes on a wooden spool, and if memory serves me correctly, it is still being manufacured by a company that has been in buiness since the mid 1700's. Cliff Tiffie Rt. 1 Box 82C Caddo, OK 74729 580-924-4187 - --------------------- Aux Ailments de Pays! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 19:53:03 EST From: GazeingCyot@cs.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Need black powder rifle info The advice about a club is very good. Thats just what I did when I started out. I still use a very cheap rifle, cost under $ 200.00, and its been good for learning with. I did get an elk with it,too. Think hard about a scope, though. The whole idea of muzzleloading is going for that extra challenge, sneaking up close enough to the game to get in that shot. It develops new skills that you dont have to consider much with a modern rifle. For instance, Crazy has taught me to think and walk like an elk when hunting- move slow, stop real often and wait, etc. Doing that, I came around a curve in the trail and a bull elk was waiting for me. He knew I was coming, but thought I was another elk from the way I was walking. (being covered with elk urine helped me, too).You'll really enjoy muzzleloading, but nix the scope and it will be even more fun! Jill - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 18:20:24 -0800 From: "Wayne & Terri" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) Chance, By chance do you know what it would cost for spool of it and how much is on a spool. and where i might find one in the northwest. our local trader is out of such things. 3 Strings - -----Original Message----- From: Chance Tiffie To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com Date: Tuesday, December 14, 1999 2:04 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) > > >I am a carpet layer by trade, and still have access to the linen thread >mentioned in your post. The thread is already waxed, and quite large. I >found it to large for cloth garments, but perfect for leather. It comes on >a wooden spool, and if memory serves me correctly, it is still being >manufacured by a company that has been in buiness since the mid 1700's. > >Cliff Tiffie >Rt. 1 Box 82C >Caddo, OK >74729 >580-924-4187 >--------------------- >Aux Ailments de Pays! > >______________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > >---------------------- >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 21:09:23 -0600 From: John Kramer Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) Most full service cities have a store listed under "leather findings" that supplies the shoe repair and upholstery trades. They will have in stock or can order linen thread in several weights (number of strands in the twist) and choice of right or left hand twist. Usually sold in 1 lb. spools for= several dollars. A lifetime supply for most folks. Buy a four strand spool then untwist working lengths of it as you use it -- divide in half then re twist as two strand for really proper sewing of garments. Twist multiple strands together for heavier work, the four strand is good on bags and such. I've never seen a spool of two strand available, I would have bought it. Waxing thread not only lubricates it but measurably strengthens it. Use 8 or 12 strand for the heaviest work. One spool of= four strand left hand twist serves my needs. =20 Hint: a drop spindle makes twisting and untwisting a lot easier. While you're there buy a few glovers needles, and a few harness needles in every size, look at the quality awl handles and blades they offer. Some of the tools are little changed over many centuries. A few cities have legendary leather suppliers like Lanworlan's (sp?) in Indianapolis. A lovely place to spend an afternoon. See if they have a good fid. John... At 06:20 PM 12/14/99 -0800, you wrote: >Chance, > > >By chance do you know what it would cost for spool of it and how much is on >a spool.=A0 and where i might find one in the northwest.=A0 our local= trader is >out of such things. > >3 Strings > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Chance Tiffie >To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com >Date: Tuesday, December 14, 1999 2:04 PM >Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) > > >> >> >>I am a carpet layer by trade, and still have access to the linen thread >>mentioned in your post.=A0 The thread is already waxed, and quite large.= =A0 I >>found it to large for cloth garments, but perfect for leather.=A0 It comes= on >>a wooden spool, and if memory serves me correctly, it is still being >>manufacured by a company that has been in buiness since the mid 1700's. >> >>Cliff Tiffie >>Rt. 1 Box 82C >>Caddo, OK >>74729 >>580-924-4187 >>--------------------- >>Aux Ailments de Pays! >> >>______________________________________________________ >>Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com >> >>---------------------- >>hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/ ~drudy/mtman/maillist.html >> > > >---------------------- >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/ ~drudy/mtman/maillist.html >=20 John T. Kramer, maker of:=A0 Kramer's Best Antique Improver >>>It makes wood wonderful<<< =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 >>>As good as old!<<< mail to: =20 - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 22:16:48 EST From: RangerSF5@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Need black powder rifle info In a message dated 12/14/99 7:54:05 PM EST, GazeingCyot@cs.com writes: << move slow, stop real often and wait, etc. Doing that, I came around a curve in the trail and a bull elk was waiting for me. He knew I was coming, but thought I was another elk from the way I was walking. (being covered with elk urine helped me, too).You'll really enjoy muzzleloading, but nix the scope and it will be even more fun! >> OK,OK,OK,OK, I'll trash the scope. I did get my papers from the PD today for a change in my new address and i'll have my new card on Friday. But I had 2 questions i wanted answered. So far Nil. I found this server through a web site. What is the URL? I had to post on that site various things to qualify. I spent 4 months in Alaska and the Yukon and was short 640 miles from theNorth Pole so that got me qualified although some things I never did,eg,skin a deer,tan a hide. UMmmm Maybe I better take my center fire weapon question to another list. But ya'll all can send me the URL and i'll pass it to by buddies here. Happy Holidays to all Bob Bordentown,NJ Peace through superior fire power! - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 21:52:07 -0600 From: bvannoy Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) You might want to look in embroidery or quilting magazines for thread suppliers. Many carry the smaller linen thread for garment stiching. If you have a hard time finding the linen thread, contact me offline. There is a speciality store near me that has some. Chases Hawks. Chance Tiffie wrote: > I am a carpet layer by trade, and still have access to the linen thread > mentioned in your post. The thread is already waxed, and quite large. I > found it to large for cloth garments, but perfect for leather. It comes on > a wooden spool, and if memory serves me correctly, it is still being > manufacured by a company that has been in buiness since the mid 1700's. > > Cliff Tiffie > Rt. 1 Box 82C > Caddo, OK > 74729 > 580-924-4187 > --------------------- > Aux Ailments de Pays! > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 21:20:45 -0800 From: randybublitz@juno.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: hand stichin.. Steve, When I started sewing leather I learned a neat trick from a friend. I would cut out my pieces of leather per the pattern. Then I took a fork (like the one you eat with) and cut off half the handle. I then sharpened the fork tines with a small file. I then bought one of those punch pads from Tandy Leather. This pad is placed under the leather so you don't dull your punch too quickly. I bought a pair of calipers with points on each side (like a compass that you used in geometry, except with two points instead of a pencil on one side-although a compass would work). I then lightly scribe, say a 1/4 inch line along the edge of the leather, running one point along the edge as a guide-dragging the other point along the leather to draw line. I then take my 4 prong punch -starting at one end I punch 4 holes-then place 1 tine in last hole, punch 3 more hole, etc...etc.... (stricking fork handle with hammer). I do this with each piece of leather where they will be sewn together. When done punching I have all my pieces of leather pre-punched. I now have made myself a 'kit' (like from tandy). I then take a length of waxed linen thread over 4 times as long as the line to be stitched. I thread two tapestry needles (rather dull, so won't cut thread) on the linen thread. Bring two ends of thread together and knot. bring needles to opposite sides of thread 'circle' so that the knot is equidistant between needles when needles are pulled away from each other. Now you are ready to saddle stitch. Put one needle through holes in leather to be sewn, and draw thread through to the knot. you should now have equal lengths of thread and a needle on either side of the leather pieces. Next put one needle through next hole and draw thread tight, now put other needle through same hole from the opposite side, draw thread tight. You should now have a binding stitch through first set of holes. Continue on down the line of holes, one needle then the other through the same hole, pull tight, next hole, etc.... It works best if you rotate needles every stitch, instead of running a line with one needle , than catching up with the other. One needle through hole, other needle through same hole from the other side. The needles will always be on opposite sides of the work from each other. The end product will be very strong, and you will have a straight, even stitch line. Folks will think you used a machine, because holes are so neatly place, evenly along the line. Almost all of my leather equipement is sewn with this method. Nothing ever breaks... Good luck, you to can sew with the best of them....... hope this helps.... Hardtack Your Second Amendment Rights protect ALL of your other Rights, Don't give up your Rights - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 21:45:19 +0000 From: R Lahti Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) Wayne & Terri wrote: > By chance do you know what it would cost for spool of it and how much is on > a spool. and where i might find one in the northwest. Wayne, You might try this sutler. He has what your looking for and at a reasonable price. His service is quick. I remain... http://www.teleport.com/~walking/clark/ YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 18:11:17 -0700 From: Charles P Webb Subject: Re: MtMan-List: hand stichin.. The fork trick also works well on heavier leather, simply dampen the leather where you wish to do your stitching, use a pair of dividers (as you suggested) to create a guide line , then impress the fork tines as you discribed along this line into the dampened leather, the tines will leave a darkened slightly depressed mark. Using strips of corrugated cardboard stacked on top of each other to support the dampened marked leather. Use your awl to punch your stitching holes. The dampened leather also accepts the linen thread without cutting, and makes for a very tight stich. I have long purchased my linen thread from shoe repair or saddle shops. I prefer to buy six ply which is very easy to split into three ply or even down to one or two ply. I also prefer to wax the plys myself rather than purchase the pre-waxed linen. The thread I prefer is "Barbour's Pure Flax Sinew" and is made in the USA 916 yard Roll, #6 Cord. by Blue Mountain Industries, Blue Mountain, Alabama 36201 cost is around $30 frog plews. Respectfully submitted, C Webb > I took a fork (like the one you eat with) and cut off half the handle. - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1999 18:45:31 -0700 From: Allen Hall Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Stitchin reply(Linen thread) At 06:20 PM 12/14/1999 -0800, you wrote: >By chance do you know what it would cost for spool of it and how much is on >a spool. and where i might find one in the northwest. our local trader is >out of such things. Saddlemakers and shoe makers use linen thread still. I got a big spool of 6 ply for $20. I sew a fair amount and can't imagine that I'll ever use it up. Allen Hall in Fort Hall country > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1999 08:58:07 -0700 From: "Wynn & Gretchen Ormond" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: brain tan This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0028_01BF47A3.ABB3EC80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I have thought about what many of you have advised Steve concerning = using commercial leather or "holding out" for brain tanned and now I = want to put in my two cents.=20 I made a pair of breeches about ten years ago. They are basically a pair = of commercial leather levi's that I used artifical sinew to sew and man = did it look like it. I had a big curved needle that wore out my fingers = and took a lot more work than a simple awl. However, if I had waited for = brain tanned I would still be waiting. Now I did not have the good = advise that Steve has from his brothers, but I still think that he could = learn a few things from making and using even an inferior product. He = also gets to feed his addiction and when he does get good leather he = will be better prepared to use it. I am curious does the AMM accept outfits made from commercial buckskin = to meet its requirements to become a bossloper? Regards WYnn=20 - ------=_NextPart_000_0028_01BF47A3.ABB3EC80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I have thought about what many of you have advised Steve concerning = using=20 commercial leather or "holding out" for brain tanned and now I want to = put in my=20 two cents.

I made a pair of breeches about ten years ago. They are basically a = pair of=20 commercial leather levi’s that I used artifical sinew to sew and = man did it look=20 like it. I had a big curved needle that wore out my fingers and took a = lot more=20 work than a simple awl. However, if I had waited for brain tanned I = would still=20 be waiting. Now I did not have the good advise that Steve has from his = brothers,=20 but I still think that he could learn a few things from making and using = even an=20 inferior product. He also gets to feed his addiction and when he does = get good=20 leather he will be better prepared to use it.

I am curious does the AMM accept outfits made from commercial = buckskin to=20 meet its requirements to become a bossloper?

Regards WYnn

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