From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #558 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Thursday, May 25 2000 Volume 01 : Number 558 In this issue: -       Re: MtMan-List: English sporters -       RE: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? -       Re: MtMan-List: Powder (resupply and yearly requirements) -       RE: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? -       RE: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 00:14:11 EDT From: Ssturtle1199@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: English sporters "Stewart had money from his mother"s estate as well as his miniscule army pay, and he traveled widely before sailing to the United States in 1832. Going on to St. Louis, Stewart became acquainted with several prominant fur traders, including Kenneth MacKenzie, William L. Sublette, and Robert Campbell. With the latter, he journied to the Rockies in 1833." The Rocky Mountain Journals of William Marshall Anderson - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 18:23:42 +0100 From: rick_williams@byu.edu Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping A fellow list member Dave Tippetts has been educating me on some of the finer points of beaver trapping (Thanks Dave) and we have speculated on some of the following: What did they use to hoop up the pelts? It would be a tremendous amount of twine and you don't see alot coming in the ledgers. My thoughts include rawhide and maybe the intestines of the beaver themselves. Haven't found any docs on this but I haven't found and docs on anything else that was used. A large beaver weighs alot. We know that camptenders did alot of the skinning and hooping, but if I had alot of weight wouldn't it make sense to "field" dress the hide and then flesh it at camp? The term regarding stick floating, does this only mean that the stick that secured the trap to the ground would float once beaver headed for deep water or was there also a method to "mark" your traps location by use of floating sticks. Osborne Russell list a recipe for lure. Any other primary docs on lures? Wyeth mentions trapping beaver during the summer months as he traveled. I believe James Audobon did as well although he was not a trapper. How prevalent was summer trapping of beaver? What were the hides used for after the fur was shaved off? Hide glue? - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 16:06:40 -0500 From: don neighbors Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping try sinew for hooping the pelts, and dental floss works great, and it is linen. rick_williams@byu.edu wrote: > A fellow list member Dave Tippetts has been educating me on some of the > finer points of beaver trapping (Thanks Dave) and we have speculated on some > of the following: > > What did they use to hoop up the pelts? It would be a tremendous amount of > twine and you don't see alot coming in the ledgers. My thoughts include > rawhide and maybe the intestines of the beaver themselves. Haven't found > any docs on this but I haven't found and docs on anything else that was > used. > > A large beaver weighs alot. We know that camptenders did alot of the > skinning and hooping, but if I had alot of weight wouldn't it make sense to > "field" dress the hide and then flesh it at camp? > > The term regarding stick floating, does this only mean that the stick that > secured the trap to the ground would float once beaver headed for deep water > or was there also a method to "mark" your traps location by use of floating > sticks. > > Osborne Russell list a recipe for lure. Any other primary docs on lures? > > Wyeth mentions trapping beaver during the summer months as he traveled. I > believe James Audobon did as well although he was not a trapper. How > prevalent was summer trapping of beaver? > > What were the hides used for after the fur was shaved off? Hide glue? > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 13:55:26 -0700 From: Baird.Rick@orbital-lsg.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? Really? Is Dental Floss really Linen? No kiddin'? I always just assumed it was some sort of space-age nylon or something. Where can I find out for sure? Rick - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 15:45:56 -0500 From: jc60714@navix.net Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Powder (resupply and yearly requirements) Washtahay- during a long walk after my truck broke down today, I finally had time to consider this question. I'm using Hawk's numbers as a starting point only to show different perspectives on this, not because I think he is terribly wrong. Anyone who knows me knows I usually travel with enough ammo and firepower to start a war--I admire Hawk's willingness to publicly admit he would want enough ammo to fight from the Brook's Range to Peru!!!! Given a choice, I don't disagree with him--for today. I've gained the impression that in 1827 or so the situation was different. I don't think most folks travelled with that kind of armament and supplies, so I did some number-crunching and cogitating on my little jaunt today. You can do a lot of that in 17 miles. . . . If I were stepping on a time machine for a year in the mountains ca 1830, I would probably be basing my powder supply demand on numbers like this. They are based on a .54 cal rifle, using a 110 grain charge. The observant amongst the readers will note that this is a charge equal to 1/2 of the ball weight. In addition to being a common period calculation, it is also a charge that provides a roughly 2000 fps load. It'll shoot through a buff, it'll do for anything else I might run across. 10 shots hunting/week=520 rounds 10 shots skirmishing/biweekly=260 rounds fresh load every day=365 rounds 1145 rounds @110 grains per=roughly 19 1/2 pounds powder Call it 21 pounds, as I would want to take a pound of priming powder. Those numbers are based on me, and are admittedly what I see as a worst-case scenario. I would be comfortable with half that. For the non-time-traveling resident of the ca. 1830 Rocky Mountains, that would probably be seen as overkill. Realistically, I wonder if the average wasn't closer to 3 rounds per week--that works out to about 2.5 pounds of powder per year. They were there to hunt beaver, not to shoot small game and plink at rocks. Meat came conveniently packaged as buffalo, elk, and deer--a decent shot should be able to provide camp meat on such large animals with less than 3 shots per week. Reading the primary literature, I have the impression that Indian fights weren't really that common. Folks worked hard to avoid them as risky, and a waste of time and money. Hawk has some good words about other equipment as well: >I would have took 2 to 4 ----25lb kegs of powder---75 to 150 lb of lead >and 10 yds of patching---25 lb of tow for cleaning I'd probably go with about two yards of patching, and use the scraps for cleaning the gun, supplemented by buff hair on a tow worm (works right well). From what I've read of early trade lists, I think patching was probably often the latest shirt that wore out. Scrap cloth or fiber on a tow worm for cleaning, again supplemented by buff hair. >would also need a bit of salt----I would guess about 100 lbs would last >for curing hides and meat Personally, I would take maybe three pounds of salt, and that for "table" use. I don't salt hides now, I wouldn't then. I don't think the practice was common in the field either. Large quantities of salt weren't mentioned in the trade lists I have seen. I prefer to dry meat without salt. I feel it makes a better staple that way. >I would also guess that you would need 5 yds >of cloth to make char for fire starting I'd use scrap cloth--old cleaning patches work well--or punk wood. I'm too cheap to buy cloth for such a purpose, and it wouldn't surprise me to discover the practice was the same "way back when" >and about 2 grose of rifle flints--- I'd be taking about a gross, along with a spare lock. I bet my hypothetical pioneer would have maybe 2 dozen flints. There are an awful lot of mentions of misfires and klatches in the old journals. >a couple of good woll blankets--- or a blanket and a robe. >a half dozen good skinner knives --- Here's where you lose me for a minute Hawk. Six knives? Wait a minute. I'm sitting here at the keyboard in street clothes, and I have three on my person. A quick check of my hunting bag turns up two more, and there are a pair on the belt in my parfleche. You are right, sorry about that. The minimal mountain man may have had two, or only one. I think it was in Meek's autobiography where he used the example of a man losing his knife to make a point, and I can think of at least two other mentions in the literature of people losing thier "only" knife. >a good ax and tomahawk--- a good bow saw--- If you are going to trap, you might want to add a shovel and a pick. I don't know how common the carrying of a saw was back then, I've never seen mention of one outside a fort--and then only one with a carpenter's shop. >a half dozen #4 double spring traps---a half dozen # 1 1/2 single spring traps-- I'd be for upping that to a dozen #4s and a dozen #1 1/2s, this is the same trap load as I ran for many years. In the field in the far west, if I recall correctly the common practice was to carry 6 beaver traps per trapper. >least 2 or more fire steels. At least. I had a poorly tempered Warranted Bright Oval break one time, had I not had a spare I would have had a cold night of it (No firelock with me that trip) >now you have a basic load without any creature conforts---total up the >weight-----comes to over 400 lbs without creature comforts---or riggin >for the horses or mules---each pack animal could carry about 125 lb >easily---means at least 3 pack animals My load for this time travel vacation (with a robe and blanket for bedding) would run about 180 pounds, and I would either work to reduce it to cut myself to one pack animal, or travel with two lightly loaded pack animals. My minimal mountain man would have a load of about 90 pounds--less than one animal load. Either way, when consumables are figured in, we are looking at two pack-loads of gear. LongWalker c. du B. - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 15:28:10 -0600 From: louis.l.sickler@lmco.com Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? Rick, Never tried this. I, too, always thought it was nylon. But, hold it to a flame, if it melts, it's nylon or some sort of plastic. If it doesn't, it's something else. Hard to tell what, though. I'll have to try this one when I get home. Lou Sickler Colorado Territory > -----Original Message----- > From: Baird.Rick@orbital-lsg.com [SMTP:Baird.Rick@orbital-lsg.com] > Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2000 2:55 PM > To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? > > > > Really? Is Dental Floss really Linen? No kiddin'? I always just assumed > it > was some sort of space-age nylon or something. > Where can I find out for sure? > Rick > > > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 17:45:59 -0400 From: "D Miles" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? > Really? Is Dental Floss really Linen? No kiddin'? I always just assumed it > was some sort of space-age nylon or something. > Where can I find out for sure? Burn it, if it melts it is nylon, if it just burns into oblivion.. It is linen, or cotton... D "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e" DOUBLE EDGE FORGE Period Knives & Iron Accoutrements http://www.bright.net/~deforge1 "Knowing how is just the beginning" - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 18:36:18 EDT From: GHickman@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping rick_williams@byu.edu writes: > Osborne Russell list a recipe for lure. Any other primary docs on lures?>> The Lewis & Clark juornals also list a recipe, but I can't locate it now. I and perhaps others on the list would also be interested in the recipes you find. How about sharing the Russell recipe now. Thanks. YMOS Ghosting Wolf - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 16:47:03 -0700 From: "John C. Funk, Jr." Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? Dental floss is made with a synthetic....not "linen". Burn it....it melts....and stinks....like nylon. Linen in that thickness wouldn't have the tensile strength even if it was waxed. John funk - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2000 2:28 PM Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? > Rick, > > Never tried this. I, too, always thought it was nylon. But, hold it to a > flame, if it melts, it's nylon or some sort of plastic. If it doesn't, it's > something else. Hard to tell what, though. > > I'll have to try this one when I get home. > > Lou Sickler > Colorado Territory > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Baird.Rick@orbital-lsg.com [SMTP:Baird.Rick@orbital-lsg.com] > > Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2000 2:55 PM > > To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > > Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? > > > > > > > > Really? Is Dental Floss really Linen? No kiddin'? I always just assumed > > it > > was some sort of space-age nylon or something. > > Where can I find out for sure? > > Rick > > > > > > > > ---------------------- > > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 19:05:11 PDT From: "Chance Tiffie" Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping Excellent questions!! "Drewyer's" recipe for bait, 1806. "To prepare beaver bait, the castor or barkstone is first gently pressed from the bladder-like bag which contains it, into a phial of four ounces, with a large mouth. Five or six of these stones are thus taken, to which must be added nutmeg, 12 or 15 cloves, and 30 grains of cinnamon, finely pulverised and stirred together, with as much ardent spirits as will reduce the whole to the consistency of mustard." I have used this particular batch with some success. As for hooping beaver, I have used rawhide, without even removing the hair. I don't think twine should be dismissed though, as one piece could be used over and over again. I have always assumed the "floatstick" was seperate from the stake, and was attached to the trap like a bobber. I have set traps on water here in Oklahoma, that rose over night, and finding your set would be next to impossible without a "floatstick." Seems we obsess over the quality of our hides these days, how well they are skinned, and how well they are hooped. I can't help but think that these men were after quantity. If they could sell a summer plew, then they would trap in the summer. Provided some were over-achievers. Buyers were after the hair, I don't think much time was invested in a flawless skinning, with ears and nostrils intact. Some of the beaver I have hooped didn't turn out quite round, but they still weighed the same as a perfectly round hide. If I had my choice I would skin just as soon as I pulled one out of the water, no point carrying them heavy suckers. It would be a hack and yank job though; let the camp keepers clean them up. A person that didn't want to be caught out much after daylight, or the fear of leaving to many carcass's laying around to attract unwanted attention, might justify carrying them out. Cliff Tiffie PO Box 5089 Durant, OK 74702 580-924-4187 - --------------------- Aux Aliments de Pays! ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 21:38:15 -0500 From: "Ratcliff" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? If you want some real linen cordage, from thread to thick twine check = out Barbour's. I recently posted some information about the subject. = See the sites below for information and sources. =20 Lanney Ratcliff Check out Barbours and Leather Factory below: =20 http://leatherfactory.com/ http://www.barbour-threads.com/profile.html - ----- Original Message -----=20 From: To: Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2000 3:55 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? >=20 >=20 > Really? Is Dental Floss really Linen? No kiddin'? I always just = assumed it > was some sort of space-age nylon or something. > Where can I find out for sure? > Rick >=20 >=20 >=20 > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: = http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 22:06:14 -0600 From: "Ron Chamberlain" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping I read somewhere, Book of Buckskinning series maybe(?), that wangs made from green hides were used to to hoop beaver pelts with. They surely had a regular supply of them due to hunting. I will try and find it and any documentation on it. Ron A fellow list member Dave Tippetts has been educating me on some of the finer points of beaver trapping (Thanks Dave) and we have speculated on some of the following: What did they use to hoop up the pelts? It would be a tremendous amount of twine and you don't see alot coming in the ledgers. My thoughts include rawhide and maybe the intestines of the beaver themselves. Haven't found any docs on this but I haven't found and docs on anything else that was used. A large beaver weighs alot. We know that camptenders did alot of the skinning and hooping, but if I had alot of weight wouldn't it make sense to "field" dress the hide and then flesh it at camp? The term regarding stick floating, does this only mean that the stick that secured the trap to the ground would float once beaver headed for deep water or was there also a method to "mark" your traps location by use of floating sticks. Osborne Russell list a recipe for lure. Any other primary docs on lures? Wyeth mentions trapping beaver during the summer months as he traveled. I believe James Audobon did as well although he was not a trapper. How prevalent was summer trapping of beaver? What were the hides used for after the fur was shaved off? Hide glue? - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 22:20:32 -0600 From: "Ron Chamberlain" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? Taken from http://www.dentaldigest.com/perio/floss.html Ain't technology wonderful! COLGATE® TOTAL® Colgate Description: A state-of-the-art, low-friction, Teflon® fiber ...... Glide® Floss W.L. Gore & Associates Description: Made from expanded PTFE (polytetrafluorethylene), ...... JOHNSON & JOHNSON REACH® FLOSS Johnson & Johnson Description: Nylon dental floss ...... JOHNSON & JOHNSON REACH® FLOSS EASY SLIDE® Johnson & Johnson Description: Made of patented PTFE material .... PHB PERIO-FLOSS PHB, Inc. Description: A USA-made acrylic yarn floss ..... WISDOM DENTAL FLOSS Wisdom Toothbrush Co. Description: Features 840 denier nylon strands. ..... Wher'd you come up with linen??? Ron > > > Really? Is Dental Floss really Linen? No kiddin'? I always just assumed it > was some sort of space-age nylon or something. > Where can I find out for sure? > Rick - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 08:51:41 -0500 From: don neighbors Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? I was told that by an old buckskinner who was a dentist. I use it to sew with alot. Baird.Rick@orbital-lsg.com wrote: > Really? Is Dental Floss really Linen? No kiddin'? I always just assumed it > was some sort of space-age nylon or something. > Where can I find out for sure? > Rick > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 08:53:53 -0500 From: don neighbors Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? wrong. it melts because of the wax in it, and it is sterile..................... "John C. Funk, Jr." wrote: > Dental floss is made with a synthetic....not "linen". Burn it....it > melts....and stinks....like nylon. Linen in that thickness wouldn't have > the tensile strength even if it was waxed. > > John funk > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2000 2:28 PM > Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? > > > Rick, > > > > Never tried this. I, too, always thought it was nylon. But, hold it to a > > flame, if it melts, it's nylon or some sort of plastic. If it doesn't, > it's > > something else. Hard to tell what, though. > > > > I'll have to try this one when I get home. > > > > Lou Sickler > > Colorado Territory > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Baird.Rick@orbital-lsg.com [SMTP:Baird.Rick@orbital-lsg.com] > > > Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2000 2:55 PM > > > To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > > > Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? > > > > > > > > > > > > Really? Is Dental Floss really Linen? No kiddin'? I always just > assumed > > > it > > > was some sort of space-age nylon or something. > > > Where can I find out for sure? > > > Rick > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------- > > > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > > ---------------------- > > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 07:54:34 -0500 From: "northwoods" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping - -----Original Message----- From: rick_williams@byu.edu To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com Date: May 24, 2000 12:29 PM Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping >>A fellow list member Dave Tippetts has been educating me on some of the finer points of beaver trapping (Thanks Dave) and we have speculated on some of the following:>> Here is some additional information from the book Adventures in Mexico & the Rocky Mountains, published in 1848, by Ruxton: Having determined the locality of his trap ground, he starts to the mountains, sometimes alone, sometimes with three or four in company, as soon as breaking up the ice allows him to commence operations. Arrived on his hunting grounds, he follows the creeks and streams, all the while keeping a sharp lookout for "sign". If he sees a prostrate cottonwood tree he examines it to see if it be the work of the beaver-whether "thrown" for the purpose of food or to dam the stream. The track of the beaver on the mud or the sand is also examined; and if the sign be fresh, he sets his traps in the run of the animal, hiding it under water, and attaching it by a stout chain to a picket driven in the bank, or to a bush or a tree. A "float stick" is made fast to the trap by a cord a few feet long, which, if the animal carry away the trap, floats on the water and points out its position. The trap is baited with "medicine", an oily substance obtained from a gland in the scrotum of the beaver, but distinct of the testes. A stick is dipped in this and planted over the trap; and the beaver attracted by the smell, and wishing a close inspection, very foolishly puts his leg in the trap, and is a "gone beaver." When a lodge is discovered, the trap is set at the edge of the dam, at the point where the animal passes from deep water to shallow, and always under water. Early in the morning the hunter mounts his mules and examines his traps. The captured animals are skinned, and the tails, which are a great dainty, carefully packed into camp. The skin is stretched over a hoop or framework of osier twigs, and is allowed to dry, the flesh and fatty substance being scraped (grained). When dry, it is folded into a square sheet, the fur turned inward, and the bundle, containing about ten to twenty skins, tightly pressed and corded, is ready for transportation. During the hunt, regardless of Indian vicinity, the fearless trapper wanders far and near in search of "sign". His nerves must ever be in a state of tension, and his mind ever present at his call. His eagle eyes sweep around the country, and in an instance detects any foreign appearance. A turned leaf, a blade of grass pressed down, the uneasiness of wild animals, the flight of birds, are all paragraphs to him written in natures legible hand and the plainest language. All the wits of the subtle savage are called into play to gain an advantage over the wily woodsman; but with the natural instinct of the primitive man, the white hunter has the advantage of a civilized mind, and, thus provided, seldom fails to outwit, under equal advantage, the cunning savage. The trappers of the Rocky Mountains belong to a "genus" more approximating to the primitive savage than perhaps any other class of civilized man. There lives being spent in the remote wilderness of the mountains, with no other companion than nature herself, there habits and characters assume a most singular cast of simplicity mingled with ferocity, appearing to take there coloring from the scenes and object around them. Knowing no wants save those of nature, there sole care is to procure sufficient food to support life, and the necessary clothing to protect them from the rigorous climate. This, with the assistance of there rifles, they are generally able to effect, but sometimes at the expense of great peril and hardship. When engaged in there avocation, the natural instinct of primitive man is ever alive, for the purpose of guarding against danger and the provision of necessary food. Keen observers of nature, they rival the beasts of prey in discovering the haunts of wild game, and in there skill and cunning in capturing it. Constantly exposed to perils of all kinds, they become callous to any feeling of danger, and destroy human as well as animal life with as little scruple and as freely as they expose there own. Of laws, human or divine, they neither now or care to know. There wish is there law, and to attain it they do not scruple as to ways and means. Firm friends and bitter enemies, with them it is "a word and a blow" and the blow often first. They may have good qualities, but they are those of the animal; and people fond of giving hard names call them revengeful, bloodthirsty, drunkards (when the wherewithal can be had), gamblers, regardless of the laws, in fact, white Indians. However, there are exceptions, and I have met honest mountain men. There animal qualities, however, are undeniable. Strong, active, hardy as bears, expert in the use of there weapons, they are just what uncivilized man might be supposed in a brute state, depending upon his instinct for the support of life. Not a hole or corner in the vast wilderness of the "far west" has not been ransacked by these hardy men.From the Mississippi to the mouth of the Colorado west, from the frozen regions of the north to the Gila in Mexico, the beaver trapper has set his traps in every river and stream. All this vast country, but for the daring enterprise of these men, would be terra incognito to geographers, as indeed a great portion is still, but there is not an acre that has not been passed and repassed by the trappers on ther perilous excursions, The mountians and streams still retain the names assigned to them by the rude hunters; and alone these are the hardy pioneers who pave the way for the settlement of the western country. Sorry for getting carried away, I had the book open and apparently my typing skills are improving steadily. I find Ruxtons descriptions to not be error free, but entertaining, and enlightening in much of the time. T. Clark - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 09:07:04 -0500 From: don neighbors Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? wrong.......nice try.......... Ron Chamberlain wrote: > Taken from http://www.dentaldigest.com/perio/floss.html > Ain't technology wonderful! > > COLGATE=AE TOTAL=AE Colgate > Description: A state-of-the-art, low-friction, Teflon=AE fiber ...... > > Glide=AE Floss W.L. Gore & Associates > Description: Made from expanded PTFE (polytetrafluorethylene), ...... > > JOHNSON & JOHNSON REACH=AE FLOSS Johnson & Johnson Description: Nylon d= ental > floss ...... > > JOHNSON & JOHNSON REACH=AE FLOSS EASY SLIDE=AE Johnson & Johnson > Description: Made of patented PTFE material .... > > PHB PERIO-FLOSS PHB, Inc. > Description: A USA-made acrylic yarn floss ..... > > WISDOM DENTAL FLOSS Wisdom Toothbrush Co. > Description: Features 840 denier nylon strands. ..... > > Wher'd you come up with linen??? > > Ron > > > > > > > Really? Is Dental Floss really Linen? No kiddin'? I always just as= sumed > it > > was some sort of space-age nylon or something. > > Where can I find out for sure? > > Rick > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 08:19:26 -0700 From: "Paul W. Jones" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? Don: Why is the reponse wrong? Are you still maintaining that dental floss is made from a natural fiber? Some perhaps, although I have not found it. = Was at the pharmacy yesterday and stopped and perused the dental floss. Each and every brand on the shelf listed synthetic materials. Could you explain, or do I misunderstand your response. Regards, Paul - ----- Original Message ----- From: don neighbors To: Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2000 7:07 AM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? wrong.......nice try.......... Ron Chamberlain wrote: > Taken from http://www.dentaldigest.com/perio/floss.html > Ain't technology wonderful! > > COLGATE=AE TOTAL=AE Colgate > Description: A state-of-the-art, low-friction, Teflon=AE fiber ...... > > Glide=AE Floss W.L. Gore & Associates > Description: Made from expanded PTFE (polytetrafluorethylene), ...... > > JOHNSON & JOHNSON REACH=AE FLOSS Johnson & Johnson Description: Nylon d= ental > floss ...... > > JOHNSON & JOHNSON REACH=AE FLOSS EASY SLIDE=AE Johnson & Johnson > Description: Made of patented PTFE material .... > > PHB PERIO-FLOSS PHB, Inc. > Description: A USA-made acrylic yarn floss ..... > > WISDOM DENTAL FLOSS Wisdom Toothbrush Co. > Description: Features 840 denier nylon strands. ..... > > Wher'd you come up with linen??? > > Ron > > > > > > > Really? Is Dental Floss really Linen? No kiddin'? I always just assumed > it > > was some sort of space-age nylon or something. > > Where can I find out for sure? > > Rick > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 09:19:57 -0400 From: "D Miles" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? > wrong. it melts because of the wax in it, and it is > sterile..................... I melted some of the 3 types we have here.. All three melted into a hard nylon ball, not a wax type melt. And as an earlier post from Ron pointed out, the manufacturers says it is made from nylon, PTFE, acrylic yarn & teflon fiber of all things!... If you believe the word of an "Old Buckskinner" on all subjects.. I gots some beach property fer ya! D "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e" DOUBLE EDGE FORGE Period Knives & Iron Accoutrements http://www.bright.net/~deforge1 "Knowing how is just the beginning" - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 07:39:19 -0700 From: "John C. Funk, Jr." Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? The wax "burns"; the synthetic melts! - ----- Original Message ----- From: don neighbors To: Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2000 6:53 AM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? > wrong. it melts because of the wax in it, and it is > sterile..................... > > "John C. Funk, Jr." wrote: > > > Dental floss is made with a synthetic....not "linen". Burn it....it > > melts....and stinks....like nylon. Linen in that thickness wouldn't have > > the tensile strength even if it was waxed. > > > > John funk > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: > > To: > > Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2000 2:28 PM > > Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > Never tried this. I, too, always thought it was nylon. But, hold it to a > > > flame, if it melts, it's nylon or some sort of plastic. If it doesn't, > > it's > > > something else. Hard to tell what, though. > > > > > > I'll have to try this one when I get home. > > > > > > Lou Sickler > > > Colorado Territory > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: Baird.Rick@orbital-lsg.com [SMTP:Baird.Rick@orbital-lsg.com] > > > > Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2000 2:55 PM > > > > To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > > > > Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: Beaver trapping/Dental Floss? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Really? Is Dental Floss really Linen? No kiddin'? I always just > > assumed > > > > it > > > > was some sort of space-age nylon or something. > > > > Where can I find out for sure? > > > > Rick > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------- > > > > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > > > > ---------------------- > > > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > > > > > ---------------------- > > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #558 ******************************* - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message.