From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #607 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Sunday, August 13 2000 Volume 01 : Number 607 In this issue: -       Re: MtMan-List: Beaver traps -       Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader -       Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader -       Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader -       Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader -       MtMan-List: Water Proofing -       MtMan-List: Vail -       Re: MtMan-List: Water Proofing -       Re: MtMan-List: Vail -       MtMan-List: Water Proofing -       MtMan-List: russia sheeting -       MtMan-List: Russia Sheeting -       Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader -       Re: MtMan-List: waterproofing lodge -       Re: MtMan-List: russia sheeting -       MtMan-List: Before our time BUT... -       Re: MtMan-List: Before our time BUT... -       Re: MtMan-List: russia sheeting -       MtMan-List: russia sheeting -       Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader -       Re: MtMan-List: russia sheeting -       Re: MtMan-List: waterproofing lodge -       Re: MtMan-List: russia sheeting -       MtMan-List: Murdered & Pillaged Americans, 1810 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2000 19:46:54 -0600 From: Todd Glover Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver traps Rod Douglas does make some mighty fine traps, I'll give him that. There's also a fellow here in Utah that makes nice hand forged traps. Allen Hall donated one of them to the museum. Perhaps Allen can remember the mans name, or at least can get it. As I recall, these particular traps cost around $125.00 each, which I believe is one of the better deals you're likely to find. Prices are high, that's why my friends and I are treying to make our own. "Teton" Todd D. Glover Poison River Party - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 1980 20:13:43 -0600 From: Angela Gottfred Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader Capt. Lahti wrote: >> I just read about it's use historically in a quote that I think Angela may have passed on to us about how tarps used to protect goods carried via Voyager Canoe/Mackenze boat through Canada were treated. All it said was that the goods were covered with tarps water proofed or treated "with corn oil and animal fats".<< Yikes! When was that?! It must have been quite a while ago, because I don't remember anything about it, and I would expect to. I think I might have posted, quite a while ago, a note to the effect that oilcloth was routinely used by voyageurs, with some documentation, but I don't recall ever reading anything about how the oilcloth was made. Maybe it's that K.R.A.F.T. disease I've been hearing about? Your perplexed yet humble and obedient servant, Angela Gottfred - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2000 20:51:45 -0700 From: "Roger Lahti" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Angela Gottfred" To: Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 1980 7:13 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader I think I might have > posted, quite a while ago, a note to the effect that oilcloth was routinely > used by voyageurs, with some documentation, but I don't recall ever reading > anything about how the oilcloth was made. Maybe it's that K.R.A.F.T. > disease I've been hearing about? > > Your perplexed yet humble and obedient servant, > Angela Gottfred Angela, May not have been your post but it was a quote from some British Explorer and likely something you would have cotributed. I will go back through my messages and see if I can find it. Stand by. I remain..... YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2000 20:58:55 -0700 From: "Roger Lahti" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader Angela, Can't find it in my latest messages and I know I read it within the past couple weeks so I think it was in T&LR or Muzzle Loader. I will look. I remain..... YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Angela Gottfred" To: Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 1980 7:13 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader > Capt. Lahti wrote: > >> I just read about it's use historically in a quote that I > think Angela may have passed on to us about how tarps used to protect goods > carried via Voyager Canoe/Mackenze boat through Canada were treated. All it > said was that the goods were covered with tarps water proofed or treated > "with corn oil and animal fats".<< > > Yikes! When was that?! It must have been quite a while ago, because I don't > remember anything about it, and I would expect to. I think I might have > posted, quite a while ago, a note to the effect that oilcloth was routinely > used by voyageurs, with some documentation, but I don't recall ever reading > anything about how the oilcloth was made. Maybe it's that K.R.A.F.T. > disease I've been hearing about? > > Your perplexed yet humble and obedient servant, > Angela Gottfred > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2000 21:13:39 -0700 From: "Roger Lahti" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader Angela and Gentlemen, OK, here's the quote and it comes from the July/August issue of Muzzle Loader Magazine, page 38, middle paragraph of the article "Alexander Mackenzie Searches for the Northwest Passage, Part 1" by Tony Hunter. Hunter is explaining how Mackenzie had taken such great pains to make sure all his bases were covered on this particular expedition and he is talking about all the contents of the cargo that went into four large canoes. "Ninety pound pieces of pemmican and others of jerked venison and parched corn provided an adequate food supply. The cargoes were covered with cloths soaked in corn oil and animal fat to make them waterproof" (Vail 35-36). That's what I am going by. I presume Vail was a trustworthy reporter and got it right. Don't know who Vail is by the way. Sorry for dragging you into this Angela. I remain..... YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2000 23:40:50 -0500 From: "harddog" Subject: MtMan-List: Water Proofing Capt. L, I wonder what these tarps smelled like after the oil and fat got rancid? Also wondering how long before the corn oil and fat mixture started rotting the material? Randy Hedden - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2000 23:54:13 -0500 From: "harddog" Subject: MtMan-List: Vail Capt. L, According to the bibliography for Hunter's article in Muzzleloader Mag, Phillip Vail wrote "The Magnificant Adventures of Alexander Mackenzie", published in 1964. Wonder where he got his information if not from Mackenzie's journals? Guess we would have to dig up a copy of Vail's book and look at his footnotes and the bibliography for that book? YMOS, Randy Hedden - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2000 22:05:22 -0700 From: "Roger Lahti" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Water Proofing Harddog, Don't know but it will be worth experimenting to find out. Capt. L - ----- Original Message ----- From: "harddog" To: Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2000 9:40 PM Subject: MtMan-List: Water Proofing > Capt. L, > I wonder what these tarps smelled like after the oil and fat got rancid? > Also wondering how long before the corn oil and fat mixture started rotting > the material? > Randy Hedden > > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2000 22:19:21 -0700 From: "Roger Lahti" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Vail Harddog, Sounds like the way to go. Got a copy? Capt. L - ----- Original Message ----- From: "harddog" To: Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2000 9:54 PM Subject: MtMan-List: Vail > Capt. L, > > According to the bibliography for Hunter's article in Muzzleloader Mag, > Phillip Vail wrote "The Magnificant Adventures of Alexander Mackenzie", > published in 1964. Wonder where he got his information if not from > Mackenzie's journals? Guess we would have to dig up a copy of Vail's book > and look at his footnotes and the bibliography for that book? > > YMOS, > > Randy Hedden > > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 00:18:24 -0500 From: "harddog" Subject: MtMan-List: Water Proofing Capt. L, Nope, don't have a copy of Vail's book or of Mackenzie's journals. YMOS, Randy Hedden - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2000 23:19:57 -0700 From: "Thomas Ballstaedt" Subject: MtMan-List: russia sheeting This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_002E_01C004B3.D490F260 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable what exactly is russia sheeting ? cotton? linen? also how heavy was = it compared to modern canvas duct? thanks tom - ------=_NextPart_000_002E_01C004B3.D490F260 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable what exactly is = russia sheeting=20 ?  cotton?  linen?  also how heavy was it compared to = modern=20 canvas duct?       thanks  =20 tom - ------=_NextPart_000_002E_01C004B3.D490F260-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 01:06:55 -0500 From: "harddog" Subject: MtMan-List: Russia Sheeting Tom, Russia sheeting was/is twilled, hemp linen material, (sailcloth), and apparently came in various weights or thicknesses as various inventory lists and bills of sale show russia sheeting that was used to make tents and cargo covers as well as russia sheeting that was used to make military packs and trousers, much like cotton duck comes in various weights today depending on intended use. YMOS, Randy Hedden - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 09:28:25 EDT From: LODGEPOLE@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader In an earlier message, Roger Lahti writes: << Water proof it with bee's wax and corn oil or a modern formula. >> I dunno folks. Last winter in deer camp I saw first hand just how fast a canvas tent can go up in flames when my buddy crawled out from under it in just the nick of time. Making the burn down time increase does not seem like sound advice. Just food for thought. I'm all for using period methods in most cases, but there are times when I must consider the safety factor. I'd go with a modern water proof myself. Longshot "Longshot's Rendezvous Homepage" http://members.aol.com/lodgepole/longshot.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 10:09:39 -0400 From: Robert M Keefe Subject: Re: MtMan-List: waterproofing lodge > > Hello to all on the list. I have a problem I'm sure has come up > from > > time to time for someone on this list. I recently bought a used > panther > > 14x10 wall tent that had ben power washed with degreaser. > > you need to get the degreaser off. It is decreasing the surface > tension of > the water. Try washing the tent, first in soap, then a time or two > in plain > water, (you must get all the soap off first) THEN try water proofing > it > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: > http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html Does anyone else on the list have any thoughts , views, opinions, ect. on this subject ? I have washed the tent very well and put the canvac on with a pump sprayer , do you think it would be better to brush or roll on ? I'm really lost for an answer Lightning ________________________________________________________________ YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET! Juno now offers FREE Internet Access! Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 14:40:35 GMT From: "scott mcmahon" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: russia sheeting what exactly is russia sheeting ? cotton? linen? also how heavy was it compared to modern canvas duct? thanks tom As was previously mentioned Russia Sheeting is made of hemp...I'm not sure if it fell thru or not but Sharon Brown of Whitehall MT was working on getting some for sale here in the states...I understand it's pretty pricey to import...you could give her a call or write her at Couturiere De Victoriana 209 N. Whitehall St PO Box 651 Whitehall MT 59759 406 287 9233 fax 406 494 5938...Sharon carries ALOT of good period material at good prices so if you're looking..... Sincerely, Scott McMahon mountedranger@hotmail.com ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 08:50:17 -0700 (PDT) From: S Jones Subject: MtMan-List: Before our time BUT... From another forum I belong to, this on Ötzis' ax head. Would you care to comment? "That copper axe head is a wonder. On a UK documentary they tried to make a replica within a modern metallurgical lab. They couldn't get close to its quality. No doubt modern engineers could replicate it with time but they were dumbfounded how it could be achieved with "primitive" methods. Its discovery has lead to a complete rewriting of the history books on when the copper age may have started. Its nice to have these mysteries. I think we are losing our way really not blazing a new trail. " To me, this loosens the listers' strict adherence to documented authenication. Not saying that anything goes, just saying that they seem brighter than us now. On a side note , according to the Bible, the Ark of the Covenant is built along the lines of a capacitor. Some western Native American tribes had the makings of a battery. Wild West, anyone? ===== defstones In the 60's, people took acid to make the world weird. Now the world is weird, and people take Prozac to make it normal! __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail – Free email you can access from anywhere! http://mail.yahoo.com/ - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 12:01:07 -0500 From: "northwoods" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Before our time BUT... - -----Original Message----- From: S Jones To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com Date: August 13, 2000 10:50 AM Subject: MtMan-List: Before our time BUT... >>From another forum I belong to, this on =D6tzis' ax >head. Would you care to comment? Not really appropriate disscussion for this forum in my opinion but I hav= e to ask who is Otsi? >"That copper axe head is a wonder. On a UK documentary >they tried to make a replica within a modern >metallurgical lab. They couldn't get close to its >quality. No doubt modern engineers could replicate it >with time but they were dumbfounded how it could be >achieved with "primitive" methods. Why is the axe a wonder? Why couldn't they get close to it's quality? Mak= ing an axe out of copper doesn't require anything more than "primitive technology" to my knowledge. Its discovery has >lead to a complete rewriting of the history books on >when the copper age may have started. I have books that are over 100 years old that speculate on the north american copper age being thousands of years old. It's been widely accept= ed since the 1950s' that people have been utilizing copper in N. America for several thousand years. Many archeologist who study the matter have known for years that evidence exists which indicates its use for 10,000 or more years. Whats mysterious about that? northwoods - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 12:23:11 -0600 From: "Terry R. Koenig" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: russia sheeting This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0037_01C00521.3EC484E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Tom: The Spring 1988 issue of "The Museum of the Fur Trade Quarterly" (Vol. = 24, No. 1 ) has an excellent 2 page article, on the manufacture, and use = of oilcloth/Russia Sheeting. Terry R. Koenig - ------=_NextPart_000_0037_01C00521.3EC484E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =FF=FE<=00!=00D=00O=00C=00T=00Y=00P=00E=00 =00H=00T=00M=00L=00 = =00P=00U=00B=00L=00I=00C=00 = =00"=00-=00/=00/=00W=003=00C=00/=00/=00D=00T=00D=00 =00H=00T=00M=00L=00 = =004=00.=000=00 = =00T=00r=00a=00n=00s=00i=00t=00i=00o=00n=00a=00l=00/=00/=00E=00N=00"=00>=00= =0D=00=0A= =00<=00H=00T=00M=00L=00>=00<=00H=00E=00A=00D=00>=00=0D=00=0A= =00<=00M=00E=00T=00A=00 = =00c=00o=00n=00t=00e=00n=00t=00=3D=00"=00t=00e=00x=00t=00/=00h=00t=00m=00= l=00;=00 = =00c=00h=00a=00r=00s=00e=00t=00=3D=00u=00n=00i=00c=00o=00d=00e=00"=00 = =00h=00t=00t=00p=00-=00e=00q=00u=00i=00v=00=3D=00C=00o=00n=00t=00e=00n=00= t=00-=00T=00y=00p=00e=00>=00=0D=00=0A= =00<=00M=00E=00T=00A=00 = =00c=00o=00n=00t=00e=00n=00t=00=3D=00"=00M=00S=00H=00T=00M=00L=00 = =005=00.=000=000=00.=002=007=002=002=00.=002=008=000=000=00"=00 = =00n=00a=00m=00e=00=3D=00G=00E=00N=00E=00R=00A=00T=00O=00R=00>=00=0D=00=0A= =00<=00S=00T=00Y=00L=00E=00>=00<=00/=00S=00T=00Y=00L=00E=00>=00=0D=00=0A= =00<=00/=00H=00E=00A=00D=00>=00=0D=00=0A= =00<=00B=00O=00D=00Y=00 = =00b=00g=00C=00o=00l=00o=00r=00=3D=00#=00f=00f=00f=00f=00f=00f=00>=00=0D=00=0A= =00<=00D=00I=00V=00>=00<=00F=00O=00N=00T=00 = =00s=00i=00z=00e=00=3D=002=00>=00T=00o=00m=00:=00<=00/=00F=00O=00N=00T=00= >=00<=00/=00D=00I=00V=00>=00=0D=00=0A= =00<=00D=00I=00V=00>=00&=00n=00b=00s=00p=00;=00<=00/=00D=00I=00V=00>=00=0D= =00=0A= =00<=00D=00I=00V=00>=00<=00F=00O=00N=00T=00 = =00s=00i=00z=00e=00=3D=002=00>=00T=00h=00e=00 = =00S=00p=00r=00i=00n=00g=00 =001=009=008=008=00 =00i=00s=00s=00u=00e=00 = =00o=00f=00&=00n=00b=00s=00p=00;=00"=00T=00h=00e=00 = =00M=00u=00s=00e=00u=00m=00 =00o=00f=00 =00t=00h=00e=00 =00F=00u=00r=00 = =00T=00r=00a=00d=00e=00 =00=0D=00=0A= =00Q=00u=00a=00r=00t=00e=00r=00l=00y=00"=00 =00(=00V=00o=00l=00.=00 = =002=004=00,=00 =00N=00o=00.=00 =001=00 =00)=00 =00h=00a=00s=00 = =00a=00n=00 =00e=00x=00c=00e=00l=00l=00e=00n=00t=00 =002=00 = =00p=00a=00g=00e=00 =00a=00r=00t=00i=00c=00l=00e=00,=00 =00o=00n=00 = =00t=00h=00e=00 =00=0D=00=0A= =00m=00a=00n=00u=00f=00a=00c=00t=00u=00r=00e=00,=00 =00a=00n=00d=00 = =00u=00s=00e=00 =00o=00f=00 = =00o=00i=00l=00c=00l=00o=00t=00h=00/=00R=00u=00s=00s=00i=00a=00 = =00S=00h=00e=00e=00t=00i=00n=00g=00.=00<=00/=00F=00O=00N=00T=00>=00<=00/=00= D=00I=00V=00>=00=0D=00=0A= =00<=00D=00I=00V=00>=00&=00n=00b=00s=00p=00;=00<=00/=00D=00I=00V=00>=00=0D= =00=0A= =00<=00D=00I=00V=00>=00<=00F=00O=00N=00T=00 = =00s=00i=00z=00e=00=3D=002=00>=00T=00e=00r=00r=00y=00 =00R=00.=00 = =00K=00o=00e=00n=00i=00g=00<=00/=00F=00O=00N=00T=00>=00<=00/=00D=00I=00V=00= >=00<=00/=00B=00O=00D=00Y=00>=00<=00/=00H=00T=00M=00L=00>=00=0D=00=0A= =00 - ------=_NextPart_000_0037_01C00521.3EC484E0-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 12:39:05 -0700 From: "Thomas Ballstaedt" Subject: MtMan-List: russia sheeting This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_002D_01C00523.776CFF00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I should have known it was hemp. I also should have checked the = archives. thanks, list mates for all the good imfo. - ------=_NextPart_000_002D_01C00523.776CFF00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I should have known it was hemp.  = I also=20 should have checked the archives.  thanks, list mates for all the = good=20 imfo.
- ------=_NextPart_000_002D_01C00523.776CFF00-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 12:13:57 -0700 From: "Roger Lahti" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Muzzleloader Longshot, Just for what it's worth, as a retired Fire Capt. I can assure you that there are very few water proofing treatments (and that are effective) that you can use that are not going to increase the flammability/combustibility of canvas. You can buy a canvas that has been commercially treated though I don't know where you get it. I know that flannel intended for children's sleep wear is so treated and will not support combustion (the flame dies out on it's own, without a flame from some other source to keep it burning). But whatever, there is no substitute for good common sense and safety. Most if not all the cases of lodges or etc. burning up were the result of some pretty stupid actions as is usually the case. Your free to do as you wish. I'll take appropriate steps and not worry about it. I remain..... YMOS Capt. Lahti' - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 12:22:03 -0700 From: "Roger Lahti" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: russia sheeting This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0049_01C00521.16874F80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Terry, I don't have that issue. Before my time as a subscriber. Can you = condense the process down to the basics for us? Capt. L ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Terry R. Koenig=20 To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Sunday, August 13, 2000 11:23 AM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: russia sheeting Tom: The Spring 1988 issue of "The Museum of the Fur Trade Quarterly" (Vol. = 24, No. 1 ) has an excellent 2 page article, on the manufacture, and use = of oilcloth/Russia Sheeting. Terry R. Koenig - ------=_NextPart_000_0049_01C00521.16874F80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =FF=FE<=00!=00D=00O=00C=00T=00Y=00P=00E=00 =00H=00T=00M=00L=00 = =00P=00U=00B=00L=00I=00C=00 = =00"=00-=00/=00/=00W=003=00C=00/=00/=00D=00T=00D=00 =00H=00T=00M=00L=00 = =004=00.=000=00 = =00T=00r=00a=00n=00s=00i=00t=00i=00o=00n=00a=00l=00/=00/=00E=00N=00"=00>=00= =0D=00=0A= =00<=00H=00T=00M=00L=00>=00<=00H=00E=00A=00D=00>=00=0D=00=0A= =00<=00M=00E=00T=00A=00 = =00c=00o=00n=00t=00e=00n=00t=00=3D=00"=00t=00e=00x=00t=00/=00h=00t=00m=00= l=00;=00 = =00c=00h=00a=00r=00s=00e=00t=00=3D=00u=00n=00i=00c=00o=00d=00e=00"=00 = =00h=00t=00t=00p=00-=00e=00q=00u=00i=00v=00=3D=00C=00o=00n=00t=00e=00n=00= t=00-=00T=00y=00p=00e=00>=00=0D=00=0A= =00<=00M=00E=00T=00A=00 = =00c=00o=00n=00t=00e=00n=00t=00=3D=00"=00M=00S=00H=00T=00M=00L=00 = =005=00.=000=000=00.=002=007=002=002=00.=002=008=000=000=00"=00 = 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=00K=00o=00e=00n=00i=00g=00<=00/=00F=00O=00N=00T=00>=00<=00/=00D=00I=00V=00= >=00<=00/=00B=00L=00O=00C=00K=00Q=00U=00O=00T=00E=00>=00<=00/=00B=00O=00D= =00Y=00>=00<=00/=00H=00T=00M=00L=00>=00=0D=00=0A= =00 - ------=_NextPart_000_0049_01C00521.16874F80-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 19:55:19 EDT From: LivingInThePast@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: waterproofing lodge I'd suggest you contact Panther Primitives and ask them. Also, they sell fire retardant treated canvas. Barney Panther Primitives< /A> - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 21:42:01 EDT From: Casapy123@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: russia sheeting There is an article in the Museum of the Fur Trade (Vol. 24, No.1. pp. 1-3) that was previoulsy mentioned in this string. That article does NOT use the word hemp at all in the entire article! According to that article, "Russia sheeting was a coarse, heavy linen cloth." It doesn't get much clearer than that. Hemp is very costly and, while it may be a period fabric, not everything has to be made from it. Now, linen isn't exactly cheap, but it is more affordable and more available than hemp. Jim Hardee, AMM #1676 P.O. box 1228 Quincy, CA 95971 (530)283-4566 (H) (283-3330 (W) (530)283-5171 FAX Casapy123@aol.com - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 13 Aug 1980 19:43:23 -0600 From: Angela Gottfred Subject: MtMan-List: Murdered & Pillaged Americans, 1810 Here are a couple more items I found in my reading of the journal of Alexander Henry the Younger, for the winter of 1810-1811, at Rocky Mountain House (at present-day Rocky Mountain House, Alberta, Canada). I thought list members might be able to tell me what incidents from the summer of 1810 are being described here, or just be interested in a different perspective: "...a party of their [Fall Indians'] Country men were just returned from the war upon the Crow Mountain Indians, where they had fought a Battle with their enemies upon the Yellow Stone River, where they had also seen a Fort which they supposed was occupied by the Americans...During the head of the battle the Crow Mountain Indians called out to them that in future they would save them the trouble of coming to war upon them, that the ensuing Summer they would in company with the Americans go to war upon them and find them out upon the banks of the Saskatchwoine [N. Saskatchewan R.]. Arms and Ammunition they were not in want of. Their traders had good hearts towards them and never rendered them pitiful &c &c." (Gough 2:533) "Last Summer these people [Gros Ventres] upon a War excursion fell upon a party of Americans or Freemen from the Isbenois [Illinois]; they confess to have murdered them all, and brought away a considerable booty in utencils Beaver Skins &c. Some of the Beaver Skins I observed were marked, Valley and Jnumell with different numbers 8, 15 &c." (Gough 2:545) "The Blood Indians [part of the Blackfoot Confederacy--A.G.] had been at War upon the Missouri nearly about the same time the Fall Indians. They also fell upon a party of Americans and murdered the whole of them, and brought away a considerable Booty consisting of Goods of various kinds such as fine cotton shirts, Beaver Traps, Hats, Knives, Dirks, Handkerchiefs, Russie Sheeting Tents, and a number of Bank notes, some signed and others not, New Jersey and Trenton Banking Company. From the description the Blood Indians give of the dress and behaviour, one of the party whom they murdered must have been an Officer [i.e. management-level guy, not a military officer--A.G.] or a Trader. They say he killed two Blood Indians, before he fell." (Gough 2:545-546) Any thoughts? Your humble & obedient servant, Angela Gottfred - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #607 ******************************* - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message.