From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #861 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Wednesday, September 12 2001 Volume 01 : Number 861 In this issue: -       Re: MtMan-List: Delaware Indians -       MtMan-List: .....WTC thoughts -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: AMM-List: Off Topic.....WTC thoughts -       MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles -       Re: MtMan-List: WTC -       Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles -       Re: MtMan-List: Re: AMM-List: Off Topic.....WTC thoughts -       MtMan-List: Book -       Re: MtMan-List: WTC -       Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles -       Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles -       Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles -       Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles -       Re:MtMan-List:Off Topic...WTC thoughts -       Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles -       MtMan-List: A new time....a NEW Counrty -       Re: Re: MtMan-List: Delaware Indians -       Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles -       Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles -       Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 22:10:00 +0000 From: "darlene secondine" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Delaware Indians Thanks Mike, I'll try to find the book. Wow, what do you do when you find conflicting documentation? Yep, interesting to say the least. Happy journey to ya, Don Secondine >From: Mike Moore >Reply-To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com >To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com >Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Delaware Indians >Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 06:32:14 -0600 > >Don, > A new book is out on Tom Tobin by James Perkins. Very good! >"Tom Tobin, Frontiersman" In it he says Tom's mother Sarah Tissman, >was a freed colored, her husband was french. While the book spans >much more than the fur trade, it is very inlightening on a individual >who >helped shape the west. The books has lots of references and good >locations >and descriptions. > mike. > > >darlene secondine wrote: > > > Also, I went to the Mountain Man website > > and looked for "Delaware" in search tools and found some new stuff I > > had not > > seen before. I didn't know, for instance, that Tom Tobin was half > > Delaware. > > Thanks again guys, for the tip. > > Your friend, > > Don Secondine > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > > http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Subject: Re: Re: MtMan-List: Delaware Indians > > Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 20:05:03 -0600 > > From: "Daniel L. Smith" > > Reply-To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > > To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > > > > You guys want a little more information on the > > Lenape (Delaware) Indians, here's what Buck had > > on one of his pages, when talking about a family > > member that was of such breeding. > > > > Concho. > > > > ----------------------------------------------- > > The Lennie-Lenape & Our Connection > > > > At one time the Lenape (Delawares), formed a > > confederacy, the most important of the Algonquian > > stock, consisting of the Munsee, Unami, and > > Unalachtigo divisions, speaking different > > dialects and occupying the basin of the Delaware > > river in eastern Pennsylvania and southeastern > > New York, and also most of New Jersey and > > Delaware. According to tribal tradition the > > Delawares had a common origin with the Nanticoke, > > Conoy, Shawnee, and Mahican. > > > > When they made their first treaty with William > > Penn in 1682 their council fire was at > > Shackamaxon, about the present Germantown, > > Pennsylvania. One of their great chiefs at this > > period was Tamanend, from whom the Tammany > > Society takes its name. In 1720 the Iroquois > > assumed dominion over them. This condition lasted > > until about the opening of the French and Indian > > War. Encroachments by the whites forced them > > across the mountains; by 1742 the main body > > located on the Susquehanna, at Wyoming and other > > points. > > > > By 1760 owing to Iroquois pressure and by > > invitation of the Hurons they commenced to form > > settlements in eastern Ohio, and in a short time > > the grater part of the Delawares, together with > > the Munsee (often referred to as distinct) and > > Mahican, had become established on the Muskingum > > and other streams of that region. Being now > > within reach of the French and supported by the > > western tribes, the Delawares were enabled to > > cast off the Iroquois yoke, and up to the treaty > > of Greenville to come in 1795 they were the most > > determined opponents of the advancing whites. > > > > By permission of the Miami and Piankashaw, about > > 1770, they settled in the country between the > > Ohio and White rivers in Indiana, and with the > > sanction of the Spanish Government in 1789 a part > > of them, together with some Shawnee, moved to > > Missouri and later to Arkansas. > > > > By 1820 the two bands had found their way to > > Texas, where at that time the Delawares numbered > > about 700. > > > > By 1835 most of the tribe had been gathered on a > > reservation in Kansas, whence they were removed > > in 1867 to Indian Territory (Oklahoma) and > > incorporated with the Cherokee Nation. Another > > band is affiliated with the Caddo and Wichita in > > Western Oklahoma, and in addition there are a few > > scattered remnants in the Untied States and > > several hundred in Canada where they are known as > > Delawares, Munsee, and Moravians. > > > > After many years of investigation it has been > > narrowed down that John Westley Connor's wife's > > mother (a 1/2 Native American) was probably of > > the Lennie-Lenape tribe because of words and sign > > found in a family Bible, and a letter written > > that she had been carried by her mother from > > eastern Ohio in early winter back to family in > > Harrisburg Pennsylvania after getting away from > > her capturers in Nov. 1856, making E. Helen > > Thomas - her daughter, a breed of 1/2 white and > > 1/2 Lenape heritage. > > > > ----------------------------------------------- > > ---- Begin Original Message ---- > > Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Delaware Indians > > Thanks Wynn for the note, > > The Delawares or Lenape speak an Algonquin > > language. The Delawares lived around > > Westville(present day kansas City) > > andLawrence,Ks. from the 1820's to 1867-68. (One > > of their many stops during the migration west > > from their homeland along the Delaware River > > Valley at European contact. I'll check out > > Dean's site(great site for trade lists, too.) in > > more detail concerning Delawares. > > Thanks again, > > Don Secondine > > > > -------------------- > > >In a post not long go someone asked about > > referances to Delaware Indians in the fur trade. > > I went to Deans AMM site and entered Delware in > > the search. I go a dozen or so responces > > including Irvings quote: > > > > > >. The conference ended, Fontenelle sent a > > Delaware Indian of his party to conduct fifteen > > of the Blackfeet to the camp of Captain > > Bonneville. > > > > > >Also, it is my belief for what that is worth > > that many referances to Iroquois are really not > > being tribe specific. The Iroquois were a large > > presense and they were known to adopt other > > tribes into the league so it would be easy to > > refer to something like the Iroquois with Peter S > > Ogden when in fact there were more tribes > > represented. I can not remember now if the > > Delaware were in the same lingistic group as the > > Iroquois but if they are that would make the link > > even closer. > > > > > >Sorry to be so slow to respond to your inquiry. > > > > > >Wynn Ormond > > > > ---- End Original Message ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sign up for a free About Email account at > > http://About.com > > > > ---------------------- hist_text list info: > > http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 17:33:26 -0700 From: "larry pendleton" Subject: MtMan-List: .....WTC thoughts Dennis Miles wrote : This day is what all those years of "understanding and nurturing" gets you... >>Dennis, you are exactly right ! Not so many years ago, the people of the U.S. were respected by most, and feared by the rest. Unfortunately, we have become a softer, gentler, warm and fuzzy society steeped in P.C. BULLSHIT ! Our children are no longer taught history. Most of them have no clue what happened on December 7, 1941. They have never heard of places like Seoul or Saigon. They have no idea what took place between the years of 1861 and 1865. In other words, they have no idea of the meaning of the word PATRIOTISM. Folks, I'm not just talking about HighSchool or College kids here. I'm talking about 25 to 40 year old working adults, who have all the answers, but don't know what the question is ! Do all of our young folks fall into the category I just described ? No, but sadly most do. "Freedom has a flavor that the protected never know." I fear our young folks have been protected from the harsh reallity of what it takes to remain Free, for too long ! Pendleton - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 17:38:24 -0700 From: "larry pendleton" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: AMM-List: Off Topic.....WTC thoughts I have been off this list for a year and upon resubscribing for the last week or so am surprised to see Dennis that you are even more of a loud mouthed bully than you used to be. You use much more profanity these days. Congratulations to you for expanding your horizons. T. Clark >>Mr. Clark, Go play in the traffic ! Or COME TO TEXAS ! I ain't hard to find ! We cha ah yeh - E ne che key pee sh'nee yell o Pendleton - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 16:09:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Chris Sega Subject: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles Come now,Mr Clark is not going to contact anyone personally, or show up at anyones home, so don't even offer it. I must commend this list for the civility everyone generally exhibits.Only when everyone is on edge because of a national tragedy have I seen this list degenerate into name calling and saber rattling. (I'm not talkin about the comments made about terrorists,just responses to those making a post) A certain other list has many problems with this sort of response to stupid posts and incindiary comments, and I don't want to see this list degenerate every time some fool types out a comment intended to piss someone off. Just ignore fools, for they are not worthy of your scorn. Now if I thought someone was making an ass of themselves in their posts, I certainly would not give my address and phone number and say "come get some" That is inviting more aggravation than the original post could possibly have given. End of subject. Young and I know what happened between 1861-1865. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email alerts & NEW webcam video instant messaging with Yahoo! Messenger http://im.yahoo.com - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 01:35:02 -0500 From: palmer@netdor.com (Palmer Schatell) Subject: Re: MtMan-List: WTC - ----- Original Message ----- From: "De Santis, Nick" To: Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 5:17 AM Subject: MtMan-List: WTC > > It is time to count coup on our enemies and show them what honor is. > Sir: With all due respect, to slap an enemy with an open hand proves ones bravery but does not get the job done. This is the time to put a fine edge on one's scalping knife. What I would really like to see is a detachment of my old outfit Airborne Rangers or those not so gentle men in the green face paint and bring out Osama bin Laden's head to be mounted on a pike in front of the U.N. building as an object lesson to the less than civilized. Palmer (trescoupes) honestly earned, Schatell > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 20:04:51 -0400 From: "Double Edge Forge" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles "I certainly would not give my address and phone number and say "come get some" That is inviting more aggravation than the original post could possibly have given." Chris, My name address & such is on the website.Pretty much public. And folks are welcome to visit the shop, if they call first and I invite them..I just figure some people need more help than others than finding me. Especially when I WANT them to come visit.. But I have found that most that bluster, hold a superior attitude and degrade others when they feel "safe" behind a keyboard are yellow cowards face to face. D "Abair ach beagan is abair gu math e" DOUBLE EDGE FORGE Knives and Iron Accouterments http://www.bright.net/~deforge1 "Knowing how is just the beginning." - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 20:25:38 EDT From: TerryTwoBear@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Re: AMM-List: Off Topic.....WTC thoughts MR clark. BYE YOU clown Two Bear - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 20:37:56 -0400 From: "Double Edge Forge" Subject: MtMan-List: Book This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C13BCA.CDD1DD00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Got a real good book at the library this evening. called "THe Forgotten = Arts & Crafts" by John Seymour Covers everything from making a saddle to brewing beer. Not real heavy, = technical reading, but allot of 19thC Pics and line drawings.. D - ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C13BCA.CDD1DD00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Got a real good book at the library = this evening.=20 called "THe Forgotten Arts & Crafts" by John Seymour
 Covers everything from making a = saddle to=20 brewing beer. Not real heavy, technical reading, but allot of 19thC Pics = and=20 line drawings..
D
 
 
- ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C13BCA.CDD1DD00-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 20:55:00 EDT From: JSeminerio@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: WTC - --part1_bc.19f128a1.28d15de4_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey Guys John in NYC here. Yesterday was a helluva day. I am running in the local city council race. We stopped on our way to give out cookies at a polling place and could see the smoke billowing out of the WTC, about 10 miles away. The smoke looked like dunderheads in the western horizon. In fact they are still smoking. The haze protects us out in Queens from seeing the gap in the skyline. The elections in the whole state have been canceled until further notice. But life goes on. Tomorrow the subways will be packed. I'll be stumping at one. Getting on with ourselves is what we do. My Democratic Club did have one casualty my friend Gabe's wife. She worked at WTC, we don't know what floor, her company had many. Gabe's been in the City, we haven't heard from him, there's no word on her. Please keep us in your prayers, Gabe especially Thanks John - --part1_bc.19f128a1.28d15de4_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey Guys

John in NYC here.  Yesterday was a helluva day.  I am running in the local
city council race.  We stopped on our way to give out cookies at a polling
place and could see the smoke billowing out of the WTC, about 10 miles away.  
The smoke looked like dunderheads in the western horizon.  In fact they are
still smoking.  The haze protects us out in Queens from seeing the gap in the
skyline.

The elections in the whole state have been canceled until further notice.  
But life goes on.  Tomorrow the subways will be packed.  I'll be stumping at
one.  Getting on with ourselves is what we do.

My Democratic Club did have one casualty my friend Gabe's wife.  She worked
at WTC, we don't know what floor, her company had many.  Gabe's been in the
City, we haven't heard from him, there's no word on her.

Please keep us in your prayers, Gabe especially

Thanks
John - --part1_bc.19f128a1.28d15de4_boundary-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 20:52:34 -0700 From: "larry pendleton" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles Chris Sega, We cha ah yeh - E ne che key pee sh'nee yell o Pendleton - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 01:51:40 +0000 From: "darlene secondine" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles Friends of the Lists, Their is an estimated 30,000 fellow Americans murdered. Is this squabbling really that important? Let's put this thread to rest. Don Secondine >From: "larry pendleton" >Reply-To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com >To: >Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles >Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 20:52:34 -0700 > >Chris Sega, > >We cha ah yeh - E ne che key pee sh'nee yell o > > >Pendleton > > >---------------------- >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 21:55:15 -0400 From: "Double Edge Forge" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles Secondine, Do you even know that LP said?? Just curious... D - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2001 02:02:37 +0000 From: "darlene secondine" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles D, Not exactly since it has been awhile since I saw Dances with Wolves, please clue me in. I don't have the time to watch the movie tonight, and I am not familiar with the Dakota tongue. Don Secondine >From: "Double Edge Forge" >Reply-To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com >To: >Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles >Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 21:55:15 -0400 > >Secondine, > Do you even know that LP said?? Just curious... >D > > > >---------------------- >hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 19:05:51 -0700 (PDT) From: Scott McMahon Subject: Re:MtMan-List:Off Topic...WTC thoughts > > If you oppose this opinion , keep it to your damned self.. You WON'T like my answer. I can guarentee it. Members of the List, I hate to say anything but I guess I will...First off I don't think there is ANYONE in the WORLD who hasn't heard of this cowardly attack on the innocent civilians of our great country! I don't think ANYONE on this list is disinterested in this horrible chain of events nor do I think ANYONE on this list disagrees that this happened because of America's past policies dealing with this sort of thing...I may be wrong but I don't think I am. I feel like a swift, vengeful counter-attack on those who we KNOW perpetrated this is strongly called for! I am young (25) and do know and understand patriotism...I am a Texan as well as an American. My grandfather fought so that my father, my family and future family would be free from the threat of the Nazi terror and I have many friends whom I think very highly of who have fought in wars since to protect America from various other threats. I understand our EARLY(both American and Texan) history and how we fought as Americans and Texans to gain freedom from tyrants abroad as well as tyrants from within(American Revolution, War of 1812, Texas Revolution and the Mexican War). One of the things that makes America such a great nation is our FREEDOM...and we have many freedoms that are non-existent elsewhere in the world. ONE of our many freedoms is free speech(and here comes the kicker)...that means that one may speak out an opinion that others may not like! YES..I can say something that someone else may not like, BUT that doesn't mean I can voice my opinion and then say...but if you don't like it shut up cause that's the way it is! We ALL share these freedoms and we ALL have the right to voice our opinions! Reread the qoute at the top of this post...does this sound like the voice of a great, FREE country such as America?! I don't know any involved in this immmature verbal bashing but would expect that they could be a bit more civil about the whole matter. YES we as Americans are experiencing something VERY tragic but that does NOT give anyone the right to act or behave as they are on this list. No, I haven't lost anyone in this tragedy, and no I'm not indifferent to what is going on but I am trying to act CIVILIZED(a word that is being used alot right now) and keep a cool head about myself. I would hope that everyone here could do the same. We as a group should have a special bond being that we are all interested in the same things(obvious by our subscription to this list) and should as some have said come together in light of recent happenings! I do honestly apologize if I personally have offended any on this list with this post but I tire of this immature bickering amongst people who share a love and vision of the history of our great country...God be with those victims of this tragedy and God bless America! Dios, Libertad y Tejas, Cpt. Scott McMahon S.W. Frontiers Mntd Ranging Co _______________________________________________________ http://inbox.excite.com - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 19:09:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Scott McMahon Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles Do you even know that LP said?? Just curious... D D, I don't understand...why don't you please enlighten those of us not blessed with the understanding of certain native tongues... Dios, Libertad y Tejas, Cpt. Scott McMahon S.W. Frontiers Mntd Ranging Co _______________________________________________________ http://inbox.excite.com - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 19:11:45 -0700 From: "John Funk" Subject: MtMan-List: A new time....a NEW Counrty Gentleman....... I submit: We live in a ..New country, a ..New time...... We are no longer the free living, free thinking landed "patriots" that our predecessors strove for and envisioned... We are now influenced and moved by those global entities that would both internally and externally control us with their collective and individual will. We cannot, we will, submit to their will ! We are a free people, in which liberty, freedom and justice WILL prevail..... If we seek to capture the past.......then let us bring it to the forefront..... - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 21:14:19 -0500 From: John Kramer Subject: Re: Re: MtMan-List: Delaware Indians A long time ago I enjoyed: "The Indians of New Jersey" "Dickon among the Lenapes" a 1966 reprint of a 1938 first printing. by M.R. Harrington, Rutgers University Press, ISBN 0-8135-0425-2 John... At 08:05 PM 9/11/01 -0600, you wrote: >You guys want a little more information on the >Lenape (Delaware) Indians, here's what Buck had >on one of his pages, when talking about a family >member that was of such breeding. > >Concho. > >----------------------------------------------- >The Lennie-Lenape & Our Connection > >At one time the Lenape (Delawares), formed a >confederacy, the most important of the Algonquian >stock, consisting of the Munsee, Unami, and >Unalachtigo divisions, speaking different >dialects and occupying the basin of the Delaware >river in eastern Pennsylvania and southeastern >New York, and also most of New Jersey and >Delaware. According to tribal tradition the >Delawares had a common origin with the Nanticoke, >Conoy, Shawnee, and Mahican. > >When they made their first treaty with William >Penn in 1682 their council fire was at >Shackamaxon, about the present Germantown, >Pennsylvania. One of their great chiefs at this >period was Tamanend, from whom the Tammany >Society takes its name. In 1720 the Iroquois >assumed dominion over them. This condition lasted >until about the opening of the French and Indian >War. Encroachments by the whites forced them >across the mountains; by 1742 the main body >located on the Susquehanna, at Wyoming and other >points. > >By 1760 owing to Iroquois pressure and by >invitation of the Hurons they commenced to form >settlements in eastern Ohio, and in a short time >the grater part of the Delawares, together with >the Munsee (often referred to as distinct) and >Mahican, had become established on the Muskingum >and other streams of that region. Being now >within reach of the French and supported by the >western tribes, the Delawares were enabled to >cast off the Iroquois yoke, and up to the treaty >of Greenville to come in 1795 they were the most >determined opponents of the advancing whites. > >By permission of the Miami and Piankashaw, about >1770, they settled in the country between the >Ohio and White rivers in Indiana, and with the >sanction of the Spanish Government in 1789 a part >of them, together with some Shawnee, moved to >Missouri and later to Arkansas. > >By 1820 the two bands had found their way to >Texas, where at that time the Delawares numbered >about 700. > >By 1835 most of the tribe had been gathered on a >reservation in Kansas, whence they were removed >in 1867 to Indian Territory (Oklahoma) and >incorporated with the Cherokee Nation. Another >band is affiliated with the Caddo and Wichita in >Western Oklahoma, and in addition there are a few >scattered remnants in the Untied States and >several hundred in Canada where they are known as >Delawares, Munsee, and Moravians. > >After many years of investigation it has been >narrowed down that John Westley Connor's wife's >mother (a 1/2 Native American) was probably of >the Lennie-Lenape tribe because of words and sign >found in a family Bible, and a letter written >that she had been carried by her mother from >eastern Ohio in early winter back to family in >Harrisburg Pennsylvania after getting away from >her capturers in Nov. 1856, making E. Helen >Thomas - her daughter, a breed of 1/2 white and >1/2 Lenape heritage. >----------------------------------------------- >---- Begin Original Message ---- >Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Delaware Indians >Thanks Wynn for the note, > The Delawares or Lenape speak an Algonquin >language. The Delawares lived around >Westville(present day kansas City) >andLawrence,Ks. from the 1820's to 1867-68. (One >of their many stops during the migration west >from their homeland along the Delaware River >Valley at European contact. I'll check out >Dean's site(great site for trade lists, too.) in >more detail concerning Delawares. >Thanks again, >Don Secondine > >-------------------- > >In a post not long go someone asked about >referances to Delaware Indians in the fur trade. >I went to Deans AMM site and entered Delware in >the search. I go a dozen or so responces >including Irvings quote: > > > >. The conference ended, Fontenelle sent a >Delaware Indian of his party to conduct fifteen >of the Blackfeet to the camp of Captain Bonneville. > > > >Also, it is my belief for what that is worth >that many referances to Iroquois are really not >being tribe specific. The Iroquois were a large >presense and they were known to adopt other >tribes into the league so it would be easy to >refer to something like the Iroquois with Peter S >Ogden when in fact there were more tribes >represented. I can not remember now if the >Delaware were in the same lingistic group as the >Iroquois but if they are that would make the link >even closer. > > > >Sorry to be so slow to respond to your inquiry. > > > >Wynn Ormond > >---- End Original Message ---- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Sign up for a free About Email account at http://About.com > >---------------------- hist_text list info: >http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." Benjamin Franklin 1759 - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 22:24:13 -0400 From: "Double Edge Forge" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles I will put it in a modern translation.. "Why waste my breath on a waste of breath" D - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 21:31:53 -0500 From: "Lanney Ratcliff" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles Chris Sega wrote: Just ignore fools, for they are not worthy of your scorn. We try. It's hard, but we try. Lanney Ratcliff - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2001 20:50:29 -0600 From: "Walt Foster" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Recent Verbal squabbles Dennis, Are you saying that this means this? > I will put it in a modern translation.. > "Why waste my breath on a waste of breath" > D >We cha ah yeh - E ne che key pee sh'nee yell o Walt Park City, Montana USN Destroyman USS Lansing 388--1958 USA Rifleman NATO "the big red one" 1962 - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #861 ******************************* - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message.