From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #952 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Monday, February 11 2002 Volume 01 : Number 952 In this issue: -       MtMan-List: BoB Trappin' Article -       Re: MtMan-List: hardtack recipe? -       Re: MtMan-List: hardtack recipe? -       Re: MtMan-List: hardtack recipe? -       MtMan-List: Winter Camp -       Re: MtMan-List: Beaver on the Brain! My Answer. -       Re: MtMan-List: Cougar Explosion in California -       MtMan-List: Brief Intro -       Re: MtMan-List: Brief Intro -       MtMan-List: Ned, you are missed!!! -       Re: MtMan-List: BoB Trapping' Article -       MtMan-List: 1796 Cookbook -       Re: MtMan-List: BoB Trapping' Article -       RE: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 19:57:23 -0700 From: Allen Hall Subject: MtMan-List: BoB Trappin' Article Hello the List, For those that are still interested in the beaver trappin' deal, the Book of Buckskinning #8 has a good article. It's on page 70, and is written by Shawn Webster, check it out, you'll like it. Allen - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 20:38:50 -0700 From: "Thomas Ballstaedt" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: hardtack recipe? I've found that horses really groove on the taste of hard tack to. that recipe sounds like it might taste better than the one I use. In which, has no shortening or grease or milk, in it. sounds good! Tom - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Randal Bublitz" To: "hist_text" Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2002 7:55 PM Subject: RE: MtMan-List: hardtack recipe? > > Hardtack Recipe: > From the New Ulm Minnesota Militia 1863 > > 3 Cups Milk (raw, or buttermilk) > 8 Cups Flour (3 whole wheat, 5 unbleached) > 2 tablespoons Sugar (brown, or raw) > 1 tablespoon salt > 4 Tablespoons Lard (vegetable shortening) > Mix well and roll out 1/4" thick. Cut into 3" x 3" squares. Punch holes > into a grid pattern with a wooden spoon Handle, think saltine crackers. > Bake at 400 dg. for 35 minutes (to taste). The ( ) are mine. This > recipe was given to me by my Garndma, her Dad served in this Militia Unit, > which was formed after the Sioux uprising of 1862 in the Minnesota > Territory.I've had good luck with it. All dogs and some people like it. > hardtack > > > [Original Message] > > From: p monty > > To: > > Date: 2/10/02 3:45:29 PM > > Subject: MtMan-List: hardtack recipe? > > > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > Does any one have a good period recipe for hardtack? > > > > Thanks, > > Paul Montgomery > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: > > http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx > > > > > > ---------------------- > > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > --- Randal Bublitz > --- rjbublitz@earthlink.net > we have NOT inherited the Earth from our fathers, > we are Bo > > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 20:38:50 -0700 From: "Thomas Ballstaedt" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: hardtack recipe? I've found that horses really groove on the taste of hard tack to. that recipe sounds like it might taste better than the one I use. In which, has no shortening or grease or milk, in it. sounds good! Tom - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Randal Bublitz" To: "hist_text" Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2002 7:55 PM Subject: RE: MtMan-List: hardtack recipe? > > Hardtack Recipe: > From the New Ulm Minnesota Militia 1863 > > 3 Cups Milk (raw, or buttermilk) > 8 Cups Flour (3 whole wheat, 5 unbleached) > 2 tablespoons Sugar (brown, or raw) > 1 tablespoon salt > 4 Tablespoons Lard (vegetable shortening) > Mix well and roll out 1/4" thick. Cut into 3" x 3" squares. Punch holes > into a grid pattern with a wooden spoon Handle, think saltine crackers. > Bake at 400 dg. for 35 minutes (to taste). The ( ) are mine. This > recipe was given to me by my Garndma, her Dad served in this Militia Unit, > which was formed after the Sioux uprising of 1862 in the Minnesota > Territory.I've had good luck with it. All dogs and some people like it. > hardtack > > > [Original Message] > > From: p monty > > To: > > Date: 2/10/02 3:45:29 PM > > Subject: MtMan-List: hardtack recipe? > > > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > Does any one have a good period recipe for hardtack? > > > > Thanks, > > Paul Montgomery > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: > > http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx > > > > > > ---------------------- > > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > > > --- Randal Bublitz > --- rjbublitz@earthlink.net > we have NOT inherited the Earth from our fathers, > we are Bo > > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 20:27:33 -0800 From: "Randal Bublitz" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: hardtack recipe? Tom, This recipe came from a bunch of German Immigrant Farmers in Minnesota. Farm folks know how to eat . hardtack > I've found that horses really groove on the taste of hard tack to. that > recipe sounds like it might taste better than the one I use. In which, has > no shortening or grease or milk, in it. sounds good! > Tom > > > > > > Hardtack Recipe: > > From the New Ulm Minnesota Militia 1863 > > > > 3 Cups Milk (raw, or buttermilk) > > 8 Cups Flour (3 whole wheat, 5 unbleached) > > 2 tablespoons Sugar (brown, or raw) > > 1 tablespoon salt > > 4 Tablespoons Lard (vegetable shortening) > > Mix well and roll out 1/4" thick. Cut into 3" x 3" squares. Punch > holes > > into a grid pattern with a wooden spoon Handle, think saltine crackers. > > Bake at 400 dg. for 35 minutes (to taste). The ( ) are mine. This > > recipe was given to me by my Garndma, her Dad served in this Militia Unit, > > which was formed after the Sioux uprising of 1862 in the Minnesota > > Territory.I've had good luck with it. All dogs and some people like it. > > hardtack > > > > > > > > > > > Hello All, > > > > > > Does any one have a good period recipe for hardtack? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Paul Montgomery - --- Randal Bublitz - --- rjbublitz@earthlink.net we have NOT inherited the E - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 23:44:17 EST From: SWcushing@aol.com Subject: MtMan-List: Winter Camp Klahowya Boys, I'm just back from a neat little Winter Camp with a few of the Columbia Dept. boys, up around the Santiam Pass, in the high Cascades. Can't say when I've been in such deep SNOW! I'm thinking it had to be at least 8' feet of powder, and it took all day for George and Dale to break/pack a trail into camp, and then to near dark trying to find and dig out the cave/camp. I had it easy coming in Saturday morning until I slid off the trail on a down hill, and launched into the deep stuff..... had to actually tunnel out from all the gear I was packing to get back on the trail. Ever try to get out of yer snowshoe bindings by feel alone, buried to your arm pits? Puts new meaning into having fun! Anyway ... gathered up all my gear and made it into camp with only one more wreck. Next time I'll have toboggan to haul my stuff...think I was a bit top heavy. The camp sure was sumtin! George and that group put a lot of effort into building a shelter of logs on three sides and a roof, up against a volcanic out cropping. With so much snow, they had to dig down about five feet to find the entrance, then fight their the way around back and up top to tunnel down for the smoke hole. Once you got inside, it was the neatest little shelter/cave a mountaineer could want. Enough room for 6 people at least, and more if ya moved all the cut and dry wood outside. With a piece of canvas covering the entrance, and a good hot little fire going, it was shirt sleeve comfortable inside. We didn't spend much time exploring because it was just to hard to get around. By night fall, I hurt in places I didn't know I had ... need to spend more time on snowshoes.... We all ate buffalo for dinner, rice, jerk, parched corn, hot chocolate, and of course a jug of apple pie that somehow survived all my crashes... I was new blood for the Columbia Dept. gang, so all my yarns didn't draw too many yawns... George, Joseph, and Dale (and Margaret and Elijah too!) made great conversation and we spent a very pleasant evening. I think it was late when we all finally turned in.... We all kinda cooked sumtin for breakfast... I had oatmeal porridge with raisins, looked like Dale had some chicken....Joseph was working on some buffalo.. plenty of food left as we broke camp. This time I put my bed roll and some gear on Joe's toboggan and I acted as a break on the way out..easy going. George had over a hundred pounds of gear, and Elijah on his toboggan, and once out on the main trail, they took off on the down hill run....hootin and hollerin all the way down.... A good pay back for all the work they did coming in. As I packed up my stuff, I'm thinking I need to spend more than a couple days in this country at this time of the year....a great camp. Here's a couple jpg's of (l-r) George, Joseph, Dale... in the other, the hole to the lower left is the way in... Magpie gjd.jpg http://members.aol.com/swcushing/gjd.jpg wc.jpg http://members.aol.com/swcushing/wc.jpg - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 23:56:46 -0500 From: Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver on the Brain! My Answer. Greetings Sue and list, I was not able to access the URL you first sent, however the second U= RL allowed me to download what appears to be a small book, with Real Downloa= d. I have only skimmed through it up to now, and will need some time to read= it all. On the face of it, from what I did read and scan, so far, it looks pretty accurate to me (keeping in mind that so far I have only skimmed through it. Here is a passage that caught my eye that I thought was real good info, as I have been saying the same thing for years, the better you know your target critter, and the more attention to detail you pay with t= rap adjustment - placement, etc. the better job you will be able to do. Here= is a paragraph from the text in column form. *************************************** Trapping The use of traps in most situations where beavers are causing damage is the most effective, practical, and environmentally safe method of control. The effectiveness of any type of trap for beaver control is dependent on the trapper=92s knowledge of beaver habits, food preferences, ability to read beaver signs, use of the proper trap, and trap placement. A good trapper with a dozen traps can generally trap all the beavers in a given pond (behind one dam) in a week of trap nights. Obviously in a large watershed with several colonies, more trapping effort will be required. Most anyone with trapping experience and some outdoor =93savvy=94 can become an effective beaver trapper in a short time. In an area where beavers are common and have not been exposed to trapping, anyone experienced in trapping can expect good success. Additional expertise and improved techniques will be gained through experience. ******************************* I think this is right on point, and it's why I teach Trapper Education, s= o new trappers can go out and hopefully not make the same mistakes I did wh= en there was no one to show me!!! I have often said, "If I have to be stran= ded in the woods and could choose between a couple of traps and a firearm, gi= ve me the traps. I will be sure of eating more regularly than with a firearm!!! When I read the whole thing (probably in a few days) I will e-mail you my thoughts directly so as not to clutter up the list with continuing this subject, unless the list wants to hear the rest, after I read it. Also the site has nice looking drawings!!! More to follow when= I have read it all!!! Thanks for the opportunity and info Sue. Sincerely, John Enos TrapRJohn traprjon@mediaone.net "The saddest epitaph which can be carved in memory of a vanished liberty, is that it was lost because it's possessors failed to stretch forth a sav= ing hand, while yet there was time." -- Justice George Sutherland, 1938 *************************************************************** > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: SUE RAVEN > > To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com > > Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2002 7:49 PM > > Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver on the Brain! > > > > Mr. John Enos, > > > > I would like your critique of the quality of the info on this site = on > >beavers. > > > > http://deal.unl.edu/icwdm/handbook/handbook/allPDF/ro_b1.pdf > > > > Sue Raven > > > > *********************************************************** > Mr. John Enos, > I see what you mean. My first click failed on this site. However > my 2nd click got me right in. try it again and if it fails I'll send a= s > much data as possible to get you there. > > Sue Raven ************************************************************** - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 10:05:56 EST From: Elkflea@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Cougar Explosion in California Greetings the Group: I live in California. Many folks might live their whole lives without ever seeing Mr. Longtail. Since 1993, excepting last year, I have seen more Mt. Lions than legal bucks. I have heard them at night chasing deer outside my bedroom window, running them into barbed wire fences, then the ensuing woman-like scream sentinels the death to follow. This was in the early '90's. I got the idea to sit high atop a building one night with a Cabellas deer call and fawn bleat. I remained motionless, sat upon the floor of an upstairs dwelling with the window open. I called for about 40 minutes without peeking outside. It wasn't long until I heard rustling outside. I turned on a flashlight to see a set of cat eyes spaced 5 inches apart-my neck hackles stood straight up! I slid down the wall and sat quietly on the floor for a few minutes. He was merely some 40 feet from the house. Another time I pulled off the side of old highway 101, one night to relieve myself. I stepped from the car, walked to the rear bumper, caught the essence of motion behind me, turned to see Mr. Longtail in the moonlight some 30+ feet from me. Needless to say, I sauntered back to the drivers door then drove another 5 miles further to complete the task. My first sighting of a Puma was early on, it was one of the variants a large black one during a mid-summer day. I watched it as it crossed an open field behind my house. A couple of years ago, there was one hit by a car in downtown Santa Rosa, about 15 miles from my home. Some years back, an acquaintance of my wife was mauled to death by one. I've had chance encounters with them while deer hunting, a brief glimpse across a river and as follows: I recall one year my hunting partner was stalked by one, I picked up on what was going on and began stalking the cat that was stalking my best friend. Mr. Longtail became suspicious after some minutes of this and took the high road. My very first encounter with Mr. Longtail was when I was about 16 or 17 years old. I used to take the family car and go off solo camping in remote areas. This one time was a deer hunting trip in the Northern Sierras. I climbed up this one snow capped peak near the Village of Viola. Upon approaching the top I encountered a set of cat tracks in the snow. I circled around the knoll to encounter my own tracks again when I noticed that there were a large set of cat tracks following my old tracks from where I started. At age 16 I didn't want to mess with shooting at any Mt. Lion. Nor did I enjoy the idea of being stalked and possibly surprise attacked. This was a long time before they were protected in this state. In 1995 my wife and I were surrounded by 3 of them for the better part of 2 1/2 days. This was the only occurrence in all the years that they were verbal. The resonance of the three cats in this canyon was awesome. They sound much like a housecat but about an octave lower and as if they were using a megaphone. We contemplated that one was in heat and the others were males. They didn't seem all that interested in us. Though we did have a peculiar interaction with the female. The female did yield eye contact . The eye contact from one of these big cats has a mysterious way of freezing you, you forget about time and self...its most paralyzing. Its on a very primal level, that unless you have experienced it, its indescribable. I have seen them on the premises where I work in broad daylight. These are a few of the encounters / sightings I have had with the big cats. Well, its getting late and I have a date with a local steelhead stream...... Be safe in the California West, The Best to All, Tom - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 09:39:04 -0500 From: "WindWalker" Subject: MtMan-List: Brief Intro This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0169_01C1B860.1AD7B540 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable New to list Name Sam Been in/out muzzleloading for little over 40 yrs. {god has it been that long?} I might know a few of you from the ole days and Ive met a few from the "other" list I hope its easier to post here than other list Thinking of building another rifle, or commission one...Researching some info first Avid hunter.. Go alot of western state shoots Love canoe trips from days to weeks nuff said Sam - ------=_NextPart_000_0169_01C1B860.1AD7B540 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
New to list
Name Sam
Been in/out muzzleloading for  = little=20 over
40 yrs. {god has it been that = long?}
I might know a few of you from the ole=20 days
and Ive met a few from the "other"=20 list
I hope its easier to post here than = other=20 list
Thinking of building another rifle, or=20 commission
one...Researching some info = first
Avid hunter.. Go alot of western state=20 shoots
Love canoe trips from days to = weeks
nuff said
Sam
- ------=_NextPart_000_0169_01C1B860.1AD7B540-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 09:05:03 -0800 From: "rtlahti" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Brief Intro This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_002D_01C1B2DB.310B7160 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Welcome Sam. Nuff said. Capt. Lahti' ----- Original Message -----=20 From: WindWalker=20 To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Monday, February 18, 2002 6:39 AM Subject: MtMan-List: Brief Intro New to list Name Sam Been in/out muzzleloading for little over 40 yrs. {god has it been that long?} I might know a few of you from the ole days and Ive met a few from the "other" list I hope its easier to post here than other list Thinking of building another rifle, or commission one...Researching some info first Avid hunter.. Go alot of western state shoots Love canoe trips from days to weeks nuff said Sam - ------=_NextPart_000_002D_01C1B2DB.310B7160 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Welcome Sam. Nuff said.
 
Capt. Lahti'
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 WindWalker
Sent: Monday, February 18, 2002 = 6:39=20 AM
Subject: MtMan-List: Brief = Intro

New to list
Name Sam
Been in/out muzzleloading for  = little=20 over
40 yrs. {god has it been that = long?}
I might know a few of you from the = ole=20 days
and Ive met a few from the "other"=20 list
I hope its easier to post here than = other=20 list
Thinking of building another rifle, = or=20 commission
one...Researching some info = first
Avid hunter.. Go alot of western = state=20 shoots
Love canoe trips from days to = weeks
nuff said
Sam
- ------=_NextPart_000_002D_01C1B2DB.310B7160-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:13:31 -0800 From: "SUE RAVEN" Subject: MtMan-List: Ned, you are missed!!!



Ned,
      After the silence it seems the list has taken on a new perspective.  The emotionally charged quarreling seems to have vanished.  I would like to think it was partly because they had encountered your spirit and maybe realized that all were somewhat guilty from time to time; even though few put it in print.
      If you look in the past week we had a delightful debate on trapping beaver.  Gawd, I'm jealous of you men getting to have all the fun.   Hope to see your poats soon.
 
Your eternal pal,
 
Sue Raven

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- ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:27:25 -0800 From: "SUE RAVEN" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: BoB Trapping' Article





>From: Allen Hall
>Reply-To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com
>To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com
>Subject: MtMan-List: BoB Trappin' Article
>Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2002 19:57:23 -0700
>
>Hello the List,
>
>For those that are still interested in the beaver trappin' deal, the Book of
>Buckskinning #8 has a good article. It's on page 70, and is written by
>Shawn Webster, check it out, you'll like it.
>
>Allen
>
Allen,
      Eric, my brother said he read this about a year ago.  Having such an interest in trapping, even though the bounty exceeded the fur market.  He claims the data is pretty good yet he doubts if any large adults could be taken by these methods.  He also mentioned that the author of the article was very honest in admitting he was no expert; which adds to the authors credibility.
      As I'm not a rendezvou-er, so to speak, and do not have this collection of books or access to them, it is hard for me to discuss the articles.  Could you list the documents sources and authors where I may evaluate the article?
 
Trying not to create a flame,
Sue Raven
   

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- ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 12:53:45 -0800 (PST) From: George Noe Subject: MtMan-List: 1796 Cookbook This add is in the Northeast Oklahoma Electric Cooperative News paper "Oklahoma Living" Their site is: http://www.trescocorp.com American Cookery: recipies for "Indian Slapjacks" and "Johnny Cake". This is a reprint by a Ohio Publisher.$19.95 + $3.98 p/h or $30.00 for 2 with postage paid. American Cookbook Special Offer AC3915 718- 12th Street N.W.,Box24500 Canton, OH 44701 I don't know much more but do have the ad and if you want more info, Hit me off list. ===== George R. Noe< gnoe39@yahoo.com > Watch your back trail, and keep your eyes on the skyline. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 20:36:37 -0600 From: "Paul Jones" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: BoB Trapping' Article This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0084_01C1B33B.CD91A080 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This has been an interesting exchange, and, as Sue has noted, the tone = has been positive which I applaud. =20 As to this most recent post about the article in Book of Buckskinning = VIII, Sue, is your brother saying, when he acknowledges that the "data = is pretty good" but further notes that he doubts if any large adults = could be taken by these methods," that if the fur trappers, during the = rocky mountain fur trapping era, had used traps like the reproduction = traps described in the article, and the general methods of trapping = discussed in the article, that they could not (or did not, as a general = rule) take large adult beaver? I want to fully understand his position as regards the methods cited in = the article, as I gather that he has a great deal of hands-on experience = actually trapping beaver over the years. Since the article has been questioned to this degree, I am sending a = copy of it to a friend from Kansas, who, over the course of some years = of hard effort, has actually trapped several thousand beaver, including = over 350 during a 3-1/2 week period several years ago, while trapping on = the Arkansas River. The documented effort was amazing both in terms of = the amount of work (and very long hours) involved and the degree of = success. Even more so when he then drove to Dubois, Wyoming, where a = very fine tannery is located, and proceeded to flesh (with the help of a = friend from Texas), the entire lot. I cannot image how long those days = must have seened, or the degree of exhaustion involved. It will be = interesting to see his take on the article as a whole and the methods, = etc. described in it.=20 =20 As I will be making his copy tomorrow, should you wish to have a copy to = review, since I can make two copies about as easily as I can make one, = please advise and I will send it to you immediately. Regards, Paul Allen, Eric, my brother said he read this about a year ago. Having = such an interest in trapping, even though the bounty exceeded the fur = market. He claims the data is pretty good yet he doubts if any large = adults could be taken by these methods. He also mentioned that the = author of the article was very honest in admitting he was no expert; = which adds to the authors credibility. As I'm not a rendezvou-er, so to speak, and do not have this = collection of books or access to them, it is hard for me to discuss the = articles. Could you list the documents sources and authors where I may = evaluate the article? =20 Trying not to create a flame, Sue Raven =20 - -------------------------------------------------------------------------= - ----- Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. Click Here ---------------------- hist_text list info: = http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html=20 - ------=_NextPart_000_0084_01C1B33B.CD91A080 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This has been an interesting exchange, and, = as Sue has=20 noted, the tone has been positive which I applaud.
 
As to this most recent post about the = article in Book=20 of Buckskinning VIII, Sue, is your brother saying, when he=20 acknowledges that the "data is pretty good" but further notes that he=20 doubts if any large adults could be taken by these methods," that=20 if the fur trappers, during the rocky mountain fur trapping = era, had=20 used traps like the reproduction traps described in the article, and the = general=20 methods of trapping discussed in the article, that they could not (or = did not,=20 as a general rule) take large adult beaver?
 
I want to fully understand his position as = regards the=20 methods cited in the article, as I gather that he has a great deal of = hands-on=20 experience actually trapping beaver over the = years.
 
Since the article has been questioned to = this degree,=20 I am sending a copy of it to a friend from Kansas, who, over the course = of some=20 years of hard effort, has actually trapped several thousand beaver, = including=20 over 350 during a 3-1/2 week period several years ago, while trapping on = the=20 Arkansas River.  The documented effort was amazing both in terms of = the=20 amount of work (and very long hours) involved and the degree=20 of success.  Even more so when he then drove to Dubois, = Wyoming,=20 where a very fine tannery is located, and proceeded to flesh (with = the help=20 of a friend from Texas), the entire lot.  I cannot image how long = those=20 days must have seened, or the degree of exhaustion involved.  It = will be=20 interesting to see his take on the article as a whole and the methods, = etc.=20 described in it. 
 
As I will be making his copy = tomorrow, should you=20 wish to have a copy to review, since I can=20 make two copies about as easily as I can make one, please advise = and I will=20 send it to you immediately.
 
Regards,
 
Paul
Allen,
      Eric, = my=20 brother said he read this about a year ago.  Having such an = interest in=20 trapping, even though the bounty exceeded the fur market.  He = claims the=20 data is pretty good yet he doubts if any large adults could be taken = by these=20 methods.  He also mentioned that the author of the article was = very=20 honest in admitting he was no expert; which adds to the authors=20 credibility.
      As = I'm not a=20 rendezvou-er, so to speak, and do not have this collection of books or = access=20 to them, it is hard for me to discuss the articles.  Could you = list the=20 documents sources and authors where I may evaluate the = article?
 
Trying not to create a = flame,
Sue Raven
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---------------------- hist_text list info:=20 http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html = - ------=_NextPart_000_0084_01C1B33B.CD91A080-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 22:13:57 -0500 From: David Usner Subject: RE: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) How can I get a copy? David Usner usnerd@bigplanet.com - -----Original Message----- From: owner-hist_text@lists.xmission.com [mailto:owner-hist_text@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Gretchen Ormond Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2002 9:39 AM To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) > At 12:38 AM 02/09/2002 -0500, you wrote: > >I once wrote on article on trapper productivity during the fur trade era. If > >anyone is interested, I could post it ont the list. Could do it as an > >attachment, just post it, or make it available to those who request it. > >Anybody have a preference? (does anyone want to see it?) > > > >Jim Hardee, AMM#1676 Please make it available. I have concidered doing a little number crunching myself and I am sure you used the same (Ogdens) or better sources than I would. Mind Yer Hair Wynn Ormond - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ End of hist_text-digest V1 #952 ******************************* - To unsubscribe to hist_text-digest, send an email to "majordomo@xmission.com" with "unsubscribe hist_text-digest" in the body of the message.