From: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com (hist_text-digest) To: hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: hist_text-digest V1 #996 Reply-To: hist_text Sender: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-hist_text-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk hist_text-digest Friday, February 22 2002 Volume 01 : Number 996 In this issue: -       Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) -       Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) -       MtMan-List: need a little help -       MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT -       Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT -       FW: MtMan-List: ARTICLE - Trapper Productivity -       Re: MtMan-List: need a little help -       Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) -       Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) -       Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT -       Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT -       Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT -       Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) -       Re: Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT -       MtMan-List: funeral for Laura Jean -       Re: Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT -       Re: Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 10:13:50 -0500 From: "WindWalker" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C1B9F7.4ABC4E40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Myself I never seen it..Maybe you posted while list was down ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Casapy123@aol.com=20 To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2002 12:31 AM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) Say, I posted the article on trapper productivity about a week agao = but have seen no reposne to it. Did anyone read it? Surely it wasn't = so good that no one wanted to rebut it? Jim Hardee=20 - ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C1B9F7.4ABC4E40 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Myself I never seen it..Maybe you = posted while list=20 was down
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Casapy123@aol.com
To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com= =20
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, = 2002 12:31=20 AM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver = catch=20 (Trapper productivity)

Say, I posted the article on trapper productivity = about a=20 week agao but have seen no reposne to it.  Did anyone read = it? =20 Surely it wasn't so good that no one wanted to rebut it?=20 <grin>

Jim Hardee = - ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C1B9F7.4ABC4E40-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 21:50:09 EST From: LivingInThePast@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) - --part1_172.3ea5fa3.29a5ba61_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/20/2002 3:24:40 PM Pacific Standard Time, windwalker@fastmail.fm writes: > the article on trapper productivity about a week agao but have seen no > reposne to it. Did anyone read it? Jim, Is it possible you posted that article during the fiasco/flood of junk mail last week? I'm thinking people (myself included) were mass deleting at the time and it got lost. Please try it again, as things have quieted down and it will most likely be read and responded too now. Barney - --part1_172.3ea5fa3.29a5ba61_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/20/2002 3:24:40 PM Pacific Standard Time, windwalker@fastmail.fm writes:


the article on trapper productivity about a week agao but have seen no reposne to it.  Did anyone read it?


Jim, Is it possible you posted that article during the fiasco/flood of junk mail last week?  I'm thinking people (myself included) were mass deleting  at the time and it got lost.  Please try it again, as things have quieted down and it will most likely be read and responded too now.   Barney - --part1_172.3ea5fa3.29a5ba61_boundary-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 20:16:45 EST From: Traphand@aol.com Subject: MtMan-List: need a little help I picked a kettle at a shoot last year its brass and tin lined. how would one go about finding out if its tin lined and not 50/50 solder.got to thinking about it and was wondering. Anyone out there know how to tell them apart. Traphand Rick Petzoldt Traphand@aol.com - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 18:40:12 -0600 From: "Frank Fusco" Subject: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT The other Frank said, I wear a bear claw necklace every moment of every day, have for many years. When in period dress I have others that I wear, as do many pre-1840 re-enactors. All these claws were either purchased or given to me as gifts at different times and places over the years. Does this mean that if I am attending a rendezvous in Georgia, or just there with my single claw necklace I can be arrested? Frank G. Fusco Mountain Home, Arkansas http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/ozarksmuzzleloaders - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 08:57:26 EST From: LivingInThePast@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT - --part1_10.1a56ac6e.29a656c6_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/20/2002 8:23:06 PM Pacific Standard Time, frankf@cox-internet.com writes: > Does this mean that if I am attending a rendezvous in Georgia, or just > there with my single claw necklace I can be arrested? > It sure does Frank. The regs in effect WHERE YOU ARE, NOT WHERE YOU WERE come into play. You better have proper documentation. My best buddy, Dances With Wood, who has since passed on, had nesting Redtails in his backyard for years, and attached a number of primo feathers to his hatband. At a rendezvous in CA, where Hawks, like rocks, are 'protected', a Fish & Game maniac (cruising the rendezvous in plain clothes) treatened him with citation if he didn't put them away. The F&G guy was cool enough to let him do that, but Dances With Wood had been into the Agave juice, and didn't appreciate the offer. When he got indignant (a BIG mistake), explaining that the Hawks lived and loved in HIS backyard, and the feathers fell to the ground every day, and he WASN"T going to put the hat away, he was threatened with ARREST. Fortunately, I prevailed over both of them, dragged the big Lug to his lodge, threw the hat inside and then let him loose to play another day! Barney - --part1_10.1a56ac6e.29a656c6_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/20/2002 8:23:06 PM Pacific Standard Time, frankf@cox-internet.com writes:


Does this mean that if I am attending a rendezvous in Georgia, or just
there with my single claw necklace I can be arrested?


It sure does Frank. The regs in effect WHERE YOU ARE, NOT WHERE YOU WERE come into play. You better have proper documentation.

My best buddy, Dances With Wood, who has since passed on, had nesting Redtails in his backyard for years, and attached a number of primo feathers to his hatband.

At a rendezvous in CA, where Hawks, like rocks, are 'protected', a Fish & Game maniac (cruising the rendezvous in plain clothes) treatened him with citation if he didn't put them away. The F&G guy was cool enough to let him do that, but Dances With Wood had been into the Agave juice, and didn't appreciate the offer.

When he got indignant (a BIG mistake), explaining that the Hawks lived and loved in HIS backyard, and the feathers fell to the ground every day, and he WASN"T going to put the hat away, he was threatened with ARREST.

Fortunately, I prevailed over both of them, dragged the big Lug to his lodge, threw the hat inside and then let him loose to play another day!

Barney - --part1_10.1a56ac6e.29a656c6_boundary-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 23:25:44 -0800 From: "Randal Bublitz" Subject: FW: MtMan-List: ARTICLE - Trapper Productivity > [Original Message] > From: > To: > Date: 2/9/02 12:36:52 PM > Subject: MtMan-List: ARTICLE - Trapper Productivity > > Here is the article in its entirety. It was published in The Trapline, vol. > 3, #3, Spring 2000. I hope you find it helpful. > > > Trapper Productivity > By Jim Hardee > > Records of production typically drive success in the workplace, i.e. how > many widgets can worker "A" turn out during a given shift? Similarly, > determining the production of a fur trapper, in terms of beaver pelts > gathered, provides a better understanding of a day's effort in the Shining > Mountains. Just how many skins did an average trapper take? > In a discussion of trapper productivity, some general assumptions must be > made. For example, the length of the trapping season varied from year to > year, depending on weather extremes, location, etc. Usually, the season was > divided into a Spring and a Fall hunt, each generally lasting for two to > three months. Ultimately, general averages must be used for a statistical > analysis of trapper productivity. > Nathaniel Wyeth estimated a good hunter with average success would take > 120 beaver skins in a year, worth in Boston or New York about $1000. > (Chittenden. Vol. 1 p.6) This is a nice succinct statement of a trapper's > average productivity equating to sixty skins per hunt or about twenty hides > per month. > Unfortunately, averages are simply that; a mathematical mid-point between > a high and low figure. Warren Ferris provides an example of these highs and > lows. He reported his 1831 American Fur Company brigade took from forty to > seventy beaver per day on Henry's Fork. In the same breath, he described a > small party sent to the "Burnt Hole" on the Madison River that returned > without success. These numbers would have more meaning had Ferris provided > the number of hunters involved. (Ferris. 159-60) Another example of the > fickle nature of the business is Thomas Fitzpatrick's report that Benjamin > Bonneville's entire fall hunt in 1833 netted only 112 skins. That is less > than forty skins per month for a party consisting of 110 men. (Morgan and > Harris. P. 255.) > Examination of further examples of production can be examined to > determine if Wyeth's estimate is on the mark. In 1825, William Ashley > arrived in St. Louis with one hundred packs of beaver skins. While it is > generally accepted that a pack weighed about ninety to one hundred pounds, > Ashley's packs only weighed an average of fifty-two pounds each. This is > according to a chart in his account book that lists the first twenty-five > packs. Assuming these represent the remainder, each pack contained an > average of thirty-two beaver hides making a typical pelt weigh 1.625 pounds. > Ashley's one hundred packs with about thirty-two hides in each one then > equals 3200 total hides. (Morgan. "Smith" pp. 170 - 173. Morgan "Ashley" pp. > 118-29. Russell. p.157.) > From Ashley's report, there were one hundred twenty men at the > rendezvous. This equates to about twenty-seven hides per man. Yet, most of > the men recorded in Ashley's accounts with the trappers at the rendezvous > show far more than this average. The seven men under Jedediah Smith, for > instance, average ninety-six pounds of beaver each, about one hundred and > fifty skins. Smith himself is credited with an amazing six hundred sixty > eight pounds of hides. At first glance, this is almost unbelievable, but a > closer examination shows he is only credited with $275.00. With beaver at > $3.00 per pound, this equals about ninety two hides; a far more reasonable > total of pelts. (Morgan "Ashley" pp. 126.) > Did none of the Henry-Ashley men attain Wyeth's average? Much of the > confusion can be attributed to the difference in assignments of the men in a > trapping party. Not all of the men are trappers, some being camp keepers. > These latter men generally stayed in camp to watch the stock, prepare the > meals, dress the beaver hides and any of the other mundane activities > required in the camp. Ferris reports that up to half of the men in the > mountains were camp keepers. (Ferris. pp. 361-62.) Historian Hiram M > Chittenden, author of "A History of the American Fur Trade of the Far West," > says there was usually one camp keeper for every two trappers. (Chittenden. > pp. 54-55.) > In the brigade of men under Smith alluded to above, Ezekiel Able is only > credited with four pounds of beaver while most of his fellows all took vastly > more hides. Able must have been such a camp keeper in this brigade. Two > other men, Thomas Eddie and William bell, had fifty-six and fifty pounds > credited to their respective accounts, while the remaining four men have well > over one hundred pounds each. Thomas Galbraith tallies one hundred > eighty-nine pounds alone. Eddie and Bell may have been camp keepers too. > This would make three out of the eight men making up Smith's brigade assigned > to the role of camp keeper, which closely approximates Chittenden's report. > Applying these percentages of camp keepers to the one hundred twenty men > at the first rendezvous increases the individual trapper's take to forty and > fifty-three skins per man; still far short of Wyeth's projection. Wyeth > apparently wrote this figure in an attempt to drum up financial backing for a > proposed expedition to the mountains. Perhaps he was too optimistic. > In 1832, Indian John Dougherty compiled a chart indicating the > expenditures, returns and profits in the fur trade for the fifteen-year > period from 1815 to 1830. The chart does not stipulate that all the returns > are solely from the rocky Mountain trade and does not differentiate between > hides obtained through trading and trapping. Using the gross numbers in the > chart and applying the same three percentages of camp keepers used above, > Dougherty indicates the annual return per man to be one hundred twenty-five, > one hundred eighty-six and two hundred fifty skins. Exactly what information > Dougherty based his calculations on is unknown, but he appears to anticipate > greater returns than Wyeth does. (Chittenden. Vol. 1 p.7) > Perhaps looking at specific returns will reveal further information. In > 1826, Ashley's rendezvous in Cache Valley netted him one hundred twenty-five > packs that brought him $60,000 in St. Louis. This comes out to $480 per pack > which, with beaver at $5.00 per pound in St. Louis, closer approximates the > readily accepted one hundred pound pack. Records show there were one hundred > men at the second rendezvous. Again, applying the same ratios as above, the > beaver taken per trapper calculates to seventy-six, one hundred fourteen and > one hundred fifty-three hides. Considering camp keepers into the mix of > trappers brings the return closer to Wyeth's estimate. (Gowans. p. 31. > Wishart. p. 126.) > Rendezvous of 1829 netted Smith, Jackson and Sublette 4,076 beaver skins. > Robert Newell recalled in his memoirs that there were one hundred > seventy-five men present. While this number seems high, if it is accurate, > the success rate of the men was quite low. Using the same calculations, the > average take becomes fourteen, twenty-one and twenty-eight, respectively for > each ratio of trapper to camp keeper. Newell was, himself, a newcomer to the > Rockies, having arrived as one of the fifty-five man crew with Sublette's > supply caravan. If Newell included these men in his total, they should be > subtracted from the total attendees he says were there for they were > obviously not involved in procuring the fifty-five packs of beaver turned in > at the rendezvous. Reducing the participants to one hundred twenty increases > the averages to twenty-one, thirty-one and forty-one. This is still not > terrific but is a little better. It is a wonder the company could stay in > business. > In a letter to Francis Ematinger, Wyeth himself provides information > regarding two brigades that can be used in this discussion. The brigade > under Andrew Drips and Lucien Fontenelle arrived to the 1832 rendezvous in > Pierre's Hole on July 8th. They had one hundred sixty men with them and had > obtained fifty-one packs of beaver at one hundred pounds each. If all the men > are trappers, the average take is only twenty hides per man. If two out of > three are trappers, the take increases to thirty per man. Finally, if half > the men are trappers, the take reaches forty skins a piece; still far short > of Wyeth's lofty goal for a good trapper. (Wyeth. p. 111) > The same letter includes date on the rocky Mountain Fur Company who > showed up with fifty-five packs of fur but only fifty-five men. That is one > pack of hides per man. If all are trappers, that is a yearly average of > about sixty-one beaver each. With only two thirds of the men trapping while > one third attend camp, the average raises to about ninety-one per trapper. > If half the men are camp keepers then the average finally attains Wyeth's > prediction of one hundred twenty pelts per trapper. (Wyeth. p. 111) > None of these calculations take into consideration how many hides were > traded for with Indians. Also not considered is how many pelts may have been > stolen by Indians, lost while crossing a swollen river, spoiled by damage to > a hidden cache or in any other way taken but not making it to rendezvous for > whatever reason. Any of these factors could effect the average take per > trapper. > # HIDES HIDES PER MAN > YEAR LBS. (1.625 LB/HIDE) # MEN ALL TR. 1/3 C.K. 1/2 C.K. > 1825 8829 5433 120 45 68 > 91 > 1826 12500 7692 100 77 115 154 > 1829a 4076 2508 175 14 21 > 29 > 1829b 4076 2508 120 21 31 > 42 > 1832 (Drips) 5100 3138 160 20 29 > 39 > 1832 (RMF) 5500 3385 55 62 91 > 121 > Dougherty's 15 yr. Est. 25,000 200 125 167 250 > > > > > References: > Chittenden, Hiram M. The American Fur Trade of the Far West. Vol 1. Academic > Reprints, Stanford, CA, 1954. > Dale, Harrison. The Ashley-Smith Explorations and the Discovery of a Central > Route to the Pacific. Arthur Clark Co. Glendale, CA. 1941 > Ferris, Warren A. Life in the Rocky Mountains. Old West Publishing. Denver, > 1983. > Gowans, Fred. Rocky Mountain Rendezvous. Gibbs-Smith, Layton, UT. 1985. > Harris, Eleanor T. and Morgan, Dale L. The Rocky Mountain Journals of William > Marshall Anderson. Huntington Library, San Marino, CA. 1967. > Morgan, Dale. Jedediah Smith and the Opening of the West. Bobbs-Merril, NY. > 1953. > _____ . The West of William Ashley. Old West Publishing, Denver. 1964. > Wishart, David J. The Fur Trade of the American West, 1807-1840. University > of Nebraska Press, Lincoln. 1979. > Wyeth, Nathaniel J. Journal of Captain Nathaniel J. Wyeth's Exp - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 07:19:24 EST From: TrapRJoe@aol.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: need a little help They make test kits used to check the paint on plates. It seems some of the older china was painted with a lead base paint. The had a program on it a few years back on TV. At that time you could get the test kit at ACE Hardware. Ridge Pole - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 22:38:55 -0800 From: "Randal Bublitz" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity)
Jim,  I received it, and appreciate your efforts.  And No, I will not refute it <s>.  There was a lot of crap being posted, so perhaps it got lost in the hail storm.  I did see it, but I know you and tend to pay attention your words.   Thanks,  hardtack
----- Original Message -----
From:
Sent: 2/19/02 4:31:33 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity)

Say, I posted the article on trapper productivity about a week agao but have seen no reposne to it.  Did anyone read it?  Surely it wasn't so good that no one wanted to rebut it? <grin>

Jim Hardee

 
--- Randal Bublitz
we have NOT inherited the Earth from our fathers,
we are Borrowing it from our Children
 
 - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 22:25:23 -0700 From: "Michael Powell" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) - ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C1BA5D.7D0096C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jim, In answer to your query, I for one was impressed by your post and made a= hard copy of it to share with some friends who don't have e-mail or acce= ss to the AMM List. Thank you for taking the time and effort to type all that in. YMHOS =20 Mike Powell AMM #1769 =20 =20 - ----- Original Message ----- From: WindWalker Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2002 4:25 PM To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) =20 Myself I never seen it..Maybe you posted while list was down - ----- Original Message ----- =20 From: Casapy123@aol.com =20 To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com =20 Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2002 12:31 AM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) Say, I posted the article on trapper productivity about a week agao but h= ave seen no reposne to it. Did anyone read it? Surely it wasn't so good= that no one wanted to rebut it? Jim Hardee Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://ex= plorer.msn.com - ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C1BA5D.7D0096C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Jim,
In answer to your query,&= nbsp; I for one was impressed by your post and made a hard copy of it to = share with some friends who don't have e-mail or access to the AMM List.<= /DIV>
Thank you for taking the time and effort to type all that in.<= /DIV>
YMHOS
Mike Powell
AMM #1769  =
 
----- Original Message -----
= From: WindWalker
Sent: W= ednesday, February 20, 2002 4:25 PM
To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity)=
 
Myself I never s= een it..Maybe you posted while list was down
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, = February 20, 2002 12:31 AM
Subje= ct: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity)
Say, I posted the article on trapper productivity a= bout a week agao but have seen no reposne to it.  Did anyone read it= ?  Surely it wasn't so good that no one wanted to rebut it? <grin= >

Jim Hardee

Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer downloa= d : http://explorer.msn.com
- ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C1BA5D.7D0096C0-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 23:54:03 -0500 From: "Addison Miller" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT > Does this mean that if I am attending a rendezvous in Georgia, or just > there with my single claw necklace I can be arrested? > Frank G. Fusco As I understand the DNR Laws on such items, the answer is YES unless you have documentation on you stating how you came by them.. ie... a gift, purchased in another state, killed yourself, etc... and documentation from the DNR in that state agreeing with what you have written down. We have a rather large Fur Trader that comes to the Alafia each year, and DNR is there going over his stuff like fleas on a coon dog. I have a stuffed Red Fox that was a road kill and a friend of mine had it stuffed and gave it to me as a joke. Had DNR seen me with it, I'd have been in deep poo.... As I remember, Red Fox is protected in Florida. Ad - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 22:33:22 -0500 From: "WindWalker" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT possible, If its real Griz claw or teeth necklace.. Grizzly are highly protected in some states... One show have the standard documentation on them if wearing them i.e source of how obtained Black bear i dont think are protected, so i think their laws are diffrent Sam - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Frank Fusco" To: "hist_text-digest" Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2002 7:40 PM Subject: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT > The other Frank said, > > > I wear a bear claw necklace every moment of every day, have for many > years. When in period dress I have others that I wear, as do many pre-1840 > re-enactors. All these claws were either purchased or given to me as gifts > at different times and places over the years. > Does this mean that if I am attending a rendezvous in Georgia, or just > there with my single claw necklace I can be arrested? > Frank G. Fusco > Mountain Home, Arkansas > http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/ozarksmuzzleloaders > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 12:09:09 -0500 From: "WindWalker" Subject: Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT Checking .. its not legal to have any Griz parts in lower 48 without documentation.. as they are endangered. alaska has hunting on them, pelts and parts have to be checked by Fish and Game and have stamp and documentation. Native americans in alaska can have pelts from them. Having any parts/pelts in lower 48 carries stiff fines. A native american can most likely get by with having said parts by showing tribal card. {certain tribal councels] penality possible $10,000 fine, possible 5 years in prison Call your local game warden and inquire... ask for permit to have said parts and be prepared to prove they were not taken illigal. God help ya in Fl if you have Panther claws or teeth.. Sam - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Addison Miller" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2002 11:54 PM Subject: Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT > > Does this mean that if I am attending a rendezvous in Georgia, > or just > > there with my single claw necklace I can be arrested? > > Frank G. Fusco > > As I understand the DNR Laws on such items, the answer is YES unless > you have documentation on you stating how you came by them.. ie... a > gift, purchased in another state, killed yourself, etc... and > documentation from the DNR in that state agreeing with what you have > written down. > > We have a rather large Fur Trader that comes to the Alafia each year, > and DNR is there going over his stuff like fleas on a coon dog. I > have a stuffed Red Fox that was a road kill and a friend of mine had > it stuffed and gave it to me as a joke. Had DNR seen me with it, I'd > have been in deep poo.... As I remember, Red Fox is protected in > Florida. > > Ad > > ---------------------- > hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html > - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 22:23:52 EST From: HikingOnThru@cs.com Subject: Re: MtMan-List: Beaver catch (Trapper productivity) In a message dated 2/20/02 10:28:05 AM Eastern Standard Time, Casapy123@aol.com writes: << Say, I posted the article on trapper productivity about a week agao but have seen no reposne to it. Did anyone read it? >> I sure did print it out and read it. It was pretty interesting though the numbers threw me a bit. I got that there were a lot of guys not trapping at all and when you look at the take it is pretty impressive for some during some years and not so much other years. Overall, I give it an 8.5, Jack!!! - -C.Kent - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 20:53:09 -0500 From: Subject: Re: Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT Frank, My bust, I assumed you were speaking of black bear. A few years ago I almost got in deep doo when someone said I was selling tortuise shells. They were snapper shells and legal to sell but boy what a scare. This is one reason that I stopped selling horns, skins, and critter bones at archery shoots and rendezvous. Frank hist_text@lists.xmission.com wrote: > In a message dated 2/20/2002 8:23:06 PM Pacific Standard Time, frankf@cox-internet.com writes: > > > Does this mean that if I am attending a rendezvous in Georgia, or just > there with my single claw necklace I can be arrested? > > > It sure does Frank. The regs in effect WHERE YOU ARE, NOT WHERE YOU WERE come into play. You better have proper documentation. > > My best buddy, Dances With Wood, who has since passed on, had nesting Redtails in his backyard for years, and attached a number of primo feathers to his hatband. > > At a rendezvous in CA, where Hawks, like rocks, are 'protected', a Fish & Game maniac (cruising the rendezvous in plain clothes) treatened him with citation if he didn't put them away. The F&G guy was cool enough to let him do that, but Dances With Wood had been into the Agave juice, and didn't appreciate the offer. > > When he got indignant (a BIG mistake), explaining that the Hawks lived and loved in HIS backyard, and the feathers fell to the ground every day, and he WASN"T going to put the hat away, he was threatened with ARREST. > > Fortunately, I prevailed over both of them, dragged the big Lug to his lodge, threw the hat inside and then let him loose to play another day! > > Barney - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 17:39:45 -0600 From: "Lanney Ratcliff" Subject: MtMan-List: funeral for Laura Jean Several people have asked me about where to send flowers for Laura Jean's funeral. Laura Jean's Texas funeral services will be handled by Pennington Funeral Home in San Marcos, Texas (512)353-4311. The services are pending at this time but presumably will be sometime on Saturday March 2. She will be interred at the old San Marcos cemetery. Lanney Ratcliff amm1585@hyperusa.com - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 23:06:26 -0800 (PST) From: Jon Towns Subject: Re: Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT - --0-1865488559-1014361586=:56938 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I AM QUARTER CHIPAWA AND I DON'T HAVE ANY PAPERS TO PROVE IT SO I AM VERY CAREFUL ABOUT MY FEATHERS AND CLAWS AND TEETH. I KEEP THEM OUT OF SIGHT FROM OTHER PEOPLE THEN BROTHERS AND AT POW WOWS I HAVE A SET OF BRAIN TAN LAGGENS AND WAR SHIRT AND ALL THE INDIANS A THE POW WOWS JUST CAN'T GET OVER THE HIDES. THEY ALL WANT TO KNOW WHERE I GOT THEM SO I TELL THEM I MADE THEM. THAT IN PRESSES THEM BECAUSE MOST OF MY INDIAN BROTHER DON'T KNOW HOW TO TAN HIDES. I ALSO DO WOOD CARVING AND TALK JARGON AND USE SIGN WHICH MOST OF THE ALSO DON'T. IT GIVES ME A CHANCE TO BULL SHIT THEM A LITTLE BECAUSE SOMETIMES I CAN'T REMEMBER THE RIGHT WORKS TO USE SO I SUBS ATUTE PLUS I CAN'T SPELL VERY WELL EIATHER. AS YOU ALL CAN TELL. I WILL HAVE TO GET A LOT BETTER BECAUSE I AM A VOLUNTEER AT FORT CLAPSAP AND I NEED TO BE UP ON IT BECAUSE SOMEONE MIGHT KNOW WHAT I AM SAYING. BUT IT WILL GIVE ME A CHANCE TO PRATACE I AM SORRY ABOUT THE SPELLING BUT THE SPELL CHEACK DID KNOW HOW TO SPELL THEM. UNTIL LATER JON TOWNS HIV 944 Until later Jon Towns - --------------------------------- Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games - --0-1865488559-1014361586=:56938 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

 I AM QUARTER CHIPAWA AND I DON'T HAVE ANY PAPERS TO PROVE IT SO I AM VERY CAREFUL ABOUT MY FEATHERS AND CLAWS AND TEETH.  I KEEP THEM OUT OF SIGHT FROM OTHER PEOPLE THEN BROTHERS AND AT POW WOWS I HAVE A SET OF BRAIN TAN LAGGENS AND WAR SHIRT AND ALL THE INDIANS A THE POW WOWS JUST CAN'T GET OVER THE HIDES.  THEY ALL WANT TO KNOW WHERE I GOT THEM SO I TELL THEM I MADE THEM.  THAT IN PRESSES THEM  BECAUSE MOST OF MY INDIAN BROTHER DON'T KNOW HOW TO TAN HIDES.  I ALSO DO WOOD CARVING AND TALK JARGON AND USE SIGN WHICH MOST OF THE ALSO DON'T.  IT GIVES ME A CHANCE TO BULL SHIT THEM A LITTLE BECAUSE SOMETIMES I CAN'T REMEMBER THE RIGHT WORKS TO USE SO I SUBS ATUTE PLUS I CAN'T SPELL VERY WELL EIATHER.  AS YOU ALL CAN TELL.  I WILL HAVE TO GET A LOT BETTER BECAUSE I AM A VOLUNTEER AT FORT CLAPSAP AND I NEED TO BE UP ON IT BECAUSE SOMEONE MIGHT KNOW WHAT I AM SAYING.  BUT IT WILL GIVE ME A CHANCE TO PRATACE I AM SORRY ABOUT THE SPELLING BUT THE SPELL CHEACK DID KNOW HOW TO SPELL THEM.  UNTIL LATER JON TOWNS HIV 944      

 



Until later Jon Towns


Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games - --0-1865488559-1014361586=:56938-- - ---------------------- hist_text list info: http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/mtman/maillist.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 19:47:56 -0700 From: "Michael Powell" Subject: Re: Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT - ------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C1BBD9.D2F73C00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hey Jon, Do you think you could find a bigger font for your posts? My nieghbor en= joys reading them through the window, next door. Thanks, Mike =20 =20 - ----- Original Message ----- From: Jon Towns Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 2:41 PM To: hist_text@lists.xmission.com Subject: Re: Re: MtMan-List: mountain trapper NOT =20 I AM QUARTER CHIPAWA AND I DON'T HAVE ANY PAPERS TO PROVE IT SO I AM VER= Y CAREFUL ABOUT MY FEATHERS AND CLAWS AND TEETH. I KEEP THEM OUT OF SIGH= T FROM OTHER PEOPLE THEN BROTHERS AND AT POW WOWS I HAVE A SET OF BRAIN T= AN LAGGENS AND WAR SHIRT AND ALL THE INDIANS A THE POW WOWS JUST CAN'T GE= T OVER THE HIDES. THEY ALL WANT TO KNOW WHERE I GOT THEM SO I TELL THEM = I MADE THEM. THAT IN PRESSES THEM BECAUSE MOST OF MY INDIAN BROTHER DON= 'T KNOW HOW TO TAN HIDES. I ALSO DO WOOD CARVING AND TALK JARGON AND USE= SIGN WHICH MOST OF THE ALSO DON'T. IT GIVES ME A CHANCE TO BULL SHIT TH= EM A LITTLE BECAUSE SOMETIMES I CAN'T REMEMBER THE RIGHT WORKS TO USE SO = I SUBS ATUTE PLUS I CAN'T SPELL VERY WELL EIATHER. AS YOU ALL CAN TELL. = I WILL HAVE TO GET A LOT BETTER BECAUSE I AM A VOLUNTEER AT FORT CLAPSAP= AND I NEED TO BE UP ON IT BECAUSE SOMEONE MIGHT KNOW WHAT I AM SAYING. = BUT IT WILL GIVE ME A CHANCE TO PRATACE I AM SORRY ABOUT THE SPELLING BUT= THE SPELL CHEACK DID KNOW HOW TO SPELL THEM. UNTIL LATER JON TOWNS HIV = 944 =20 =20 Until later Jon Towns Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic GamesGet more from the Web. = FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com - ------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C1BBD9.D2F73C00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hey Jon,
=
Do you think you could find a bigger font for your posts?  My = nieghbor enjoys reading them through the window, next door.
Th= anks,
Mike
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Jon Towns
Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 2:41 PM
To: hist_text@lists.xmission.c= om
Subject: Re: Re: MtMan-Li= st: mountain trapper NOT
 

 I AM QUARTER CHIPAWA AND I DON'T HAVE ANY PAPERS TO PROVE= IT SO I AM VERY CAREFUL ABOUT MY FEATHERS AND CLAWS AND TEETH.  I K= EEP THEM OUT OF SIGHT FROM OTHER PEOPLE THEN BROTHERS AND AT POW WOWS I H= AVE A SET OF BRAIN TAN LAGGENS AND WAR SHIRT AND ALL THE INDIANS A THE PO= W WOWS JUST CAN'T GET OVER THE HIDES.  THEY ALL WANT TO KNOW WHERE I= GOT THEM SO I TELL THEM I MADE THEM.  THAT IN PRESSES THEM  BE= CAUSE MOST OF MY INDIAN BROTHER DON'T KNOW HOW TO TAN HIDES.  I ALSO= DO WOOD CARVING AND TALK JARGON AND USE SIGN WHICH MOST OF THE ALSO DON'= T.  IT GIVES ME A CHANCE TO BULL SHIT THEM A LITTLE BECAUSE SOMETIME= S I CAN'T REMEMBER THE RIGHT WORKS TO USE SO I SUBS ATUTE PLUS I CAN'T SP= ELL VERY WELL EIATHER.  AS YOU ALL CAN TELL.  I WILL HAVE TO GE= T A LOT BETTER BECAUSE I AM A VOLUNTEER AT FORT CLAPSAP AND I NEED TO BE = UP ON IT BECAUSE SOMEONE MIGHT KNOW WHAT I AM SAYING.  BUT IT WILL G= IVE ME A CHANCE TO PRATACE I AM SORRY ABOUT THE SPELLING BUT THE SPELL CH= EACK DID KNOW HOW TO SPELL THEM.  UNTIL LATER JON TOWNS HIV 944 = ;     

 



Until l= ater Jon Towns


Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2= 002 Olympic Games
Get more = from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com

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