From: "Travis K. Manning" Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Steve Perry radio show Date: 01 Nov 2003 20:16:33 -0800 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C3A0B5.0B975E20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Steve Perry radio showGood call. Travis ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Christopher Bigelow=20 To: 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com'=20 Sent: Friday, October 31, 2003 12:46 PM Subject: [irr-ed] Steve Perry radio show Hey, Travis and anyone else who's thinking about this, I'm sending = Steve Perry copies of our last 4 issues so he can go through and = identify any pieces/authors that particularly interest him for the radio = show. ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C3A0B5.0B975E20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Steve Perry radio show
Good call.
 
Travis
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Christopher Bigelow =
To: 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmi= ssion.com'=20
Sent: Friday, October 31, 2003 = 12:46=20 PM
Subject: [irr-ed] Steve Perry = radio=20 show

Hey, Travis and anyone else who's thinking about = this, I'm=20 sending Steve Perry copies of our last 4 issues so he can go through = and=20 identify any pieces/authors that particularly interest him for the = radio=20 show.

------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C3A0B5.0B975E20-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [irr-ed] LDS Video Store banner Date: 03 Nov 2003 09:18:35 -0700 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3A226.21A7FC20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hey, as a result of my recent little lament on AML-List about Irreantum's circulation challenges, we got a prominent free banner at the LDS Video Store. Check it out at http://www.ldsvideostore.com and let me know if I should tell the webmaster anything to change. Very nice of them! (That lament is also what Steve Perry was responding to with his invitation for his radio show. So sometimes it pays to lament . . .) ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3A226.21A7FC20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable LDS Video Store banner

Hey, as a result of my recent little lament on = AML-List about Irreantum's circulation challenges, we got a prominent = free banner at the LDS Video Store. Check it out at http://www.ldsvideostore.com and let me know if I = should tell the webmaster anything to change. Very nice of = them!

(That lament is also what Steve Perry was responding = to with his invitation for his radio show. So sometimes it pays to = lament . . .)

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3A226.21A7FC20-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Date: 20 Nov 2003 15:25:47 -0700 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3AFB5.3EF39CC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he agreed to do a short review for us. Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . . ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3AFB5.3EF39CC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Neil LaBute

For the film issue, I have now completed an = interesting interview with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of = "Brigham City" because he agreed to do a short review for = us.

Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . .

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3AFB5.3EF39CC0-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Travis K. Manning" Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Date: 21 Nov 2003 00:23:12 -0800 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01C3AFC5.A6364B20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Neil LaButeChris, Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly impressed. Way to go. For the next issue, I already submitted a memoir piece = (nothing related to film). And, I'm still working through edits with = Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on the history of = Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA conference in = Missoula.. I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else has. I forwarded some = stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly what it was. I = think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham City by "that MD in = Boston," I forget his name. If that's the case, I don't see a problem = with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute can get his critique = to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter. I may end up with a two-essay = set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on the last a = couple months ago. I have one essay, but I may seek an author to write = an opposing piece. It's just a matter of finding the time to do it all. What else do we have for the film issue?! Very curious, Travis ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Christopher Bigelow=20 To: 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com'=20 Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM Subject: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview with = Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he = agreed to do a short review for us. Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . .=20 ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01C3AFC5.A6364B20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Neil LaBute
Chris,
 
Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly=20 impressed.
 
Way to go.   For the next issue, I = already=20 submitted a memoir piece (nothing related to film).  And, I'm still = working=20 through edits with Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on = the=20 history of Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA = conference in=20 Missoula..
 
I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else = has.  I=20 forwarded some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly = what it=20 was.  I think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham = City by=20 "that MD in Boston," I forget his name.  If that's the case, I = don't see a=20 problem with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute can get his = critique=20 to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter.  I may end up with a = two-essay=20 set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on the last a = couple=20 months ago.  I have one essay, but I may seek an author to write an = opposing piece.  It's just a matter of finding the time to do it=20 all.
 
What else do we have for the film issue?!
 
Very curious,
 
Travis
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Christopher Bigelow =
To: 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmi= ssion.com'=20
Sent: Thursday, November 20, = 2003 2:25=20 PM
Subject: [irr-ed] Neil = LaBute

For the film issue, I have now completed an = interesting=20 interview with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham = City"=20 because he agreed to do a short review for us.

Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . . =

------=_NextPart_000_001E_01C3AFC5.A6364B20-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Date: 21 Nov 2003 09:25:38 -0700 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B04C.19336EB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" A third piece I wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter John Moyer. I would welcome some questions from people. I also hope we can maybe include some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not going to get involved myself in that area. LaBute gave me a short story to run, not a script excerpt. -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 1:23 AM Chris, Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly impressed. Way to go. For the next issue, I already submitted a memoir piece (nothing related to film). And, I'm still working through edits with Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on the history of Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA conference in Missoula.. I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else has. I forwarded some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly what it was. I think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham City by "that MD in Boston," I forget his name. If that's the case, I don't see a problem with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute can get his critique to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter. I may end up with a two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on the last a couple months ago. I have one essay, but I may seek an author to write an opposing piece. It's just a matter of finding the time to do it all. What else do we have for the film issue?! Very curious, Travis ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he agreed to do a short review for us. Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . . ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B04C.19336EB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Neil LaBute
A third piece I wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter John Moyer. I would welcome some questions from people.
 
I also hope we can maybe include some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not going to get involved myself in that area. LaBute gave me a short story to run, not a script excerpt.
-----Original Message-----
From: Travis K. Manning [mailto:tmanning.eagle@sisna.com]
Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 1:23 AM
To: irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

Chris,
 
Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly impressed.
 
Way to go.   For the next issue, I already submitted a memoir piece (nothing related to film).  And, I'm still working through edits with Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on the history of Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA conference in Missoula..
 
I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else has.  I forwarded some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly what it was.  I think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham City by "that MD in Boston," I forget his name.  If that's the case, I don't see a problem with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute can get his critique to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter.  I may end up with a two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on the last a couple months ago.  I have one essay, but I may seek an author to write an opposing piece.  It's just a matter of finding the time to do it all.
 
What else do we have for the film issue?!
 
Very curious,
 
Travis
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM
Subject: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he agreed to do a short review for us.

Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . .

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B04C.19336EB0-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Travis K. Manning" Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Date: 21 Nov 2003 09:26:39 -0800 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C3B011.9114D4E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Neil LaButeIsn't Moyer the one that got into the tiff with Dutcher = several months back. Seems to me I remember reading a diary excerpt on = Moyer's website that mentions that. Has Moyer reconciled these = differences with Dutcher? I didn't see Moyer at the AML's recent = writer's seminar, but I wonder if he said anything there that could be = followed up on. Or, if there aren't further questions to be gleaned = from perusing his website. I also wonder if Moyer is at any way = involved with that new nonprofit started by Jongiorgi and Richard, and = how he views other aspects of the growing niche of Mormon film. It = might be interesting to get a standard question in about what are = Moyer's all time favorite/least favorite films, in various genres = (international, pre-1950, cartoon, romantic comedy, horror, action, = Mormon, Jewish, etc.). Nuts and bolts of screenwriting might be = interesting: when he writes, how, why, where, and how much money he = makes. I assume he only writes on the side. You could run the Whitney = quote by him and ask him where our Milton and Shakespeare filmmakers = are, are they still in embryo, or have they already begun making films. = Travis ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Christopher Bigelow=20 To: 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com'=20 Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 8:25 AM Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute A third piece I wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter = John Moyer. I would welcome some questions from people. I also hope we can maybe include some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not = going to get involved myself in that area. LaBute gave me a short story = to run, not a script excerpt. -----Original Message----- From: Travis K. Manning [mailto:tmanning.eagle@sisna.com] Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 1:23 AM To: irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Chris, Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly impressed. Way to go. For the next issue, I already submitted a memoir piece = (nothing related to film). And, I'm still working through edits with = Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on the history of = Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA conference in = Missoula.. I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else has. I forwarded = some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly what it = was. I think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham City by = "that MD in Boston," I forget his name. If that's the case, I don't see = a problem with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute can get his = critique to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter. I may end up with a = two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on the = last a couple months ago. I have one essay, but I may seek an author to = write an opposing piece. It's just a matter of finding the time to do = it all. What else do we have for the film issue?! Very curious, Travis ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Christopher Bigelow=20 To: 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com'=20 Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM Subject: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview = with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he = agreed to do a short review for us. Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . .=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C3B011.9114D4E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Neil LaBute
Isn't Moyer the one that got into the tiff with = Dutcher=20 several months back.  Seems to me I remember reading a diary = excerpt on=20 Moyer's website that mentions that.  Has Moyer reconciled=20 these differences with Dutcher?  I didn't see Moyer at the = AML's=20 recent writer's seminar, but I wonder if he said anything there that = could be=20 followed up on.  Or, if there aren't further questions to be = gleaned from=20 perusing his website.  I also wonder if Moyer is at any way = involved with=20 that new nonprofit started by Jongiorgi and Richard, and how he views = other=20 aspects of the growing niche of Mormon film.  It might be = interesting to=20 get a standard question in about what are Moyer's all time = favorite/least=20 favorite films, in various genres (international, pre-1950, cartoon, = romantic=20 comedy, horror, action, Mormon, Jewish, etc.).  Nuts and bolts of=20 screenwriting might be interesting: when he writes, how, why, where, and = how=20 much money he makes.  I assume he only writes on the side.  = You could=20 run the Whitney quote by him and ask him where our Milton and = Shakespeare=20 filmmakers are, are they still in embryo, or have they already begun = making=20 films. 
 
Travis
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Christopher Bigelow =
To: 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmi= ssion.com'=20
Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 = 8:25=20 AM
Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil = LaBute

A third=20 piece I wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter John = Moyer. I=20 would welcome some questions from people.
 
I also hope=20 we can maybe include some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not going to = get=20 involved myself in that area. LaBute gave me a short story to run, not = a=20 script excerpt.
-----Original Message-----
From: Travis K. = Manning=20 [mailto:tmanning.eagle@sisna.com]
Sent: Friday, November = 21, 2003=20 1:23 AM
To: = irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Re:=20 [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

Chris,
 
Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly=20 impressed.
 
Way to go.   For the next issue, = I already=20 submitted a memoir piece (nothing related to film).  And, I'm = still=20 working through edits with Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages=20 doublespaced) on the history of Mormon film which she recently = presented at=20 the RMMLA conference in Missoula..
 
I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone = else=20 has.  I forwarded some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't = remember=20 exactly what it was.  I think one of the pieces was a film = review=20 of Brigham City by "that MD in Boston," I forget his name.  If = that's=20 the case, I don't see a problem with two film reviews of the same = film, if=20 LaBute can get his critique to us by deadline, or shortly = thereafter. =20 I may end up with a two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film = moratorium,=20 a topic on the last a couple months ago.  I have one essay, but = I may=20 seek an author to write an opposing piece.  It's just a matter = of=20 finding the time to do it all.
 
What else do we have for the film issue?!
 
Very curious,
 
Travis
 
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 Christopher Bigelow =
To: 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmi= ssion.com'=20
Sent: Thursday, November = 20, 2003=20 2:25 PM
Subject: [irr-ed] Neil = LaBute

For the film issue, I have now completed an = interesting=20 interview with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham = City"=20 because he agreed to do a short review for us.

Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . = .=20

------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C3B011.9114D4E0-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Date: 21 Nov 2003 10:25:21 -0700 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B054.70AFD9A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I don't remember Moyer saying much of anything at the AML writers conf. panel, which was almost completely dominated by Jongiogi, who I thought was fantastic. I'd interview Jongiorgi, but he's not accomplished enough yet or gotten onto the cultural radar enough yet. -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 10:27 AM Isn't Moyer the one that got into the tiff with Dutcher several months back. Seems to me I remember reading a diary excerpt on Moyer's website that mentions that. Has Moyer reconciled these differences with Dutcher? I didn't see Moyer at the AML's recent writer's seminar, but I wonder if he said anything there that could be followed up on. Or, if there aren't further questions to be gleaned from perusing his website. I also wonder if Moyer is at any way involved with that new nonprofit started by Jongiorgi and Richard, and how he views other aspects of the growing niche of Mormon film. It might be interesting to get a standard question in about what are Moyer's all time favorite/least favorite films, in various genres (international, pre-1950, cartoon, romantic comedy, horror, action, Mormon, Jewish, etc.). Nuts and bolts of screenwriting might be interesting: when he writes, how, why, where, and how much money he makes. I assume he only writes on the side. You could run the Whitney quote by him and ask him where our Milton and Shakespeare filmmakers are, are they still in embryo, or have they already begun making films. Travis ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 8:25 AM A third piece I wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter John Moyer. I would welcome some questions from people. I also hope we can maybe include some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not going to get involved myself in that area. LaBute gave me a short story to run, not a script excerpt. -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 1:23 AM Chris, Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly impressed. Way to go. For the next issue, I already submitted a memoir piece (nothing related to film). And, I'm still working through edits with Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on the history of Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA conference in Missoula.. I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else has. I forwarded some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly what it was. I think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham City by "that MD in Boston," I forget his name. If that's the case, I don't see a problem with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute can get his critique to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter. I may end up with a two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on the last a couple months ago. I have one essay, but I may seek an author to write an opposing piece. It's just a matter of finding the time to do it all. What else do we have for the film issue?! Very curious, Travis ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he agreed to do a short review for us. Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . . ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B054.70AFD9A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Neil LaBute
I don't remember Moyer saying much of anything at the AML writers conf. panel, which was almost completely dominated by Jongiogi, who I thought was fantastic. I'd interview Jongiorgi, but he's not accomplished enough yet or gotten onto the cultural radar enough yet.
-----Original Message-----
From: Travis K. Manning [mailto:tmanning.eagle@sisna.com]
Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 10:27 AM
To: irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

Isn't Moyer the one that got into the tiff with Dutcher several months back.  Seems to me I remember reading a diary excerpt on Moyer's website that mentions that.  Has Moyer reconciled these differences with Dutcher?  I didn't see Moyer at the AML's recent writer's seminar, but I wonder if he said anything there that could be followed up on.  Or, if there aren't further questions to be gleaned from perusing his website.  I also wonder if Moyer is at any way involved with that new nonprofit started by Jongiorgi and Richard, and how he views other aspects of the growing niche of Mormon film.  It might be interesting to get a standard question in about what are Moyer's all time favorite/least favorite films, in various genres (international, pre-1950, cartoon, romantic comedy, horror, action, Mormon, Jewish, etc.).  Nuts and bolts of screenwriting might be interesting: when he writes, how, why, where, and how much money he makes.  I assume he only writes on the side.  You could run the Whitney quote by him and ask him where our Milton and Shakespeare filmmakers are, are they still in embryo, or have they already begun making films. 
 
Travis
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 8:25 AM
Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

A third piece I wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter John Moyer. I would welcome some questions from people.
 
I also hope we can maybe include some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not going to get involved myself in that area. LaBute gave me a short story to run, not a script excerpt.
-----Original Message-----
From: Travis K. Manning [mailto:tmanning.eagle@sisna.com]
Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 1:23 AM
To: irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

Chris,
 
Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly impressed.
 
Way to go.   For the next issue, I already submitted a memoir piece (nothing related to film).  And, I'm still working through edits with Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on the history of Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA conference in Missoula..
 
I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else has.  I forwarded some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly what it was.  I think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham City by "that MD in Boston," I forget his name.  If that's the case, I don't see a problem with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute can get his critique to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter.  I may end up with a two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on the last a couple months ago.  I have one essay, but I may seek an author to write an opposing piece.  It's just a matter of finding the time to do it all.
 
What else do we have for the film issue?!
 
Very curious,
 
Travis
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM
Subject: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he agreed to do a short review for us.

Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . .

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B054.70AFD9A0-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Gideon Burton Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Date: 21 Nov 2003 16:46:05 -0700 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C3B04E.FB503060 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'd like to reserve the right for the AML board to approve any material from Neil LaBute that we publish in Irreantum as a matter of editorial oversight from AML. =20 LaBute is certainly an appropriate figure to discuss for our publication, but we have got to be careful not to alienate readers or to give the impression that AML is too liberal (or rather, that we are narrowly liberal, if you follow me). I realize that Chris has played fair in selecting across the spectrum of LDS literature for Irreantum pieces, especially recently, but there are genuine problems with LaBute's material, and some strong reasons to avoid even the appearance of being uncritical or just promotional with him and his work.=20 =20 To be plain with my own prejudices (which I invite correction to from those of other viewpoints), I personally consider LaBute to be among those who are happy to exploit a Mormon connection if it works in their favor, but he doesn't blink about violating all kinds of sensibilities in his work, and I perceive in him and his work no fundamental respect for (let alone any loyalty to) Mormonism or Mormon people. Those are not requirements for being featured in our publications, but I do think it an ethical issue if we even indirectly give legitimacy to artists or authors who work by shock and disrespect, who flout both aesthetics and morality. Like his lead character (the cutting edge artist) at the end of The Shape of Things, LaBute flips the bird at his audiences, and to me this is an ethical issue that we should be very careful about. Red flags, not the red carpet, for Brother LaBute.=20 =20 Gideon Gideon O. Burton 3113 JKHB Department of English Brigham Young University Provo, UT 84602 (801) 422-3525 Visit Silva Rhetoricae: The Forest of Rhetoric http://rhetoric.byu.edu =20 The Mormon Literature Database http://MormonLit.lib.byu.edu =20 =20 -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Christopher Bigelow Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 9:26 AM =20 A third piece I wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter John Moyer. I would welcome some questions from people. =20 I also hope we can maybe include some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not going to get involved myself in that area. LaBute gave me a short story to run, not a script excerpt. -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 1:23 AM Chris, =20 Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly impressed. =20 Way to go. For the next issue, I already submitted a memoir piece (nothing related to film). And, I'm still working through edits with Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on the history of Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA conference in Missoula.. =20 I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else has. I forwarded some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly what it was. I think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham City by "that MD in Boston," I forget his name. If that's the case, I don't see a problem with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute can get his critique to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter. I may end up with a two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on the last a couple months ago. I have one essay, but I may seek an author to write an opposing piece. It's just a matter of finding the time to do it all. =20 What else do we have for the film issue?! =20 Very curious, =20 Travis =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM =20 For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he agreed to do a short review for us. Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . .=20 ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C3B04E.FB503060 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Neil LaBute

I’d like to reserve the right = for the AML board to approve any material from Neil LaBute that we publish = in Irreantum as a matter of editorial oversight from AML.

 

LaBute is certainly an appropriate = figure to discuss for our publication, but we have got to be careful not to = alienate readers or to give the impression that AML is too liberal (or rather, = that we are narrowly liberal, if you follow me). I realize that Chris has played = fair in selecting across the spectrum of LDS literature for Irreantum pieces, especially recently, but there are genuine problems with LaBute’s material, and some strong reasons to avoid even the appearance of being uncritical or just promotional with him and his work.

 

To be plain with my own prejudices = (which I invite correction to from those of other viewpoints), I personally = consider LaBute to be among those who are happy to exploit a Mormon connection if = it works in their favor, but he doesn’t blink about violating all = kinds of sensibilities in his work, and I perceive in him and his work no = fundamental respect for (let alone any loyalty to) Mormonism or Mormon people. Those = are not requirements for being featured in our publications, but I do think = it an ethical issue if we even indirectly give legitimacy to artists or = authors who work by shock and disrespect, who flout both aesthetics and morality. = Like his lead character (the cutting edge artist) at the end of The Shape of = Things, LaBute flips the bird at his audiences, and to me this is an ethical = issue that we should be very careful about. Red flags, not the red carpet, for = Brother LaBute.

 

Gideon

Gideon O. Burton
3113 JKHB
Department of English
Brigham Young University
Provo, UT  84602

(801) 422-3525

Visit
Silva Rhetoricae: The Forest of Rhetoric http://rhetoric.byu.edu
The Mormon Literature Database http://MormonLit.lib.byu.edu

 

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com = [mailto:owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Christopher = Bigelow
Sent: Friday, November = 21, 2003 9:26 AM
To: 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com'
Subject: RE: [irr-ed] = Neil LaBute

 

A third piece I wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter John Moyer. I would welcome some = questions from people.

 

I also hope we can maybe include = some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not going to get involved myself in that = area. LaBute gave me a short story to run, not a script = excerpt.

-----Original = Message-----
From: Travis K. Manning [mailto:tmanning.eagle@sisna.com]
Sent: Friday, November = 21, 2003 1:23 AM
To: irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Re: [irr-ed] = Neil LaBute

Chris,

 

Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly = impressed.

 

Way to go.   For the next issue, I already = submitted a memoir piece (nothing related to film).  And, I'm still working = through edits with Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on the = history of Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA conference in = Missoula..

 

I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else has.  I forwarded some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly = what it was.  I think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham = City by "that MD in Boston," I forget his name.  If that's the = case, I don't see a problem with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute = can get his critique to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter.  I may end = up with a two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on = the last a couple months ago.  I have one essay, but I may seek an author to = write an opposing piece.  It's just a matter of finding the time to do it = all.

 

What else do we have for the film issue?!

 

Very curious,

 

Travis

 

----- Original Message -----

Sent: = Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM

Subject: = [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

 

For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview with Neil = LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he agreed to = do a short review for us.

Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . .

------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C3B04E.FB503060-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Travis K. Manning" Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Date: 21 Nov 2003 17:29:45 -0800 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0030_01C3B055.0E570AC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Neil LaButeIn light of Gideon's comments, perhaps we should consider = LaBute's work on the basis of his work, piece by piece, editor by = editor. Who, then, is our audience? I know Gideon may also have some = "constraints," for lack of a better word, as acting AML president, = because he is also a faculty member at BYU. As Irreantum editors, what = exactly are our connections with BYU, official and unofficial? What are = our connections as an LDS literary magazine with our audience? Who is = our audience? What is our purpose? Would publishing LaBute's work = alienate Irreantum from ... who? I guess I'm too unfamiliar with = exactly who is buying Irreantum. Where should Irreantum sit = "politically"? I guess I see us as sitting, aesthetically, at "the = middle of the road," perhaps just tiptoeing on the conservative side of = the pendulum swing. If this is something we agree on, perhaps we should = have several editors review his piece. I know the Board means well, but = I'm wondering if we can't handle this one on our own. Travis ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Gideon Burton=20 To: irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com=20 Cc: aml-board@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 3:46 PM Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute I'd like to reserve the right for the AML board to approve any = material from Neil LaBute that we publish in Irreantum as a matter of = editorial oversight from AML. LaBute is certainly an appropriate figure to discuss for our = publication, but we have got to be careful not to alienate readers or to = give the impression that AML is too liberal (or rather, that we are = narrowly liberal, if you follow me). I realize that Chris has played = fair in selecting across the spectrum of LDS literature for Irreantum = pieces, especially recently, but there are genuine problems with = LaBute's material, and some strong reasons to avoid even the appearance = of being uncritical or just promotional with him and his work.=20 To be plain with my own prejudices (which I invite correction to from = those of other viewpoints), I personally consider LaBute to be among = those who are happy to exploit a Mormon connection if it works in their = favor, but he doesn't blink about violating all kinds of sensibilities = in his work, and I perceive in him and his work no fundamental respect = for (let alone any loyalty to) Mormonism or Mormon people. Those are not = requirements for being featured in our publications, but I do think it = an ethical issue if we even indirectly give legitimacy to artists or = authors who work by shock and disrespect, who flout both aesthetics and = morality. Like his lead character (the cutting edge artist) at the end = of The Shape of Things, LaBute flips the bird at his audiences, and to = me this is an ethical issue that we should be very careful about. Red = flags, not the red carpet, for Brother LaBute.=20 Gideon Gideon O. Burton 3113 JKHB Department of English Brigham Young University Provo, UT 84602 (801) 422-3525 Visit Silva Rhetoricae: The Forest of Rhetoric http://rhetoric.byu.edu The Mormon Literature Database http://MormonLit.lib.byu.edu -----Original Message----- From: owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com = [mailto:owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Christopher = Bigelow Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 9:26 AM To: 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com' Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute A third piece I wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter = John Moyer. I would welcome some questions from people. I also hope we can maybe include some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not = going to get involved myself in that area. LaBute gave me a short story = to run, not a script excerpt. -----Original Message----- From: Travis K. Manning [mailto:tmanning.eagle@sisna.com] Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 1:23 AM To: irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Chris, Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly impressed. Way to go. For the next issue, I already submitted a memoir piece = (nothing related to film). And, I'm still working through edits with = Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on the history of = Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA conference in = Missoula.. I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else has. I forwarded = some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly what it = was. I think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham City by = "that MD in Boston," I forget his name. If that's the case, I don't see = a problem with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute can get his = critique to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter. I may end up with a = two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on the = last a couple months ago. I have one essay, but I may seek an author to = write an opposing piece. It's just a matter of finding the time to do = it all. What else do we have for the film issue?! Very curious, Travis ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Christopher Bigelow=20 To: 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com'=20 Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM Subject: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview = with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he = agreed to do a short review for us. Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . .=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0030_01C3B055.0E570AC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Neil LaBute
In light of Gideon's comments, perhaps we should = consider=20 LaBute's work on the basis of his work, piece by piece, editor by = editor. =20 Who, then, is our audience?  I know Gideon may also have some=20 "constraints," for lack of a better word, as acting AML president, = because=20 he is also a faculty member at BYU.  As Irreantum editors, = what=20 exactly are our connections with BYU, official and unofficial?  = What are=20 our connections as an LDS literary magazine with our audience?  Who = is our=20 audience?  What is our purpose?  Would = publishing=20 LaBute's work alienate Irreantum from ... who?  I guess I'm too = unfamiliar=20 with exactly who is buying Irreantum.  Where should Irreantum sit=20 "politically"?  I guess I see us as = sitting, aesthetically, at=20 "the middle of the road," perhaps just tiptoeing on the = conservative side=20 of the pendulum swing.  If this is something we agree on, perhaps = we should=20 have several editors review his piece.  I know the Board means = well, but=20 I'm wondering if we can't handle this one on our own.
 
Travis
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Gideon=20 Burton
To: irreantum-ed@lists.xmissi= on.com=20
Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 = 3:46=20 PM
Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil = LaBute

I=92d like = to reserve=20 the right for the AML board to approve any material from Neil LaBute = that we=20 publish in Irreantum as a matter of editorial oversight from=20 AML.

 

LaBute is = certainly=20 an appropriate figure to discuss for our publication, but we have got = to be=20 careful not to alienate readers or to give the impression that AML is = too=20 liberal (or rather, that we are narrowly liberal, if you follow me). I = realize=20 that Chris has played fair in selecting across the spectrum of LDS = literature=20 for Irreantum pieces, especially recently, but there are genuine = problems with=20 LaBute=92s material, and some strong reasons to avoid even the = appearance of=20 being uncritical or just promotional with him and his work. =

 

To be plain = with my=20 own prejudices (which I invite correction to from those of other = viewpoints),=20 I personally consider LaBute to be among those who are happy to = exploit a=20 Mormon connection if it works in their favor, but he doesn=92t blink = about=20 violating all kinds of sensibilities in his work, and I perceive in = him and=20 his work no fundamental respect for (let alone any loyalty to) = Mormonism or=20 Mormon people. Those are not requirements for being featured in our=20 publications, but I do think it an ethical issue if we even indirectly = give=20 legitimacy to artists or authors who work by shock and disrespect, who = flout=20 both aesthetics and morality. Like his lead character (the cutting = edge=20 artist) at the end of The Shape of Things, LaBute flips the bird at = his=20 audiences, and to me this is an ethical issue that we should be very = careful=20 about. Red flags, not the red carpet, for Brother LaBute. =

 

Gideon

Gideon O. Burton
3113=20 JKHB
Department of English
Brigham Young University
Provo, = UT =20 84602

(801) 422-3525

Visit
Silva Rhetoricae: The = Forest of=20 Rhetoric http://rhetoric.byu.edu
The=20 Mormon Literature Database http://MormonLit.lib.byu.edu

 

-----Original=20 Message-----
From:=20 owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com=20 [mailto:owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Christopher=20 Bigelow
Sent: = Friday,=20 November 21, 2003 9:26 AM
To:=20 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com'
Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil=20 LaBute

 

A third = piece I=20 wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter John Moyer. I = would=20 welcome some questions from people.

 

I also hope = we can=20 maybe include some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not going to get = involved=20 myself in that area. LaBute gave me a short story to run, not a script = excerpt.

-----Original=20 Message-----
From: Travis=20 K. Manning [mailto:tmanning.eagle@sisna.com]
Sent: Friday, November 21, = 2003 1:23=20 AM
To:=20 irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Neil=20 LaBute

Chris,

 

Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly=20 impressed.

 

Way to go.   For the next = issue, I=20 already submitted a memoir piece (nothing related to film).  = And, I'm=20 still working through edits with Melissa Smith on her piece (20 = pages=20 doublespaced) on the history of Mormon film which she recently = presented at=20 the RMMLA conference in Missoula..

 

I'm very curious to see what pieces = everyone else=20 has.  I forwarded some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't = remember=20 exactly what it was.  I think one of the pieces was a film = review=20 of Brigham City by "that MD in Boston," I forget his name.  If = that's=20 the case, I don't see a problem with two film reviews of the same = film, if=20 LaBute can get his critique to us by deadline, or shortly = thereafter. =20 I may end up with a two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film = moratorium,=20 a topic on the last a couple months ago.  I have one essay, but = I may=20 seek an author to write an opposing piece.  It's just a matter = of=20 finding the time to do it all.

 

What else do we have for the film=20 issue?!

 

Very curious,

 

Travis

 

----- Original = Message -----=20

From: Christopher Bigelow=20

To: 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmi= ssion.com'=20

Sent:=20 Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM

Subject:=20 [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

 

For=20 the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview with = Neil=20 LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he = agreed to=20 do a short review for us.

Next=20 I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . .=20

------=_NextPart_000_0030_01C3B055.0E570AC0-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute, part 2 Date: 21 Nov 2003 23:02:21 -0700 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0BE.317A4F80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" (part 2 of Neil LaBute story) The woman steals another peek at her husband, probably looking for some kind of validation for these latest ponderings. Something. She doesn't get it, though, not yet. Rather, he adjusts the rear view mirror, trying to ward off a pair of piercing headlights that suddenly appear on the horizon behind him. "...she also said, the redhead did, that this is completely typical. The allegations that he's making. It's a common trick that kids of his type do when they're brought back or have to be placed in some other surroundings...it's quite usual for them to say that they've been abused in some way. Sexually, or what have you. I think it's sick and I'm very sorry that you've got to go through this, honey, but she assured me that it happens all the time and that nine times out of ten--actually she said eight, eight times out of ten, but that's a very high number, too--it'll often blow over. Charges dropped, or the kid will say it didn't really happen or that kind of deal. So, no worries. And you know that I believe you, right? You have my complete and utter support...I mean, why would you ever lay a finger on the boy? Some young boy whom we've taken in as our child, our son? I'm aware that people do that, I'm not some naive housewife who only watches Soaps and cooks pot roast, that is not me...I read the paper and see the news and I know it happens, of course it happens, but please. How could he do that? Tell the officer that 'things' of that nature had transpired? It just frightens me, it really does. That he could have been under our roof, eating off of our dinnerware and been harboring a soul like that one. You just never know, do you? No. Never..." A truck zips past and disappears into the murk, causing the car to shudder and swerve toward the shoulder. The man grips the wheel and regains control. Cursing quietly to himself. Afterwards, the woman places a hand on the man's knee and gently toys with the fabric of his Dockers slacks. The man looks over at her for a moment, only turning away when she smiles up at him. She removes her hand slowly from his thigh, in stages. "Well, it doesn't matter...it'll go away and then we'll be right back where we were. All fine and good. Fine and good because we are that ourselves...fine and good people who enjoy a place in the community. We reached out to someone, a young someone who needed us and I have no shame in that. I feel nothing but pride and want to do it again. Do you? Sweetheart? Don't you sense that we should do it again and let everyone know that this boy was a blip on the radar, a kind of, some sort of bad apple in the barrel and we are not the problem. I do. That is exactly how this incident makes me feel and I have always been one to just jump back on the horse and ride. You know I am. ...I even played Joan of Arc once, yes, I did, in a school play. Back in my class like I was telling you about. It's true. I carried this big paper-mache horse around my shoulders on straps and had this cardboard armor on-- I even had my mother cut all my hair shorter, that's how excited I was--and we told the story of that young French girl who became a hero and martyr for her people. I have a photo of it someplace, a snapshot that my uncle took of me...he was always taking pictures of me. My mother's brother. Anyhow, that is what we need to do. We have to get back on up and ride..." The man nods without taking his eyes off the Interstate. There is construction up ahead and he begins the process of slowing, pumping his brakes to let the cars behind him know what's up. The woman spots the nod and runs with it, happy to have some reaction from her man. "That's the spirit...I realize that you were fond of him. Tried to make a life for that child and give him things. Show him how it all worked, being a man. And I in no way hold the gun thing over you, either. Feel that it was your fault for having that pistol in the house--we've already talked about that. It's a very good thing, it just might protect us one day. I agree. So, no. I think we were both...selfless and caring and perfectly in the right to do what we did. Some time back in a boy's home is exactly what he needs right now. Is crying out for, really. He was. Was screaming it out and we just couldn't even see the signs. That's how much we loved him. Loved having him with us. Maybe if he hadn't been crying it out at eighty miles an hour in our Cabriolet, we might've heard him a little better! Right? I think so. It's funny that...I read in a magazine somewhere, one of my many magazines I have--I know, I know, too many--I saw a breakdown of our lives, one of those pie-shaped thingies that takes time and divides it up into sections, and it said that we as a people spend about an eighth of our lives in cars. Yes. In automobiles. Isn't that remarkable? In our own cars, or the cars of others. Loved ones, mostly. Hmmm...maybe that's what he was doing, do you think? Driving like a madman around town because he loved us so much...maybe so. Oh well. It was quite interesting, anyway, when I read it. That article..." The first lights of the city now, in the distance. Like the fine glow of a sandy beach on a tropical night, she thinks, having seen something like it on the television. On one of the many travel shows that she watches religiously. "...and at least none of this has touched us. Right? I mean, the core of that thing which is us. What we have. That's what I'm most thankful for. That you and I, our union, is not sullied by the experience... Am I using that word correctly? 'Sullied?' I believe so...we remain untouched by this nonsense. Without sin, really. And that, in itself, is a blessing... I do have some sense of having done a bad thing, this kind of emotion that I mentioned before. I'm not sure why. The 'lousiness' I spoke of, but I'm sure that will pass. I'm sure. It just comes with the territory...that woman, the one with the red hair, she said that as well. 'This sort of thing comes with the territory.' So, that's a comfort. But the fact that it has in no way chipped away at our, you know--and I'm aware that you think I overdo the word, 'love,' I know that, but--I'm just very happy that it hasn't." She reaches over again and touches him lightly on the trousers. Rubs his leg a bit. Finally, he touches his fingers to hers. Holds them there for a minute before putting his hands firmly back at ten and two. The first of six 'Exit' signs zips by overhead. "Yes, I know...I love you, too. I do, I do. Like Shakespeare said, 'I love thee.' Him or someone like him wrote that, anyway. I do love thee. I don't know, I just don't know...I'm sure he'll be... fine. At least for the night. He's been there before, God help 'em. He certainly knows the routine of that place....and tomorrow we'll call our lawyer, check in with ol' Mr. Thompson, and put an end to all this other garbage in a heartbeat. One single heartbeat and a forty-cent call... Indeed, we will." The blinker begins to flash as the man works his way into the right lane. Slipping in between a Chevette and an older Astro Van. He drifts onto the ramp and heads down toward the stoplight ahead. There is silence for a moment as the woman waits for the signal to change. "...maybe the Germans have it right, after all. Not about...I don't mean in all ways, no, of course not. I certainly don't agree with their, you know, politics...but the car thing, that Auto-bahn they've got there, maybe that's not a bad idea, actually. Perhaps that's the way it should be...all of us, speeding by one another, too quick to stop, too fast to care...just racing along, off on our little journeys and no sense of how dangerous or careless we're being. Because we'd be safe, wouldn't we? Of course we would. Safe inside our bubbles of glass and steel--I suppose it's mostly plastic, now, but, you know what I mean--we'd be sheltered there, in these cars as we moved along. All protected and careening about. Yes. And maybe then we wouldn't hurt so much. Or feel so deeply when we've been betrayed or hurt or lost. Yes. Yes, that might be just the thing. The very thing we need. And to think...it was right there in Germany, all these years...and we never saw it before this. No, we didn't. Not even once..." A green arrow flashes on and the car lurches forward, darting around a slow-moving Cadillac. Disappearing into the haze of the underpass. The red tail lights, like the flaming eyes of an ancient monster, become smaller and smaller and smaller still. And then they are gone, swallowed up by the endless dark of an infinite night. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0BE.317A4F80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Neil LaBute, part 2

(part 2 of Neil LaBute story)

The woman steals another peek at her husband, = probably looking for some kind of validation for these latest = ponderings. Something. She doesn't get it, though, not yet. Rather, he = adjusts the rear view mirror, trying to ward off a pair of piercing = headlights that suddenly appear on the horizon behind him.

"...she also said, the redhead did, that this is = completely typical. The allegations that he's making. It's a common = trick that kids of his type do when they're brought back or have to be = placed in some other surroundings...it's quite usual for them to say = that they've been abused in some way. Sexually, or what have you. I = think it's sick and I'm very sorry that you've got to go through this, = honey, but she assured me that it happens all the time and that nine = times out of ten--actually she said eight, eight times out of ten, but = that's a very high number, too--it'll often blow over. Charges dropped, = or the kid will say it didn't really happen or that kind of deal. So, = no worries. And you know that I believe you, right? You have my = complete and utter support...I mean, why would you ever lay a finger on = the boy? Some young boy whom we've taken in as our child, our son? I'm = aware that people do that, I'm not some naive housewife who only = watches Soaps and cooks pot roast, that is not me...I read the paper = and see the news and I know it happens, of course it happens, but = please. How could he do that? Tell the officer that 'things' of that = nature had transpired? It just frightens me, it really does. That he = could have been under our roof, eating off of our dinnerware and been = harboring a soul like that one. You just never know, do you? No. = Never..."

A truck zips past and disappears into the murk, = causing the car to shudder and swerve toward the shoulder. The man = grips the wheel and regains control. Cursing quietly to himself. = Afterwards, the woman places a hand on the man's knee and gently toys = with the fabric of his Dockers slacks. The man looks over at her for a = moment, only turning away when she smiles up at him. She removes her = hand slowly from his thigh, in stages.

"Well, it doesn't matter...it'll go away and = then we'll be right back where we were. All fine and good. Fine and = good because we are that ourselves...fine and good people who enjoy a = place in the community. We reached out to someone, a young someone who = needed us and I have no shame in that. I feel nothing but pride and = want to do it again. Do you? Sweetheart? Don't you sense that we should = do it again and let everyone know that this boy was a blip on the = radar, a kind of, some sort of bad apple in the barrel and we are not = the problem. I do. That is exactly how this incident makes me feel and = I have always been one to just jump back on the horse and ride. You = know I am. ...I even played Joan of Arc once, yes, I did, in a school = play. Back in my class like I was telling you about. It's true. I = carried this big paper-mache horse around my shoulders on straps and = had this cardboard armor on-- I even had my mother cut all my hair = shorter, that's how excited I was--and we told the story of that young = French girl who became a hero and martyr for her people. I have a photo = of it someplace, a snapshot that my uncle took of me...he was always = taking pictures of me. My mother's brother. Anyhow, that is what we = need to do. We have to get back on up and ride..."

The man nods without taking his eyes off the = Interstate. There is construction up ahead and he begins the process of = slowing, pumping his brakes to let the cars behind him know what's up. = The woman spots the nod and runs with it, happy to have some reaction = from her man.

"That's the spirit...I realize that you were = fond of him. Tried to make a life for that child and give him things. = Show him how it all worked, being a man. And I in no way hold the gun = thing over you, either. Feel that it was your fault for having that = pistol in the house--we've already talked about that. It's a very good = thing, it just might protect us one day. I agree. So, no. I think we = were both...selfless and caring and perfectly in the right to do what = we did. Some time back in a boy's home is exactly what he needs right = now. Is crying out for, really. He was. Was screaming it out and we = just couldn't even see the signs. That's how much we loved him. Loved = having him with us. Maybe if he hadn't been crying it out at eighty = miles an hour in our Cabriolet, we might've heard him a little better! = Right? I think so. It's funny that...I read in a magazine somewhere, = one of my many magazines I have--I know, I know, too many--I saw a = breakdown of our lives, one of those pie-shaped thingies that takes = time and divides it up into sections, and it said that we as a people = spend about an eighth of our lives in cars. Yes. In automobiles. Isn't = that remarkable? In our own cars, or the cars of others. Loved ones, = mostly. Hmmm...maybe that's what he was doing, do you think? Driving = like a madman around town because he loved us so much...maybe so. Oh = well. It was quite interesting, anyway, when I read it. That = article..."

The first lights of the city now, in the distance. = Like the fine glow of a sandy beach on a tropical night, she thinks, = having seen something like it on the television. On one of the many = travel shows that she watches religiously.

"...and at least none of this has touched us. = Right? I mean, the core of that thing which is us. What we have. That's = what I'm most thankful for. That you and I, our union, is not sullied = by the experience... Am I using that word correctly? 'Sullied?' I = believe so...we remain untouched by this nonsense. Without sin, really. = And that, in itself, is a blessing... I do have some sense of having = done a bad thing, this kind of emotion that I mentioned before. I'm not = sure why. The 'lousiness' I spoke of, but I'm sure that will pass. I'm = sure. It just comes with the territory...that woman, the one with the = red hair, she said that as well. 'This sort of thing comes with the = territory.' So, that's a comfort. But the fact that it has in no way = chipped away at our, you know--and I'm aware that you think I overdo = the word, 'love,' I know that, but--I'm just very happy that it = hasn't."

She reaches over again and touches him lightly on the = trousers. Rubs his leg a bit. Finally, he touches his fingers to hers. = Holds them there for a minute before putting his hands firmly back at = ten and two. The first of six 'Exit' signs zips by overhead.

"Yes, I know...I love you, too. I do, I do. Like = Shakespeare said, 'I love thee.' Him or someone like him wrote that, = anyway. I do love thee. I don't know, I just don't know...I'm sure = he'll be... fine. At least for the night. He's been there before, God = help 'em. He certainly knows the routine of that place....and tomorrow = we'll call our lawyer, check in with ol' Mr. Thompson, and put an end = to all this other garbage in a heartbeat. One single heartbeat and a = forty-cent call... Indeed, we will."

The blinker begins to flash as the man works his way = into the right lane. Slipping in between a Chevette and an older Astro = Van. He drifts onto the ramp and heads down toward the stoplight ahead. = There is silence for a moment as the woman waits for the signal to = change.

"...maybe the Germans have it right, after all. = Not about...I don't mean in all ways, no, of course not. I certainly = don't agree with their, you know, politics...but the car thing, that = Auto-bahn they've got there, maybe that's not a bad idea, actually. = Perhaps that's the way it should be...all of us, speeding by one = another, too quick to stop, too fast to care...just racing along, off = on our little journeys and no sense of how dangerous or careless we're = being. Because we'd be safe, wouldn't we? Of course we would. Safe = inside our bubbles of glass and steel--I suppose it's mostly plastic, = now, but, you know what I mean--we'd be sheltered there, in these cars = as we moved along. All protected and careening about. Yes. And maybe = then we wouldn't hurt so much. Or feel so deeply when we've been = betrayed or hurt or lost. Yes. Yes, that might be just the thing. The = very thing we need. And to think...it was right there in Germany, all = these years...and we never saw it before this. No, we didn't. Not even = once..."

A green arrow flashes on and the car lurches forward, = darting around a slow-moving Cadillac. Disappearing into the haze of = the underpass. The red tail lights, like the flaming eyes of an ancient = monster, become smaller and smaller and smaller still. And then they = are gone, swallowed up by the endless dark of an infinite = night.

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0BE.317A4F80-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Date: 21 Nov 2003 23:01:31 -0700 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0BE.13B1CC80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Responding to Gideon, all I know is I get a big kick out of featuring Anita Stansfield and Neil LaBute on our cover within the same year. Maybe we should hold a celebrity death match between those two at our annual meeting. It will be a few weeks before the LaBute interview is typed up and ready for vetting, but I don't remember anything in it that should cause any problem, and I'm certain we'll run it. I really don't get the impression he exploits Mormonism; his only thing with Mormonism in it has been "Bash," and he took out the Mormon elements in the London and NY productions. I think he looks at Mormonism more as a base of sanity from which to write his stuff. A quote: "I follow the school of Flaubert. Live peacefully so you can write savagely." He commented agreeably on the following Eric Samuelsen quote I read to him: "You seem to see little need to dramatically depict characters who seek light and growth and repentance, but you anticipate such growth taking place in the audience." I haven't read his story submission yet, but here it is: AUTOBAHN Author note: it's from a collection of short pieces that take place in automobiles. the umbrella title is "four on the floor," but this particular one is called "autobahn." The headlights poke through the fog, picking out the ragged yellow line up ahead as it loops back and forth through various turns. The man keeps his eyes on the road; he tries the high beams but that only makes it worse. He knew that it would, but he gives it a go anyway. Almost immediately he returns to the standard beams and hunches forward, continuing his vigilance. The woman stares out through the windshield as well, but less worried about the conditions than her husband. She can afford it-she's not driving. After a moment, she begins talking again. Not to him, exactly, but loud enough for him to hear. Certainly with enough volume for that. "...we just keep doing lousy things, I guess. That's what it is. All this lousy stuff that seems to finally catch up with us. Right? I dunno...it's hard not to feel that sometimes, this sense of, you know, regret. Well, maybe not that, maybe not real regret, like we were these Nazi war guards or whatever, hiding out in Nova Scotia and hoping that nobody figured out it was us when they show one of those films on the History Channel...but you see what I'm saying, don't you? 'Course. I'm sure you feel it, too. I think it's just the way it is these days, the whole country is living with this now, a kind of...well, whatever it is. A sickness. Yeah, a sick sort of feeling in your gut that says, "Hey, hello there, what's going on? I got a real ache in here that tells me we're up to no good." Now, that's just me being sort of dramatic about it, but it's like that. A still, small voice of some kind. I took Drama back in school, did I ever mention that? Oh, yes. I was quite the little actress...had the lead in several productions and even sang a bit. Not much of a dancer--I've always thought that was a difficult art, don't you? Dancing--but I was known to carry a tune and could shed a tear on cue. Almost literally, on cue. That's what they call it in the movies...your cue. When it's your turn to do something, and I was able, whether by gift or just practice, I could laugh or cry with the best of 'em. The best of Teddy Roosevelt Junior High, anyway. So, that's why I was doing that...acting out that bit just now." They travel on for a while in silence. The woman glances over at the man, checking on him. Trying to gauge his reaction. Only the constant blinking of his lashes, captured by the milky light from the dashboard, betrays that he is still awake. Watching the road. "Not that I think what we've done is so awful, I mean, on paper. Down on paper you see that people do this type of thing all the time...do it and go on quite happily with their lives. Absolutely true. I mean, it is 'we,' right? You felt the same way about things, I know you did, we talked it through and I think this was a very sensible decision on our part. Almost a sacrifice, really, when you think about it, because for the first few months it seemed like we were all very happy. It felt that way to me, anyhow. As if we were a family and were going to be that way for the rest of our days. Just like you'd see on any channel of the TV. Like on those half-hour comedy shows that they have out now. It felt just like that... But you never know, do you? No, you just never know what is going on inside the heart of a person, you can't really ever be sure. I mean, you look at them, study them at the counter or in the breakfast nook before they head off to school in the morning, but you can't really tell." She drifts for a moment, remembering. His head starts to turn but stops midway through the gesture. He reaches for a cigarette instead and, without asking, fires it up. Flicks the paper match out the slit of an open window. "The first time he smiled at us, on that visit to the agency, do you remember that? I know he was sick, his nose all runny and everything, but it was like baby Jesus beaming up at you...that's what it seemed like to me. Like I was staring down into the manger or something...just brought him this big carton of that stuff they were carrying, the Wise Men--Frankincense, I believe--and there he is, looking up at me with his big blue eyes and letting me know that this is the start of a glorious time. That's what it felt like to me. Now, I know, I know he was older than that, a baby, but I'm saying what it felt like. That was the feeling I got. And, anyway, there aren't any pictures around of the teenage Jesus, so that's all I have to go on. The baby. Well, plus, the older ones, of course. The mature Christ. But he was, wasn't he? He was something almost nearly like that, like the Child himself...he was beautiful. Yes. ...I wonder if Christ really did have the blue eyes...you know, like they depict him on those shows? Hmm. I wonder." The woman glances over at her husband, but he keeps his eyes focused on the business at hand. Guiding their car through the growing mist. He tosses the butt of his Pall Mall out through the same fissure that gobbled up the match. She watches this action, even turns her head to watch the filter as it catches on the edge of the window before being swept away by the breeze. "...I know it's hard, I know that. It is completely hard and I can already feel the void that's there for me...for us. Plus, the money. I'm absolutely aware of that part as well. But I don't think I could've taken another call from his counselor or the police, you know? I really don't think I could. When people start to look at you in the store--and I don't care if it's just Target or not--then it's time to do something. To step up and do what it takes to feel right and safe and like a good citizen. Don't you think? Well, I do. Plus, this car is not made for racing, isn't that what you said? I heard you screaming that at him last time and I agree. This is not some high- performance vehicle that a person can just run up and down the access road like it was one of those deals they've got in Germany. What's it called, with the open, oh, come on, you know...the open speed limit? 'Autobahn.' That's it, an 'Autobahn.' Now, I don't know what that means, exactly, what it would translate to be in normal English, but we are not living near one of those, nor is he old enough to be out doing that. Taking the car out of the garage-- I mean, why don't we just call it what it is, it's stealing, right? Plain and simple--and off joyriding around town. I don't care if he saw it in the movies or his friends put him up to it, which I don't doubt--that older Freeman boy is just an absolute terror--but he can't do that. He had many chances to stop, we gave him, well...nothing but chances, and he just couldn't stop. Couldn't stop going in my purse or calling us names or any of it, for that matter, not in the end. Could he? No...it was just too much. Too, too much and that is not what we signed up for as foster parents. I'm no police woman. I am not Angie Dickenson with a cute haircut and a gun in my bag...I'm a working adult and I don't have time to do that. Be someone's mom. No, I don't mean that, I was his mom, I am, but he just...you know what it is? He was a pusher. He pushed us. Us, and the limits, and anything else he could butt up against. Who knows what his birth parents were like--I have an idea, thank you very much--but he was someone who would just keep on pushing until there was no room... left in the room. I know that seems wrong, using 'room' twice like that in a sentence, but it's what it was like. You know what I'm saying. He left you no space. No room in which to maneuver. Plus, the gun. I mean, my God! Taking a handgun to school, even if it's just to show off to your classmates...that's the end. The complete end and that is that. Even the agency people told us that. I don't know if you heard her, that red-headed one who was in the back office, but she said we did the right thing. She said--if you'll permit me the performance once again-'You two have done the right thing here. Absolutely the right thing.' Looked me dead in the eye as she was issuing our final check and said that, so I felt much better when I heard it. I mean, I felt it, could feel it in my heart, but it's always nice to have it validated. Your instincts. And we can always bring some one else into our home, that's what she told me. We're a level-three on the clearance chart, so we're already set up to do it again, if that's what we want. Maybe a girl this time...wouldn't that be nice? And younger, maybe. That way, if she was a bit younger...we could make a greater impression right up front and then we wouldn't find ourselves in a spot like this." (PART 2 IN next e-mail) ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0BE.13B1CC80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Neil LaBute

Responding to Gideon, all I know is I get a big kick = out of featuring Anita Stansfield and Neil LaBute on our cover within = the same year. Maybe we should hold a celebrity death match between = those two at our annual meeting.

It will be a few weeks before the LaBute interview is = typed up and ready for vetting, but I don't remember anything in it = that should cause any problem, and I'm certain we'll run it. I really = don't get the impression he exploits Mormonism; his only thing with = Mormonism in it has been "Bash," and he took out the Mormon = elements in the London and NY productions. I think he looks at = Mormonism more as a base of sanity from which to write his stuff. A = quote: "I follow the school of Flaubert. Live peacefully so you = can write savagely." He commented agreeably on the following Eric = Samuelsen quote I read to him: "You seem to see little need to = dramatically depict characters who seek light and growth and = repentance, but you anticipate such growth taking place in the = audience."

I haven't read his story submission yet, but here it = is:

AUTOBAHN
Author note: it's from a collection of short pieces = that take place in automobiles. the umbrella title is "four on the = floor," but this particular one is called = "autobahn."

The headlights poke through the fog, picking out the = ragged yellow line up ahead as it loops back and forth through various = turns. The man keeps his eyes on the road; he tries the high beams but = that only makes it worse. He knew that it would, but he gives it a go = anyway. Almost immediately he returns to the standard beams and hunches = forward, continuing his vigilance. The woman stares out through the = windshield as well, but less worried about the conditions than her = husband. She can afford it-she's not driving. After a moment, she = begins talking again. Not to him, exactly, but loud enough for him to = hear. Certainly with enough volume for that.

"...we just keep doing lousy things, I guess. = That's what it is. All this lousy stuff that seems to finally catch up = with us. Right? I dunno...it's hard not to feel that sometimes, this = sense of, you know, regret. Well, maybe not that, maybe not real = regret, like we were these Nazi war guards or whatever, hiding out in = Nova Scotia and hoping that nobody figured out it was us when they show = one of those films on the History Channel...but you see what I'm = saying, don't you? 'Course. I'm sure you feel it, too. I think it's = just the way it is these days, the whole country is living with this = now, a kind of...well, whatever it is. A sickness. Yeah, a sick sort of = feeling in your gut that says, "Hey, hello there, what's going on? = I got a real ache in here that tells me we're up to no good." Now, = that's just me being sort of dramatic about it, but it's like that. A = still, small voice of some kind. I took Drama back in school, did I = ever mention that? Oh, yes. I was quite the little actress...had the = lead in several productions and even sang a bit. Not much of a = dancer--I've always thought that was a difficult art, don't you? = Dancing--but I was known to carry a tune and could shed a tear on cue. = Almost literally, on cue. That's what they call it in the movies...your = cue. When it's your turn to do something, and I was able, whether by = gift or just practice, I could laugh or cry with the best of 'em. The = best of Teddy Roosevelt Junior High, anyway. So, that's why I was doing = that...acting out that bit just now."

They travel on for a while in silence. The woman = glances over at the man, checking on him. Trying to gauge his reaction. = Only the constant blinking of his lashes, captured by the milky light = from the dashboard, betrays that he is still awake. Watching the = road.

"Not that I think what we've done is so awful, I = mean, on paper. Down on paper you see that people do this type of thing = all the time...do it and go on quite happily with their lives. = Absolutely true. I mean, it is 'we,' right? You felt the same way about = things, I know you did, we talked it through and I think this was a = very sensible decision on our part. Almost a sacrifice, really, when = you think about it, because for the first few months it seemed like we = were all very happy. It felt that way to me, anyhow. As if we were a = family and were going to be that way for the rest of our days. Just = like you'd see on any channel of the TV. Like on those half-hour comedy = shows that they have out now. It felt just like that... But you never = know, do you? No, you just never know what is going on inside the heart = of a person, you can't really ever be sure. I mean, you look at them, = study them at the counter or in the breakfast nook before they head off = to school in the morning, but you can't really tell."

She drifts for a moment, remembering. His head starts = to turn but stops midway through the gesture. He reaches for a = cigarette instead and, without asking, fires it up. Flicks the paper = match out the slit of an open window.

"The first time he smiled at us, on that visit = to the agency, do you remember that? I know he was sick, his nose all = runny and everything, but it was like baby Jesus beaming up at = you...that's what it seemed like to me. Like I was staring down into = the manger or something...just brought him this big carton of that = stuff they were carrying, the Wise Men--Frankincense, I believe--and = there he is, looking up at me with his big blue eyes and letting me = know that this is the start of a glorious time. That's what it felt = like to me. Now, I know, I know he was older than that, a baby, but I'm = saying what it felt like. That was the feeling I got. And, anyway, = there aren't any pictures around of the teenage Jesus, so that's all I = have to go on. The baby. Well, plus, the older ones, of course. The = mature Christ. But he was, wasn't he? He was something almost nearly = like that, like the Child himself...he was beautiful. Yes. ...I wonder = if Christ really did have the blue eyes...you know, like they depict = him on those shows? Hmm. I wonder."

The woman glances over at her husband, but he keeps = his eyes focused on the business at hand. Guiding their car through the = growing mist. He tosses the butt of his Pall Mall out through the same = fissure that gobbled up the match. She watches this action, even turns = her head to watch the filter as it catches on the edge of the window = before being swept away by the breeze.

"...I know it's hard, I know that. It is = completely hard and I can already feel the void that's there for = me...for us. Plus, the money. I'm absolutely aware of that part as = well. But I don't think I could've taken another call from his = counselor or the police, you know? I really don't think I could. When = people start to look at you in the store--and I don't care if it's just = Target or not--then it's time to do something. To step up and do what = it takes to feel right and safe and like a good citizen. Don't you = think? Well, I do. Plus, this car is not made for racing, isn't that = what you said? I heard you screaming that at him last time and I agree. = This is not some high- performance vehicle that a person can just run = up and down the access road like it was one of those deals they've got = in Germany. What's it called, with the open, oh, come on, you know...the= open speed limit? 'Autobahn.' That's it, an 'Autobahn.' Now, I don't = know what that means, exactly, what it would translate to be in normal = English, but we are not living near one of those, nor is he old enough = to be out doing that. Taking the car out of the garage-- I mean, why = don't we just call it what it is, it's stealing, right? Plain and = simple--and off joyriding around town. I don't care if he saw it in the = movies or his friends put him up to it, which I don't doubt--that older = Freeman boy is just an absolute terror--but he can't do that. He had = many chances to stop, we gave him, well...nothing but chances, and he = just couldn't stop. Couldn't stop going in my purse or calling us names = or any of it, for that matter, not in the end. Could he? No...it was = just too much. Too, too much and that is not what we signed up for as = foster parents. I'm no police woman. I am not Angie Dickenson with a = cute haircut and a gun in my bag...I'm a working adult and I don't have = time to do that. Be someone's mom. No, I don't mean that, I was his = mom, I am, but he just...you know what it is? He was a pusher. He = pushed us. Us, and the limits, and anything else he could butt up = against. Who knows what his birth parents were like--I have an idea, = thank you very much--but he was someone who would just keep on pushing = until there was no room... left in the room. I know that seems wrong, = using 'room' twice like that in a sentence, but it's what it was like. = You know what I'm saying. He left you no space. No room in which to = maneuver. Plus, the gun. I mean, my God! Taking a handgun to school, = even if it's just to show off to your classmates...that's the end. The = complete end and that is that. Even the agency people told us that. I = don't know if you heard her, that red-headed one who was in the back = office, but she said we did the right thing. She said--if you'll permit = me the performance once again-'You two have done the right thing here. = Absolutely the right thing.' Looked me dead in the eye as she was = issuing our final check and said that, so I felt much better when I = heard it. I mean, I felt it, could feel it in my heart, but it's always = nice to have it validated. Your instincts. And we can always bring some = one else into our home, that's what she told me. We're a level-three on = the clearance chart, so we're already set up to do it again, if that's = what we want. Maybe a girl this time...wouldn't that be nice? And = younger, maybe. That way, if she was a bit younger...we could make a = greater impression right up front and then we wouldn't find ourselves = in a spot like this."

(PART 2 IN next e-mail)
   =20

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0BE.13B1CC80-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Date: 21 Nov 2003 23:42:05 -0700 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0C3.BE5293E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Responding to Gideon, all I know is I get a big kick out of featuring Anita Stansfield and Neil LaBute on our cover within the same year. Maybe we should hold a celebrity death match between those two at our annual meeting. It will be a few weeks before the LaBute interview is typed up and ready for vetting, but I don't remember anything in it that should cause any problem, and I'm certain we'll run it. I really don't get the impression he exploits Mormonism; his only thing with Mormonism in it has been "Bash," and he took out the Mormon elements in the London and NY productions. I think he looks at Mormonism more as a base of sanity from which to write his stuff. A quote: "I follow the school of Flaubert. Live peacefully so you can write savagely." He commented agreeably on the following Eric Samuelsen quote I read to him: "You seem to see little need to dramatically depict characters who seek light and growth and repentance, but you anticipate such growth taking place in the audience." I haven't read his story submission yet, but here it is: AUTOBAHN Author note: it's from a collection of short pieces that take place in automobiles. the umbrella title is "four on the floor," but this particular one is called "autobahn." The headlights poke through the fog, picking out the ragged yellow line up ahead as it loops back and forth through various turns. The man keeps his eyes on the road; he tries the high beams but that only makes it worse. He knew that it would, but he gives it a go anyway. Almost immediately he returns to the standard beams and hunches forward, continuing his vigilance. The woman stares out through the windshield as well, but less worried about the conditions than her husband. She can afford it-she's not driving. After a moment, she begins talking again. Not to him, exactly, but loud enough for him to hear. Certainly with enough volume for that. "...we just keep doing lousy things, I guess. That's what it is. All this lousy stuff that seems to finally catch up with us. Right? I dunno...it's hard not to feel that sometimes, this sense of, you know, regret. Well, maybe not that, maybe not real regret, like we were these Nazi war guards or whatever, hiding out in Nova Scotia and hoping that nobody figured out it was us when they show one of those films on the History Channel...but you see what I'm saying, don't you? 'Course. I'm sure you feel it, too. I think it's just the way it is these days, the whole country is living with this now, a kind of...well, whatever it is. A sickness. Yeah, a sick sort of feeling in your gut that says, "Hey, hello there, what's going on? I got a real ache in here that tells me we're up to no good." Now, that's just me being sort of dramatic about it, but it's like that. A still, small voice of some kind. I took Drama back in school, did I ever mention that? Oh, yes. I was quite the little actress...had the lead in several productions and even sang a bit. Not much of a dancer--I've always thought that was a difficult art, don't you? Dancing--but I was known to carry a tune and could shed a tear on cue. Almost literally, on cue. That's what they call it in the movies...your cue. When it's your turn to do something, and I was able, whether by gift or just practice, I could laugh or cry with the best of 'em. The best of Teddy Roosevelt Junior High, anyway. So, that's why I was doing that...acting out that bit just now." They travel on for a while in silence. The woman glances over at the man, checking on him. Trying to gauge his reaction. Only the constant blinking of his lashes, captured by the milky light from the dashboard, betrays that he is still awake. Watching the road. "Not that I think what we've done is so awful, I mean, on paper. Down on paper you see that people do this type of thing all the time...do it and go on quite happily with their lives. Absolutely true. I mean, it is 'we,' right? You felt the same way about things, I know you did, we talked it through and I think this was a very sensible decision on our part. Almost a sacrifice, really, when you think about it, because for the first few months it seemed like we were all very happy. It felt that way to me, anyhow. As if we were a family and were going to be that way for the rest of our days. Just like you'd see on any channel of the TV. Like on those half-hour comedy shows that they have out now. It felt just like that... But you never know, do you? No, you just never know what is going on inside the heart of a person, you can't really ever be sure. I mean, you look at them, study them at the counter or in the breakfast nook before they head off to school in the morning, but you can't really tell." She drifts for a moment, remembering. His head starts to turn but stops midway through the gesture. He reaches for a cigarette instead and, without asking, fires it up. Flicks the paper match out the slit of an open window. "The first time he smiled at us, on that visit to the agency, do you remember that? I know he was sick, his nose all runny and everything, but it was like baby Jesus beaming up at you...that's what it seemed like to me. Like I was staring down into the manger or something...just brought him this big carton of that stuff they were carrying, the Wise Men--Frankincense, I believe--and there he is, looking up at me with his big blue eyes and letting me know that this is the start of a glorious time. That's what it felt like to me. Now, I know, I know he was older than that, a baby, but I'm saying what it felt like. That was the feeling I got. And, anyway, there aren't any pictures around of the teenage Jesus, so that's all I have to go on. The baby. Well, plus, the older ones, of course. The mature Christ. But he was, wasn't he? He was something almost nearly like that, like the Child himself...he was beautiful. Yes. ...I wonder if Christ really did have the blue eyes...you know, like they depict him on those shows? Hmm. I wonder." The woman glances over at her husband, but he keeps his eyes focused on the business at hand. Guiding their car through the growing mist. He tosses the butt of his Pall Mall out through the same fissure that gobbled up the match. She watches this action, even turns her head to watch the filter as it catches on the edge of the window before being swept away by the breeze. "...I know it's hard, I know that. It is completely hard and I can already feel the void that's there for me...for us. Plus, the money. I'm absolutely aware of that part as well. But I don't think I could've taken another call from his counselor or the police, you know? I really don't think I could. When people start to look at you in the store--and I don't care if it's just Target or not--then it's time to do something. To step up and do what it takes to feel right and safe and like a good citizen. Don't you think? Well, I do. Plus, this car is not made for racing, isn't that what you said? I heard you screaming that at him last time and I agree. This is not some high- performance vehicle that a person can just run up and down the access road like it was one of those deals they've got in Germany. What's it called, with the open, oh, come on, you know...the open speed limit? 'Autobahn.' That's it, an 'Autobahn.' Now, I don't know what that means, exactly, what it would translate to be in normal English, but we are not living near one of those, nor is he old enough to be out doing that. Taking the car out of the garage-- I mean, why don't we just call it what it is, it's stealing, right? Plain and simple--and off joyriding around town. I don't care if he saw it in the movies or his friends put him up to it, which I don't doubt--that older Freeman boy is just an absolute terror--but he can't do that. He had many chances to stop, we gave him, well...nothing but chances, and he just couldn't stop. Couldn't stop going in my purse or calling us names or any of it, for that matter, not in the end. Could he? No...it was just too much. Too, too much and that is not what we signed up for as foster parents. I'm no police woman. I am not Angie Dickenson with a cute haircut and a gun in my bag...I'm a working adult and I don't have time to do that. Be someone's mom. No, I don't mean that, I was his mom, I am, but he just...you know what it is? He was a pusher. He pushed us. Us, and the limits, and anything else he could butt up against. Who knows what his birth parents were like--I have an idea, thank you very much--but he was someone who would just keep on pushing until there was no room... left in the room. I know that seems wrong, using 'room' twice like that in a sentence, but it's what it was like. You know what I'm saying. He left you no space. No room in which to maneuver. Plus, the gun. I mean, my God! Taking a handgun to school, even if it's just to show off to your classmates...that's the end. The complete end and that is that. Even the agency people told us that. I don't know if you heard her, that red-headed one who was in the back office, but she said we did the right thing. She said--if you'll permit me the performance once again-'You two have done the right thing here. Absolutely the right thing.' Looked me dead in the eye as she was issuing our final check and said that, so I felt much better when I heard it. I mean, I felt it, could feel it in my heart, but it's always nice to have it validated. Your instincts. And we can always bring some one else into our home, that's what she told me. We're a level-three on the clearance chart, so we're already set up to do it again, if that's what we want. Maybe a girl this time...wouldn't that be nice? And younger, maybe. That way, if she was a bit younger...we could make a greater impression right up front and then we wouldn't find ourselves in a spot like this." (PART 2 IN next e-mail) ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0C3.BE5293E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Neil LaBute

Responding to Gideon, all I know is I get a big kick out of featuring
Anita Stansfield and Neil LaBute on our cover within the same year.
Maybe we should hold a celebrity death match between those two at our
annual meeting.

It will be a few weeks before the LaBute interview is typed up and ready
for vetting, but I don't remember anything in it that should cause any
problem, and I'm certain we'll run it. I really don't get the impression
he exploits Mormonism; his only thing with Mormonism in it has been
"Bash," and he took out the Mormon elements in the London and NY
productions. I think he looks at Mormonism more as a base of sanity from
which to write his stuff. A quote: "I follow the school of Flaubert.
Live peacefully so you can write savagely." He commented agreeably on
the following Eric Samuelsen quote I read to him: "You seem to see
little need to dramatically depict characters who seek light and growth
and repentance, but you anticipate such growth taking place in the
audience."

I haven't read his story submission yet, but here it is:

AUTOBAHN
Author note: it's from a collection of short pieces that take place in
automobiles. the umbrella title is "four on the floor," but this
particular one is called "autobahn."

The headlights poke through the fog, picking out the ragged yellow line
up ahead as it loops back and forth through various turns. The man keeps
his eyes on the road; he tries the high beams but that only makes it
worse. He knew that it would, but he gives it a go anyway. Almost
immediately he returns to the standard beams and hunches forward,
continuing his vigilance. The woman stares out through the windshield as
well, but less worried about the conditions than her husband. She can
afford it-she's not driving. After a moment, she begins talking again.
Not to him, exactly, but loud enough for him to hear. Certainly with
enough volume for that.

"...we just keep doing lousy things, I guess. That's what it is. All
this lousy stuff that seems to finally catch up with us. Right? I
dunno...it's hard not to feel that sometimes, this sense of, you know,
regret. Well, maybe not that, maybe not real regret, like we were these
Nazi war guards or whatever, hiding out in Nova Scotia and hoping that
nobody figured out it was us when they show one of those films on the
History Channel...but you see what I'm saying, don't you? 'Course. I'm
sure you feel it, too. I think it's just the way it is these days, the
whole country is living with this now, a kind of...well, whatever it is.
A sickness. Yeah, a sick sort of feeling in your gut that says, "Hey,
hello there, what's going on? I got a real ache in here that tells me
we're up to no good." Now, that's just me being sort of dramatic about
it, but it's like that. A still, small voice of some kind. I took Drama
back in school, did I ever mention that? Oh, yes. I was quite the little
actress...had the lead in several productions and even sang a bit. Not
much of a dancer--I've always thought that was a difficult art, don't
you? Dancing--but I was known to carry a tune and could shed a tear on
cue. Almost literally, on cue. That's what they call it in the
movies...your cue. When it's your turn to do something, and I was able,
whether by gift or just practice, I could laugh or cry with the best of
'em. The best of Teddy Roosevelt Junior High, anyway. So, that's why I
was doing that...acting out that bit just now."

They travel on for a while in silence. The woman glances over at the
man, checking on him. Trying to gauge his reaction. Only the constant
blinking of his lashes, captured by the milky light from the dashboard,
betrays that he is still awake. Watching the road.

"Not that I think what we've done is so awful, I mean, on paper. Down on
paper you see that people do this type of thing all the time...do it and
go on quite happily with their lives. Absolutely true. I mean, it is
'we,' right? You felt the same way about things, I know you did, we
talked it through and I think this was a very sensible decision on our
part. Almost a sacrifice, really, when you think about it, because for
the first few months it seemed like we were all very happy. It felt that
way to me, anyhow. As if we were a family and were going to be that way
for the rest of our days. Just like you'd see on any channel of the TV.
Like on those half-hour comedy shows that they have out now. It felt
just like that... But you never know, do you? No, you just never know
what is going on inside the heart of a person, you can't really ever be
sure. I mean, you look at them, study them at the counter or in the
breakfast nook before they head off to school in the morning, but you
can't really tell."

She drifts for a moment, remembering. His head starts to turn but stops
midway through the gesture. He reaches for a cigarette instead and,
without asking, fires it up. Flicks the paper match out the slit of an
open window.

"The first time he smiled at us, on that visit to the agency, do you
remember that? I know he was sick, his nose all runny and everything,
but it was like baby Jesus beaming up at you...that's what it seemed
like to me. Like I was staring down into the manger or something...just
brought him this big carton of that stuff they were carrying, the Wise
Men--Frankincense, I believe--and there he is, looking up at me with his
big blue eyes and letting me know that this is the start of a glorious
time. That's what it felt like to me. Now, I know, I know he was older
than that, a baby, but I'm saying what it felt like. That was the
feeling I got. And, anyway, there aren't any pictures around of the
teenage Jesus, so that's all I have to go on. The baby. Well, plus, the
older ones, of course. The mature Christ. But he was, wasn't he? He was
something almost nearly like that, like the Child himself...he was
beautiful. Yes. ...I wonder if Christ really did have the blue
eyes...you know, like they depict him on those shows? Hmm. I wonder."

The woman glances over at her husband, but he keeps his eyes focused on
the business at hand. Guiding their car through the growing mist. He
tosses the butt of his Pall Mall out through the same fissure that
gobbled up the match. She watches this action, even turns her head to
watch the filter as it catches on the edge of the window before being
swept away by the breeze.

"...I know it's hard, I know that. It is completely hard and I can
already feel the void that's there for me...for us. Plus, the money. I'm
absolutely aware of that part as well. But I don't think I could've
taken another call from his counselor or the police, you know? I really
don't think I could. When people start to look at you in the store--and
I don't care if it's just Target or not--then it's time to do something.
To step up and do what it takes to feel right and safe and like a good
citizen. Don't you think? Well, I do. Plus, this car is not made for
racing, isn't that what you said? I heard you screaming that at him last
time and I agree. This is not some high- performance vehicle that a
person can just run up and down the access road like it was one of those
deals they've got in Germany. What's it called, with the open, oh, come
on, you know...the open speed limit? 'Autobahn.' That's it, an
'Autobahn.' Now, I don't know what that means, exactly, what it would
translate to be in normal English, but we are not living near one of
those, nor is he old enough to be out doing that. Taking the car out of
the garage-- I mean, why don't we just call it what it is, it's
stealing, right? Plain and simple--and off joyriding around town. I
don't care if he saw it in the movies or his friends put him up to it,
which I don't doubt--that older Freeman boy is just an absolute
terror--but he can't do that. He had many chances to stop, we gave him,
well...nothing but chances, and he just couldn't stop. Couldn't stop
going in my purse or calling us names or any of it, for that matter, not
in the end. Could he? No...it was just too much. Too, too much and that
is not what we signed up for as foster parents. I'm no police woman. I
am not Angie Dickenson with a cute haircut and a gun in my bag...I'm a
working adult and I don't have time to do that. Be someone's mom. No, I
don't mean that, I was his mom, I am, but he just...you know what it is?
He was a pusher. He pushed us. Us, and the limits, and anything else he
could butt up against. Who knows what his birth parents were like--I
have an idea, thank you very much--but he was someone who would just
keep on pushing until there was no room... left in the room. I know that
seems wrong, using 'room' twice like that in a sentence, but it's what
it was like. You know what I'm saying. He left you no space. No room in
which to maneuver. Plus, the gun. I mean, my God! Taking a handgun to
school, even if it's just to show off to your classmates...that's the
end. The complete end and that is that. Even the agency people told us
that. I don't know if you heard her, that red-headed one who was in the
back office, but she said we did the right thing. She said--if you'll
permit me the performance once again-'You two have done the right thing
here. Absolutely the right thing.' Looked me dead in the eye as she was
issuing our final check and said that, so I felt much better when I
heard it. I mean, I felt it, could feel it in my heart, but it's always
nice to have it validated. Your instincts. And we can always bring some
one else into our home, that's what she told me. We're a level-three on
the clearance chart, so we're already set up to do it again, if that's
what we want. Maybe a girl this time...wouldn't that be nice? And
younger, maybe. That way, if she was a bit younger...we could make a
greater impression right up front and then we wouldn't find ourselves in
a spot like this."

(PART 2 IN next e-mail)
   

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0C3.BE5293E0-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute, part 2 Date: 21 Nov 2003 23:43:18 -0700 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0C3.E9E13E30 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" (part 2 of Neil LaBute story) The woman steals another peek at her husband, probably looking for some kind of validation for these latest ponderings. Something. She doesn't get it, though, not yet. Rather, he adjusts the rear view mirror, trying to ward off a pair of piercing headlights that suddenly appear on the horizon behind him. "...she also said, the redhead did, that this is completely typical. The allegations that he's making. It's a common trick that kids of his type do when they're brought back or have to be placed in some other surroundings...it's quite usual for them to say that they've been abused in some way. Sexually, or what have you. I think it's sick and I'm very sorry that you've got to go through this, honey, but she assured me that it happens all the time and that nine times out of ten--actually she said eight, eight times out of ten, but that's a very high number, too--it'll often blow over. Charges dropped, or the kid will say it didn't really happen or that kind of deal. So, no worries. And you know that I believe you, right? You have my complete and utter support...I mean, why would you ever lay a finger on the boy? Some young boy whom we've taken in as our child, our son? I'm aware that people do that, I'm not some naive housewife who only watches Soaps and cooks pot roast, that is not me...I read the paper and see the news and I know it happens, of course it happens, but please. How could he do that? Tell the officer that 'things' of that nature had transpired? It just frightens me, it really does. That he could have been under our roof, eating off of our dinnerware and been harboring a soul like that one. You just never know, do you? No. Never..." A truck zips past and disappears into the murk, causing the car to shudder and swerve toward the shoulder. The man grips the wheel and regains control. Cursing quietly to himself. Afterwards, the woman places a hand on the man's knee and gently toys with the fabric of his Dockers slacks. The man looks over at her for a moment, only turning away when she smiles up at him. She removes her hand slowly from his thigh, in stages. "Well, it doesn't matter...it'll go away and then we'll be right back where we were. All fine and good. Fine and good because we are that ourselves...fine and good people who enjoy a place in the community. We reached out to someone, a young someone who needed us and I have no shame in that. I feel nothing but pride and want to do it again. Do you? Sweetheart? Don't you sense that we should do it again and let everyone know that this boy was a blip on the radar, a kind of, some sort of bad apple in the barrel and we are not the problem. I do. That is exactly how this incident makes me feel and I have always been one to just jump back on the horse and ride. You know I am. ...I even played Joan of Arc once, yes, I did, in a school play. Back in my class like I was telling you about. It's true. I carried this big paper-mache horse around my shoulders on straps and had this cardboard armor on-- I even had my mother cut all my hair shorter, that's how excited I was--and we told the story of that young French girl who became a hero and martyr for her people. I have a photo of it someplace, a snapshot that my uncle took of me...he was always taking pictures of me. My mother's brother. Anyhow, that is what we need to do. We have to get back on up and ride..." The man nods without taking his eyes off the Interstate. There is construction up ahead and he begins the process of slowing, pumping his brakes to let the cars behind him know what's up. The woman spots the nod and runs with it, happy to have some reaction from her man. "That's the spirit...I realize that you were fond of him. Tried to make a life for that child and give him things. Show him how it all worked, being a man. And I in no way hold the gun thing over you, either. Feel that it was your fault for having that pistol in the house--we've already talked about that. It's a very good thing, it just might protect us one day. I agree. So, no. I think we were both...selfless and caring and perfectly in the right to do what we did. Some time back in a boy's home is exactly what he needs right now. Is crying out for, really. He was. Was screaming it out and we just couldn't even see the signs. That's how much we loved him. Loved having him with us. Maybe if he hadn't been crying it out at eighty miles an hour in our Cabriolet, we might've heard him a little better! Right? I think so. It's funny that...I read in a magazine somewhere, one of my many magazines I have--I know, I know, too many--I saw a breakdown of our lives, one of those pie-shaped thingies that takes time and divides it up into sections, and it said that we as a people spend about an eighth of our lives in cars. Yes. In automobiles. Isn't that remarkable? In our own cars, or the cars of others. Loved ones, mostly. Hmmm...maybe that's what he was doing, do you think? Driving like a madman around town because he loved us so much...maybe so. Oh well. It was quite interesting, anyway, when I read it. That article..." The first lights of the city now, in the distance. Like the fine glow of a sandy beach on a tropical night, she thinks, having seen something like it on the television. On one of the many travel shows that she watches religiously. "...and at least none of this has touched us. Right? I mean, the core of that thing which is us. What we have. That's what I'm most thankful for. That you and I, our union, is not sullied by the experience... Am I using that word correctly? 'Sullied?' I believe so...we remain untouched by this nonsense. Without sin, really. And that, in itself, is a blessing... I do have some sense of having done a bad thing, this kind of emotion that I mentioned before. I'm not sure why. The 'lousiness' I spoke of, but I'm sure that will pass. I'm sure. It just comes with the territory...that woman, the one with the red hair, she said that as well. 'This sort of thing comes with the territory.' So, that's a comfort. But the fact that it has in no way chipped away at our, you know--and I'm aware that you think I overdo the word, 'love,' I know that, but--I'm just very happy that it hasn't." She reaches over again and touches him lightly on the trousers. Rubs his leg a bit. Finally, he touches his fingers to hers. Holds them there for a minute before putting his hands firmly back at ten and two. The first of six 'Exit' signs zips by overhead. "Yes, I know...I love you, too. I do, I do. Like Shakespeare said, 'I love thee.' Him or someone like him wrote that, anyway. I do love thee. I don't know, I just don't know...I'm sure he'll be... fine. At least for the night. He's been there before, God help 'em. He certainly knows the routine of that place....and tomorrow we'll call our lawyer, check in with ol' Mr. Thompson, and put an end to all this other garbage in a heartbeat. One single heartbeat and a forty-cent call... Indeed, we will." The blinker begins to flash as the man works his way into the right lane. Slipping in between a Chevette and an older Astro Van. He drifts onto the ramp and heads down toward the stoplight ahead. There is silence for a moment as the woman waits for the signal to change. "...maybe the Germans have it right, after all. Not about...I don't mean in all ways, no, of course not. I certainly don't agree with their, you know, politics...but the car thing, that Auto-bahn they've got there, maybe that's not a bad idea, actually. Perhaps that's the way it should be...all of us, speeding by one another, too quick to stop, too fast to care...just racing along, off on our little journeys and no sense of how dangerous or careless we're being. Because we'd be safe, wouldn't we? Of course we would. Safe inside our bubbles of glass and steel--I suppose it's mostly plastic, now, but, you know what I mean--we'd be sheltered there, in these cars as we moved along. All protected and careening about. Yes. And maybe then we wouldn't hurt so much. Or feel so deeply when we've been betrayed or hurt or lost. Yes. Yes, that might be just the thing. The very thing we need. And to think...it was right there in Germany, all these years...and we never saw it before this. No, we didn't. Not even once..." A green arrow flashes on and the car lurches forward, darting around a slow-moving Cadillac. Disappearing into the haze of the underpass. The red tail lights, like the flaming eyes of an ancient monster, become smaller and smaller and smaller still. And then they are gone, swallowed up by the endless dark of an infinite night. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0C3.E9E13E30 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Neil LaBute, part 2

(part 2 of Neil LaBute story)

The woman steals another peek at her husband, probably looking for some
kind of validation for these latest ponderings. Something. She doesn't
get it, though, not yet. Rather, he adjusts the rear view mirror, trying
to ward off a pair of piercing headlights that suddenly appear on the
horizon behind him.

"...she also said, the redhead did, that this is completely typical. The
allegations that he's making. It's a common trick that kids of his type
do when they're brought back or have to be placed in some other
surroundings...it's quite usual for them to say that they've been abused
in some way. Sexually, or what have you. I think it's sick and I'm very
sorry that you've got to go through this, honey, but she assured me that
it happens all the time and that nine times out of ten--actually she
said eight, eight times out of ten, but that's a very high number,
too--it'll often blow over. Charges dropped, or the kid will say it
didn't really happen or that kind of deal. So, no worries. And you know
that I believe you, right? You have my complete and utter support...I
mean, why would you ever lay a finger on the boy? Some young boy whom
we've taken in as our child, our son? I'm aware that people do that, I'm
not some naive housewife who only watches Soaps and cooks pot roast,
that is not me...I read the paper and see the news and I know it
happens, of course it happens, but please. How could he do that? Tell
the officer that 'things' of that nature had transpired? It just
frightens me, it really does. That he could have been under our roof,
eating off of our dinnerware and been harboring a soul like that one.
You just never know, do you? No. Never..."

A truck zips past and disappears into the murk, causing the car to
shudder and swerve toward the shoulder. The man grips the wheel and
regains control. Cursing quietly to himself. Afterwards, the woman
places a hand on the man's knee and gently toys with the fabric of his
Dockers slacks. The man looks over at her for a moment, only turning
away when she smiles up at him. She removes her hand slowly from his
thigh, in stages.

"Well, it doesn't matter...it'll go away and then we'll be right back
where we were. All fine and good. Fine and good because we are that
ourselves...fine and good people who enjoy a place in the community. We
reached out to someone, a young someone who needed us and I have no
shame in that. I feel nothing but pride and want to do it again. Do you?
Sweetheart? Don't you sense that we should do it again and let everyone
know that this boy was a blip on the radar, a kind of, some sort of bad
apple in the barrel and we are not the problem. I do. That is exactly
how this incident makes me feel and I have always been one to just jump
back on the horse and ride. You know I am. ...I even played Joan of Arc
once, yes, I did, in a school play. Back in my class like I was telling
you about. It's true. I carried this big paper-mache horse around my
shoulders on straps and had this cardboard armor on-- I even had my
mother cut all my hair shorter, that's how excited I was--and we told
the story of that young French girl who became a hero and martyr for her
people. I have a photo of it someplace, a snapshot that my uncle took of
me...he was always taking pictures of me. My mother's brother. Anyhow,
that is what we need to do. We have to get back on up and ride..."

The man nods without taking his eyes off the Interstate. There is
construction up ahead and he begins the process of slowing, pumping his
brakes to let the cars behind him know what's up. The woman spots the
nod and runs with it, happy to have some reaction from her man.

"That's the spirit...I realize that you were fond of him. Tried to make
a life for that child and give him things. Show him how it all worked,
being a man. And I in no way hold the gun thing over you, either. Feel
that it was your fault for having that pistol in the house--we've
already talked about that. It's a very good thing, it just might protect
us one day. I agree. So, no. I think we were both...selfless and caring
and perfectly in the right to do what we did. Some time back in a boy's
home is exactly what he needs right now. Is crying out for, really. He
was. Was screaming it out and we just couldn't even see the signs.
That's how much we loved him. Loved having him with us. Maybe if he
hadn't been crying it out at eighty miles an hour in our Cabriolet, we
might've heard him a little better! Right? I think so. It's funny
that...I read in a magazine somewhere, one of my many magazines I
have--I know, I know, too many--I saw a breakdown of our lives, one of
those pie-shaped thingies that takes time and divides it up into
sections, and it said that we as a people spend about an eighth of our
lives in cars. Yes. In automobiles. Isn't that remarkable? In our own
cars, or the cars of others. Loved ones, mostly. Hmmm...maybe that's
what he was doing, do you think? Driving like a madman around town
because he loved us so much...maybe so. Oh well. It was quite
interesting, anyway, when I read it. That article..."

The first lights of the city now, in the distance. Like the fine glow of
a sandy beach on a tropical night, she thinks, having seen something
like it on the television. On one of the many travel shows that she
watches religiously.

"...and at least none of this has touched us. Right? I mean, the core of
that thing which is us. What we have. That's what I'm most thankful for.
That you and I, our union, is not sullied by the experience... Am I
using that word correctly? 'Sullied?' I believe so...we remain untouched
by this nonsense. Without sin, really. And that, in itself, is a
blessing... I do have some sense of having done a bad thing, this kind
of emotion that I mentioned before. I'm not sure why. The 'lousiness' I
spoke of, but I'm sure that will pass. I'm sure. It just comes with the
territory...that woman, the one with the red hair, she said that as
well. 'This sort of thing comes with the territory.' So, that's a
comfort. But the fact that it has in no way chipped away at our, you
know--and I'm aware that you think I overdo the word, 'love,' I know
that, but--I'm just very happy that it hasn't."

She reaches over again and touches him lightly on the trousers. Rubs his
leg a bit. Finally, he touches his fingers to hers. Holds them there for
a minute before putting his hands firmly back at ten and two. The first
of six 'Exit' signs zips by overhead.

"Yes, I know...I love you, too. I do, I do. Like Shakespeare said, 'I
love thee.' Him or someone like him wrote that, anyway. I do love thee.
I don't know, I just don't know...I'm sure he'll be... fine. At least
for the night. He's been there before, God help 'em. He certainly knows
the routine of that place....and tomorrow we'll call our lawyer, check
in with ol' Mr. Thompson, and put an end to all this other garbage in a
heartbeat. One single heartbeat and a forty-cent call... Indeed, we
will."

The blinker begins to flash as the man works his way into the right
lane. Slipping in between a Chevette and an older Astro Van. He drifts
onto the ramp and heads down toward the stoplight ahead. There is
silence for a moment as the woman waits for the signal to change.

"...maybe the Germans have it right, after all. Not about...I don't mean
in all ways, no, of course not. I certainly don't agree with their, you
know, politics...but the car thing, that Auto-bahn they've got there,
maybe that's not a bad idea, actually. Perhaps that's the way it should
be...all of us, speeding by one another, too quick to stop, too fast to
care...just racing along, off on our little journeys and no sense of how
dangerous or careless we're being. Because we'd be safe, wouldn't we? Of
course we would. Safe inside our bubbles of glass and steel--I suppose
it's mostly plastic, now, but, you know what I mean--we'd be sheltered
there, in these cars as we moved along. All protected and careening
about. Yes. And maybe then we wouldn't hurt so much. Or feel so deeply
when we've been betrayed or hurt or lost. Yes. Yes, that might be just
the thing. The very thing we need. And to think...it was right there in
Germany, all these years...and we never saw it before this. No, we
didn't. Not even once..."

A green arrow flashes on and the car lurches forward, darting around a
slow-moving Cadillac. Disappearing into the haze of the underpass. The
red tail lights, like the flaming eyes of an ancient monster, become
smaller and smaller and smaller still. And then they are gone, swallowed
up by the endless dark of an infinite night.

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0C3.E9E13E30-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [irr-ed] Our audience Date: 21 Nov 2003 23:48:28 -0700 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0C4.A287E740 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Responding to Travis, following is a list of the 375 or so current subscribers to Irreantum. Maybe skimming the list will give you a better idea of our readership. I think we're a pretty good mix, not as liberal as Sunstone but slightly left of center, overall. I see our purpose as exploring all kinds of Mormon literature, all over the spectrum, with an overall balance in approach on a year-to-year basis, if not within every single individual issue. I can see playing to an audience's expectations to some degree, but first and foremost I'm following my own interests and instincts of what's interesting and valid and also deferring to the department editors. Our unofficial connection to BYU is Gideon and the fact that we use BYU's mailing service to do all our bulk mailing. Aagard Mary Abegg Rainbow Adair Morgan Adams Kellene Adams Linda Aitken Neil Alder Doug Alexander Merilyn Alexander Thomas G Allen Bruce Amatangelo Ellen Andersen Mary Anne Andersen Susan Anderson Bob & Janice Anderson Dawn Arnold Marilyn Astle Matthew Atkinson Christine AUC Faculty/Writing Program Tom Johnson c/o IIE Baker Dr Doran Barlow Laurel Barthel Mildred V Baugh Steven Bauman Nancy H Bean Kent R Beecroft Anne Tisdel Bench Curt Benchmark Books Bennion John 3170 JKHB Bennion Lowell & Sherilyn Bennion Molly Bentley Elizabeth Petty Bethers Linda Bigelow Christopher K Bird Al Birkin Rebecca Bishop Paul Bjerum RaeAnn Blanchard Gay N Blood Dwight Bluth Kris Boise State University Library Bowen Annette P Bowen Leah Bowns Marsha Bradshaw Charles Bradshaw Dan & Emily Brady Suzanne Brewer Josi Briggs Betty Brown Diann Brown Marilyn Brown Mark S Brown Roylee Brown Samuel Browning Karlene Bryan John Burton Gideon Burton Jeff Burton Rulon T Tabernacle Books Bushman Richard L Busk Judy Butler Richard BYU English Dept Cairns Janice Campbell Diane Carter Stephen Cheney Jean Utah Humanities Council Chidester Leon Clark Bessie Clark Dennis Clark Harlow Clark Krista Clark Susan Clawson Elizabeth Clawson Kevan Clifford Dixie R Clyde-Curtis Emily Corey Karrol Cornell David Costley Cecelie Creative Works A-285 ASB Crooks James E Curtis Judith Dastrup Thomas Davidson Kathy Davis Lynn R Dawson Darrow F Day Larry Dialogue Dixon Eric Downing Lisa Duerden Donna Duffy John-Charles Dutcher Richard Zion Films Earl Danielle Eaton Edgar E Edwards Jonathan Edwards Paul M Graceland University Eliason Eric English Dept Ellsworth Carol Ellsworth Jennifer England Charlotte H Engler Nancy Enos Jongiorgi Erekson Carol FAIR Sharon Bunch Farmer Ross H Feher Sherman Felt Geraldine Ferguson Debbie Findlay Ross & Linnie Finnegan Amy Glenn Sharlee G Goodfellow Matthew Goodfellow Paula Grames Conan Green Gary Gripkey Les Groesbeck Joan Gunn Nancy Haight Angela B Hale Veda T Hale Dean Hall Andrew Hallstrom Angela Hamer Ginger Hanni Gerry Hansen Helynne H Hansen John H Harold B Lee Library (1 of 2) Serials Dept Harold B Lee Library (2 of 2) Serials Dept Harrell Jack English Dept Haslam Matt Hatch Valerie Thursby Head Grant Heinerman John Henderson Gae Lyn Herbert Kathleen Heward Bugsy Hogan Edward R Hogge Robert M Holmes Michele & Spencer Homer William Horne Lewis Houghton Joyce P Huff Edward Hughes Dean Hunt Darvell Hunter Angela Hunter Preston D Hyde Linda J Jameson Amy Janklow & Nesbit Associates Jeffery Lorraine Jenkins David I Jensen Janet Jenson Scott Jeppson Buckley C Jeppson Marlys Jepson Ellen Jepson Eric W Jimenez Carlos S Johnson LaVerna Bringhurst Johnson Neil Johnson Richard B Jones Bonnie Jones Gerald E Jorgensen Mari Joseph F Smith Library Brigham Young Univ-Hawaii Justesen Sammie Kammeyer Kurt Karamesines Patricia Keogh Abel Kersey Christine Kilpack Josi Kimball Linda Hoffman Kimball Thomas S Signature Books Knudsen Ronda Walker Koltko-Rivera Mark Koontz Elaine Lamb Connie Lamb-Kwon Tracie Lane Cathryn Larsen Kris (continued in next e-mail) ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0C4.A287E740 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Our audience

Responding to Travis, following is a list of the 375 = or so current subscribers to Irreantum. Maybe skimming the list will = give you a better idea of our readership. I think we're a pretty good = mix, not as liberal as Sunstone but slightly left of center, = overall.

I see our purpose as exploring all kinds of Mormon = literature, all over the spectrum, with an overall balance in approach = on a year-to-year basis, if not within every single individual issue. I = can see playing to an audience's expectations to some degree, but first = and foremost I'm following my own interests and instincts of what's = interesting and valid and also deferring to the department = editors.

Our unofficial connection to BYU is Gideon and the = fact that we use BYU's mailing service to do all our bulk mailing. =

Aagard Mary  
Abegg Rainbow  
Adair Morgan  
Adams Kellene  
Adams Linda  
Aitken Neil  
Alder Doug  
Alexander Merilyn  
Alexander Thomas G 
Allen Bruce  
Amatangelo Ellen  
Andersen Mary Anne  
Andersen Susan  
Anderson Bob & Janice  
Anderson Dawn  
Arnold Marilyn  
Astle Matthew  
Atkinson Christine  
AUC Faculty/Writing Program Tom Johnson   = c/o IIE
Baker Dr Doran  
Barlow Laurel  
Barthel Mildred V 
Baugh Steven  
Bauman Nancy H 
Bean Kent R 
Beecroft Anne Tisdel 
Bench Curt   Benchmark Books
Bennion John   3170 JKHB
Bennion Lowell & Sherilyn  
Bennion Molly  
Bentley Elizabeth Petty 
Bethers Linda  
Bigelow Christopher K 
Bird Al  
Birkin Rebecca  
Bishop Paul  
Bjerum RaeAnn  
Blanchard Gay N 
Blood Dwight  
Bluth Kris  
Boise State University Library    =
Bowen Annette P 
Bowen Leah  
Bowns Marsha  
Bradshaw Charles  
Bradshaw Dan & Emily  
Brady Suzanne  
Brewer Josi  
Briggs Betty  
Brown Diann  
Brown Marilyn  
Brown Mark S 
Brown Roylee  
Brown Samuel  
Browning Karlene  
Bryan John  
Burton Gideon  
Burton Jeff  
Burton Rulon T  Tabernacle Books
Bushman Richard  L 
Busk Judy  
Butler Richard  
BYU English Dept   
Cairns Janice  
Campbell Diane  
Carter Stephen  
Cheney Jean   Utah Humanities Council =
Chidester Leon  
Clark Bessie  
Clark Dennis  
Clark Harlow  
Clark Krista  
Clark Susan  
Clawson Elizabeth  
Clawson Kevan  
Clifford Dixie R 
Clyde-Curtis Emily  
Corey Karrol  
Cornell David  
Costley Cecelie  
Creative Works    A-285 ASB
Crooks James  E 
Curtis Judith  
Dastrup Thomas  
Davidson Kathy  
Davis Lynn R 
Dawson Darrow F 
Day Larry  
Dialogue   
Dixon Eric  
Downing Lisa  
Duerden Donna  
Duffy John-Charles  
Dutcher Richard   Zion Films
Earl Danielle  
Eaton Edgar E 
Edwards Jonathan  
Edwards Paul M  Graceland University
Eliason Eric   English Dept
Ellsworth Carol  
Ellsworth Jennifer  
England Charlotte H 
Engler Nancy  
Enos Jongiorgi  
Erekson Carol  
FAIR    Sharon Bunch
Farmer Ross H 
Feher Sherman  
Felt Geraldine  
Ferguson Debbie  
Findlay Ross & Linnie  
Finnegan Amy  
Glenn Sharlee G 
Goodfellow Matthew  
Goodfellow Paula  
Grames Conan  
Green Gary  
Gripkey Les  
Groesbeck Joan  
Gunn Nancy  
Haight  Angela B 
Hale  Veda  T 
Hale Dean  
Hall Andrew  
Hallstrom Angela  
Hamer Ginger  
Hanni Gerry  
Hansen Helynne H 
Hansen John H 
Harold B Lee Library (1 of 2)    = Serials Dept
Harold B Lee Library (2 of 2)    = Serials Dept
Harrell Jack   English Dept
Haslam Matt  
Hatch Valerie Thursby 
Head Grant  
Heinerman John  
Henderson Gae Lyn  
Herbert Kathleen  
Heward Bugsy  
Hogan Edward R 
Hogge Robert M 
Holmes Michele & Spencer  
Homer William  
Horne Lewis  
Houghton Joyce P 
Huff Edward  
Hughes Dean  
Hunt Darvell   
Hunter Angela  
Hunter Preston D 
Hyde Linda J 
Jameson Amy   Janklow & Nesbit = Associates
Jeffery Lorraine  
Jenkins David I 
Jensen Janet  
Jenson Scott  
Jeppson Buckley C 
Jeppson Marlys  
Jepson Ellen  
Jepson Eric W 
Jimenez Carlos S 
Johnson LaVerna Bringhurst 
Johnson Neil  
Johnson Richard B 
Jones Bonnie  
Jones Gerald E 
Jorgensen Mari  
Joseph F Smith Library    Brigham = Young Univ-Hawaii
Justesen Sammie  
Kammeyer Kurt  
Karamesines Patricia  
Keogh Abel  
Kersey Christine  
Kilpack Josi  
Kimball Linda Hoffman 
Kimball Thomas S  Signature Books
Knudsen Ronda Walker 
Koltko-Rivera Mark  
Koontz Elaine  
Lamb Connie  
Lamb-Kwon Tracie  
Lane Cathryn  
Larsen Kris  

(continued in next e-mail)

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0C4.A287E740-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [irr-ed] Our audience, part 2 Date: 21 Nov 2003 23:49:44 -0700 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0C4.CFCAF850 Content-Type: text/plain (continued from earlier e-mail) Larson Lawrence Leonard Glen M Library Acquisitions Church History Library Lindquist Jason Linton John Littke Lael J Lynn Karen Lyon Annette Mackert Cindy Madsen Kim Madsen Laurel Manning Travis Kent Markham Tony Marrott Hazel Martin Bruce J Martin Michelle Martin Trisa Martindale D Michael Maude Cheri Maxwell Cory H Deseret Book McCulloch Nan P McDonald Dylan Means Robert S 5525 HBLL Merrill Micah Mietus Carolyn Miles Carrie A Miles Henry Miller RJ Miller Sherry Ann Mills Carol Mills Tanya Mitchell Alan Moloney Karen M Moore Beth S Morris William Morrison Christine Mortimer Lyle Neal James L Nelson Glen Nelson Vicki Newell Coke Nielsen Ann Norton Tamra Norton Tennery Taylor Nunes Rachel Oborn Mike Ockey Catherine W Osborn Eliana Oscarson R Don Ottesen Carol Clark Ottosen Terry Pace David G Palmer Madelyn Parker Katie Parkin Scott & Marny Parkinson Dilworth Patton Nancy Paulsen Deirdre 185 HGB Perry Kimberly Petersen Boyd Peterson Dorothy W Petty Kathy Pingree J Frederick Pope Richard Porter Melinda Prince Gregory A Proctor Maurine Meridian Proffitt Melissa & Jacob Provo Public Library Purdy Victor W Pyles Ron Quist Carol B Quist William B Randall Alison Randall Jane Rapier Kim Reinwand Jeanne English Dept Remy Jana Bouck Richardson David E Richardson Marilyn Robinson Bonnie B Robinson Joy S Romriell Brian Pierian Spring Books Rosenbaum Karen Rowley Brent J Russell Reed Ryan Judy Sanders Brett Alan Savage Jo Ann Serials Acquisitions Salt Lake City Pub Lib Serials Dept/UMC 3105 Science & Tech Library Serials Order Dept Marriott Lib-Univ of Utah Seshachari Candadai Sexton Paul W Shumway Marcy Shunn William Silver Cherry Silver Ariel Simmons Diana Smith Farrell M Smith Alan Smith Bruce Smith Richard S Snider Margaret Snow Edgar Soderborg Josie Sorensen Peter Speek Vickie St Clair Faith Staheli Julie Steadman Julie Steed Marsha Stoddard Elizabeth Stoddard William Straubhaar Sandra B Swedin Eric G Taber Susan B Tait Lisa Taylor Clinton Taylor Nancy David O McKay Lib Acquis Taylor Nancy H Thomas Geoffrey Thomas Mark Thursby Dr Jacqueline S Tighe Heidi Time Lines Etc Tinney Mari Vawn Todd Julia H Tolman Louise L. Toronto Matt Turley Kylie Nielson Turner Lisa Tyler Linda Tyner Kathleen Underwood Grant 133 KMB Univ of CO Libraries Serials Acquisitions Utah State Historical Soc Van Komen Janie Vance Barbara VanDenBerghe Elizabeth Vicinus Victor Von Canon Library SVU Wahlquist Jen Walker Elmo L Walker Steve 3142 JKHB Warnick Quinn Watanabe Sundy Weber Lloyd S Wendy Wise Library UVSC Weyland Jack Whiting Linda Whitley Colleen 185 HGB Williams Pamela Willian Lotte Willson William M Wilson Brent Wilson Cathy Helpertouch WindRiver Publishing Inc Woodbury Eugene Woodbury Hugh & Joyce Woodbury Kathleen Woods Ron Wright Julie 20 S Main Young Darlene Young Joan Young Mandy Young Margaret & Bruce Zollinger Michael ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0C4.CFCAF850 Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Our audience, part 2

(continued from earlier e-mail)


Larson Lawrence  
Leonard Glen M 
Library Acquisitions    Church = History Library
Lindquist Jason  
Linton John  
Littke Lael J 
Lynn Karen  
Lyon Annette  
Mackert Cindy  
Madsen Kim  
Madsen Laurel  
Manning  Travis  Kent 
Markham Tony  
Marrott Hazel  
Martin Bruce J 
Martin Michelle  
Martin Trisa  
Martindale D Michael 
Maude Cheri  
Maxwell Cory H  Deseret Book
McCulloch Nan P 
McDonald Dylan  
Means Robert S  5525 HBLL
Merrill Micah  
Mietus Carolyn  
Miles Carrie A 
Miles Henry  
Miller RJ  
Miller Sherry Ann 
Mills Carol  
Mills Tanya  
Mitchell Alan  
Moloney Karen  M 
Moore Beth S 
Morris William  
Morrison Christine  
Mortimer Lyle  
Neal James L 
Nelson Glen  
Nelson Vicki  
Newell Coke  
Nielsen Ann  
Norton Tamra  
Norton Tennery Taylor 
Nunes Rachel  
Oborn Mike  
Ockey Catherine W 
Osborn Eliana  
Oscarson R Don 
Ottesen Carol Clark 
Ottosen Terry  
Pace David G 
Palmer Madelyn  
Parker Katie  
Parkin Scott & Marny  
Parkinson Dilworth  
Patton Nancy  
Paulsen Deirdre   185 HGB
Perry Kimberly  
Petersen Boyd  
Peterson Dorothy W 
Petty Kathy  
Pingree J Frederick 
Pope Richard  
Porter Melinda  
Prince Gregory A 
Proctor Maurine   Meridian
Proffitt Melissa & Jacob  
Provo Public Library   
Purdy Victor  W 
Pyles Ron  
Quist Carol B 
Quist William B 
Randall Alison  
Randall Jane  
Rapier Kim  
Reinwand Jeanne   English Dept
Remy Jana Bouck 
Richardson David E 
Richardson Marilyn  
Robinson Bonnie  B 
Robinson Joy  S 
Romriell Brian   Pierian Spring Books =
Rosenbaum Karen  
Rowley Brent J 
Russell Reed  
Ryan Judy  
Sanders Brett Alan 
Savage Jo Ann  
Serials Acquisitions    Salt Lake = City Pub Lib
Serials Dept/UMC 3105    Science = & Tech Library
Serials Order Dept    Marriott = Lib-Univ of Utah
Seshachari Candadai  
Sexton Paul W 
Shumway Marcy  
Shunn William  
Silver  Cherry  
Silver Ariel  
Simmons Diana  
Smith  Farrell M 
Smith Alan  
Smith Bruce  
Smith Richard S 
Snider Margaret  
Snow Edgar  
Soderborg Josie  
Sorensen Peter  
Speek Vickie  
St Clair Faith  
Staheli Julie  
Steadman Julie  
Steed Marsha  
Stoddard Elizabeth  
Stoddard William  
Straubhaar Sandra B 
Swedin Eric G 
Taber Susan B 
Tait Lisa  
Taylor Clinton  
Taylor Nancy   David O McKay Lib Acquis =
Taylor Nancy H 
Thomas Geoffrey  
Thomas Mark  
Thursby Dr Jacqueline S 
Tighe Heidi  
Time Lines Etc   
Tinney Mari Vawn 
Todd Julia H 
Tolman Louise L. 
Toronto Matt  
Turley Kylie Nielson 
Turner Lisa  
Tyler Linda  
Tyner Kathleen  
Underwood Grant   133 KMB
Univ of CO Libraries    Serials = Acquisitions
Utah State Historical Soc   
Van Komen Janie  
Vance Barbara  
VanDenBerghe Elizabeth  
Vicinus Victor  
Von Canon Library    SVU
Wahlquist Jen  
Walker Elmo L 
Walker Steve   3142 JKHB
Warnick Quinn  
Watanabe Sundy  
Weber Lloyd S 
Wendy Wise Library    UVSC
Weyland Jack  
Whiting Linda  
Whitley Colleen   185 HGB
Williams Pamela  
Willian Lotte  
Willson William M 
Wilson Brent  
Wilson Cathy   Helpertouch
WindRiver Publishing Inc   
Woodbury Eugene  
Woodbury Hugh & Joyce  
Woodbury Kathleen  
Woods Ron  
Wright Julie   20 S Main
Young Darlene  
Young Joan  
Young Mandy  
Young Margaret & Bruce  
Zollinger Michael

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B0C4.CFCAF850-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Date: 22 Nov 2003 18:15:40 -0700 Travis K. Manning wrote: > In light of Gideon's comments, perhaps we should consider LaBute's work > on the basis of his work, piece by piece, editor by editor. We should give LaBute the same treatment as what we've given any other artist. He's an artist and he is Mormon. So what if he's at the edge of the spectrum? Somebody has to be. Didn't we already discuss that it's not our place to be deciding who is worthy and who is not? > I know Gideon may also have some "constraints," for > lack of a better word, as acting AML president, because he is also a > faculty member at BYU. As Irreantum editors, what exactly are our > connections with BYU, official and unofficial? Our connections with BYU, official and unofficial, are zero. > What are our connections > as an LDS literary magazine with our audience? Who is our audience? > What is our purpose? Our purpose is to cover all of LDS literature. Our audience is people who are interested in that. > Would publishing LaBute's work alienate Irreantum > from ... who? We've already alienated some of our audience over much less. (Cf. Jacob Proffitt's tirade against our editorial policy and his insistence that he won't read us anymore.) We don't give LaBute carte blanche to promote himself, but we don't do that for anyone, do we? And I hardly think Chris Bigelow of all people is going to throw nothing but softball questions at him. > I guess I'm too unfamiliar with exactly who is buying > Irreantum. Where should Irreantum sit "politically"? If you literally mean politically, then neutral. If you mean it literarily, then we are not conservative, middle-of-the-road, or edgy. We are all of it. We seek balance. If LaBute upsets the balance, approach Gerald Lund for the next issue. But don't filter LaBute beyond what we'd do with anyone else. > If this is > something we agree on, perhaps we should have several editors review his > piece. I know the Board means well, but I'm wondering if we can't > handle this one on our own. We should send the questions to LaBute and print his answers, nothing more, nothing less. It's what we do with everyone else. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: [irr-ed] Sunstone/Dialogue mentions Date: 24 Nov 2003 09:14:23 -0700 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B2A6.064D4B70 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" By the way, our mag got mentioned several times in the new Dialogue and Sunstone issues, especially Dialogue. A whole short reponse article about poetry was built around commenting on our summer 02 issue. Only one of the mentions was sort of negative (a guy complaining that the editor of Irreantum--me--said on AML-List that I like humor better than poetry). -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 6:30 PM In light of Gideon's comments, perhaps we should consider LaBute's work on the basis of his work, piece by piece, editor by editor. Who, then, is our audience? I know Gideon may also have some "constraints," for lack of a better word, as acting AML president, because he is also a faculty member at BYU. As Irreantum editors, what exactly are our connections with BYU, official and unofficial? What are our connections as an LDS literary magazine with our audience? Who is our audience? What is our purpose? Would publishing LaBute's work alienate Irreantum from ... who? I guess I'm too unfamiliar with exactly who is buying Irreantum. Where should Irreantum sit "politically"? I guess I see us as sitting, aesthetically, at "the middle of the road," perhaps just tiptoeing on the conservative side of the pendulum swing. If this is something we agree on, perhaps we should have several editors review his piece. I know the Board means well, but I'm wondering if we can't handle this one on our own. Travis ----- Original Message ----- Cc: aml-board@lists.xmission.com Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 3:46 PM I'd like to reserve the right for the AML board to approve any material from Neil LaBute that we publish in Irreantum as a matter of editorial oversight from AML. LaBute is certainly an appropriate figure to discuss for our publication, but we have got to be careful not to alienate readers or to give the impression that AML is too liberal (or rather, that we are narrowly liberal, if you follow me). I realize that Chris has played fair in selecting across the spectrum of LDS literature for Irreantum pieces, especially recently, but there are genuine problems with LaBute's material, and some strong reasons to avoid even the appearance of being uncritical or just promotional with him and his work. To be plain with my own prejudices (which I invite correction to from those of other viewpoints), I personally consider LaBute to be among those who are happy to exploit a Mormon connection if it works in their favor, but he doesn't blink about violating all kinds of sensibilities in his work, and I perceive in him and his work no fundamental respect for (let alone any loyalty to) Mormonism or Mormon people. Those are not requirements for being featured in our publications, but I do think it an ethical issue if we even indirectly give legitimacy to artists or authors who work by shock and disrespect, who flout both aesthetics and morality. Like his lead character (the cutting edge artist) at the end of The Shape of Things, LaBute flips the bird at his audiences, and to me this is an ethical issue that we should be very careful about. Red flags, not the red carpet, for Brother LaBute. Gideon Gideon O. Burton 3113 JKHB Department of English Brigham Young University Provo, UT 84602 (801) 422-3525 Visit Silva Rhetoricae: The Forest of Rhetoric http://rhetoric.byu.edu The Mormon Literature Database http://MormonLit.lib.byu.edu -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Christopher Bigelow Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 9:26 AM A third piece I wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter John Moyer. I would welcome some questions from people. I also hope we can maybe include some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not going to get involved myself in that area. LaBute gave me a short story to run, not a script excerpt. -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 1:23 AM Chris, Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly impressed. Way to go. For the next issue, I already submitted a memoir piece (nothing related to film). And, I'm still working through edits with Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on the history of Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA conference in Missoula.. I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else has. I forwarded some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly what it was. I think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham City by "that MD in Boston," I forget his name. If that's the case, I don't see a problem with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute can get his critique to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter. I may end up with a two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on the last a couple months ago. I have one essay, but I may seek an author to write an opposing piece. It's just a matter of finding the time to do it all. What else do we have for the film issue?! Very curious, Travis ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he agreed to do a short review for us. Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . . ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B2A6.064D4B70 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Neil LaBute
By the way, our mag got mentioned several times in the new Dialogue and Sunstone issues, especially Dialogue. A whole short reponse article about poetry was built around commenting on our summer 02 issue. Only one of the mentions was sort of negative (a guy complaining that the editor of Irreantum--me--said on AML-List that I like humor better than poetry).
-----Original Message-----
From: Travis K. Manning [mailto:tmanning.eagle@sisna.com]
Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 6:30 PM
To: irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

In light of Gideon's comments, perhaps we should consider LaBute's work on the basis of his work, piece by piece, editor by editor.  Who, then, is our audience?  I know Gideon may also have some "constraints," for lack of a better word, as acting AML president, because he is also a faculty member at BYU.  As Irreantum editors, what exactly are our connections with BYU, official and unofficial?  What are our connections as an LDS literary magazine with our audience?  Who is our audience?  What is our purpose?  Would publishing LaBute's work alienate Irreantum from ... who?  I guess I'm too unfamiliar with exactly who is buying Irreantum.  Where should Irreantum sit "politically"?  I guess I see us as sitting, aesthetically, at "the middle of the road," perhaps just tiptoeing on the conservative side of the pendulum swing.  If this is something we agree on, perhaps we should have several editors review his piece.  I know the Board means well, but I'm wondering if we can't handle this one on our own.
 
Travis
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 3:46 PM
Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

I'd like to reserve the right for the AML board to approve any material from Neil LaBute that we publish in Irreantum as a matter of editorial oversight from AML.

 

LaBute is certainly an appropriate figure to discuss for our publication, but we have got to be careful not to alienate readers or to give the impression that AML is too liberal (or rather, that we are narrowly liberal, if you follow me). I realize that Chris has played fair in selecting across the spectrum of LDS literature for Irreantum pieces, especially recently, but there are genuine problems with LaBute's material, and some strong reasons to avoid even the appearance of being uncritical or just promotional with him and his work.

 

To be plain with my own prejudices (which I invite correction to from those of other viewpoints), I personally consider LaBute to be among those who are happy to exploit a Mormon connection if it works in their favor, but he doesn't blink about violating all kinds of sensibilities in his work, and I perceive in him and his work no fundamental respect for (let alone any loyalty to) Mormonism or Mormon people. Those are not requirements for being featured in our publications, but I do think it an ethical issue if we even indirectly give legitimacy to artists or authors who work by shock and disrespect, who flout both aesthetics and morality. Like his lead character (the cutting edge artist) at the end of The Shape of Things, LaBute flips the bird at his audiences, and to me this is an ethical issue that we should be very careful about. Red flags, not the red carpet, for Brother LaBute.

 

Gideon

Gideon O. Burton
3113 JKHB
Department of English
Brigham Young University
Provo, UT  84602

(801) 422-3525

Visit
Silva Rhetoricae: The Forest of Rhetoric http://rhetoric.byu.edu
The Mormon Literature Database http://MormonLit.lib.byu.edu

 

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com [mailto:owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Christopher Bigelow
Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 9:26 AM
To: 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com'
Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

 

A third piece I wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter John Moyer. I would welcome some questions from people.

 

I also hope we can maybe include some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not going to get involved myself in that area. LaBute gave me a short story to run, not a script excerpt.

-----Original Message-----
From: Travis K. Manning [mailto:tmanning.eagle@sisna.com]
Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 1:23 AM
To: irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

Chris,

 

Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly impressed.

 

Way to go.   For the next issue, I already submitted a memoir piece (nothing related to film).  And, I'm still working through edits with Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on the history of Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA conference in Missoula..

 

I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else has.  I forwarded some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly what it was.  I think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham City by "that MD in Boston," I forget his name.  If that's the case, I don't see a problem with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute can get his critique to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter.  I may end up with a two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on the last a couple months ago.  I have one essay, but I may seek an author to write an opposing piece.  It's just a matter of finding the time to do it all.

 

What else do we have for the film issue?!

 

Very curious,

 

Travis

 

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM

Subject: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

 

For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he agreed to do a short review for us.

Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . .

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B2A6.064D4B70-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Christopher Bigelow Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Date: 24 Nov 2003 09:34:37 -0700 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B2A8.D9CF30B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" <<< We don't give LaBute carte blanche to promote himself, but we don't do that for anyone, do we? And I hardly think Chris Bigelow of all people is going to throw nothing but softball questions at him. >>> I have to admit that because Brother LaBute wouldn't do an e-mail interview and I had to do it with him over the phone, I probably didn't ask as many hard questions, which I find so much easier to do via e-mail. So now I have a tape that I've got to transcribe sometime. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B2A8.D9CF30B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RE: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

<<<
We don't give LaBute carte blanche to promote =
himself, but we don't do that for anyone, do we? And = I hardly think
Chris Bigelow of all people is going to throw = nothing but softball
questions at him.
>>>

I have to admit that because Brother LaBute wouldn't = do an e-mail interview and I had to do it with him over the phone, I = probably didn't ask as many hard questions, which I find so much easier = to do via e-mail. So now I have a tape that I've got to transcribe = sometime.

------_=_NextPart_001_01C3B2A8.D9CF30B0-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Gideon Burton Subject: RE: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Date: 24 Nov 2003 17:25:25 -0700 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0029_01C3B2AF.FCC31490 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Travis / Irreantum editors =20 Although I'm more than happy to open the discussion Travis invites, it's equally important that the Irreantum editorial board recognize that the magazine is the official publication of the Association for Mormon Letters, and is subject to our editorial oversight. We feel the AML-Irreantum relationship is a symbiotic and productive one, but if at any point AML feels as if the content of Irreantum is not serving the interests of its parent organization, the AML board will direct editorial content and decisions. =20 I think it is equally important that you not confuse my role as a BYU professor with my role as President of AML. We have gone to great lengths to keep AML a neutral organization over the years, and I concur with that policy. If my comments about LaBute seem conservative, it is in light of the constituencies I believe AML has set itself up to serve, which are broader than BYU's limited audiences (and in some ways perhaps more sensitive, since Irreantum is appealing to general readers, not those studying literature in school). =20 Gideon Gideon O. Burton 3113 JKHB Department of English Brigham Young University Provo, UT 84602 (801) 422-3525 Visit Silva Rhetoricae: The Forest of Rhetoric http://rhetoric.byu.edu =20 The Mormon Literature Database http://MormonLit.lib.byu.edu =20 =20 -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Travis K. Manning Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 6:30 PM =20 In light of Gideon's comments, perhaps we should consider LaBute's work on the basis of his work, piece by piece, editor by editor. Who, then, is our audience? I know Gideon may also have some "constraints," for lack of a better word, as acting AML president, because he is also a faculty member at BYU. As Irreantum editors, what exactly are our connections with BYU, official and unofficial? What are our connections as an LDS literary magazine with our audience? Who is our audience? What is our purpose? Would publishing LaBute's work alienate Irreantum from ... who? I guess I'm too unfamiliar with exactly who is buying Irreantum. Where should Irreantum sit "politically"? I guess I see us as sitting, aesthetically, at "the middle of the road," perhaps just tiptoeing on the conservative side of the pendulum swing. If this is something we agree on, perhaps we should have several editors review his piece. I know the Board means well, but I'm wondering if we can't handle this one on our own. =20 Travis =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 Cc: aml-board@lists.xmission.com=20 Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 3:46 PM =20 I'd like to reserve the right for the AML board to approve any material from Neil LaBute that we publish in Irreantum as a matter of editorial oversight from AML. =20 LaBute is certainly an appropriate figure to discuss for our publication, but we have got to be careful not to alienate readers or to give the impression that AML is too liberal (or rather, that we are narrowly liberal, if you follow me). I realize that Chris has played fair in selecting across the spectrum of LDS literature for Irreantum pieces, especially recently, but there are genuine problems with LaBute's material, and some strong reasons to avoid even the appearance of being uncritical or just promotional with him and his work.=20 =20 To be plain with my own prejudices (which I invite correction to from those of other viewpoints), I personally consider LaBute to be among those who are happy to exploit a Mormon connection if it works in their favor, but he doesn't blink about violating all kinds of sensibilities in his work, and I perceive in him and his work no fundamental respect for (let alone any loyalty to) Mormonism or Mormon people. Those are not requirements for being featured in our publications, but I do think it an ethical issue if we even indirectly give legitimacy to artists or authors who work by shock and disrespect, who flout both aesthetics and morality. Like his lead character (the cutting edge artist) at the end of The Shape of Things, LaBute flips the bird at his audiences, and to me this is an ethical issue that we should be very careful about. Red flags, not the red carpet, for Brother LaBute.=20 =20 Gideon Gideon O. Burton 3113 JKHB Department of English Brigham Young University Provo, UT 84602 (801) 422-3525 Visit Silva Rhetoricae: The Forest of Rhetoric http://rhetoric.byu.edu =20 The Mormon Literature Database http://MormonLit.lib.byu.edu =20 =20 -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Christopher Bigelow Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 9:26 AM =20 A third piece I wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter John Moyer. I would welcome some questions from people. =20 I also hope we can maybe include some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not going to get involved myself in that area. LaBute gave me a short story to run, not a script excerpt. -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, November 21, 2003 1:23 AM Chris, =20 Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly impressed. =20 Way to go. For the next issue, I already submitted a memoir piece (nothing related to film). And, I'm still working through edits with Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on the history of Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA conference in Missoula.. =20 I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else has. I forwarded some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly what it was. I think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham City by "that MD in Boston," I forget his name. If that's the case, I don't see a problem with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute can get his critique to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter. I may end up with a two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on the last a couple months ago. I have one essay, but I may seek an author to write an opposing piece. It's just a matter of finding the time to do it all. =20 What else do we have for the film issue?! =20 Very curious, =20 Travis =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM =20 For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview with Neil LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he agreed to do a short review for us. Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . .=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0029_01C3B2AF.FCC31490 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Neil LaBute

Travis / Irreantum = editors

 

Although I’m more than happy = to open the discussion Travis invites, it’s equally important that the = Irreantum editorial board recognize that the magazine is the official publication = of the Association for Mormon Letters, and is subject to our editorial = oversight. We feel the AML-Irreantum relationship is a symbiotic and productive one, but if = at any point AML feels as if the content of Irreantum is not serving the = interests of its parent organization, the AML board will direct editorial content and = decisions.

 

I think it is equally important = that you not confuse my role as a BYU professor with my role as President of AML. = We have gone to great lengths to keep AML a neutral organization over the years, = and I concur with that policy. If my comments about LaBute seem conservative, = it is in light of the constituencies I believe AML has set itself up to serve, = which are broader than BYU’s limited audiences (and in some ways perhaps = more sensitive, since Irreantum is appealing to general readers, not those = studying literature in school).

 

Gideon

Gideon O. Burton
3113 JKHB
Department of English
Brigham Young University
Provo, UT  84602

(801) 422-3525

Visit
Silva Rhetoricae: The Forest of Rhetoric http://rhetoric.byu.edu
The Mormon Literature Database http://MormonLit.lib.byu.edu

 

-----Original Message-----
From: = owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com [mailto:owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Travis K. Manning
Sent: Friday, November = 21, 2003 6:30 PM
To: irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Re: [irr-ed] = Neil LaBute

 

In light of Gideon's comments, perhaps we should consider = LaBute's work on the basis of his work, piece by piece, editor by editor.  Who, = then, is our audience?  I know Gideon may also have some "constraints," for lack of a better word, as acting AML president, because he is also a faculty member at BYU.  As = Irreantum editors, what exactly are our connections with BYU, official and unofficial?  What are our connections as an LDS literary magazine = with our audience?  Who is our audience?  What is our purpose?  = Would publishing LaBute's work alienate Irreantum from ... who?  I guess = I'm too unfamiliar with exactly who is buying Irreantum.  Where should = Irreantum sit "politically"?  I guess I see us as sitting, aesthetically, at "the middle of the = road," perhaps just tiptoeing on the conservative side of the pendulum = swing.  If this is something we agree on, perhaps we should have several editors = review his piece.  I know the Board means well, but I'm wondering if we = can't handle this one on our own.

 

Travis

 

----- Original Message -----

Sent: Friday, = November 21, 2003 3:46 PM

Subject: RE: = [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

 

I’d like to reserve the right = for the AML board to approve any material from Neil LaBute that we publish = in Irreantum as a matter of editorial oversight from AML.

 

LaBute is certainly an appropriate = figure to discuss for our publication, but we have got to be careful not to = alienate readers or to give the impression that AML is too liberal (or rather, = that we are narrowly liberal, if you follow me). I realize that Chris has played = fair in selecting across the spectrum of LDS literature for Irreantum pieces, especially recently, but there are genuine problems with LaBute’s material, and some strong reasons to avoid even the appearance of being uncritical or just promotional with him and his work.

 

To be plain with my own prejudices = (which I invite correction to from those of other viewpoints), I personally = consider LaBute to be among those who are happy to exploit a Mormon connection if = it works in their favor, but he doesn’t blink about violating all = kinds of sensibilities in his work, and I perceive in him and his work no = fundamental respect for (let alone any loyalty to) Mormonism or Mormon people. Those = are not requirements for being featured in our publications, but I do think = it an ethical issue if we even indirectly give legitimacy to artists or = authors who work by shock and disrespect, who flout both aesthetics and morality. = Like his lead character (the cutting edge artist) at the end of The Shape of = Things, LaBute flips the bird at his audiences, and to me this is an ethical = issue that we should be very careful about. Red flags, not the red carpet, for = Brother LaBute.

 

Gideon

Gideon O. Burton
3113 JKHB
Department of English
Brigham Young University
Provo, UT  84602

(801) 422-3525

Visit
Silva Rhetoricae: The Forest of Rhetoric http://rhetoric.byu.edu
The Mormon Literature Database http://MormonLit.lib.byu.edu

 

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com [mailto:owner-irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Christopher Bigelow
Sent: Friday, November = 21, 2003 9:26 AM
To: = 'irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com'
Subject: RE: [irr-ed] = Neil LaBute

 

A third piece I wanted to do was an interview with the screenwriter John Moyer. I would welcome some = questions from people.

 

I also hope we can maybe include = some screenplay excerpts, but I'm not going to get involved myself in that = area. LaBute gave me a short story to run, not a script = excerpt.

-----Original = Message-----
From: Travis K. Manning [mailto:tmanning.eagle@sisna.com]
Sent: Friday, November = 21, 2003 1:23 AM
To: = irreantum-ed@lists.xmission.com
Subject: Re: [irr-ed] = Neil LaBute

Chris,

 

Oh yeah, well I am, uh, um, uh ... duly = impressed.

 

Way to go.   For the next issue, I already = submitted a memoir piece (nothing related to film).  And, I'm still working = through edits with Melissa Smith on her piece (20 pages doublespaced) on the history = of Mormon film which she recently presented at the RMMLA conference in = Missoula..

 

I'm very curious to see what pieces everyone else has.  I forwarded some stuff to D. Mike a while back but can't remember exactly = what it was.  I think one of the pieces was a film review of Brigham = City by "that MD in Boston," I forget his name.  If that's the = case, I don't see a problem with two film reviews of the same film, if LaBute = can get his critique to us by deadline, or shortly thereafter.  I may end = up with a two-essay set on the topic of the Movie film moratorium, a topic on = the last a couple months ago.  I have one essay, but I may seek an author to = write an opposing piece.  It's just a matter of finding the time to do it = all.

 

What else do we have for the film issue?!

 

Very curious,

 

Travis

 

----- Original Message -----

Sent: = Thursday, November 20, 2003 2:25 PM

Subject: = [irr-ed] Neil LaBute

 

For the film issue, I have now completed an interesting interview with Neil = LaBute, and I just sent him a DVD of "Brigham City" because he agreed to = do a short review for us.

Next I'm going to go after Tony Kushner . . .

------=_NextPart_000_0029_01C3B2AF.FCC31490-- -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "D. Michael Martindale" Subject: Re: [irr-ed] Neil LaBute Date: 27 Nov 2003 16:32:01 -0700 Gideon Burton wrote: > I think it is equally important that you not confuse my role as a BYU > professor with my role as President of AML. I don't think it's so much that we confused it as that we wondered if you had confused it. -- D. Michael Martindale dmichael@wwno.com ================================== Check out Worldsmiths, the new online LDS writers group, at http://www.wwno.com/worldsmiths Sponsored by Worlds Without Number http://www.wwno.com ================================== -- Irreantum Editor's Discussion List