From: owner-klr650-digest@lists.xmission.com (klr650-digest) To: klr650-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: klr650-digest V2 #95 Reply-To: klr650 Sender: owner-klr650-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-klr650-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk klr650-digest Saturday, March 6 1999 Volume 02 : Number 095 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 18:18:34 EST From: K650dsn@aol.com Subject: (klr650) (NKLR) Moab Girls I spent a delightful day building a barn today in 20 mph winds and 30 degrees. Came in to warm up and check out Fred's revised homepage and noticed he had the umbrella girl page. Then I got a brilliant idea. Think of the money we could save at the rally by getting a bunch of umbrella girls for all the guys and umbrella guys for the girls. We wouldn't have to rent tents, just buy some umbrellas. It's not every day that the stroke of genius hits me like this, but what do you all think? Gino ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Mar 1999 15:32:03 -0800 From: brbo@uniserve.com Subject: (klr650) Alpinestar Boots This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - --------------DB1AA0EE51B8B8E58A0B297F Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have been looking for a good quality boot, waterproof, durable, for dirt / road use, any recommendations or experience that anyone would like to share ? I have reviewed the archives and would still like a little more information. I have seen an Alpinestar Stage Goretex in black, but from the picture they don't seem to be that well suited for off road use. Thanks for all the excellent information, and to the people who make it happen, Brian -A12- BC, Canada - --------------DB1AA0EE51B8B8E58A0B297F Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="brbo.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for ƒÄ‹Ž¨ Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="brbo.vcf" begin:vcard n:Bonenfant;Brian x-mozilla-html:FALSE adr:;;;;;; version:2.1 email;internet:brbo@uniserve.com fn:Brian Bonenfant end:vcard - --------------DB1AA0EE51B8B8E58A0B297F-- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 17:06:32 -0700 From: "Skip Faulkner" Subject: Re: (klr650) Fuse Block Wire Gauge >...Snip........ >So, upgrading a wire size won't hurt, but it probably won't help either. ....Snip.................. >Could an OEM bike maker use nothing but 14ga? Sure, with no ill effects. >But imagine the size of the resultent wiring harness.....kinda unsightly, and >hard to hide, in addition to raising the cost of the bike. > >See ya, Dennis Dennis, From one A&P (IA, DAR) to another, you`re right except that in the case of the KLR, larger wire will help, because it`s too small now. Otherwise when I rewired with 12AWG and 14AWG on almost all my circuits, my stock lights wouldn`t have become brighter. Kawasaki`s wiring practices also have innumerable splices going on under the hood, which is money saving but inefficient. Also, my bike HAS been rewired with no space problem or unsightliness. I have relays for high beam and low beam. Tom rewired his KLR with 10AWG for the lighting system. Good to see another A&P on the List. Welcome. Are you still active? I`ve got an FBO in Montana, repairs, restorations and mods from J-3`s to jets. Skip ( constantly chased by one woman in particular, usually for doing something wrong) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 19:23:40 -0500 From: PAT_HENSLEY@HP-USA-om32.om.hp.com Subject: (klr650) [NKRL] Hydraulic Valves - --openmail-part-1953c1c2-00000001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; name="BDY.TXT" Content-Disposition: inline; filename="BDY.TXT" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a curious quest for knowledge.... Can anyone point me to a web site or explain to me why Hydraulic valves never need adjusting and how they 'self' adjust? Also, why don't all bike have Hydraulic valves since they are so wonderful? And please don't just tell me they cost more and that's why. The NightHawk 750 was a cheap bike with Hydraulic valves. There must be a performance reason also. Looking for education... Pat Austin, TX '97 w/ 10.8K miles - --openmail-part-1953c1c2-00000001-- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 19:48:22 EST From: Cloudhid@aol.com Subject: (klr650) Boer War of '99 (NKLR) On 3/6/99, DawnRides@aol.com writes: snip re: boring >i can't tell if Redondo is a flaming boor or just deliciously evil > if i heard your voice-would your 'oink' give you away? >dawn-using estrogen to bore in on a boorish boar Thanks for the heartfelt feedback Dawn. Is there anything that I can do to make it more comfortable for you to express your feelings here? Redondo Ron <----(feeling your pain) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 17:48:17 -0700 From: "Skip Faulkner" Subject: Re: (klr650) Fuse Block Wire Gauge >amps. Lets consider a simple circuit consisting of a battery, wire, switch, >fuse, and a light. The total electropotential (voltage) of this circuit is >constant (nearly) and is supplied by the battery. The total resistance of >the circuit is the sum of the individual resistance of every object in this >circuit, since the objects are in series. Granted, on some objects it is >desirable to have as little resistance as possible, like for the switch and >the wire, but they do have resistance. Ohm's law states that i = V / R, >that is, the current (amps) is equal to the Voltage divided by the >Resistance. If you lower the resistance of the wire by going to a smaller >gauge, then you've lowered the total resistance of the circuit, and more >amps MUST flow through that circuit. Simply stated, less R means more i. > > >Jeff > Jeff, You`re right as far as Ohm`s Law goes, but there are many other factors involved that have to be taken in account, and Ohm`s Law is not sufficient for the whole system. You also need to remember that the appliance itself effects the system.This bike has a complex 3-phase charging system that has been rendered problematic, due in effect to cost cutting measures on Kawasaki`s part, through minimal use of wire and minimum sizes of wire, based on computer programs of the bike. Yes, less resistance means more current flow, but the problem is that the resistance in the system is too high for the required draw. The appliance is also a factor. A 60 watt light will not draw 20 amps just because the 10AWG line will allow it and it`s available. Because of the number of splices and connections in the KLR`s circuit, resistance does add up. Going to large is one thing, but wire of insufficient gauge is another factor. Since re-wiring, I`m using 80watt lights, running lights, GPS and heated grips ( which I`ll be removing for other reasons) all while being monitored by my installed volt meter, amp meter and battery monitor, all showing a healthy charging system with no excessive draw on the battery. Go figure. My last 2 cents for now. Skip ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 18:18:39 -0800 From: "Vik Banerjee" Subject: Re: (klr650) Alpinestar Boots Brian, I ride in Danner Gor-tex combat boots. They are comfy and waterproof. You can ride all day in them and go hiking if you want to /have to - heck I have even run more than a few miles in them. They lace from just above the toe to well past the ankle. Having tried and owned a lot of boots these are without a doubt the nicest ones I own. As an added bonus they look pretty decent with dockers or jeans for those times when you don't want to scream."..I GOTTA MOTO-CYCLE!". Cheers, Vik - -----Original Message----- From: brbo@uniserve.com To: KLR List Date: Saturday, March 06, 1999 3:33 PM Subject: (klr650) Alpinestar Boots > > I have been looking for a good quality boot, waterproof, durable, >for dirt / road use, any recommendations or experience that anyone would >like to share ? > I have reviewed the archives and would still like a little more >information. I have seen an Alpinestar Stage Goretex in black, but from >the picture they don't seem to be that well suited for off road use. > >Thanks for all the excellent information, and to the people who make it >happen, > >Brian -A12- BC, Canada > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 18:58:34 -0800 From: "Jeff & Lisa Walker" Subject: Re: (klr650) [NKRL] Hydraulic Valves Hydraulic Lash Adjusters never need adjusting because they use the hydraulic pressure supplied by the engine oil pressure to expand and take up the slack in the valves. That said, they require an engine oil pressure greater than an engine without HLA's. Higher engine oil pressure means more power from the engine is used to drive the oil pump, more high pressure components in the oil system, and more headaches. Also, Hydraulic engines can be notoriously sloppy in their valve timing, which also robs power. When the valves are chain driven, non-hydraulic, as the KLR's, tighter tolerances can be used in the valve timing. This makes the engine more efficient, which translates to more power, which is oh-so important for the KLR. When I was into Beetles, a company from SOCAL came out with hydraulic valve heads. It was found that the valve timing was sloppy, and robbed power. Plus one had to upgrade the oil pump, and the higher pressure often caused the oil cooler to blow its seals. In many engines today, HLA's can be great, and when running, there is virtually no clearance between the cams and the valves, which is efficient indeed. Then again, I had one HLA get gummed up and stick once, and gawd what a racket. Point is, there are arguments to be made both ways. In many ways, I prefer simpler systems. Less things can go wrong then. Others may prefer the ease of maintenance aspect, not needing to ever adjust the valves. Hell, on my Isuzu, all I ever have to do is change the oil and filter, and adjust the spark plug gaps. What fun is that? One more point, specifically for the KLR. You know how tight the head is in the frame now? The head to accommodate HLA type valves would have to be bigger. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 21:59:45 -0800 From: nocoffee@juno.com Subject: (klr650) Pedersen in Cincinnati Newsflash! Helge' Pedersen of "10 years on 2 wheels" fame for riding over, under and around the world is going to be in Cincinnati April 7th for a presentation from 7:00pm - 10:30 pm. Tickets are available from BMW of the Tri-State 513.860.1114 Anyone else on this list from the Cinci area? Norm C. ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 19:10:43 -0800 From: "Jeff & Lisa Walker" Subject: Re: (klr650) Alpinestar Boots >I ride in Danner Gor-tex combat boots. They are comfy and waterproof. You >can ride all day in them and go hiking if you want to /have to - heck I have >even run more than a few miles in them. They lace from just above the toe >to well past the ankle. Having tried and owned a lot of boots these are >without a doubt the nicest ones I own. > >As an added bonus they look pretty decent with dockers or jeans for those >times when you don't want to scream."..I GOTTA MOTO-CYCLE!". > I always found the Danner Gortex to be too heavy and too HOT for my feet for serious field use, except in very cold conditions. I could see them being good for riding in the cold, but after I went inside, my feet would be sweating in them. For that reason, I've really been liking my Corcoran Jump Boots, seriously polished with Kiwi. Greatly waterproof, warm enough, and don't look too funny under my jeans at work and class. For off-roading, I use my leather combat boots (leg boots for you airborne types) having to get over the shame in not having my feet shod in my jump boots or jungle boots is worth the comfort and protection that these boots offer. Maybe one day I'll invest the wampum in something like Alpinstars, but I can't imagine them being comfortable enough to wear all over campus after my commute, and would look kind of strange. My absolute favorite boot to wear around all day, every day, are my HI-Tech Magnums. (I very rarely wear shoes.) I don't think that these would be the most protective for riding though, and they are an all nylon upper. Yes, the Danners are a great choice, except for the heat and weight aspect. But hey, wearing that extra weight on your feet all the time would bulk up your leg muscles some, and after a while you wouldn't notice it anymore. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 19:48:39 -0800 From: "Jeff & Lisa Walker" Subject: Re: (klr650) Fuse Block Wire Gauge >Jeff, > You`re right as far as Ohm`s Law goes, but there are many other factors >involved that have to be taken in account, and Ohm`s Law is not sufficient >for the whole system. Sorry to dissagree again, but Ohm's Law is a physical law, and thus holds true always. Granted it isn't truly a linear relationship, as resistance increases with temperature, but its a close enough approximation for our purposes. Yes, every splice and switch and what not adds resistance. When calculating the total resistance of a serial circuit, you must add the resistance of every individual object in that circuit. The entire system consists of several parallel circuits, each one branch of the system has its own total resistance. Overall resistance for parallel circuits is less than circuits in series, of course, but that's not the issue. The entire system has an EMF (electromotor force), the voltage, which is supplied by the battery and the charging system, and for the most part is fairly constant, between what 11.5 to 13.5 volts? The entire system has a total resistance, and the entire system has a current flowing through it, as determined by how many devices are on and drawing current. You yourself gave the evidence that your system is flowing more amps through it, you said that your lights burn brighter. If the voltage stays the same, then the only thing that can cause this is a change in current, which means less resistance, and more amps. That is my only point, and it is irrefutable. I already said that I was guessing that the charging system was insuffecient, based on how much my lights dim at idle. You also need to remember that the appliance itself >effects the system.This bike has a complex 3-phase charging system that has >been rendered problematic, due in effect to cost cutting measures on >Kawasaki`s part, through minimal use of wire and minimum sizes of wire, >based on computer programs of the bike. Yes, less resistance means more >current flow, but the problem is that the resistance in the system is too >high for the required draw. The appliance is also a factor. A 60 watt light >will not draw 20 amps just because the 10AWG line will allow it and it`s >available. Because of the number of splices and connections in the KLR`s >circuit, resistance does add up. As I said, every object in the circuit has a resistance, and they all must be added to calculate the total resistance. > Going to large is one thing, but wire of insufficient gauge is another >factor. Since re-wiring, I`m using 80watt lights, running lights, GPS and >heated grips ( which I`ll be removing for other reasons) all while being >monitored by my installed volt meter, amp meter and battery monitor, all >showing a healthy charging system with no excessive draw on the battery. Go >figure. The argument can be made from a design standpoint that the wires are of sufficient size if they don't get overly hot during full draw, and all the "appliances" are functional. This is an economic argument though, not an efficiency argument. In the ideal world, wires, switches, splices and other connections would have zero resistance. I'm very glad to hear that your charging system can handle all of those accessories, but I'm wondering about the thermodynamics conservation aspect, meaning if you are working your charging system at max output at all times, with no reserve capacity, then won't the lifespan of the system be lessened? Consider two identical cars, except one is powered by a V-8 and one a V-6. All things being equal, the V-8 should last longer, since it doesn't have to run at max power to match the output of the V-6. Hey, I don't claim to know it all, and I am attempting to get a more clear understanding of this. I would love to have brighter lights, and someday I probably will upgrade the wires in my for my lights, but I also don't plan on running any accessories either. My entire point is that upgrading the wires does make the system more efficient, but also draws more amps from the charging system because more amps are flowing through the circuits. OK, I'll quit now. My apologies for the length, and for flogging a decommissioned beast of burden. Jeff ------------------------------ End of klr650-digest V2 #95 ***************************