From: owner-klr650-digest@lists.xmission.com (klr650-digest) To: klr650-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: klr650-digest V2 #371 Reply-To: klr650 Sender: owner-klr650-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-klr650-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk klr650-digest Wednesday, May 5 1999 Volume 02 : Number 371 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 18:24:51 -0700 From: "Jeff & Lisa Walker" Subject: Re: (klr650) KLR - NKLR >Okay can someone make a WAV file of the sound of an impact socket driver >working. I am making all the right noises, but I can fool the sprocket >into believing I am using an impact driver - ....=) > I don't have an air impact driver either, but I could record me firing my H&K MP-5, would that be close enough? Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 19:18:00 -0700 From: "Vik Banerjee" Subject: Re: (klr650) KLR - NKLR Ya it might scare the nut loose...lol Vik - -----Original Message----- From: Jeff & Lisa Walker To: Vik Banerjee ; VFR754@aol.com ; klr650@lists.xmission.com Date: Wednesday, May 05, 1999 6:22 PM Subject: Re: (klr650) KLR - NKLR > >>Okay can someone make a WAV file of the sound of an impact >socket driver >>working. I am making all the right noises, but I can fool the >sprocket >>into believing I am using an impact driver - ....=) >> >I don't have an air impact driver either, but I could record me >firing my H&K MP-5, would that be close enough? > >Jeff > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 18:34:39 -0700 From: "Jeff & Lisa Walker" Subject: Re: (klr650) Finally put my 16T on....... > >>Okay the obvious question why no 6th gear? Seems like if you are building a >>5 gear tranny adding one more gear shouldn't be a huge problem with added >>cost or weight. So why does the DR650 and KLR650 only have 5? > > > > Because the KL engine was originaly designed for a rompin', stompin' dirt >bike of sorts and it wasent nessicery for that mission. Now that the KL is >as much a touring bike as anything, the additon of a sixth speed would >entail reengineering the entire geartrain. Also, either the case would have >to be rengineered as well to allow a wider "gearbox" or the gears >themselves would have to be narrower, resulting in shorter service life and >reduced reliability. > > Right on. My Open Class Honda CR only had 4 gears, and believe me, that was more than enough. That bike had way too much power. All the big four strokes have always had 5 gears, no more, no less. Maybe its traditional. Comparing the 6 gear tranny on my old RM 125 to the five gear tranny on my YZ 250, both covered roughly the same range, but the six speed tranny had closer ratio gears, because the motor's power was limited. Well, if after switching to a 16T countersprocket you still are looking for more, I dare say you're going too fast. Jeff--kinda wishing for a granddaddy low gear instead ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 18:37:02 -0700 From: "Jeff & Lisa Walker" Subject: Re: (klr650) KLR 650 Fast Front Fender >We can still get that fender (last time I checked) direct from the Italians. >It is not out of production just not brought here anymore. >We would prefer to order at least 3 or more at a time. The wait is usually >3 months, as they build to order. And you will have to prepay. > Just what is the "Fast Front Fender"? What does it look like? Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 19:48:45 -0600 From: "Kurt Simpson" Subject: Re: (klr650) dangles... >Jake Jakeman mailed me one of those stickers when he sent me some >of his countershaft sprocket shims, along with some insence and a >feather dealie to put on the zipper of my jacket and I can tell you that if Jake ever meets you in person the first thing he'll ask is "where is your dangle"...a word to the wise for anyone meeting Jake at Moab....put it on your coat right now if it isn't already. Jake performs a ritual ceremony over each and every one of these asking the spirits for your safety... Kurt ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 21:46:52 EDT From: GVBettes@aol.com Subject: (klr650) Re: klr650-digest V2 #369 In a message dated 5/5/99 2:07:14 PM Pacific Daylight Time, owner-klr650-digest@lists.xmission.com writes: > - - Is the mounting frame/hardware provided as part > of the package? That is, nothing is required > from the stock seat for the > manufacture/installation/use of the new seat, is > it? I ask this because I would still want to > have my stocker available for local and offroad > riding. They use the stock seat pan and some of the foam to build the new seat. They said they can provide the foam but the seat pan is required. > > - - How long did it take for Russell to get the > order to you? I did a ride in service (for additional cost). Made the appointment in June for October 9. They were able to build seats for both my wife's and my bikes on the same day at the same time. We showed up at 8:30 am and were on the road at 2:30 pm. > > - - Most importantly, how does it rate in terms of > fit, finish, and comfort? Worth recommending? The fit and finish were very good. This is the best improvement I have ever made to any motorcycle in over 30 years. After 8 months I still am amazed every time I get on the bike. They were able to modify the seating position to better fit the rider to the bike. They lowered my wife's seat 1" and raised mine 1". Gary A9 Fresno > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 19:54:29 -0600 From: "Kurt Simpson" Subject: (klr650) Oil breakthough? Dr. Moreau's thoughtful lectures on oils have turned me into a doughnut seeking idiot. You see Dr. Moreau told us to try and find some oils w/o the SJ doughnut. Well, I've found it. It's called Valvoline Premium Blue (formerly Cummins), classification is CG-4/SH, 15w-40w. And the cost? A little over $6.....(pause for dramatic affect) ....per gallon. Kurt ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 19:57:58 -0600 From: "Kurt Simpson" Subject: Re: (klr650) Re: klr650-digest V2 #369 >> - - Most importantly, how does it rate in terms of >> fit, finish, and comfort? Worth recommending? I've followed the Russell threads pretty closely. To my knowledge no one has had either Russell or Bill Maier build a double for rider and passenger on the KLR, struth? They told me they will do it... Kurt ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 22:20:20 -0400 From: "LindaT" Subject: RE: (klr650) Why no 6 Is this possible?? My humble KLR250 of '86 vintage has a 6 speed and the 650s do not?? What's the deal here? I know, poor little engine needs more gears. BTW, the carb has now been torn down and cleaned. The bike was started, but it's no easier to start. Started the first time on the third stroke. Whoopee - hoping for a portent of good things. Let it stall (stupid, stupid) and it didn't restart until oh say the 87th stroke. Warmed it up good, let it stall again (arggggh) and it started again on the 143rd stroke. This is getting old fast. LindaT. 95 F3 Purple Haze (55K miles and counting...) 86 KLR250 Klarabelle http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Pit/4807/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 19:39:04 -0700 From: "e. rhoads" Subject: (klr650) Re: Finally put my 16T on.... > >I'd only be guessing, but it would be interesting to pose this > >question to the inscrutable creators === that's about right as they all live in the country where the bike was designed >>(and their accountants). === good point and integral to the problem no doubt > > > > Wouldn't it be interesting (probably only for a librarian for me) to try and track down the > designer or designer team members of the KLR? I bet it can be done...and I know just the person > for the job...he lives in Portland and his name is Eric... > Kurt > === That's very flattering, thanks. I believe both Mr. T and Tom S. (and others) have already hit the nail on the head. The bike has evolved from a more dirt-oriented past where it seems a 6th gear wasn't considered necessary. I called KHI for more clarification and really couldn't get any more than what's already been surmised here. Part of what I was told is that the tooling is in place for this particular configuration and that the addition of a sixth gear would mean a complete redesign of the engine. A new model would result. (comments from Hiro welcome) One more thing....I wonder how many of us appreciate the huge effect EPA regulations and requirements have on the vehicles we drive? I would guess that the various requirements must add several (many?) thousands of dollars to the price of our cars alone. When I mentioned that a number of us used 16 tooth sprockets I was cautioned that this was an improper thing to do from the standpoint of EPA rules/requirements. I can imagine the requirements must create nightmares for designers and engineers (and accountants) who must produce driveable, reliable cars and bikes at reasonable cost. I wonder where all this is heading.......can you say "mass transit"? regards, eric ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 22:36:10 EDT From: K650dsn@aol.com Subject: Re: (klr650) dangles... In a message dated 5/5/99 7:49:14 PM Mountain Daylight Time, ajax@xmission.com writes: << and I can tell you that if Jake ever meets you in person the first thing he'll ask is "where is your dangle"...a word to the wise for anyone meeting Jake at Moab... >> Yep. When I met him in Idaho he made one for me too. Still have it on my jacket. I got my dangle caught in the zipper a few times. I hate when that happens. Gino ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 19:43:16 -0700 From: "e. rhoads" Subject: (klr650) Re: Finally put my 16T on.... > >I'd only be guessing, but it would be interesting to pose this > >question to the inscrutable creators === that's about right as they all live in the country where the bike was designed >>(and their accountants). === good point and integral to the problem no doubt > > > > Wouldn't it be interesting (probably only for a librarian for me) to try and track down the > designer or designer team members of the KLR? I bet it can be done...and I know just the person > for the job...he lives in Portland and his name is Eric... > Kurt > === That's very flattering, thanks. I believe both Mr. T and Tom S. (and others) have already hit the nail on the head. The bike has evolved from a more dirt-oriented past where it seems a 6th gear wasn't considered necessary. I called KHI for more clarification and really couldn't get any more than what's already been surmised here. Part of what I was told is that the tooling is in place for this particular configuration and that the addition of a sixth gear would mean a complete redesign of the engine. A new model would result. (comments from Hiro welcome) One more thing....I wonder how many of us appreciate the huge effect EPA regulations and requirements have on the vehicles we drive? I would guess that the various requirements must add several (many?) thousands of dollars to the price of our cars alone. When I mentioned that a number of us used 16 tooth sprockets I was cautioned that this was an improper thing to do from the standpoint of EPA rules/requirements. I can imagine the requirements must create nightmares for designers and engineers (and accountants) who must produce driveable, reliable cars and bikes at reasonable cost. I wonder where all this is heading.......can you say "mass transit"? regards, eric ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 22:58:38 EDT From: Cloudhid@aol.com Subject: (klr650) Final Drive Compromise (was 16T) On 5/5/99, jlwalk@prodigy.net writes: [snip] >if after switching to a 16T countersprocket you still are >looking for more, I dare say you're going too fast. >Jeff--kinda wishing for a granddaddy low gear instead The idea is not to increase speed. It's to reduce felt vibration by reducing rpms. I'm with you on the granny gear. Since a 6th gear might be too wide for the case, does anyone have any ideas for finding a shorter 1st and/or taller 5th gear. This would give you better control on the steep and hairy, while smoothing out the interstate slab droning. The best of both worlds without swapping sprockets. I have a 14T for the dirt, but a wider ratio trans would be a better compromise. This engine has plenty of power potential to compensate for the extra reach. The Hink Man thinks it can be done-if you have enough gears to check for a match and a modest markie budget. Anyone? Redondo Ron A10 - ready to break open another secret markie bank ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 22:08:59 -0500 From: "Tom Meagher" Subject: Re: (klr650) Re: Finally put my 16T on.... While y'all are complaining about the lack of a 6th gear on the KLR, I'm simply grateful for the five wonderful ratios it does possess. Compared to say, a BMW GS series (old or new) the wide ratios of the KLR are a delight, as they are adjusted to be a good compromise for the dual purpose role. really. In contrast, I always found my old R100GS ratios to truly suck. This is because BMW was too cheap to develop a new wide ratio gear cluster for the GS. The gearbox was *identical* across the entire line, from R100RS to R100GS, despite different engine tuning and rear-end ratios. You could really throw 4th gear out on the GS, as it is, in fact redundant. 1st was still too high for dirt, even with the 10% overall reduction, and 5th was *way* to low for comfortable highway cruising. The R11GS perpetuates this cheapskate practice, and detracts seriously from what would otherwise be a good bike, IMHO. Note that in Germany, you could buy "granny" first gear and "overdrive" fifth gear replacements, which BMW should have supplied OEM. Now, a 16 tooth sprocket on a KLR would be really great, if somebody made a lower 1st gear. Alternatively, how about a bicycle-style derailleur two speed rear sprocket, eh? Just a thought. Tom Meagher Houston TX A13 [eric wrote] > Part of what I was told is that the tooling is in place for this particular >configuration and that the addition of a sixth gear would mean a complete >redesign of the engine. A new model would result. (comments from Hiro >welcome) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 20:14:08 -0700 From: "Arne Larsen" Subject: Re: (klr650) Alternate engines for KLR >I've been thinking a Suzuki SV650 engine would fit nicely in the engine bay. >Imagine a KLR that would out run a Ducati M900 Monster. Hmmmm.... >Gino, it's okay to dream, Pokluda I feel a ripple in the Force... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 20:30:46 -0700 From: "e. rhoads" Subject: (klr650) Huh !? NKLR Did I really post that twice? ...doggone.....pardon me if I did, I didn't really think it was *that* good.... eric ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 20:32:44 From: Guy Cheney Subject: Re: (klr650) mike those feelers NKLR At 12:04 AM 5/5/99 -0700, you wrote: >Here's a second thought on miking your feeler gauges....since this sort of >came up anyway. > >My brand new set of offset feelers from Sears have a burr on the leading >edges which I think could affect insertion. Apparently I had a burr on my leading edge when born but the medical establishment convinced my dear mama that it was healthful to have it removed. I've not had any problems with insertion so I guess it's just water under the bridge. Guy (not even of the Jewish persuasion) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 20:47:38 -0700 From: "Arne Larsen" Subject: Re: (klr650) RE: Engines While there was a KZ750 triple at once upon a time, I bought my new KZ750 in 1980. It was a four cylinder. The KZ650 has always been a four I think. Arne - -----Original Message----- From: Bryce Hysjulien To: KLR 650 list Date: May 5, 1999 2:33 PM Subject: (klr650) RE: Engines >What about a Ninja 500 engine? There are a lot of YZ 490s around where I >live. That would be interesting, especially modified. Would a KZ 650 or >750 fit? I think they were both twins. How about a Suzuki Gamma (500 V4 >two stroke, I think)? The things that would roll out of my garage if I were >independently wealthy... > >Bryce >98 KLR > > ------------------------------ End of klr650-digest V2 #371 ****************************