From: owner-kraftwerk-digest@lists.xmission.com (kraftwerk-digest) To: kraftwerk-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: kraftwerk-digest V2 #247 Reply-To: kraftwerk-digest Sender: owner-kraftwerk-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-kraftwerk-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes kraftwerk-digest Tuesday, December 15 1998 Volume 02 : Number 247 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 11:27:48 +0100 From: "Christian Di Sante" Subject: R: RAP and KW. (Re: (kw) Hip-hop music--recognize the real!) > Da: 47 <47@radiolink.net> > For me one Kraftwerk > >album is worth tons of albums by DJs. > > DJ's remix and make new music, it takes incredible skill, talent, > coordination, and dexterity to be able to manipulate records the way DJ's > do. take a listen to Q-bert, Invisble Scratch Piklz. no drum machines, no > synthesizers, just man (DJ), machine (turntable), and music (record). now > how is that different from KW? > > lenny g Because KW uses drum machines and synthesizers, it's obvious ! ! ! They produces their OWN music, they don't create a collage of music by DIFFERENT artists ! Isn't it? Didi Milan - PDN robotnik@iol.it # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 11:04:37 +0100 From: "Christian Di Sante" Subject: R: RAP and KW. (Re: (kw) Hip-hop music--recognize the real!) > Da: Vladimir Ivaschenko > > 3. "Rappers" (not MCs) do not represent the music or the culture. If you > > think Puffy, Mase, and the like represent true hip-hop, YOU ARE DEAD > > WRONG!!!! You want lyrics? Hear KRS-One, Company Flow, Wu-Tang, Gang > > Starr, The Pharcyde, A Tribe Called Quest, Jeru the Damaja, Nas, and > > X-Clan, just to name a few. Real lyricists teach and speak the truth > > about the ills in our (USAn) society, but that's just the tip of the > > iceberg. > > > > Well, tastes differ. I think that music first of all should consist of musical > sound, not text. For me important is how one sings, not the text he/she speaks. > I live in a country where most people don't speak English and so don't > understand the text. That's why not many people like rap (ok, hip-hop) over > here. When they watch videoclips, they see people which look and act like they > are bandits from the streets. I bet they don't think that "yeah, they must be > teaching and speaking the truth about the ills of their (USAn) society.". They > think that those rappers ARE the ills of the society. WONDERFUL ! ! ! >For me one Kraftwerk album is worth tons of albums by DJs. YOU ARE MY BEST FRIEND ! ! ! > My language may be too simple, sorry, it's hard to express this kind of stuff in > words... NO PROBLEM ! > Vladimir Didi Milan - PDN robotnik@iol.it # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 14:04:06 +0300 From: Vladimir Ivaschenko Subject: Re: RAP and KW. (Re: (kw) Hip-hop music--recognize the real!) 47 wrote: > >Really I didn't wanted to say that people listen only rap in cars, they listen > >other music, which doesn't disturb them. > > really? i thought people listen to Gary Neuman in their cars, it's the only > way to live. > Ok, I admit I could be wrong wit this. Unfortunately I'm still far from KW ideals - - I make mistakes, so I'm still human :-( What's worse, I listen to acoustic music and I like jazz ;) > > anyway, your're a cool cat, Vladimir. i dig Pulp Fiction too, all Tarantino > movies. do you live in Russia or else where. i used to live there ten > years ago, in Minsk. > That was back in Soviet Union then. Yeah, I live in Russia. Vladimir # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 14:03:38 +0300 From: Vladimir Ivaschenko Subject: (kw) Re: KW and modern music. (was Re: RAP and KW) 47 wrote: > Vladimir Ivaschenko wrote: > > > >Kraftwerk gives me feelings that no other group managed to give..., > > Kraftwerk? Feeling? isn't that an oxymoron? a Paradox? > Yeah, sort of. I was thinking about it. You know, machine feelings. I said that there are no human feelings. But there are other and strange. I still don't understand them really, you know, when you listen to other music, you feel happy or bad, love or hate etc.. When I listen to Kraftwerk, I feel something other, non-human, I feel it. Previously I had this feelings (or emotions) when I was placing them in reality - eg., I remember when 10 years ago I (visited for the first time) computing center with a big room with mainframe and three floors of terminals :-) Printers were typing, tapes were rewinding, lights were flashing... Listening to Computer World I get the same emotions, but via music.. Hmm... > > For me one Kraftwerk > >album is worth tons of albums by DJs. > > DJ's remix and make new music, it takes incredible skill, talent, > coordination, and dexterity to be able to manipulate records the way DJ's > do. take a listen to Q-bert, Invisble Scratch Piklz. no drum machines, no > synthesizers, just man (DJ), machine (turntable), and music (record). now > how is that different from KW? > Hmm, KW makes music about man-machine, but KW were not man machine when they were making their music (they are when they are playing it, however). You know, there is some science fiction story about future when the machines took all the hard work from human, but the human was left to create, to invent, because that was the thing machines couldn't do. They could improve what they had, but they couldn't invent anything completely new. So human and machines were living together in symbiosis. But still DJ music is not for me, it annoys and bores me, because *for me* it almost always sounds the same. The same beats (but different samples), with the same passages etc.. Recently I was listening to some "hits" (yeah, I don't admit that their music is really the best of their kind...) - "babydrop","venus rapsody","children","breath of sax", and you know, their music was structered, constructed the same, and it sounded the same, and it had the same feeling (really I feel sleepy after listening to it). Also, much of the music doesn't have an idea (or is it hided so well?). All KW songs (starting at least from Autobahn period) have some kind of original idea. Radioactivity, transmitter/antenna, neon lights, Europe is endless... Now what is DJ music about? I do not say that I don't like music by DJs/rappers. I can like it, listen to it several times, but after some time I become bored with it and it just becomes another CD in my collection. Now there are CDs which I listen at least once in two days. Among them are all KW, YELLO, JMJARRE (another strange fact; his music is somewhat simple sometimes, but I still like it), some of the Art of Noise.. I can put a KW CD in CD player, turn on loop mode, and listen to it 10 times continiously before my ears would feel that I need to change it (while doing work). I don't get bored. And speaking about dexterity - hmmm, never noticed this from KW :-) Vladimir # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 14:08:52 +0300 From: Vladimir Ivaschenko Subject: Re: (kw) Video Clips thomas m weibrecht wrote: > >bandwidth and disk space. > > > > and, if you are going to insult people, please do so in their own > language...thanks... Ok, may be I was unpolite with that guy.. I'm sorry. Vladimir # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 14:37:45 +0100 From: "Der Automat" Subject: (kw) Neotropic I-F Bradley Strider Bochum Welt Dynamix II Tangerine Dream The new album "Mr. Brubaker's Strawberry Alarm Clock" (NTone, 1998) by Neotropic (Riz Maslen (a.k.a. Small Fish With Spine)), apparently, includ= es a cover version of "Hall of Mirrors". Is anybody able to confirm this? "Space Invaders Are Smoking Grass" by I-F is a song (included in their "Fucking Consumer" (Disko B) LP) made by means of catchy retrofuturism an= d robotic chorus. Bradley Strider has a record entitled "Bradley's Robot" (Rephlex cat020). Bochum Welt (aka Gianluigi Di Constanzo), in his CD-singles "Desktop Robotics" (Rephlex cat051, 1997) and "Feelings On A Screen" (Rephlex cat046, 1997) has clear influences from KRAFTWERK, Trevor Horn, Ryuichi Sakamoto, Thomas Dolby (with whom also has collaborated) and the Sheffiel= d scene of the early eighties. "Non Stop Electro Megamix. From 1985 To Present" 4LP/CD (Rephlex cat065) = is a compilation of the 12"s by Dynamix II. And the KRAFTWERK's influence is not only in the title. Tangerine Dream have released recently two albums "Tournado-Live in Europ= e" (recorded in 1997) and "Quiona" (with three unreleased tracks). BTW, I've got (available for sale or trade) an only spare copy of cassett= e Kraftwerk/Organisation "Tone Float". If you're interested e-mail me. Firs= t come first served. DER AUTOMAT =AE # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 03:19:57 PST From: "Ricardo Cassolatto" Subject: (kw) Hip - Hop If somebody on this list with +- 28/30 years old, remember, The Afrika=20 Bambaata/Soul Sonic Force 1982 Planet Rock song uses the NUMBER drum=20 beats with T.E.E. basic melody !!!!!!! And I believe, the drums beat is not a sampled edition to Planet Rock=20 song, only the TEE melody !!!!! Samples are old than can you imagine !!,=20 because we are in 1998/99 - 1982 =3D 16 year of history, this for actual=20 music tecnology is like a century !!!! And today all bands using the=20 modern synthetizers, virtual analog sinthetizers and keyboards, uses=20 sample for the basic song engine, nothin live without samples, on live=20 PA, use and abuses about samples, like others moderns bands, the problem=20 is not the samples , is the creativity, some have, some no !!!!!! Listen=20 , before discuss, critical comments about samples is only if you really=20 know you talking about !!! We are turning to the second milenium of christian age, why not uses the=20 technology, samples, drum boxes, but with creativity, the great dream of=20 technology=B4s men is imitate the nature, today we can imitate the songs,= =20 this is first steps, Kraftwerk make this 20 year ago !!! and continue=20 actual than some todays bands !!!! and uses samples, or you believe the=20 live show you see is realtime played ???? !!!!! Thanx for all here !!!! IMHO, let discuss about KRaftwerk and their=20 influences, everybody usus technology, we are using e-mail to=20 communication, but I never see the faces of people here, but have some=20 feeling, virtual, but this exists !!!!! ************************************************** ** Merry Christmas - Happy, very happy New Year ** ** Peace and music for all people of the world ** ************************************************** The Sintetik Way Of Life - sintetik@hotmail.com =20 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 03:58:40 PST From: "Nicolau Centola" Subject: (kw) Here we go again! Where is Mr. Zaepke? Maybe on vacation? Help us, please! Here we go again in another flame battle... and now not for our=20 favourite band (well, I consider KW is our favourite band. If not, maybe=20 this list has no reason to live). We (not me, please) started to talk about rap and so on... I remember=20 some time ago we talked about the toppics for this list. And it seemed=20 rasonable for me that this list is dedicated to KW and "related" bands.=20 Yes, I know the term "related" is very subjective, but if we start to=20 talk about all bands or music influenced by KW, we HAVE to talk about=20 rap, eletronic music, David Bowie, Brian Eno, new wave, Ultravox, Devo,=20 Industrial, Acqua, Frente, dance, hip hop, disco, Giorgio Moroder, even=20 Heavy Metal (treponem pal made a nice cover from radioactivity), ebm=20 (somebody remember them?), Joy Division, pop music, techno, jungle,=20 classical music (maybe Barlanescu?), eletronic jazz, Duran Duran and new=20 romantics (anybody remember Classix Noveaux?), another 1.694.002.536.776=20 undergroud (or not) bands, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc... So please, I don=B4t have nothing against rap or hip hop. It=B4s not my=20 favourite kind of music... I have to confess I listened some first=20 generation artists some time ago (maybe 8 or 10 years ago)... and I=B4m a= =20 little bit borrowed about this music. The new rap artists now just talk=20 about how many girls they took, or the size of their penis and so on...=20 and this is not my favourite kind of lyrics. (please don=B4t took it like an generalization. Of course I know there=B4= s a=20 lot of rap artists talking about many important themes. So please don=B4t= =20 send me a list of them, OK?) Did you note I called rap bands like artists and not musicians? Well,=20 IMHO, rap is much more connected with speak and not music. Musician is a=20 guy who plays music, and artist is a guy who express their culture=20 through a lot of different ways, including music, but not only music.=20 OK, don=B4t send me no consideration about the difference between=20 musician, artists, rap, pop, music or noise, please. I will not talk=20 about it. It=B4s just my oppinion. Look, I=B4m not against a little of rap at KW list, I said more than one=20 time I love to hear all kind of oppinions... but please, don=B4t make it=20 the only toppic of our list, OK? If you love to talk about rap, there=B4s= =20 a lot of rap lists in the net. I would not like to open my mail and have=20 428 messages about rap and not even one about KW (it can be just one=20 from our friend Automat talking about a concert from a band playing KW=20 music or Klaus talking about a corean article about KW. I like this=20 too..) Please Klaus, come back! :-) BTW, Merry Christmas for everybody!!! peace Nicolau http://members.xoom.com/kraftworld/ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 14:08:51 GMT-3 From: "Jan Luitingh" Subject: (kw) Re: kraftwerk-digest V2 #246 Dear members. My name is Jan Luitingh. I am a Kraftwerk fan, and living in South Africa. My music liking varies from Bach, Bartok, Chopin, Moricone, Mike Oldfield to Pink Floyd, Joe Satriani and so on. Then, I like Kraftwerk. I would say, one don't listen to KW, you live it!! I particularly like the German versions of their Albums, because they are really Germans, although I own some of their English versions. The Man Mashine and Electric Cafe is my favourites. No, let me refrase: My favourites is all of KW, but I listen to these the most!! I was really worried when I received the first digest, because I thought that some of the people that contribute to it, aren't really Kraftwerkers, because they act/debate like idiots!! For me, to listen to Kraftwerk, you have to be intelligent and open minded. Try to stop the bullshit and get on with intelligent debate and informative discussions!!! I like to know if every single little roomer on a new album is true or just a hoax? Lets discuss this like Kraftwerkers, instead of insulting each other like stupid people, O.K!! I also want to find out, given the age of the two "permanent" members of the group (nota bene: not band!!), if there is any future for tours, concerts or new albums/singles. (I know about their new two "werks" that was recently performed. Cheers and thank you very much Jan Luitingh Pretoria, South Africa # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 10:32:47 -0700 From: "Gary Pedoto" Subject: (kw) Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 12:31:48 -0500 If joined a group to read about The Beatles, that's what I would expect to read about. If I joined a group to read about Rick Wakeman, I would expect to read about Rick Wakeman. I joined this group to read about Kraftwerk. I came here to find where to buy concert recordings, rare LPs, CDs and other things related to KRAFTWERK. I didn't join this group to hear about Puff Pappa Crack Head and MC Grandmaster Car Thief. Before any of you politically correct watchdogs starts calling me a racist... My black friends won't even allow that crap in their house. I work with a black guy (the son of one of my friends) who brings that garbage in to work and every other word is motherf__cker, cocks__ker, ni__er, etc... Real uplifting and positive music, huh? How about keeping this list about KRAFTWERK? Those of you accusing me of going off topic should go back and read past posts. One night, as I was reading the latest digest, I thought I received the wrong list. I got half-way down the page until I saw something about KRAFTWERK. This is a KRAFTWERK group, in case some of you have forgotten. Gary # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 09:01:30 -0800 (PST) From: Jeff Young Subject: (kw) Automat BS Der Automat wrote: > The new album "Mr. Brubaker's Strawberry Alarm Clock" (NTone, 1998) by > Neotropic (Riz Maslen (a.k.a. Small Fish With Spine)), apparently, includes > a cover version of "Hall of Mirrors". > Is anybody able to confirm this? You seem to have the information--why does this need "confirming??" > Tangerine Dream have released recently two albums "Tournado-Live in Europe" > (recorded in 1997) and "Quiona" (with three unreleased tracks). I like TD, but why are you giving us all this non-KW info? Jeff _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 12:34:30 EST From: SLDubster@aol.com Subject: (kw) Africa Bambaataa and KW A few years ago, I saw a show on public television about rap music and its roots. Kraftwerk was mentioned in this show. I could of sworn that Africa Bambaataa said that he introduced KW to America. When he said this, he didn't mean by doing "Planet Rock", but by telling club DJs about TEE and "Autobaun". Is this true or did Americans know about KW way before hand? S C O T T # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 12:37:38 EST From: SLDubster@aol.com Subject: Re: (kw) MIME-Version: 1.0 In a message dated 98-12-14 21:52:49 EST, you write: > > There's no melody, there's no originality, there's no nothing. > It's > the > > same beat, I think that anybody that does not enjoy or maybe understand rap music would think that all rap sounds alike. I'm not too much into country or classical. I feel the same way, and that is most of those types of music sound the same. What does "unt Kraft" mean anyway? S C O T T # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 12:30:42 EST From: SLDubster@aol.com Subject: Re: (kw) (C) rap "music" and hip-hop (music) In a message dated 98-12-14 21:47:27 EST, you write: > who steal KW music and play it in their mixes. honestly, if it wasn't for > the sampling of KW by hip-hop, rap acts, I own over 400 rap albums, and honestly, I have not heard too many artists that sample KW. On the top of my head, I can think of Sir Mix-A-Lot, Kool G Rap and DJ Polo, and MC Lyte using samples of KW music. What am I missing? I don't include Planet Rock as a sample because that sounds like it was re-done and not sampled. S C O T T # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 19:14:15 +0000 From: Lbo Subject: Re: (kw) Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 12:31:48 -0500 > This is a KRAFTWERK group, in case some of you have forgotten. well, maybe it's a short time you are here, but you know, after a while you just run out of matters directly related to K. if sometime someone take it from a wider point of view - without exaggerations, well, where is the problem?... I am sure you had all the occasion to read about cd, boot, concert etc. take the other messages as a plus and think how boring an empty list could be. and please all, don't talk like professors to other, ok? try to be more nice. someone talk like he has all the wisdom of the world and just look like a frustrated stupid. # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 13:04:43 EST From: SLDubster@aol.com Subject: (kw) Related Artists Hi. I am interested in knowing about other artists who sound like KW. I have heard of a group I think called Elektrik Musik or something to that effect. Also, who is this group called Kraftwelt? I always see their albums in the KW section, especially at Virgin Megastore. I am especially interested in stuff that came out in the 1980's. It is kind of hard to get into most music of the 1990's. Anyway, if you can suggest some other similar artists, please let me know if their stuff is still available. Thanks, S C O T T # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 12:38:07 -0600 From: Chris Stann Subject: RE: (kw) Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 12:31:48 -0500 >My black friends won't even allow that crap in their house. I work with = a black guy=20 Good for you. Since KW was so influential in early rap, I'd say that = discussing KW and rap is definitely ON the subject. > This is a KRAFTWERK group, in case some of you have forgotten. You're right, this is a KRAFTWERK group. How many times can you talk = about Florian's latest haircut? If you choose to discuss nothing but KW = and exclude all other related subjects, this email list will become = like, well, rap. Redundant and very repetitive. I think we're just too old for this. Face it, my fellow KW fans. We're = just a bunch of grumpy old men, and women. Have we become our parents? - -----Original Message----- From: Gary Pedoto [SMTP:lpmj@worldnet.att.net] Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 1998 11:33 AM To: kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com Subject: (kw) Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 12:31:48 -0500 If joined a group to read about The Beatles, that's what I would expect to read about. If I joined a group to read about Rick Wakeman, I would expect to read about Rick Wakeman. I joined this group to read about Kraftwerk. I came here to find where = to=20 buy concert recordings, rare LPs, CDs and other things related to=20 KRAFTWERK. I didn't join this group to hear about Puff Pappa Crack Head and MC Grandmaster Car Thief.=20 Before any of you politically correct watchdogs starts calling me a racist... My black friends won't even allow that crap in their house. I work with = a black guy (the son of one of my friends) who brings that garbage in to work = and every other=20 word is motherf__cker, cocks__ker, ni__er, etc... Real uplifting and positive music, huh? How about keeping this list about KRAFTWERK? Those of you accusing me of going off topic should go back and read past posts. One night, as I was = reading the latest digest, I thought I received the wrong list. I got half-way down the = page until I saw something about KRAFTWERK. This is a KRAFTWERK group, in case some of you have forgotten. Gary # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original = sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: = http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 12:30:05 -0700 From: "FXCordero" Subject: Re: (kw) Africa Bambaataa and KW SLDubster writes: >A few years ago, I saw a show on public television about rap music and its >roots. Kraftwerk was mentioned in this show. I could of sworn that Africa >Bambaataa said that he introduced KW to America. When he said this, he didn't >mean by doing "Planet Rock", but by telling club DJs about TEE and "Autobaun". >Is this true or did Americans know about KW way before hand? Poppycock! Gay and black DJ's were spinning TEE in clubs back in '77. Dance crowds even emulated robotic moves on the dancefloor. Brian Chin writes: ".....co-founder Ralf Hutter was already hearing his own music at New York after-hours loft parties around 1976..." DJFRANKX http://members.tripod.com/~DJFRANKX/kw2000.htm # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 20:10:49 -0000 From: "Jim Rusbridge" Subject: (kw) R E S P E C T O N E A N O T H E R O.K. everyone this is getting out of hand. Its time to get back to basics, this is a Kraftwerk mail list, lets keep it that way and not turn it into a free for all slagging match. Respect others musical taste and views as they respect yours. If you feel you cant then you should leaving the list. Jim Members Numbers Money People # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 13:26:46 -0700 (MST) From: Ra Subject: Re: (kw) Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 12:31:48 -0500 On Tue, 15 Dec 1998, Lbo wrote: > > This is a KRAFTWERK group, in case some of you have forgotten. > > well, maybe it's a short time you are here, but you know, after a while > you just run out of matters directly related to K. if sometime someone > take it from a wider point of view - without exaggerations, well, where > is the problem?... I don't see a problem, as long as the wanderings stay KW-related. It would be nice if we could be civil about our disagreements as well. I think a case can be made that KW had some influence on early rap and hip-hop and I'm not against discussion of that, but I'm tired of this debate over modern hip-hop that has little or no relation to KW. I would rather see an empty list than this noise. > I am sure you had all the occasion to read about cd, boot, concert etc. > take the other messages as a plus and think how boring an empty list > could be. It's been empty before. No big deal. > and please all, don't talk like professors to other, ok? try to be more > nice. someone talk like he has all the wisdom of the world and just > look like a frustrated stupid. Are you suggesting that we should not use our best grammar and spelling? /* Soleil "Ra" Lapierre www.cuug.ab.ca/~lapierrs * * The remarkable thing about the human mind is its range of limitations. */ # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 13:32:47 -0700 (MST) From: Ra Subject: Re: (kw) Related Artists On Tue, 15 Dec 1998 SLDubster@aol.com wrote: > Hi. I am interested in knowing about other artists who sound like KW. I have > heard of a group I think called Elektrik Musik or something to that effect. Others know more about that than I do. As I understand it, EM was formed by Karl Bartos after he left KW. He took a lot of KW samples along with him. I only have one EM single though, so I don't have much to say about them. > Also, who is this group called Kraftwelt? I always see their albums in the KW > section, especially at Virgin Megastore. I am especially interested in stuff Kraftwelt albums are tributes to Kraftwerk. The first three are "Electric Dimension", "Deranged in Space" and "Retroish". I recommend them, but I also say they're not KW-ish music. Some of their tracks could be said to have a KW flavor, but they are mostly a different style. > that came out in the 1980's. It is kind of hard to get into most music of the > 1990's. Anyway, if you can suggest some other similar artists, please let me > know if their stuff is still available. I can't think of much from the 80s, but there is Komputer, of course. I consider their "World of Tomorrow" very KW-like. There is also a compilation of KW tributes out called "Trancewerk Express vol. 1" - I'm not sure if there is a second volume or not. /* Soleil "Ra" Lapierre www.cuug.ab.ca/~lapierrs * * The remarkable thing about the human mind is its range of limitations. */ # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 21:51:05 +0100 From: "Christian Di Sante" Subject: R: (kw) Related Artists > Da: SLDubster@aol.com > > Hi. I am interested in knowing about other artists who sound like KW. I have > heard of a group I think called Elektrik Musik or something to that effect. > Also, who is this group called Kraftwelt? I always see their albums in the KW > section, especially at Virgin Megastore. I am especially interested in stuff > that came out in the 1980's. It is kind of hard to get into most music of the > 1990's. Anyway, if you can suggest some other similar artists, please let me > know if their stuff is still available. You should try to listen to ALL Kraftwelt albums :Electric Dimension, Retroish, Deranged in space; they' re beautiful. Elektrik Music is a group by K.Bartos and L.Manteuffell, I liked very much their first album "Esperanto". If you liked Computer World you must buy Elecktroids album Elecktroworld. Didi Milan - PDN robotnik@iol.it # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 22:08:15 +0100 From: "Christian Di Sante" Subject: (kw) KW on italian TV!!! It's incredible!!!!!! On italian TV national channel RAI2, at 20:40 today, in background of a report there was a cover version of Autobahn, like the ones you can find in Synthesizer Compilations ! ! ! It run for about 30 sec. Didi Milan - PDN robotnik@iol.it # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 11:44:46 +0100 From: "Fischer, Hans-Peter" Subject: (kw) Misc. >Musziknut wrote: >2. Hip-hop is one of the most important musical and cultural movements of >the century. You=B4re definatly right, but as most things get commercial at a = certain point, they loose originality as well as cultural importance. With = people like Puff Daddy, HipHop went the same way e.g. Synthi Pop went, it was underground first and then got commercial... >4. Beats ARE music! The absence of melody does not disqualify it from >being music. It's a purely Western (and of Mighty Whytie) belief that >melody is the essence of music. You can have music without melody, but >you CANNOT have music without Rhythm. Just think of some traditional arabian music, which is arhythmic.=20 >6. John Cage said that there's no sound that's not music Now that=B4s a true statement, and I Ralf and Florian would agree to = that too! >Vladimir Ivaschenko wrote: >I live in a country where most people don't speak English and so don't >understand the text. That's why not many people like rap (ok, hip-hop) over >here.=20 Hmm, here in Germany it=B4s vice versa, if more people would understand = what they=B4re singing (or better: saying), they=B4d stop listening to it... = (Stuff like "I=B4m not a player, I just fuck a lot" or "I=B4m the best in all positions"... Got not much to do with the political motivaton of the = early HipHop artists) But we shouldn=B4t dicuss about HipHop, some of us like it, some = don=B4t, there=B4s no point in discussing that, the point is we=B4re here = because we all like Kraftwerk. On Sunday, I=B4ve listened to the radio (HR XXL, a station here in = Hesse where they play mainly "young" music) and they played a song I didn=B4t know = and the presenter said after it "This was what electronic music sounded like = BEFORE there was techno". Then they gave a historical overview of the = development of electronic music, starting with the 1920=B4s instruments, mentioning = the big influence of Stockhausen, the Krautrock era and the SynthiPop in = the beginning of the 80=B4s (Depeche Mode, OMD, etc.). They also mentioned = how the instruments changed and other styles that grew more or less directly = from that root, like EBM and Industrial and even the early HipHop. They = haven=B4t mentioned KW to that point, but that changed: "The band with the = biggest influence to this process...", but they haven=B4t told anything new. It = ended with the sound of TEE in the background, which was changed to the remix = of Anthony Rother then. I really didn=B4t expect to hear KW on this = station, so it really made my day! :) Peter # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 21:52:45 +0000 From: Philip Spedding Subject: (kw) The list Chris Stann wrote: "How many times can you talk about Florian's latest haircut" Florian still has hair to cut?? I loved all the postings about RAP, Hip Hop and Kraftwerk. Much is made of Kraftwerk's influence on this atypical American style of music and therefore, IMHO, it is on topic. I thought/think it is an interesting debate, I learnt much, and there was some great humour laced into it (as well as some unnecessary bluntness) Thank you one and all who added to the debate! On another matter... Has anyone produced a really interesting bootleg, devoid of irritating non-kraftwerk re-mixes and instead full of never-before-released-on-cd original Kraftwerk tracks. Examples abound: The non-English/German language tracks (eg.Sex-Object in Spanish) Housephone and similar b-sides The Tour de France versions (yeah, one's a remix, but an original one!) etc. Surely that would be worth putting together. - -- Philip S # Need help using (or leaving) this mailing list? # Send the command "info kraftwerk" to majordomo@lists.xmission.com. # To post, email kraftwerk@lists.xmission.com; replies go to original sender. # Other questions? Read the FAQ: http://web.bham.ac.uk/busbykg/kraftwerk/FAQ/ ------------------------------ End of kraftwerk-digest V2 #247 *******************************