From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: FCC Public File Auto-FAQ Date: 01 Dec 1999 06:46:33 PST This "FAQ" is auto-posted once a month via cron triggered script, and may be triggered off by hand from time to time in between if the info is requested by someone, such as when the House recently voted down the AW Ban and the Media threw a hissy fit. The purpose of this FAQ is to inform people what they can do about Media generated lies and misinformation. While the FCC only handles Broadcast Media, (TV and Radio), some of these techniques will work for magazines and newspapers too. If I've missed something, or you find errors, let me know and I'll add/fix it. 1.a. Send letters of complaint to the Station Manager every time it happens with all the time, details, other info, and your complaint(s). 1.b. Send an additional copy for their FCC (Federal Communications Commission) Public file. 1.c. Send an additional copy to the FCC itself, in case they don't put it in their Public file. 2.a. Send a letter of complaint to their Station Owner as per above, with copies as per above (1.b and 1.c). 3. Send copies of their replies to you along with yours to them to their FCC Public file, so that it gets nice and fat, again, with copies to the FCC itself. 4. If you can afford it, send all corespondence by Certified Mail with Return Receipt Requested. Send a copy of the Return Receipt with everything that goes to the FCC itself, so that they will have additional evidence if the Station is cheating on their Public File. 5.a. Go to the Public Library and look up "Standard Rate and Data Services" (SRDS) "Directory of National Advertisers." It is found in many major Libraries (in the business/reference stacks), and lists EVERY current advertiser, who the players are at both the company and advertising agency(s), and the appropriate telephone and fax (and probably E-Mail by now) addresses. If your Library doesn't have it, it can be requested. Otherwise you can watch their commercials for a few days to a week, listing all their advertisers. There are other references that have the addresses for the nation's business headquarters too. look them all up and pass the addresses and phone/FAX numbers etc., around so that everyone can bitch to the sponsors. IF enough people do that, it'll get back to the Station. Tell them if the Station continues their nastiness you'll _consider_ changing to brand(X), (otherwise they'll just write you off as a loss). 5.b. The above, (5.a.), can be a lot easier and less time consuming if you're dealing with a newspaper's or a magazine's ads, as they are right in front of you for the listing. 6. If they put on something good or even just more reasonable, call and compliment them on it, but do _not_ send any kudos to their FCC file, or write to them about it. That way they have to keep it up and hope, as there is nothing good in the file or in writing that they can show the FCC to justify their Station's License. 7. Federal Communications Commission, Complaints and Compliance Division Room 6218, 2025 M Street NW Washington, D.C. 20554 FAX: 202-653-9659 FCC Attn: Edythe Wise -- An _EFFECTIVE_ | The _only_important_difference_ between Nazi-ism, Fascism, weapon in every | Communism, Communitarianism, Socialism and (Neo-)Liberalism hand = Freedom | is the _spelling_, and that the last group hasn't got the on every side! | Collective brains to figure it out. -- Bill Vance - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: [slickplus] VIN: Dec. 5 column -- "The Best Defense" (fwd) Date: 05 Dec 1999 08:28:22 PST On Dec 5, RichSlick@aol.com wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] In a message dated 12/3/1999 11:19:51 PM Central Standard Time, Vin_Suprynowicz@lvrj.com writes: << Subj: Dec. 5 column -- "The Best Defense" Date: 12/3/1999 11:19:51 PM Central Standard Time From: Vin_Suprynowicz@lvrj.com (Vin Suprynowicz) To: vinsends@ezlink.com FROM MOUNTAIN MEDIA FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE DATED DEC. 5, 1999 THE LIBERTARIAN, By Vin Suprynowicz But no honest citizen needs a gun ... right? One of the staple mantras of the gun grabbers -- we're not supposed to think about it (since statistics show it's 99 percent wrong), just chant it until is lulls us into a feeling of sweet repose -- is that "If you own a firearm you're just as likely to have it taken away and used against you." Right? I guess that's why I took so quickly to a new book which Floyd Coons at Master Shooters Supply handed me the other day. "The Best Defense: True Stories of Intended Victims Who Defended Themselves With a Firearm," is by Robert A. Waters, a retired vocational rehabilitation counselor from Ocala Florida ($14.95 from Cumberland House, 431 Harding Industrial Drive, Nashville 37211.) I defy anyone to dismiss these 14 harrowing, true-life accounts, often told in the words of the very crime victims who survived their ordeals due to one common factor: The fact that in America, we have a right to bear arms. Take the case of 49-year-old divorcee Sammie Foust of Cape Coral, Fla. "I used to love to open the windows and doors and feel the gulf breezes flowing through my house," Ms. Foust told interviewer Waters. "I got pleasure from watching sailboats pass by in the canal behind my home. Now I sit in a closed-up room. I'm even afraid to answer the door." Foust had fallen asleep cleaning house on the evening of May 9, 1996. The bed where she lay was piled with bags of old clothing she'd decided to give away, along with old purses and boxes of odds and ends. In her housecleaning, she'd also come across a tiny .25 caliber semiautomatic handgun a friend had long ago insisted she take for self-defense, though Sammie's father had warned her it was too small, advising: "Get a bigger gun. Wounded dogs will bite you. Dead dogs don't bite." The magazine of the .25 held four rounds. She'd checked it the night before, snapped the little slide to chamber the top round, and then fallen asleep with the little gun next to her pile of pillows. When she heard the blinds rattle in the living room at dawn, she assumed it was her cat returning. But it wasn't. It was three-time prison inmate James Wayne Horne, who had been released for the third time only a few weeks before, after serving slightly more than one year of a 10-year sentence for aggravated assault. The robber-assailant rushed into the bedroom and slashed Foust's face with a box-cutter knife. She offered him her purse, which he dumped on the bed, finding $400 in bills. He then demanded Foust tell him the location of her jewelry box, which she did. But the man was upset with the cheap quality of the costume jewelry, returning to demand "her diamonds" and to continue viciously slashing and beating her about the face. "You know I'm going to kill you," he hissed. "So you might as well give it up. Die easy or die hard, bitch." Foust directed the man to a second credenza. She knew it contained only more costume jewelry, but she needed space and time. Time to pick up the little .25, which she was amazed her assailant had not spotted ... and to figure out what to do with it. You see, Sammie Foust had never fired a gun in her life. She aimed for the man's center of mass and pulled the trigger. It sounded like a little cap pistol. There was no recoil, no blood. The man did not fly backwards or keel over dead. She figured the gun had misfired. But she'd certainly managed to upset James Wayne Horne, who flew back across the room, punching her square in the face. "She literally heard her nose implode back into her skull," Waters reports. "(start ital)Dear God,(end ital) she prayed, (start ital)don't let me pass out. Dear God, please let me hold onto this gun.(end ital)" The assailant pulled her to her feet, grabbed her wrist, and tried to wrench the gun away her with one hand while pummelling her with jackhammer blows to the face with his other fist. Police later told her James Wayne Horne had knocked out four of her teeth, which she'd swallowed. The bones in her gums were crushed, and her left cheekbone was fractured. Her nose was broken and her larynx fractured. Horne pounded and slashed at her face with his knife until one eyeball was hanging out of its socket. But he did not get the gun. Assuming her first two shots had missed, Foust resolved to save her two remaining cartridges until she had a clear shot. Finally, as the man drew back his arm for a knockout punch, she pointed the .25 at his stomach and fired again. "Bitch!" he whispered, as he dragged her into the living room and continued beating her. ""Now I'm gonna take that gun and blow your brains out!" Instead, Foust shot Horne a fourth time, in the abdomen. With the man atop her, pounding and pounding, Sammie Foust believed she could not survive. But finally, James Wayne Horne lay still. When police arrived, they found tables knocked over, chairs broken, dishes shattered, the walls and floors smeared with blood. They found James Wayne Horne where she had left him. The medical examiner concluded the first shot had entered his mouth, the second his heart, the third and fourth bullets his abdomen and groin. He had taken nearly an hour to bleed to death. Sammie Foust noticed the police and ambulance personnel wincing whenever they looked at her, cursing her attacker under their breath. When she finally found a mirror, she realized why. Her eye was surgically reattached that day, and permanent loss of sight was minimal. She has since run out of funds to pay for the proper repair of her gums and teeth. To this day, she eats only soft food. As an afterthought, as they hauled James Wayne Horne's body away, Sammie Foust pulled her hand from her pocket and asked a police interviewer: "Would you like to have this?" Foust recalled for author Waters: "A policeman came back and knelt down on the driveway. He tried to pry my fingers from the gun. And he started crying and said 'I'm gonna break your fingers. I can't get them loose.' But I couldn't let go of the handle. My knuckles were swollen up, I was holding it so tight. The grip I had on that gun was what kept my attacker from getting it from me. Even as big a man as he was, he couldn't take it away." And here I thought people like Sammie Foust would be better off if we banned all handguns. Because if she had a handgun, you see, it would just as likely be taken away and used against her. Right? Vin Suprynowicz is assistant editorial page editor of the Las Vegas Review-Journal. His new book, "Send in the Waco Killers," is available at 1-800-244-2224. *** Vin Suprynowicz, vin@lvrj.com "The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it." -- John Hay, 1872 "The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed -- and thus clamorous to be led to safety -- by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary." -- H.L. Mencken * * * - If you have subscribed to vinsends@ezlink.com and you wish to unsubscribe, send a message to vinsends-request@ezlink.com, from your OLD address, including the word "unsubscribe" (with no quotation marks) in the "Subject" line. To subscribe, send a message to vinsends-request@ezlink.com, from your NEW address, including the word "subscribe" (with no quotation marks) in the "Subject" line. All I ask of electronic subscribers is that they not RE-forward my columns until on or after the embargo date which appears at the top of each, and that (should they then choose to do so) they copy the columns in their entirety, preserving the original attribution. The Vinsends list is maintained by Alan Wendt in Colorado, who may be reached directly at alan@ezlink.com. The web sites for the Suprynowicz column are at http://www.infomagic.com/liberty/vinyard.htm, and http://www.nguworld.com/vindex. The Vinyard is maintained by Michael Voth in Flagstaff, who may be reached directly at mvoth@infomagic.com. [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: [slickplus] For the junkies: The WTO Overview] (fwd) Date: 05 Dec 1999 08:27:20 PST On Dec 5, RichSlick@aol.com wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] From: Clarence H Napier by Geov Parrish Casual observers can be excused for wondering what all the fuss is about. While local media has been flooded with horror stories about (gasp!) protesters (alternately "crazy" and "zany"), there has been very little ink given to exactly why tens of thousands would be driven to demonstrate on a topic as seemingly arcane as world trade. Why is the WTO important? How will it affect people's daily lives? It's impossible to summarize the literally dozens of issues encapsulated in the criticisms of the World Trade Organization in our limited space. But here's a quick overview of what the WTO is, what its policies are, and why they should be opposed. The WTO was created in 1994 as a successor to the GATT, the General Agreement on Tariffs and Trade, that had governed international trade since World War II. The GATT and other so-called Bretton Woods institutions such as the World Bank and International Monetary Fund served for decades as the model by which developed countries dealt with each other and attempted to develop--or, some would say, exploited the natural resources of--the Third World. This was (and is) known as the neoliberal model, and the WTO is firmly based on it. With the advent some two decades ago, in the U.S., Britain, Germany, and other developed countries, of a powerful new conservatism, came growing acceptance of a free market ideology that has led directly to the WTO. The WTO is markedly different from its previous regime in two important ways. First, its "free trade" agreements require the privatization of a wide array- -everything, really--of public resources. It requires, in the Frist and Third World alike, the logical extension of the neoliberal model: letting the free market make all public policy and control the movement of capital, goods, and services. Secondly, the WTO includes provisions that make its agreements much more legally enforceable than previous trade agreements. If a jurisdiction's law is found to be "WTO-illegal" and it is not withdrawn, the offending nation faces continuing sanctions equal to the alleged lost value of trade. This is expensive, and especially for poorer countries, this is a powerful incentive to comply. Generally--unlike statements by free trade proponents from President Clinton on down--critics of the WTO oppose not world trade, but the specific mechanisms by which the WTO governs it. These can generally be broken down into two broad categories: the specifics of sub-agreements on different industries, and the structure of the WTO itself. The power of the WTO to strike down laws is one of the major objections of WTO critics to the organization itself. It represents usurpation of democratically elected bodies by an undemocratic, unelected body that is almost completely dominated by corporate interests. When a country, usually at the request of a company or industry, lodges a complaint that another country's law is "WTO-illegal" The complaint is then heard by a secret tribunal of corporate lawyers in Geneva. Proceedings are closed to the public. No appeal is possible. So far, in four years, every complaint decided to date has been upheld by the Geneva tribunals. These include: overturning of a European ban on U.S. hormone-fed beef; overturning of a provision of the U.S. Endangered Species Act that protcted sea turtles from shrimping nets; striking down American and Brazilian programs that underwrote exporting companies; siding with Chiquita bananas (and the U.S.) against a European program that bought bananas from former Caribbean colonies; and a successful challenge of a Canadian provision that banned a particular gasoline additive. While WTO critics tend to focus on these few examples (hence the hundreds of dancing sea turtles at the Nov. 30 protest), more important, perhaps, are the laws never enacted in the first place. The WTO has had a tremendous chilling effect on jurisdictions. We saw a notable example in Seattle when the city council refused to enact a selective purchasing ordinance in support of pro- democracy forces in Burma. Sure enough, a similar law in Massachusetts is being challenged before the WTO as well as the Supreme Court. The WTO, structurally speaking, is functioning within the U.S. much like a second Supreme Court. It is not a new "world government" in the sense of being able to pass laws on its own, but, like the Supreme Court, can set the standards by which laws are passed, and strike down laws not to its liking. That's a lot of power for an institution created by and for transnational corporations. The biggest structural concern with the WTO is, quite simply, that transnational corporations are calling the shots and are the primary beneficiaries of its rulings, at the expense of countries that want to protect their environment, food safety, workers' rights, or other public policy values unrelated to profit. The problem with the WTO, in this view, is not that it promotes free trade; it's that it bans any other factors as a legitimate basis for public policy. We are left with a secretive, corporate- dominated, free-market-above-all entity that can trump any national government in its policy-making. The four-year-old WTO has had virtually no review of the impact of the agreements implemented so far. The Seattle agenda has yet to be announced, but it is expected to include both old business and new proposals. Both existing and proposed free trade agreements have extensive opposition. Existing WTO Trade Agreements: The TRIPS Agreement (Trade-Related Intellectual Property): covers patents, copyrights and trademarks. TRIPS has been enormously controversial in the Third World, particularly in the drug industry's attempts--often successful-- to patent indigenous plants and remedies that peoples in a particular country may have used for generations or even centuries. Most heavily affected by these new monopolies are the countries with the greatest biodiversity--poor countries like India and Brazil without the resources to repeatedly fight New York patent lawyers. The SPS Agreement (Agreement on Sanitary and Phytosanitary Standards) is the WTO's food safety agreement. Its prohibitions on cautious science and labeling have led directly to the European Union hormone-fed beef standoff. Under SPS countries cannot even internally--let alone in international trade- -adopt standards that require new technology be proven harmless (if King County wanted to adopt standards for produce grown within the county, it could not). Instead, the emphasis is on trade at all costs--including human. The Clinton Administration has also argued that SPS bars labelling with information that might dissuade consumers--for example, whether a product is or is not organic. SPS also has enormous implications for biotechnology and genetically modified foods. GATS (The General Agreement on Trades and Services) covers almost all economic activity that does not include manufactured goods, raw materials, or farm products. GATS is one of 15 Uruguay Round (WTO's immediate predecessor) agreements enforced by the WTO. GATS has overseen the globalization of the banking, insurance, and data management industries. Further GATS agreements are expected to push hard for the privatization of education, public health, and other services normally associated with the public sector. The Multilateral Agreement on Investments (MAI) is also being proposed as a GATS reform. The Uruguay Round Agreement on Agriculture set rules on domestic and international agricultural business that have accelerated the huge concentration of corporate agribusiness dominance in supplying the world's food. A tiny handful of companies now have a stranglehold on basic food (corn, wheat, soybean) production and distribution, with particularly disastrous consequences for developing countries which must purchase food from earnings on commodity crops. During the WTO's first four years, food prices have remained steady or increased while wholesale prices for commodities have plummeted to record lows. New Possible Seattle Agenda Items Global Free Logging Agreement: The Clinton Administration is pushing hrad for a free trade logging agreement that would abolish developing and developed countries' attempts to protect remaining old growth forests. Such an agreement, viewed as a catastrophe by environmentalists, is estimated to increase global wood products consumption by up to 5% and hasten the destruction of the world's rainforests, contributing to global warming as well. Needless to say, Washington state's politicians have clamored for this allegedly job-creating document, even though it would virtually eliminate remaining wood processing in the state as logs are sent to Japan to be chips and, eventually, disposable chopsticks. The Multilateral Agreement on Investments (MAI) covers the free flow of investment capital around the world. Ignoring the lessons of the speculation that led to successive crashes in Asia, Russia, and Brazil in 1997-98, the MAI is designed to make fast fortunes at the expense of developing countries attempting to retain capital within their borders. The MAI also contains an extraordinarily dangerous provision which allows corporations themselves, rather than countries, to challenge laws as WTO-illegal before the pro-corporate Geneva tribunal. This would remove the last vestiges of democratic representation from a WTO mechanism which abolishes public policies not made with the goal of profits first. Seattle and King and Snohomish Counties are all on record opposing the MAI due to its threat to local control over laws. The European Union is promoting a new Competition Policy that would bar any restrictions on transnational corporations trying to enter local markets. The U.S. also wants new agreements on biotechnology, enabling corporations to patent life forms, and agreements on e-commerce regulation. The net effect of the WTO's agreements, both those already in place and those proposed for the future, is to give transnational corporations tremendous power at the expense of both local businesses and democratic institutions. The effect is particularly pronounced in the Third World, where corporations are attempting to remove resources (like life forms) indigenous to the country, and can muster legal power the countries cannot afford to battle. Environmentalists see WTO agreements as contributing to air pollution, global warming, deforestation. and a host of other ills. The freedom of companies to move resources and production from country to country alarms labor, particularly with the lack of any concomitant agreements on worker safety, abolition of child or slave labor, or the right to collective bargaining. WTO proponents essentially rely on trickle-down economic arguments: the idea that enriching transnational corporations creates jobs and eventually benefits all of us. But the harm to public policies and the rapidly growing gap in income disparity between the very wealthy and everyone else are problems for which free markets offer no solutions. As it now stands, the WTO is making the rules, interpreting the rules, and enforcing the rules, all with a secretive pro-corporate structure unaccountable to any public. The WTO's agenda, quite simply, is to abolish any and all regulation of corporations. The Seattle or Millennial Round is the WTO's latest move to inexorably increase its own power. The WTO must be reigned in, starting in Seattle, before corporations rule the world--and we all lose. [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Gun Show poll- we're loosing (fwd) Date: 05 Dec 1999 09:28:14 PST On Dec 4, scott401@pop.usit.net wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Another poll @ http://today.about.com/blpoll.htm Scott "I really do know alot. I just forget it alot of times." Sam, age 7 [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joe Sylvester Subject: Gas masks don't kill people... Date: 06 Dec 1999 23:00:28 -0600 The right to bear arms Joseph Farah WND http://www.worldnetdaily.com/bluesky_btl/19991206_xcbtl_the_ri ght_.shtml There's a reason the Founding Fathers considered the right to bear arms fundamental in a free society. A couple of recent unrelated incidents should bring this home to all of us. In Seattle last week, the local government, faced with widespread civil disobedience over the city's hosting of the World Trade Organization conference declared a state of emergency, a curfew and even went so far as to ban the use of gas masks by anyone except police. Now, in case you hadn't considered this before, gas masks are not weapons. They can only be used to defend oneself, usually from tear gas fired by government police. Now imagine you lived in Seattle and had some urgent business. Perhaps you have an asthmatic son or daughter with a doctor's appointment. You live outside the immediate area of protests, but as a precaution against what could be a life-threatening attack to your child, you feel compelled to break out the gas mask collecting dust in the basement. In Seattle, you would be treated as a criminal. It's arbitrary. It's capricious. And I say it's unconstitutional. And the Constitution doesn't even explicitly guarantee the right to bear strictly defensive tools such as a gas mask. I think many, if not most, people -- left and right -- would agree with me. Nevertheless, there is still, somehow broad debate in this country about whether the Constitution really means what it says about firearms. I don't get it. Some of the anti-gun, anti-Constitution, anti-freedom crowd looks at it this way: "Yeah, it's in the Constitution. But the Constitution is outdated and in need of change -- especially the Second Amendment. Our first priority needs to be to protect people from violence. If we take the guns away from ordinary people, they will be safer and more secure. They can rest easy knowing the government will protect them." Of course, the facts, the statistics, the evidence just doesn't bear out any such theory. On the contrary, the only cold, calculating, objective, scientific research conducted in this area, by Dr. John Lott, shows just the opposite to be the case -- more guns mean less crime. But put that aside for a moment and consider a recent development in a police shooting case in Claremont, Calif. Last January, Irvin Landrum Jr., 18, was stopped for a traffic violation. The cops say Landrum pulled a gun on them, so they shot him and killed him. The family never bought the story and filed a lawsuit suggesting the police shot the kid and planted a gun on him. It turns out ballistics tests showed the gun was not fired that night. It had no fingerprints on it. And the last traceable owner was the late police chief of a neighboring town. I don't know about you, but I believe the kid was shot three times by the cops and the .45 was dropped on him. It happens. You see, some cops are crooked. Some cops are dishonest. Some cops are even unbalanced, untrustworthy and unqualified to carry a gun. And even more of them are unsuited to that role if and when the police hold a monopoly on firepower. When some nut climbs a tower somewhere and shoots innocent people, too many Americans begin clamoring to take away guns from perfectly law-abiding citizens who need them to protect themselves as well as to protect our own liberty from the creeping police state. When a nutty cop goes berserk and kills innocent people -- and it happens -- I never hear anyone suggesting we disarm all police. True self-government requires an armed citizenry. If the government holds a monopoly on force, tyranny is only a shot away. We can never allow that to happen in America. Nor can we ever tolerate American city governments, state governments or federal government suspending the constitutional rights of free people. The WTO be damned. Let the organization meet in China. Let it hire its own private security force to protect Fidel Castro and Bill Clinton. We shouldn't suspend the Constitution to protect people who would like to shred it permanently. Remember, gas masks don't kill people. Overbearing, unchecked, heavily armed governments kill people. The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution. ---Doug McKay" Joe Sylvester Don't Tread On Me ! - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: [slickplus] HUMOR: Name that House (fwd) Date: 06 Dec 1999 21:27:50 PST On Dec 6, RichSlick@aol.com wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] In a message dated 12/6/1999 12:44:40 PM Central Standard Time, BOBWORN@aol.com writes: << What should be the official name for Bill & Hillary's New York abode? There were lots of possibilities, according to the creative audience of The Jayne Carroll Show, a political talk radio program which airs daily in the Portland, Oregon, metropolitan area. On Friday, September 10th, Carroll asked her audience to come up with an official name for the Clinton $1.7 million house in Chappaqua, New York. Carroll's call-in contest required the names to be in relative good taste, original, and should capture the essence of one or both of the Clintons. The response was overwhelming! Some names nominated for the Clinton's new home included: Perjurers' Palace HillBilly Villa The House of Bill Repute Drawers Downs Cheatem Estates Castle of Contempt Sin Simeon The House That Terry Bought The Knee Pad The White Trash House The Blight House The Panderosa Liars' Lair Bill & Hill's Bribe & Breakfast The Clinton Compost Dogpatch on the Hudson Rancho Immoral Deceitful Domicile Monica's Man's Manor The Hen House The Out House The Big House The Love Shack Lucifer's Lair House of the Rising Son The House of Seven Felonies Cottage of Contempt Motel Sex But the clear, hands-down winner was- DISGRACELAND >> To subscribe to the Slick e-zine, send e-mail to RichSlick@aol.com for details. Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. http://clickhere.egroups.com/click/1702 -- Talk to your group with your own voice! -- http://www.egroups.com/VoiceChatPage?listName=slickplus&m=1 [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Re: White House Joins Suit on Gun Cos. (fwd) Date: 07 Dec 1999 23:16:40 PST On Dec 7, Chris BeHanna wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] On 7 Dec 99, at 22:00, R. Lunn wrote: > From today's Washington Post > > http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/aponline/19991207/aponline205420_000.htm > > ------ > > White House Joins Suit on Gun Cos. > By Anne Gearan > Associated Press Writer > Tuesday, Dec. 7, 1999; 8:54 p.m. EST > > WASHINGTON The White House is helping prepare a class-action suit against > gun makers, alleging that guns and how they are marketed have contributed > to violence in public housing projects, administration officials said > Tuesday. Write your Senators and Congressman. There have been no appropriations made to pay for this action, which Congress has *NOT* authorized. The action is illegal, and in the next session, Congress must quickly write into law a proscription against using federal funds for such activities. I don't know if that will actually do any good, but hey--we *did* get the NCIPC defunded, didn't we? Chris BeHanna behanna@fast.net [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: White House Joins Suit on Gun Cos. (fwd) Date: 07 Dec 1999 23:15:50 PST On Dec 7, R. Lunn wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] >From today's Washington Post http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/aponline/19991207/aponline205420_000.htm ------ White House Joins Suit on Gun Cos. By Anne Gearan Associated Press Writer Tuesday, Dec. 7, 1999; 8:54 p.m. EST WASHINGTON The White House is helping prepare a class-action suit against gun makers, alleging that guns and how they are marketed have contributed to violence in public housing projects, administration officials said Tuesday. The class-action lawsuit by some or all of the nation's 3,100 local housing authorities would be patterned on suits filed against the industry by 29 cities and counties, the officials said. Those suits claim that gun manufacturers have sold defective products or marketed them in ways that increase the likelihood that they will fall into the hands of criminals. The new legal effort was made known Tuesday and was described by some officials as more of a threat aimed at bringing gun manufacturers to the negotiating table than an effort to take them to court. The administration hopes the threat of a national lawsuit will force gun makers to agree to end practices such as marketing guns that are impervious to fingerprints. A negotiated agreement would allow the administration and gun control advocates to claim a victory at a time when Congress has rejected writing into law new firearms restrictions wanted by President Clinton. "The administration intends to work aggressively to ... try to work to reach a settlement with the industry," White House domestic policy adviser Bruce Reed said. "If settlement is not possible, then the public housing authorities are prepared to go forward with their suit." Administration officials said the White House and the Department of Housing and Urban Development are helping prepare the suit even though the actual plaintiff would be independent local authorities that run federal housing programs. The White House and HUD want gun makers to agree to a code of conduct that includes cracking down on disreputable gun dealers and making safer guns. "The legal theory is the same as the cities have been pursuing the bottom line is the gun manufacturers have not been properly supervising their distribution channels," and otherwise failing to promote safety, a HUD official said. "It's the traditional liability theory that is applied to every other product negligence and product liability," the official said, speaking on condition of anonymity. The official would not detail any previous outreach to gun makers but said new negotiations were planned. "The administration and HUD is ready to sue, but our first priority is to change the practice of the industry. We think we should first sit down at the negotiating table," the HUD official said. Some gun makers have declared bankruptcy in the wake of the suits by local governments and others have downsized their product lines and decreased advertising, according to a countersuit. The suits have had mixed success in the courts. A judge dismissed Cincinnati's suit in October but another judge had allowed Atlanta's suit to proceed and ordered the industry to open its files. Copyright 1999 The Associated Press ----------------------- NOTE: In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. section 107, this material is distributed without profit or payment to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving this information for non-profit research and educational purposes only. ----------------------- [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: boyd@seanet.com Subject: Re: White House Joins Suit on Gun Cos. (fwd) Date: 08 Dec 1999 12:46:04 -0800 Good idea. We should note however that the title isn't exactly accurate here. The president has "promised" to "join the states" in february or march if the gun manufactures dont "stop there..." blah blah blah. We surely must pressure our "leaders" to stop this unethical use of our money against us, this blackmail really, but at the same time lets write to the manufacturers urging them not to fall to this blackmail. Many of them may see the tremendous legal resources of the federal government lining up against them and decide that the smart business move is to take cover by leaping to the whim of these "leaders" (and I'm assuming you all are inserting the appropriate language when I type "leaders" ; ) We must impress on the manufacturers that the civillian market with reward them with _Ca$h_ if they hang in there, they have to be made to know that seeking refuge from the litigious behemoth may seem like a good business move short term but that it will not end at this round. If you can, now's a -great- time to buy a new gun. Make a copy of the receipt and send the manufacturer a -thank-you- note for persuing a business that has been unfairly under attack. With that thank you note, urge them to stand up for the long term interests of their market and not knuckle under even to the financial pressure of our rogue "leaders". These guys need our support, money talks. -Boyd Kneeland Bill Vance wrote: > > On Dec 7, Chris BeHanna wrote: > > [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] > > On 7 Dec 99, at 22:00, R. Lunn wrote: > > > From today's Washington Post > > > > http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/aponline/19991207/aponline205420_000.htm > > > > ------ > > > > White House Joins Suit on Gun Cos. > > By Anne Gearan > > Associated Press Writer > > Tuesday, Dec. 7, 1999; 8:54 p.m. EST > > > > WASHINGTON The White House is helping prepare a class-action suit against > > gun makers, alleging that guns and how they are marketed have contributed > > to violence in public housing projects, administration officials said > > Tuesday. > > Write your Senators and Congressman. There have been no > appropriations made to pay for this action, which Congress has *NOT* > authorized. The action is illegal, and in the next session, Congress > must quickly write into law a proscription against using federal > funds for such activities. > > I don't know if that will actually do any good, but hey--we *did* > get the NCIPC defunded, didn't we? > > Chris BeHanna > behanna@fast.net > > [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] > > -- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! > ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- > An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no > weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his > hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a > on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ > ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- > > - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Heads Up #163 (1/2) (fwd) Date: 18 Dec 1999 20:38:03 PST On Dec 18, Doug Fiedor wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Heads Up A Weekly View from the Foothills of Appalachia December 19, 1999 #163 by: Doug Fiedor fiedor19@eos.net Previous Editions at: http://www.uhuh.com/reports/headsup/list-hu.htm LIBERALS CONTROL GOP PRIMARY It's time we publicly chastise the far left, big government loving liberals in the media for even discussing conservative candidates. The liberals violated the Republican primary yet again when very liberal Tom Brokaw and some local dude from Iowa's WHO station played "moderators" for last Monday's Republican debate. What's the deal here? Have Republicans no pride, or what? In a country of 270 million people they can't find moderators who are Republican and know the issues under discussion? What a shame! Worse, it seems that maybe the only national media people in the nation who noticed the disparity were at The National Review: "Their preening was sickening -- one can see why Brokaw's station logo is a peacock -- and their questions were both the worst and the most left-wing in tendency of all three debates." The liberals should question and comment on their own candidates. Those in the liberal media don't know enough about Constitutional issues to even be in the same room with the likes of Alan Keyes and Steve Forbes. And their stupid, left-handed questions corrupt the issues we wish to hear discussed with candidates like George W. Bush and Gary Bauer. Better the media liberals stick with candidates they are supporting, like John McCain, Al Gore and Bill Bradley. It appears that Gary Bauer is starting to run from both the far right and the left simultaneously. During one debate, Bauer was asked what he would do if, as president, he could do only one thing to benefit the people of the United States. He blew it badly with his Johnny One Note message on banning abortion. The correct answer, the answer millions of American people want to hear from a candidate is simple: "I want to restore a Constitutional form of government so as to protect all rights and liberties of all Americans equally." Duh! However, that type of answer evidently did (does) not occur to Bauer. Now, he's talking about Europe's socialist agriculture policy as a model for America. Yes, we need to do something to revive failing family farms in this country. But, one answer is to get the federal government completely out of the issue. More government intrusion will only harm more family farms. Last week, Alan Keyes preempted Bauer on the abortion issue with one simple statement: "We are not 'leaving unborn children behind.' We are killing them!" There just isn't much more to discuss on the issue after that remark. Folks are now holding George W. Bush to a higher standard. That's expected. He peaked way too early and, as we suggested months ago would happen, as soon as he started actually talking about real issues his acceptance numbers would drop back down to reality. Besides, Bush will never look good as long as the idea man Steve Forbes is standing on one side of him and the Constitutional cheerleader Alan Keyes is putting everything into its proper prospective on his other side. Orrin Hatch is just joking around. The campaign is but an ego trip for Hatch. He'll continue playing the role of conservative candidate until the Senate goes back in session. Then, it's back to playing his half of the Odd Couple with Ted Kennedy. Gary Bauer and Orrin Hatch can drop out anytime. No one will mind. For some reason, the big topic at the Iowa debate was the ethanol subsidies. It's interesting how that lined up: Bush for, McCain against. That was probably McCain's only Constitutionally correct point in the three debates. Government should not be subsidizing ethanol. However, we doubt very much that McCain was against subsidies for Constitutional reasons. Campaign contribution reasons would be more like it. The liberal media supports McCain, so it's no surprise they report that he's doing well. However, the people who were able to watch the debate on that little cable cannel didn't see it quite the same way. For instance, Vote.com showed that 42% thought Alan Keyes won versus only 12% for John McCain. Bush was second with a strong 39%, Forbes with 3%, Hatch with 2%, and Bauer with only one percent of the vote. If we continue to allow the liberal media to define our candidates, the primary race will be between Bush and McCain. However, if our personal freedom and liberty -- and that of our children and grandchildren -- hold any importance to us, we have the power to force the issue and support a primary runoff between Keyes and Forbes. Both will defend our Constitution against the socialist usurpers of liberty, albeit Keyes a little more classically than Forbes. Whatever we plan to do, these next four to six weeks is the time to get it done. It's time to make some real noise and get the liberal media out of the equation for Republican candidates. CHOOSING A PRESIDENT -- KEYES This guy doesn't just "reply" to a question, he "launches" a righteous rant with every answer. So much so, in fact, that if conviction, honesty and passion of beliefs were the criteria for electing a president, this candidate stands out so far in front of the Republican pack there would be no other choice. However, the national media finds two major faults with this candidate: First, he can think on his feet and his mental capacity far exceeds that of the professional news readers trying to trip him up in an interview. And second, Alan L. Keyes is a Black man who comes nowhere near the stereotype the liberal media expects of an American citizen who is Black. Besides, the liberal national media have no idea how to handle a candidate who preaches ethics, personal responsibility and morals. Because, the problem is that his arguments are correct and Constitutionally based. They realize that any media person publicly challenging him will be hit with a quickly enunciated tirade of self-evident truths that would have them cowering like the uninformed fools many of them are. Therefore, most of the national media people actually fear Alan Keyes and do their best to stay away from him. The liberal national media cannot handle Constitutional truths any better than they can respond to strong moral convictions, and Alan Keyes brings both to the table. Loudly. And with great passion. Keyes called his radio show "America's Wake Up Call." In reality, his campaign is America's wake up call. That is, it would be if the liberals in the national media would give the Keyes platform recognition. The guy is a cheerleader for the ideals expressed by this country's Founding Fathers. The intensity of his style is not only fun to watch, his words have a very significant meaning. His message is seldom expressed in this county's national forum anymore: Government should follow the Constitution and we should teach kids individualism, morals and integrity, rather than the liberal collectivism claptrap. Gee, what a concept! Keyes launches on affirmative action by saying that instead of "calling on government to enforce the fundamental principle that all men are created equal, today's civil rights movement favors preferential treatment for groups defined by race or sex. We cannot cure injustice with another injustice," Keyes admonishes. Keyes says that he is "a strong supporter of the Second Amendment." The Second Amendment "was not put into the Constitution by the Founders merely to allow us to intimidate burglars, or hunt rabbits to our hearts' content. Above all, the Founders added the Second Amendment so that when, after a long train of abuses, a government evinces a methodical design upon our natural rights, we will have the means to protect and recover our rights. That is why the right to keep and bear arms was included in the Bill of Rights." On government schools and school choice, Keyes scores a bullseye again: "The value-free education offered by the government run schools has all too often proven to be education without value. This is especially true now that Outcome Based Education has been used as an excuse to establish curricular elements that amount to the politically correct brainwashing of our children." Calling for a revamping of the whole federal tax structure, Keyes says that tyrannical taxation and excessive government spending and borrowing "erode the resource base of our freedom and our moral responsibility. The income tax is a twentieth-century socialist experiment and it has failed. Before the income tax was imposed on us just 80 years ago, government had no claim to our income; only sales, excise and tariff taxes were allowed. We need to return to the Constitution of economic liberty that our Founders intended to be a permanent bulwark of our political liberty. The income tax in effect makes us vassals to the government -- the politicians decide how much income we can keep." For a campaign finance fix that would go far to stymie the power of Washington's $8.4 billion annual special interest lobbying industry, Keyes offers a simple solution: "No dollar vote without a ballot vote." He is also the only candidate to see the major problems cause by the liberal Great Society welfare programs: "Most of our expensive government welfare programs aim to deal with problems that are related to the breakdown of moral standards and self-discipline. Our first priority should be restoring the moral and material support for the marriage-based two-parent family. The disintegration of the family is the major contributing factor in poverty, crime, violence, the decline in educational performance, and a host of other expensive social problems." Chuck Muth, Chairman of the Nevada Republican Liberty Caucus, aptly described what many Republicans thought Monday night after the Iowa debate: "I don't care [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Heads Up #163 (2/2) (fwd) Date: 18 Dec 1999 20:37:07 PST On Dec 18, Doug Fiedor wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] if the guy can win or not, his presence on that stage raises the intellectual level of the entire discussion ... and the entire primary contest ... a hundred fold." And, talk about cleaning up government; last week Keyes named his choice for Attorney General: "I think that we need to put someone in as Attorney General who, among other things, will enforce the law and then get to the truth on behalf of the American people and there's nobody that has been doing that with greater courage and effectiveness -- even without any kind of official position -- than [Judicial Watch's] Larry Klayman." Talk about fun to watch! A Keyes administration with Larry Klayman as Attorney General would start right in cleaning up the corrupt Washington scene. A couple years of that would also set the process of American socialism back 50 years. The "Third Way" would go away. Anyone interested in their own personal freedom and liberty, Constitutional issues and the original American way that made this country so great, should pay close attention to the Keyes campaign. Alan Keyes' delivery is both passionate and intense for a good reason: He firmly believes what he is saying. For more information, go to http://www.keyes2000.org. Because, you are not likely to hear a lot about the platform of Alan L. Keyes from the liberal media. PRIVACY SHALL NOT BE VIOLATED When reading through the Federalist Papers and other writings of the Founding Fathers, one soon realizes that one of the primary reasons the federal government was formed was to protect the life, liberty and property of the American people. So, what do we do when it's government violating our rights? For instance, the police have a common trick called no-knock search. Except, one inconvenient fact is that The Fourth Amendment still states that: "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized." So, any government official wanting to conduct an investigation that includes the search of private property needs to first do a few things. Initially, there must be some sort of probable cause that a crime has been committed, or is in progress. Then, there must be some sort of proof leading to that reasoning. That being true, the officer must then visit a judge and present enough information to justify a search warrant. That last part should be difficult. But, because judges and prosecutors have immunity for all errors in judgment and cannot be charged with even the most blatant malpractice, some judges do not pay attention and will sign anything put in front of them. Therefore, the United States Supreme Court has attempted to set some rules concerning searches. For instance, in Wilson vs. Arkansas (94-5707, 1995), the Supreme Court again held that "the common law knock and announce principle forms a part of the Fourth Amendment reasonableness inquiry," as the Founding Fathers intended. "In evaluating the scope of the constitutional right to be secure in one's house, this Court has looked to the traditional protections against unreasonable searches and seizures afforded by the common law at the time of the framing. Given the longstanding common law endorsement of the practice of announcement, and the wealth of founding era commentaries, constitutional provisions, statutes, and cases espousing or supporting the knock and announce principle, this Court has little doubt that the Amendment's Framers thought that whether officers announced their presence and authority before entering a dwelling was among the factors to be considered in assessing a search's reasonableness. Nevertheless, the common law principle was never stated as an inflexible rule requiring announcement under all circumstances. Countervailing law enforcement interests -- including, e.g., the threat of physical harm to police, the fact that an officer is pursuing a recently escaped arrestee, and the existence of reason to believe that evidence would likely be destroyed if advance notice were given -- may establish the reasonableness of an unannounced entry." They forgot about physical harm to others in immediate danger, but whatever. Anyway, this was the standard until Richards vs. Wisconsin (96-5955, 1997) came around, when the Court started muddying the waters a little yet again. "If a per se exception were allowed for each criminal activity category that included a considerable risk of danger to officers or destruction of evidence, the knock and announce requirement would be meaningless. The court confronted with the question in each case has a duty to determine whether the facts and circumstances of the particular entry justified dispensing with the requirement. A 'no knock' entry is justified when the police have a reasonable suspicion that knocking and announcing their presence, under the particular circumstances, would be dangerous or futile, or that it would inhibit the effective investigation of the crime. This standard strikes the appropriate balance between the legitimate law enforcement concerns at issue in the execution of search warrants and the individual privacy interests affected by no knock entries." In truth, there should never be an excuse for a no knock entry of private property unless innocent lives are in jeopardy. One only needs to read the dozens of press accounts of innocent people being killed by police pulling their dynamic entries this past year to see why. Does the possibility of missing a conviction because a perpetrator might flush a little drug evidence override the protection of the privacy of innocent people? How about the lives of innocent people then? The words "shall not" in the Fourth Amendment must not be violated. No knock warrants got too many innocent people killed this year. It's time government officials -- from judges to police officers -- be held directly responsible for this type of negligence. EPA ENACTS KYOTO ACCORD By: Craig M. Brown DebMcB@worldnet.att.net With zero chance for Senate ratification, the EPA is using sleight of hand to push the Kyoto Treaty through the back boor. Did anybody really think that the U.S. Constitution, the law of the land, would prevent Carol Browner and the EPA from attempting to grasp control over industry, the economy and virtually every facet of our lives? Now the EPA is using smoke and mirrors to create the impression that the Clean Air Act gives them the power to regulate CO2 emissions. The fact that the Clean Air Act says nothing about regulating carbon dioxide emissions is of little concern to the EPA. The fatal flaw of the Clean Air Act is the vague language in the act itself. It invites the EPA or anybody else to interpret it any way it finds convenient. In recent years, the "scientists" at the EPA have determined that carbon dioxide is a pollutant and part of the so-called "greenhouse gasses" that are destroying our planet. In April, 1998, EPA General Counsel Jonathan Z. Cannon advised that the Clean Air Act granted the EPA the power to regulate emissions of CO2. That was all the EPA needed to set them off on another power grab. Out came a new set of EPA compliance standards aimed at regulating the hated CO2 emissions. This covers power plants, manufacturing, agriculture and transportation of all types. It also includes the air we exhale, although the EPA has not as yet released their plans to control breathing. In cities and towns across the country, centralized emissions testing sites have sprouted up with mandates that all vehicles be tested for compliance to emissions standards. If the states or communities balk at complying with these mandates, they are threatened with federal sanctions and withholding of highway funds. The sad thing is that the fear of losing highway funds causes many communities to fold and bow down. A few states, such as Maine, Minnesota, Michigan, Virginia, Louisiana and Texas have called the EPA's bluff and refused to comply with centralized testing. The Heritage Foundation and the National Motorists Association have tracked punitive action by the EPA and have found no instances in which highway funds have actually been withheld. In spite of the Gestapo-like tactics of the EPA, Congress has been strangely silent about the abuses being inflicted on their constituents. Each year, instead of de-funding the EPA, Congress keeps giving them additional money. One reason Congress permits the EPA to go its own way is the fear of demagoguery by special interest groups that support the EPA and the Kyoto Treaty. All it takes is for Al Gore or his useful idiots in the media to mumble something like Senator So-and-So wants to poison the air and the Senator runs for the hills. With courage such as this, is it any wonder why we are losing our freedom? Indeed, the irony of this is that these special interest groups such as the Sierra Club and Green Peace are being supported by grants from the EPA of taxpayer money. This money is in turn used to pay lobbyists to support the EPA. This is illegal, but Ms. Browner and her friends can't be bothered by legalities. As this millennium comes to a close, a major battle between the movement toward the New World Order and the sovereignty of the United States is coming to a head. The Clinton administration is determined to implement the Kyoto Treaty one way or another. One way he has chosen is by giving the EPA nearly unlimited power over all of us. But the Constitution of the United States is a stronger document than many of its enemies understand. Its presence gives strength to those of us who would preserve this country for the next thousand years. In the final minutes of this millennium, set aside some time to give thanks to what we have preserved of the freedom for which our forefathers sacrificed so much, and what we can do to persuade our representatives at all levels to reclaim some of what we have lost. ~ End ~ [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Paul M Watson Subject: A Christmas story, 1944 German Prisoner of War camp Date: 20 Dec 1999 15:34:28 -0600 (CST) ---------- Forwarded message ---------- [Web Page] http://www.heavybombers.com My Christmas 1944 Christmas 1944 at Luft IV Four days before Christmas, at about 1 AM in the morning, the air sirens went off making a loud wailing noise. The RAF was over Stettin again. The explosions kept us up most of the night even though it was thirty miles away. Everyone watched what activity that was visible through a window above the doorway. We were told anyone would be shot if caught looking out the window during an air raid if we did this again. Christmas, 1944 was certainly different from any that I had ever experienced before. According to our news reports, the war was going well and the air war over Europe was really in full swing. Maybe our liberation was not to far away. We could tell since downed airmen were pouring into the prison camp by the droves. They also brought with them latest news reports. The number of POWs had climbed from 3,000 when I entered the camp in July to almost 10,000 in late December. The Jerries were working feverishly building Lagers "E" and "F." The word was stay put and hang on, no escape attempts. The weather had turned bitter cold with temperatures below zero with ice and snow. There were 24 guys huddled in our little room with one little pot bellied stove trying to keep us warm. The Germans issued us 2 each blankets made of horse hair. I swear if you held them up to a light you could see through them. We usually slept with our clothes on since each room was issued only 12 peat bricks of fuel a day On Christmas Eve we were permitted to walk around the compound after dark. We had to promise no escape attempts would be made. We were on parole so to speak. We could visit with other POWs in other barracks in our compound or other lagers until 1 AM. Our kitchen personnel had been saving pieces of beef for some time and made everyone in our compound small hamburger patties. They were great, although we all thought that it was horsemeat. We savored every morsel. Some of us had been saving our raisins from our Red Cross packages from which we made "Raisin Jack." This was passed around the compound on Christmas Eve.. Other POWs made Kriegie cakes, using water, powdered milk, margarine, sugar, and crushing graham crackers from our Red Cross parcels. This mixture was put in a Klim can and baked. If you are wondering what a Klim means it was milk spelled backwards. Powdered milk from our Red Cross parcels came in these cans. The cans were used for everything. Dr. Christiansen from Sweden visited our camp. He was with War Prisoner's Aid sponsored by the YMCA. He brought many recreation articles such as cards, books and etc. The Germans handed out Christmas Red Cross parcels. This parcel contained 1 pipe, tobacco, cigarettes, mixed nuts, candy, fig bars, wash rag, honey, butter, tea, 2 pictures, variety game, rouelette, cards, turkey, cheese, vienna susage, puidding, bouillon cubes, deviled ham, chewing gum and etc. The guys were like little kids opening up their package. Groups of Kriegis walked around the compound singing Christmas carols. The guards also went around wishing everyone a Merry Christmas. We had no roll call Monday Christmas day. I think everyone had liberation on their mind that evening. Tuesday December 26th everything was back to normal. A few days later we heard the news about the German breakthrough and that the Battle of the Bulge was on. The Allies were in retreat. No wonder the guards had been walking around the compound with big smiles on their faces. I think this was our lowest point. John Kriegi6410 In a message dated 12/20/99 11:22:59 AM Pacific Standard Time, kriegi6410@aol.com writes: << A few days later we heard the news about the German breakthrough and that the Battle of the Bulge was on. The Allies were in retreat. No wonder the guards had been walking around the compound with big smiles on their faces. I think this was our lowest point. John >> This Christmas of 44 was my second one as a Kriege and the news of the bulge was demoralizing. Today Dec. 20th marks the 56th anniversary of my capture. I woke up about 0430 hours recalling the direct 88 hit and the trouble I had in getting out of the plane. Merry Christmas to all. John Carson, Lufts VI and IV and one hell of a long march. [To unsubscribe] Send - mailto:Heavy_Bombers-unsubscribe@topica.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: FW: Politics (humor, not for sourpusses) (fwd) Date: 20 Dec 1999 23:16:06 PST On Dec 21, by way of Leon A. Richard wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Couldn't resist.... ;-) Forwarded message: Republicans say "Merry Christmas!" Democrats say "Happy Holidays!" Republicans help the poor during the holidays by sending $50 to the Salvation Army. Democrats help the poor by giving $50, one buck at a time, to panhandlers on the street. Democrats get back at the Republicans on their Christmas list by giving them fruitcakes. Republicans re-wrap them and send them to in-laws. Democrats let their kids open all the gifts on Christmas Eve. Republicans make their kids wait until Christmas morning. When toasting the holidays, Republicans ask for eggnog or mulled wine. Democrats ask for a "Bud." When not in stores, Republicans shop from a catalog. Democrats watch for "incredible TV offers" on late night television. Democrats do much of their shopping at Target and Wal-Mart. So do Republicans, but they don't admit it. Republican parents have no problem buying toy guns for their kids. Democrats refuse to do so. That is why their kids pretend to shoot each other with dolls. Republicans spends hundreds of dollars and hours of work decorating the yard with outdoor lights and Christmas displays. Democrats save their time and money, and drive around at night to look at *other* people's lights. Democrats' favorite Christmas movie is "Miracle on 34th Street." Republicans' favorite Christmas movie is "It's a Wonderful Life." Right-Wing Republicans' favorite Christmas movie is "Die Hard." Republicans always take the price tag off expensive gifts before wrapping. Democrats also remove price tags off pricey gifts ... and reposition them to make sure they are seen. Democrats wear wide red ties and green sports jackets during the festive season. Republicans do too, all year round. Most Republicans try, at least once, enclosing indulgent, wretchedly maudlin form letters about their families in their Christmas cards. Public ridicule from Democrats usually discourages them from doing it again. Democrats' favorite Christmas carol is "Deck the Halls." Young Democrats' favorite Christmas carol is "Grandma Got Run Over by a Reindeer." Republicans' favorite Christmas carol is "White Christmas." Young Republicans' favorite Christmas carol is "White Christmas." Cheapskate Republicans buy an artificial Christmas tree. Tight-fisted Democrats buy a real tree, but they wait until the week before Christmas when the lots lower their prices. Green Democrats buy a real tree with roots, and then replant it after New Years. Republicans see nothing wrong with letting their children play "Cowboys and Indians." Democrats don't either, as long as the Indians win. Republicans first began thinking like Republicans when they stopped believing in Santa Claus. Democrats became Democrats because they never stopped believing in Santa Claus. Democrat men like to watch football while the women fix holiday meals. On this, Republicans are in full agreement. [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: BBC Bans Lords Prayer Date: 20 Dec 1999 23:24:02 PST The number one song in Britain right now just happens to be, "The Lord's Prayer", sung to the tune of, "Old Lang Zyne"(sp?). When the BBC refused to play it, it became even more popular. The song sounds good. Not to be outdone, another group came up with a version of, "Amazing Grace", to the tune of the theme song from, "Gilligans Island". I know it seems like it would be ___WEIRD!!!!!___, but it actually sounds pretty decent. -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Firearm Owners - YOU Are NEXT! (fwd) Date: 22 Dec 1999 20:27:42 PST On Dec 22, Dave Wiegand wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Dear RKBA'ers, Fronts for the psychiatric industry are attempting an "end run" around our Second Amendment rights by using the PR technique of "positioning" in an attempt to portray firearm owners as less than sane. >From the controversial book available on the internet, thought by many to be the textbook of enemies of freedom, "Brainwashing, A Synthesis of the Russian Textbook on Psychopolitics:" "This manual of the Communist Party should be in the hands of every loyal American, that they may be alerted to the fact that it is NOT ALWAYS BY ARMIES AND GUNS [my caps] that a nation is conquered..." "...Thus the subject of loyalties and their re-alignment is in fact the subject of non-armed conquest of an enemy." And this: "Death and violence against persons attacking Communism in a nation should be eschewed as forbidden. Violent activity against such persons might bring about their martyrdom. DEFAMATION, AND THE ACCUSATION OF INSANITY, ALONE SHOULD BE EMPLOYED, [my caps] and they should be brought at last under the ministrations of psychopolitical operatives, such as PSYCHIATRISTS [my caps] and controlled psychologists." How many times as a firearms-rights advocate have you been defamed? How many times in the media and spewed out of the mouths of gun-grabbing politicians have you heard "gun nut," "gun violence," "reasonable gun legislation," or "gun control [as if being a responsible, safe, and competent marksman was NOT good control?]" in an attempt to portray firearms enthusiasts as those not quite operating with a full magazine, and being disarmed in the face of armed-to-the teeth criminals and police was the most sane thing to do? Here in California the psychpoliticians are hard at work drafting legislation that would make it easier to incarcerate firearm owners if "they are ABOUT TO BECOME dangerous or incapable of caring for themselves," a la the Soviet "mental health" model. Front for the drug company controlled National Alliance for the Mentally Ill (NAMI), and psychopolitician California Assemblywoman Helen Thomson's bill, AB 1028 would not only make it easier to involuntarily hospitalize [read incarcerate] firearms owners, it would make it easier for courts to force people locked up to take harmful "medications" [read - mind-altering psychiatric drugs]. Additionally, the court would be able to lock up for a month any responsible firearm owner who disagreed with the "bend over and let the government shove paternalistic social programs up your behind" politically correct attitude. AB 1028 is being touted as way to provide treatment for "thousands of mentally ill people statewide" who "couldn't get treatment, or didn't seek it." and "would up on the streets, or in county jails." What is not acknowledged is that these people are the failures of the psychiatric industry. Many of them are permanently neurologically damaged by psychiatric drugs. We are being asked to fund an already failed "health-care" system. This same tactic was used by the Nazis to round up gypsies, Jews, and other "street people" who also didn't seek treatment [read - agree with the racist views of the Nazi party] and force them into mental hospitals where they were killed, or to psychiatrist run concentration camps where they worked at war related industries until they were not able to produce and were sent to gas chambers. On one level, the agenda behind this legislative push, (it IS a US wide orchestrated campaign) is to make HUGE profits for pharmaceutical companies. Behind THAT, is a plan to control the US (and worldwide) population with drugs for the profit of a small group of individuals who are suppressive to individual freedom. RKBA patriots. Heed the indicators of coming attacks not only to your RKBA rights, but to your very liberty and freedom! VOCALLY oppose ANY legislation that expands the paternalistic power of psychiatry, or any government agency over individual liberty and freedom of choice. __________________ Here are excerpts from: Bill aims to reform laws for mentally ill The plan is to clarify right to detain patients By Clark Brooks San Diego Union Tribune Staff Writer December 17, 1999 http://www.uniontrib.com/news/uniontrib/fri/news/news_1n17lps.html "Assemblywoman Helen Thomson laid out her plan yesterday to reform the law that sets the conditions under which mentally ill people can be involuntarily hospitalized."..... "Next month, Thomson intends to introduce legislation that will combine the detention and medication hearings and lengthen the initial extended hospital stay from two to four weeks. It also will provide an outpatient alternative for people ordered into treatment [read - forced drugging at your home]..." "In addition, the bill will allow for the detention of people whose history of mental illness makes it clear they are ABOUT TO BECOME [my caps] dangerous or incapable of caring for themselves..." "The bill also will extend appointments of court-ordered conservators from six months to a year...." "AB-1028 will improve the LPS law by making it an effective tool to provide earlier access to a fully funded, assisted outpatient treatment program in the community [read - more efficient to incarcerate those who oppose a tyrannical government] as originally envisioned 30 years ago," Thomson said during a news conference in Sacramento.... [One in opposition said,] "You can't predict dangerousness. It's going to be very subjective. People are going to be unnecessarily committed into the hospital when they don't need to be committed and don't meet any kind of dangerous criteria."" Read more about the real agenda behind the headlines at: http://www.freeyellow.com/members8/iurist/drugkids.htm RKBA FREEDOM! David F. Wiegand PO Box 20850 Oakland, CA 94620 DFWiegand@email.msn.com [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: The Lone Ranger is dead Date: 28 Dec 1999 14:17:25 PST Actor, Clayton Moore, has died of a heart attack at 85, in a California hospital. The Lone Ranger is dead; Long live the Lone Ranger..... -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: [IL] Gun control poll, governor's felony bill (fwd) Date: 28 Dec 1999 16:18:08 PST On Dec 28, Jim Zoes wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] http://chicagonorth.about.com/local/midwestus/chicagonorth/library/weekly/aa1 22799.htm Only 29 votes cast so far. Please vote. [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Fw: Liberal hate speech, 1999 (fwd) Date: 30 Dec 1999 16:16:08 PST On Dec 30, The McGehee Zone wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Wednesday, December 29, 1999 3:14 PM (Note: This is an expanded version of the column as it will appear in print. I could easily have filled a second column with all the grotesque examples that there was simply no room to include.) 'SHOOT HIM WITH A .44': LIBERAL HATE SPEECH, 1999 By Jeff Jacoby The Boston Globe December 30, 1999 Remember the wave of outrage that swept the nation after Charlton Heston, the president of the National Rifle Association, told a radio interviewer that the best way to deal with liberal filmmaker Spike Lee would be to "shoot him with a .44-caliber Bulldog" revolver? Remember how newspaper editorials scathingly condemned Heston's appalling remark? Remember the full-page ads blasting the twisted mindset that leads conservatives like Heston to say such grotesque things? You don't remember? Don't feel bad. It never happened. Heston never spoke those words about Lee. Lee spoke them about Heston. He was talking to reporters in May, just a few weeks after the slaughter in Littleton, Colo. Asked for his thoughts on Heston, Lee recommended assassinating him with a .44 special. A conservative who made such a comment about a liberal would have been crushed under an avalanche of denunciation. But when a liberal talks that way about a conservative, the media rarely notice. Welcome to my yearly column on liberal hate speech and the double standard that shields it. By "hate speech," I don't mean language that is merely insulting. When Rosie O'Donnell, hosting a Hillary Clinton fundraiser in October, described Rudolph Giuliani as New York's "village idiot" and compared his looks to "a Pez dispenser," she was simply being obnoxious. When Margaret Carlson of Time magazine said, apropos congressional Republicans, that "the only thing that could explain this love of tax cuts is a lowered IQ," she was engaging in childish name-calling. But when liberals liken conservatives to Hitler, or call for them to be killed -- *that's* hate speech. It isn't only Spike Lee who advocates death for those who have the temerity to hold non-left-wing views. (*) When Elia Kazan, the *bete noir* of Hollywood's aging Reds, was awarded the Oscar for lifetime achievement, the haters were out in force. "I'll be watching, hoping someone shoots him," said Abraham Polonsky, who was blacklisted for his Communist sympathies in the 1950s. "It would no doubt be a thrill." (*) The Washington Post's Richard Cohen commented on the fact that Newt Gingrich was cheating on his wife even as he was denouncing Bill Clinton's moral failings. "For hypocrisy, for sheer gall," Cohen wrote, "Gingrich should be hanged." (*) Even the comics aren't free of death threats. The main character in Aaron McGruder's "Boondocks" is Huey, a militant black student. In one strip, Huey considers titles for his report on "the black neoconservative movement and its most famous champion." His first choice: "Ward Connerly Should Be Beaten by Raekwon the Chef With a Spiked Bat." (Eventually he settles on something less obscure, but just as ugly: "Ward Connerly Is a Boot-Licking Uncle Tom.")*** No doubt Polonsky, Cohen, and McGruder didn't mean for their words to be taken literally. But the test of hate speech isn't what you mean, it's what you say. And saying that a public figure ought to be murdered is so far beyond the pale that even liberals shouldn't be allowed to get away with it. Central to the leftist mentality is the belief that conservative opinions are not simply misguided, they're evil. Conservatives are not erring brethren to be reasoned with, they're moral heretics to be excommunicated. And so liberals routinely reach for the most vicious comparisons when talking about nonliberals: Nazis, racists, the Ku Klux Klan. "Conservative legal interest groups," says Atlanta Mayor Bill Campbell, "such as the Center for Individual Rights and the Southeastern Legal Foundation" -- both of which oppose racial preferences and quotas -- "are ... a homogenized version of the Klan. They may have traded in their sheets for suits ..., but it's the same old racism." Newsweek's archliberal Eleanor Clift was one of many who erupted with venom when Bill Clinton was impeached. "That herd of managers from the House," she hissed in January, "I mean, frankly all they were missing was white sheets. They're like night riders..." The left-leaning Arkansas Times spat poison at the independent counsel. "Kenneth Starr," the paper editorialized, "is cunning, ruthless, and about as well-mannered as Heinrich Himmler." In the Los Angeles Times, Karen Grigsby Bates wrote, "Whenever I hear Trent Lott speak, I immediately think of nooses decorating trees. Big trees, with black bodies swinging...." Cartoonist Paul Conrad, also of the L.A. Times, drew a sketch of Buford Furrow -- the bigot who opened fire in a Jewish community center in August, then murdered a Filipino mailman -- and labeled it: "A faith-based compassionate conservative." Republicans opposing a minimum wage hike, charged US Rep. Major Owens of New York, are comparable to foreign leaders who support "ethnic cleansing" -- i.e., mass killing. Then there was the proposal in Florida to raise funds for adoption agencies through a new specialty license plate bearing the logo "Choose Life." There are already 45 such plates, which promote everything from protecting dolphins to Special Olympics. A pro-life message, however, was too much for state Senator Skip Campbell, who fretted that senators would next be asked to approve a plate reading "Be a Nazi." But for sheer filth, nothing in 1999 topped Salon's hate-filled attack on Ann Coulter, an attractive and well-known conservative activist and Clinton critic. In June, Coulter wrote a nonpolitical column lamenting the state of romance in Washington. Soon after, the web magazine Salon, an avidly pro-Clinton publication, launched a malignant personal attack. It purported to offer 11 tips for improving her love life. Among them: "Quit injecting yourself with your own urine," "Stop being a mean bitch," "Buy a vibrator," and "Get your head out of your ass." It urged her to tape a sign in her kitchen reading, "Men don't want to date castrating bitches." And that's not to mention the gross innuendoes that can't be repeated in a family newspaper. If a conservative web site had hurled such vileness at, say, Cheryl Mills, Clinton's liberal young attorney, there would have been a furious outcry. It would have become a national scandal. Pundits and talk show hosts would have torn the web site and its writer to shreds. But Salon is liberal and Coulter is not. So nobody said a thing. (Jeff Jacoby is a columnist for The Boston Globe. His e-mail address is jacoby@globe.com) ====================================== Forwarder's comment: *** The comic strip "Boondocks" appears in, among other newspapers, the Atlanta Conjob (I can't bring myself to call that Constitution-hating rag what it has the gall to call itself), and so I am able to read the strip at work. Although I didn't see the strip to which Jeff refers, I've seen enough other "Boondocks" storylines to be reasonably convinced that Huey and his brother Riley are satirical characters through whom McGruder makes fun of attitudes held, unfortunately, by many young blacks. Another storyline, for example, lampooned conspiracy theories widely held in some African-American communities (such as that the CIA deliberately introduced AIDS and drugs into black neighborhoods -- and the recently jury-ratified claim of a vast multipartisan conspiracy to assassinate Martin Luther King) by having Huey discover all kinds of "evidence" that Santa Claus is the mastermind of a vast international conspiracy. My inclination is that satirical depictions of ugliness, if rooted in truth, ought to be somewhat exempt -- I repeat, *somewhat* exempt -- from the standard that rightfully applies to serious speech. Kevin McGehee Newnan, Georgia mail@mcgeheezone.com http://www.McGeheeZone.com/ [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Y2K update Date: 31 Dec 1999 07:29:35 PST The day before yesterday, I heard a caller on a Radio show state that, "The Bank of England had crashed!" It should be noted that more recent reports state otherwise: Merely every last one of their Credit Card Machines have crashed. -- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: boyd@seanet.com Subject: Re: Y2K update Date: 31 Dec 1999 11:55:00 -0800 20,000 machines manufactured by Racal crashed. All the news I've seen implies that's one of many mfgrs (certainly there are 3 in the US) and a small fraction of B of Es machines (as you'd expect). Bill Vance wrote: > > The day before yesterday, I heard a caller on a Radio show state that, "The > Bank of England had crashed!" It should be noted that more recent reports > state otherwise: Merely every last one of their Credit Card Machines have > crashed. > > -- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! > ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- > An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no > weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his > hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a > on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ > ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- > > - -