From: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com (roc-digest) To: roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: roc-digest V2 #46 Reply-To: roc-digest Sender: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk roc-digest Thursday, January 15 1998 Volume 02 : Number 046 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 14 Jan 1998 13:11:10 -0600 (CST) From: Subject: Retired Navy Brass calls for TWA 800 investigation - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: jim hofmann Date: Tue, 13 Jan 1998 16:20:30 -0400 Subject: CAS: Moorer's dissent makes it into the Navy Times This week's Navy Times, a publication widely read by Naval enlisted and officers and sold in just about every Navy facility, included a full-page article on Adm Moorer's dissent on the TWA investigation at the recent AIM news conference. It wasn't front page (instead there was a poll that suggested many Naval officers are leaving because the current leadership is too politicized). The article was pulled from the Gannett news service. I haven't checked their online edition to see if it was published there. - - --- Jim ========================================================================== This mailing list is for discussion of Clinton Administration Scandals. If you wish to unsubscribe from this mailing list, send electronic mail to majordomo@majordomo.pobox.com. In the message body put: unsubscribe cas - ------------------------------ From: tmulkern@mail.ameritel.net (Trent C Mulkern) Date: Tue, 13 Jan 1998 16:41:52 -0500 Subject: CAS: From the Navy Times--TWA Flt-800 Navy Times Published: 01-19-98 Category: THIS WEEK Page: 14 Retired Navy Brass Revives Twa Missile Theory / Officers Voice Suspiciouns Over Fbi's Findings By John Hanchette and Billy House Adm. Thomas H. Moorer, former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, on Jan. 8 called for new congressional hearings into last July's crash of TWA Flight 800. "It absolutely deserves more investigation -- a lot more," Moorer told Gannett News Service. "This time, I wouldn't let the FBI do it. I'd have the NTSB (National Transportation Safety Board) do it. I think Congress certainly should get more answers from the FBI." Moorer and other retired Navy brass, at a news conference, expressed grave suspicion over the FBI's recently concluded 18-month investigation of the disaster, in which the plane disintegrated July 17, 1996, en route to Paris and plunged into the Atlantic near Long Island, killing 230. They said a military missile explosion just outside the 747's forward cabin seems the likely cause. "All evidence would point to a missile," Moorer said. "All those witnesses who saw a streak that hit the airplane -- you have to assume it's a missile. In an investigation like this, you can't overlook anything." Moorer, an expert on missile weaponry, attended the news conference convened by a media critic group that scoffs at the official NTSB and FBI findings unveiled a month ago. Joseph Valiquette, FBI spokesman in New York, said the agency is "comfortable" with its conclusions that "there's no evidence a criminal act was responsible." 'A train wreck in the sky' The Navy officers -- who appeared with a veteran TWA pilot, two witnesses and members of Accuracy in Media, which coordinated the briefing -- said a new study of evidence from recovered Flight 800 data recorders rebuts the government's official story about fuel vapors exploding in a central tank of the jetliner after a spark from unknown causes. "This is either a train wreck in the sky, or an explosive device -- mid-air, outside the plane," said retired Navy Cmdr. William Donaldson, who flew 89 combat missions over Vietnam and for five years was a top Naval aviation accident investigator. Donaldson, who said he is not working for TWA or the passenger jet's manufacturer, Boeing, examined the mountain of material released in early December about the $100 million federal investigation. He particularly criticized one NTSB document reflecting flight-recorder data that was not discussed when the material was unveiled in Baltimore last month. Donaldson noted a line drawn through readings of the last five seconds of the doomed jet's flight, with a handwritten margin note reading "End of Flt. 800 DATA" -- except there are more revealing readings below it. He said he thinks this was an attempt to divert attention from the final readings on the flight recorder: "The only reason you put flight data recorders into an airplane at millions of dollars cost is to capture this last data line." He said NTSB officials later tried to convince the Navy dissidents it merely was transcript from an earlier flight -- a conclusion former TWA pilot Howard Mann said is "not possible -- it's erased -- there's just no way." The final readings show chaos in the sky -- with airspeed dropping instantly by almost 200 knots, the pitch angle jumping five degrees, altitude dropping 3,600 feet in about three seconds, the roll angle going from zero to 144 degrees (the plane almost inverted), and magnetic heading changing from 82 degrees to 163 degrees. The small vane that measures wind angle striking the nose -- situated on the left forward fuselage -- goes from 3 degrees to 106 degrees back to 30 degrees. Donaldson said all these indicate an extremely high-pressure wave coming from the lower left side of the plane's front. The measurements "indicate there was an explosion -- a big explosion -- outside the cockpit." Mann agreed with Donaldson's interpretations. Donaldson also said: * Divers found debris from the forward fuselage as much as 2,900 feet to the right of the extended flight path, suggesting it may have been propelled by an explosion from the plane's left. * Fuselage doors from near the front of the craft, later recovered, were bent and dented inward. * Subsequent tests Donaldson conducted showed fuel vapor in the empty center tank would not have been flammable enough to cause such an explosion, and there was nothing to ignite it. * More damage occurred to the left wing than the right. * The fuselage skin broke up in such a way as to suggest a pressure wave from the outside left front. "What you're looking at is the product of an explosion in the sky that totally destroyed the aircraft's ability to fly anywhere," he said. A digital animation computer rendering of the catastrophe -- prepared by the CIA for media use in early December -- sought to explain some of the physical forces on the flight data by showing the nose breaking off the huge aircraft and the body then climbing almost 3,000 feet before a huge petroleum explosion sends it fireballing into the sea. "There couldn't have been an aviator at CIA who had anything to do with that," said Donaldson. "They were laughed out of town by pilots." Eyewitness accounts Two witnesses from Long Island -- lawyer Frederick Meyer and furniture maker Richard Goss -- described what looked like a missile contrail rising upward in the sky before the TWA explosion. Goss said the FBI was interested and "very amazed," but later "there wasn't as much enthusiasm . . . I never heard from them again." Meyer, a helicopter pilot in Vietnam, was flying an Air National Guard helicopter on maneuvers when the disaster occurred in front of him: "I saw, what I swear to God, was military ordnance explode." Meyer said, "The aircraft I saw came out of the air like a stone. Nobody saw that aircraft climb a foot after it was hit. The CIA cartoon bears no similarity to what I saw." Meyer approached the FBI with his report, but said after two desultory interviews, agents never called back. He claims he knows several witnesses who called the FBI's 800 number with similar reports, but were not called back. The FBI, Donaldson said, "is holding the lid on 92 witnesses who allege they saw something go and climb to the sky. Most of those people are scared to death right now." Valiquette, the FBI spokesman, said, "We know there are always going to be people who will never accept our findings. And we're comfortable with that, too. . . . We went back and re-interviewed all those eyewitnesses. We plotted their positions, and there was a lot of analysis done. Today, we are comfortable with the results." The retired officers speculated a missile could have come from either a submarine or a buoy device developed by the Navy years ago to float attack missiles into position for launch from miles away. "One vital question we haven't attacked is the origin of that streak of light," Moorer said. "Where did it come from? Who fired it." For its part, the NTSB insisted after the briefing that "We have no physical evidence that a missile impacted TWA 800, or a fragment of a missile penetrated the aircraft." Copyright 1998 Army Times Publishing Company. All Rights Reserved. ========================================================================== This mailing list is for discussion of Clinton Administration Scandals. If you wish to unsubscribe from this mailing list, send electronic mail to majordomo@majordomo.pobox.com. In the message body put: unsubscribe cas - ------------------------------ From: "Jon Dougherty" Date: Tue, 13 Jan 1998 15:50:09 -0600 Subject: CAS: Re: Moorer's dissent makes it into the Navy Times Just a quick comment... What we're seeing here, in having all the better military enlisted and officer personnel leave the service, is that the remainder [and all 'new hires', so to speak] will be just as PC as the current administration and, hence, less able to fulfill their mission[s] -- the primary which is defense of this nation. Not a good sign. Jon @ USA Features - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jan 98 12:28:27 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Media Contact Site (fwd) Here's a tool we can use. On Jan 14, Bob Mueller wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Thought I'd point everyone to this site - it's not perfect, but it's got a _bunch_ of addresses, along with some tips on writing letters to editors. Some of the category links are dead, but as a rule, it looks pretty good (after about 10 min of hopping around). They claim to list over 2000 magazines; newspaper links appear to be under construction, as do radio and TV. I couldn't quite tell how current they're keeping the site. http://mediareport.com/toc.html For each entry on their list, they provide address info, deadline restrictions, publishing companies, voice and fax numbers, electronic presence info (web and email). For newspapers, they claim to have the circulation counts and regions, although I couldn't see that info in what I found. Bob Mueller <>< ICQ# 5721178 Tandem Computers Professional Services Second Amendment Research Network - http://www.infinet.com/~bmueller/Index.html D, 6/52 ADA Alumni Association - http://www.gather.com/d652ada [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Jan 1998 15:57:58 -0600 (CST) From: Subject: Lippo Documents just released by feds. - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- - ------------------------------ From: softwar@us.net (CharlesSmith) Date: Thu, 15 Jan 1998 05:35:38 -0500 (EST) Subject: CAS: New Paper Trail Details What Lippo Cash Bought New Paper Trail Details What Lippo Cash Bought By Larry Klayman and Tom Fitton Long-sought documents reveal much about Democratic fund-raising scandal and -- GOP lack of concern. A new batch of Commerce Department documents finally was released by the Clinton administration to Judicial Watch in Washington. Some of these documents were released more than two-and-a-half years after they were due under a court order. They raise questions of Clinton administration bribery, extortion and the sale of government services to agents of influence for a foreign power. The documents also explain why the Republican-controlled Congress has been uninterested in pursuing the Commerce side of the Clinton fund-raising scandal. One document that screams out for further investigation is a letter dated Nov. 1, 1994, from a Democratic donor to President Clinton. Investment banker and Democratic fund-raiser Sanford R. Robertson writes about his participation in a Ron Brown-led trade mission to China earlier that year. Complimenting Brown's "diplomatic skills" in a meeting with Chinese dictator Li Peng, Robertson wrote that the then-commerce secretary "deftly navigated the human-rights issues by obtaining an agreement on further talks and then moved directly into the economic issues at hand: helping Chrysler, Sprint and others with their 'joint ventures.'" In other words, Brown shoved aside concerns about human rights to talk money with the butcher of Beijing. The Robertson letter closes with a smoking-gun postscript: "[Treasury Secretary] Bob Rubin came to our home on Thursday [presumably Sept. 29, 1994] for a [California Democratic Sen.] Dianne Feinstein dinner, which raised over $100,000 for her campaign. Bob, of course, turned out the financial community and Silicon Valley." We've always wondered why Feinstein -- as a recipient of Lippo Group contributions, and the reported target of Chinese attempts to influence U.S. elections -- never was grilled by her colleagues on the Senate Governmental Affairs Committee investigating the China connection. Perhaps the answer lies in the fact that many of the U.S. companies linked to Lippo and other figures in the foreign-money scandal give to both political parties. Robertson and his company, for example, gave generously in 1996 to GOP Sen. Alfonse D'Amato of New York ($1,000) and the Republican National State Elections Committee ($100,000). The newly released documents show three previously undisclosed occasions when the communist Chinese-backed Lippo Group directly and indirectly benefited from Clinton administration actions. Testimony before Sen. Fred Thompson's committee indicated that the Lippo Group is in fact a joint venture of China Resources, a trading and holding company "wholly owned" by the Chinese communist government and used as a front for Chinese espionage operations. China Resources investments in Lippo grew during the course of the Clinton administration, coinciding with illegal six-figure Lippo contributions to Clinton's cash machine. These contributions seem to not only have bought Lippo employee John Huang a job in the Commerce Department, but special consideration for Lippo business interests at the highest level of the Clinton administration.=7F The documents indicate that Lippo business partner Mission Energy (now named Edison Mission Energy) received strong Clinton=7F administration support for a $2.6 billion power-plant project in Indonesia. One 1994 document sings the praises of the Indonesian government-backed project -- "with its state-of-the-art emissions-control technology and by using low-sulfur Indonesian coal, the project will be on the cleanest, most efficient coal-fired facilities in the world." As the Lippo conglomerate is a key supplier of low-sulfur Indonesian coal, Clinton's Lippo Group donors -- the Riady family, Huang and Arief and Soraya Wiriadinata -- had much to gain from official government support of this Lippo homeland project. The official mention of "low-sulfur Indonesian coal" also is interesting in light of Clinton's creation of the 1.7 million-acre Grand Staircase-Escalante National Monument in Utah, placing off-limits the world's largest deposit of low-sulfur coal and thereby increasing the value of Lippo's investments in clean-burning coal deposits in Indonesia. The documents prove the administration was very much aware of the Lippo coal interests that later benefited from Clinton's decision. The people of the Beehive State will be outraged to learn that the Clinton administration promoted the coal interests of a foreign Clinton donor while shutting down the development of the Utah coal fields. In light of the new documents it is ludicrous to suggest that no one in the Clinton administration considered the Lippo Group's interests in keeping the Utah coal off the market -- especially since Huang and the Riady family had access to the Oval Office. Clinton's Commerce Department also kept hidden a successful attempt by the Lippo Group to gain official U.S. support for a power project in Fujian, China. The Lippo Group is the controlling partner in the project, having as coinvestors America's Mission Energy and Bechtel Enterprises. Handwritten notes and a Commerce E-mail indicate that Mission Energy representatives met with Commerce officials to discuss the project and that the Lippo Group specifically was mentioned. Huang likely was involved in these discussions or at a minimum assisted in the planning of the trade missions. The Lippo-Mission-Bechtel project also makes use of pulverized coal, no doubt to come from Lippo coal fields in Indonesia. The Commerce Department E-mail notes that Brown advocated the project during his 1994 trip to China. This trip also saw Clinton administration support for another proposed Lippo power project in China with the Arkansas-based Entergy Corp., another large Clinton contributor. Clinton's Lippo donors seem to have gotten themselves a twofer on this taxpayer-financed trade trip. Why hasn't Mission Energy publicly been asked by the congressional investigative committees about its dealings with the Lippo Group, Huang and the Clinton Commerce Department? Is it because the conglomerate owners of Mission Energy and Bechtel give to Republicans as well as Democrats? The documents also show how important it was for China-backed Lippo to have its ex-employee and Clinton White House regular Huang in a high-level position at Commerce. Indeed, Huang's telephone records and reports about his activities from his tenure at Commerce indicate that he was in regular contact with Lippo agents, both foreign (the Riadys) and domestic (Web Hubbell, Mark Middleton, Joe Giroir and Mark Grobmyer). Another document indicates that Grobmyer involved himself in nuclear-proliferation issues involving Russia and Iran. The Commerce Department produced a copy of an April 30, 1994, fax that Grobmyer sent National Security Council Staff Director Nancy Soderberg reporting on the work of his U.S. Fuel and Security Team. According to a July article in Time magazine, Grobmyer's project was a "curious plan to buy enriched uranium from Russia and the United States, lease it to utilities worldwide, collect the spent radioactive rods and store them on a tiny volcanic island in steel casks made in, of course, Arkansas." Grobmyer recounts how he met Russia's atomic-energy minister, Viktor Mikhailov, and other unnamed Russians to try to push the deal. According to the faxed memo, in return for being involved with the U.S. Fuel and Security Team, the Russians would agree to "cease or limit the sale of reactors to nations such as Iran, and would agree to store excess plutonium on the proposed site." Grobmyer's scheme eventually was shot down personally by Clinton, but only after Grobmyer made himself a nuisance at the White House by aggressively trying to obtain special White House consideration and environmental waivers for his project. But why was Grobmyer, a Little Rock lawyer whose only credentials seemed to have been with the Lippo Group and Clinton, negotiating nuclear-proliferation issues with the government of Russia? Why haven't Republicans raised questions about Grobmyer's scheme? Was it because Grobmyer's plan had the backing of former Republican secretary of state James Baker? One can see that there was good reason for the Commerce Department to hide these damaging documents from the American people and a federal court -- they provide more evidence that the China-backed Lippo Group had its tentacles all over the Clinton administration. And the involvement of GOP donors and officials in this influence-peddling explain why this Republican-controlled Congress couldn't seem to care less about the Commerce-China connections. INSIGHT web site - http://www.insightmag.com Judicial Watch (Larry Klayman) - http://www.judicialwatch.org ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 1 if by land, 2 if by sea. Paul Revere - encryption 1775 Charles R. Smith SOFTWAR http://www.us.net/softwar Pcyphered SIGNATURE: 84B421652CED9871E71BA1633A1368D6114274883B068ED3863ED7A6E23C4849 EEC3F2CF0FE35BCD3B9003CC252E847797B6E77817D40C159513B157B585FA35 75406CD364FB6E75 ========================================================================== This mailing list is for discussion of Clinton Administration Scandals. If you wish to unsubscribe from this mailing list, send electronic mail to majordomo@majordomo.pobox.com. In the message body put: unsubscribe cas - ------------------------------ - - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Jan 1998 16:02:40 -0600 (CST) From: Subject: OKC-Text:Key's Press Conf. (fwd) - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 15 Jan 1998 16:45:01 -0600 From: believer@telepath.com To: pwatson@utdallas.edu Subject: OKC-Text:Key's Press Conf. - ------------------------ 01/15/98 - This is the transcript of the press conference held at 1:30 p.m. cst today by State Rep. Charles Key, revealing new evidence in the Oklahoma City bombing -- foreknowledge on the part of Congressman Ernest Istook, and the involvement of a sect of Muslim fundamentalists operating in Oklahoma City. The conference was carried live on KTOK Radio AM 1000 in Oklahoma City. Please pardon any typos. This transcript was prepared in a great hurry. -- Michele - ------------------------ JERRY BOHNEN (News Director KTOK Radio): ...information he says there was prior knowledge about the bombing. Live now, here's KTOK's Kim Edwards. KIM EDWARDS (KTOK Reporter): Jerry, a throng of national and local media have gathered around the Survivor Tree in downtown Oklahoma City, preparing to hear what testimony Representative Charles Key is prepared to offer. Right now, Glenn Wilburn's widow is at the podium, and she is speaking to the press about her experiences with the grand jury investigation that is looking into the possibility that the government had prior knowledge of the April 19th, 1995 bombing. After she is done speaking, Representative Charles Key will come up to the podium and he will release what he says is new damaging evidence that the government did know, prior to April 19th, that a bomb was going to go off at the Murrah Building here in downtown Oklahoma City. Again, right now, Kathy Wilburn, Glenn Wilburn's widow, who was... Glenn Wilburn was crucial in getting this grand jury started. She is now at the podium speaking. Jerry, back to you. BOHNEN: Okay, Kim. Now, based on information and such from the Key investigation and their committee, I've spoken with the two witnesses that they brought on hand... I understand, at least, are to be on hand for the announcement today -- a couple of Oklahoma County Reserve Sheriff's Deputies. They have a story to tell about what was told them the night of the bombing, statements made by at least an Oklahoma Congressman and an individual who was accompanying the Congressman to the scene of the Murrah Building -- indications of prior knowledge about the bombing and perhaps an indication of at least a bomb threat that had been made some ten days before the April 19th, 1995 bombing. And again, this information being gathered by State Representative Charles Key. Kim, let's listen to who is speaking at this point now. EDWARDS: Right now, Kathy Wilburn is still on the stand... or still at the podium and then Representative Charles Key is standing behind her with a crowd of other people associated with the bombing investigation. Several of his investigators are there with him. And there are representatives from virtually all of the local media outlets as well as CNN and the Fox News Channel. A crowd of spectators has come away from the fence now and is also gathering around listening to what Kathy Wilburn has to say. Again, you talked about the deputies that say they have new information and they are there with Charles Key as well. I'm having some problems hearing you, Jerry, and I'm going to toss back to you for just a moment while I fix my audio problems at this end. And again, Kathy Wilburn is still speaking at the podium as we speak. BOHNEN: Okay. While Kim clarifies that... The two deputies apparently were on guard duty the night of the bombing. I've interviewed them last night and the interview was embargoed until now while they are preparing the news conference. And what their story is is that one of them was on guard duty in front of the Water Resources Board when an Oklahoma Congressman approached them and happened to be talking about what happened... you know, earlier in the day, and the Congressman said, "Yeah, we knew this was going to happen. We blew it." There was apparently some right-wing, fundamentalist Muslim sect in Oklahoma City and the Sheriff's deputy made the comment, "I beg your pardon? What did you say?" "Yeah, we knew it was going to happen. We blew it." And at the same time, another reserve deputy was escorting one of the Congressman's aides around and at that point the aide told the reserve deputy that, "Yeah, Congressman indicated that there had been an April 9th bomb threat made to the federal building." Apparently no documentations can verify or support the claims, but certainly these are two long-time members of the Oklahoma County Sheriff's Reserve who tell me that they've been haunted for the past two-and-a-half years by what they knew, that they said they've talked freely about it with other Oklahoma County Sheriff's deputies, indicating that whenever they would see news media coverage of the government denying any prior knowledge, they would almost laugh about it and say, "Well, we know of at least one individual who had supposed prior knowledge." Let's see if KTOK's Kim Edwards has his monitoring problem rectified. EDWARDS: Yes, I do, Jerry, and you're exactly right. The deputies do say that they were haunted by this, knowing that at least one government official claims he knew that this was going to happen, and then that's why they finally decided to come forward. And apparently they will talk today and hopefully answer questions about why they waited and what exactly they heard from Representative Ernest Istook on the night of April 19th. Again, Representative Istook apparently -- or according to Oklahoma County Reserve Deputies -- said that he knew this was going to happen and talked about a bomb threat that had been called in on April the 9th and also claimed to have knowledge of a right-wing, fundamentalist Muslim group working in Oklahoma City. What we can tell you right now: at the podium, Kathy Wilburn, the widow of Glenn Wilburn, who was instrumental in getting the Oklahoma County grand jury to investigate prior knowledge of the bombing. She is talking to reporters and others that have gathered here at the bomb site about her experiences since the day of April 18th. She is joined by Representative Charles Key who is about to step forward to the podium. And let's go now live to the podium to cover the comments made by Representative Charles Key. CHARLES KEY (State Representative): No one of us, and no one, would have ever wanted anything to have happened that happened here two-and-a-half years ago or the ordeal that we've gone through to simply find the truth. As we've seen with the deadlocked jury recently in Denver, it's obvious that there is much more to this case than what some in the government want us to know about. But the government refuses to admit that there were other murders and we know that there were. Why do they refuse to admit that and why do they refuse to continue to look for them? Why has it been so difficult to get answers to the questions? Why have we been fought every step of the way in an unprecidented manner? When Glenn and I and Kathy and Edye and many others began this quest more than two years ago, we had a lot of questions, and we've had a lot of those questions answered since then. With these two witnesses coming forward today, we hope that many more questions will begin to be answered. In October, Don Hammonds and David Kulkendorfer came to us... contacted my office, I should say. It took us several weeks of playing phone tag before we could finally make contact. And just approximately six weeks ago we got together, sat down, and talked to them and heard their story -- the same story you're going to hear in just a few minutes. These men are very courageous. They're telling just the truth, just what they know, and we think that people deserve to know what the truth is. And the grand jury has had this information passed to them and they'll hear this testimony and see their sworn affidavits in the very near future. So I want to introduce right now to you David and Don. They'll tell their stories. After they finish, I'll come up and make a few comments, and then after that time, all of us will be glad to field any questions. So I'll introduce to you David at this time. DAVID KULKENDORFER (Oklahoma County Sheriff's Reserve Deputy): Hello. Can you hear me okay? My name is David Kulkendorfer and I'm an insurance agent in Oklahoma City by occupation. I'm also a reserve for the Oklahoma County Sheriff's office, a reserve deputy, which is my public service. And during the day of the bombing, I was on South Shields heading north to an appointment when I saw a plume of smoke go up. I was at the intersection of S.E. 66th and Shields. At that time, I knew something bad happened. By the black smoke, I thought possibly an oil tanker or something exploded. And by the direction of the smoke, I said, "That's right downtown and something is wrong. They're going to need some help." So I got on the phone and called my office and told them to cancel my appointment, that I wasn't going to be in. I said, "There is something going on in the city and I'm going to check." I think that was my responsibility as a reserve. When I got here... I got here about 9:30 and it was very chaotic, obviously most of you know. So I just basically started to help and tried to do what I could do to be of assistance. I wound up down at the northwest corner of the building, and I entered the building at that point and worked my way through the building looking for survivors, calling out to see if anybody could hear me. And I worked my way along with an Oklahoma City police officer and an FBI agent. We worked our way to the seventh floor. And at that time, we were heading west to east on the seventh floor and a fireman came from the other direction and said, "You don't need to go that way. I've already cleared it." So we were in the hallway heading back to go down the stairway, and on the south side of the building we could see people running, scattering. We kind of looked at each other and said, "Well, what's going on?" And we heard, "A bomb! There's another bomb! Get out of the building!" So we immediately gathered ourselves and ran to the stairway and started down the stairs. And as we were going down the stairs, this lady police officer, she stepped on some debris and twisted her ankle so we basically had to carry her the rest of the way. As we left the building, the FBI agent picked up her up and carried her to the safe area. Well, after the "all clear," I came back up and I said, "Well, what I need to do is I need to get organized and get in uniform." So I called my wife and told her, "Call the office. I'm not coming back today. Get my uniform. I'll meet you at the Sheriff's Office." I met her at the Sheriff's Office and changed clothes and came back and pretty well just tried to do what I could do. We went into the building continuing with the search and rescue. Well, that went on throughout the day. Then that evening, when the rains came, we'd pretty well backed off and we went to our command post and got rain gear, came back out after the rain. And I was pretty well working the northwest corner when I was approached by a U.S. Marshal and said, "We got the building. The fire department turned it over to us. This is now a federal crime scene. We need to secure the area. Nobody comes in except...." He said, "Keep all non-essentials out." I said, "What's non-essential?" And he said, "The only ones to come in are the search and rescue and law enforcement." I said, "Okay." So, basically that was my responsibility from that point on, to keep everybody out. Well, later on, during the evening, a lot of public officials started to show up. The mayor showed up with a contingency, and the district attorney, the governor, and several dignitaries. I was standing approximately in front of the Water Resources Building, to try to keep people out and watching the search and rescue. As I looked to my left, I could see Congressman Istook kind of working his way east to west. Well, he worked his way up to me and he stopped to my left and introduced himself and we kind of small-talked a little bit about, "How's everything? It's a bad, bad, bad deal." And he made the comment to me, he says, "Yeah, we knew this was going to happen." And I said, "Excuse me?" And he says, "Yeah, we knew this was going to happen. We got word through our sources that there is a radical fundamental Islamic group in Oklahoma City and that they were going to bomb the federal building." And I didn't say anything because I really had nothing to say. But a little bit of small talk later, he kind of looked at me and said, "What department are you with?" He came over in front of me, and at that time I had a raincoat on and my campaign hat from the county. He looked at the emblem on the campaign hat. And I said, "Well, I'm a deputy with the Oklahoma County Sheriff's Office." And he said, "Oh! I thought you were with the Highway Patrol," and immediately stopped talking and turned around and walked away. And really, the reason I haven't said anything to this point... Don and I have talked about it every time we were on duty, and I thought, "Since the grand jury was in session, I'm sure this informoation is going to come out. It's got to. Because I'm sure if he made a comment to me, other people know also." And this last fair, when Don and I were working, we got to discussing it again, and Don said, "Well, let me do this." He said, "Let me call Representative Key anonymously and tell him what we have to say, and if they want to hear us, fine; if they don't, fine. But at least we'll know either they know it or they don't." So he called Representative Key and through telephone tag we finally made an appointment and we basically said what we had to say. And later, Representative Key called us back for another appointment... another conference and said, "We need to take this to another level." He said, "What you have to say is very important." So that's why we're here. And like I said, that's all I know. I don't know the befores, the afters, or the what fors. All I know is this is what was said to me and that's what I'm repeating to you. DON HAMMONDS: (Oklahoma County Sheriff's Reserve Deputy): My name is Don Hammonds and I'm a businessman and I've also been a reserve deputy with Oklahoma County since 1992. And I'm just going to jump in right kind of where Dave... where we were working together on the northwest side. And our job was to also give people coming in, like the mayor and stuff like that, hard hats and make sure they had hard hats, and also not to let anybody take pictures. I noticed a lady back behind me by a back hoe over there taking pictures. I went up there and approached her and told her that, you know, "You can't take pictures here, ma'am." And she identified herself as an attorney, Lanney... Lana Tyree , and she was with Ernest Istook. She said they were friends and she was an amateur photographer and that she was taking pictures for Ernest Istook. So I agreed to let her come on in, but I told her she had to make sure she took pictures of... up, and no facial shots of anybody because they were photo sensitive. So she was... I was with her as she was taking pictures of the building and stuff like that. And she made a comment to me that Istook told her that they were aware of a bomb threat since April 9th, and that's all she said to me. That's the kind of stuff that... after it all happened... I mean, you didn't really think much about it until this grand jury and stuff stated probing into it and people were claiming that there wasn't any prior knowledge. I started thinking about it and got with Dave, and we put two and two together. I mean, hey! Somebody knew about a prior bomb threat. This ought to be known. And you know, I was given a date -- April 9th -- that they knew about it, ten days before. And you know... So we feel like, you know, it's only fair that everyone knows the truth that there is... you know, what's going on and who else knows about this. Thank you. CHARLES KEY: Again, we'll take questions here in just a moment, but I guess some final thoughts are that we've had a lot of information. It's been a long process that we've been through, and it's probably still got a long ways to go. We've had a lot of people contact us with information, and I'm sure, and I understand the county grand jury, now that the two trials are over, they've had a lot of information come forward. And I can say to you that there will be more very significant, dynamic information like this come forward in the future. This is just the first of some major revelations that prove what Glenn Wilburn said quite a number of months ago, and that he was right -- that there was significant prior knowledge. And there are those that know that. And I want to take this time to call again on people that do know information to come forward, take it to the grand jury. You can get it to our organization if you'd like. Because the truth needs to be told. It deserves to be told. And many people may be implicated because of their silence and their lack of action in regard to this. The people of this State and of this city and of this country deserve to know the truth. There is no reason why you can't just lay all of the facts and the truth out about this case or any other case and let justice find its way through what the truth and what the facts are. And that's all we want. That's all most people want. And I can't think of any reason why that can't be done in this case. Again, we've had so much trouble. We've been fought in an unprecidented way, at every turn and every step. JERRY BOHNEN: You've been listening to a live coverage on KTOK -- a news conference held by State Representative Charles Key revealing the testimony or the claims of two Oklahoma County Reserve Deputy Sheriffs, that Congressman Ernest Istook told them the night of the bombing, "We knew this was going to happen, we blew it." So far, no comment from Congressman Ernest Istook, but we'll have him. He'll be joining us live at 4:15 p.m. on the KTOK Afternoon Report. We're eleven minutes away from two o'clock. Live from the KTOK News Center, I'm Jerry Bohnen. [END OF PRESS CONFERENCE COVERAGE] - - ------------------------------ End of roc-digest V2 #46 ************************