From: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com (roc-digest) To: roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: roc-digest V2 #298 Reply-To: roc-digest Sender: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-roc-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk roc-digest Friday, November 5 1999 Volume 02 : Number 298 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 1 Nov 99 10:51:15 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Fw: A speech by Lt. Harry Thomas, Feb. 1994 (fwd) On Nov 1, McGeheeZone.com wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Good morning, Nobanners. Kevin McGehee Peachtree City, Georgia mail@mcgeheezone.com http://www.McGeheeZone.com/ Wake up and smell the smoke: http://gundebate.org/roots.htm - ----- Original Message ----- From: Kort E Patterson To: Intertel Top1 list ; Oregon Mensa email list Sent: Monday, November 01, 1999 12:38 AM Subject: fwd: A speech by Lt. Harry Thomas, Feb. 1994 - -------------------------------------- A Speech by Lt. Harry Thomas, Cincinnati Police Division Fountain Square, Cincinnati, Ohio February 27, 1994 "Welcome to the People's Republic of Cincinnati! As usual, since I am speaking publicly, I must make the following disclaimer: I am not speaking to you as an official spokesman or representative of the Cincinnati Police Division. If I don't say that, I'm liable to have visitors waiting for me when I get back to work. For the past 21 years, I have been a member of the Cincinnati Police Division. On three occasions, I have sworn a solemn oath; once when I was promoted from cadet to patrolman, once when I was promoted from patrolman to sergeant, and yet again when I was promoted from sergeant to lieutenant. That oath was to support the Constitution of the United States of America. I have buried almost a dozen of my fellow police officers who died defending that oath. The last one died right before my eyes in the major trauma room of University Hospital. I signed the receipt for his body so that he could be transported to the morgue. I think about those men often, and I think about what they died for. And that is why I become furiously angry when I see our Constitution, the most remarkable document ever written in the course of human existence, being used as toilet paper at every level of government. The Brady Bill is now a reality. For the first time in the history of our country, American citizens must request the government's permission to exercise a constitutional right. And if the government sees its way clear to grant permission, we must wait 5 days to exercise that right. But even this is not enough to please our keepers in Sodom-by-the-Potomac. Gun laws are not being passed quickly enough to suit our federal law enforcement agencies, so they have formulated their own plan to discourage gun ownership. In Ruby Ridge, Idaho, Sammy Weaver, age 14, the son of Randy Weaver, a man who had taken his family to the mountains to escape the tyranny of a government run amok, was hunting in the forest near the Weaver cabin with his dog. He wasn't the only person hunting in the forest that day. Sammy Weaver was ambushed and fatally shot in the back by two United States Marshals. And lest anyone accuse the U.S. Marshals of not being thorough in the performance of their assigned tasks, I would point out that they also shot the dog, also in the back. Later, Vicki Weaver, Randy's wife and the mother of the Weaver children, opened the door of the Weaver cabin to admit her husband, who had been in a nearby shed to visit the body of his son. Vicki Weaver was holding her 10 month old infant daughter in her arms. That proved to be only a slight inconvenience to FBI sniper Lon Horiuchi, as he shot Vicki Weaver through the head. She fell dead to the floor, her skull exploded, still clutching her daughter in her lifeless arms. It would appear that it is now a capital offense to be the son, wife, or dog of a gun owner. Waco. "Waco" is a word which, among American patriots, engenders the same anguished feelings of outrage as the word "Alamo." Last year at the NRA Convention in Nashville, my wife and I returned to our hotel room and flipped on CNN to see the latest developments in Waco. The Branch Davidian compound was burning. My wife cried. She knew that there were many children in that compound. She asked me why. Why are they burning the compound? I told her the simple truth: They have to burn it. Has anyone here seen and read the Waco search warrant affidavit? It's crap. It didn't establish enough probable cause to even knock on the Branch Davidian's door. When the FBI took over from the BATF (which some people say actually stands for Burn All Toddlers First), they knew that they would find no illegal weapons in the Branch Davidian compound. They were between a rock and a hard place. 4 ATF men dead, an unknown number of Branch Davidians dead, the FBI had only one choice: destroy the compound so that no one could ever prove whether illegal weapons were present or not. For hours, the FBI pumped supposedly non-lethal CS gas into the compound. Those of us in law enforcement and the military know differently. CS gas, in high concentrations in an enclosed area is lethal. The first ones to be affected by vomiting, convulsions unconsciousness and death, would be the children. The same children that local Texas authorities found to be happy and healthy under the care of the Branch Davidians. The FBI did not pump CS gas into the Branch Davidian compound to force its occupants to come out. They pumped gas in to make sure the occupants couldn't come out. Dead gun owners, and dead gun owner's children, tell no tales. The time has come for us to openly discuss something that up to this time we have mainly whispered about. The purpose of the 2nd Amendment is to threaten the government. The framers of our Constitution knew that government is a necessary evil, which, as in the case of the British government, could easily become more evil than necessary. The Founding Fathers wanted to ensure that should that situation again come to pass, the American people would have the capability to reclaim their country by force of arms. I believe that we are dangerously close to that day when we will have to use the 2nd Amendment in exactly the manner that our forefathers anticipated. When I was a boy, my father could buy firearms through the mail. It was rightly believed at the time that such a transaction was the business of the buyer, the gun dealer and no one else. I lost that right with the passage of the GCA in 1968. In my lifetime, I have been able to walk into a gun store, select a handgun, and walk out of that store with that gun in my hand. My children lost that right with the passage of the Brady Bill. I'm not giving up any more rights. I sincerely hope that a political solution to this problem is still possible, and I will continue to work on the NRA Board of Directors to try to find that solution. But if that solution cannot be found, I say this to the megalomaniacs in Washington: Pass your gun laws. I will not beg the government for a license to continue to be a handgun owner. I will not submit to being fingerprinted or photographed or interrogated like a criminal for claiming my birthright as a free American. I will not register a single gun that I own. I will not surrender a single gun that I own. I will not apply for an "arsenal" license because I own more than 20 guns or more than a thousand rounds of ammunition. I will not attend mandatory safety training, nor will I submit to a test to prove that I'm fit to be a gun owner. And Miss Reno, I have this to say to you: If you send your jack-booted, baby-burning bushwhackers to confiscate my guns, pack them a lunch; it will be a damned long day. The Branch Davidians were amateurs; I'm a professional. - -- Kort E Patterson http://www.hevanet.com/kort - - To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@mainstream.net, and as the body of the message (plain text, no HTML), send the following: . unsubscribe noban email-address . where email-address is the address under which you are subscribed. Report problems to owner-noban@mainstream.net [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Nov 99 06:26:47 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Fratrum: Re: National ID Card (fwd) On Nov 02, Huck wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] It's past time to wake up and smell the coffee, because now it's burning! Huck spiker wrote: > From: David Gould > > Post Number 145: National ID Card > > First, I need to add a clarification; many of you have seen the supposed > 'victory' over the National ID in Congress. I hope most of you > understand what an illusion this is. For one thing, when the "bill" goes > to the joint house/senate conference, you could easily see the defeat(?) > disappear. For another, this provision would not have been in place if it > was not mandated by some agreement/treaty which is already binding upon > the United States government. The reality is that a National ID is going to be > put in place in America, just as complete tracking of you from cradle to > grave is going to be implemented. Of course, much of this already exists. > Please read on. - David G. > > Freedom? How free are you, really? Ever wonder about that, or about > some of the rumors you hear being bandied about? Well, you are about to > learn, first hand, what the real nature of the United States government (a > corporation in bankruptcy and under the control of the International > Monetary Fund) is. This is not a pretty picture, but what is coming is > what amounts to an internal passport, where you will have to show your > "approved" ID for travel, for "work," and for any other activity, such as > banking, that you now foolishly take for granted. Welcome, to a brave new > world. Oh, and as you read this first part, please note that license is > simply another word for tax. > > BUT DON'T FORGET WE LIVE IN A FREE COUNTRY > > Last fall, as I was preparing to go on my annual 10-day, Montana elk > hunt, I learned that I would have to obtain a brand inspection for the > donkey I had purchased to pack gear - this license because I would cross > county lines, and I might be deemed a "rustler" without it. So, it suddenly > occurred to me to count up the necessary licenses, without which I > couldn't make the hunting trip. > 1. Drivers license > 2. Motor vehicle title (pickup) > 3. Motor vehicle registration > 4. Motor vehicle license and plates > 5. Trailer # 1 (haul camp gear) title > 6. Trailer # 1 registration > 7. Trailer # 1 license and plate > 8. Trailer # 2 (carry donkey) title > 9. Trailer # 2 registration > 10. Trailer # 2 license and plate > 11. Conservation license > 12. Elk hunting license > 13. Deer hunting license > 14. State lands access permit > 15. Forest Service firewood cutting permit > 16. Donkey transport permit and bill of sale (brand inspection) > > As I was traveling slowly (with two trailers) down the road headed for > hunting camp, I was counting up these government permissions, and realized > that I had even more permits in my wallet. > 1. Concealed weapon carry permit > 2. Private pesticide applicator's license > 3. Commercial pesticide applicator's license > 4. Voter registration permit > > Then it occurred to me to think of the other permits that I had at home > that are critical to my daily existence. > 1. Business license (to be in business for myself) > 2. Occupancy permit for my home, including these permits I had to get to > build my home: > a. zoning and comprehensive plan compliance permit > b. building permit > c. excavation permit > d. septic permit > e. electrical permit > f. foundation permit > 3. Lobbyist permit (to lobby the Legislature to uphold the Constitution) > > I am told that the necessary laws are already passed to require every > person to have and carry an internal passport, smart card driver's license, > by October 1st of 2,000. Then, a person will need to obtain government > permission to travel, and probably to breathe. Best wishes, Gary S. > Marbut, President Montana Shooting Sports Association > > If you are looking for a newspaper with good news and timely articles, I > recommend this one, The Jubilee. I have received it before, and I always > found it to be Truthful and full of facts. Washington Grassroots Email > Network > Subject: NID: National ID Card Is Now Federal Law > > > paper.com/id_card_95.htm > The Jubilee Newspaper > http://www.jubilee-newspaper.com/ > P.O. Box 310 > Midpines, CA 95345 > 1-209-742-NEWS > Copies of this issue V9n5 are available from The Jubilee Circulation Dept. > > National ID Card Is Now Federal Law by Cyndee Parker > > In September of 1996, President Clinton signed into law, the Illegal > Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act of 1996. Buried at > approximately page 650 of the new national Defense Bill, also known as > Public Law 104-208, Part B, Title IV, the American public was given a > national ID card. With no fanfare, no publicity and no scrutiny, the bill > easily avoided the watchful eyes of even its most aggressive opponents. > > The Coalition to Repeal the Fingerprints Law, a Georgia grassroots > movement trying to rid the state of the new requirement to give digital > fingerprints in order to obtain a state ID or driver's license, recently > discovered the national ID tie. The group found that the national law not > only mandates a national ID card, but found how it is to be used. > > In Section 401-403, pilot programs have been initiated by the U.S. > Attorney General, one of which is the "Machine Readable Document Pilot > Program." In this particular program, employers would have to "procure" a > document reader linked to the federal government's Social Security > Administration in order to have the potential employee swipe their new > driver's license/national ID card through the reader. Then, it would be up > to the federal government to either approve or disapprove the applicant > for employment. > > Section 326 and 327 provide $5,000,000 per year grants to each state > participating in any of the three pilot programs. The money has been > allocated through the Criminal Alien Tracking Center and is called the > Criminal Alien Identification System. The "automated identification > system," which is to be used by "Federal, State, and local law > enforcement" and will "provide for recording of fingerprints of aliens > previously arrested and removed." The grants run from "fiscal years > 1997 through 2001." > > Additionally, Section 656 of the new law states that "after October 1, > 2000, Federal agencies may only accept as proof of identity driver's > licenses that conform to standards developed by the Secretary of the > Treasury," after consultation with state motor vehicle officials and the > American Association of Motor Vehicle Administrators. The AAMVA sees > digital fingerprinting as the best way to go in driver's license > identifiers. > > Fearing that all Americans were about to be digitally tattooed under the > government's paranoiac guise of catching everything from aliens to dead > beat dads, Congressman Dick Armey (R-TX) was one of the first to voice his > opinion. Armey called the move, "an abomination and wholly at odds with > the American tradition of individual freedom." Senator Spencer Abraham > (R-MI) joined Armey in signing a letter denouncing the computer registry > and tracking system and Jack Kemp announced in the New York Times > that this was, "an anti-privacy, anti-business and anti-American approach" > and that "it was no way to run immigration policy." Of course, all this was > said before the bills were snuck through in the last defense bill. There is a > possibility at this time, they don't even know the proposed legislation > became law. > > For the first time in American history and reminiscent of Communist > countries, our government would have the ability to grant approval before > a private company enters into private employment contracts with private > citizens. Because of the nature of the employment system alone, personal > information would be accessible to local agencies and anyone who even > claims to be an employer. The government would have comprehensive files of > all American citizen's names, dates of birth, place of birth, mother's > maiden names, Social Security numbers, gender, race, driving records, > child support payments, divorce status, hair color, eye color, height, weight, > and anything else they may dream up in the future. > > On May 10, 1995, a hearing was held by the Senate Subcommittee on > Immigration entitled, "Verification of Applicant Identity for the Purposes > of Employment and Public Assistance." The hearing was chaired by Senator > Alan Simpson (R-WY) and attended by Senators Ted Kennedy (D-MA), Dianne > Feinstein (D-CA), and John Kyl (R-AZ). Robert Razor of the Secret Service > Financial Crimes Division gave the Subcommittee an explanation of the > emerging biometric technological role in personal identification. He said, > "The use of biometrics is the means by which an individual may be > conclusively identified. > > There are two types of biometric identifiers: physical and behavioral > characteristics. Physiological biometrics include facial features, hand > geometry, retinal and iris patterns, DNA, and fingerprints. Behavioral > characteristics include voice characteristics and signature analysis." > > Now the people of America not only must have digital tattoos on their > driver's licenses, we must also give information to the government when > boarding commercial aircraft, called personality profiles, along with a > government ID card. > > Of course, this guise is in order to catch some would-be terrorist. > Dianne Feinstein, author of the national ID law, explained in a Capitol > Hill magazine that it was her intention to see Congress immediately > implement a national identity system where every American is required to > carry a card with a "magnetic strip on it which the bearer's unique voice, > retina pattern, or fingerprint is digitally encoded." She also stated that > "fifteen years ago, they would have torn the [The Congressional] building > down." We probably would have if we had known about it. (I hope she > doesn't mind that Georgia left out the magnetic strip and replaced it > with two dimensional bar-coding.) > > During closing remarks of the May 10th Subcommittee meeting, Senator Alan > Simpson stated, "There is much to do here, but I was just saying to Ted > [Kennedy] before he left, a hearing like this fifteen years ago, > would have torn the building down. And here we are today, just a bunch of > us, kind of sitting around and no media, no nothing. This is fine with me. > I get tired of them on this issue." > > Based on other federal mandates, the Associated Press reported in the > Wichita Eagle on March 6, 1997 that the "Federal government mandates a > registry of new employees: State lawmakers balk at bill required by > Congress to ease child support collection. A bill designed to increase > state collection of child support payments was described as a 'Big > Brother' move and drew little support from members of the Senate > Judiciary Committee on Wednesday. But the federal government says the > legislature must pass it or the state could lose as much as $29 million in > federal funds." > > The bill referred to requires the state to set up a "new hires directory" > that would require all employers to report to the state information about > every newly hired employee. The directory would be made available to the > Department of Social and Rehabilitation Services for child support > collections. In the article, they reported that "the date in Kansas and > other states, although confidential, would be available to a national > directory of new hires." They further reported that all people would be > listed, regardless of age and even those that have no child support > obligation. > > The Senate Judiciary Committee in Kansas was quick to offer comments > condemning the federal mandate. Senator Mike Harris from Wichita, the > committee chairman said, "This is the most potentially significant, > far-reaching piece of legislation that has come through this committee." > The legislators from both parties referred to "Big Brother" and George > Orwell's novel, "1984." > > Kansas State Senator Paul Feleciano of Wichita said, "If ever we give > witness to Big Brother watching over us, this is the beginning of it." > Sen. Ed Pugh of Wamego had sharper words for the bill. He said, "I don't > see how it can be drafted by someone in a free society. It's a perfect > example of the ends justifying the means." These Kansas lawmakers are > not referring to the Immigration Act, but to another new federal law, the > Welfare Reform Act. If Kansas refuses to have a state bill in place later > this year, they will lose as much as $29 million in federal funds for child > support collection. Senator Pugh said it is a "wholesale assault on > Constitutional rights." > > The new driver's license requirement mandating fingerprints for Georgia > driver's and those wanting ID cards passed the state legislature with > virtually no public or media attention in April of 1996. The first known > announcement was on the local Atlanta news announcing an October, 1996 > date to begin fingerprinting. (Cyndee Parker, now a coordinator for the > Coalition to Repeal the Fingerprint Law in Georgia began the campaign to > repeal the egregious law.) > > Many Georgia lawmakers joined in on the repeal efforts. Representatives > Mitchell Kaye, Brian Joyce, Vernon Jones and Senator Pam Glanton were the > first to help lead the repeal efforts in the General Assembly of Georgia. > Eight bills were drawn by the House and one by the Senate. > Mitchell Kaye refers to the law as, "tracking us like a can of dog food." > > Due to the Governor's and House Speaker's manipulations, all eight House > bills were held hostage by the House Motor Vehicle's Committee and were > never voted on. The Senate overwhelmingly passed a Senate Bill, only to > find it placed as hostage, along with the other bills in Motor Vehicles. > On the last night of the Georgia Session, Senator Glanton amended another > driver's license related bill and it also was never voted on by the House > due to the same manipulations, illegal rule changes and an incredible > amount of confusion on the House Floor. > > Governor Miller stated numerous times during the year that he would veto > any repeal effort. House Speaker Tom Murphy was happy to see that the > Governor did not have to get out his veto pen. > > Georgia just slipped theirs through unnoticed by lawmakers and the > public, the same way the Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant > Responsibility Act was. > > The group also had to notify their United States Congressional > Representatives and Senators, as they were unaware of the facts as well. > Both State and Federal Representatives and Senators had absolutely no > knowledge they had passed the new laws until the Coalition brought it to > their attention. > > The Coalition to Repeal the Fingerprints Law can be reached at > 404-250-8105 > or visit their web site at: > [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 08:23:35 -0600 From: Joe Sylvester Subject: Paranoid Conspiracy Freaks Right Again? Echelon spy net, exists say BBC and European Parliment! http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/newsid_503000/503224.stm Tuesday, November 2, 1999 Published at 18:01 GMT World Global spy network revealed Listening in to your phone calls and reading your emails By Andrew Bomford of BBC Radio 4's PM programme Imagine a global spying network that can eavesdrop on every single phone call, fax or e-mail, anywhere on the planet. It sounds like science fiction, but it's true. Two of the chief protagonists - Britain and America - officially deny its existence. But the BBC has confirmation from the Australian Government that such a network really does exist and politicians on both sides of the Atlantic are calling for an inquiry. ... Every international telephone call, fax, e-mail, or radio transmission can be listened to by powerful computers capable of voice recognition. They home in on a long list of key words, or patterns of messages. They are looking for evidence of international crime, like terrorism. Open Oz The network is so secret that the British and American Governments refuse to admit that Echelon even exists. But another ally, Australia, has decided not to be so coy. The man who oversees Australia's security services, Inspector General of Intelligence and Security Bill Blick, has confirmed to the BBC that their Defence Signals Directorate (DSD) does form part of the network. "As you would expect there are a large amount of radio communications floating around in the atmosphere, and agencies such as DSD collect those communications in the interests of their national security", he said. Asked if they are then passed on to countries like Britain and America, he said: "They might be in certain circumstances." ... "There's no safeguards, no remedies, " he said, "There's nowhere you can go to say that they've been snooping on your international communications. Its a totally lawless world." Breaking the silence Both Britain and America deny allegations like this, though they refuse to comment further. But one former US army intelligence officer has broken the code of silence. Colonel Dan Smith told the BBC that while this is feasible, it is not official policy: "Technically they can scoop all this information up, sort through it, and find what it is that might be asked for," he said. "But there is no policy to do this specifically in response to a particular company's interests." The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution. ---Doug McKay" Joe Sylvester Don't Tread On Me ! - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Nov 99 09:14:21 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: Fwd: Gun Ban Poll at www.vote.com, We're Losing! Vote Early; Vote (fwd) On Nov 5, ASSETNJ@AOL.COM wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] In a message dated 11/5/99 3:08:09 AM Eastern Standard Time, NJGunsRus writes: << http://www.vote.com/vote/1180/ >> [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Nov 99 10:33:00 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: FBI relies upon witch's authority to define cultic behavior (1/4) (fwd) Long, but any Christian who thinks they shouldn't be involved in Politics, desperately needs to read this! On Nov 05, D. D. wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] Thought you'd like to see if you are in this group of terrorists. Rick ;-(> - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: "ScanThisNews" To: "ScanThisNews Recipients List" Subject: [FP] FBI relies upon witche's authority to define cultic behavior Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 23:54:23 -0600 ====================================================================== SCAN THIS NEWS 11.4.99 FBI relies upon witch's authority to define cultic behavior This is totally shocking! This is long but you must read this report! Every religious organization in this country should campaign for an official government retraction of the inflammatory, guilt-by-association aspersions cast upon Christians within the FBI's Project Megiddo report. On Tuesday, November 2, 1999 the FBI released its report on potential domestic terrorism in the United States in anticipation of possible domestic disruptions at the end of the year. The Project Megiddo (PM) report begins with the statement: : "Many extremist individuals and groups place some significance on : the next millennium, and as such it will present challenges to law : enforcement at many levels. The significance is based primarily : upon either religious beliefs relating to the Apocalypse or : political beliefs relating to the New World Order (NWO) conspiracy : theory. The challenge is how well law enforcement will prepare and : respond." The report is replete with inferences that anyone who believes the events which the Bible describes as taking place at the time of Christ's return will be "apocalyptic" in nature, and anyone who believes these events could take place during their own lifetime, is a potential terrorist and a potential threat to the country's security. In the PM report at page 28 under section VII, titled "Apocalyptic Cults," footnote 43, you will find reference to the "cult check lists" for use by law enforcement in determining whether or not a given group (within their respective jurisdiction) is a "cult" (as defined in the report). Groups which fit the FBI's definition of a cult pose a potential threat during the coming end of year changes. Thererore, isn't it very important that we all know what the cult traits are? The authority cited for this study is B.A. Robinson. He is credited as author of "Factors Commonly Found in Doomsday Cults." The PM report says that Robinson's material gives law enforcement a method to identify "traits that provide a framework for analyzing cults." The following web page link is included in footnote 43: http://www.religioustolerance.org/cultsign.htm. Robinson's web page, entitled "Common Signs of Destructive Cults," is really little more than an index page with hotlinks to some extreme left-wing, anti-Christian pages. He states that these pages provide the "guidelines that give a general idea of the degree of manipulation found in religious and other groups." Those of faith who presently attend any mainstream denominational church should seriously consider whether their own church affiliation is, in light of these cult tests, considerd cultic behavior. This is, after all, the best and indeed only clue we have as to who exactly the FBI is talking about when it refers to "cults" in its PM report. The first link Mr. Robin provides is to the Institute for First Amendment Studies, Inc: http://www.berkshire.net/~ifas/ Robinson says this about the IFAS: "They oppose various political activities of conservative Christian groups. They have checklist of symptoms to be sensitive to when you, a friend or family member becomes involved with a religious group. Here's the link he provides for IFAS: http://www.berkshire.net/~ifas/wa/warning.html There, you'll find their "Early warning signs," wherein it is stated: "These early warning signs ... may serve as a useful checklist to determine if you, a family member, or a friend has become involved in a destructive Bible-based religion." And, here are the signs: : - Isolation from everyone or everything outside of the group and : its control. : - A we/they mentality. All those outside the group are somehow : negative or not equal; one must be a member. Partial commitment : or belief is not tolerated (no shades of grey). : - Everything outside of the group is evil, of the devil, or : worldly. : - Excessive fasting and praying, extreme tension or stress, which : may result in eating disorders, chronic depression, acute : anxiety, physical exhaustion, or illness. : - Hallucinations (i.e. visions or messages from God). : - Compulsively talking about the group, its leaders, and its : doctrines. Repeatedly quoting certain scriptures emphasized : by the group. : - Refusing to engage in conversation that may question the : group and its leaders. Such criticism may even be : characterized as satanic. : - Almost complete or total domination of the participant's : time by the group. : - Attending Bible study, crusades, revivals, prayer meetings, : services, or other group activities constantly. Little if : any time is left for family, old friends, or other interests. : - The group discourages questions concerning its leaders or : doctrines. Doubt may be equated to an attack by the devil : upon the follower's mind. : - Compulsively and constantly witnessing their beliefs to : everyone, often in a confrontational or extreme manner. [Note: This caveat is included at the bottom of this page: "These early warning signs were prepared by former deprogrammer and current exit counselor, Rick Ross. Ross was recently found guilty of conspiracy to limit the civil rights to freedom of religion of a member of a Pentecostal church. However, the above guidelines appear to have merit in spite of the background of the author." This is an FBI source for the Megiddo Report] The next link found on the FBI's ultra left-wing, anti-Christian scare-the-dickens-out-of-ya cult-checklist source web page is called "Mind-Manipulating Groups: Are you or a Family Member a Victim?": http://www.csj.org/infoserv_cult101/checklis.htm Here are the warning signs: : - The group is preoccupied with bringing in new members. : - The group is preoccupied with making money. : - Questioning, doubt, and dissent are discouraged or even : punished. : - Mind-numbing techniques (such as meditation, chanting, : speaking in tongues, denunciation sessions, debilitating : work routines) are used to suppress doubts about the group : and its leader(s). : - The leadership dictates sometimes in great detail how : members should think, act, and feel (for example: members : must get permission from leaders to date, change jobs, get : married; leaders may prescribe what types of clothes to : wear, where to live, how to discipline children, and so : forth). : - The group's leader is not accountable to any authorities : (as are, for example, military commanders and ministers, : priests, monks, and rabbis of mainstream denominations). : - The group teaches or implies that its supposedly exalted : ends justify means that members would have considered : unethical before joining the group (for example: collecting : money for bogus charities). : - The leadership induces guilt feelings in members in order : to control them. : - Members' subservience to the group causes them to cut ties : with family and friends, and to give up personal goals : and activities that were of interest before joining the : group. : - Members are expected to devote inordinate amounts of time : to the group. : - Members are encouraged or required to live and/or socialize : only with other group members However, when I got to the third link I could not believe what I found. There, readers are directed to the web pages of a professing witch. The witch, P.E.I. Bonewits, "founder of the Druidic group ArnDraiocht Fein," in 1979 developed a checklist of 15 items which the FBI recommends for us in evaluating the potential danger of religious groups. This list was published in Real Magic, Revised Edition, (Samuel Weiser, NY, 1989). See: http://www.neopagan.net/ABCDEF.HTML or http://www.witchvox.com/basics/cultaware.html You must remember when reading the following, this is the authority the FBI used for defining dangerous cults and cult behavior and it is written by a professing witch. Here's the pagan witch web site relied upon by the FBI: http://www.neopagan.net/ The "neopagan" site, hosted by Isaac Bonewits contains (in his words), "materials by and about Isaac Bonewits and his topics of expertise: Druidism, Paganism, Witchcraft, magic(k), liturgical design, polytheology, and polyamory." This is the FBI's authority talking. You better pay attention. He may be talking about you. The witch's cult check list is called the "Advanced Bonewits' Cult Danger Evaluation Frame," or the "ABCDEF" -- again, this is the FBI's authority. The introduction to the ABCDEF checklist includes the following statement: "...members of the "Religious Reich" will find that their own organizations (and quite a few large mainstream churches) are far more "cult-like" than the minority belief systems they so bitterly oppose." Notice who the cult is? The "religious right" (Reich). Now if you are wondering who Bonewits and the FBI consider to be the Religious Reich, wonder no longer because Mr. Bonewits has prepared a complete report -- which you can be certain the FBI also read and blessed -- which is included in its entirety below. [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Nov 99 10:33:56 PST From: roc@xpresso.seaslug.org (Bill Vance) Subject: FBI relies upon witch's authority to define cultic behavior (2/4) (fwd) On Nov 05, D. D. wrote: [-------------------- text of forwarded message follows --------------------] ========================================== Understanding the Religious Reich 1.5 http://www.neopagan.net/ReligiousReich.HTML or How Fundamentalists Define "Religious Freedom" "Deeply hath sunk the lesson thou hast given and shall not soon depart." -- William C. Bryant Introduction, Summer '99 c.e. A few years ago, Neopagan newsletters and journals were publishing articles about a religious freedom organization (now defunct), that had been founded by Christian fundamentalists and which had invited Neopagans to join. The response from Neopagans at the time was, I believed, naive. That led to the first publishing of this essay in 1990 under the title, "Can We Trust 'Friendly' Fundamentalists?" During the 1990s, organizations such as the Moral Majority and the Christian Coalition almost completely took over the Republican Party on a local and state level, and bragged about their abilities to control the results of elections. By the mid-90s, they were riding high and convinced that they had essential control over the Congress, if not the rest of the national government. However, Republican Representatives and Senators failed to drive Bill Clinton out of office amid a bewildering (to them) amount of high public support for the President. That support was rooted, I believe, not only in a good economy, but also in three other factors: (1) the common cultural expectation that a nation's ruler is supposed to be a "stud" (thus fullfilling the Indo-European "Third Function" of fertility, for example); (2) the quiet agreement of the average American male that if he were the nations primary "power object," he too would probably take advantage of the many women approaching him as such; and (3) the simple fact that most Americans simply don't care about a politician's sex life, as long as it doesn't interfere with doing his or her job. Only now is the "Religious Right" beginning to realize and admit that it has already lost the "culture wars" with the rest of modern society. This bitter pill is combining with millenial fever to put some fundamentalist Christian leaders into a frenzy. Many of them actually hope that the dreaded "Y2K Bug" will lead to a collapse of the national and state governments, so that they can use their already existing political networks and militia groups to take over in the "power vaccuum". When 2001 c.e. arrives and neither the longed for "Armageddon" nor their "Second Coming" has occurred, their political and cultural power will be finally, irreparably, broken. History, however, shows that opponents are often most dangerous when they have accepted defeat and no longer care about their own survival -- just the destruction of as many enemies as they can take down with them. In these dangerous times, American Neopagans, and all others who cherish our constitutional freedoms, should improve our understanding of what fundamentalism is, of the long-range plans of "Christian Reconstructionism," and of what a fundamentalist considers "religious freedom." If, by the way, you feel that this essay and others on this site such as the one on the Real Origins of Halloween are filled with "hatred" of Christianity, you might wish to read "Anti-Christianity" and Who Hates Who? Defining "Fundamentalism" Throughout this essay I'm going to be referring to "fundamentalists," so perhaps I should clarify the term. Let me start, as I so often do, with a historical review of the term -- on this occasion quoting from the 1964 edition of A Handbook of Theological Terms, by Van A. Harvey: Fundamentalism is a name that was attached to the viewpoint of those who, shortly after the turn of the [19th-20th] century, resisted all liberal attempts to modify orthodox Protestant belief or to question the infallibility of the Bible in any respect. The name is derived from a series of tracts published between 1912-14, entitled The Fundamentals that aimed at defining and defending the essentials of Protestant doctrine. The most important of the fundamental doctrines were (1) the inspiration and infallibility of the Bible, (2) the doctrine of the Trinity, (3) the virgin birth and deity of Christ, (4) the substitutionary theory of the atonement, (5) the bodily resurrection, ascension and second coming of Christ (parousia). Since most of these beliefs have been a part of Christian orthodoxy [for fifteen centuries], historians have seen the uniqueness of fundamentalism to consist in its violent opposition to all beliefs that seem opposed to some teaching of the Bible. In the twenties and thirties, this opposition was focused particularly on any theory of man's [sic] origins, especially evolution, that seemed incompatible with the account in Genesis. Consequently, fundamentalism tended to be identified with blind opposition to all critical inquiry. Because of this identification, certain conservative theologians who share the above-described beliefs but who think they can be defended in a rational manner have tended to shirk the name "fundamentalist" and call themselves "evangelical conservatives." They generally oppose the spirit of ecumenism and any theology, including neo-Reformed theology, which does not regard the Bible as the absolute and infallible rule of faith and practice. The term "fundamentalist" has since been extended by the mass media to refer to "fundamentalist" Jews, Moslems, and even Hindus! In each case, the inference is that some people refuse to budge from the most conservative version of their faith that is available to them. Non-Christian examples include some Orthodox Jews and Shiite Moslems. Christian but not Protestant examples would be conservatives within both Roman and Eastern Orthodox Catholicism, as well as Mormons (though non-Mormons often consider them "non-Christian"). Nontheistic examples would include most Marxists and Secular Humanists, as well as other fervent atheists. For the purposes of this essay, I could simply refer to "ultra-conservative monotheists," but "fundamentalists" is somewhat shorter and the modern Christian Protestants who call themselves by this term are, in fact, the primary threat to our lives and freedom right now. So on those occasions when I don't specifically mention it, you may keep in mind all the others mentioned in the preceding paragraph. The Unholy Trinity The primary emotions driving fundamentalists are an Unholy Trinity of anger, hatred and fear: anger that there are other religions in the world (implying the possibility that their own fundamentalism might not be the One True Right and Only Way after all); hatred of these other faiths and their followers for daring to exist and refusing to immediately convert; a fear that if these other faiths are allowed to continue to exist, they will seduce the fundamentalists' membership away, and an even deeper fear that if their fundamentalist beliefs are actually incorrect, then they will have essentially wasted their lives avoiding opportunities for happiness in the here-and-now while chasing their "pie in the sky when they die" (which is not relevant for the atheist fundamentalists). While psychological analyses of their religious beliefs infuriate True Believers, they can nonetheless be quite revealing to outside observers. It seems obvious to me that this Unholy Trinity is a religious expression of the severely dysfunctional childhoods so common to fundamentalists. The emotional repression involved in being raised as a fundamentalist tends to breed anger, hatred and fear towards yourself and the world around you. Fundamentalism, with its pervasive sense of guilt about most normal physical and emotional feelings, and its patriarchal structure wherein the father's word is law, creates family atmospheres in which emotional, physical and/or sexual abuse of children is the rule, not the exception. Such abuse, now being publicized thanks to organizations such as Fundamentalists Anonymous, Walk Away, and various incest survivors' groups, can't help but create personalities in which legitimate anger, hatred, and fear towards their abusers is redirected inwards, creating the guilt and shame so useful for fundamentalist religious authorities. Later in life, these painful emotions can be redirected again, this time towards "safe" targets -- people with different religious and moral convictions than those one's family claims. Again, I'm using the term "fundamentalists" very broadly. I've heard similar life histories from people raised as Orthodox Jews, Mormons, and Jehovah's Witnesses -- and I can clearly remember the patterns from my own Roman Catholic childhood. The Unholy Trinity is exhibited in other ways that have affected all of Western history: anger towards ambiguity (why can't Mom/Dad/Siblings be predictable?); hatred towards women (why didn't Mom protect me?); and a generalized fear of the entire world (what awful thing will happen to me next?). The resulting emotional turmoil from these factors can't help but effect the overall worldview, and thus the religious beliefs and actions, of the victims. Arguing with Fundamentalists Many people of good will are naive enough to think that they can logically persuade fundamentalists to be more tolerant. Unfortunately, trying to discuss religion with a fundamentalist is somewhat like trying to discuss color theory with people who can only see black and white. When you try to point out, however diplomatically, that their vision is limited by their inability to see red, green, blue or yellow, they will insist that it is your view that is the limited one, because you can't see that a black and white worldview is more accurate in some ultimate way. If you suggest that the universe is more complex than their dogmatic divisions of "100% Truth" vs. "100% Falsehood," they will accuse you of being dogmatic, because you refuse to consider the possibility that their dogmas might be 100% True. Their next step is usually to denounce you as demonic, or the dupe of demons, for thinking that there might be any Truth outside their particular denomination's version of their scriptures. More sophisticated (or pretentious) fundamentalists will suggest that critics of fundamentalism should try to raise objections which show that it "fails" on "its own terms," not "your" terms. This, of course, is impossible, not because fundamentalism has no gaping holes in its theology (it has many, as any moderate or liberal Christian minister will be happy to explain), but because it is a closed logic system that defines itself as always True and all differing views as always False -- hence logical "failure" can never be demonstrated because it literally cannot be perceived by the fundamentalists. The closedness of the fundamentalist logic system is turned into a "virtue" by references to "the theological fallacy of testing God's authoritative word by extrascriptural standards." As for what they assume "your" terms are, this is always a simplistic cartoon that distorts -- and blurs together -- every competing view on the planet into a dualistic mirror of their own, which they then can triumphantly "defeat" (the famous "straw man" gambit). When fundamentalism's prime philosophical opposition came from Scientistic atheists and agnostics, who were dualists themselves, it was relatively easy for fundamentalists to play this game. They are much more confused -- and threatened -- by pluralism, relativity, and ambiguity, hence their urgent need to reduce all complexity to the psychologically soothing, if philosophically and spiritually bankrupt, simplicity of dualism. More dangerously, for those of us who care about human rights, this need for simplicity leads them to desire secular power to enforce their opinions, which they call "God's Law," and to eliminate all competing worldviews. [------------------------- end of forwarded message ------------------------] - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- RKBA! ***** Blessings On Thee, Oh Israel! ***** RKBA! - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- An _EFFECTIVE_ | Insured | All matter is vibration. | Let he who hath no weapon in every | by COLT; | -- Max Plank | weapon sell his hand = Freedom | DIAL | In the beginning was the | garment and buy a on every side! | 1911-A1. | word. -- The Bible | sword.--Jesus Christ - ----------------+----------+--------------------------+--------------------- - - ------------------------------ End of roc-digest V2 #298 *************************