From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest) To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: Zorn List Digest V2 #969 Reply-To: zorn-list Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk Zorn List Digest Wednesday, June 21 2000 Volume 02 : Number 969 In this issue: - Brotzmann tentet + 2 [was: SY in NYC review] Re: Brotzmann tentet + 2 [was: SY in NYC review] Re: Brotzmann tentet + 2 [was: SY in NYC review] Re: Brotzmann tentet + 2 [was: SY in NYC review] Re: Marclay/Arto Big Gundown Anniversary Edition RE: Eyvind Kang's "The Story Of Iceland" Re: Big Gundown Anniversary Edition Kotik's Response to John Kennedy's post re 103 Re: Big Gundown Anniversary Edition Dying Ground (was RE: Eyvind Kang's "The Story Of Iceland") Re: Brotz show HIPocrisy HOP COBRA RE: Big Gundown Anniversary Edition the namesake If it isn't broken............ new Murakami books house of leaves Re: new Murakami books book recs [murakami-l] Re: new Murakami books ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 19 Jun 2000 23:09:04 EDT From: "Mathieu Belanger" Subject: Brotzmann tentet + 2 [was: SY in NYC review] Hello, > The Br=F6tzmann 10tet + 2 was pretty good. Sorry for this little question. I know it seems a little late but I simply kept forgetting to ask... Who are the "+2"? I am assuming the line-up of the tentet did not change very much in the last year, but I am curious to know who are the additionnal players, Thank you, Mathieu - - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jun 2000 23:33:56 EDT From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: Re: Brotzmann tentet + 2 [was: SY in NYC review] In a message dated 6/19/00 11:05:45 PM, belanmat@MAGELLAN.UMontreal.CA writes: << Who are the "+2"? >> Joe McPhee and Mars Williams. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 00:44:37 -0400 From: "Jesse Kudler" Subject: Re: Brotzmann tentet + 2 [was: SY in NYC review] Was William Parker with them at the SY show? I believe it was the Okka Disk page that said he wasn't going to be playing either NY show (or was it just at Tonic?). Which is a shame if true, because he's been the highlight of the groups I've seen him play with on several occasions. - -Jesse - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, June 19, 2000 11:33 PM Subject: Re: Brotzmann tentet + 2 [was: SY in NYC review] > > In a message dated 6/19/00 11:05:45 PM, belanmat@MAGELLAN.UMontreal.CA writes: > > << Who are the "+2"? >> > > Joe McPhee and Mars Williams. > > Jon > www.erstwhilerecords.com > > - > > - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 00:39:24 CDT From: "Kristopher S. Handley" Subject: Re: Brotzmann tentet + 2 [was: SY in NYC review] Weren't McPhee and Williams both part of the "original" Tentet (on the recordings)? So isn't it Campbell (or Kondo) and ________? - -----s: yes, anal >From: JonAbbey2@aol.com ><< Who are the "+2"? >> > >Joe McPhee and Mars Williams. > >Jon >www.erstwhilerecords.com > >- > ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 13:16:18 CEST From: "Andreas Dietz" Subject: Re: Marclay/Arto >From: Dan Hewins >Date: Mon, 19 Jun 2000 16:24:49 -0400 > >Arto, on the other hand, seemed to employ only one technique on his >guitar and that was turn on the distortion and make noise. As a >preface I'll say that I don't want to sound disrespectful but I do >want to describe what I saw as accurately as I can. He didn't ever >play any "notes" or even very many rhythms. He tuned down the lowest >string down to a slobber and left it that way for much of the set. >Does he know how to play the guitar? (I know he does, at least a >little, by hearing his more song-oriented records but If I hadn't >ever heard those I would seriously wonder about his skill level.) Arto is great as a songwriter and singer - not a guitar player. About 10-15 years ago he decided to concentrate on these things and not to really learn the guitar. On his latest CDs are lots of phantastic guitars played by Marc Ribot, Vinicius Cantuaria, Romero Lubambo, Bill Frisell, Amadeo Pace... Arto is still making the noise. Andreas Dietz ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 09:44:25 -0400 From: "Neil H. Enet" Subject: Big Gundown Anniversary Edition What's this BIG GUNDOWN 15th Anniversary Edition about? Does it have extra tracks, liner notes, etc? Thanks in advance Neil - ---- - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 11:01:10 -0400 From: "John L. Scott / Tonic" Subject: RE: Eyvind Kang's "The Story Of Iceland" >Got this album today, it's really quite hard to describe. Somewhere in >between 7 NADEs and Theatre Of Mineral NADEs. The pieces are much longer >and a bit more experimental than on the latter, but there aren't any >noisefests like on the former. The first 5 tracks (which make up "The Story >Of Iceland") focus on one nice little 'theme' (rest assured it isn't the >NADE theme!) developing it in a few different ways, and inserting little >bits of contrasting material here and there. The sixth track is kind of >poppy, but with lots of layered singing and playing. Basically the layers >build up till the end where it has become completely distorted. And the >last track is a short gamelan solo. > >Anyway, my admittedly quite early impression is that it's generally good, >but some of the longer repetitive ones tend to get boring (particularly the >one described as 'kind of poppy' above). > >Incidentally some of the more well known musicians on there: Bar McKinnon, >Tim Young, Keith Lowe, Tucker Martine, Bill Frisell... Trey Spruance is >also cited as one of the recording engineers. > FYI: Eyvind is performing his "Dying Ground" project tonight at Tonic (9:30) with the following line-up: Eyvind Kang (violin), Kato Hideki (bass), Calvin Weston & Billy Martin (drums), Trey Spruance & Tim Young (guitar/keyboards). - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 17:31:09 +0200 From: patRice Subject: Re: Big Gundown Anniversary Edition hi neil! where have you heard about this? what label will it be on? elektra? tzadik? i did a search on amazon, but they only listed the original issue. patRice - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 11:51:38 -0400 From: "Ljova" Subject: Kotik's Response to John Kennedy's post re 103 PETR KOTIK'S RESPONSE TO KENNEDY LETTER: Dear John Kennedy, Here are a few comments on your email message regarding my recording of 103 by John Cage, a copy of which I have just received. It is obvious that you have not taken the trouble to listen to the 103 recording in question; and what is more surprising, is that you have also not taken into account the music itself. I have no problem with personal attacks, but here you have attacked my work, my work ethics, and my music making without an adequate professional base to do so. This is what prompted me to answer your statement: 1) I worked continuously with John Cage from 1964 until his death in August, 1992. My extensive experience with Cage allows me to have a broad perspective on his music, ideas, and personality. 2) I have explained in detail in the liner notes of the Asphodel record release of how Atlas Eclipticalis and 103 were prepared. If you wish to debate this issue perhaps you should read the notes first. 3) Performance versions of Cage's music (something you refer to as an "arrangement") is common practice and is sometimes explicitly required. It assumes understanding of the music, and must be free of ideological baggage. David Tudor did this throughout his life, and it is what I do every time it is necessary. 4) The only thing which matters is the music itself. - -------- Lev "Ljova" Zhurbin L@Ljova.com http://Ljova.com/ Listen to my music: http://mp3.com/Ljova/ (improvisations) http://mp3.com/LevZhurbin/ (compositions) http://mp3.com/FreeBach/ (Free Bach Project) "Do not fear mistakes - there are none." -Miles Davis - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 14:10:16 -0400 From: Steve Smith Subject: Re: Big Gundown Anniversary Edition Can't add anything to the discussion of what's on this new issue of 'Gundown,' but it's on Tzadik, and the Nonesuch version is officially out of print on July 1. Steve ssmith36@sprynet.com patRice wrote: > what label will it be on? elektra? tzadik? > > i did a search on amazon, but they only listed the original issue. - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 20:15:48 +0200 From: "Marcin Gokieli" Subject: Dying Ground (was RE: Eyvind Kang's "The Story Of Iceland") > FYI: Eyvind is performing his "Dying Ground" project tonight at Tonic (9:30) > with the following line-up: Eyvind Kang (violin), Kato Hideki (bass), Calvin > Weston & Billy Martin (drums), Trey Spruance & Tim Young (guitar/keyboards). DG is playing in Warsaw on Thusday, so, any info would be apreciated... Marcin Gokieli marcingokieli@go2.pl <> Auden & Kallman, Stravinsky's "The Rake's Progress" - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 12:40:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Ryan Novak Subject: Re: Brotz show >Date: Mon, 19 Jun 2000 14:09:55 -0400 >From: Dan Hewins >Subject: SY in NYC review (was Re: syr4) >The Br=F6tzmann 10tet + 2 was pretty good. I think >the venue was too >large and open for them to sound good though. They >were mic'd and >mixed like a rock band and that didn't sound so hot >to >me. The >composition wasn't that interesting to me either. It >seemed like >full-on blasts from the whole group interspersed with >sols and duos >and trios improvising. Isn't that the appeal though, that the huge group breaks into pieces at points and creates various combinations of the different musicians? I think if the whole band was jumping all the time things would probably have to be more rigidly composed instead of a looser, more texture oriented organization. As someone who is travelling from LA to see the fellows in San Francisco, I just don't want to hear anything negative. :~) Actually, I love Other Brothers also, but that has composition and the smaller group improv in it too doesn't it? Ryan N.- geeked up about seeing the show tonight __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send instant messages with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com/ - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue Jun 20 15:51:59 2000 From: XRedbirdxx@aol.com Subject: HIPocrisy HOP COBRA am late getting to my mail and replying to this, sorry. this comes as quite a surprise, given the unjust shit he gave the Cincinnati group for including speech elements, pop/jazz music mixed with the abstract, and such, on a radio interview here. his words: "i wrote cobra to make beautiful music." fucking hypocrite. it's almost as if he pisses on them for it, and then takes the idea for his own use. or maybe since it's cibo matto with the idea here, being cute asian ladies with fame a record contract and all, it's all kosher with him -- he'll come prompt! but if it's young unknown musicians in the midwest trying to bring his work to a new audience in a sincere and conscientious manner, who also happen to have ideas about taking cobra in new directions, well they can just kiss his ass and fall victim to another classic, tired, zorn complainfest. on that note why continue to call this the "zorn" list, as it covers all musicians on the scene? many of whom are proving to be more worthwhile than its namesake. idol killing and hoping he sees this, J breinfalk Cibo Matto presents > John Zorn's HIP HOP Cobra > + special guest performers & djs > Brooklyn Bridge Anchorage, Brooklyn, NY > $12 adv/ $15 at door; 10pm > > (zorn will be prompter - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 16:40:09 -0400 From: "Neil H. Enet" Subject: RE: Big Gundown Anniversary Edition Pat asked: where have you heard about this? what label will it be on? elektra? tzadik? - ---------------- I was looking in a place called TOWER RECORDS www.towerrecords.com (never heard of it before) and there it was. But there's no information, actually it says "n/a". But there is another one (obviously the same one) that says:The Big Gundown (Remaster) on TZADIK. The release date is 8/22/00. Personally, I'm glad I haven't bought this one yet. :-) Neil H. Enet - ------------ - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 18:45:11 -0600 From: "Matthew W Wirzbicki (S) " Subject: the namesake >on that note why continue to call this the "zorn" list, as it covers all >musicians on the scene? many of whom are proving to be more worthwhile >than its namesake. I'm not sure what 'scene' you're refering to. Downtown NY or beyond? In any event I would like to see a name change. It seems like the "zorn" list is a little bit of an inappropriate title for this list given the spectrum covered. Plus all the messages warning NO ZORN CONTENT are a little odd to me. But, I'm no zorn fan. I never have been. A new name would likely change the tone of the list a little bit. The future subscribers wouldn't necessarily be zorn fans but I don't think that's a downside. Relocation might also be an option. Matt Wirzbicki - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 18:04:52 -0700 From: "s~Z" Subject: If it isn't broken............ Please don't change anything about this list. Mr. Rizzi does a fabulous job of managing things just the way they are, called just what it is called. This list ain't broke, and needs no fixing. - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 00:08:05 EDT From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: new Murakami books well, unless the name of the list changes to murakami-l, I suppose this is somewhat off-topic. but I know we discussed the works of Haruki Murakami here a year or two ago, so I thought I'd let people know that there are two new books available by him in English translations. the first is Norwegian Wood, which he wrote in 1987, and the second is Underground, which is his most recent book, a non-fiction book about the gas attacks in the Tokyo subway. anyway, here's the catch: these are only available in Europe as of now. Norwegian Wood is scheduled for US release in September and Underground seems to have been dropped from Knopf's US schedule completely, at least for now. but thanks to the wonders of the internet, those of us in the US can order them from Amazon's UK site. the two of them cost me about $48 including shipping, and got here within a few days after I ordered, making me a happy guy. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 00:50:24 -0400 From: "Caleb T. Deupree" Subject: house of leaves As long as books are coming up again, I'll just add that I appreciate the recommendations from the multi-national group here, and enjoyed the Lars Gustafsson novel Death of a Beekeeper which was recommended here several months ago. I think our eclectic musical tastes must spill over into literature as well. It is these eclectic tastes and discussions that categorize this discussion group. The connection to Zorn is that his music is equally eclectic, and he quite happily discusses all sorts of new art in liner notes and interviews. I also wouldn't change a thing about this list. With this in mind, I'd also like to recommend the best new American fiction I've seen in years, since Mason Dixon, Underworld, or Infinite Jest: House of Leaves by Mark Z. Danielewski. It's a first novel, with parallel tales about a house that's bigger on the inside than it is on the outside, and the narration by the novel's first reader, a tattoo-parlor worker from southern California. The book has the most interesting use of fonts and typographical expression that I've ever seen. Some people might find it gimmicky, but I found it very effective at telling a pretty creepy and complex story. - -- Caleb Deupree cdeupree@erinet.com Work like you don't need the money. Love like you've never been hurt. Dance like nobody's watching. - -- Satchel Paige - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 02:02:38 -0400 From: Steve Smith Subject: Re: new Murakami books I haven't yet checked into Murakami but at least I've got one of his books on my teeming "to be read" pile - 'South of the Border, West of the Sun.' Managed to pick this up recently at my former place of work, whose offices are in the same building as Random House. At least once a week RH would put several bookshelves of books in the foyer opposite the company cafeteria on the 8th floor, free for the taking. I found the Murakami and remembered the discussion that had gone on here, so I should get around to it soon. Darn thing's autographed, too... SS - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 06:02:23 GMT From: "Bill Ashline" Subject: book recs Who cares about list names? Book recommendations: Michel Gaillot/Multiple Meaning Techno: Political Laboratory of the Present/Disvoir Press (contains an interview with the philosopher Jean-Luc Nancy and one with a sociologist who's written on orgies--a smarter reading of techno than one will get from most avant-garde heads, though he makes little distinction regarding the forms) Michael Hardt and Antonio Negri/Empire/Harvard UP (critique of globablization--Negri still sits in an Italian prison for political activities in the eighties) Alphonso Lingis/Abuses/U California (travel narratives with a theoretical accent) Just bought a copy of Douglas Kahn's Wireless Imagination--precursor to Noise/Water/Meat discussed here previously--also bought a copy of Ryo Murakami's Coin Locker Babies at narita airport in Tokyo. Will provide a non-evaluative explication to all private queries.... ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 02:33:47 EDT From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: [murakami-l] Re: new Murakami books In a message dated 6/21/00 2:03:14 AM, ssmith36@sprynet.com writes: << I haven't yet checked into Murakami but at least I've got one of his books on my teeming "to be read" pile - 'South of the Border, West of the Sun.' >> this one's pretty good, but it's definitely a minor work. I'd recommend starting with Hard-Boiled Wonderland and the End of the World or The Wind-Up Bird Chronicle. the latter is as good as any book I've read in the past five years. <> one of the very few things I miss about working at Time is all the books and CDs that were constantly laying around, also free for the taking. I probably picked up a hundred Vintage International titles this way. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - - ------------------------------ End of Zorn List Digest V2 #969 ******************************* To unsubscribe from zorn-list-digest, send an email to "majordomo@lists.xmission.com" with "unsubscribe zorn-list-digest" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "zorn-list-digest" in the commands above with "zorn-list". Back issues are available for anonymous FTP from ftp.xmission.com, in pub/lists/zorn-list/archive. These are organized by date. Problems? Email the list owner at zorn-list-owner@lists.xmission.com