From: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com (Zorn List Digest) To: zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Subject: Zorn List Digest V3 #720 Reply-To: zorn-list Sender: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Errors-To: owner-zorn-list-digest@lists.xmission.com Precedence: bulk Zorn List Digest Tuesday, January 29 2002 Volume 03 : Number 720 In this issue: - Re: NRBQ's Ardolino (was: Re: The Gift) Re: Fwd: Re: The Gift (actual Zorn content; LONG AND BORING) Re: NRBQ's Ardolino (was: Re: The Gift) Re: lots of questions RE: godel's incompleteness theorem 1. non-zc, but interesting [? ] content about a piece i'm working on. Fwd: Re: Fwd: Re: The Gift (actual Zorn content; LONG AND BORING) Re: Re: lots of questions Re: Fujii/ Feldman/ February Re: NRBQ's Ardolino (was: Re: The Gift) [none] Re: Re: lots of questions Re: Fujii/ Feldman/ February Tom Ardolino Odp: Online Bookstores (NO ZORN CONTENT - SORRY!) Odp: Zorn / Douglas (was: Re: The Gift) Odp: Bar KoKhba Odp: The Gift (actual Zorn content; LONG AND BORING) Re: Odp: Zorn / Douglas (was: Re: The Gift) Odp: NRBQ's Ardolino (was: Re: The Gift) Re: Curlew ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 10:18:24 -0800 From: Skip Heller Subject: Re: NRBQ's Ardolino (was: Re: The Gift) > From: patRice > Subject: NRBQ's Ardolino (was: Re: The Gift) > > Could you maybe tell me/us a little more about this band? I've never > heard of them... > Which album can you recommend? > > patRice Conventional wisdom says YANKEE STADIUM, which is prob their most Beatle-esque record, is the one. But it leaves out a lot of things I love about the band. On the other hand, it might be the easiest intro to the group. NRBQ (the one on Rounder, not Columbia) is my favorite in most ways. But the easiest recommendation to make is the Rhino double-disc PEEK A BOO, which anthologizes the band fr 1970-1990. The trick is to play disc two first, and kind of work your way backwards. Al Anderson didn't join the group until about 1972, and Ardolino didn't get there until 1975, so the "real" line-up (re: anything with Tom) didn't happen until then. And, at that, the best way to discover this group is to go see 'em live. They're always pretty cosmic. skip h - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 10:22:26 -0800 From: "Patrice L. Roussel" Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: The Gift (actual Zorn content; LONG AND BORING) On Tue, 29 Jan 2002 10:23:04 +0100 (CET) =?iso-8859-1?q?Efr=E9n=20del=20Valle?= wrote: > > I listened to an statement from Evan Parker on Zorn's > playing in which he regarded JZ as the only really Where did you see this statement? Patrice. - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 13:27:50 -0500 From: James Hale Subject: Re: NRBQ's Ardolino (was: Re: The Gift) To this I would add TERRIBLE, which was released on New World under Terry Adams' name. In addition to the great Ardolino it features Roswell Rudd, Marshall Allen, Bobby Previte and many others (including John Sebastian on guitar). Great CD. James Hale Skip Heller wrote: > > From: patRice > > > Subject: NRBQ's Ardolino (was: Re: The Gift) > > > > Could you maybe tell me/us a little more about this band? I've never > > heard of them... > > Which album can you recommend? > > > > patRice > > Conventional wisdom says YANKEE STADIUM, which is prob their most > Beatle-esque record, is the one. But it leaves out a lot of things I love > about the band. On the other hand, it might be the easiest intro to the > group. > > NRBQ (the one on Rounder, not Columbia) is my favorite in most ways. But > the easiest recommendation to make is the Rhino double-disc PEEK A BOO, > which anthologizes the band fr 1970-1990. The trick is to play disc two > first, and kind of work your way backwards. Al Anderson didn't join the > group until about 1972, and Ardolino didn't get there until 1975, so the > "real" line-up (re: anything with Tom) didn't happen until then. > > And, at that, the best way to discover this group is to go see 'em live. > They're always pretty cosmic. > > skip h > > - - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 10:35:08 -0800 From: Chris Selvig Subject: Re: lots of questions Re: Canavarro, I remember reading somewhere (Swill Radio, maybe?) that the Moikai version of "Plux Quba" was toyed with by Toral and/or O'Rourke, apparently giving it a sound more in line with Mouse on Mars et al. It's an interesting record, but I can't say it really blew me outta the water. Re: the spectral crew, they do a kinda post-Ligeti layering of extended tones. The Radulescu I have, "Inner Time II," is quite worthwhile - it's one hour-long piece in which a bunch of bass clarinets (8 or 9?) sweep gradually from super-high squeaks down to the frequency range one tends to associate with the instrument. The Grisey I've heard is great, though I can't remember title or label info, so what good am I? The Murail, borrowed from the owner of the Grisey disc, left me a bit cold - the feel of the music is too academic for my tastes. And I can't believe all the good shows happening in Colorado Springs, of all places. Better than the Bay Area this week! Chris Selvig - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 11:29:52 -0700 From: "Matthew W Wirzbicki (S)" Subject: RE: godel's incompleteness theorem 1. non-zc, but interesting [? ] content about a piece i'm working on. >>Even on-topic posts from you quickly turn into a bragging session. >>[SNIP] >>NB: you would do everyone a service if you stopped assuming >>that the vast silent majority of potential admirers (the 698 pairs of >>eyes >>staring, and that you are very well aware of, based on what I gather >>from >>your posts) necessarily find your ramblings of any interest. >Seconded. Over. >S here's a third. I think there are many composers/performers/artists here on the list (and I would include myself in the first two catagories) but most people (including myself and I've been here for 4 years) don't make their work the topic of conversation. I've only ever seen such talk as a referance to the topic at hand (ie: "in my experience as a [whatever i am] I have found...."). also, as someone said earlier, if what you've posted is representative of your artwork then I fail to be moved to interest. Matt sorry for the potential futility of this post....I'll try to avoid clutter by simply not reading these postings ala the Rev.'s mirror suggestions. - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 19:57:04 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Efr=E9n=20del=20Valle?= Subject: Fwd: Re: Fwd: Re: The Gift (actual Zorn content; LONG AND BORING) Hi, > > > > I listened to an statement from Evan Parker on > Zorn's > > playing in which he regarded JZ as the only really > > Where did you see this statement? > > Patrice. > Someone sent me 2 Cds with four programs from the BBC Radio dedicated to John Zorn and hosted by Steve Beresford. There are many interesting statements there and I'd be glad to reproduce some of the most outstanding here if you like. It goes through most of Zorn's musical life up to "Taboo & Exile". Really good. Let me know if you want me to pick up some interesting fragments (and pardon my English in advance if my transcriptions are wrong at some point). Best, Efrén del Valle _______________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Messenger Comunicación instantánea gratis con tu gente. http://messenger.yahoo.es - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 13:56:50 -0500 From: Subject: Re: Re: lots of questions Fine little summary of spectralism, something I'm still trying to come to terms with myself. I could just *spit* that I missed a performance of works by Grisey, Claude Vivier and Ivan Fedele (that last one I've not heard of) last night here in NYC - I'd thought that it would give me greater insight into a style of music that would seem to have a greater impact live than on disc. Radalescu aside, there aren't very many discs of most of this stuff, anyway (though I've read great things about a new Grisey disc on the Kairos label). However, I will say that an orchestral work I heard by Murail late last year was staggering. Reportedly a musical realization of a complex computerized interpretation of a photo of the ocean (!), the music did indeed sound like a 21st century 'La Mer' - not a bad thing in my book. Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 11:23:17 -0800 From: hatta Subject: Re: Fujii/ Feldman/ February Hey where can I find out more info about this? I live near(enough) to Portland and this sounds worth the the drive! - -Robert >BTW, since Satoko Fujii will play in Portland (OR) on May 6, I assume that she >is touring the States. Even more interesting, Tatsuya Yoshida (Ruins) will >be the drummer. > > Patrice. - -- Hobbes: "Is it a right to remain ignorant?" Calvin: "I don't know, but I refuse to find out!" -Bill Waterson, 'Calvin & Hobbes' - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 11:51:32 -0800 From: Skip Heller Subject: Re: NRBQ's Ardolino (was: Re: The Gift) > From: James Hale > Organization: James Hale Writing & Editing > Reply-To: jhale@sympatico.ca > Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 13:27:50 -0500 > To: zorn-list@lists.xmission.com > Subject: Re: NRBQ's Ardolino (was: Re: The Gift) > > To this I would add TERRIBLE, which was released on New World under Terry > Adams' name. > In addition to the great Ardolino it features Roswell Rudd, Marshall Allen, > Bobby Previte and many others (including John Sebastian on guitar). > Great CD. > > James Hale Actually, for this list, that's the ideal starting point, and I always take it with me when I'm travelling as it is one of the few CDs I can listen to no matter what my mood (along with the Beatles' HELP and Tower Of Power LIVE & IN LIVING COLOR). sh - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 13:42:38 -0800 From: "John Schuller" Subject: [none] Are there any Keiji Haino fans here? I need to find recordings of his music, that I do not already have. Feel free to e-mail me off list. john _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 13:49:34 -0800 From: Chris Selvig Subject: Re: Re: lots of questions I'd like to see something like Grisey's work performed live, since what I've heard was pretty dependent on processing of acoustic sounds via tape/computer trickery, though the performances may well involve prerecorded tapes. If you're interested in overtone-intensive music I'd recommend checking out Phill Niblock, too - his work is a lot more structurally static than the spectralist guys' stuff, but it is great. At 01:56 PM 1/29/02 -0500, ssmith36@sprynet.com wrote: >Fine little summary of spectralism, something I'm still trying to come to >terms with myself. I could just *spit* that I missed a performance of >works by Grisey, Claude Vivier and Ivan Fedele (that last one I've not >heard of) last night here in NYC - I'd thought that it would give me >greater insight into a style of music that would seem to have a greater >impact live than on disc. Radalescu aside, there aren't very many discs of >most of this stuff, anyway (though I've read great things about a new >Grisey disc on the Kairos label). > >However, I will say that an orchestral work I heard by Murail late last >year was staggering. Reportedly a musical realization of a complex >computerized interpretation of a photo of the ocean (!), the music did >indeed sound like a 21st century 'La Mer' - not a bad thing in my book. > >Steve Smith >ssmith36@sprynet.com Chris Selvig - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 16:09:04 -0500 From: Alan Lankin Subject: Re: Fujii/ Feldman/ February There's a release scheduled in the U.S. next week: - - Satoko Fujii with Mark Feldman - April Shower (Buzz) Feb 5 Has anyone heard this? Fujii will be performing at the Painted Bride in Philadelphia in April. Alan Lankin - -- Jazzmatazz http://jazzmatazz.home.att.net lankina@att.net doron galili wrote: > can anyone tell me if there is a new / american / international/ re - > release of fujii+Feldman's April shower coming up this february? heard > something of it, but still pretty sure it was already released in japan. > any information about that?? - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 23:02:04 GMT From: Parry Gettelman Subject: Tom Ardolino You can't get much more asymmetrical than Tom Ardolino. Plus, it's well nigh impossible to sit still when he plays, and he has this way of making you jiggle around in a nice groove and then all of a sudden, thwack, he drops a beat into some slightly unexpected spot and it's like an invisible chiropractor just snapped your spine into adjustment. Amazing. My favorite drummer, followed by Paul Motian and Kenny Wollesen. Tom Ardolino also has just about the best -- and most twisted -- musical taste in the whole world. I am eternally grateful to him for turning me on to both Rodd Keith (Ellery Eskelin's dad, who composed the brilliantly weird song-poem music) and Takako Minekawa. I think Tom Ardolino has heard just about everything ever recorded. One time I gave him a bizarro self-produced CD somebody sent to me at the Orlando Sentinel, by some Florida guy calling himself the Drugstore Fleabag Cowboy or something like that, and Tom said "Oh, great, I've only ever had his singles!" NRBQ is one of those bands you really have to see live to fully appreciate, but the Rhino compilation Peek-a-Boo has a good selection of some of their most accessible (i.e. pop-leaning) material. If you don't want to spring for a double CD, "At Yankee Stadium" is frequently cited as a good intro, or "Grooves in Orbit." But my personal favorite is "Tap-dancin' Bats," which was the album that hooked me. The beat on "Rats in My Room" is just irresistibly demented. Unfortunately, there's not one individual album that fully documents the really, really left-field aspect of NRBQ -- but you can hear their version of Sun Ra's "Rocket No. 9" on their self-titled (1969!) debut, and the live "Welcome to Orlando," on the CD version of "Kick Me Hard," is a fine example of free jazz (if you will) used as a weapon (to punish a surly audience). And keyboardist Terry Adams has a quite lovely solo album, "Terrible," that shows more of his Monk-ish and Sun-Ra-esque sides (and "I Feel Lucky" I took for a Carla Bley composition when I first heard it live -- he played w/ her on Musique Mecanique and the European tour recording). BTW, NRBQ has a brand-new album available through the Grateful Dead website, "Atsa My Band," but even as a diehard fan, it took me a little while to get into it. It does have a really gorgeous pure-pop song, "Goodbye," by Johnny Spampinato, who had the unenviable task of replacing guitar god Al Anderson jeez, almost a decade ago (and some people are still whining, although Johnny brings plenty of fine musical qualities to the table). Of course, in all things NRBQ, I defer to Skip, who had the enviable if daunting responsibility of filling in for Johnny recently, and acquitted himself most admirably, according to the folks on the NRBQ mailing list who were in attendance. Parry - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2002 00:22:10 +0100 From: "Marcin Gokieli" Subject: Odp: Online Bookstores (NO ZORN CONTENT - SORRY!) I did not use powells.com, but i've been told that the shipping for orders over $50 is free. Which makes me interested in their offer. > I'm wondering whether any of you can recommend good online bookstores? - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2002 00:25:04 +0100 From: "Marcin Gokieli" Subject: Odp: Zorn / Douglas (was: Re: The Gift) I must say his sextet work is where he was the most succesful as a leader IMO (especially 'In our lifetime'). 'Witness' did not impress me, and TBT is greatlive, but boring on disc IMO. - ----- Original Message ----- From: Efrén del Valle > or legitimate, but I love Douglas in every context he > performs (maybe not that much when he gets too > classic, though) and Masada would be one of those > contexts in which I find him most inspired, together > with his Tiny Bell Trio and the lovely, amazing > "Witness" album. - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2002 00:27:58 +0100 From: "Marcin Gokieli" Subject: Odp: Bar KoKhba OK ... if anyone is interested (and can't fin it by some p2p), drop me a line. - ----- Original Message ----- From: Jeroen de Boer To: ; Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 2:21 PM Subject: Re: Bar KoKhba > There's a Polish (25/6/99) recording of the Masada String Trio in > circulation among tapetraders. Try looking for it on Gnutella or another > p2p-program. - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2002 00:33:13 +0100 From: "Marcin Gokieli" Subject: Odp: The Gift (actual Zorn content; LONG AND BORING) > The drummer in NRBQ. He's beyond words. I bought C.Bley 'European Tour 1977' today and found out that Terry Adams, the pienist, appears 'couretsy of NRBQ and Red Rooster Records'. The NRBQ you' re talking about? - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 15:28:11 -0800 From: Skip Heller Subject: Re: Odp: Zorn / Douglas (was: Re: The Gift) > From: "Marcin Gokieli" > Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2002 00:25:04 +0100 > Cc: > Subject: Odp: Zorn / Douglas (was: Re: The Gift) > > I must say his sextet work is where he was the most succesful as a leader > IMO (especially 'In our lifetime'). 'Witness' did not impress me, and TBT is > greatlive, but boring on disc IMO. > Ditto over here, except that I also like Charms Of The Night Sky a helluva lot. sh - - ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2002 00:36:04 +0100 From: "Marcin Gokieli" Subject: Odp: NRBQ's Ardolino (was: Re: The Gift) - ----- Original Message ----- From: James Hale > To this I would add TERRIBLE, which was released on New World under Terry > Adams' name. > In addition to the great Ardolino it features Roswell Rudd, Marshall Allen, > Bobby Previte and many others (including John Sebastian on guitar). > Great CD. That resolves my previous query on bley's album. What's the album like? Seems fascinating. - - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 18:32:56 -0500 From: Rich Williams Subject: Re: Curlew > >On an unrelated issue Curlew - the band - are practically unknown in the UK, >it is hard to track down their releases. I gather a new one is imminent . >Their music seems quite closely related to much of the stuff discussed on >this list but they hardly get a mention. They seem to have been going for >about 20 years. I first heard of them in Gene Santoro 's book Stir It Up but >have seen no mention of them in magazines/books since. > >Do they gig regularly in NYC? Are they seen as part of the downtown gang? I >would appreciate any first hand experience of their live gigs (as far as I >know they have never played here). I would definitely say that they were part of the downtown gang, When Tom Cora moved to Europe and George Cartwright went back down south they performed much more rarely though. and after Tom's passing, I was never fully convinced by the last few versions of the band without him. (Though I haven't yet heard the brand new disc). In their prime they were a very exciting live band usually centered around Cora and Cartwright, Curlew v1 also featured Bill Laswell, Nicky Skopeletis and Drummer Bill Bacon(whatever happened to him?) and recorded a self-titled LP, not reissued on CD, AFAIK. They played at all the regular downtown spots, CBGB,The Mudd Club, Zu, etc. during 1980-81 Curlew v2 had Anton Fier on drums and a bassist whose name i dont remember, they never recorded, I saw this band live a few times. Around 83 Fred Frith joined on bass(mostly),guitar, and violin, Drummer Rick Brown and Guitarist Mark Howell joined briefly before Davey Williams, and most importantly, Drummer Pippin Barnett of the Orthotonics joined. This band recorded North America for Moers Music and played some gigs before Fred Frith was fired in 1985 for "attempting to take over the band" (or so the story goes) They enlisted Wayne Horvitz to play keyboard bass for a while, before settling down with Ann Rupel playing bass. With Frith gone and Davey Williams(The REAL Twang Bar king) in the band, there was a real strong southern swamp jazz feel to the music. This band played regularly throughout the late 80's and were regulars at the old knit. They made several discs for Cuneiform.(I believe their all still available) The post-Cora versions of the band usually included guitarist Chris Cochrane, and eventually Barnett was replaced by Kenny Wolleson. My favorite memory of the band was their appearance at the 1985 Kool Jazz fest. Davey Williams went missing and the band played as a quartet. At one point I was talking with another concert goer, who seemed very concerned about Williams absence, as Curlew was supposed to play the very next day at his wedding! which , at that time, was about the coolest thing I'd ever heard ;-) - - ------------------------------ End of Zorn List Digest V3 #720 ******************************* To unsubscribe from zorn-list-digest, send an email to "majordomo@lists.xmission.com" with "unsubscribe zorn-list-digest" in the body of the message. For information on digests or retrieving files and old messages send "help" to the same address. Do not use quotes in your message. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "zorn-list-digest" in the commands above with "zorn-list". Back issues are available for anonymous FTP from ftp.xmission.com, in pub/lists/zorn-list/archive. These are organized by date. Problems? Email the list owner at zorn-list-owner@lists.xmission.com