From: "Andreas Dietz" Subject: Re: Bill Dixon Date: 01 Oct 1999 09:01:02 CEST Jon Abbey wrote: has anyone heard Dixon's Intents and Purposes, from the late sixties? is it a lost essential classic, or just a good record? I think it´s more than only a good record. There is a solo piece in two parts in Dixon´s typical warm tone, a quintet piece with Byard Lancaster, Jimmy Garrison a.o. which is very inspired silent improv and a tentet piece free and loud. The only matter is: I think it´s hard to find and the duration time is less than 30 minutes... Andreas Dietz ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeni Dahmus Subject: Masada & Zorn/Haas/Fly Date: 01 Oct 1999 11:37:47 -0400 Sadly, I couldn't make it to Tonic last night. How were the Masada and Zorn/Andy Haas/Fly sets? Jeni - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dan Hewins Subject: Re: Masada & Zorn/Haas/Fly Date: 01 Oct 1999 11:44:43 -0400 Jeni et al, I saw the first set of Masada but not the midnight jam. This was the first time I saw Masada live. I was not disappointed in the least. I could watch Joey Baron all night long. He always looks like he's having a great time playing. He laughed and smiled throughout the set. There was one tune (I don't know the title) which is basically a drum solo and it received quite a lot of response from the audience. I just wish it wasn't so expensive. I ended up selling the tix for the second set because I realized I didn't want to pay 40 dollars for two sets of music. Still, I really enjoyed the show and am looking forward to watching Joey play any time! Dan Hewins At 11:37 AM -0400 10/1/99, Jeni Dahmus wrote: >Sadly, I couldn't make it to Tonic last night. How were the Masada and >Zorn/Andy Haas/Fly sets? > >Jeni > >- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jason Tors Subject: Masada Date: 01 Oct 1999 12:16:05 -0800 here you are jeni The first set of Masada was amazing! The first band [forget their name] went over about 1/2 hour so everything else was backed up. Once in, it was packed as usual with laughing and smiling folks. Tonic put up some new lights for the stage so it looked real professional with that same intimate tonic feel. Folks were set down in front of the seats crosslegged looking up at the players, with joey's bass drum in their faces. The guys set up fast and played a tune I didnt recognize, it was a tight fast head with improv blowing and structure changes after, zorn was waving hand signals to the rhythm section, dave didnt need any instruction from zorn he just knew it seemed. The format was a bit different this time around, dave and zorn didnt do the chasing solo bit, they all really set back and played solos, but what great solos they were. As usual I am so in awe of the architecture of DD's solos, where the hell does he get this stuff, I know nothing about music theory but these solos he was blowing were so dynamic and thought provoking and LYRICAL!! joey was laughing and smiling all the time, they all were particularly more exuberant, I think because they might not have played in a while. Everyone was patting each other on the back, many of the other shows seemed to be more serious and intense, this one had the intensity but it was coupled with an infectious giddy energy. JZ took a solo that was back perfectly by greg, he was in his outs and greg used few of those notes to further the out, it really sounded perfect they had a great conversation there. The first solo zorn took I was not impressed with. Excuse me for not mentioning names of songs, there is no way I could track down what song is what tho I recognized over half of them to be greatest hits [meaning ones I have heard them play live many times before] There was one solo that zorn took that was mind blowing. The structure of the solo was joey playing a tom laden rolling rhythm building the tension and broke it after a successful development by zorn and lay into a swing that was so hard, got everyone, and myself included, swaying in the crowd, zorn took it and really pushed it into a trancendant solo. As he was walking to the other side of the stage he swaggered a bit, never really seen that before, and unstrapped his horn and squatted on his hams to listen to DD blow his ass off. Using the same structure joey built up the tension and broke it, everyone was laughing because dave was playing something so incredible, again after he had just blown everyone away in that last tune. What a band. I was disappointing that dave and zorn didnt try to follow eachother, I wonder if they need time playing together to get back in eachother's solos. Or maybe zorn has been composing a lot lately and not playing as much. >Sadly, I couldn't make it to Tonic last night. How were the Masada and >Zorn/Andy Haas/Fly sets? > >Jeni > >- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Martin Schmitz-Ohrndorf Subject: Franz Casseus Date: 01 Oct 1999 19:15:19 +0200 Does anyone know if the works of franz casseus have ever been published. I really would like to know where I can get the scores of the pieces Ribot plays on his casseus recording. thanx martin - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Daniel L Brown" Subject: Joseph Holbrooke(!) Date: 01 Oct 1999 14:50:11 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF0C1C.42E84880 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I just received a mailing from Incus Records.. this struck my eye and I = figured it woud be of great interest to many on this list.... =20 Joseph Holbrooke - "'65 Rehersah Extract" =20 Derek Bailey - guitar Gavin Bryars - bass Tony Oxley - drums =20 A CD single (10:26 long). The only issued recording by Joseph = Holbrooke. They don't give a price in American currency, but list the = item at 6 British Pounds (I'm sure someone knows the math...). Incus Records 14 Downs Road London E5 8DS England ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF0C1C.42E84880 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I just received a mailing from Incus = Records.. this=20 struck my eye and I figured it woud be of great interest to many on this = list....
 
Joseph Holbrooke - "'65 Rehersah=20 Extract"
 
Derek Bailey - guitar
Gavin Bryars - bass
Tony Oxley - drums
 
A CD single (10:26 long).  The = only issued=20 recording by Joseph Holbrooke.  They don't give a price in American = currency, but list the item at 6 British Pounds (I'm sure someone knows = the=20 math...).
 
Incus Records
14 Downs Road
London E5 8DS England
 
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF0C1C.42E84880-- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: Re: Joseph Holbrooke(!) Date: 01 Oct 1999 17:43:32 EDT In a message dated 10/1/99 2:51:43 PM, DLB7@prodigy.net writes: << They don't give a price in American currency, but list the item at 6 British Pounds (I'm sure someone knows the math...). >> I just came from Other Music, where they have this in stock for 13 bucks. also Derek Bailey is playing Roulette November 26, 27 and 28, with the respective lineups being (bear with me, I'm doing this from memory) Zorn, Ikue Mori and Jim Staley on the 26th, Susie Ibarra on the 27th (to celebrate their upcoming Incus CD), and w/drum and bass on the 28th, no more details listed. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Pratt Subject: questions Date: 01 Oct 1999 19:46:47 -0700 (PDT) Does anyone know if Henryk Gorecki has written any more string quartets since his first two? I really love those pieces and would like to hear more. Also, I just re-listened to the excellent Disinformation remix album on Ash International called 'Al-Jabr' and was wondering what people knew about this group T:un[k] Systems. I like their track a lot but can't seem to find any info on them. Thanks. -Tom Pratt ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Julian" Subject: new don byron Date: 02 Oct 1999 23:21:05 +1000 Just thought I'd mention that I just came across a new cd by Don Byron called Romance With The Unseen. It looks like it features Bill Frisell, Drew Gress and Jack De Johnette. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dan Hewins Subject: Isotope 217 Date: 02 Oct 1999 15:27:31 -0400 I saw Isotope 217 at the Knitting Factory last night and they were great! For those of you who don't know who they are, they are a Chicago band. There are members of Tortoise in the band as well as some other people. They are more improv oriented than Tortoise but they have the same tendency to groove and employ the analog synthesizers every now and then. They also have qualities of the "Chicago sound," being that they are from Chicago, which isn't usually harsh and can get mellow at times. I highly recommend checking this group out if you get the chance. Look here for tour info: http://www.brainwashed.com/thrilljockey/tours.html Dan Hewins - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dan Hewins Subject: Isotope 217 Date: 02 Oct 1999 15:27:31 -0400 I saw Isotope 217 at the Knitting Factory last night and they were great! For those of you who don't know who they are, they are a Chicago band. There are members of Tortoise in the band as well as some other people. They are more improv oriented than Tortoise but they have the same tendency to groove and employ the analog synthesizers every now and then. They also have qualities of the "Chicago sound," being that they are from Chicago, which isn't usually harsh and can get mellow at times. I highly recommend checking this group out if you get the chance. Look here for tour info: http://www.brainwashed.com/thrilljockey/tours.html Dan Hewins - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: month o'mazzacane Date: 02 Oct 1999 17:00:24 EDT so, the month of Loren Mazzacane concerts at Tonic celebrating his fiftieth birthday kicked off last night, with Haunted House, Loren's hand-picked quartet (disclaimer: Haunted House's only currently available CD is on my label) and 2 Dollar Guitar, a Steve Shelley (drummer of Sonic Youth) side project. I had to leave midway through the 2 Dollar Guitar set, so I didn't get to see Loren get up and play with them, but I can report on the Haunted House set, which was pretty wild. HH plays long, stretched out, 15 or 20 minute blues tunes, filtered through Loren's unique aesthetic. one piece they play at almost every show, Blue Ghost Blues, is by Lonnie Johnson, and last night, they started off with a seriously hard-rocking version of Spoonful. Loren has a little-known affinity for the white blues-rock of the late sixties, especially Cream, and this was quite obvious on this piece. about twenty minutes in, unfortunately, Loren broke a string, but while his guitar was being repaired, Suzanne Langille, the singer in the quartet and Loren's wife, sang a couple of acapella pieces which were quite nice. then the guitar was ready, and they went into an extremely passionate and overwrought version of Blue Ghost Blues, with Suzanne wringing every possible bit of emotion out of the very evocative lyrics. very exciting stuff by one of my current favorite few bands in NYC. they're scheduled to play Tonic five more times this month (and Loren is doing 12 other shows there in addition), so check them out if you get a chance. even if they play the same songs, the performances are pretty different each time. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Daniel L Brown" Subject: Re: Isotope 217 Date: 02 Oct 1999 22:51:57 -0400 > I saw Isotope 217 at the Knitting Factory last night and they were > great! For those of you who don't know who they are, they are a > Chicago band. There are members of Tortoise in the band as well as > some other people. Who all is in this band? -Dann - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dan Hewins Subject: Re: Isotope 217 Date: 03 Oct 1999 14:01:24 -0400 At least Jeff Parker (guitar, analog synth), John Herndon, and Dan Bitney (who traded off playing drum kit and hand drums). Rob Mazurek is on the record but I don't think it was him playing on Friday (I could be wrong). This person played cornet and keyboards. There was a bass player too but I don't know who it was. Dan Hewins At 10:51 PM -0400 10/2/99, Daniel L Brown wrote: > > I saw Isotope 217 at the Knitting Factory last night and they were > > great! For those of you who don't know who they are, they are a > > Chicago band. There are members of Tortoise in the band as well as > > some other people. > >Who all is in this band? > >-Dann > > >- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Nvinokur@aol.com Subject: All the News that fits Date: 03 Oct 1999 18:10:30 EDT Yet another wonderful article from our friends at the New York Times. http://www.nytimes.com/yr/mo/day/artleisure/music-ethnic.html - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: King Wilson Subject: is the real Parliament touring Date: 03 Oct 1999 17:51:26 -0500 George Clinton is playing in chicago in october. It's billed as a Parliament/Funkadelic show, rather than the Funkadelic Allstars, which is what Clinton's been touring with the last few years...... Does anyone know if this is the Bootsy/Bernie version of the band? I assume it is......... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Zachary J. Griffin" Subject: Re: is the real Parliament touring Date: 03 Oct 1999 23:10:44 -0400 From what I read in an article in my local paper (In Connecticut. The same show is coming here this tuesday), Bootsy Collins and Bernie Worrell appear at some, but not all, shows. George Clinton decided to change the "P-Funk All Stars" to "George Clinton and The Parliment-Funkadelics" to avoid confusion with another touring group past P-Funk members calling itself "The Original P". I do not know who specifically are the members of either group. But I do know that George is not involved with "Original P". Zach Griffin King Wilson wrote: > George Clinton is playing in chicago in october. It's billed as a > Parliament/Funkadelic show, rather than the Funkadelic Allstars, which is > what Clinton's been touring with the last few years...... > Does anyone know if this is the Bootsy/Bernie version of the band? I > assume it is......... > > - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: jewel/ny times (trust me, there's content) Date: 04 Oct 1999 10:36:17 -0500 Speaking of seeing plenty of Greg C around (as Droyko did), I saw him on a VH1 storytellers (and I swear I only watched about 90 seconds) with Jewel. I guess you can't fault a guy for needing to make a living -- or at least, I'd like to think that's all it is). Also looked like Mark Dresser on cello (?), but I could be wrong. My vitriol for Jewel is matched only by the NYTimes piece on Arto and JZ that ran yesterday (I'm guessing that's the one Nvinokur meant). I guess they did Arto OK, and you can only expect them to be dismissive of his guitar playing, which I really like (at one point they listed him as a singer/composer in a list of musicians, not acknowledging that he's been performing and recording on his instrument in a variety of settings for well over a decade). But JZ went from playing beautiful music (I forget the wording) to no more than "radical kitsch" simply because the author thinks he's wrong about the Jewish diaspora. I can see why JZ won't mess with the press (and I'm one of 'em). The article by David Byrne that ran alongside it, however, was quite good. I like some of his music, although I got over his naive intellectual schtick shortly after high school. But I'm glad to see someone in the mainstream press finally point out the implied xenophobia of the term "world music." (And I smiled when he confessed to liking Ricky Martin). "World music" means nonwestern, nonwhite and from somewhere foreign which we (American mass consumers, I mean), with no knowledge of geograpy, can only imagine is populated by people who either eat whales or where plants over their privates. Besides Bill Laswell, especially (but not exclusively) in his work with Threadgill, I can't think of anyone whose work I'd really describe as world musice. Oh, except Ornette's Tone Dialing (brilliant disc). So did anyone catch Zorn/Haas/Fly? Who's Fly? I know of a female EVillage artist that goes by that name. kg - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Katje Subject: Re: jewel/ny times (trust me, there's content) Date: 04 Oct 1999 07:39:06 -0700 kurt_gottschalk@scni.com wrote: > My vitriol for Jewel is matched only by the NYTimes piece on Arto and JZ that > ran yesterday http://www.nytimes.com/yr/mo/day/artleisure/music-ethnic.html > The article by David Byrne that ran alongside it, however, was quite good. http://www.nytimes.com/yr/mo/day/artleisure/music-world.html - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Bob Kowalski" Subject: byron / frisell Date: 04 Oct 1999 10:59:08 -0400 Would just like to put in my two cents (they are fantastic!!!) on two new = releases, both featuring Frisell's guitar in a big way. Actually, Byron = puts in some great appearances on the Costello/Bacarach (sp?) songs and = his own Romance with the Unknown is wonderful. I'd say there is a big = difference between "lite" and "subtle" for this music - its a far cry from = finding its way to elevators (who knows though - they play new wave in my = local supermarket.) Frisell's album is stellar - like a musical Ken = Burns, channeling (maybe reworking is a better phrase?) Americana through = his recordings. happy listening=20 Bob - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu Subject: Re: jewel/ny times (trust me, there's content) Date: 04 Oct 1999 11:33:36 -0400 Kurt wrote: >But JZ went from >playing beautiful music (I forget the wording) to no more than "radical kitsch" >simply because the author thinks he's wrong about the Jewish diaspora. I can >see why JZ won't mess with the press (and I'm one of 'em). I can hardly wait for the inevitable venomous response from JZ next weekend. I've encountered the "kitsch" response to Zorn's Masada-type music from a number of Jewish friends whose experience with klezmer was "that awful music from bar mitzvah parties" in their youth. Naturally, one might say, that was a music to be rebelled against at the time and seems to remain, psychologically, as a bug bear. Perhaps that was one of the writer's problems. Of course, some critics also can't deal with "pretty" music, ie, a beautiful, romantic melody _must_ be "kitsch", right? Those of us "fortunate" enough not to have any real knowledge of klezmer until adulthood might be better able to approach it, or variations thereof, with untainted ears. Brian Olewnick NB: Willem Breuker Kollektief at Tonic tomorrow night. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: burnt scottish weeny Date: 04 Oct 1999 15:12:07 -0500 Hello -- I copied the White Noise url from these pages a while ago, but maybe got it wrong. Anyway, I wasn't able to access it today and would like to have a look. Let me know if I got it right (http://www.burntweeny.freeserve.co.uk) or if it's still up. You can respond privately at kurt.gottschalk@scni.com if you like. Thanks. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: oh Date: 04 Oct 1999 12:49:07 -0500 and, of course, i meant 'foolhardy.' don't you love when you see those stupid mistakes just as you're clicking 'send'? kg - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: more ny times (no jewel) Date: 04 Oct 1999 12:47:29 -0500 another foolhearty assertion in the sunday piece was that nobody in the downtown scene had delved into klez before jz except don byron (who of course they have to point out is black and not jewish). now i wasn't in nyc at the time, but i believe zorn was not one of the first on this bandwagon. they even mention krakauer in the article, but don't give him props as one of the first revivalist/interpreters. and by the time masada's first recorded release, on the knit's jewish festival 93(?) comp came out, there were enough other bands to fill the disc. and i really don't know how bar khoba can be seen as kitsch and byron's music of mickey katz not. but then many's the time i've resisted the urge to lambaste ill-informed writers here, especially since i'm struggling at a small paper a few miles from new york, and wouldn't exactly kick the times out of bed for eating crackers. but, y'know, as a news writer, i'm supposed to get things right or at least say where the info came from. these bigtime music writers can belly up to the bar when they think they've spotted a trend (usually a half decade or so into it), start guessing about who started it and what their motivations were, and then create what will become the popular conception in the morning paper. aargh. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu Subject: Re: more ny times (no jewel) Date: 04 Oct 1999 16:37:10 -0400 >another foolhearty assertion in the sunday piece was that nobody in >the downtown scene had delved into klez before jz except don byron I recall a sunny afternoon in 1982 when I stumbled on a free outdoor performance at 59th and 5th of the band Klezmorim. I was knocked out by the stuff, ran out and purchased their 'Metropolis' album. Now, I'm not sure if the members qualified as 'downtown' (and don't know if any are still very active on the scene) but they pretty much looked the part and, in any case, a new form of klezmer was certainly in the air by that time. Andy Statman's another obvious example; don't know off the top of my head, but I'm pretty sure he's been melding klezmer with Coltrane since at least the early 80's. Ivo Papasov, also. Brian Olewnick - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: KWaltuch@aol.com Subject: No Subject Date: 04 Oct 1999 20:39:04 EDT just a note: Zorn was hardly the first to delve into klezmer during its revival; any interested parties should check out Henry Sapoznik's band, Kapelye, who was going at it during the early- mid 70's. Also, Hankus Netsky's band The Klezmer Conservatory Band, should be credited for bringing the style back into the public eye.... Flying Bulgar Band, Andy Statman, Sid Beckerman, Walter Zev Feldman, etc., etc., etc...... These guys are amazing! I think Zorn listeners should recognize exactly where Zorn gets his ideas and influences... although I love Bar Kokhba and the Circle Maker as much as the next gal/guy.... One more thing for klezmer enthusiasts: The Klezmatics, who are up north currently, will be giving a concert at the Quick Center for the Arts in Fairfield, CT. -karen - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Pratt Subject: free-jazz klezmer Date: 04 Oct 1999 19:17:38 -0700 (PDT) When did Burton Greene begin his Klezmer-influenced projects? -Tom Pratt ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve Smith Subject: Re: jewel/ny times (trust me, there's content) Date: 04 Oct 1999 22:51:46 -0400 brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu wrote: > I can hardly wait for the inevitable venomous response from JZ next weekend. I don't think you'll see any. On Sunday morning and all day today I heard a handful of secondhand reports of Zorn's personal reactions to this article, in theory an interesting concept (the appropriation of ethnic musics in an aging downtown scene seeking identity), but one that was badly executed to the point of seeming like little more than an extended attack on the very quality and authenticity not of Zorn's music, which is scarcely touched upon in the piece, but his very Judaism. Those who spoke first to Zorn and then to me unanimously reported his shock, dismay and hurt. Those around him, like Dave Douglas, were much angrier. It is from others that I would anticipate rebuke and vitriol... from Zorn I expect another retreat - after all, the New York Times article was clearly a reaction to the Jazziz piece, only the second time in the last twelve years or so that he's spoken to the press. I'd now expect him to look at that and say, "Well, I broke my silence and look where it got me..." Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com NP - Pain Killer, "Dr. Phibes," 'Collected Works' - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve Smith Subject: Re: more ny times (no jewel) Date: 04 Oct 1999 23:29:13 -0400 But regarding the whole klezmer issue, perhaps more to the point than "who came first" was the exact phrasing of the statement. What Adam wrote was, to paraphrase, "before Zorn discovered klezmer, only Don Byron was playing with it." And this is a foolhardy statement to make... without having spoken to Zorn, how was Adam to know exactly when he had "discovered" klezmer? I'd imagine that at the rate Zorn has assimilated music over his years of listening and collecting, it seems likely that he had "discovered" klezmer long before he found the personal calling to insinuate it into his own music. But the way it's stated, it comes off as more or less insinuating that Zorn set off on this path of "exploiting" his roots after discovering klezmer, or at least that's one way of reading what's there on the page. It's just one of a whole bunch of niggling little details that damage the piece and by extension the credibility of the writer. And there are any number of other details in the piece that come off as equally offensive even to someone who doesn't know John personally at all - the fact that his route to reclaiming his roots was defined by his having "spoken vaguely" about his father's death and racist treatment in Germany, his speaking in "hallucinatory tones" about what it means to be Jewish, his desire to use Jewish suffering as his way out of being another white jazz musician - his "right to play the blues." All of these things came across to me as quite disturbing and offensive, and I am neither Jewish nor a close personal friend of John's. And ultimately, is there not something sort of intrensically troubling about an article which seems to say that while Arto Lindsay, while not a Brazilian, is reclaiming/assimilating the music of his bicultural childhood in the "right" way, Zorn, who *is* a Jew and has always *been* a Jew even when it was not the focus of his artistry, is somehow reducing said cultural/musical influences to exotica and "kitsch"? Furthermore, is it not muddying the water to preface such a piece by making it seem to be an article about the ways in which a maturing downtown scene is seeking to rejuvenate and even locate itself via cultural appropriation, citing Ribot's and Laswell's Cuban projects and the Brooklyn Balkan brigade as examples and Paul Simon and Peter Gabriel as precursors? I mean, last time I looked, Gabriel wasn't Senegalese, Simon wasn't South African, Ribot wasn't claiming "authenticity" and Speed wasn't trying to pass as Bulgarian... and yet, Zorn remains Jewish. And shortly after beginning the piece in this manner, it quickly abandons this tack and focuses on "Zorn = wrong / Lindsay = right." I mentioned in my previous message that I expected a number of responses from Zorn's friends. I'll add here that I wouldn't be surprised if Lindsay was among them. Anyway, I don't have all the answers, and I hope you'll forgive me for ranting (you'll note Pain Killer is playing in the background). It's just that I've spent most of two days discussing this article with its author, other artists involved, other writers and so on, and I guess I just need to vent a little amongst friends. Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com NP - Pain Killer, "The Toll," 'Collected Works' - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Daniel L Brown" Subject: again with the NY times article. Date: 04 Oct 1999 23:47:21 -0400 Yes. I finally went back and read the article in question. Needless to say, both as a Zorn fan and as a Jew, I was disheartened. And it really should -matter- who or where or when the klezmer revival began. The wonderful fact of the matter is that it has 'made its comeback' (so to speak), and enjoyed by many in a multitude of situations. The Knitt's Jewish Alternative Movement and Zorn's Radical Jewish Culture series doing nothing but helping it along. (As a side thought, those who haven't heard Paniots Nine by Joe Maneri on avant should go do the right thing...) Dann - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Daniel L Brown" Date: 04 Oct 1999 23:54:45 -0400 Did I say "should"? I mean "Shouldn't" It SHOULDN'T matter where or when or who the klez revival started with/at. Dann - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: King Wilson Subject: Re: more ny times (no jewel) Date: 04 Oct 1999 23:22:19 -0500 >Anyway, I don't have all the answers, and I hope you'll forgive me for ranting >(you'll note Pain Killer is playing in the background). It's just that I've >spent most of two days discussing this article with its author, other artists >involved, other writers and so on, and I guess I just need to vent a little >amongst friends. So what did the author have to say? I take it you gave him an idea of the "problems" we have been discussing about his article. How did he react? BTW did anyone catch the Tim Berne show in Chicago this weekend? I was all ready to go, and a Phish ticket dropped into my lap. How was Berne? This is turning out to be an interesting week in chicago. Phish last night, the Vandermark 5 tommorrow, and Public Enemy is Wednesday....... (Phish was excellent, as always) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve Smith Subject: Re: more ny times (no jewel) Date: 05 Oct 1999 01:03:04 -0400 King Wilson wrote: > So what did the author have to say? I take it you gave him an idea of > the "problems" we have been discussing about his article. How did he react? Well, at the point at which I spoke to Adam, there was little to report in terms of "our" (i.e., the Zornlist's) problems regarding his piece, so I was only able to relate my own gut reactions and those I'd heard from people who made it their business to call me on Sunday and Monday morning. To wit - as I write this it's 1 A.M. EST on Tuesday morning, and yet there has been fairly little reaction to the NYT Sunday Arts & Leisure article as yet, even from the Zornlist en masse. At this point, very few of us aside from Brian, Kurt, you and me have in fact weighed in as yet... But if anyone else wants to say anything... Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com NP - Ruben Blades on "Sessions at West 54th" - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Stephane Vuilleumier" Subject: Re: Klezmer revival Date: 05 Oct 1999 09:04:32 +0200 I have one Klezmer Conservatory Band LP that includes Don Byron and Frank London in the lineup... How many records did they do as KCB? Did the lineup contain other now luminaries of NY downtown or other scenes? Stephane -----Original Message----- >Also, Hankus Netsky's band The >Klezmer Conservatory Band, should be credited for bringing the style back >into the public eye.... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Corey Marc Fogel Subject: Re: more ny times (no jewel) Date: 05 Oct 1999 01:28:18 -0700 (MST) is this article online anywhere or transcribed and in anyone's possession? (other than *for sale* @nytimes.com) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Peter Hollo Subject: Re: more ny times (no jewel) Date: 05 Oct 1999 21:22:49 +1000 Well I went and "subscribed" on the NY Times site (using a yahoo.com email address, since I don't want any junk mail from doing so) and read the article. I didn't immediately find it extremely offensive. Certainly misguided, certainly a lot of errors, but not incredibly negative. Nevertheless, I can see why it is hurtful and offensive. Being a secular Jew myself, I wonder (from experience) whether the author may be exhibiting (possibly not deliberately) that sortof shtetl mentality that says "I'm Jewish, so I should make extra extra sure that nobody thinks I'm being biased towards the Jews"... This often comes out (I see it a lot in Russian Jews for instance) in a tendency to be particularly critical of Jewish people, especially in contrast to goyim. Well obviously that's not all there is to it, but I got a bit of a feeling that this phenomenon could be involved. Cheers, Peter. -- Peter Hollo raven@fourplay.com.au http://www.fourplay.com.au/me.html FourPlay - Eclectic Electric String Quartet http://www.fourplay.com.au Raven: experimental electronic http://www.fourplay.com.au/sound.html - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Subject: Re: Re: ny times Date: 05 Oct 1999 09:15:10 -0400 >(other than *for sale* @nytimes.com) It's not for sale: subbing to the NYT over the net involves no money and you don't get put on any mailing lists. - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: DRoyko@aol.com Subject: Statman Date: 05 Oct 1999 10:07:44 EDT In a message dated 99-10-05 04:35:22 EDT, you write: >Andy Statman's another obvious example; don't know off > the top of my head, but I'm pretty sure he's been melding klezmer with > Coltrane since at least the early 80's. His first major recorded statement in that vein was his LP, Flatbush Waltz, on Rounder, which came out in 1980. An amazing album, and one of two terrific LPs (the other being Nashville Mornings, New York Nights), incidently, that Rounder, inexplicably, has never transfered to CD. Considering Statman's relatively high profile, especially since Perlman collaborated with him on those two Fiddler's House CDs, and the elevation of the tune Flatbush Waltz into the pantheon of modern klezmer standards, it is mystifying to me. Relatedly, here's a piece on Statman I wrote a few years back for the Chgo Trib (when I was still using a nom de plume--David Duckman--in Chicago area publications). He is an interesting guy. Dave Royko ----------------- CHICAGO TRIBUNE December 1, 1994 Tempo Section MAN OF DEPTH Andy Statman's latest affirms life of breaking barriers. By David Duckman Both Andy Statman and Bill Monroe are exceptional bluegrass mandolinists and composers, and they both wear hats. That just about sums up their similarities. Their differences begin with the colors of their hats. Monroe's is a white Stetson; the image of it perched atop his head is the very image of bluegrass music itself. Statman's is a black Streimel; the image of it perched upon his head is the very image of the orthodox Jew. Perhaps to some, the idea of an orthodox Jew excelling in bluegrass might seem odd, but not to Andy Statman. He has spent his life breaking musical barriers, not simply for the sake of doing so, or to create controversy, but because his musical path cuts across many terrains. Nobody has introduced elements of the jazz avant garde into bluegrass playing to the degree Statman has. From his early 1970s recordings with Country Cooking and Breakfast Special, sharp stabs of atonality have marked his soloing. In addition, he has also stirred healthy dollops of Eastern European, Turkish, Armenian, and Jewish seasonings into his sound. Three albums released by Rounder in the 1980s showcase his eclectic, highly personal approach to mandolin music--the jazz-based "Flatbush Waltz" (1980), the aptly titled album of improvised duets with David Grisman, "Mandolin Abstractions" (1982), and the quasi-bluegrass "Nashville Mornings, New York Nights" (1986). It took until now for Statman to release another bluegrass album, and it is his most orthodox bluegrass musical statement yet. A tribute to Bill Monroe, "Andy's Ramble" (Rounder) consists of nine original tunes played by a group that includes Tony Trischka, John Sholle, Kenny Kosek, and Vassar Clements. During the eight year gap between this and his previous Rounder album, however, Statman disappeared from the bluegrass world, and many of his fans wondered if he had left music altogether. In fact, Statman was building a following in his home city of New York, not as a bluegrass mandolinist, but as one of the premier klezmer clarinetists and band leaders in town, and spending time with the pioneering klezmer giant, the late Dave Tarras. Tarras, who held a position in klezmer music that was equivalent to Bill Monroe's position in bluegrass, came to consider Statman his protege. "The first time I saw him, I travelled way out to a very inaccessible area," says Statman. "He showed me a song, and I asked if I could tape it, so I could learn all the subtleties. So he said, 'You come to me for a lesson, and you want I should make a record too?'" With that quip, an important relationship began, one that Statman describes as like that of "a grandfather and grandson." "I would come over and we'd spend hours talking about music, and he'd play for me," says Statman. "I'd ask him how to do certain things, or I'd ask him questions about taste, and he'd sit down and show me. We'd have tea, I'd go with him to the barbershop. He was often ill, so I'd go out and get medicine for him. We spent alot of time together, which was great. Here was a guy who went from remembering when they had the first Edison cylinder type phonographs in the Ukraine to seeing a man land on the moon. He was in the Czar's army. He lived through an amazing period in history." Likewise as a teacher, Tarras was from a different age. "By and large, he had no real system of teaching," says Statman. "These days, you see jazz courses that take you from a to b to c to d. With these old guys, you just sort of jump in and that's it. For lack of a better word, there's a certain spiritual transference that you can get just by hanging out with someone, watching their body language." Tarras was not the only teacher of Statman's who did not fit the typical "instructor" mold, nor was Tarras the first musical giant to influence him in a profound way. "I'd seen David Grisman play, and I contacted him and a life long friendship evolved out of that," says Statman of an association that began thirty years ago. "He had almost a teach yourself method, which was ideal for me. I'd go there, and he would show me a tune. Then he'd say, 'Listen, I have to leave. Make tape copies of all this stuff, and lock the door when you leave, and call me when you learn the stuff.' He would have rare tapes of Bill Monroe shows and Jim & Jesse shows, and all these old 78s and 45s on tape, stuff that was not available anywhere else in 1965. So I'd tape for a few hours, go home, slow down these tapes, learn as much as I could, and after a month or two, I'd give him a call. So, over two years, I took five, maybe six lessons like that. By that time, I was getting into other types of music. I was very interested in jazz, and other things. And David gave me the added impetus to move off into my own direction." As the years passed, Statman's musical direction led to his deepening commitment to Judaism. "Andy wasn't raised orthodox," says Grisman. "He came to that through the music. As he got more into the Jewish music, he realized that the key to it was in the spirituality of it. It's not easy to be an orthodox Jew. To come to it through the music shows the power of that music." Grisman considers his impact on Statman to be among his own major accomplishments. "Andy has that rare ability that only a few mandolinists have," says Grisman. "That depth, that pure expression that touches the inner part of me. Like Bill Monroe, and Dave Apollon. If I'd done nothing but been Andy's first mandolin teacher, I would feel like I'd made a contribution." - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ken Waxman Subject: Re: free-jazz klezmer Date: 05 Oct 1999 10:33:03 -0400 (EDT) Probably in the early 1990s. But like Zorn they're not a focus. He still plays a lot of free jazz. Ken Waxman On Mon, 4 Oct 1999, Tom Pratt wrote: > When did Burton Greene begin his Klezmer-influenced > projects? > > -Tom Pratt - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: more on the times Date: 05 Oct 1999 11:19:06 -0500 Sunday and Monday I was just angry at a newspaper article that missed the point of music I love. But today, especially after reading Steve's comments, I really feel sick. I know many of the musicians on the "scene" and am not close friends with any, so it gives me a vantage to look at what articles like this can do. I mean, Zorn's pretty big and pretty secure in his career, and I think he can weather the storm of having been insulted and shredded in what could be seen as an anti-Semetic article if you get down to it (other folks can dabble in whatever ethnic musics they want, the piece seems to say, but Jews have a special obligation to represent their own culture in a certain way -- even if that way is never stated). Since we know what Zorn thinks about the media, I think (as Steve said) he'll probably just reason "yeah, I was right to not talk to them since the 80s"). But less established artists may not be able to suffer the hamfisted blows of the Arts & Leisure section so easily. I've tried to stay above the fray in the storm caused by the Times' piece on Susie Ibarra, who I know to be a very sweet person and gifted percussionist. I still don't know the details -- and don't really care to -- but it seems evident that the stir created by the Times' profile of Ibarra not only led to the dissolution of one of the finest rhythm sections in town (Susie and William Parker, who played together in the David S. Ware quartet, William's In Order To Survive, Assif Tsahar's trio and other projects), but a lot of hard feelings and harsh words. Zorn (perhaps) aside, this is a small group of people who all know each other and work together, and aren't necessarily used to such high-profile attention, at least not stateside. When the attention of one of the most powerful papers in the country comes with comments that are sure to be divisive (why call Ibarra the best drummer on the scene, for example? Why can't she just be "one of the best"? Journalism 101: anytime you say best, biggest, tallest, tiniest, most advanced, first, last, etc., someone will take exception), some people are bound to start taking sides. It wouldn't surprise me to start hearing some musicians and/or audience members now adopt the "Zorn isn't Jewish enough" NYTimes stance, which is such a meaningless statement it's absurd to even call it misinformed. But, as I said, I wouldn't be surprised. Not after the anti-Zorn graffiti that's been popping up in the bathrooms at Tonic and the Knit. Don't know what that's about. Haven't seen too many people devote themselves to building this music (beyond just their own career) the way Zorn has. But whereas stupid graffiti should be ignored, stupid newspaper articles should not. I'm not sure what the point is here -- that the press is powerful, and used incorrectly that power can be harmful? Well, that's nothing new. I guess it's just sad that a writer can think his or her knee-jerk opinion of the week is more important than the career of an artist. Not that Zorn's career will really suffer, but it makes me feel bad that Ibarra's might. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: more on the times Date: 05 Oct 1999 11:29:38 -0500 On Tue, Oct 05, 1999 at 11:19:06AM -0500, kurt_gottschalk@scni.com wrote: > But less established artists may not be able to suffer the hamfisted blows of > the Arts & Leisure section so easily. I've tried to stay above the fray in the > storm caused by the Times' piece on Susie Ibarra, who I know to be a very sweet > person and gifted percussionist. I must have missed this article. Is it still online anywhere? -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Handley" Subject: Radically jewish (was: more on the times) Date: 05 Oct 1999 16:39:36 GMT >From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com other folks can dabble in >whatever ethnic musics they want, the piece seems to say, but Jews have a >special obligation to represent their own culture in a certain way -- even >if >that way is never stated Kurt, pardon if I took your comments out of context, or missed something, but what makes you think this? [I also realize this isn't soc.culture.jewish, but it seems like a pretty germane topic considering so much of the Downtown scene (Knit, Zorn and Tzadik, etc etc) has been collectively working towards new expressions of Judaism, or explorations of what it means, among other things.] Why Jews? And why an obliagtion? And why is it "special"? More "special" than African-Americans, or more special in its own specified way? (Which, BTW, would seem to really require a rephrasing of the position.) I could see a couple factors leading you to make your statement. For example, the deceptive (social) nature of both "race" and "ethnicity". Zorn traced his "awakening" to his cultural roots back to a visit to Germany, among other things; apparently anti-Semitic activity made him realize that he "wasn't white" (as he put it). So: acute awareness of marginality, of oppressed status, perhaps; certainly of VULNERABILITY and insitutional and historical injustice. Another idea: the Holocaust as a cataclysmic reminder of the first point. But first point: does this not equally apply to Black people, who additionally do not have the option of "passing", or choosing to assimilate deceptively into the majority of a given culture? How about mulattos, who might or might not have this choice? Are they specially obliged to express their racial (read: minority) heritage? And as to the second point: the Holocaust becomes less unique, less uniquely catacysmic, when compared to internationally variable HIV/AIDS statistics. (Of course, these two Holocausts are very different; but both seem to demand a multifaceted cultural response.) These are just some questions that occurred to me that, IMHO, contribute to one possible deep enjoyment of the richness, texture, and historical complexity of Zorn playing explicitly Jewish free jazz, or Don Byron playing klezmer music, or Henry Threadgill's use of tango, or Uri Caine's apropriations of Mahler. Anyhoo. ----s ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeremy Isaac Mc Cormick Subject: Couple Questions Date: 05 Oct 1999 14:02:10 -0400 Welp, I've realized that the combined knowledge of everyone in this group is enough to answer any music question, so here goes. Sorry, if these seem easy, but I'm lazy. :) Does anyone know of any Downbeat articles about David S. Ware? I'm interested in checking out what equipment he uses. Anything in the past year or two would be cool. Also, does anyone know of any Tom Waits articles where he discusses his influences in detail, not just a few remarks? Any web addresses on this would be appreciated, too. Okay, I really enjoy the list, hope yall can answer these 2 questions! Now I'll go back to killing myself with beer nuggets. Jeremy "Jailbird" McCormick - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Andy Miller Subject: some Zorn questions Date: 05 Oct 1999 14:02:25 -0500 (CDT) Some of these questions might be a little out of place at the moment-- the Zorn-NYTimes issue seems to be the major thread at the moment. Still, I want to ask a few things about Zorn's recent work. 1. I've been listening to the recently released "Godard" piece-- it's interesting, but I feel that I'm not picking up on the 'networks of meaning and suggestion' that I assume must be at work in it. (As a point of contrast, I feel a certain affinity for the "world" evoked by Spillane or or Two-Lane Highway... but Godard leaves me a little bewildered). I guess what I'm wondering is: how does this piece relate to/illuminate/problematize (etcetc) its subject? 2. In the liner notes to 'The String Quartets' Zorn makes some strong claims for "Memento Mori"-- something about how the piece was a sort of breakthrough for him, etc. I've listened to this several times but always mind myself getting bored with it. Any ideas what Zorn is getting at with this composition? (and in his remarks about it?) I hope these are worthwhile questions... Andy - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Bruno" Subject: Request - help in contacting AVANT recodrs Date: 06 Oct 1999 09:24:30 +1100 Hallo Zorn-heads just a quick coupla questions - I've been a bit of a Zorn fan for a while now, and I'm looking to track down a few more of the Naked City albums. From hitting the Zorn discog, it looks like the "Avant" label have a lot of the stuff I'm after - so the questions are: 1. does anybody know how to contact Avant records (an e-mail or WWW would be nice) - I've tried to get local record stores to track them down, but they have NO idea 2. any reccomendations for "the" Naked City albums to track down - I have "Torture Garden" & "Naked City" - are they all genius? any better than others? Thanks.... u-no *********************************************************** Raimondo.Bruno@utas.edu.au School of Psychology, University of Tasmania GPO Box 252-30, Hobart, Tasmania 7001. ph: (03) 62 26 7664 Mob: 0409 211 347 Fax: (03) 62 26 2883 http://come.to/u-no *********************************************************** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: philz Subject: Re: more on the times Date: 05 Oct 1999 18:28:27 -0400 --============_-1272959971==_ma============ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" ; format="flowed" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable kurt_gottschalk@scni.com wrote: >Sunday and Monday I was just angry at a newspaper article that=20 >missed the point >of music I love. But today, especially after reading Steve's=20 >comments, I really >feel sick. I know many of the musicians on the "scene" and am not=20 >close friends >with any, so it gives me a vantage to look at what articles like=20 >this can do. I >mean, Zorn's pretty big and pretty secure in his career, and I think he can >weather the storm of having been insulted and shredded in what could=20 >be seen as >an anti-Semetic article if you get down to it (other folks can dabble in >whatever ethnic musics they want, the piece seems to say, but Jews have a >special obligation to represent their own culture in a certain way -- even = if >that way is never stated). I must be incredibly thick, but I don't understand the reaction to=20 this article. Not that I particularly like the article, it's as good=20 or bad as any article that attempt to generalize two artists careers=20 and motivations on one page, but where is the insult, the=20 misrepresentation? Is it paragraphs like: "When Zorn performs with his free jazz band Masada at a synagogue on=20 the Lower East Side, or when the Brazilian-reared Lindsay sings in=20 Portuguese before an audience of samba fans and Brazilian =E9migr=E9s,=20 there is an almost palpable feeling of intimacy among strangers, of=20 community, that goes beyond esthetic pleasure. Such music reflects an=20 effort to provide audiences with a home in the world, a coherent=20 sense of place in a musical scene that has grown bewilderingly=20 global. " >I'm not sure what the point is here -- that the press is powerful, and used >incorrectly that power can be harmful? =2E.. >(why call Ibarra the best drummer on the >scene, for example? Why can't she just be "one of the best"? Journalism 101= : >anytime you say best, biggest, tallest, tiniest, most advanced, first, last= , >etc., someone will take exception), some people are bound to start=20 >taking sides. >It wouldn't surprise me to start hearing some musicians and/or=20 >audience members >now adopt the "Zorn isn't Jewish enough" NYTimes stance, which is such a >meaningless statement it's absurd to even call it misinformed. Huh? What harmful power is there in spreading the word about two=20 musicians? I saw nothing criticizing Zorn or Lindsay, and in fact=20 they're described as two of the savviest of the downtown crew. The=20 comments on the shifts in the village, the changes to the Knitting=20 =46actory, the growing interest in Jewish history and music, all this=20 seems reasonably accurate given the scope of the article. Am I reading the wrong article??? philz --============_-1272959971==_ma============ Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable kurt_gottschalk@scni.com wrote: Sunday and Monday I was just angry at a newspaper article that missed the point of music I love. But today, especially after reading Steve's comments, I really feel sick. I know many of the musicians on the "scene" and am not close friends with any, so it gives me a vantage to look at what articles like this can do. I mean, Zorn's pretty big and pretty secure in his career, and I think he can weather the storm of having been insulted and shredded in what could be seen as an anti-Semetic article if you get down to it (other folks can dabble in whatever ethnic musics they want, the piece seems to say, but Jews have a special obligation to represent their own culture in a certain way -- even if that way is never stated).=20 I must be incredibly thick, but I don't understand the reaction to this article. Not that I particularly like the article, it's as good or bad as any article that attempt to generalize two artists careers and motivations on one page, but where is the insult, the misrepresentation? Is it paragraphs like: Arial"When Zorn performs with his free jazz band Masada at a synagogue on the Lower East Side, or when the Brazilian-reared Lindsay sings in Portuguese before an audience of samba fans and Brazilian =E9migr=E9s, there is an almost palpable feeling of intimacy among strangers, of community, that goes beyond esthetic pleasure. Such music reflects an effort to provide audiences with a home in the world, a coherent sense of place in a musical scene that has grown bewilderingly global. " I'm not sure what the point is here -- that the press is powerful, and used incorrectly that power can be harmful? ... (why call Ibarra the best drummer on the scene, for example? Why can't she just be "one of the best"? Journalism 101: anytime you say best, biggest, tallest, tiniest, most advanced, first, last, etc., someone will take exception), some people are bound to start taking sides. It wouldn't surprise me to start hearing some musicians and/or audience members now adopt the "Zorn isn't Jewish enough" NYTimes stance, which is such a meaningless statement it's absurd to even call it misinformed. Huh? What harmful power is there in spreading the word about two musicians? I saw nothing criticizing Zorn or Lindsay, and in fact they're described as two of the savviest of the downtown crew. The comments on the shifts in the village, the changes to the Knitting =46actory, the growing interest in Jewish history and music, all this seems reasonably accurate given the scope of the article. Am I reading the wrong article??? philz --============_-1272959971==_ma============-- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: nickmc@home.com Subject: Re: Request - help in contacting AVANT recodrs Date: 05 Oct 1999 18:19:17 -0600 I would definately reccomend Radio, many consider it one of naked city's best albums, absinth is naked city's ambient work, while grand guignol is a peice of music dedicated to the horror house grand guignol, there is also some classical works undertaken by NC on this album. (although I'll remind you, it contains all of torture garden on the second half) and lastly Heretic is a series of duets and trio's that members of naked city perform in, they is only 1 or 2 full band songs. This was john's effort at scoring for an japanese S&M movie. The order I bought them in was 1.torture garden 2.Grand guignol 3.Absinth 4.Radio 5.Heretic and I rate them this way 4.,5.,2.,1.,3, Hope that gives you a little reccomendation cheers Nick McCormick Bruno wrote: > > Hallo Zorn-heads > > just a quick coupla questions - I've been a bit of a Zorn fan for a while > now, and I'm looking to track down a few more of the Naked City albums. From > hitting the Zorn discog, it looks like the "Avant" label have a lot of the > stuff I'm after - so the questions are: > > 1. does anybody know how to contact Avant records (an e-mail or WWW would be > nice) - I've tried to get local record stores to track them down, but they > have NO idea > 2. any reccomendations for "the" Naked City albums to track down - I have > "Torture Garden" & "Naked City" - are they all genius? any better than > others? > > Thanks.... > > u-no > > *********************************************************** > > Raimondo.Bruno@utas.edu.au > School of Psychology, University of Tasmania > GPO Box 252-30, Hobart, Tasmania 7001. > ph: (03) 62 26 7664 > Mob: 0409 211 347 > Fax: (03) 62 26 2883 > http://come.to/u-no > > *********************************************************** > > - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Caleb T. Deupree" Subject: Re: Request - help in contacting AVANT recodrs Date: 05 Oct 1999 20:37:28 -0400 At 09:24 AM 10/6/99 +1100, Bruno wrote: > >1. does anybody know how to contact Avant records (an e-mail or WWW would be >nice) - I've tried to get local record stores to track them down, but they >have NO idea No known website for avant specifically, but many of the better online places stock them, including (at least) Forced Exposure and DMG. >2. any reccomendations for "the" Naked City albums to track down - I have >"Torture Garden" & "Naked City" - are they all genius? any better than >others? Yes they're all genius. Absinthe is the 'ambient' one, Radio is smaller groupings, Leng T'che is one long (30 min) and very intense piece (and probably only available as part of the Torture Garden set on Tzadik at this point), Grand Guignol is classical music (Messiaen, Lassus, Ives, Scriabin) plus more like TG, and Heretic is more like rock. Just get them all. -- Caleb Deupree cdeupree@erinet.com It is pretty obvious that the debasement of the human mind caused by a constant flow of fraudulent advertising is no trivial thing. There is more than one way to conquer a country. -- Raymond Chandler - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: tired of what the times thinks, but... Date: 05 Oct 1999 19:39:18 -0500 Scott, your comments are interesting, and I basically agree. What you might have missed is that I said "the piece seems to say." I wouldn't put unique strictures on Jewish artists (although some cultures contain histories which can be dramatically used if an artist so chooses). The Times piece seems to want to hold Zorn responsible for something more than an African American playing klezmer, a Polish Jew playing son or the son of an American missionary appropriating samba. Zorn, because his background matches his stylings, is deemed kitschier than Don Byron holding a rubber chicken. np: The Jam "Start!" >From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com other folks can dabble in >whatever ethnic musics they want, the piece seems to say, but Jews have a >special obligation to represent their own culture in a certain way -- even >if >that way is never stated Kurt, pardon if I took your comments out of context, or missed something, but what makes you think this? - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve Smith Subject: Re: more on the times Date: 06 Oct 1999 00:42:25 -0400 philz wrote: > I must be incredibly thick, but I don't understand the reaction to this article. Not that I particularly like the article, it's as good or bad as any article that attempt to generalize two artists careers and motivations on one page, but where is the insult, the misrepresentation? Well, let's see. Consider the following (with my points of emphasis set apart with asterisks): "The prime architects of the new sensibility are Mr. Zorn, *who now considers himself a Jewish composer*..." "It is unclear what led Mr. Zorn, a secular Jew from Queens, to his awakening. In interviews, he has *spoken vaguely of getting hostile looks in Germany and of his father's death.*" "The titles of his compositions *often evoke Jewish victimhood*..." "*Until Mr. Zorn discovered klezmer,* the only jazz musician to show much interest in Eastern European soul was the black clarinetist Don Byron." "Recently, Mr. Zorn has spoken *in almost hallucinatory tones* about what it means to be Jewish in America." "Mr. Zorn is *committed to the idea of Jews as an eternal pariah class*..." "It may be that for Mr. Zorn, Jewishness answers a deeply felt desire - a desire not to be a white jazz musician. *By invoking his own history of oppression, he can assert his right to play the blues*, without the racial envy that often burdens white musicians." Is that enough to illustrate what Kurt was saying? Those are my own major points of disturbance, as well as those of many others with whom I've spoken (and yes, the debate carries on today as lively as yesterday and the day before - this is probably the most talked-about music article in the Times in months if not years. Would that it were being talked about for positive reasons...). Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com NP - Haunted House, "Only When You Sleep," 'Up in Flames' (Erstwhile) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: more FMP news Date: 06 Oct 1999 00:51:50 EDT well, it seems as if only two of the three titles I posted about recently ar= e=20 actually currently available. these are: FMP CD 103=A0=A0DIGGER'S HARVEST - Alexander von Schlippenbach + Tony Oxley=20 Alexander von Schlippenbach: piano Tony Oxley: drums Recorded November 1998, Berlin (78:00)=20 FMP CD 104=A0=A0MELANCHOLY - Cecil Taylor Workshop Ensemble=20 Tobia Netta: trumpet Wolfgang Fuchs: sopranino saxophone, bass clarinet Harry Sj=F6str=F6m: soprano saxophone Volker Schlott: alto saxophone Evan Parker: soprano + tenor saxophones Thomas Klemm: tenor saxophone J=F6rge Huke: trombone Thomas Wiedermann: trombone Cecil Taylor: piano Barry Guy: bass Tony Oxley: drums Recorded September 1990, Berlin (70:00)=20 so we'll have to wait a bit longer for the first Evan=20 Parker/Schlippenbach/Lovens record in 8 years. but check out what else FMP=20 has planned for their next set of releases: FMP CD 102=A0=A0BASS DUETS - Peter Kowald with...=20 Peter Kowald: bass Barre Phillips: bass Maarten Altena: bass Barry Guy: bass Recorded March 1979, Berlin; March 1982, Berlin; October 1984, Berlin (79:00= ) (original issue FMP 0680, 0960, 0990)=20 FMP CD 106:=A0=A0COMPLETE COMBUSTION - Schlippenbach Trio=20 Evan Parker: soprano + tenor saxophones Alexander von Schlippenbach: piano Paul Lovens: drums + percussion Recorded April 1998, Berlin (75:00)=20 FMP CD 107:=A0=A03 POINTS AND A MOUNTAIN, PLUS... - Br=F6tzmann/Mengelberg/B= ennink=20 Peter Br=F6tzmann: saxophones + clarinets, piano Misha Mengelberg: piano, voice Han Bennink: drums, viola, tenor saxophone Recorded February 1979, Berlin (77:00) (original issue FMP 0670)=20 FMP CD 108=A0=A0NAILED - C.T.: The Quartet=20 Tobia Netta: trumpet Evan Parker: soprano + tenor saxophones Cecil Taylor: piano Barry Guy: bass Tony Oxley: drums Recorded September 1990, Berlin (78:00)=20 pretty promising stuff. what a lineup on that Cecil CD. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com NP: Mets-Diamondbacks tied in the 6th - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Nvinokur@aol.com Subject: SAL SALVADOR Date: 06 Oct 1999 08:45:27 EDT BEBOP GUITARIST, JAZZ EDUCATOR SAL SALVADOR DIES AT 73 Sal Salvador, the guitarist whose over 50-year career included important stints with Stan Kenton, as well as important university music posts, died Sept. 22. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: philz Subject: Re: more on the times Date: 06 Oct 1999 07:59:20 -0400 steve smith explained: >philz wrote: > > > I must be incredibly thick, but I don't understand the reaction >to this article. Not that I particularly like the article, it's as >good or bad as any article that attempt to generalize two artists >careers and motivations on one page, but where is the insult, the >misrepresentation? > >Well, let's see. Consider the following (with my points of emphasis >set apart with asterisks): > >"The prime architects of the new sensibility are Mr. Zorn, *who now >considers himself a Jewish composer*..." But isn't he? Why else would he do pieces like Kristalnacht, or make a band like Masada? He has emphasized his culture so that I can't personally help but think of him in those terms, at least partially (of course I think of bird calls when I think of Zorn as well, but I've been following him for over 10 years now). Zorn has brought more pride to his culture (imho) than any other "Jewish composer" that I can think of. Is this really an insult? >"It is unclear what led Mr. Zorn, a secular Jew from Queens, to his >awakening. In interviews, he has *spoken vaguely of getting hostile >looks in Germany and of his father's death.*" > >"The titles of his compositions *often evoke Jewish victimhood*..." Like Kristalnacht? I stood packed in a dark room in the old Knitting Factory assaulted by the sounds of that piece and understood a piece of the Holocaust that I might not have otherwise understood... is this comment really inaccurate? >"*Until Mr. Zorn discovered klezmer,* the only jazz musician to show >much interest in Eastern European soul was the black clarinetist Don >Byron." This sounds like usual bombastic inaccurate writing overgeneralizing... >"Recently, Mr. Zorn has spoken *in almost hallucinatory tones* about >what it means to be Jewish in America." This sounds like the writer's attempt to add color and imagery to his article... much of what I talk about my coworkers probably find hallucinatory (but maybe that's 'cause I smoke too much :) >"Mr. Zorn is *committed to the idea of Jews as an eternal pariah class*..." > >"It may be that for Mr. Zorn, Jewishness answers a deeply felt >desire - a desire not to be a white jazz musician. *By invoking his >own history of oppression, he can assert his right to play the >blues*, without the racial envy that often burdens white musicians." OK, this unbased speculation is probably the most offensive thing in the article, but I really don't think the writer was attempting to misrepresent Zorn, just place him inside the growing emphasis on Jewish culture that Zorn has cultivated. Clearly it's only a piece of the Zorn puzzle, which is the writer's major mistake, but it is the most obvious attribute of Zorn to anyone who hasn't followed his music closely. The writer did start the article distancing Zorn from jazz musicians, so this is only stupidly attempting to keep the tone of the article, as dumb as the comment is. But, can Zorn or anyone be that surprised that the media is picking up on the Jewish angle? Isn't that somewhat the idea, to draw attention to the Jewish plight? I get the impression that some are upset that the media actually noticed some part of what Zorn is up to. So what if Zorn is identified with Jewish culture? - He's been responsible for the Radical Jewish Culture series and has promoted Jewish artists where possible. >Is that enough to illustrate what Kurt was saying? Those are my own >major points of disturbance, as well as those of many others with >whom I've spoken (and yes, the debate carries on today as lively as >yesterday and the day before - this is probably the most >talked-about music article in the Times in months if not years. >Would that it were being talked about for positive reasons...). Well, better leave me in the dark, I still find the article, even with the comments illustrated above, generally positive and inoffensive. It focuses attention on the artists involved and on some of their personal interests. It of course misses the mark, but that's why I don't read much about music anymore in general, and why I don't take anything written too literally. I think the arguments against it are over-sensitive and thin-skinned, but that's my opinion. philz - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard@rcvs.org.uk Subject: More media moans Date: 06 Oct 1999 09:58:18 +0100 > >whatever ethnic musics they want, the piece seems to say, but Jews have a > >special obligation to represent their own culture in a certain way -- > >even if that way is never stated > > Kurt, pardon if I took your comments out of context, or missed something, Kurt can tell you for certain, but my reading of this was that the ARTICLE was claiming that Jews have a special obligation etc etc, and that Kurt, like you, begs to differ (not unreasonably). I know I caused a flame war last time I grouched about this, but it does seem to me that the national press in the UK is completely and wilfully clueless about contemporary music in a way that it isn't about the plastic arts. It may not be cutting edge, but broadsheet arts coverage seems reasonably informed about paintings and sculptures but totally uncomprehending when it comes to music. I mention this because (a) it pisses me off, and (b) I can't see why it should be so. Surely some small London exhibition of conceptual sculptures is no more accessible to newspaper readers than a new CD by Evan Parker (say). I know this is slightly off-topic but I'd be interested in anyone's thoughts on this, esp in relation to Zorn's non-participation policy, which strikes me as being rather defeatist. Rich Latest on (musings): reviews (with MP3s) of new CD releases featuring, among others, John Stevens, Chris Speed, Dave Douglas, Wayne Horovitz, Bobby Previte, Francois Houle, Hans Tammen, Keith Tippett, Jerry Granelli, Thurston Moore... http://come.to/musings.com +++STOP PRESS+++ Also Run Ra, John Tchicai, Braxton, Ganelin Trio... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: more signs of the Times Date: 06 Oct 1999 10:40:42 -0500 Day 3 of the post Times fracas... philz, I think you're kinda right. My reactions at least are a little oversensitive and thinskinned. But when I read the piece, I didn't feel like I was just reading a bad article. I felt like I'd fallen for the bait-and-switch. I actually thought I was going to read a piece about Arto, someone I'd trust the Times more to talk about (he's got that whole multi-culti portrait of a scenic vista avant Buena Vista thing, plenty of what the Times likes to do, and I thought I'd just learn a little about his anxiously awaited new rekkerd). I turn to the jump, see a disarmingly huge photo of JZ's mug, and start to descend downhill with the writer. You're right again, philz (not trying to be facetious -- you really are). Much of the article, especially the first half, focuses attention on the accomplishments of deserving artists. But the writer is clearly setting us up for a fall. In the end he wants to add oomph to his position, that Zorn has no business feeling like an outcast Jew in New York City and that it's funny for him to use Jewish iconography and wear Jewish clothes. Steve's excerpts help show that, but the real probblem is in the overall construction of the piece, devolving from describing the music as "an almost palpable feeling of intimacy among strangers, of community, that goes beyond esthetic pleasure," to that last line about "Jewish kitsch." If that's really all Zorn's doing, why devote so much of the article to him. Why not run an enormous photo of someone who's work is valid? Or why not write about something like Roy Nathanson and Anthony Coleman's duet, which I like, but which I could see (at times) described as "Jewish kitsch." Kitsch is something cute you put on a shelf, and if that's all Masada is, then the author is in the end showing contempt for that group of strangers who feel a sense of community because of the music. (That group, in part being us. Like you, I was in that crowded room at the old Knit years ago, realizing as I stood in the dark listening to the sounds of a train the depth of the piece. But apparently what we shared, philz, was more like "Good Times" than "Roots.") Another odd statement here, as Steve clipped for us, is "By invoking his own history of oppression, he can assert his right to play the blues, without the racial envy that often burdens white musicians." This is freaked and stupid. Not to diminish the accomplishments of many many many brilliant black musicians, there is this odd idea in America that heartfelt, extemporaneous music is the property of people of African descent. The terms we use, like "blues" or "soulful," evoke African American traditions, and the popular conception is that everything comes from slave songs. As has been said here before, who came first decades or centuries ago has little to do with creative expression in the present, but still, improvisation is not a single tradition. Beethoven, Chopin and others used to improvise in concert. In fact, the improv segment that would follow a composed work was often considered to be the highlight of a performance. If you listen to European liturgical music (like Bach's violin solos), it seems likely (though I don't know) that expanding upon the work while playing could have been done. And I can't imagine that the klezmer tradition hasn't always included improvisation. African Americans have no doubt added more to the tradition of improvised music in America than any other cultural grouping, and you (not necessarily philz, but anyone) can decide what value you think that has as a race-based argument. But to say that anyone who picks up a horn without having sheet music in front of them owes a debt to African slaves is short-sighted. The tradition is far richer and more diverse than any one continent. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Stephen Fruitman Subject: The "Inauthentic" Jew? Date: 06 Oct 1999 16:46:44 +0200 The "quality and authenticy...of his very Jewishness", as Steve Smith pointed out, seems indeed to be the ill-chosen target of Adam Shatz=B4 NY Times attack on John Zorn. Albeit that he appends a disclaimer that ultimately, Zorn=B4s Jewishness will be "primarily of interests to scholars of ethnicity". Well, here=B4s one chiming in, who also happens to be a music lover with his own crotchety tastes and believes that the Radical Jewish Culture being produced over there is both radical and very Jewish indeed. The bee in Shatz=B4 bonnet I would loosely identify with the term "essentialism". Essentialism prefers "authenticity" (and what in the world is that, now?) - and which promises some sort of symmetry and completedness - over diversity, which leaves a lot of threads dangling and questions unanswered. He claims for instance that Zorn=B4s compilation tributes to musicians such as Marc Bolan and Serge Gainsbourg (wonder why he didn=B4t mention Bacharach - is his oeuvre somehow more blatantly Jewish?) reek of an "atavistic form of identity politics". However, as Zorn stated when I queried him good-naturedly via fax about the Bacharach-as-Great-Jewish-Musician postulate, he answered to the effect that Bacharach=B4s music need not be played by a klezmer band with payes a-flyin=B4 in order to be considered Jewish; in fact, he asked me, under the circumstances, isn=B4t Irving Berlin=B4s "White Christmas" just about one of the most Jewish cultural artefacts around? There are many levels to this argument, in my estimation, all of them quite fascinating. But foremost to the discussion at hand is the one which refutes Shatz=B4 self-appointed position as arbiter of Jewishness. Despite the fact that he dedicated the entire series of Masada studio CDs to Ahad Ha=B4-am (ideologue of cultural Zionism), I would classify Zorn as more of a follower of Micha Berdyczewski, a disciple of Ahad Ha=B4-am=B4s who took Nietzschean exception to his master=B4s own "essentialism": For AH, a radically new Jewish culture was to be based solely on _Jewish_ cultural artefacts, to wit, the texts of the Bible and the Prophets. No foreign influence was to be allowed, indeed, it was to be rooted out. MB on the other hand said, in so many words, that as a Jewish author and Jew, whatever I _do_ is Jewish. This allows for a more expansive, individualist interpretation of what "Jewishness" (or anythingness) is in age of fragmentation, creating community while effectively safeguarding against the exclusionary "tribalism" Shatz tut-tuts over. Yet despite all this ethnography and dabbling in the history of ideas, there is of course a value judgement made by Shatz on the music, that the result is "simply radical kitsch", which may well be the instigation for these speculations about Zorn=B4s motives in the first place. So in the fina= l analysis, the reader is left with the impression that all this ink has been spilled for no other reason than the fact that the writer likes Arto Lindsay=B4s music and deems it "authentic", while he does not care for Zorn=B4s, which he must wave off as "inauthentic" in order to lend his own taste some form of "verifiable" credibility. Stephen Fruitman Bj=F6rn Olsson, Inst. f=F6r id=E9historia, Ume=E5 universitet 901 87 Ume=E5 tel. 090-7867982 fax 143374 e-post: bjorn.olsson@idehist.umu.se - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Whit Schonbein Subject: Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #766 Date: 06 Oct 1999 09:47:56 -0500 (CDT) On Wed, 6 Oct 1999, Zorn List Digest wrote: > 1.torture garden > 2.Grand guignol > 3.Absinth > 4.Radio > 5.Heretic > and I rate them this way 4.,5.,2.,1.,3, my ranking, fwiw: 4 (radio - favourite), 2 (first 1/2), 5 (rewards multiple listens - sounds like a series of free improvs with various combinations of the band members), 1 & 2 (second 1/2 of 2; there is a lot of overlap with torture garden and grand guignol; the latter has many of the same songs as the former (perhaps even the same recordings - torture garden is on shimmy disc, not avant); torture garden is also only 30-something minutes long; grand guignol is closer to an hour or 70min), 3 (absinthe - not sure it's my least favourite, just the least listened to - as nick said, it's ambient noises/drones). cheers, whit - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ken Waxman Subject: Re: more FMP news Date: 06 Oct 1999 11:13:16 -0400 (EDT) All very impressive new FMP stuff. But if the title Quartet is right for the new(er) CT session, who of the five musicians named *doesn't* play? Ken Waxman - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Benito Vergara" Subject: RE: more on the times Date: 06 Oct 1999 08:58:38 -0700 > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com > [mailto:owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of philz > Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 1999 4:59 AM steve smith highlighted some excerpts: > >"The prime architects of the new sensibility are Mr. Zorn, *who now > >considers himself a Jewish composer*..." > >"Mr. Zorn is *committed to the idea of Jews as an eternal pariah > class*..." And philz wrote: > Well, better leave me in the dark, I still find the article, even > with the comments illustrated above, generally positive and > inoffensive. Well, Steve left out Shatz's conclusion, where he calls Zorn's music "radical kitsch." To which I say, "Huh?" Shatz also questions Zorn's apparent positioning of himself as an oppressed outsider, noting that he is the consummate downtown insider in a city that has been the capital of postwar Jewish culture, etc. Granted, putting Zorn in that cultural context is indeed fair, but it makes him sound like a poseur somehow. Who is anyone to question Zorn's "authenticity?" (Funny how David Byrne criticizes the idea of the authentic in the accompanying article.) Ultimately, it's not dissimilar from what Cook and Morton rather bluntly raised in The Penguin Guide (I'm quoting here from the third edition): "Even a project like [Masada]... raises questions about opportunism. Why was his interest in Hebrew culture not made known sooner? A desire for privacy? A slow awakening to his cultural roots? Or a more cynical reason?" (Cook and Morton do add in the next paragraph: "There seems no reason to take the third course in approaching these records.") Later, Ben http://www.bigfoot.com/~bvergara/ ICQ# 12832406 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Stefan Verstraeten" Subject: Re: contacting avant Date: 06 Oct 1999 17:58:40 +0200 Hi (sorry for the late response) The best thing to do is go to forced exposure www.forcedexposure.com and then go to the option browse by label and go to the avant label. The site mentions every avant release that is for sale and even gives a brief description. As far as I know the label doesn't have an official website like tzadik does... never understood why best wishes stefan verstraeten np frisell...good dog happy man..... one of his best albums in my opinion >From: "Bruno" >Subject: Request - help in contacting AVANT recodrs > >Hallo Zorn-heads > > just a quick coupla questions - I've been a bit of a Zorn fan for a while >now, and I'm looking to track down a few more of the Naked City albums. From >hitting the Zorn discog, it looks like the "Avant" label have a lot of the >stuff I'm after - so the questions are: > >1. does anybody know how to contact Avant records (an e-mail or WWW would be >nice) - I've tried to get local record stores to track them down, but they >have NO idea - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mark Corroto Subject: NYT started it.... Date: 06 Oct 1999 12:45:41 -0500 At the risk of assasination and censure: My wife made an astute observation regarding the Times piece Zorn's career is tracking the same path as Spike Lee's preaching to the converted is boring enlightening the uninformed is much more interesting Sure the biography of MAlcolm X had to be made into a movie As a book it moved me, as a film it bored the shit outta me But Spike has a mission not to entertain but to hold up an entire people Is Zorn pushing himself into being a LEADER OF HIS PEOPLE? Do you want to be led? Who are his people? Did John Coltrane approach music like this? I don't think so.... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: benjamin elliot axelrad Subject: Re: more on the times Date: 06 Oct 1999 11:44:48 -0500 (CDT) Has anyone read anything in the Jewish media about Zorn? I remember reading an article on Jewish musicians and the rebirth of Klezmer in a free publication from United Jewish Appeal where the author critiqued Zorn's music (specifically Masada) for only being superficially Jewish. The author felt that Zorn was appropriating the symbols of Judaism (wearing a tallis on stage, performing in a temple) but somehow not capturing any of the "depth." I'm not sure what any of this means. (Does anyone know why Safam is so popular?) Ben On Wed, 6 Oct 1999, philz wrote: > But, can Zorn or anyone be that surprised that the media is picking > up on the Jewish angle? Isn't that somewhat the idea, to draw > attention to the Jewish plight? I get the impression that some are > upset that the media actually noticed some part of what Zorn is up > to. So what if Zorn is identified with Jewish culture? - He's been > responsible for the Radical Jewish Culture series and has promoted > Jewish artists where possible. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: benjamin elliot axelrad Subject: The "Inauthentic" Jew? Date: 06 Oct 1999 11:56:10 -0500 (CDT) that Bacharach=B4s music need not be played by a klezmer band with payes a-flyin=B4 in order to be considered Jewish; in fact, he asked me, under th= e circumstances, isn=B4t Irving Berlin=B4s "White Christmas" just about one o= f the most Jewish cultural artefacts around? I know this is off-topic, but I'm reminded of something that Philip Roth wrote in _Operation Shylock_. He argues that Berlin did so much for the Jews by writing "White Christmas" and whatever song he wrote about Easter because these two songs effectively "shlock-ified" the two most important Christian holidays. Ben - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: NYT started it.... Date: 06 Oct 1999 14:31:01 -0500 On Wed, Oct 06, 1999 at 12:45:41PM -0500, Mark Corroto wrote: > Is Zorn pushing himself into being a LEADER OF HIS PEOPLE? > Do you want to be led? > Who are his people? What you mean "his people", kemosabe? (very old Lone Ranger joke reference...) Or more interestingly, what do you mean "leader"? and "pushing"? Is his work with Radical Jewish Culture and Tzadik providing an example that I would want to follow? Yes. (The same might be true in those fields of, respectively, say, Liz Lerman and Robert Fripp.) Does this mean I want to follow his lead in imitating "Leng Tche" or Painkiller? No, not particularly. Do I want to be led? Not a bad thing in many ways (the peculiar compulsive antiauthority fetish pervading the Net notwithstanding)... as long as I can choose, whom to follow, and when and how... -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: Jon Rose/David Watson free concert in NYC 10/11 Date: 06 Oct 1999 16:00:12 EDT I thought some people here might be interested to learn that Jon Rose and David Watson are doing a free in-store concert at Downtown Music Gallery this coming Monday, 10/11, at 7 PM. DMG is at 211 E. 5th St., phone number is (212) 473-0043. Rose is also playing at 11 PM the next night at the Alterknit, which I believe is his only other appearance in town this time through. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com NP: Harry Pussy-What Was Music? (Siltbreeze) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu Subject: Free Flutists? Date: 06 Oct 1999 15:33:08 -0400 Possibly a silly question, but, aside from the arguable example of Robert Dick, are there any free players around who stick exclusively to the flute? Not someone like Braxton who sometimes plays flute and sometimes plays free, but...the Derek Bailey of the flute. Brian Olewnick - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeni Dahmus Subject: Re: some Zorn questions Date: 06 Oct 1999 17:37:08 -0400 Andy Miller wrote: > 2. In the liner notes to 'The String Quartets' Zorn makes some strong > claims for "Memento Mori"-- something about how the piece was a sort of > breakthrough for him, etc. I've listened to this several times but always > mind myself getting bored with it. Any ideas what Zorn is getting at with > this composition? (and in his remarks about it?) I think the beauty of "Memento Mori" lies in its subtle through-composed structure. Zorn takes the listener on an intimate "journey" in which the musical expression is stripped of conventional models. There is an element of mystery regarding what compositional method will be implemented as the piece unfolds--much like the spontaneity of an example Zorn cited in the liner notes, Harry Smith's Heaven and Earth Magic. I suppose the piece was a breakthrough for Zorn because he approached writing from a different perspective (a gradual working out or stretching of the framework). The string quartet is a perfect medium for an introspective work of this nature; it can express a private dialogue in a way that larger forms cannot. Jeni - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Pratt Subject: Charlemagne Palestine Date: 06 Oct 1999 14:57:58 -0700 (PDT) I'd just like to quickly rave about the new Charlemagne Palestine disc on New World called 'Schlingen-Blangen'. For those who don't know, Palestine was one of the main innovators of the '70s minimalist movement that included Terry Riley, Philip Glass, Steve Reich and others. For some reason, while those folks gained a lot of attention (even mainstream success), Palestine has continued to remain a largely unknown and neglected figure in music. The disc is a single 72-minute piece for solo organ (performed by Palestine) that evolves very slowly and makes use of some really lush harmonics. It's pretty similar to a lot of Terry Riley's organ works, so I'd definitely recommend this one to any of his fans. Anyway, it's a beautiful disc. For those who are interested, there's a feature article on Palestine at http://home.cdsnet.net/~michaelm/death/charla/html and a really fantastic interview (check this one out!) at http://home.cdsnet.net/!michaelm/death/ch_int.html. Lastly, does anyone know anything about the two Palestine albums on Barooni (Barooni 14 & 19) listed in the selective discography of the liner notes? I'm assuming they're long out-of-print LPs. Am I right? -Tom Pratt ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Pratt Subject: Re: Free Flutists? Date: 06 Oct 1999 15:01:04 -0700 (PDT) --- brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu wrote: > Possibly a silly question, but, aside from the > arguable example of > Robert Dick, are there any free players around > who stick exclusively > to the flute? Not someone like Braxton who > sometimes plays flute and > sometimes plays free, but...the Derek Bailey of > the flute. I don't have an answer to your question, but it prompted a question in my head (which could end up answering your question after all). Has anyone heard the Matthias Ziegler solo CD that just came out? I'd love to hear some comments on that one. Thanks. -Tom Pratt ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: Charlemagne Palestine Date: 06 Oct 1999 18:07:08 -0500 On Wed, Oct 06, 1999 at 02:57:58PM -0700, Tom Pratt wrote: > For those who are interested, there's a feature > article on Palestine at > http://home.cdsnet.net/~michaelm/death/charla/html and That would be http://home.cdsnet.net/~michaelm/death/charla.html > a really fantastic interview (check this one out!) at > http://home.cdsnet.net/!michaelm/death/ch_int.html. and http://home.cdsnet.net/~michaelm/death/ch_int.html -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Whit Schonbein Subject: Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #767 Date: 06 Oct 1999 17:30:13 -0500 (CDT) On Wed, 6 Oct 1999, Zorn List Digest wrote: > Date: Wed, 6 Oct 1999 17:58:40 +0200 > From: "Stefan Verstraeten" > Subject: Re: contacting avant > np frisell...good dog happy man..... one of his best albums in my opinion i agree wholeheartedly. i /really/ like this album (and i'm usually a fan of his older material, e.g., this land, where in the world, and live material with the frisell/driscoll/baron trio). it really fills a niche in my music collection, and i find myself coming back to it time and time again. cheers, whit schonbein np: plug (luke vibert), 'drum'n'bass for papa' http://artsci.wustl.edu/~wwschonb - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ryan Novak Subject: yet more NYT Date: 06 Oct 1999 15:38:35 -0700 (PDT) >Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 12:45:41 -0500From: Mark >Corroto >Subject: NYT started it.... >At the risk of assasination and censure: >My wife made an astute observation regarding the >Timespiece >Zorn's career is tracking the same path as Spike Lee's >preaching to the converted is boring >enlightening the uninformed is much more interesting I read the NYT article (and now I can get the NYT, pretty cool, thanks) and I thought it was, well, written by a guy who doesn't know Zorn too well and doesn't want to start. But at the same time, all of those points are valid. Zorn's probably on to something good but he may be over-zealous about it a lot of the time. I think when he started with hardcore it was a lot like that (and someone mentioned not wanting to "follow" that particular path). Probably in time that will chill out and writers won't get distracted by all the peripheral stuff and they'll focus on the music instead. ---Ryan Novak ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "John Thomas" Subject: RE: more FMP news Date: 06 Oct 1999 18:06:24 -0500 >>so we'll have to wait a bit longer for the first Evan=20 >>Parker/Schlippenbach/Lovens record in 8 years. but check out what else FMP=20 >>has planned for their next set of releases: >>FMP CD 106:=A0=A0COMPLETE COMBUSTION - Schlippenbach Trio=20 >>Evan Parker: soprano + tenor saxophones >>Alexander von Schlippenbach: piano >>Paul Lovens: drums + percussion >>Recorded April 1998, Berlin (75:00)=20 I heard from FMP directly that this should be available in Europe in November '99 and available through Cadence in December '99 just in time for Xmas stocking stuffing. :-) John - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve Smith Subject: Re: more on the times Date: 06 Oct 1999 20:34:09 -0400 philz wrote: > >"The prime architects of the new sensibility are Mr. Zorn, *who now > >considers himself a Jewish composer*..." > > But isn't he? Why else would he do pieces like Kristalnacht, or make > a band like Masada? He has emphasized his culture so that I can't > personally help but think of him in those terms, at least partially I think the point of emphasis is "now considers himself a Jewish composer." This seems to be painting Zorn as an opportunist, something of a Johnny-come-lately who found an easy marketing hook. This seems to deny that Zorn has always been Jewish and also that he's still doing music not easily categorized as "Jewish." > >"The titles of his compositions *often evoke Jewish victimhood*..." > > Like Kristalnacht? I stood packed in a dark room in the old Knitting > Factory assaulted by the sounds of that piece and understood a piece > of the Holocaust that I might not have otherwise understood... is > this comment really inaccurate? It is if you focus on the word "often," which was where I was looking. Aside from 'Kristalnacht' and the band name Masada, are there actually enough other examples to justify using the word "often," which to my mind is being used to reinforce the premise that Zorn is looking to evoke his eternal victimhood? > >"Recently, Mr. Zorn has spoken *in almost hallucinatory tones* about > >what it means to be Jewish in America." > > This sounds like the writer's attempt to add color and imagery to his > article... much of what I talk about my coworkers probably find > hallucinatory (but maybe that's 'cause I smoke too much :) Yes, but in this particular case, given that the writer has been expending so much effort to point out the general falsehood and opportunism of Zonr's Jewish stance, the word "hallucinatory" is just one more twist of the knife. Everyone, but everyone, with whom I have spoken has pointed out that particular phrase and its implications. > >"It may be that for Mr. Zorn, Jewishness answers a deeply felt > >desire - a desire not to be a white jazz musician. *By invoking his > >own history of oppression, he can assert his right to play the > >blues*, without the racial envy that often burdens white musicians." > > OK, this unbased speculation is probably the most offensive thing in > the article, but I really don't think the writer was attempting to > misrepresent Zorn, just place him inside the growing emphasis on > Jewish culture that Zorn has cultivated. Clearly it's only a piece > of the Zorn puzzle, which is the writer's major mistake, but it is > the most obvious attribute of Zorn to anyone who hasn't followed his > music closely. But please remember that probably 99.999999999999999% of those who will see this article fit into the category of those who haven't followed Zorn's career at all, let alone closely. In that light, is this article a fair introduction? > Well, better leave me in the dark, I still find the article, even > with the comments illustrated above, generally positive and > inoffensive. It focuses attention on the artists involved and on some > of their personal interests. No, it doesn't, and that's a big part of the problem. A premise is introduced, one which may have been interesting if developed, and then just as quickly it is abandoned in order to launch into this Zorn/Lindsay dichotomy. Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve Smith Subject: Re: Couple Questions Date: 06 Oct 1999 20:38:13 -0400 Jeremy Isaac Mc Cormick wrote: > Does anyone know of any Downbeat articles about David S. Ware? I'm > interested in checking out what equipment he uses. Anything in the past > year or two would be cool. Not Down Beat, no, but there was a Jazz Times article in Ocotber 1998, and I do think that Jazz Times also lists equipment at the end of articles. There was also a Jazziz cover story but I don't think they list equipment. Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Benito Vergara" Subject: RE: Couple Questions Date: 06 Oct 1999 17:50:15 -0700 > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com > [mailto:owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Steve Smith > Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 1999 5:38 PM > Jeremy Isaac Mc Cormick wrote: > > > Does anyone know of any Downbeat articles about David S. Ware? I'm > > interested in checking out what equipment he uses. Anything in the past > > year or two would be cool. According to the liner notes in "Go See The World" (1998), "David S. Ware plays Buffet Crampon tenor saxophones exclusively." Linking this back to the NY Times, can anyone elaborate on the supposed connection (earlier alluded to by Kurt or Steve maybe, I can't remember) between the NYT article on Susie Ibarra and her departure from the Ware Quartet? Later, Ben np: "in memoriam gilles deleuze" http://www.bigfoot.com/~bvergara/ ICQ# 12832406 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rick Lopez" Subject: Re: Couple Questions Date: 06 Oct 1999 20:57:37 -0400 >According to the liner notes in "Go See The World" (1998), "David S. Ware >plays Buffet Crampon tenor saxophones exclusively." > >Linking this back to the NY Times, can anyone elaborate on the supposed >connection (earlier alluded to by Kurt or Steve maybe, I can't remember) >between the NYT article on Susie Ibarra and her departure from the Ware >Quartet? Well... Actually the Ibarra split post-NYT was with Willi', Parker and all of his projects. She had left the Ware Qrtt a short while before that. Complications on their complications, RL Marilyn Crispell, Susie Ibarra, William Parker, Sam Rivers, Matthew Shipp, David S. Ware, and Reggie Workman Discographies--Samuel Beckett Eulogy--Baseball & the 10,000 Things--Time Stops--LOVETORN--HARD BOIL--etc., at: http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k UPDATE August 20, 1999: vids, a few CDs, baseball books, a few Cadence back issues, a few more CDs... ***Very Various For Sale: ***http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k/4SALE.html - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Daniel L Brown" Subject: Re: Free Flutists? Date: 06 Oct 1999 22:33:55 -0400 > Possibly a silly question, but, aside from the arguable example of > Robert Dick, are there any free players around who stick exclusively > to the flute? Not someone like Braxton who sometimes plays flute and > sometimes plays free, but...the Derek Bailey of the flute. Not a completely free player (think Dolphy instead of Bailey), but James Newton has some wonderful stuff out there.... Dann - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Hugo Linares" Subject: RE: Couple Questions Date: 05 Oct 1999 23:41:21 -0300 Jeremy Isaac Mc Cormick wrote: > > Does anyone know of any Downbeat articles about David S. Ware? I'm >interested in checking out what equipment he uses. Anything in the past >year or two would be cool. > There's one in the January '95 issue (Sonny Rollins on the cover): David S. Ware/Charles Gayle.- Tenor Madness (pages 34, 35, 36 and 37). Best, Hugo - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Matthew Ross Davis Subject: Re: Free Flutists? Date: 07 Oct 1999 00:35:15 -0400 Not necessarilly a 'free' flute player, but definitely one to know if you're interested in contemporary flautists is John Fonville. He has done a LOAD of recordings with various composers and improvisors (including the whole Roulette gang) and even has a CD out on the Einstein label with some of his own compositions along with other composers. Some of the microtonal stuff he can do is pretty amazing! - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Stefan Verstraeten" Subject: Re: Free Flutists Date: 07 Oct 1999 07:14:14 +0200 >From: brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu >Subject: Free Flutists? > > Possibly a silly question, but, aside from the arguable example of > Robert Dick, are there any free players around who stick exclusively > to the flute? Not someone like Braxton who sometimes plays flute and > sometimes plays free, but...the Derek Bailey of the flute. > > Brian Olewnick Hi Brian, how do you do? The derek bailey of the flute, ahum, interisting point of view... I would defintitely recommend Bobbi Humphrey, and as far as i know she exclusively plays the flute. But there is one problem, because the only albums that were released so far on the blue note label are 'blue breakbeats' and 'black and blues'.... albums that are filled with very beautiful and very steaming jazz-funk-soul ..... but no free playing i am afraid. She has definitely made free music as well but no rereleased i am afraid. Although i can't wait to hear this free stuff, because she really has incredible techniques..... ps anyone on this list knows what she does these days Best wishes stefan verstraeten NP Bobbi Humphrey: Blue bREAKBEATS.... or what did you think - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: DR S WILKIE Subject: Re: The ubiquitous Greg Cohen Date: 07 Oct 1999 09:58:38 GMT0BST He IS everywhere - check out Annie Ross' character's band in the nightclub in Short Cuts. Greg plays a bass player, and his old buddy Tom Waits plays the drunk slumped over the bar. Sean Wilkie - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andreas Dietz" Subject: Re: Free Flutists? Date: 07 Oct 1999 13:38:23 CEST This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_27ea972f_7528cc71$2ea98223 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_49bc7731_7528cc71$2ea98223" ------=_NextPart_001_49bc7731_7528cc71$2ea98223 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed > Possibly a silly question, but, aside from the arguable example of > Robert Dick, are there any free players around who stick exclusively > to the flute? Not someone like Braxton who sometimes plays flute and > sometimes plays free, but...the Derek Bailey of the flute. > > Brian Olewnick > Not a Derek Bailey but I have to mention Michael Heupel, a member of the Cologne Loft Scene. He plays the whole flute family from piccolo to subcontrabassflute (according to the lines notes on his solo cd 'Flute News' from 1989 he is the only one who has such a flute in the whole world). In the early eighties he played with the band BOURY. He´s not well known but he does very interesting flute explorations in different moods. I think before his premature death Thomas Chapin was the most amazing flute player though he didn´t use it as his major instrument. Andreas Dietz ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------=_NextPart_001_49bc7731_7528cc71$2ea98223 Content-type: text/html
                            
       Possibly a silly question, but, aside from the arguable example of
     Robert Dick, are there any free players around who stick exclusively
     to the flute? Not someone like Braxton who sometimes plays flute and
     sometimes plays free, but...the Derek Bailey of the flute.

     Brian Olewnick


Not a Derek Bailey but I have to mention Michael Heupel, a member of the Cologne Loft Scene. He plays the whole flute family from piccolo to subcontrabassflute (according to the lines notes on his solo cd 'Flute News' from 1989 he is the only one who has such a flute in the whole world). In the early eighties he played with the band BOURY. He´s not well known but he does very interesting flute explorations in different moods.

I think before his premature death Thomas Chapin was the most amazing flute player though he didn´t use it as his major instrument.

Andreas Dietz

Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
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------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: free the flutes Date: 07 Oct 1999 10:44:37 -0500 been thinking on this, and not coming up with much. but james newton, who isn't way outside but has done some nice stuff with the likes of murray and threadgill, may be exclusively a flutist. he and threadgill also did a nice flute quartet record on black saint a few years back, called flute force four. and while we're on the subject (and because i'm one of those etymology geeks), i just checked four dictionaries, including webster's third new international unabridged and the norton concise encyclopedia of music, and none contain the word "floutist." to flout, whoever, is to treat with contempt or disregard. but far as i can tell, they're flutists. (not that you used either word, brian. just something that bugs me). kg - --- brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu wrote: > Possibly a silly question, but, aside from the > arguable example of > Robert Dick, are there any free players around > who stick exclusively > to the flute? Not someone like Braxton who > sometimes plays flute and > sometimes plays free, but...the Derek Bailey of > the flute. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: =?iso-8859-1?q?A?= Subject: Avant Date: 07 Oct 1999 08:06:09 -0700 (PDT) I have a friend who has a kinda big CD store, and he has 2 of these phone-book like catalogs. Anyway, one (I think it´s from AMJ company or something like that) is American and it lists practically every Avant title, but the thing is these are listed as being about $25 each. But that´s something. A ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: he puts the 'z' in 'zealous' Date: 07 Oct 1999 10:53:05 -0500 Zorn overzealous? Never!!! [little winky emoticon thing] > Zorn's probably on to something good but he may be over-zealous about it a lot > of the time. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: Re: free the flutes Date: 07 Oct 1999 10:54:15 EDT In a message dated 10/7/99 10:51:29 AM, kurt_gottschalk@scni.com writes: << and while we're on the subject (and because i'm one of those etymology geeks), i just checked four dictionaries, including webster's third new international unabridged and the norton concise encyclopedia of music, and none contain the word "floutist." to flout, whoever, is to treat with contempt or disregard. but far as i can tell, they're flutists. (not that you used either word, brian. just something that bugs me). >> you didn't find it because the word is flautist. try looking that one up. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com NP: the lulling background babble of CNBC - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Subject: Re: he puts the 'z' in 'zealous' Date: 07 Oct 1999 11:03:27 -0400 > Zorn's probably on to something good but he may be over-zealous Yet another Jewish reference apparently. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: flouting the flautists Date: 07 Oct 1999 11:26:19 -0500 despite my valiant efforts, it has privately been pointed out to me that the proper spelling of that stupid word is 'flautist,' which is in the dictionary. so now i no longer have an argument for not using the word, i just think it's silly and pompous to. [little emoticon frowny face or something] - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: free the flutes Date: 07 Oct 1999 11:26:51 -0500 On Thu, Oct 07, 1999 at 10:44:37AM -0500, kurt_gottschalk@scni.com wrote: > and while we're on the subject (and because i'm one of those etymology geeks), i > just checked four dictionaries, including webster's third new international > unabridged and the norton concise encyclopedia of music, and none contain the > word "floutist." to flout, whoever, is to treat with contempt or disregard. but > far as i can tell, they're flutists. (not that you used either word, brian. just > something that bugs me). The word you want is "flautist". The spelling "floutist" is used only by spelling floutists :-). -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: benjamin elliot axelrad Subject: Re: more on the times Date: 06 Oct 1999 11:44:48 -0500 (CDT) Has anyone read anything in the Jewish media about Zorn? I remember reading an article on Jewish musicians and the rebirth of Klezmer in a free publication from United Jewish Appeal where the author critiqued Zorn's music (specifically Masada) for only being superficially Jewish. The author felt that Zorn was appropriating the symbols of Judaism (wearing a tallis on stage, performing in a temple) but somehow not capturing any of the "depth." I'm not sure what any of this means. (Does anyone know why Safam is so popular?) Ben On Wed, 6 Oct 1999, philz wrote: > But, can Zorn or anyone be that surprised that the media is picking > up on the Jewish angle? Isn't that somewhat the idea, to draw > attention to the Jewish plight? I get the impression that some are > upset that the media actually noticed some part of what Zorn is up > to. So what if Zorn is identified with Jewish culture? - He's been > responsible for the Radical Jewish Culture series and has promoted > Jewish artists where possible. - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: more on the times Date: 07 Oct 1999 12:21:31 -0500 On Wed, Oct 06, 1999 at 11:44:48AM -0500, benjamin elliot axelrad wrote: > Has anyone read anything in the Jewish media about Zorn? I remember > reading an article on Jewish musicians and the rebirth of Klezmer in a > free publication from United Jewish Appeal where the author critiqued > Zorn's music (specifically Masada) for only being superficially Jewish. > The author felt that Zorn was appropriating the symbols of Judaism > (wearing a tallis on stage, performing in a temple) but somehow not > capturing any of the "depth." I'm not sure what any of this means. THere was a favorable front-page article on him in the Forward a while back, as well as, IIRC, in Response. What I've seen in the Jewish press has been generally approving. > (Does anyone know why Safam is so popular?) *gak* Well, at least no one seems to mention Poogy anymore... -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linares Hugo Subject: RE: Free Flutists? Date: 07 Oct 1999 12:50:06 -0300 Andreas Dietz wrote: > I think before his premature death Thomas Chapin was the most amazing > flute player though he didn=B4t use it as his major instrument.=20 >=20 >=20 > Seconded. He also played amazing tango-tinged music in Pablo Aslan's > Avantango. >=20 Cheers. Hugo =20 > =20 >=20 >=20 >=20 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Subject: Re: Re: The ubiquitous Greg Cohen Date: 07 Oct 1999 14:32:26 -0400 DR S WILKIE wrote: > He IS everywhere - check out Annie Ross' character's band in the nightclub in Short Cuts. Greg plays a bass player, and his old buddy Tom Waits plays the drunk slumped over the bar. Sean Wilkie - And as I remember it, Bobby Previte is the drummer... Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com (checking in from work for no particular reason...) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Whit Schonbein Subject: mp3 - ruins + massacre / +/- Date: 07 Oct 1999 13:30:58 -0500 (CDT) hello folks. updated my sporadically updated webpage to include a massacre tune from may of 99 and two ruins tunes from july of 99. if anyone is interested in trading live material, email me. http://artsci.wustl.edu/~wwschonb/music.html also, for any st. louis, missouri zorn-listers: i'm under the impression that +/- (gene coleman + plochswel (excuse my spelling!)) performs tonight (thursday), 8:00pm, forum for contemporary art (right next door to jazz at the bistro). not sure what the cover is. sponsored by the new music circle (i'm not affiliated). see you there! whit William W. Schonbein Philosophy-Neuroscience-Psychology Program Department of Philosophy Washington University St. Louis, MO, USA whit@twinearth.wustl.edu - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Whit Schonbein Subject: formanek interview Date: 07 Oct 1999 14:13:44 -0500 (CDT) this interview with michael formanek was posted to rec.music.bluenote. i'm posting the first 1/2 or so (since it's long) here because it is probably of interest to some of you. if there is demand, i'll post the remainder. (also, i'm on digest, so apologies if someone has already posted this...) cheers, whit Newsgroups: rec.music.bluenote Organization: Blue Lake Public Radio Lines: 200 Michael Formanek, bassist/bandleader/composer at home in Milford, Pennsylvania. Interview with Lazaro Vega, Blue Lake Public Radio September 27, 1999 Lazaro Vega: Though you=92ve made 13 albums with saxophonist Tim Berne, the= re=92 s only one duo album, right? (=93Ornery People,=94 Screwgun). I guess the obvious observation is that many of the group settings you=92ve worked in w= ere compositionally oriented with many sections for improvisation, but the structures were very definite. I=92m thinking of the records I have from En= ja, =93Wide Open Spaces,=94 =93Low Profile=94 and =93Nature of the Beast.=94 It= would seem like with the duo you can be more responsive and a lot freer. Michael Formanek: Yes, usually that=92s the case. It=92s taken on a few different incarnations. We=92ve been doing it on and off since 1991 or 1992= =2E We=92ve done different things. Sometimes where we=92ve just played a lot of compositions sort of individually, and sometimes were we play less compositions and string them together with more improv, and sometimes where we just totally improvise, or just use some of the material from the pieces as kind of reference material. That=92s what we=92ve more recently been doi= ng. But because we just play so much together in so many different situations, we have so much common language that it=92s kind of interesting sometimes j= ust to go and see if we land on one of the tunes or not, and if we do we don=92= t necessarily stay there. You know: yeah, so it=92s pretty wide open at this point. Vega: I bet there=92s a lot of sort of instantaneous communication having played together as long as you have. Formanek: (Laughing) yeah, it=92s pretty amazing what things develop! Vega: Would you rather have Berne playing the baritone saxophone or alto? Formanek: I like them both. I started playing with Tim around the time he started playing the bari. So being in my band, the Wide Open Spaces band that we did for a couple of years back in the early =9190=92s, that was one= of the first times he played it doing someone else=92s music and being forced = to have to really deal on it. So I just enjoy his bari playing. I just like doing that with him. There are times we talk about just doing that; just bari and bass duos, but we haven=92t quite gotten to that. But I like both. I love the alto. It=92s a great color, and he=92s so free = on that instrument, you know, he=92s been playing it so long. And it=92s nice = to have a little bigger range read between the two instruments. Vega: In terms of bass playing, it=92s sometimes an observation that bass players maybe in your generation have tried to find a common ground between the cello-like bass playing of Dave Holland and the more swing oriented style of Ray Brown or Jimmy Blanton, even. I=92m wondering as a bassist whe= re do you find yourself coming out of the jazz tradition in terms of the sound production? Formanek: Well, I mean it=92s kind of little bits of all of it. And sort of disregarding all of it at the same time. I really came up listening to everybody: I loved Ray Brown, I loved Paul Chambers, and I loved (Charles) Mingus. Probably overall Mingus might have made the biggest impression in terms of the expressiveness and sound, the combination, coming out of the bass. That=92s something I was really attrac= ted to, and Oscar Pettiford=92s sound, I loved Scotty LaFaro=92s sound. In pretty much different periods I was kind of into everybody. I had period= s where I was heavily into Holland. I guess a little bit of everybody at various times. So my thing, it=92s maybe a little darker, a little bassier, maybe, than so= me of the more cello-like guys. Probably a little more percussive than some of the other people. It=92s sort of my own mish-mosh. I don=92t know how to describe it. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "ïÿS  .¥Äÿÿÿÿÿÿÿø" Subject: 180 and the Letter G Date: 07 Oct 1999 12:57:45 -0700 (PDT) I have it on good word that the Weatherman's house is for sale. For those of you familiar with Negativland's output, this is the famous house where Weatherman grew up, the directions to which form the last track on the album, Big 10-8 Place. A classic piece of underground lore and a mecca for the many (well, maybe you wouldn't call us "many") Negativland fans. In any case, thought some of you would like to know. Peter ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tal Goldman Subject: Berne, Hemphill Realaudio at screwgun site Date: 08 Oct 1999 00:23:02 +0200 People might be interested to know that Screwgun has put up some unreleased Berne, Berne/Rainey, Django Bates, and Hemphill files at http://www.screwgunrecords.com/sound.htm Got the Hemphill one going now. Nice stuff.... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Benito Vergara" Subject: RE: more on the times Date: 06 Oct 1999 08:58:38 -0700 > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com > [mailto:owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of philz > Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 1999 4:59 AM steve smith highlighted some excerpts: > >"The prime architects of the new sensibility are Mr. Zorn, *who now > >considers himself a Jewish composer*..." > >"Mr. Zorn is *committed to the idea of Jews as an eternal pariah > class*..." And philz wrote: > Well, better leave me in the dark, I still find the article, even > with the comments illustrated above, generally positive and > inoffensive. Well, Steve left out Shatz's conclusion, where he calls Zorn's music "radical kitsch." To which I say, "Huh?" Shatz also questions Zorn's apparent positioning of himself as an oppressed outsider, noting that he is the consummate downtown insider in a city that has been the capital of postwar Jewish culture, etc. Granted, putting Zorn in that cultural context is indeed fair, but it makes him sound like a poseur somehow. Who is anyone to question Zorn's "authenticity?" (Funny how David Byrne criticizes the idea of the authentic in the accompanying article.) Ultimately, it's not dissimilar from what Cook and Morton rather bluntly raised in The Penguin Guide (I'm quoting here from the third edition): "Even a project like [Masada]... raises questions about opportunism. Why was his interest in Hebrew culture not made known sooner? A desire for privacy? A slow awakening to his cultural roots? Or a more cynical reason?" (Cook and Morton do add in the next paragraph: "There seems no reason to take the third course in approaching these records.") Later, Ben http://www.bigfoot.com/~bvergara/ ICQ# 12832406 - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard@rcvs.org.uk Subject: More media moans Date: 06 Oct 1999 09:58:18 +0100 > >whatever ethnic musics they want, the piece seems to say, but Jews have a > >special obligation to represent their own culture in a certain way -- > >even if that way is never stated > > Kurt, pardon if I took your comments out of context, or missed something, Kurt can tell you for certain, but my reading of this was that the ARTICLE was claiming that Jews have a special obligation etc etc, and that Kurt, like you, begs to differ (not unreasonably). I know I caused a flame war last time I grouched about this, but it does seem to me that the national press in the UK is completely and wilfully clueless about contemporary music in a way that it isn't about the plastic arts. It may not be cutting edge, but broadsheet arts coverage seems reasonably informed about paintings and sculptures but totally uncomprehending when it comes to music. I mention this because (a) it pisses me off, and (b) I can't see why it should be so. Surely some small London exhibition of conceptual sculptures is no more accessible to newspaper readers than a new CD by Evan Parker (say). I know this is slightly off-topic but I'd be interested in anyone's thoughts on this, esp in relation to Zorn's non-participation policy, which strikes me as being rather defeatist. Rich Latest on (musings): reviews (with MP3s) of new CD releases featuring, among others, John Stevens, Chris Speed, Dave Douglas, Wayne Horovitz, Bobby Previte, Francois Houle, Hans Tammen, Keith Tippett, Jerry Granelli, Thurston Moore... http://come.to/musings.com +++STOP PRESS+++ Also Run Ra, John Tchicai, Braxton, Ganelin Trio... - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: more month'o'mazzacane Date: 07 Oct 1999 23:30:24 EDT two more Mazzacane concerts to report on: last night Loren played with Andrew Burnes and John Allen, both guitarists. they built their last piece into a nicely controlled frenzy. then Loren played for a bit solo, and in a slightly different style from anything I've seen him do before, very quiet and more moved from the blues than usual. then the guest star of the evening, Rafael Toral, came on and began a duet with Loren. Toral, at least on the evidence of this evening, hasn't quite made the transition to presenting his music in a live context. as the duet progressed, Toral was so wrapped up in his own thing that he wasn't really paying much attention to what Loren was doing. Loren's solution to this, about halfway through the piece, was to cut his own volume all the way, so that only Toral could be heard. the look on Toral's face when he realized that this had occurred was pretty priceless. but after that, the duo worked much better, with much more interplay (Loren told me afterwards that he got that idea from a Godard movie, which I found interesting). over the rest of the duo segment, Loren cut his own volume a few more times, and that helped to keep the piece somewhat on track. then Toral played solo for a stretch, which was pretty good but a bit uneven. tonight, the evening began with Loren, again accompanied by Andrew Burnes. Loren broke another string (at least his fourth in the three shows I've seen so far. I'm not sure what the deal with that is.), which killed the momentum for a while, but the duo ended up sounding pretty good. that went on for 45 minutes or so, during which way too many of the young'uns there to see their idol, Chan Marshall (who records for Matador under the name Cat Power), felt free to yammer over some of Loren's most poignant playing. then, after a break, Marshall joined Loren on stage. it was all improvised, with her strumming simple melodies and periodically singing, and Loren accompanying her, and it was breathtakingly gorgeous for virtually the entire 45 minutes. most of the songs she sang were her own, I assume, but early on, she sang six or seven couplets from Satisfaction by the Rolling Stones. what I found especially funny about this, besides the fact that it was presented as a post-modern blues dirge, was that when I spoke to Loren afterwards, he wasn't even aware that she had done that, since that's not what he was focusing on. definitely the highlight of Lorenfest thus far. if Marshall has any sense, she'll record her next record with Loren. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com NP: Charlemagne Palestine-Schlingen-Blangen (New World) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: philz Subject: Re: more on the times Date: 06 Oct 1999 07:59:20 -0400 steve smith explained: >philz wrote: > > > I must be incredibly thick, but I don't understand the reaction >to this article. Not that I particularly like the article, it's as >good or bad as any article that attempt to generalize two artists >careers and motivations on one page, but where is the insult, the >misrepresentation? > >Well, let's see. Consider the following (with my points of emphasis >set apart with asterisks): > >"The prime architects of the new sensibility are Mr. Zorn, *who now >considers himself a Jewish composer*..." But isn't he? Why else would he do pieces like Kristalnacht, or make a band like Masada? He has emphasized his culture so that I can't personally help but think of him in those terms, at least partially (of course I think of bird calls when I think of Zorn as well, but I've been following him for over 10 years now). Zorn has brought more pride to his culture (imho) than any other "Jewish composer" that I can think of. Is this really an insult? >"It is unclear what led Mr. Zorn, a secular Jew from Queens, to his >awakening. In interviews, he has *spoken vaguely of getting hostile >looks in Germany and of his father's death.*" > >"The titles of his compositions *often evoke Jewish victimhood*..." Like Kristalnacht? I stood packed in a dark room in the old Knitting Factory assaulted by the sounds of that piece and understood a piece of the Holocaust that I might not have otherwise understood... is this comment really inaccurate? >"*Until Mr. Zorn discovered klezmer,* the only jazz musician to show >much interest in Eastern European soul was the black clarinetist Don >Byron." This sounds like usual bombastic inaccurate writing overgeneralizing... >"Recently, Mr. Zorn has spoken *in almost hallucinatory tones* about >what it means to be Jewish in America." This sounds like the writer's attempt to add color and imagery to his article... much of what I talk about my coworkers probably find hallucinatory (but maybe that's 'cause I smoke too much :) >"Mr. Zorn is *committed to the idea of Jews as an eternal pariah class*..." > >"It may be that for Mr. Zorn, Jewishness answers a deeply felt >desire - a desire not to be a white jazz musician. *By invoking his >own history of oppression, he can assert his right to play the >blues*, without the racial envy that often burdens white musicians." OK, this unbased speculation is probably the most offensive thing in the article, but I really don't think the writer was attempting to misrepresent Zorn, just place him inside the growing emphasis on Jewish culture that Zorn has cultivated. Clearly it's only a piece of the Zorn puzzle, which is the writer's major mistake, but it is the most obvious attribute of Zorn to anyone who hasn't followed his music closely. The writer did start the article distancing Zorn from jazz musicians, so this is only stupidly attempting to keep the tone of the article, as dumb as the comment is. But, can Zorn or anyone be that surprised that the media is picking up on the Jewish angle? Isn't that somewhat the idea, to draw attention to the Jewish plight? I get the impression that some are upset that the media actually noticed some part of what Zorn is up to. So what if Zorn is identified with Jewish culture? - He's been responsible for the Radical Jewish Culture series and has promoted Jewish artists where possible. >Is that enough to illustrate what Kurt was saying? Those are my own >major points of disturbance, as well as those of many others with >whom I've spoken (and yes, the debate carries on today as lively as >yesterday and the day before - this is probably the most >talked-about music article in the Times in months if not years. >Would that it were being talked about for positive reasons...). Well, better leave me in the dark, I still find the article, even with the comments illustrated above, generally positive and inoffensive. It focuses attention on the artists involved and on some of their personal interests. It of course misses the mark, but that's why I don't read much about music anymore in general, and why I don't take anything written too literally. I think the arguments against it are over-sensitive and thin-skinned, but that's my opinion. philz - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andreas Dietz" Subject: RE: Free Flutists? Date: 08 Oct 1999 09:30:23 CEST >Andreas Dietz wrote: > > > I think before his premature death Thomas Chapin was the most amazing > > flute player though he didn´t use it as his major instrument. > > >Hugo Linares wrote: > > > > Seconded. He also played amazing tango-tinged music in Pablo Aslan's > > Avantango. > > Hugo, can you give some recording details about Avantango? Andreas ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: stephen drury Subject: Re: some Zorn questions Date: 08 Oct 1999 07:03:57 -0400 >Andy Miller wrote: >> 2. In the liner notes to 'The String Quartets' Zorn makes some strong >> claims for "Memento Mori"-- something about how the piece was a sort of >> breakthrough for him, etc. I've listened to this several times but always >> mind myself getting bored with it. Any ideas what Zorn is getting at with >> this composition? (and in his remarks about it?) Some music, even in the late 20th-century, really is meant to be listened to the old-fashioned way -- performed live by musicians in the same room as the listener. Having heard Memento Mori several times on tour, I cannot imagine getting anywhere near the full impact of the piece llistening to a CD, no matter how carefully. So much is gained from that extreme accoustic delicacy, the sense of community, the experience of seeing four musicians living through and sustaining the entire stretch of time, and the knowledge that you must listen to every moment because there is no repeat button. --steve www.stephendrury.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Stephen Fruitman Subject: The "Inauthentic" Jew? Date: 06 Oct 1999 16:46:44 +0200 The "quality and authenticy...of his very Jewishness", as Steve Smith pointed out, seems indeed to be the ill-chosen target of Adam Shatz=B4 NY Times attack on John Zorn. Albeit that he appends a disclaimer that ultimately, Zorn=B4s Jewishness will be "primarily of interests to scholars of ethnicity". Well, here=B4s one chiming in, who also happens to be a music lover with his own crotchety tastes and believes that the Radical Jewish Culture being produced over there is both radical and very Jewish indeed. The bee in Shatz=B4 bonnet I would loosely identify with the term "essentialism". Essentialism prefers "authenticity" (and what in the world is that, now?) - and which promises some sort of symmetry and completedness - over diversity, which leaves a lot of threads dangling and questions unanswered. He claims for instance that Zorn=B4s compilation tributes to musicians such as Marc Bolan and Serge Gainsbourg (wonder why he didn=B4t mention Bacharach - is his oeuvre somehow more blatantly Jewish?) reek of an "atavistic form of identity politics". However, as Zorn stated when I queried him good-naturedly via fax about the Bacharach-as-Great-Jewish-Musician postulate, he answered to the effect that Bacharach=B4s music need not be played by a klezmer band with payes a-flyin=B4 in order to be considered Jewish; in fact, he asked me, under the circumstances, isn=B4t Irving Berlin=B4s "White Christmas" just about one of the most Jewish cultural artefacts around? There are many levels to this argument, in my estimation, all of them quite fascinating. But foremost to the discussion at hand is the one which refutes Shatz=B4 self-appointed position as arbiter of Jewishness. Despite the fact that he dedicated the entire series of Masada studio CDs to Ahad Ha=B4-am (ideologue of cultural Zionism), I would classify Zorn as more of a follower of Micha Berdyczewski, a disciple of Ahad Ha=B4-am=B4s who took Nietzschean exception to his master=B4s own "essentialism": For AH, a radically new Jewish culture was to be based solely on _Jewish_ cultural artefacts, to wit, the texts of the Bible and the Prophets. No foreign influence was to be allowed, indeed, it was to be rooted out. MB on the other hand said, in so many words, that as a Jewish author and Jew, whatever I _do_ is Jewish. This allows for a more expansive, individualist interpretation of what "Jewishness" (or anythingness) is in age of fragmentation, creating community while effectively safeguarding against the exclusionary "tribalism" Shatz tut-tuts over. Yet despite all this ethnography and dabbling in the history of ideas, there is of course a value judgement made by Shatz on the music, that the result is "simply radical kitsch", which may well be the instigation for these speculations about Zorn=B4s motives in the first place. So in the fina= l analysis, the reader is left with the impression that all this ink has been spilled for no other reason than the fact that the writer likes Arto Lindsay=B4s music and deems it "authentic", while he does not care for Zorn=B4s, which he must wave off as "inauthentic" in order to lend his own taste some form of "verifiable" credibility. Stephen Fruitman Bj=F6rn Olsson, Inst. f=F6r id=E9historia, Ume=E5 universitet 901 87 Ume=E5 tel. 090-7867982 fax 143374 e-post: bjorn.olsson@idehist.umu.se - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linares Hugo Subject: Blomfield, Peaks and Troughs Date: 08 Oct 1999 12:14:28 -0300 People from Verge (Canada) has sent the October update and among others there is a Bomfield & Peaks cd. Who are they? What line do they lead in jazz? Thanks for any help. Hugo > ASC RECORDS England > > Blomfield, Jim Peaks and Troughs: music for quartet and septet > OI-ASC26-CD Jazz 5029716002226 ($28.00 CD) > Jim Bloomfield, piano; Andy Sheppard, soprano & tenor sax; Ben Waghorn, > tenor & soprano sax; Dave Goodier, bass; > Sam Brown, drums; Andy Hague, trumpet, flugelhorn, drums; Ken Figes, > alto sax; John Cornick, trombone. > > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: noise annoys Date: 08 Oct 1999 13:07:05 -0500 pardon the crosspost, but i was listening to a merzbow disc i picked up last night (on alien8, forget the title), and found myself thinking on a thread i wanna start. see, i used to hate merzbow a couple years ago. i bought and quickly sold a couple titles. but based on a recommendation, i picked up music for bondage performance and really enjoyed it. been opening up to some other noise too, while other things still leave me cold. like with any other music, i understand -- some like it, some don't. but i was trying to put into words last night what might have changed to make me able to listen to this stuff. what i'm wondering is, can anyone out there put their noise aesthetic into words. i can't, and i'm curious. kg - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: s~Z Subject: Re: noise annoys Date: 08 Oct 1999 10:29:41 -0700 kurt_gottschalk@scni.com wrote: >can anyone out there put their noise aesthetic into words. It serves as a sonic Ritalin for the swirling madness in my fragmented, tormented psyche. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Eric Martens Subject: Re: noise annoys Date: 08 Oct 1999 12:56:15 -0700 (PDT) --- kurt_gottschalk@scni.com wrote: what i'm > wondering is, can anyone out there put their noise > aesthetic into words. i > can't, and i'm curious. This is probably going to come out sounding really lame (ideas that sound good in yr head have a tendency to do that once you try to articulate them, I've noticed), but anyway . . . I've always regarded noise as kind of a way to get outside of myself . . . With most music you can devote a certain amount of attention to other activities (e.g., answering mail, clipping your toenails, cooking dinner, whatever) but noise, if it's at all engaging, pretty much demands full attention, or at least makes it hard to pay att'n to anything else , so listening to it is almost like some kind of meditation . . . For me, anyway, noise is about the only way I've found to really just tune everything out, almost like the only place I can get real silence is in the middle of all-encompassing noise. Did any of that make sense? Eric NP: Saint Etienne: "Places to Visit" (Does anyone know exactly what Jim O'Rourke did on this record?) ===== Disco Down: http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Plaza/8107 Music: http://www.mp3.com/discodown undo add event: http://www.mp3.com/undo "Reminds me of an art student who takes a pretty piece of pottery and smashes the hell out of it with a sledge hammer and says the pieces of pottery flying through the air have an artistic edge so it's art." Raw 42 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: more signs of the Times Date: 06 Oct 1999 10:40:42 -0500 Day 3 of the post Times fracas... philz, I think you're kinda right. My reactions at least are a little oversensitive and thinskinned. But when I read the piece, I didn't feel like I was just reading a bad article. I felt like I'd fallen for the bait-and-switch. I actually thought I was going to read a piece about Arto, someone I'd trust the Times more to talk about (he's got that whole multi-culti portrait of a scenic vista avant Buena Vista thing, plenty of what the Times likes to do, and I thought I'd just learn a little about his anxiously awaited new rekkerd). I turn to the jump, see a disarmingly huge photo of JZ's mug, and start to descend downhill with the writer. You're right again, philz (not trying to be facetious -- you really are). Much of the article, especially the first half, focuses attention on the accomplishments of deserving artists. But the writer is clearly setting us up for a fall. In the end he wants to add oomph to his position, that Zorn has no business feeling like an outcast Jew in New York City and that it's funny for him to use Jewish iconography and wear Jewish clothes. Steve's excerpts help show that, but the real probblem is in the overall construction of the piece, devolving from describing the music as "an almost palpable feeling of intimacy among strangers, of community, that goes beyond esthetic pleasure," to that last line about "Jewish kitsch." If that's really all Zorn's doing, why devote so much of the article to him. Why not run an enormous photo of someone who's work is valid? Or why not write about something like Roy Nathanson and Anthony Coleman's duet, which I like, but which I could see (at times) described as "Jewish kitsch." Kitsch is something cute you put on a shelf, and if that's all Masada is, then the author is in the end showing contempt for that group of strangers who feel a sense of community because of the music. (That group, in part being us. Like you, I was in that crowded room at the old Knit years ago, realizing as I stood in the dark listening to the sounds of a train the depth of the piece. But apparently what we shared, philz, was more like "Good Times" than "Roots.") Another odd statement here, as Steve clipped for us, is "By invoking his own history of oppression, he can assert his right to play the blues, without the racial envy that often burdens white musicians." This is freaked and stupid. Not to diminish the accomplishments of many many many brilliant black musicians, there is this odd idea in America that heartfelt, extemporaneous music is the property of people of African descent. The terms we use, like "blues" or "soulful," evoke African American traditions, and the popular conception is that everything comes from slave songs. As has been said here before, who came first decades or centuries ago has little to do with creative expression in the present, but still, improvisation is not a single tradition. Beethoven, Chopin and others used to improvise in concert. In fact, the improv segment that would follow a composed work was often considered to be the highlight of a performance. If you listen to European liturgical music (like Bach's violin solos), it seems likely (though I don't know) that expanding upon the work while playing could have been done. And I can't imagine that the klezmer tradition hasn't always included improvisation. African Americans have no doubt added more to the tradition of improvised music in America than any other cultural grouping, and you (not necessarily philz, but anyone) can decide what value you think that has as a race-based argument. But to say that anyone who picks up a horn without having sheet music in front of them owes a debt to African slaves is short-sighted. The tradition is far richer and more diverse than any one continent. - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Stefan Verstraeten" Subject: Re: contacting avant Date: 06 Oct 1999 17:58:40 +0200 Hi (sorry for the late response) The best thing to do is go to forced exposure www.forcedexposure.com and then go to the option browse by label and go to the avant label. The site mentions every avant release that is for sale and even gives a brief description. As far as I know the label doesn't have an official website like tzadik does... never understood why best wishes stefan verstraeten np frisell...good dog happy man..... one of his best albums in my opinion >From: "Bruno" >Subject: Request - help in contacting AVANT recodrs > >Hallo Zorn-heads > > just a quick coupla questions - I've been a bit of a Zorn fan for a while >now, and I'm looking to track down a few more of the Naked City albums. From >hitting the Zorn discog, it looks like the "Avant" label have a lot of the >stuff I'm after - so the questions are: > >1. does anybody know how to contact Avant records (an e-mail or WWW would be >nice) - I've tried to get local record stores to track them down, but they >have NO idea - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ken Waxman Subject: Re: more FMP news Date: 06 Oct 1999 11:13:16 -0400 (EDT) All very impressive new FMP stuff. But if the title Quartet is right for the new(er) CT session, who of the five musicians named *doesn't* play? Ken Waxman - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Knit Webcasts? Date: 08 Oct 1999 17:28:04 -0500 I see that the Knit is ostensibly Webcasting a Tacuma-Ribot-Zorn gig tonight. However, it's been months since I've actually found them to be Webcasting any even that I've tuned in for. Have they given up on Webcasting live entirely, or am I just having incredibly bad luck catching them? Is it worth planning to be home to hear this? *sigh* -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Whit Schonbein Subject: Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #766 Date: 06 Oct 1999 09:47:56 -0500 (CDT) On Wed, 6 Oct 1999, Zorn List Digest wrote: > 1.torture garden > 2.Grand guignol > 3.Absinth > 4.Radio > 5.Heretic > and I rate them this way 4.,5.,2.,1.,3, my ranking, fwiw: 4 (radio - favourite), 2 (first 1/2), 5 (rewards multiple listens - sounds like a series of free improvs with various combinations of the band members), 1 & 2 (second 1/2 of 2; there is a lot of overlap with torture garden and grand guignol; the latter has many of the same songs as the former (perhaps even the same recordings - torture garden is on shimmy disc, not avant); torture garden is also only 30-something minutes long; grand guignol is closer to an hour or 70min), 3 (absinthe - not sure it's my least favourite, just the least listened to - as nick said, it's ambient noises/drones). cheers, whit - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: illusion of safety Date: 08 Oct 1999 17:21:53 -0500 riding the crest of the noise comments. interesting stuff. for me, i think i'm beginning to understand what eno meant by music as wallpaper. i used to always think it was just facetious, but now i get it (even if merzbow ain't the sort of wall covering eno'd be interested in -- i'm not sure). meanwhile, i'm wondering what anyone might teach me about illusion of safety. jim o'rourke was involved at some point, yes? i got 'bad karma' and listened to it once. i'll listen once more, and that might be all i can take. i was already in a bad mood when i spun it first (plus i was reading the new acme comics, double downer fun), so maybe i overreacted. learn me please. kg - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: tired of what the times thinks, but... Date: 05 Oct 1999 19:39:18 -0500 Scott, your comments are interesting, and I basically agree. What you might have missed is that I said "the piece seems to say." I wouldn't put unique strictures on Jewish artists (although some cultures contain histories which can be dramatically used if an artist so chooses). The Times piece seems to want to hold Zorn responsible for something more than an African American playing klezmer, a Polish Jew playing son or the son of an American missionary appropriating samba. Zorn, because his background matches his stylings, is deemed kitschier than Don Byron holding a rubber chicken. np: The Jam "Start!" >From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com other folks can dabble in >whatever ethnic musics they want, the piece seems to say, but Jews have a >special obligation to represent their own culture in a certain way -- even >if >that way is never stated Kurt, pardon if I took your comments out of context, or missed something, but what makes you think this? - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mark Corroto Subject: NYT started it.... Date: 06 Oct 1999 12:45:41 -0500 At the risk of assasination and censure: My wife made an astute observation regarding the Times piece Zorn's career is tracking the same path as Spike Lee's preaching to the converted is boring enlightening the uninformed is much more interesting Sure the biography of MAlcolm X had to be made into a movie As a book it moved me, as a film it bored the shit outta me But Spike has a mission not to entertain but to hold up an entire people Is Zorn pushing himself into being a LEADER OF HIS PEOPLE? Do you want to be led? Who are his people? Did John Coltrane approach music like this? I don't think so.... - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Matthew Ross Davis Subject: Re: noise annoys Date: 08 Oct 1999 13:35:34 -0400 > wondering is, can anyone out there put their noise aesthetic into words. i > can't, and i'm curious. Though I don't listen to "noise bands", I think I might be able to comment at least a bit on noise aesthetic. Mine, I believe, comes from a desire to enjoy the sound simply as it exists - the "noise"-like pieces to which I have enjoyed listening often contain an extremely interesting conglomeration of sounds which both tug and divide my sonic attention and ultimately challenge my sonic comprehension, which is something I love. I will put on a disclaimer here, however - one reason I don't think I enjoy "noise bands" as much as other "noise" types of things (John Cage's "Cartridge Music" or Zorn's wind machine thingy, whatever the title of that is) is a matter of amplitude - interesting conglomerations of sound and noise don't need to be loud to be engaging, and in fact sometimes become more unintelligible with increasing amplitude. But maybe that's a different aesthetic altogether. -- ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||/Matthew Ross Davis||| |||||||||||||||||||||artswire.org/mrd||||||||||||||||||| |||||||||||||||metatronpress.com/mp3|||||||||||||||||||| ||||||||||||||||||||||||mp3.com/mrd||||||||||||||||||||| - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Nvinokur@aol.com Subject: SAL SALVADOR Date: 06 Oct 1999 08:45:27 EDT BEBOP GUITARIST, JAZZ EDUCATOR SAL SALVADOR DIES AT 73 Sal Salvador, the guitarist whose over 50-year career included important stints with Stan Kenton, as well as important university music posts, died Sept. 22. - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Craig Rath Subject: Re: illusion of safety Date: 08 Oct 1999 19:51:44 -0500 At 05:21 PM 10/8/99 -0500, you wrote: > >meanwhile, i'm wondering what anyone might teach me about illusion of safety. >jim o'rourke was involved at some point, yes? i got 'bad karma' and listened to >it once. i'll listen once more, and that might be all i can take. i was already >in a bad mood when i spun it first (plus i was reading the new acme comics, >double downer fun), so maybe i overreacted. learn me please. > I also picked up Bad Karma and haven't quite been able to get into it, but the rest of the stuff I've gotten by them has been great, and I'll probably try to give Bad Karma more of a chance sometime soon. Three other things to try would be "Of & The" and their contributions to two compilations, "Invisible Domains" on Malignant Records (MRCD0001) which also features Voice of Eye, Maeror Tri, Lull, Yen Pox, and others, and "Guru Means Slayer of Darkness" on Manifold (MANCD07), which also has Hands To and Beequeen. These are all very good. I'll have to try Bad Karma again. The more I think about it I probably was too harsh. I mean, I didn't like Fushitsusha the first time I heard them either, and now look at me. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ryan Novak Subject: unintentional irony Date: 08 Oct 1999 12:45:15 -0700 (PDT) >> Zorn's probably on to something good but he may >>be over-zealous >Yet another Jewish reference apparently. I wish I were so smart, didn't realize the irony of my choice of words until I checked out a dictionary. But I just meant it in the generic form not... Zealot: n. A member of a fanatical Jewish party (A.D. 6-70) in almost continual revolt against the Romans. Always learning... ---Ryan Novak ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Caleb T. Deupree" Subject: Re: illusion of safety Date: 08 Oct 1999 21:36:48 -0400 At 05:21 PM 10/8/99 -0500, kurt_gottschalk@scni.com wrote: > >meanwhile, i'm wondering what anyone might teach me about illusion of safety. I strongly recommend Of & The (Soleilmoon) if you like deep drones. Water Seeks its own Level is more abrupt noisy changes, but Of & The is excellent. -- Caleb Deupree cdeupree@erinet.com It is pretty obvious that the debasement of the human mind caused by a constant flow of fraudulent advertising is no trivial thing. There is more than one way to conquer a country. -- Raymond Chandler - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mike Baktin Subject: Re: noise annoys Date: 08 Oct 1999 22:07:37 -0400 >I will put on a disclaimer here, however - one reason I don't think I enjoy >"noise bands" as much as other "noise" types of things (John Cage's "Cartridge >Music" or Zorn's wind machine thingy, whatever the title of that is) is a matter >of amplitude - interesting conglomerations of sound and noise don't need to be >loud to be engaging, and in fact sometimes become more unintelligible with >increasing amplitude. But maybe that's a different aesthetic altogether. Well, I think this points to one of the central aspects behind the noise aesthetic: volume (as in "loudness") is still antithetical to serious art. Whenever I'm browsing the noise section, I'll almost always chuckle to myself when confronted with the intentionally childish, inane, usually pornographic artwork on the cd covers. I believe one of the main assets of being a noise musician is being able to sleep at night (so to speak) knowing you create highly-challenging music while at the same time not being associated with anything snobby, stuffy, or "avant-garde" (and I'm obviously referring to its negative connotations). I mean, when's the last time you ever thought Merzbow's music was a despicable example of elitism? However, I'm not saying noise musicians don't take themselves seriously . . . there's just something terribly alluring and liberating about being labelled a "sonic terrorist" . . . a league of their own, not necessarily a higher one though . . . Which is probably why if someone like Jim O'Rourke ever referred to himself as a noise musician (among other things) I'd probably laugh and spill milk out of my nose. If you can understand my meaning here, you'll realize I'm saying something positive about Mr O'Rourke. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: SUGAR in their vitamins? Subject: Re: illusion of safety Date: 08 Oct 1999 18:58:39 -0700 (PDT) On Fri, 8 Oct 1999, Caleb T. Deupree wrote: > At 05:21 PM 10/8/99 -0500, kurt_gottschalk@scni.com wrote: > >meanwhile, i'm wondering what anyone might teach me about illusion of safety. > > I strongly recommend Of & The (Soleilmoon) if you like deep drones. Water > Seeks its own Level is more abrupt noisy changes, but Of & The is excellent. "Bad Karma" is a return to the old sound of IoS in the early cassette days (we're talking 1980s) when this kind of disjointed, noisy and sample-driven stuff was considered both experimental and "industrial". IoS is Dan Burke and anyone who is hanging out with him at the time. Jim O'Rourke was in the band for a while. looking over all their releases, there is a great deal of variety. pretty much, any CD you can find is worth checking out. the older vinyl and cassette material is going to be more difficult to track down. hasta. Yes. Beautiful, wonderful nature. Hear it sing to us: *snap* Yes. natURE. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: more signs of the Times Date: 06 Oct 1999 10:40:42 -0500 Day 3 of the post Times fracas... philz, I think you're kinda right. My reactions at least are a little oversensitive and thinskinned. But when I read the piece, I didn't feel like I was just reading a bad article. I felt like I'd fallen for the bait-and-switch. I actually thought I was going to read a piece about Arto, someone I'd trust the Times more to talk about (he's got that whole multi-culti portrait of a scenic vista avant Buena Vista thing, plenty of what the Times likes to do, and I thought I'd just learn a little about his anxiously awaited new rekkerd). I turn to the jump, see a disarmingly huge photo of JZ's mug, and start to descend downhill with the writer. You're right again, philz (not trying to be facetious -- you really are). Much of the article, especially the first half, focuses attention on the accomplishments of deserving artists. But the writer is clearly setting us up for a fall. In the end he wants to add oomph to his position, that Zorn has no business feeling like an outcast Jew in New York City and that it's funny for him to use Jewish iconography and wear Jewish clothes. Steve's excerpts help show that, but the real probblem is in the overall construction of the piece, devolving from describing the music as "an almost palpable feeling of intimacy among strangers, of community, that goes beyond esthetic pleasure," to that last line about "Jewish kitsch." If that's really all Zorn's doing, why devote so much of the article to him. Why not run an enormous photo of someone who's work is valid? Or why not write about something like Roy Nathanson and Anthony Coleman's duet, which I like, but which I could see (at times) described as "Jewish kitsch." Kitsch is something cute you put on a shelf, and if that's all Masada is, then the author is in the end showing contempt for that group of strangers who feel a sense of community because of the music. (That group, in part being us. Like you, I was in that crowded room at the old Knit years ago, realizing as I stood in the dark listening to the sounds of a train the depth of the piece. But apparently what we shared, philz, was more like "Good Times" than "Roots.") Another odd statement here, as Steve clipped for us, is "By invoking his own history of oppression, he can assert his right to play the blues, without the racial envy that often burdens white musicians." This is freaked and stupid. Not to diminish the accomplishments of many many many brilliant black musicians, there is this odd idea in America that heartfelt, extemporaneous music is the property of people of African descent. The terms we use, like "blues" or "soulful," evoke African American traditions, and the popular conception is that everything comes from slave songs. As has been said here before, who came first decades or centuries ago has little to do with creative expression in the present, but still, improvisation is not a single tradition. Beethoven, Chopin and others used to improvise in concert. In fact, the improv segment that would follow a composed work was often considered to be the highlight of a performance. If you listen to European liturgical music (like Bach's violin solos), it seems likely (though I don't know) that expanding upon the work while playing could have been done. And I can't imagine that the klezmer tradition hasn't always included improvisation. African Americans have no doubt added more to the tradition of improvised music in America than any other cultural grouping, and you (not necessarily philz, but anyone) can decide what value you think that has as a race-based argument. But to say that anyone who picks up a horn without having sheet music in front of them owes a debt to African slaves is short-sighted. The tradition is far richer and more diverse than any one continent. - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: illusion of safety Date: 09 Oct 1999 01:44:40 -0500 On Fri, Oct 08, 1999 at 05:21:53PM -0500, kurt_gottschalk@scni.com wrote: > meanwhile, i'm wondering what anyone might teach me about illusion of safety. The one performance I went to of theirs, some years ago, was the single most painful nonmedical experience I had -- until I saw the Haters, whose concert I escaped after approximately 15 seconds, my hearing only returning many minutes later. -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Daniel L Brown" Subject: noise etc. Date: 09 Oct 1999 03:18:55 -0400 Maybe to shed some light on the (problem with) Merzbow/noise thread... I used to listen to the noise stuff, but don't any longer. I took in both the Japanese scene and the American scene until I became disintrested in them and haven't felt like re-establishing my aquaintance with it since. Here's why: 1) To me, there's way too much similarity from one Merzbow album to the next. It's not so much that what he's doing is -bad-, but it is -samey-. Certianly some people shy away from his stuff simply based on what hey hear (and that shoudn't surprise anyone...), but there seems to be very little variation from disc to disc. Here's an analogy: Imagine if evey Evan Parker album that existed was nothing but solo soprano saxophone. It would be interesting for three or four albums, but lose it's charm quickly after that. There wouldn't be much surprise when a new album came out - and that's how I see Merzbow. '1930' is one of the (very) few Tzadik albums I don't plan on buying. 2) There's very little room for interplay even when other musicians/performers are invited on board. The collaborative CD with Merzbow and Gore Beyond Necropsy has a few isolated moments of semi-ironic humor (as well as some of the most well-titled tracks this side of the Boredoms -- "A Horse Named Rectal Anarchy"?!), but not many. It's just another huge monolithic and impenetrable wall of sound. I'm sure my dislike of GBN doesn't help ths situation, but I gave the album a fair shot and it just didn't do anything. 3) There is a huge lack of imagination beyond the top few noise bands out there. Why Masonna claiming he uses frequencies that cause headaches and Namanax claiming he equalizes his albums at levels that will damage stereo equipment becomes the focal selling point to their CDs, I don't know (a lack of effort in making the sounds?), but there's no sense of new ground being broken. Perhaps there is no new ground to break. In America, the noise scene is even worse. At least in Japan the noise is linked to the (very Japanese) concept of eroticism, where in America it is linked to the (very American) concept of violence. Just some thoughts from someone who immersed himself in the noise scene to see what he would learn. More ofetn then not, band like Dog and Cock ESP were, above anything else, disappointing. There's not much else I can say. Dann - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: parry@macconnect.com Subject: That NY Times verbiage (& Jewel) Date: 09 Oct 1999 03:55:37 +0100 I suppose the author of that piece didn't realize that the sniping tone undermined any points he was trying to make. The David Byrne essay, on the other hand, was a rather refreshing change from the usual Times music trend story. As much as I enjoy reading other sections of the Times, I get very little out of its music coverage. Those trend/theme pieces are almost always pompous, ponderous and pontifical, not to mention about 20 inches longer than they need to be. Maybe the paper doesn't really believe music is a worthy topic in and of itself, and that's why even concert reviews have to be larded with lengthy discussions of the artists' supposed socio-cultural significance. Sometimes it's difficult to tell whether the writer enjoyed a concert or not, since description of the event is secondary to some clever semiotic thesis. At the same time, the Times appears to be so afraid of appearing elitist that it devotes enormous amounts of space to fawning analyses of ephemeral pop effusions by the likes of Alanis Morissette. But at least they didn't splash Ricky Martin all over the front page for winning an MTV award, as did the fine "news"paper I work for. Meanwhile, all of this is relatively low on my scale of outrage compared to the mortifying spectacle of Merle Haggard dueting with Jewel on the Country Music Association awards. I think, or at any rate, I'd like to think, his manager has to have drugged him. Parry Gettelman briefly un-lurking - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Oger Subject: Re: Free Flutists? Date: 09 Oct 1999 13:25:47 GMT > Possibly a silly question, but, aside from the arguable example of > Robert Dick, are there any free players around who stick exclusively > to the flute? Not someone like Braxton who sometimes plays flute and > sometimes plays free, but...the Derek Bailey of the flute. > > Brian Olewnick In France, we have a very good flautist (thanks Jon, you learn me the correct spelling :-) : Jerome Bourdellon. He played and made a very good CD with Joe Mac Phee. He played with Jim Denley and Machine for making sense too. Jacques Oger - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Knutboy@aol.com Subject: Free Flutists? Date: 09 Oct 1999 12:11:57 EDT Maybe David Toop? - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: That NY Times verbiage (& Jewel) Date: 09 Oct 1999 12:08:47 -0500 BTW, Byrne to some extent rehashes points made well by Jody Diamond in her article 'There is no "they" there', available online at http://www.lib.virginia.edu/reserve/cscan/gaunt/diamond.there.pdf -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: Re: Charlemagne Palestine Date: 09 Oct 1999 13:40:26 EDT In a message dated 10/6/99 5:55:07 PM, tpratt9@yahoo.com writes: << Lastly, does anyone know anything about the two Palestine albums on Barooni (Barooni 14 & 19) listed in the selective discography of the liner notes? I'm assuming they're long out-of-print LPs. Am I right? >> nope, they're both CDs. Four Manifestations On Six Elements is Barooni 14 and Godbear is Barooni 19. not sure if they're in print or not. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Caleb T. Deupree" Subject: Re: noise etc. Date: 09 Oct 1999 16:22:14 -0400 At 03:18 AM 10/9/99 -0400, Daniel L Brown wrote: > >2) There's very little room for interplay even when other >musicians/performers are invited on board. The collaboration with Christopher Heeman on Streamline, Sleeper on the Edge of the Abyss, is a very pleasant exception to this general rule. Heeman seems to have had the final say (i.e., he remixed Merzbow), but this album is very atmospheric and almost ambient in nature. Merzbow listeners will certainly find some of the original herein, but to a much greater extent it's Heeman's product. -- Caleb Deupree cdeupree@erinet.com It is pretty obvious that the debasement of the human mind caused by a constant flow of fraudulent advertising is no trivial thing. There is more than one way to conquer a country. -- Raymond Chandler - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Nervenet@aol.com Subject: Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #771 Date: 09 Oct 1999 20:06:28 EDT Someone wrote: <<> wondering is, can anyone out there put their noise aesthetic into words. i > can't, and i'm curious.>> Like a couple other respondants here, I don't much listen to noise bands anymore. I got into the genre, such as it is, before it had crystallized into the scene that it is now. It was somewhere in the late 80's, but most of the music that I sought out was of late 70's or early 80's vintage - No Wave stuff mostly, plus Zorn, Frith, and Laswell projects of varying couth, and The Residents and Snakefinger (not noise bands, I know, but certainly cut from the same cloth) and Neubauten leading the way into that mess. Reading Lester Bangs' stuff (now he has a great definition of his impulse to enjoy noise, can't find my book or I'd quote it for you) also provided an impetus to seek out more - Miles's Rated X and Ornette Coleman and Coltrane; John Cage, Xenakis and Stockhausen. When I check out Boredoms offshoots and some pieces on Avant, I just think "well, that sounds cool." Although the sonic specifics may be different, the impulse seems the same as some of the above artists - the Boredoms don't tell me anything that DNA didn't - and Arto went on to make even better music IMO (although I grant that the Boredoms are responsible for two of the best concerts I've ever seen). I have friends who are heavily into the noise thing who are jealous that I've seen Zorn and play me newer stuff they think I'll dig along those lines and again, it all sounds good, but strangely familiar. i think that my detachment goes more along the lines of this argument: <> than the three that Daniel brown laid out: Not enough variety from album to album, although this can be a curse as well; not enough active interplay with musicians - this doesn't bother me; and lack of imagination - I don't pay enough attention to notice. I'd rather hear Cecil Taylor, or Ayler, or Coltrane, or Zorn. It just seems to me like the music is subtler and more complex than a lot of what friends loan me to check out lately. And Ascension is pretty damn loud, as is Miles's Rated X, but both are deadly serious - standing in contrast to this statement (with which i don't fully agree): <>. Anyway, i don't come to this discussion with fully-formed arguments. Simply a feeling that noise bands that I hear are acting off the same impulses that drove noisy bands yesterday. (Early) Red Crayola, Mars, Merzbow, the guy(s?) who wrote Maldoror - they all come from a similar position to my ears. I shared that position once and feel like I'm not in tune with it anymore. But I'm still willing to try to hear music in this vein that will tell me something new.... Patrick Brown Nervenet@aol.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: nickmc@home.com Subject: Can anyone tell me what Prelapse's album is like? Date: 09 Oct 1999 19:42:51 -0600 I know some have said naked city influenced, but I would like to know a little more if I could, thanks alot Nick McCormick - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Artur Nowak" Subject: Masada @ Warsaw Summer Jazz Days, Poland Date: 10 Oct 1999 15:02:35 +0200 For those of you who already have recordings from this year edition of WSJD: I wrote down all titles of the tunes performed by Masada String Trio, Bar Kokhba and Masada and uploaded them to http://www.emd.pl/emd/en4/artists/m/masada/live/19990625.htm Just one song played by Bar Kokhba that evening sounds new to me, it was the only one introduced by Zorn, the title is "Kol Nidre" (or whatever the spelling is) - is it published anywhere? Or is it really new? Listening to these tunes I noticed that few notes from "Katzatz" sound like faster version of "Lakum" - these are probably the most similar Masada tunes. One more question: does Zorn speak a lot during live performances? While he was introducing Bar Kokhba band he said "The handsome Marc Ribot!... He should change his clothes often though!" (Ribot played one evening before and wore the same suit :-) __________________________________________________________________ Artur Nowak [arno AT emd.pl] www.emd.pl - Discography of Bill Frisell - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Brian Olewnick Subject: Delusion on disc Date: 10 Oct 1999 11:18:10 -0400 Just a note to let listers know that Harry Partch's masterwork, 'Delusion of the Fury' is finally available on disc (on Innova, as 'Enclosure 6'). Perhaps many have come to know Partch's music only over the last decade and have been unable to hear this work, issued on Columbia in 1972. If so, run, do not walk, to pick this up. IMHO, one of the single greatest works of the century. The remastering is excellent with somewhat clearer sound, greater stereo separation and, at least with regards to my stereo, the emergence of a handful of instrumental parts I was unable to hear previously. There's also a fine essay by Danlee Mitchell and intriguing notes by Partch. My only complaint is that the bonus album of Partch demonstrating and discussing his instruments (among other things) was not included here (though his prologue and epilogue, beautiful statements of aesthetic philosophy, are printed on the inside back cover--still, one does miss Partch's stentorian voice). A deep, beautiful, endlessly inventive work of art. Brian Olewnick - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Nvinokur@aol.com Subject: Re: Masada @ Warsaw Summer Jazz Days, Poland Date: 10 Oct 1999 11:38:09 EDT Kol Nidre is a based on cantorial melodies from the Yom Kippur and Rosh Hashanah service written around the time of the first Temple over 2000 years ago. It is probably in the public domain by now. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Nudeants@aol.com Subject: Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #766 Date: 10 Oct 1999 14:20:02 EDT As someone who's listened to each Naked City album since its release, the debut and Radio are by far the most expendable to me. Grand Guignol, Heretic, and Absinthe are masterpieces. Absinthe is the one that has held up best over time for me, actually; I'd say it's by far the darkest. Don't forget Leng T'Che, either. I think the hardcore pieces on GG that are the repeats from Torture Garden are better placed on GG; they're much more dark and menacing (obviously) I'm sure this has been oft-tread, but I'm relatively new to the list and I wanted to get in my cent. matt mitchell - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: User384726@aol.com Subject: Great Sax Session Date: 10 Oct 1999 16:22:08 EDT I was wondering what people thought of zorn's playing on this disk. He is unquestionably the most recognizable voice on this album and I think he's an interesting addition to the more straight ahead voices on the album but as he also sounds like a fish out of water due to the lack of interplay between the rhythm section (particularly the drums). Any thoughts? - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Daniel L Brown" Subject: Re: Zorn List Digest V2 #766 Date: 10 Oct 1999 23:24:18 -0400 > As someone who's listened to each Naked City album since its release, the > debut and Radio are by far the most expendable to me. Grand Guignol, > Heretic, and Absinthe are masterpieces. Absinthe is the one that has held up > best over time for me, actually; I'd say it's by far the darkest. Don't > forget Leng T'Che, either. I think the hardcore pieces on GG that are the > repeats from Torture Garden are better placed on GG; they're much more dark > and menacing (obviously) Just a side thought, but has anyone ever noticed how much "Fleur du Mal" from Absinthe sounds like "Dark River" from Redbird? And that Zorn used the same sample in "Artemesia Absinthium" as he did in "Propolution" on the Nani Nani album? A pair of things I've figure out over repeated listenings. =-) Dann - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: SUGAR in their vitamins? Subject: Charlemagne Palestine Date: 10 Oct 1999 21:03:02 -0700 (PDT) someone asked if his Barooni releases are still available. as far as i know, "Four Manifestations On Six Elements" is still in print. Barooni releases tend to go in and out of print. hasta. Yes. Beautiful, wonderful nature. Hear it sing to us: *snap* Yes. natURE. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: month'o'mazzacane, night 6 Date: 11 Oct 1999 01:25:35 EDT the saga continues... I missed the Loren/Joe Morris night on Friday to go see a couple of Michael Snow movies (Wavelength and Back and Forth; if you get a chance to see Wavelength, grab it). but I was there on Saturday to see Haunted House for the second time in the festival (repeated disclaimer: the only Haunted House CD is on my label, Erstwhile). the guest star tonight was William Hooker, who never met a drum set that he didn't want to pound the hell out of. Hooker opened, with Donald Miller, Blaise Siwula, and a pianist whose name I don't remember. although I wasn't there for a lot of this set, from what I saw, I think it's safe to say that it was on the loud, unsubtle side. eventually that ended, and Haunted House took the stage, but the spirit of Hooker was still in the air, with the set opening with a fairly long percussion solo by Neel Murgai. now, I've seen this band play probably 10 or 12 times, and I've never seen Neel do much more than add color in the background. Haunted House have never practiced ; they just get together to play gigs, so the fact that they're booked at Tonic six times this month should really help them develop. and much like the No Neck Blues Band, another NYC-based band, their performances are very different each time out, even if they play the same songs. anyway, Neel was eventually joined by Loren, who also seemed to think Hooker was still playing, playing in his loudest, wildest style. meanwhile, Suzanne Langille, the singer (and Loren's wife) was waiting patiently for her chance to add to the proceedings. eventually Loren and Neel slowed to a crawl, and they went into a gorgeous version of Only When You Sleep, the best version I've heard yet of that. the rest of the set seemed to alternate between the raucous, wilder parts and the slower, more dirgelike bluesy pieces. it was a bit uneven, but still pretty compelling. the two Mazzacane shows I'm most eagerly anticipating this week are the duo with longtime sparring partner Alan Licht on Wednesday. they haven't played together in about two years, and I think this one will be memorable. and on Saturday (10/16) is a potential classic, with Milford Graves, patron saint to the No Neck guys, doing a solo set, then Haunted House, then the No Neck Blues Band, with Loren probably jamming with them at some point. probably my two favorite NYC bands right now. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Taylor McLaren Subject: re: Naked City re-runs Date: 11 Oct 1999 01:25:48 -0400 MEEP! matt mitchell wrote: >I think the hardcore pieces on GG that are the >repeats from Torture Garden are better placed on GG... [HACK!] Only having heard a couple (or four, I suppose) of Naked City albums to date, I can't say that I'm even terribly sure that there's a pattern to spot in the first place, but *is* there some reason for the repetition of tracks from NC album to NC album? Having picked up the Black Box set before anything else, I was more than a tad disappointed to find out just how much of the Nonesuch debut disc was material that I had heard before... and now it looks as though I'm in for exactly the same treat if I ever decide to pick up _Grand Guignol_. What gives? Is there some profound conceptual logic behind this repetition, or are these duplicate tracks just label-to-label padding? -me (apologies if this is FAQ material) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: patrice schneider Subject: Re: Masada @ Warsaw Summer Jazz Days, Poland Date: 11 Oct 1999 11:18:42 +0200 Artur Nowak wrote: > > Just one song played by Bar Kokhba that evening sounds new to me, it was the > only one introduced by Zorn, the title is "Kol Nidre" (or whatever the > spelling is) - is it published anywhere? Or is it really new? > hi artur, "kol nidre" is the last piece on john zorn's tzadik release "the string quartets". patRice btw: i'll contact you again soon about the "emergency" live recording from switzerland! - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andreas Dietz" Subject: Re: Free Flutists? Date: 11 Oct 1999 12:29:38 CEST > > Possibly a silly question, but, aside from the arguable example of > > Robert Dick, are there any free players around who stick >exclusively > > to the flute? Not someone like Braxton who sometimes plays flute >and > > sometimes plays free, but...the Derek Bailey of the flute. > > > > Brian Olewnick > >In France, we have a very good flautist (thanks Jon, you learn me the >correct spelling :-) : Jerome Bourdellon. >He played and made a very good CD with Joe Mac Phee. > >He played with Jim Denley and Machine for making sense too. > >Jacques Oger > > Jim Denley is a very interesting flautist with a unique style too !! At the end of October he is on tour with the quintet LINES (Martin Blume, Phil Wachsman and others). Andreas Dietz ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Whit Schonbein Subject: milt jackson rip Date: 11 Oct 1999 09:35:05 -0500 (CDT) pardon if this is postmature - i'm on digest. subject line says it all. there's an article on the cnn website: http://www.cnn.com/US/9910/11/obit.jackson.ap/index.html whit - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Pratt Subject: Re: month'o'mazzacane, night 6 Date: 11 Oct 1999 07:48:34 -0700 (PDT) --- JonAbbey2@aol.com wrote: > but I was there on Saturday to > see Haunted House for > the second time in the festival While Jon was busy seeing Haunted House for the millionth time, I was up at Cooper Union listening to the Flux String Quartet perform all six hours of Morton Feldman's "String Quartet No. 2". Since there are no available recordings of the piece, I was not familiar with the music beforehand. But what I found was that the musical material and arrangements were very similar to "String Quartet (No. 1)" but that it had more of a block/cell structure like "Patterns In A Chromatic Field". Structurally, this piece is completely mindblowing - Feldman is an architect. Throughout the six hours, separate sections were stated and then reappeared later in a different form and context. Yet there was always new material being presented, so it was as if it were always propelling forward but always remembering what had happened before. Everything was *so* meticulous, detailed and delicate... I can't really grasp this thing yet. The piece is a living, breathing whale. There was a section about an hour long somewhere in the middle that moved me more than any music I can remember. If you ever get a chance to see this thing, don't be scared off by its length. It's an amazing bit of music. -Tom Pratt listening to: Folk Music of Nepal (World Music Library) ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Pratt Subject: Feldman Date: 11 Oct 1999 07:49:25 -0700 (PDT) --- JonAbbey2@aol.com wrote: > but I was there on Saturday to > see Haunted House for > the second time in the festival While Jon was busy seeing Haunted House for the millionth time, I was up at Cooper Union listening to the Flux String Quartet perform all six hours of Morton Feldman's "String Quartet No. 2". Since there are no available recordings of the piece, I was not familiar with the music beforehand. But what I found was that the musical material and arrangements were very similar to "String Quartet (No. 1)" but that it had more of a block/cell structure like "Patterns In A Chromatic Field". Structurally, this piece is completely mindblowing - Feldman is an architect. Throughout the six hours, separate sections were stated and then reappeared later in a different form and context. Yet there was always new material being presented, so it was as if it were always propelling forward but always remembering what had happened before. Everything was *so* meticulous, detailed and delicate... I can't really grasp this thing yet. The piece is a living, breathing whale. There was a section about an hour long somewhere in the middle that moved me more than any music I can remember. If you ever get a chance to see this thing, don't be scared off by its length. It's an amazing bit of music. -Tom Pratt listening to: Folk Music of Nepal (World Music Library) ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Nudeants@aol.com Subject: SIMILARITIES Date: 11 Oct 1999 11:07:55 EDT Fleur du Mal and track on Redbird do sound a like, though I think that's due to the common use of extremely soft and extremely low freuqncies on both track. I think its interesting how the same effect is achieved by different means (assuming the Absinthe track is electronic, which it does sound like to me) As for the Artemisia Absinthium sample, do you mean the 'buzzing' sound? I haven't listened to Nani Nani in a long time; I'll have to check that out. matt mitchell - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Nudeants@aol.com Subject: Re: Naked City re-runs Date: 11 Oct 1999 11:20:46 EDT I THINK that the deal is this: The first album came out, the one with the face-down dead guy on the front. I'm pretty sure that Grand Giugnol was to be the next one, but Elektra/nonesuch balked at the artwork. Somewhere in the meantime, out comes Torture Garden, with the 8 or so hardcore pieces from the first album and the hardcore pieces from GG. Then GG comes out as the first release on Avant. I'm positive that TG was before GG (in this country, at least) because I remember being surprised when I saw GG for the same reason you mentioned. Basically, the hardcore tracks on GG are TG minus the first album, in exactly the same order. I surmise that GG was how he intended it, but then how do you explain his re-release of TG in the Black Box? Oh well. If anybody has any corrections, feel free to flame my ass. :) matt mitchell - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Nudeants@aol.com Subject: Feldman rips Date: 11 Oct 1999 11:26:30 EDT Yes, I LOOVE Feldman. I've not heard iehter string quartet, but your description of what you saw is fairly similar to how I'd describe For Philip Guston, also a late piece, about four hours long. Lucky! matt mitchell - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: sonny shine Subject: Re: Naked City re-runs Date: 11 Oct 1999 08:33:38 -0700 (PDT) my brother has Torture Gardens. he says there's quite a bit of stuff on there from the self-titled naked city album. so the self-titled release WOULD HAVE been the first one, had Elektra/nonesuch not had a cow about it? hmmmm.... sounds plausable... but the artwork in Torture gardens isn't very amiable, either. sonny --- Nudeants@aol.com wrote: > I THINK that the deal is this: > > The first album came out, the one with the face-down > dead guy on the front. > I'm pretty sure that Grand Giugnol was to be the > next one, but > Elektra/nonesuch balked at the artwork. Somewhere > in the meantime, out comes > Torture Garden, with the 8 or so hardcore pieces > from the first album and the > hardcore pieces from GG. Then GG comes out as the > first release on Avant. > I'm positive that TG was before GG (in this country, > at least) because I > remember being surprised when I saw GG for the same > reason you mentioned. > Basically, the hardcore tracks on GG are TG minus > the first album, in exactly > the same order. I surmise that GG was how he > intended it, but then how do > you explain his re-release of TG in the Black Box? > Oh well. > > If anybody has any corrections, feel free to flame > my ass. :) > > matt mitchell > > - > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Peter Risser Subject: Floutist Date: 11 Oct 1999 09:52:07 -0700 (PDT) Obviously, half the members of the Zorn list already corrected this poor guy about the spelling of flautist, but after reading it it reminded me about how pissed I would get when I'd ask my mom how to spell something and she'd tell me to look it up in the dictionary. How's that going to help a third-grader trying to spell mneumonic? Anyway, I prefer: flute-player. Seeya, Peter ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: Floutist Date: 11 Oct 1999 13:12:53 -0500 On Mon, Oct 11, 1999 at 09:52:07AM -0700, Peter Risser wrote: > How's that going to help a third-grader trying to > spell mneumonic? Hmm... that would depend on whether he's trying to spell mnemonic or, perhaps, pneumatic :-) Trying to spell "mneumonic" would be a curious goal... -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Daniel L Brown" Subject: Re: SIMILARITIES Date: 11 Oct 1999 13:35:10 -0400 > Fleur du Mal and track on Redbird do sound a like, though I think that's due > to the common use of extremely soft and extremely low freuqncies on both > track. I think its interesting how the same effect is achieved by different > means (assuming the Absinthe track is electronic, which it does sound like to > me) Which is what I was trying to get at =-) Similar sound, Completely different means of achieveing it. No real matter, though - both are superb. > As for the Artemisia Absinthium sample, do you mean the 'buzzing' sound? I > haven't listened to Nani Nani in a long time; I'll have to check that out. No, the sound in question is the screeching, "sheet-metal" sound. I'm not sure how else to describe it, but if you have both Absinthe and Nani Nani, check it out. Dann - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Adrienne Alexander" Subject: sheet music Date: 02 Oct 1999 19:22:36 -0700 I"m looking for sheet music or lead sheets i can arrange for a string trio, (sheet music I do't have to arrange would be wonderful as well). "m looking for contemporary stuff (we are really sick of mozart, beethoven, and vivaldi, not that it isn't good) and i"m having a hell of a time finding it. any ideas? -adrienne - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Shlomo Weintraub Subject: Zorn Transriptions Date: 12 Oct 1999 12:18:15 +0200 Hi there, Is there anyone who owns Zorn Transcriptions? Please mail me, if you have any or if you know where I can get some. cu Shlomo - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Handley" Subject: Re: Zorn Transriptions Date: 12 Oct 1999 12:30:36 GMT _I_ made transcriptions of CLASSIC GUIDE TO STRATEGY, but no one can read them but me. ;-) -----s >Hi there, >Is there anyone who owns Zorn Transcriptions? >Please mail me, if you have any or if you know where I can get some. >cu Shlomo > > >- > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu Subject: Roulette, Fall Schedule Date: 12 Oct 1999 09:36:27 -0400 You can check out the complete schedule at: http://www.roulette.org but a few highlights include: 10/16 Robert Black, solo bass, performing works by Lang, Jaggard, Truax, Dreyblatt and Wolff. 11/26- 28 Derek Bailey with Zorn/Mori/Staley, Ibarra and d 'n' b. 12/3 Robin Holcomb 12/10 Jon Gibson/David Behrman Buncha folk I don't know but sound intriguing from the descriptions provided. Can anyone fill me in on: Michael Evans Marco Trevisani Tomoko Yazawa Clarence Barlow Jarryd Lowder - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: sumpthin w/ the server or ? Date: 12 Oct 1999 11:35:37 -0500 brilliant and insightful as i am, i'm still starting to get tired of seeing my old messages from the times furor days pop up over and over. i haven't heard this complaint from other people i write, and i've noticed other messages resurfacing repeatedly here as well. is something up with the listserv? jess wondering. kg - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: lmc/morris Date: 12 Oct 1999 11:50:14 -0500 filling the shoes of the esteemed jon abbey, i'll type a few words about the mazzacane morris duo at tonic friday night. billed as solos and duo, it turned out to be something slightly different. no solo joe, unfortunately. the eve started off with loren playing solo, very nice stuff of the quiet assault style (rather than his deep mellow) before he brought up percussionist ryan sawyer, who sat at half a kit and played very nice, sparse bits, very sympathetic to loren's playing. after a short while loren said, without looking up and without a mike, "we could use some poetry." steve dalachinsky joined them, but unfortunately wasn't miked either. i could hear him up front, but i doubt many could. they took a short break before the morris duet, which turned out to be not what i had expected. (the road to disappointment is paved with expectations.) i had pictured loren's wash with joe's fast lines combining to be a sort of electrified charlie parker with (12) strings. but joe seemed to be working a little to mesh with loren, and the first of the two long pieces they did ended up muddied for it. joe stuck to the lower register and picked less, blurring notes and getting lost a little in loren's sound. maybe that isn't a fair criticism, but my heart was set on the clean/dirty dichotomy i had imagined. after the first song, loren said with a funny grin, "you wanna play another tune?", and the second piece opened with more ground covered between the two. by the end of that piece, i was really enjoying it, so in the end it was saved i guess. the weekend ended with another nice pairing, at the alterknit. the gold sparkle trio was joined by ken vandermark, and ken and charles waters (w/rhythm section) met up on two really great pieces, first w/ kv on clarinet and cw on piano, and then kv on clarinet w/ cw on alto sax and clarinet. don't know how much the trio practiced w/kv ahead of time, but after loren's duets with ryan and joe, it was another example of two players really listening to what each other were doing. i also got bit by mosquitos twice over the weekend, so i expect my brain will start swelling shortly. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Peter Risser Subject: Prelapse Date: 12 Oct 1999 09:28:16 -0700 (PDT) Somebody asked what the Prelapse album was like. It's certainly Naked City influenced, seeing as they do a bunch of Naked City covers, so that's one side. But they seem to be less... jazz or funk oriented, and more rock/prog oriented. Some of their own stuff reminds me of, maybe Dr. Nerve's skin, maybe a little Pantera (though I don't exactly know because I don't listen to them, but how I imagine they sound). I dunno. I like it. On this same note, I really like the new Korekyojin, the new project featuring the Ruins, plus a guitarist. To me, it's a more logical extension of the Ruins than some of the other stuff they've done, although it's less choppy and more proggish in parts, as well as some more free playing. Anyway, that doesn't sound like a resounding endorsement, but I do think it's really good. It's a nice change from the Ruins stuff that I think is starting to get a little stale. Anyway, that's my two cents. Seeya, Peter ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Caleb T. Deupree" Subject: Re: Roulette, Fall Schedule Date: 12 Oct 1999 18:33:25 -0400 At 09:36 AM 10/12/99 -0400, brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu wrote: > > Buncha folk I don't know but sound intriguing from the descriptions > provided. Can anyone fill me in on: > > Clarence Barlow First time I've seen this guy's name in years. Barlow wrote an ultra-complex 'piano' piece with a completely unpronounceable name, which was recorded on Wergo in two versions, one played by a human (the virtuosic Herbert Henck), and one played by a computer. A short biographical blurb from one of the Wergo Computer Music cds says that he's worked with in various European computer studios since 1969, that he helped to found 'Initiative Music and Informatics Cologne', and that an interview with him appears in issue 9(1)(1985) of Computer Music Journal. Sort of a cross between Ferneyhough and Stockhausen. -- Caleb Deupree cdeupree@erinet.com It is pretty obvious that the debasement of the human mind caused by a constant flow of fraudulent advertising is no trivial thing. There is more than one way to conquer a country. -- Raymond Chandler - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Martin_Wisckol@link.freedom.com (Martin Wisckol) Subject: Query to Harmon Kardon, Onyko CD owners Date: 12 Oct 1999 17:50:04 -0700 I have a Harmon Kardon (sp?) carousel CD changer. I have problems and I'm wondering what kind of luck other owners are having. My first one went back under warranty (three months after buying it) with laser and random-play problems. It was determined it couldn't be easily fixed, so I was given a store credit. I got the same brand, same model. Two months later, problems with the carousel (spinning madly, refusing to stop) and random play. Back in under warranty. If they decide not to fix this one, I'm pretty tempted to use my credit to get something else -- perhaps an Onyko (the store is Circuit City). But if other HK owners have had good luck with there's, I could change my mind. I'd be grateful for response from HK and Onyko owners. Martin - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Orangejazz@aol.com Subject: Memento Mori, Etc.. Date: 12 Oct 1999 23:29:42 EDT About the Memento Mori question posed a few digests back, I think it requires a lot of isolated thinking, in that, you can't look at it in context with 20th century classical, or even Zorn's past compositions, because it is simply seperate..It's hard to explain the emotion in this piece, because I can't fully describe where it's coming from, but I guarantee you that it's present. Zorn balances the Sado-masochism and a certain tenderness that seems to never be the focus of his pieces. Maybe I'm way off here, but there's got to be some other people on the list that were as moved by this piece as I? Also, if there's anyone familiar with FilmWorks IV, I'm wondering if Zorn's quoting Erik Satie on the piece Maogai (another severely overlooked brilliant piece), does anyone else notice, or are my synapses totally inept? from, matt - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andreas Dietz" Subject: GOD MOUNTAIN Label Date: 13 Oct 1999 15:33:12 CEST Hi, does anyone know if these CDs with Marc Ribot are still available (distribution for Europe?) or out of print? Is the label still active or went out of business? GOD MOUNTAIN GMCD-001 Optical*8 GOD MOUNTAIN GMCD-004 Optical*8*2/The Last Waltz From Distorded Honky-Tonk GOD MOUNTAIN GMCD 007 Slut thanks in advance Andreas Dietz ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: noise and news, again Date: 13 Oct 1999 10:42:34 -0500 maybe i should be doing p.r. for the village voice, because the 'noise annoys' thread would have been a nice little piece of hype. kyle gann, who i like although i'm often not familiar with his subject, does a good piece on borbetomagus in the current issue (cover date 10/19), in which he talks about his reactions to noise. it mirrors some of the responses i've seen here, at least in part. the idea of music that you can't get outside of is really appealing to me -- sort of like intensely oppressive wallpaper, to extend eno's analogy. here's a clip: "The conceit is to hear music from the inside, to be so pervaded by the noise that you can't remain separate from it; the total sound mass changes, and you barely notice how. It's a foreground/background reversal, music turned inside out. To make it literal, the noise must be inside your head and unescapable." gann talks mostly about the borbs, of course, but also brings up xenakis, amacher and branca. ok, so he likes his noise on the arty side. it's still a nicely written piece, and he doens't bring up anyone's religion. surprisingly enough, the knight-ridder chain did a nice job of capturing zorn's aesthetic as well, recognizing that even if zorn names everything for his heritage, you can write about other things. it's not too long, so i'll paste it on. What's new in record racks Knight Ridder Newspapers (KRT) JOHN ZORN "String Quartets" (Tzadik) 3 stars I doubt the 20th century has produced a more omnivorous musician than John Zorn. There hardly seems a genre of music anywhere with which he isn't conversant, from all manner of jazz, classical, rock and film music, to traditional Islamic music, Japanese noise bands, Jewish music, ad infinitum. Zorn, to paraphrase critic Fred Kaplan, is a cultural scavenger, rummaging through the history of recorded sound and assimilating whatever he finds valuable. At 45, Zorn is best known as an avant-garde jazzman, but he's been composing classical music for decades. As more of these pieces find their way onto CD, Zorn's voice seems to grow in stature. Of his four string quartets, three were commissioned by the Kronos Quartet. They trace an unpredictable arch, from the downtown-collage aesthetic of "Cat O'Nine Tails" (1988) through the dark and disturbing surrealism of "The Dead Man" (1990) to the philosophical and hermetic density of "Memento Mori" (1992) to the strikingly emotional lament "Kol Nidre" (1996), reflective of Zorn's rediscovery of his Jewish roots. "Cat O'Nine Tails" is a Tex Avery-cartoon inspired riot: 14 minutes sliced into countless stylistic nuggets, epigrams and quotes - from Berg to bluegrass - that abut each other like randomly spliced film clips. It works because Zorn is so clever and because his eclecticism is so genuine; he never seems to be slumming. A suite of 13 miniatures, "The Dead Man" echoes the skull on the CD cover, with nightmarish textures, disjointed clusters and evocative dissonances and exploding dynamics. Zorn considers each movement a soundtrack to a short S/M scenes. At the other extreme, the eight minutes of "Kol Nidre" unfold in one long homophonic sigh of humanity. Zorn's melody carries a Jewish inflection, but its intensity of expression has roots in late Beethoven, especially the cavatina from the Op. 130 quartet. I have no idea what Zorn's next string quartet will sound like, but I can't wait to hear it. -Mark Stryker - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Theodorus@webtv.net (Theodorus Klaase) Subject: Masada Date: 13 Oct 1999 14:28:23 -0400 (EDT) This is a question for people who have 5 or more Masada albums... Which do you like best? Please email me privately, Thanks.... ...Just curious. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: SUGAR in their vitamins? Subject: Re: GOD MOUNTAIN Label Date: 13 Oct 1999 11:34:45 -0700 (PDT) On Wed, 13 Oct 1999, Andreas Dietz wrote: > does anyone know if these CDs with Marc Ribot are still available > (distribution for Europe?) or out of print? Is the label still active or > went out of business? God Mountain still exists. the release schedule is a bit slow at times as Hoppy has many projects he juggles, including eX-Girl (which has been fairly popular lately). > GOD MOUNTAIN GMCD-001 Optical*8 > GOD MOUNTAIN GMCD-004 Optical*8*2/The Last Waltz From Distorded > Honky-Tonk > GOD MOUNTAIN GMCD 007 Slut these should still be in print. hasta. Yes. Beautiful, wonderful nature. Hear it sing to us: *snap* Yes. natURE. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: flouting mneumonics Date: 13 Oct 1999 15:05:44 -0500 feeling vindicated for my spelling gaff, i will leap to peter's defense. 'mneumonic' is a very different thing than 'pneumatic', and i'm impressed that he was even trying to spell it in third grade. oddly, like 'onomatopoeia', there's no easy way to remember it. kg - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Zorn Scores? Date: 13 Oct 1999 15:46:39 -0500 I remember a long while back there was talk of a forthcoming book of Zorn scores. Was it ever published? -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Aaron Chee-Kean Chua Subject: Re: Floutist Date: 14 Oct 1999 07:01:51 +1000 (EST) i know i'm a little slow jumping on this thread, but how about just plain 'piper' :) a little of topic but just out of curiosity, has anyone else noticed that the remastered_ kind of blue_ has changed the order of the tracks? ie flemenco sketches comes after all blues cf original lp. also in the description in the liner notes, they've flipped the descriptions with the titles.( you can just make out what was written on the original cover.) also has anyone been able to match up all the titles with the strips on the spy v spy cd? there are the same no of panels and i can make out certain connections. ( this sounds SO obsessive ;) ) reagrds, aaron - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: what are we, mainstream? Date: 13 Oct 1999 18:24:04 -0500 continuing on the subject of media coverage, or of how i bide my time at work, a pretty good (if pretty basic) piece on patton and mr. bungle just moved over the associated press wire. email me private if you want a copy. (kurt.gottschalk@scni.com) i'll send it tomorrow. kg - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Julian" Subject: Re: flouting mneumonics Date: 14 Oct 1999 09:31:10 +1000 > feeling vindicated for my spelling gaff, i will leap to peter's defense. > 'mneumonic' is a very different thing than 'pneumatic', and i'm impressed that > he was even trying to spell it in third grade. oddly, like 'onomatopoeia', > there's no easy way to remember it. Isn't the word actually 'mnemonic'? My dictionary has no mention of 'mneumonic' but that could be my dictionary... incidentally i think the example 'pneumatic' was used not because it has any relationship to the other word, but just because both words would be difficult to spell or even to find in a dictionary if you had never heard them before. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Brian Olewnick Subject: Muhal in NYC, 10/30 Date: 13 Oct 1999 22:06:38 -0400 Nice looking concert by the Muhal Richard Abrams Experimental Band on Saturday, October 30th, 8:00 PM, at the NY Society for Ethical Culture, 2 West 64th St. in NYC. Check out this impressive line-up: Violin Leroy Jenkins Trumpets Leo Smith Frank Gordon Trombone George Lewis Reeds Roscoe Mitchell Joseph Jarman Henry Threadgill Wallace McMillan Pianos Muhal Amina Claudine Myers Bass Leonard Jones Percussion Thurman Barker Reggie Nicholson Yow! Tix $15 ($8 Students and Seniors), info (212) 594-7149 Brian Olewnick NP: Yanks/Sox - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Lang Thompson Subject: Re: noise and news, again Date: 14 Oct 1999 00:59:56 -0400 I did an interview with Borbetomagus sometime around '86 or '87 (in Birmingham Alabama of all places; we can thank Davey Williams and LaDonna Smith for some activity in the South) and one thing that always stuck in my mind was a comment that they don't play noise since noise is something you didn't intend to produce. LT Lang Thompson http://www.tcf.ua.edu/wlt4 Full Alert Film Review (formerly World Cinema Review) http://wlt4.home.mindspring.com/fafr.htm - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Al Tabor Subject: RE: noise annoys Date: 13 Oct 1999 11:27:07 -0700 I'm interested in how we construct meaning from incoherence and the constant stream of injury that the world hands any living system. The edge between sound that appears patterned to me and sound that does not appear patterned, or the way that pattern emerges out of noise, evokes that for me on a visceral level. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Pratt Subject: Re: GOD MOUNTAIN Label Date: 13 Oct 1999 23:43:58 -0700 (PDT) --- SUGAR in their vitamins? wrote: > On Wed, 13 Oct 1999, Andreas Dietz wrote: > > > does anyone know if these CDs with Marc Ribot are > still available > > (distribution for Europe?) or out of print? Is the > label still active or > > went out of business? > > God Mountain still exists. > the release schedule is a bit slow at times > as Hoppy has many projects he juggles, including > eX-Girl (which has been fairly popular lately). There are three new God Mountain discs listed in the latest DMG e-mail update: Hoppy Komiyama/Hiroaki Sugawara/DJ Force - Saboten "unique electronic-samples-turntable action soundscapes" Panicsmile - We Cannot Tell You Truth Again "yet another brutal Ruins offshoot post-punk power trio with Tatsuya Yoshida on drums" Viddekazz - Maybe Tomorrow "twisted & throttling post-punk rock" -Tom Pratt ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard@rcvs.org.uk Subject: Re: Memento Mori, Etc Date: 14 Oct 1999 11:13:58 +0100 > Maybe > I'm way off here, but there's got to be some other people on the list that > were as moved by this piece as I? I heard it about a year ago at the Barbican in London. I thought that isolated moments were very effective, but didn't think it held together too well over the whole length. I'd like to reserve final judgement, as these things often make a lot more sense after several hearings, when the compositional signposts can become a little more clear. However, I always thought JZ liked to work without architectural forms; MM sounds like it ought to have some great formal framework which appeared to be absent. Moment to moment it can be very beautiful, but I must confess I found myself looking at my watch. The problem may be that it needs listening to again and again, but as someone's already pointed out, those tiny, high-pitched harmonics are going to need a top-drawer hi-fi system. Rich (musings): reviews (with MP3s) of new improv, free jazz and avant-electronic releases. http://come.to/musings.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: dennis summers Subject: Prelapse Date: 14 Oct 1999 07:38:09 -0700 I just picked up the Prelapse album, and I'd have to say that it sounds like Naked City lite. It doesn't have the edge of NC; it's humor is broader and it doesn't have Eye, (I guess there really is a difference between people's screaming). yours in zornocity --ds ***Quantum Dance Works*** ****http://members.home.net/dennisqdw/**** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: =?iso-8859-1?q?A?= Subject: Noise Date: 14 Oct 1999 09:38:43 -0700 (PDT) Since there´s an ongoing noise discussion I might throw in my 1/50th of an American buck: When I used to play in bands we always ended our rehearsals with a bunch of grindcore-ish noise. When we started getting tired of the music, we longed for the moment we ended the songs and the noise started. About a year later the band dissolved and me & 2 other members formed a project, on which we just made noise and noise and noise for however long the rehearsal would last. It´s all pretty much with instruments, distorted vocals/keyboards, pretty insane. The thing is, we compiled some portions of rehearsals, mastered them and we´re about to put out a demo tape, as soon as we get the artwork. The funniest thing is that this project has gone much further than any of the other previous bands I was in. And it´s top secret, the identity of us, because I play in a pretty well known locally punk band and the noise conglomerate has fascist themes (all a big joke of course) and since most people in Peru ain´t aryan well...we might get some backlash Anyway, I´m digressing here. The thing about noise is that we all find it very cathartic. There´s nothing like rehearsing after college finals because we really release a lot of tension...Does anyone want our demo??? A ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: sonny shine Subject: Re: Noise Date: 14 Oct 1999 10:31:49 -0700 (PDT) ah ha. ahhaahha! i'm editing my replies. ANYway, i used to play in a band called Windell Greene. a lot of nirvana, janes addiction-type music. but we had one song we called the JAM. it always changed. but the one constant was the blues riff our bassist would play. this was where i would get to rant about whatever i wanted. no form, no direction. just spit out what was on my mind. it was a great release. we did one concept album that was a lot of keyboards and wild effects on the vocals and guitars... it was called "A concept album by windell greene."... i'm no longer in the band due to distance, and a personal fued between me and the new bassist... but the guitarist wants me to come back for a while to do another concept album. YES. i might be interested in hearing your "noise". actually, i have a 'project' that i do the same thing. some spoken word, some sampling.. a lot of wierd sounds. it's called a project, cuz i'm doing it all by myself... if you're intrested, i could sell you a copy. or maybe a demo sampler.(free cassette) lemme know. it would be so great to get this project out and running. strecth it's legs, so to speak. later, sonny. --- A wrote: > Since there´s an ongoing noise discussion I might > throw in my 1/50th of an American buck: > When I used to play in bands we always ended our > rehearsals with a bunch of grindcore-ish noise. When > we started getting tired of the music, we longed for > the moment we ended the songs and the noise started. > About a year later the band dissolved and me & 2 > other > members formed a project, on which we just made > noise > and noise and noise for however long the rehearsal > would last. It´s all pretty much with instruments, > distorted vocals/keyboards, pretty insane. The thing > is, we compiled some portions of rehearsals, > mastered > them and we´re about to put out a demo tape, as soon > as we get the artwork. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: sonny shine Subject: Re: Prelapse Date: 14 Oct 1999 10:30:30 -0700 (PDT) well i can tell when Eye is screaming. i love his vocals. they rock. Eye is da man! sonny --- dennis summers wrote: > I just picked up the Prelapse album, and I'd have to > say that it sounds like > Naked City lite. It doesn't have the edge of NC; > it's humor is broader and > it doesn't have Eye, (I guess there really is a > difference between people's > screaming). > > yours in zornocity --ds > ***Quantum Dance Works*** > ****http://members.home.net/dennisqdw/**** > > > - > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: King Wilson Subject: Dawn of a New Age Date: 14 Oct 1999 13:14:01 -0500 You know it's gonna be a wacky year when Mike Patton turns up on CNN...... http://www.cnn.com/SHOWBIZ/Music/9910/14/mikepatton.ap/ (it's the same A.P. article that Kurt offered up yesterday) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve Smith Subject: Melancholy Cecil Date: 15 Oct 1999 01:00:48 -0400 Well, my fellow Zornlisters, I'll be straight with you. I'm waaaayyyy too tired tonight to write anything of substance about much of anything... And yet, I just can't go to bed tonight without mentioning that there's something else altogether going on during the hour-plus duration of the new FMP Cecil Taylor issue, 'Melancholy,' which dates from late September 1990. Maybe later I'll talk about specifics. But right now these are a few of the things that are keeping me awake long enough to post this message: - During the first piece, at about 11 minutes in, there's a fine quartet section by Evan Parker, Barry Guy. Tony Oxley and CT. - During the second piece, at about 17 minutes in, there's a stretch of music that to me sounds as close to Steve Reich as CT's ever likely to get in this or any other lifetime. - The third piece is just brilliant so far. About 4 minutes ago I wanted to write about the first few minutes. But at this point, as the section just gets better and better, I realize that I can't say anything of substance. - It's a big band, all right. But you always know which horn is Evan. And that's a very fine thing. And if I absolutely HAVE to say something negative, well... Barry Guy could have been miked more naturally, so he didn't sound so bloody "amplified." In other words, it's yet another fascinating CT disc from FMP well worth owning... And boy am I glad about that. Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com NP - duh... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: sonny shine Subject: Re: Dawn of a New Age Date: 15 Oct 1999 06:46:11 -0700 (PDT) but a well written article, no less. whoda thunk patton was 30. well. that does make good sense, donnit? sonny. --- King Wilson wrote: > You know it's gonna be a wacky year when Mike Patton > turns up on CNN...... > > http://www.cnn.com/SHOWBIZ/Music/9910/14/mikepatton.ap/ > > (it's the same A.P. article that Kurt offered up > yesterday) > > > > - > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott" Subject: Sale/exchange update Date: 15 Oct 1999 15:13:33 +0100 I've just added a whole bunch of stuff to my sale/trade list inc Paul Miller, Bill Laswell, Pharoah Sanders, Oval, To Rococo Rot and others. You can check it out at: http://www.burntweeny.freeserve.co.uk/list.html Thanks Scott Russell White Noise For experimental events in Scotland http://www.burntweeny.freeserve.co.uk - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jason Tors Subject: Free Grass Date: 15 Oct 1999 11:27:18 -0800 A while back I checked out this band called free grass at the old office, I believe tony trishka was in the band, the rest was a blur. I was pretty well blown away by the music, now I am trying to track some of this material down, can anyone help me find recordings? thanks! J - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ben Wallace Subject: RUINS in SF this Sunday! Date: 15 Oct 1999 10:51:31 -0700 (PDT) 2nd JAPANESE NEW MUSIC FESTIVAL The Japanese New Music Festival is back from its European Tour in '97 to bring an even more powerful performance. The three musicians will now perform in an overwhelming five different projects. Sunday, October 17, 1999, 9 pm $7 cover, all ages Club Cocodrie 1024 Kearny St (near Broadway) San Francisco, CA 94133 (415) 986-6678 YOSHIDA TATSUYA solo (drums, vocal, keyboard, guitar) A non-digital, "purely physical" performance of one man performing 4 instruments simultaneously. Full of experimental, improvisational spirit, and eclectic musical structure, the performance defies common sense. TSUYAMA ATSUSHI solo (guitar, vocal) Tsuyama has traveled the world and accumulated the traditional styles of Europe and Asia. He adds his own interpretations and lyrical sense to create a beautiful but odd "fake traditional" musical world. AKATEN (yoshida, tsuyama) Experimental and humorous unit formed by Yoshida/Tsuyama in '95. They bring their interests to life, by using cameras/scissors/zippers/pet bottles as percussion, simulating bird calls, or even turning a Sumo broadcast into a song. ZUBIZUVA-X (yoshida, tsuyama, sasaki) Polyrhythmic acappella vocal trio formed by Yoshida in '95. Running the gamut from Gregorian chant and Tuvan throat-singing to doo-wop, hardcore and looney tunes. Essential listening for those interested in the outer limits. X is a special formation for this tour. RUINS (yoshida tatsuya, sasaki hisashi) This amazing drum/bass duo are masters of quick-change, stop/start tempos, time signatures and textures. Music is an amalgam of hardcore/ progressive rock/contemporary music/free jazz. Their explosive and intricately composed tunes are sung in a peculiar language of their own invention. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: morricone 1900 Date: 15 Oct 1999 14:23:11 -0500 Has anyone heard "The Legend of 1900" by Morricone? Sounds interesting, even if Roger Waters is on it. clip below: RECORDS: Capsule Reviews of Recent Releases By J.D. Considine (c) 1999, The Baltimore Sun If George Gershwin, Scott Joplin, Louis Armstrong and Erich Korngold had somehow gotten together and collaborated on a soundtrack, perhaps we might have gotten something as delicious as the score Ennio Morricone created for "The Legend of 1900" (Sony Classical 67672). A gifted mimic, Morricone mixes bits of ragtime, jazz and Tin Pan Alley pop to give the music a suitably vintage feel (the Gershwin gloss in the main theme is worth the price of the CD). But as much as those elements add color to the music, the meat is Morricone's themes, which - as with his work for "The Good, the Bad, and The Ugly," "Once Upon a Time in America" and "The Mission" - are melodically rich and emotionally resonant. Add in cameos by singer Roger Waters and guitarist Edward Van Halen, and this becomes a must-hear album. Distributed by the Los Angeles Times-Washington Post News Service - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: DRoyko@aol.com Subject: free grass Date: 15 Oct 1999 16:56:14 EDT In a message dated 99-10-15 14:32:11 EDT, you write: >A while back I checked out this band called free grass at the old office, I >believe tony trishka was in the band, the rest was a blur. I was pretty >well blown away by the music, now I am trying to track some of this >material down, can anyone help me find recordings? Please post any reply to the list, or e-mail me as well--I follow Trischka and pickers of his ilk pretty carefully, but I've not herd specifically of "Free Grass" myself. Dave Royko - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "John Thomas" Subject: RE: Cecil Taylor's _Melancholy_ Date: 15 Oct 1999 16:24:59 -0500 Just wanted to contribute some more initial impressions on this very interesting record...I also got _Digger's Harvest_ with Schlippenbach & Oxley but I will wait to comment on that until I have a few more listens under my belt... Steve Smith wrote: [snip] >>And yet, I just can't go to bed tonight without mentioning that there's >>something else altogether going on during the hour-plus duration of the >>new FMP Cecil Taylor issue, 'Melancholy,' which dates from late >>September 1990. I wholeheartedly agree with Steve here, I heard many things on this CD I have not heard from Cecil before, yet at the same time, there were the expected similarities from previous performances. In the latter case, the ending of the third section (Sphere?), reminded heavily of the _Looking_ piece but for larger ensemble, particularly Cecil's playing. >>Maybe later I'll talk about specifics. But right now these are a few of >>the things that are keeping me awake long enough to post this message: >>- - During the first piece, at about 11 minutes in, there's a fine quartet >>section by Evan Parker, Barry Guy. Tony Oxley and CT. >>- - During the second piece, at about 17 minutes in, there's a stretch of >>music that to me sounds as close to Steve Reich as CT's ever likely to >>get in this or any other lifetime. >>- - The third piece is just brilliant so far. About 4 minutes ago I >>wanted to write about the first few minutes. But at this point, as the >>section just gets better and better, I realize that I can't say anything >>of substance. >>- - It's a big band, all right. But you always know which horn is Evan. >>And that's a very fine thing. >> Steve has picked up on a whole bunch of stuff I have missed on first listen but here are some other things that I really found interesting: * The great use of themes and structures in the horns in the first part. * The Taylor/Oxley/Guy trio when the rest of the group drops out, esp at the beginning of the second piece. * Use of lots of space in the music, even with ensemble, it really doesn't blare as much as some of the previous ensembles. * I would say Evan Parker is not particularly prominent on this disc and personally I found that refreshing. But I am still greatly looking forward to the quartet disc with Parker, Oxley, Taylor & Guy! >>And if I absolutely HAVE to say something negative, well... Barry Guy >>could have been miked more naturally, so he didn't sound so bloody >>"amplified." I found Guy very difficult to hear in the full ensemble passages, even in some of the smaller groupings similar to hearing William Parker's contributions on the Feel Trio discs. >>In other words, it's yet another fascinating CT disc from FMP well worth >>owning... >> >>And boy am I glad about that. Yup, seconded. Very engrossing. I can see why Cecil complained (I think this is mentioned in the liner notes) this hadn't been released sooner. John - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dgasque@aol.com Subject: Re: free grass Date: 15 Oct 1999 17:52:32 EDT In a message dated Fri, 15 Oct 1999 5:05:00 PM Eastern Daylight Time, DRoyko@aol.com writes: > In a message dated 99-10-15 14:32:11 EDT, you write: > >A while back I checked out this band called free grass at the old office, I > >believe tony trishka was in the band, the rest was a blur. I was pretty > >well blown away by the music, now I am trying to track some of this > >material down, can anyone help me find recordings? > > Please post any reply to the list, or e-mail me as well--I follow Trischka > and pickers of his ilk pretty carefully, but I've not herd specifically of > "Free Grass" myself. > > Dave Royko > > - I sightly remember a one-shot CD by a group called "Psychograss" that had Darryl Anger (sp?) and others, possibly Trischka (sounds like something he'd be involved in)- supposedly a bluegrass band doing Hendrix, Blue Cheer, and other 60's heavies. I looked for this in vain- never came across it. Nice to see some bluegrass chatter here, as un-Zornlike as it may be. I've always considered bluegrass musicians to be among the best musicians around. Anybody heard the Czech bluegrass band Bruha Trava? (sp?, again...) Supposedly this genre has a _huge_ following in that country- Czechnya/Slovenya, to be proper...Amazing to see how this form of music has a worldwide following. =dg= - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jason Tors Subject: Re: free grass Date: 15 Oct 1999 18:09:42 -0800 The free grass performance was really interesting, it was like it sounds, free bluegrass, I always had this perception of bluegrass as so rooted down in that plodding beat, it was quite liberating for the pickers [I think] to not have those constraints. It sure sounded like they were having fun! >I sightly remember a one-shot CD by a group called "Psychograss" that had >Darryl Anger (sp?) and others, possibly Trischka (sounds like something >he'd be involved in)- supposedly a bluegrass band doing Hendrix, Blue >Cheer, and other 60's heavies. I looked for this in vain- never came >across it. > >Nice to see some bluegrass chatter here, as un-Zornlike as it may be. >I've always considered bluegrass musicians to be among the best musicians >around. > >Anybody heard the Czech bluegrass band Bruha Trava? (sp?, again...) >Supposedly this genre has a _huge_ following in that country- >Czechnya/Slovenya, to be proper...Amazing to see how this form of music >has a worldwide following. > >=dg= > >- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dan Given Subject: Re: Melancholy Cecil Date: 15 Oct 1999 18:47:48 -0400 >Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 01:00:48 -0400 >From: Steve Smith >Subject: Melancholy Cecil > >Well, my fellow Zornlisters, I'll be straight with you. I'm waaaayyyy >too tired tonight to write anything of substance about much of >anything... > >And yet, I just can't go to bed tonight without mentioning that there's >something else altogether going on during the hour-plus duration of the >new FMP Cecil Taylor issue, 'Melancholy,' which dates from late >September 1990. >(a bunch of stuff snipped) I just got this a couple of days ago, and haven't had a chance to listen yet. But, I did take it in to the radio station yesterday and play section 2. That part of it, at least, is, as Steve says, another fascinating recording of Cecil Taylor. > >And if I absolutely HAVE to say something negative, well... Barry Guy >could have been miked more naturally, so he didn't sound so bloody >"amplified." > Agreed. He sounds awful on the piece that I have listened to.I haven't heard section 1, with the quartet segment, so can't say how Guy sounds there. The liner notes say there were three shows at the time -- the large ensemble, solo, and the Taylor/Parker/Oxley/Guy quartet --and calls it an "FMP trilogy". Does anyone know if there are plans to release these other shows, or are they more referring to the probability that FMP sponsored the concerts? We can only hope. I also picked up the other new FMP release -- Alexander von Schlippenbach and Tony Oxley. I love it!! There is a lightness to this recording, something I haven't really pulled from the handful of Schlippenbach recordings I have (a couple of the trio, some Globe Unity.) For me, it calls to mind Monk, Duke, and early CT -- in theory, not sound. It may have something to do with Oxley's junk percussion sound though, which is mostly clattering metal sounds. Dan - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve Smith Subject: Re: Cecil Taylor's _Melancholy_ Date: 15 Oct 1999 20:22:42 -0400 Thanks for your own insights, John. > >>- - During the second piece, at about 17 minutes in, there's a stretch of > >>music that to me sounds as close to Steve Reich as CT's ever likely to > >>get in this or any other lifetime. I rather overreacted here. I can't hear this anymore. I must have *really* been tired. Basically it's just a section where the massed horns repeat a melodic cell over and over. It's not that unusual in Cecil's larger ensemble music, and not especially Reichian at all. Minus one for me... > * I would say Evan Parker is not particularly prominent on this disc > and personally I found that refreshing. But I am still greatly looking > forward to the quartet disc with Parker, Oxley, Taylor & Guy! Agreed on both counts. Even if Evan doesn't dominate, he's always recognizable. And that quartet will be one to savor. > >>And if I absolutely HAVE to say something negative, well... Barry Guy > >>could have been miked more naturally, so he didn't sound so bloody > >>"amplified." > > I found Guy very difficult to hear in the full ensemble passages Yes, but when he is exposed, the sound is just not very attractive. He sounds way too amplified to my ears in such places as the trio and quartet passages that open Sphere No. 3. I bought two other discs last night that I've spent most of today listening to: 'Ethiopiques 3' and 'Musique du Nordeste - Volume One, 1916-1945,' both from Buda in France, and both completely fascinating in very different ways. The first is from the much-discussed series of releases of Ethiopian pop from the early '70s, and if this disc is indicative I'll be going back for more. The second compiles, in very clean transfers, music of the Nordeste tradition of early 20th century Brazil, particularly the birth of embolada and frevo. Remarkable stuff. Damn do I love Other Music... Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com NP - Atlanta/NYMets, top of the first, and Cecil Taylor, "Sphere No. 3," 'Melancholy' - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve Smith Subject: The last words on the New York Times? Date: 15 Oct 1999 20:32:09 -0400 This Sunday's New York Times Arts & Leisure section (October 17 issue) contains three very considered responses to the Zorn piece by Adam Shatz in the "Letters to the Editor" column. Those by Dave Douglas and Bill Milkowski seek to politely but very firmly rebuke Shatz for the tenor of his piece, with Milkowski in particular going to great length to mention all of the work Zorn has done to create a community and Douglas lamenting the fact that Shatz had not followed through on his premise but had instead veered into an ad hominem attack. The third, by Larry Blumenfeld, restores to their original context the quotes that Shatz borrowed from his own Jazziz interview. All three are worth reading, especially if you followed the debates here on the Zornlist. Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com NP - Atlanta/NYMets, end of the first, and Cecil Taylor, "Sphere No. 3," 'Melancholy' - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Steve Smith Subject: Re: Cecil Taylor's _Melancholy_ Date: 15 Oct 1999 20:37:46 -0400 Steve Smith, in a continuing monologue, wrote: > > >>- - During the second piece, at about 17 minutes in, there's a stretch of > > >>music that to me sounds as close to Steve Reich as CT's ever likely to > > >>get in this or any other lifetime. > > I rather overreacted here. I can't hear this anymore. I must have *really* > been tired. Basically it's just a section where the massed horns repeat a > melodic cell over and over. It's not that unusual in Cecil's larger ensemble > music, and not especially Reichian at all. Minus one for me... Or maybe I meant to type "third piece," since there actually *is* a passage between 17 and 19 minutes where the high-pitched woodwinds do play a rather minimalist arpeggio figure more than a few times (although now, somewhat more awake, it sounds more like a Glass figure than one from Reich). Whatever. I'll stop trying to redeem myself now. ;-) Steve Smith ssmith36@sprynet.com NP - Atlanta/NYMets, top of the second, and CT, "Sphere No. 3," 'Melancholy' - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: infolit Subject: set digest Date: 16 Oct 1999 04:12:45 +0200 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Stephen Fruitman Subject: Review: Aki Onda X 2 Date: 16 Oct 1999 12:42:23 +0200 Review: Aki Onda, _Beautiful Contradiction_ (All Access); _Un Petit Tour_ (All Access) A new voice emerges from Japan and immediately stakes its claim to a territory all its own. Thirty-one-year-old Aki Onda has paid his dues in elektro, noise and hiphop, as well as being a sought-after producer, and now emerges as an ambitious soundscaper of great gifts. A mature hand guides the sounds culled from collaborators as diverse as Europeans Simon =46isher Turner, Blixa Bargeld and No=EBl Akchot=E9 and brilliant Japanese players like Jyoji Sawada, Kazutoki Umeza and Onda himself (cassette recorder, sampler, programming), with a handful of American avantjazz names like Steven Bernstein and Ben Perowsky thrown in for good measure. Recorded in London, Tokyo, New York and Paris, his first solo CD _Beautiful Contradiction_ has the atmosphere of an imaginary movie soundtrack. Opening with "Chrysanthemum", an ambient piece of great beauty which then gives way to the sampler/flugelhorn/guitar duel of "Red Light", the record thus embarks on a fifty-minute journey featuring an array of styles and top-flight musicians so diverse yet so cohesive, and including occasional vocals in German (the wonderfully suggestive "In Windungen" sung by Bargeld), Turkish and English (a slightly seedy story of doomed love growled forth by Linda Sharrock). "Rosemary" is a remarkable composition featuring the trilling of glassharps propelled along a bed of electronics by snare drum, while "Petal" is a short jazz chamber piece that wouldn=B4t sound out of place on one of John Zorn=B4s Masada ensemble recordings. _Beautiful Contradiction_ dwells at the crossroads of acoustic and electronic music, extracting the essences of both and producing something quite unique in the process. The final impression is that of a restless cosmopolitan in love with sound, not merely for its own sake but for its narrative properties. The second and latest release, _Un Petit Tour_, is unavoidably more of a _h=F6rspiel_ due to the preponderance of narration - reflections on love penned mostly by Onda and told in French by several voices. The spoken words are linked a kind of free-jazz scarlet thread, with the trumpet of Bernard Vitet (a little bit Hassell, a little bit Kondo) and the programming of Onda dominating. A delicate solo on the Japanese sanshin by Jyoji Sawada (who by the way is all over _Beautiful Contradictions_, playing a wide array of instruments and even composing one of its tracks) leads off the track "O=F9 es-tu donc?", before other instruments begin scraping away at its fragile veneer. The music on this release is much more jagged than on _Beautiful Contradiction_, though the smokey, late-night guitar/trumpet duet which closes the album is just lovely. Both are packaged in equally handsome digipaks, with the latter featuring a gallery of photographs by Ayako Mogi which serve well as a visual complement to the sounds within. Aki Onda is an artist worth keeping a very close eye on in the years to come. The Japanese label All Access does not appear to have a web presence yet, but can be contacted via fax at +81 -3-5466-4581. Stephen Fruitman Bj=F6rn Olsson, Inst. f=F6r id=E9historia, Ume=E5 universitet 901 87 Ume=E5 tel. 090-7867982 fax 143374 e-post: bjorn.olsson@idehist.umu.se - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: Re: Review: Aki Onda X 2 Date: 16 Oct 1999 10:54:29 EDT In a message dated 10/16/99 6:46:00 AM, stephen.fruitman@idehist.umu.se writes: << Thirty-one-year-old Aki Onda has paid his dues in elektro, noise and hiphop, as well as being a sought-after producer, and now emerges as an ambitious soundscaper of great gifts. >> I didn't get too much out of Beautiful Contradiction myself, but one of Onda's earlier projects, Audio Sports, put out an incredibly prescient trip-hop CD in 1992 called Era Of Glitterring Gas (also on All Access), and featuring, on most tracks, the trio of Onda, Nobukazu Takemura (now of Thrill Jockey fame), and Yamatsuka Eye as the rapper, believe it or not. there are other Audio Sports records with different personnel, including one EP with Otomo and Greg Osby, I believe, but I've only ever heard this one. I love this record. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Theodorus@webtv.net (Theodorus Klaase) Subject: Prelapse... Date: 16 Oct 1999 11:51:16 -0400 (EDT) How does one get a copy of this Prelapse CD? -Theodorus www.freeyellow.com/members7/theodorus/index.html - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: ctonelli@trentu.ca Subject: Re: Dawn of a New Age Date: 16 Oct 1999 13:36:58 -0400 (EDT) Perhaps, it's not so strange, aren't Bungle and CNN both owned by Time-Warner? > --- King Wilson wrote: > > You know it's gonna be a wacky year when Mike Patton > > turns up on CNN...... > > > > > http://www.cnn.com/SHOWBIZ/Music/9910/14/mikepatton.ap/ > > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AnneJan van Aperloo Date: 17 Oct 1999 00:22:23 +0200 Hi, Is there anybody who reads this digest who wants to trade live Naked City cd-r's. I have got a lot to trade AnneJan Hok.Pop@net.HCC.nl - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Nvinokur@aol.com Subject: Re: Dawn of a New Age Date: 16 Oct 1999 18:32:53 EDT In a message dated 10/16/99 1:39:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ctonelli@trentu.ca writes: > Perhaps, it's not so strange, aren't Bungle and CNN both owned by > Time-Warner? Maybe Mr. Bungle can play the national anthem at the World Series in Atlanta - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "wetboy" Subject: 4 the mp3 listeners in the group Date: 16 Oct 1999 20:38:40 -0700 i didn't post it, but the quality is xcellent. Dave Douglas Quartet Dave Douglas Trumpet Mike Formanek Bass Guy Klucevek Accordian Mark Feldman Violin Recorded at the Knitting Factory in 1998 Encoded at 192/44.1 9 tracks in all "and you, young skywalker. we will watch your career with great interest." criterion ld/dvd info: http://www.geocities.com/sunsetstrip/vine/9374 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "wetboy" Subject: oh yeah i should tell u where its posted Date: 16 Oct 1999 20:51:14 -0700 u c? the yankees get pummelled and i lose all sense of reality. the dave douglas quartet mp3s were posted in alt.binaries.sounds.mp3.bootlegs whoops "and you, young skywalker. we will watch your career with great interest." criterion ld/dvd info: http://www.geocities.com/sunsetstrip/vine/9374 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Brian Olewnick Subject: Robert Black at Roulette Date: 17 Oct 1999 09:49:23 -0400 The several spheres of the NYC music avant garde often seem to be mutually exclusive. The Bang on a Can crowd, perhaps more representative of the music school view of things, rarely interacts with the Zornian downtown bunch. Their marathon extends a few feelers in that direction (a nominal avant jazz act or two every year) but, to the average concert goer, they appear to inhabit separate worlds. In fact, as an audience member, I rarely see the same faces at both types of events. Does BOAC produce a lot of academic crap? Sure, just like everyone else; but there are jewels to be discovered. Roulette, the superb, long-standing performance space run by trombonist Jim Staley, is the rare venue that brings both strains (and many others) together (Their board of directors includes Alvin Lucier, George Lewis, William Parker, David Weinstein and Zorn). Last evening, Robert Black, the bassist for the BOAC ensemble, gave a superb solo recital. Highlights: Christian Wolff's 'Look She Said', a 20 minute suite in five sections where Wolff gets _this_ close to traditional melodies and rhythms before veering away into wistful asides, with poignant/humorous vocalizations from the bassist. Two hilarious songs by ex-pat David Jaggard, 'I Had a Dog' and 'Stay Where Yer Born' combining down to earth, very funny lyrics with virtuoso playing to an astonishing degree. Anyone know this guy's other work? James Tenney's 'Beast', a postcard composition (one of a number of pieces written out on postcards and mailed to perfomers), an amazing exporation of the oscillations within a single, deep, bowed chord. I was absolutely baffled how Black was producing the variation in oscillating rhythms; I couldn't discern any related movement in either left hand or bow. A very beautiful, mysterious work (audience member Mark Helias was visibly wowed). The evening ended with a performance of Arnold Dreyblatt's 'Nodal Excitations' on an upright bass strung with piano wire. The sounds produced ranged from thin and grating to rich and vibrant, especially when played with open strings, allowing an enormous range of harmonic activity within a furiously rhythmic context. Check out Mr. Black if you have the chance. Brian Olewnick - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Stefan Verstraeten" Subject: Loren mazzacane connors question Date: 16 Oct 1999 10:36:06 +0200 Hi I hope that someone on this list can help me out with the following question: I recently spotted on a list three new cds by loren mazzacane: -airs -the dagget year 1978-1980 -unaccompanied accoustic does someone on this list know if these are new albums or even give a brief description Best wishes Stefan Verstraeten stefan.annik@planetinternet.be np AUBE - Shade away..... never imagined that the sound of glass would be that subtle - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: Re: Loren mazzacane connors question Date: 17 Oct 1999 16:08:18 EDT In a message dated 10/17/99 3:31:28 PM, stefan.annik@planetinternet.be writes: << I recently spotted on a list three new cds by loren mazzacane: -airs -the dagget year 1978-1980 -unaccompanied accoustic does someone on this list know if these are new albums or even give a brief description >> Airs (Road Cone) is a new recording, Loren's latest in a long line of solo suites. I've heard it twice, and I don't think too much of it. it's so subdued that I feel like the life has been squeezed out of it, and I find it kind of boring, a word that's never crossed my mind in describing Loren in any other context. the other two are the same thing, the 4 CD box set just released by Thurston Moore's Ecstatic Peace label. it's a reissue of the nine acoustic records that Loren pressed himself in 1979 and 1980. he never sold any, sent some to radio stations, and ended up throwing away most of them because they were just taking up too much space. I just bought this about an hour ago, so I can't comment on the music yet. Haunted House played the best set I've seen them do yet last night, in between solo Milford Graves and the No Neck Blues Band, who were pretty good despite only having six of their nine members present. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Diego Gruber Subject: Re: oh yeah i should tell u where its posted Date: 17 Oct 1999 12:55:46 -0500 I don't have access to newsgroups so if someone is willing to send me these mp3s (or at least one or two) by mail (to dgruber@inlandes.com), or post them on a website, i'd greatly appreciate it. if you're willing to send them by mail please contact me first (maybe too many generous ppl would send me Mbs of info twice or more, just to avoid that). Thanks, D wetboy wrote: > > u c? the yankees get pummelled and i lose all sense of reality. the dave > douglas quartet mp3s were posted in alt.binaries.sounds.mp3.bootlegs > > whoops > > "and you, young skywalker. we will watch your career with great interest." > > criterion ld/dvd info: > http://www.geocities.com/sunsetstrip/vine/9374 > > - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Eisenbeil@aol.com Subject: NYC CREATIVE MUSIC CONCERT Date: 17 Oct 1999 21:44:28 EDT PINK PONY IMPROV SERIES PRESENTS Oluyemi Thomas (bass clarinet, saxophone) Bruce Eisenbeil (guitar) Jackson Krall (drums) Tuesday October 19, 1999 beginning at 8 pm Come out to hear unique creative music with 3 musicians who will intertwine=20 their inner visions Visiting from Oakland, Oluyemi Thomas is a highly evolved individual whose=20 music reveals his unique and universal perspectives from three decades of=20 musicianship. He has played in festivals all over the world, most recently=20 in the Fire in the Valley Festival on Saturday with Alan Silva and before=20 that he has worked with Cecil Taylor, Roscoe Mitchell, Wolfgang Fuch, John=20 Tchicai, Wilber Morris, Wadada Leo Smith, William Parker, and many others. =20 His own recordings include: =20 At the Center Of the Threshold(MW Production), Invocation #9 (Music & Arts),= U nity in Multiplicity(Rastascan). Bruce Eisenbeil is a cutting edge improvising guitarist from NYC. Eisenbeil=20 has performed with William Hooker, Roy Campbell Jr., Jason Kao Hwang, Fred=20 Lonberg-Holm, Craig McIver, John Bickerton, Sabir Mateen, Jack Wright, Danie= l=20 Carter, Steve Swell, Jackson Krall, Christina Wheeler, Edgar Bateman, Todd=20 Margasak, Toshi Makihara, Blaise Siwula, Eddie Gale, India Cooke,=20 Ernesto-Diaz Infante, Oluyemi Thomas, Damon Smith, Adam Lane, Tom Heasley an= d=20 many other jazz explorers. He has two releases on the CIMP label, Nine Wing= s( with Rob Brown & Lou Grassi) and his recently released CD, MURAL (with J=20 Brunka & Ryan Sawyer). For more info on him check out his website: www.eis= en beil.com Jackson Krall has performed extensively with Cecil Taylor(p) and can be hear= d=20 on Taylor's recent CD Qu'a-Live at the Iridium Vols 1 & 2(Cadence). These=20 CD's also feature Dominic Duval(b) and Harri Sjostrom(ss). Krall has=20 performed with Bill Dixon, Don Cherry, William Parker, Karen Borca and many=20 other great musicians. PINK PONY CAF=C9 176 Ludlow St./Houston St. NYC 212-253-1922 $4 donation requested - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: User384726@aol.com Subject: Cobra in Chicago! Date: 18 Oct 1999 00:04:27 EDT On Sunday (10/24/99) a group of students at DePaul's School of Music will be playing the famous Zorn game piece Cobra. Fred Lomberg-Holm will be playing and possibly Ken Vandermark (if he is in town). The concert is free and all are welcome to come. The conert is in the Music Builing at DePaul's Lincoln Park Campus located on the corner of Belmont and Halsted. You don't need to obey the sign about facilty parking only since it is a weekend. Hope you enjoy. Aaron Solomon - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Pratt Subject: Re: Loren mazzacane connors question Date: 17 Oct 1999 21:29:09 -0700 (PDT) --- JonAbbey2@aol.com wrote: > > Airs (Road Cone) is a new recording, Loren's latest > in a long line of solo > suites. I've heard it twice, and I don't think too > much of it. it's so > subdued that I feel like the life has been squeezed > out of it, and I find it > kind of boring, a word that's never crossed my mind > in describing Loren in > any other context. I've yet to give this one a really close listen, but it's definitely clean and reserved. For what it's worth, Loren says it's his favorite of all his recordings. > the other two are the same thing, the 4 CD box set > just released by Thurston > Moore's Ecstatic Peace label. it's a reissue of the > nine acoustic records > that Loren pressed himself in 1979 and 1980. he > never sold any, sent some to > radio stations, and ended up throwing away most of > them because they were > just taking up too much space. I just bought this > about an hour ago, so I > can't comment on the music yet. I listened to all of the first disc this morning and was pretty blown away. It's really sparse and totally skewed folk/blues/improv stuff that still sounds like Loren, but it's just *alien* to hear him on acoustic and so early in his career. I think fans of John Fahey, Joseph Spence or even Derek Bailey would really get a lot out of this music. Again, I've only heard the first disc, and Loren told me today that the third and fourth ones are the *really* crazed and jagged ones! I'm pretty excited about this set. Amazing stuff, I think. There's also another MazzaCane disc compiling his early '80s collaborations with a female folk singer. I can't remember the details, so someone else will have to provide the info. -Tom Pratt listening to: Lowell Davidson Trio - s/t (ESP) ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: Re: Loren mazzacane connors question Date: 18 Oct 1999 00:35:24 EDT In a message dated 10/18/99 12:15:52 AM, tpratt9@yahoo.com writes: << There's also another MazzaCane disc compiling his early '80s collaborations with a female folk singer. I can't remember the details, so someone else will have to provide the info. >> and shockingly, that someone is me. the CD is called Kath Bloom/Loren Mazzacane-1981-1984 (Megalon), and it's from just after his solo acoustic work on the box set. it's a compilation from 5 LPs that Loren released on his own St. Joan label in editions of 200. again, I haven't heard it yet, so I can't comment on the music. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: stephen.fruitman@idehist.umu.se (Stephen Fruitman) Subject: Kol Nidre Date: 18 Oct 1999 15:32:09 +0200 (MET DST) Can anyone kindly give me a time reading on the length of "Kol Nidre" on Zorn=B4s _String Quartets_ CD? Thanks in advance, Stephen =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Lena Berggren Licentiate of Philosophy Department of Historical Studies University of Umea SE-901 87 Umea SWEDEN Lena.Berggren@histstud.umu.se Phone +46 (0)90 786 96 19 Mobile +46 (0)70 233 47 30 =46ax +46 (0)90 14 33 74 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: sonny shine Subject: Re: RUINS in SF this Sunday! Date: 18 Oct 1999 07:08:02 -0700 (PDT) oh man!! i SO wanted to go to that. but me. i'm in wisconsin. and i've got school and work. SUX! now all the californians are gonna rant and rave about how kool it was, and i will kick myself for living in wisconsin and having responsibilities. sonny. --- Ben Wallace wrote: > > > 2nd JAPANESE NEW MUSIC FESTIVAL > > The Japanese New Music Festival is back from its > European Tour > in '97 to bring an even more powerful performance. > The three > musicians will now perform in an overwhelming five > different > projects. > > Sunday, October 17, 1999, 9 pm > $7 cover, all ages > Club Cocodrie > 1024 Kearny St (near Broadway) > San Francisco, CA 94133 > (415) 986-6678 > -- __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Herb Levy Subject: Interactive computer music in RealAudio Date: 18 Oct 1999 09:08:14 -0500 Hi, I thought readers of this list might be interested in this week's Mappings, which presents interactive computer music by composers Martin Bartlett, David Behrman, Chris Brown, Luc Houtkamp, and George Lewis; with performances by these composers as well as trumpeters Rhys Chatham & Ben Neill, percussionist Ikue Mori, saxophonist Evan Parker, and cellist Francis-Marie Uitti. The show is available on demand all week at Unfortunately, the notes for the program have not been posted correctly as of this e-mail. Since I've moved I've had trouble with the FTP address, and the person who runs the station hasn't responded to my e-mail yet. If you have questions, and can't wait for the notes to be corrected, please get in touch with me at the e-address below. (The show to which the incorrect notes refer is the show available through the archive link on the page above). Bests, Herb Herb Levy NEW MAILING ADDRESS: P O Box 9369 Forth Wort, TX 76147 NEW PHONE: 817 377-2983 same old e-mail: herb@eskimo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: DRoyko@aol.com Subject: Re: free grass Date: 18 Oct 1999 10:21:08 EDT In a message Dgasque@aol.com writes: >I sightly remember a one-shot CD by a group called "Psychograss" that had >Darryl Anger (sp?) and others, possibly Trischka (sounds like something he'd >be involved in)- supposedly a bluegrass band doing Hendrix, Blue Cheer, and >other 60's heavies. I looked for this in vain- never came across it. That band made two recordings. The first one came out in 1993 on (believe it or not) Windham Hill, which already had a track record with Darol Anger and Mike Marshall, who were the core members of the band. Trischka guested on a couple of tracks. The album is OK, not great, a little too laid back, especially given the group's name. The second Psychograss album is "Like Minds" which came out in 1996 on Sugar Hill. This is a much stronger album, and has a slightly revamped line-up of Anger/Marshall plus Trischka (throughout) and David Grier, a pretty amazing guitarist, and Todd Phillips (who was also on the first one) on bass. This is the recording to get. >Nice to see some bluegrass chatter here, as un-Zornlike as it may be. I've >always considered bluegrass musicians to be among the best musicians around. Couldn't agree more, on both points. And the connection to Zorn can be made easily--Eugene Chadbourne has recorded with Trischka. >Anybody heard the Czech bluegrass band Bruha Trava? (sp?, again...) >Supposedly this genre has a _huge_ following in that country- >Czechnya/Slovenya, to be proper...Amazing to see how this form of music has a >worldwide following. Druha Trava (translation--"Second Grass") is lead by Robert Krestan, a revered, Bob Dylan-like figure in the Czech Republic. Excellent band, but only the most famous (and they are huge in their homeland) of a surprisingly large contingent of bluegrass and newgrass bands from Eastern Europe and, particularly, the former Czechoslovakia. Another one in particular to keep an eye out for is a guy named Jiri Plocek, whose current group, Teagrass, blends Eastern European folk forms with progressive bluegrass. Their "Eastbound" album is a masterpiece. Much easier to track down is transplanted (now a Chicagoan) Czech guitarist Slavek Hanzlik. He has recorded 4 terrific solo albums, with all-star people (Bela Fleck, Stuart Duncan, Vassar Clements, etc.), and all are worth exploring. Dave Royko - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Alexander Blok Subject: Re: questions (T:un[k] Systems) Date: 18 Oct 1999 12:10:19 -0400 Sorry for the delay in reply. >Also, I just re-listened to the excellent >Disinformation remix album on Ash International called >'Al-Jabr' and was wondering what people knew about >this group T:un[k] Systems. I like their track a lot >but can't seem to find any info on them. T:un[k] Systems is actually the work of a guy named Pete Hodgkinson. The only other T:un[k] release I'm aware of is this self-released CD from last year. I can't remember the title or the label name, sorry. Anyway, it's a collaboration between Pete, Barry Nichols of Action Concrete, Linden Hale, and perhaps someone else as well. Lots of rough digital flickering and droney whines and Voice Crack-ish crack, all very atmospheric as if it was a field recording, i.e., not Mego-ish sounding exactly, not spawned inside a computer and never let out. Process-oriented music like that of The Hafler Trio and (some) of Mika Vainio's work comes to mind if I had to draw a comparison. In all, it's thoughtfully constructed stuff and quite intriguing if taken alone (from the thousands of other groups doing something similar these days). I don't know if this ever saw the light of day in a major way(??). Perhaps Other Music has it tucked away somewhere.=20 Hope that helps. -- $..:=A6=A6=A6=A6=B2 2933.43344Z=20 powered by Tom Recchion - "Chaotica" http:// - 10100 00000 10000 01011 011 000 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Brad Hamlin Subject: sheet music Date: 18 Oct 1999 09:36:27 -0700 (PDT) hey, i just joined this list and so maybe i'm asking a redundant dead question... flog me i guess if i am... is there some where i can get sheet music of zorn's stuff... i've heard marc ribot talk about how much learning the book of heads improved his playing and i'd really like to try to learn it... ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: King Wilson Subject: Re: RUINS in SF this Sunday! Date: 18 Oct 1999 11:29:22 -0500 >oh man!! i SO wanted to go to that. but me. i'm in >wisconsin. and i've got school and work. SUX! > >now all the californians are gonna rant and rave about >how kool it was, and i will kick myself for living in >wisconsin and having responsibilities. > >------------------------------------------------------------------ >> 2nd JAPANESE NEW MUSIC FESTIVAL >> >> The Japanese New Music Festival is back from its >> European Tour >> in '97 to bring an even more powerful performance. >> The three >> musicians will now perform in an overwhelming five >> different >> projects. >> >> Sunday, October 17, 1999, 9 pm >> $7 cover, all ages >> Club Cocodrie >> 1024 Kearny St (near Broadway) >> San Francisco, CA 94133 >> (415) 986-6678 I don't know the exact date, but I believe this festival has a Chicago date, at the Fireside Bowl, in the next month or so. I know Ruins are playing here soon, in any case. That's a hellava lot closer to Wisconsin....... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Whit Schonbein Subject: Re: dave douglas mp3s Date: 18 Oct 1999 11:54:28 -0500 (CDT) > Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 12:55:46 -0500 > From: Diego Gruber > Subject: Re: oh yeah i should tell u where its posted > > I don't have access to newsgroups so if someone is willing to send me > these mp3s (or at least one or two) by mail (to dgruber@inlandes.com), > or post them on a website, i'd greatly appreciate it. if you're willing > to send them by mail please contact me first (maybe too many generous > ppl would send me Mbs of info twice or more, just to avoid that). If someone can send them my way via email, i'll stick them on my website for everyone's enjoyment. whit whit@twinearth.wustl.edu - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AnneJan van Aperloo Subject: West coast masada Date: 18 Oct 1999 20:00:01 +0200 Hi, My first Masada concert I saw was the one with Dougie Bowe (??) on clarine in Cologne back in '94. Was this an incidental concert or did he actualy tour with the clarinet line up. If so.........are there any recordings ?? AnneJan - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AnneJan van Aperloo Subject: Naked City Hamburg '88 Date: 18 Oct 1999 20:01:11 +0200 Hi, Back in '89 (february) I heard a complete Naked City show on German radio. I wasn't in to zorn those days so I didn't record it. As far as I remembered it was a gig at the Hamburg Jazz festival '88, but I can't find it in any traders list. Do I remember it wrong???? did they broadcast another concert then. Can any of the german readers help me out on this ? AnneJan - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: IOUaLive1@aol.com Subject: Re: Naked City Hamburg '88 Date: 18 Oct 1999 16:58:30 EDT In a message dated 10/18/1999 1:52:01 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Hok.Pop@net.HCC.nl writes: > Back in '89 (february) I heard a complete Naked City show on German radio. > I wasn't in to zorn those days so I didn't record it. As far as I > remembered it was a gig at the Hamburg Jazz festival '88, but I can't find > it in any traders list. Do I remember it wrong???? did they broadcast > another concert then. Can any of the german readers help me out on this ? There are quite a few radio broadcast tapes of Naked City out there, although ive never seen one from hamburg 1988. They toured Germany around November of 1988 and I know of several from other cities around that time. If you see hamburg May 3rd 1992 on a traders list, grab it!! -jody - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: IOUaLive1@aol.com Subject: Re: West coast masada Date: 18 Oct 1999 16:59:51 EDT In a message dated 10/18/1999 1:51:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Hok.Pop@net.HCC.nl writes: > My first Masada concert I saw was the one with Dougie Bowe (??) on clarine > in Cologne back in '94. Was this an incidental concert or did he actualy > tour with the clarinet line up. If so.........are there any recordings ?? It was Dougie Bowne on drums, and Ben Goldberg on Clarinet. I think they did one tour with that lineup. -Jody - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "wetboy" Subject: Re: Naked City Hamburg '88 Date: 18 Oct 1999 19:44:17 -0700 recently a concert from berlin in 1998 (or so it was listed) was posted in a newsgroup. i only managed 2 get 1 track, as the rest came up incomplete. maybe it was hamburg and the original poster got the city wrong. sound quality is tremendous. the track is about 20 min long. they play inside straight and taxi driver. as zorn says about inside straight, "bill played the fuckin shit outta that tune" yes, frisell's playing really was THAT good -----Original Message----- >Hi, > >Back in '89 (february) I heard a complete Naked City show on German radio. >I wasn't in to zorn those days so I didn't record it. As far as I >remembered it was a gig at the Hamburg Jazz festival '88, but I can't find >it in any traders list. Do I remember it wrong???? did they broadcast >another concert then. Can any of the german readers help me out on this ? > >AnneJan > >- > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: benjamin elliot axelrad Subject: Re: Cobra in Chicago! Date: 18 Oct 1999 20:11:08 -0500 (CDT) What time? On Mon, 18 Oct 1999 User384726@aol.com wrote: > On Sunday (10/24/99) a group of students at DePaul's School of Music will be > playing the famous Zorn game piece Cobra. Fred Lomberg-Holm will be playing > and possibly Ken Vandermark (if he is in town). The concert is free and all > are welcome to come. The conert is in the Music Builing at DePaul's Lincoln > Park Campus located on the corner of Belmont and Halsted. You don't need to > obey the sign about facilty parking only since it is a weekend. Hope you > enjoy. > > > Aaron Solomon > > - > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andreas Dietz" Subject: Re: Naked City Hamburg '88 Date: 19 Oct 1999 09:15:39 CEST >From: AnneJan van Aperloo > >Hi, > >Back in '89 (february) I heard a complete Naked City show on German radio. >I wasn't in to zorn those days so I didn't record it. As far as I >remembered it was a gig at the Hamburg Jazz festival '88, but I can't find >it in any traders list. Do I remember it wrong???? did they broadcast >another concert then. Can any of the german readers help me out on this ? > I think it was the Berlin Jazzfest in November ´89 (Laurie Anderson on the same evening). The festival is usually broadcasted at different radio stations. I never heard of a performance in Hamburg. >My first Masada concert I saw was the one with Dougie Bowe (??) on clarine >in Cologne back in '94. Was this an incidental concert or did he actualy >tour with the clarinet line up. If so.........are there any recordings ?? >AnneJan >- In November ´94 Masada played in Mainz with the Lineup Zorn, Douglas, Cohen, Wollesen. The drummer Dougie Bowne on clarinet? Is this possible? Andreas Dietz ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: DR S WILKIE Subject: Re: Kind Of Blue Date: 19 Oct 1999 09:42:10 GMT0BST As no-one's picked up on this. I'll have a go: I don't have a copy of the original vinyl issue, but as I understand, side two has always begun with All Blues and always ended with Flamenco Sketches. The original liner notes, I believe, were the problem: either the track listing or the discussion suggested that the sequence of these pieces was the other way around. Sean NP: Parker/Lytton/Guy/Crispell (interesting!!) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "in.out" Subject: T.sugimoto Date: 19 Oct 1999 14:05:52 +0200 Hi zorner, Japanese guitar player Taku sagimoto is Actualy touring in France. He will play Solo Wed 20th of October in Monaco at Logoscope. more info @ www.anima.net/silsir/taku/ - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Stephane Vuilleumier" Subject: Re: T.sugimoto Date: 19 Oct 1999 14:39:50 +0200 Is there a list of the other concert dates somewhere? The site just says he will be touring London and then Switzerland (lucky us) Stephane -----Original Message----- >Japanese guitar player Taku sagimoto is Actualy touring in France. > >He will play Solo Wed 20th of October in Monaco at Logoscope. > >more info @ www.anima.net/silsir/taku/ - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Yves Dewulf Subject: Zorn Ensemble European tournee ? Date: 19 Oct 1999 14:58:14 +0200 (MET DST) The Saudades agency mentions a tour of the John Zorn Ensemble in Europe, fall 1999: http://www.ejn.it/concerts/zonernes.htm Does someone know more about this ? What ensemble is this ? Cobra? Chamber Music ? Circle Maker ? The dates are: 16-11-99 Roma 17-11-99 Antwerp 18-11-99 Madrid 19-11-99 Coimbra 20-11-99 Wien YVes - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: philz Subject: Downtown NY CD's for Sale Date: 19 Oct 1999 08:47:55 -0400 Last night I added a bunch of cd's to my ongoing rekkid sale, located at: http://rekkids.squidco.com/ I think most of the new items will be of interest to people on the Zorn list, so I'm posting here first before I tell the rest of the world via Usenet. You can see the recent additions alone by selecting the Recent Additions item on that page, or directly at: http://rekkids.squidco.com/FMPro?-token=recent&-db=Rekkids&-format=dis playList.html&-max=50&-sortfield=EntryDate&-SortOrder=Descending&-sort field=Artist&-sortfield=Format&-SortOrder=Ascending&-Op=neq&Ordered=1& -find Thanks for the bandwidth! philz zampino@squidco.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: sonny shine Subject: Re: RUINS in SF this Sunday! Date: 19 Oct 1999 07:17:39 -0700 (PDT) yeah. that is a lot closer. lemme know when you find out a definitive date! anyone. son --- King Wilson wrote: > >oh man!! i SO wanted to go to that. but me. i'm in > >wisconsin. and i've got school and work. SUX! > > > >now all the californians are gonna rant and rave > about > >how kool it was, and i will kick myself for living > in > >wisconsin and having responsibilities. > > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------ > >> 2nd JAPANESE NEW MUSIC FESTIVAL > >> > >> The Japanese New Music Festival is back from its > >> European Tour > >> in '97 to bring an even more powerful > performance. > >> The three > >> musicians will now perform in an overwhelming > five > >> different > >> projects. > >> > >> Sunday, October 17, 1999, 9 pm > >> $7 cover, all ages > >> Club Cocodrie > >> 1024 Kearny St (near Broadway) > >> San Francisco, CA 94133 > >> (415) 986-6678 > > > I don't know the exact date, but I believe this > festival has a Chicago > date, at the Fireside Bowl, in the next month or so. > I know Ruins are > playing here soon, in any case. > > That's a hellava lot closer to Wisconsin....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: Re: T.sugimoto Date: 19 Oct 1999 11:23:16 EDT In a message dated 10/19/99 8:44:46 AM, Vuilleumier@micro.biol.ethz.ch writes: << Is there a list of the other concert dates somewhere? The site just says he will be touring London and then Switzerland (lucky us) >> I know that he's playing three times (solo, guitar trio with Otomo and Keith Rowe, and in Otomo's large-scale project, Mira Ni Narumade) over the weekend of November 5-7 at the Music Unlimited festival in Wels, Austria. more info at: http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/4782/unlimited/deutsch-unltd99/prgvorlmain.htm Otomo's playing in five different bands over the three days. and yes, I'll be attending. and I'm getting fairly excited about the prospect too. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ken Waxman Subject: Experimental segregation Date: 19 Oct 1999 11:52:42 -0400 (EDT) Just back from a trip to Chicago. Saw some great music and picked up quite a few CDs. However I did note a disturbing trend there that I've also noted in record stores in Montreal and New York City. After looking over the jazz bins in a couple of places and finding that some musicians seemed conspicuous by their absence, I asked store personnel and was directed to the variously titled "experimental" or "out" sections. There in a hodgepodge of discs that usually included (and I'm putting together the sections of a few cities now) The Ruins, The Boredoms, Steve Reich, Philip Glass, Scott Walker [!] and some early moog experiments, I found discs by Peter Brotzmann, Evan Parker, AMM, John Zorn, Ken Vandermark etc. Now there are those who would say what those musicians and others play isn't really "jazz" and thus should be in another section. However work by Leo Smith, Anthony Braxton, Roscoe Mitchell, Cecil Taylor and others, who are also a bit removed from the jazz tradition is still kept in the "jazz" section. The only unifying factor I can see in the two groups is that one of made up of Whites, the other Blacks. Do I detect the whiff of exclusion here or maybe even downright segregation? Ken Waxman - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: Experimental segregation Date: 19 Oct 1999 11:51:03 -0500 On Tue, Oct 19, 1999 at 11:52:42AM -0400, Ken Waxman wrote: > There in a hodgepodge of discs that usually included (and I'm putting > together the sections of a few cities now) The Ruins, The Boredoms, Steve > Reich, Philip Glass, Scott Walker [!] and some early moog experiments, I > found discs by Peter Brotzmann, Evan Parker, AMM, John Zorn, Ken > Vandermark etc. [*snip*] > The only unifying factor I can see in the two groups is that one of made > up of Whites, the other Blacks. Hmm... are the Ruins and the Boredoms "Whites"? -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "van Osdel, Eric" Subject: RE: RUINS in SF this Sunday! Date: 19 Oct 1999 09:24:34 -0700 You want to talk about kicking yourself? I live an hour away from San Francisco, but I didn't get the message about the show until *MONDAY* because of Stupid Email Server Tricks. Gah! Man, was I pissed.... --evo. > --- King Wilson wrote: > > >oh man!! i SO wanted to go to that. but me. i'm in > > >wisconsin. and i've got school and work. SUX! > > > > > >now all the californians are gonna rant and rave > > about > > >how kool it was, and i will kick myself for living > > in > > >wisconsin and having responsibilities. > > > > > > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------ > > >> 2nd JAPANESE NEW MUSIC FESTIVAL > > >> > > >> The Japanese New Music Festival is back from its > > >> European Tour > > >> in '97 to bring an even more powerful > > performance. > > >> The three > > >> musicians will now perform in an overwhelming > > five > > >> different > > >> projects. > > >> > > >> Sunday, October 17, 1999, 9 pm > > >> $7 cover, all ages > > >> Club Cocodrie > > >> 1024 Kearny St (near Broadway) > > >> San Francisco, CA 94133 > > >> (415) 986-6678 > > > > > > I don't know the exact date, but I believe this > > festival has a Chicago > > date, at the Fireside Bowl, in the next month or so. > > I know Ruins are > > playing here soon, in any case. > > > > That's a hellava lot closer to Wisconsin....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com > > - > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Patrice L. Roussel" Subject: Re: Friedlander/Hole Date: 19 Oct 1999 10:46:53 -0700 On Tue, 28 Sep 1999 11:01:44 -0300 Linares Hugo wrote: > > According to Eric Friedlander's BIO Page, he appeared playing cello with > Courtney Love's band Hole on MTV's Unplugged. > When did it happened? Did anyone watch it or even listen to it? > Any other further comments? MTV UNPLUGGED SHOW No. 54: Hole Recorded on 2/14/95 at Brooklyn Academy of Music, Brooklyn, New York Aired on 4/17/95 Courtney Love: vocals, guitar Melissa Auf Der Maur: bass, vocals Patty Schemel: drums Eric Erlandson: guitar with: Zeena Parkins: harp Erik Friedlander: cello Ralph Carney: miscellaneous wind intruments Hal Wilner: musical supervisor Set list: 1/ Miss World 2/ Best Sunday Dress 3/ Pee Girl (Softer Softest) 4/ Drown Soda 5/ He Hit Me (And It Felt Like a Kiss) 6/ Asking For It 7/ You Got No Right 8/ Drunk in Rio 9/ Season of the Witch 10/ Old Age 11/ Hungry Like the Wolf 12/ Doll Parts - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu Subject: Re: Experimental segregation Date: 19 Oct 1999 13:30:07 -0400 Ken wrote some interesting observations, then: >Do I detect the whiff of exclusion here or maybe even downright segregation? I don't think things are _quite_ as sinister as Ken suspects, though certainly subtle strains of racism are present whenever one discusses the marginalization of jazz (even here, in the US at least, I get the strong impression that the fear of the 'other'--racism, if you will--is directed more towards non-whites from the same culture, rather than those safely and exotically elsewhere in the world). As is usually the case, the stores are likely responding to the predilections of their customers, racially based as those might be, when they put Brotzmann in one section and Taylor in another. There are many music consumers (no-one on this list, of course!) who enjoy experimental music produced by folk whose prime influences are jazz musicians but whose music might be able to be _perceived_ as something else, who have an aversion to actual jazz music. Now, to a great extent, this maps pretty closely onto a white/black breakdown, but whether that's simply because of the large number of black musicians in jazz vis a vis those in "experimental" (jazz-influenced but not jazz) music or due to any underlying racism--it could be both, of course--is an open question. The whole notion of "jazz" has been so polluted by the mainstream media that it's no wonder listeners, especially younger ones, are put off from the start. Check out any representation of jazz musicians in commercials, for example; if it's not some sappy white schlockmeister a la the G-man, it's a pimpified or beatnik-ized black guy, only to be enjoyed "ironically" like lounge music. Why would any self-respecting young listener want to have anything to do with _that_?! In other words, they're glad to listen to and buy music that is strongly jazz-influenced as long as they don't have to use the word "Jazz", because that might force them to deal with implications, some of them racially motivated, that they'd rather ignore. Hey, maybe Ken was right after all. FWIW, in NYC, one of the HMV's had an experimental section for a while (located in the jazz department) which followed the patterns that Ken observed. I also wondered about their decisions on who to include (though I have to say, I didn't think of it in racial terms--too many Japanese musicians there!) but, overall, appreciated the gesture, as it saved me time wandering the various areas to see, for example, where they chose to file something like Frith's 'Pacifica'. They've since abandoned the idea, so now I have to hope to serendipitously find, say, Frank London in the Israel portion of their World section. Brian Olewnick Note: the above was written in one irrepressible spasm and may contain opinions I'll find ridiculous in a couple of hours. But probably not. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Hale Subject: Re: Experimental segregation Date: 19 Oct 1999 14:20:25 -0500 Ken Waxman wrote: > Now there are those who would say what those musicians and others play > isn't really "jazz" and thus should be in another section. However work > by Leo Smith, Anthony Braxton, Roscoe Mitchell, Cecil Taylor and others, > who are also a bit removed from the jazz tradition is still kept in the > "jazz" section. In a recent conversation, Dave Douglas said that he really doesn't like to refer to the bulk of his work (the quartet recordings aside) as jazz. The best thing to do would just be to do away with classifications and file an entire store alphabetically. James Hale - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jls@tonic107.com (John Scott) Subject: Re: RUINS in SF this Sunday! Date: 19 Oct 1999 14:45:51 -0400 Ruins are playing in NYC at Tonic tomorrow night! Wed, Oct 20 Ruins at 10:00pm, $12 ($10 in advance)... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Martin_Wisckol@link.freedom.com (Martin Wisckol) Subject: winter & winter (no zorn) Date: 19 Oct 1999 12:13:13 -0700 anybody have a web address for winter & winter records? thanks. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Hale Subject: Re: winter & winter (no zorn) Date: 19 Oct 1999 15:26:48 -0500 Martin Wisckol wrote: > > anybody have a web address for winter & winter records? thanks. > > - Nothing is listed, but their e-mail is WinterProduction@compuserve.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linares Hugo Subject: RE: Experimental segregation Date: 19 Oct 1999 16:39:03 -0300 > world). As is usually the case, the stores are likely responding to the > predilections of their customers, racially based as those might be, when > they > put Brotzmann in one section and Taylor in another. There are many music > consumers (no-one on this list, of course!) who enjoy experimental music > > > Though I know many Americans have grown up in the middle of pure racism, I must admit that from my "Latin American" (?) point of view it's hard to believe these kind of situation can happen nowadays. Actually, off topic (or not), I had the fortune of being contemporary with the great Astor Piazzola, and I'm proud of it. Then I wonder if most of (white) Americans are still proud of being contemporary with Miles Davis, John Coltrane, Cecil Taylor, etc (regarding the fame and respect they have worldwide) or they aren't. Just a question. Hugo - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tony Reif Subject: new Songlines releases Date: 19 Oct 1999 13:05:16 -0700 "...the Vancouver based label whose astonishingly high level output is expanding the boundaries of new jazz." - Andy Hamilton, The Wire New CDs by Jerry Granelli, Mark Nodwell and Junk Genius are now out: JERRY GRANELLI & BADLANDS, Crowd Theory (SGL 1526-2) Drummer/bandleader Granelli has had several very well received 90s releases on Intuition, including two by his dual-guitar band UFB. This is the second Songlines CD by his septet of young downtown NY improvisers (Chris Speed, Briggan Krauss, Peter Epstein, reeds; Curtis Hasselbring, trombone/guitar; Jamie Saft, piano/organ/slide guitar; and J. Anthony Granelli, bass) - a record full of character, deep groove, and relaxed intensity. The program, all original tunes by Granelli and band members, ranges across and beyond jazz territory to include avant-funk, a dark tango, an ambient-meets-Sun Ra sort of piece, and a breezy homage to Monsieur Hulot. "Ageless traps vet Jerry Granelli has bonded with his edgy young Badlands septet for another essay in spontaneous combustion....Brims with energy and incident, including excellent work from [the] reed men. There are longeurs and squiggly bits here and there, but that is overcome by a surfeit of strong material, particularly from the leader's pen. In particular his tuneful 'Tango' should turn many heads." - Billboard Previous release: Jerry Granelli & Badlands, Enter, a Dragon (SGL 1521-2) "If quality was the only criterion, Granelli's small, select output would have earned him a place among the leading contemporary jazz players....Comparisons have been made with master drummer Paul Motian for subtlety and sensitivity, but Motian hasn't attempted anything as ambitious as Granelli's compositions." - The Wire Related releases: Chris Speed, Deviantics (SGL 1524-2) and Yeah No (SGL 1517-2) Human Feel, Speak to It (SGL 1514-2) featuring Chris Speed Brad Shepik & the Commuters, The Loan (SGL 1518-2) featuring Peter Epstein BABKAS, Fratelli (SGL 1513-2), Ants to the Moon (SGL 1505-2), and BABKAS (SGL 1502-2), featuring Briggan Krauss MARK NODWELL, (co)incidents (SGL 1527-2) =46or his debut CD, Vancouver soprano saxist Nodwell has assembled a fine international sextet, including jazz/improv string player Eyvind Kang (here on viola), clarinetist Fran=E7ois Houle, and NY guitarist Khabu Doug Young. His four expansive compositions, all played with a searing lyricism, shift from lush textures to driving solos and ensembles to raucous free-for-alls. The stylistic diversity draws upon Eastern European and Asian musics as well as rock, ambient, and contemporary classical, and the interplay of elements and musicians evokes vivid images in sound: "...weaves together composition and improvisation with an extraordinary power." - Vancouver Courier. Related releases: =46ran=E7ois Houle 5, In the Vernacular (SGL 1522-2) =46ran=E7ois Houle and Beno=EEt Delbecq, Nancali (SGL 1519-2) =46ran=E7ois Houle Et Cetera, Hacienda (SGL 1501-2) JUNK GENIUS (Ben Goldberg/John Schott/Trevor Dunn/Kenny Wollesen), Ghost of Electricity (SGL 1525-2) Junk Genius's first record (on Knitting Factory) consisted of fractured, go-for-broke treatments of difficult bebop compositions, and earned them high praise. Five years later they return with a different focus: original songs that sound as if they'd come from old field recordings, recovered artifacts inspiring a new oral tradition. Through hymns, stomps, hollers, and anarchic strum-alongs, Junk Genius trace the border regions between alternative jazz, improvisation, and the primal music of Dock Boggs, Son House, the Carter Family, and the Georgia Sea Islands. Ben Goldberg (clarinet), John Schott (guitars), Trevor Dunn (bass), and Kenny Wollesen (drums) play as one - and are beautifully recorded (in analogue, mixed to 24 bits/88.2 KHz and HDCD encoded). But this is no exercise in nostalgia: while it may move the listener with the reverence of its melodies, the rhythmic feel is dynamic and unsettling and the overall tone of the record both liberating and tragic. Related releases: Marty Ehrlich and Ben Goldberg, Light at the Crossroads (SGL 1511-2), featuring Trevor Dunn and Kenny Wollesen Andy Laster, Interpretations of Lessness (SGL 1515-2), featuring Kenny Wolle= sen Brad Shepik & the Commuters, The Loan (SGL 1518-2), featuring Kenny Wollesen =46or further information please contact: Tony Reif Songlines Recordings 1003 - 2323 W. 2nd Ave. Vancouver, B.C. V6K 1J4, Canada Tel (604) 737-1632 * fax 737-1678 treif@songlines.com www.songlines.com Distributed in the U.S. and Canada by Allegro Tony Reif (Songlines Recordings) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Handley" Subject: Re: winter & winter (no zorn) Date: 19 Oct 1999 20:18:47 GMT Speaking of which, I noticed a FULL BACK COVER AD for W&W on this month's downbeat magazine. Right on!!! Beautiful ad too, appeals to my Omnivore Music Collector Fetishism---makes me want to spend all my $. ;-> --s ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andreas Dietz" Subject: Re: Zorn Ensemble European tournee ? Date: 19 Oct 1999 22:35:31 CEST >From: Yves Dewulf > >The Saudades agency mentions a tour of the John Zorn Ensemble >in Europe, fall 1999: > http://www.ejn.it/concerts/zonernes.htm > >Does someone know more about this ? What ensemble is this ? >Cobra? Chamber Music ? Circle Maker ? > >The dates are: > 16-11-99 Roma > 17-11-99 Antwerp > 18-11-99 Madrid > 19-11-99 Coimbra > 20-11-99 Wien > >YVes > The Lineup is: John Zorn - sax (announced, but I think he´ll only put the chairs for the musicians...?) Jennifer Choi - violin Erik Friedlander - cello Stephen Drury - piano William Winant - percussion Andreas Dietz ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mike Chamberlain Subject: Re: Zorn Ensemble European tournee ? Date: 19 Oct 1999 17:02:16 -0400 > > >From: Yves Dewulf > > > >The Saudades agency mentions a tour of the John Zorn Ensemble > >in Europe, fall 1999: > > http://www.ejn.it/concerts/zonernes.htm > > > >Does someone know more about this ? What ensemble is this ? > >Cobra? Chamber Music ? Circle Maker ? > > > >The dates are: > > 16-11-99 Roma > > 17-11-99 Antwerp > > 18-11-99 Madrid > > 19-11-99 Coimbra > > 20-11-99 Wien > > Well, it looks like whoever booked the dates is a circle maker. Seems strange to go from Rome to Antwerp to Madrid to Coimbra and then back east to Vienna on successive nights (and Coimbra is not the easiest place in the world to get to). --Mike -- Mike Chamberlain Teacher, Writer, Broadcaster, Father, Farmer, Baseball Fan, Jazz Nerd, Sumo Nut, Bald Guy "I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused." - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ken Waxman Subject: Re: Experimental segregation Date: 19 Oct 1999 17:54:39 -0400 (EDT) I only picked out those two names because they were the ones I remembered. Believe me the variety of faces in the pictures on album covers in those sections were not "yellow" either --and they certainly weren't Bl;ack. Ken Waxman On Tue, 19 Oct 1999, Joseph Zitt wrote: > On Tue, Oct 19, 1999 at 11:52:42AM -0400, Ken Waxman wrote: >> > > The only unifying factor I can see in the two groups is that one of made > > up of Whites, the other Blacks. > > Hmm... are the Ruins and the Boredoms "Whites"? - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "m. rizzi" Subject: ZORN-LIST Notice: Server Change Date: 19 Oct 1999 15:03:47 -0700 (PDT) Tonight (19 Oct 1999 10 PM MDT), the zorn-list's generous host (xmission.com) is upgrading the server software to Solaris 7. This may result in a delay of zorn-list messages. SO, don't panic, stay calm, eat ice cream. your list manager, mike rizzi -- rizzi@netcom.com -------------------------------------- www.browbeat.com "Another nerd with a soulpatch" -------- browbeat magazine, po box 11124, oakland, ca 94611-1124 ------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rick Lopez" Subject: Re: Experimental segregation Date: 19 Oct 1999 18:20:52 -0400 > > Then I wonder if most of (white) Americans are still proud of being >contemporary with Miles Davis, John Coltrane, Cecil Taylor, etc (regarding >the fame and respect they have worldwide) or they aren't. > > Hugo Most (white & black) Americans don't have any idea who these people are. -RL Marilyn Crispell, Susie Ibarra, William Parker, Sam Rivers, Matthew Shipp, David S. Ware, and Reggie Workman Discographies--Samuel Beckett Eulogy--Baseball & the 10,000 Things--Time Stops--LOVETORN--HARD BOIL--etc., at: http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k UPDATE August 20, 1999: vids, a few CDs, baseball books, a few Cadence back issues, a few more CDs... ***Very Various For Sale: ***http://www.velocity.net/~bb10k/4SALE.html - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Joseph Zitt Subject: Re: Experimental segregation Date: 19 Oct 1999 18:12:57 -0500 On Tue, Oct 19, 1999 at 05:54:39PM -0400, Ken Waxman wrote: > I only picked out those two names because they were the ones I > remembered. Believe me the variety of faces in the pictures on album > covers in those sections were not "yellow" either --and they certainly > weren't Bl;ack. It's interesting, though, seeing whether one lumps in "non-black" as "white" or "non-white" as "black" or does something else. I wonder where they file Jason Hwang and Toshiki Akioshi (now there's someone I haven't thought of in a dog's age... and probably misspelled...) -- |> ~The only thing that is not art is inattention~ --- Marcel Duchamp <| | jzitt@metatronpress.com http://www.metatronpress.com/jzitt | | Latest CD: Shekhinah: The Presence http://www.mp3.com/josephzitt | | Comma: Voices of New Music Silence: the John Cage Discussion List | - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: ron nishimoto Subject: Re: RUINS in SF this Sunday! Date: 19 Oct 1999 16:04:23 -0700 Anybody know what happened to the show that was supposed to be at UCLA this past weekend? - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: stephen drury Subject: Re: Zorn Ensemble European tournee ? Date: 19 Oct 1999 21:54:59 -0400 At 12:11 PM 10/19/99 -0600, Yves wrote:-- >The Saudades agency mentions a tour of the John Zorn Ensemble >in Europe, fall 1999: > http://www.ejn.it/concerts/zonernes.htm > >Does someone know more about this ? What ensemble is this ? Modern chamber music, dude. New piano trio ("L'amor fou"), violin/piano piece "Le Momo", "Carny", "Music for Children", I think a solo cello piece, maybe more... Jenny Choi, Erik Friedlander, William Wynant, and the undersigned. --steve www.stephendrury.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: User384726@aol.com Subject: Chicago Cobra time Date: 19 Oct 1999 22:57:53 EDT I apologize for forgetting the time on the original post but it is 6:00 P.M. Hope you all can make it. Aaron Solomon - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "john rust" Subject: zorn in europe Date: 20 Oct 1999 10:40:45 +0200 I beg those who get the first details on the fortrhcoming european dates to send them either to the list or privately to me... I was looking for a chance to see Zorn for some years already and always lost the chances. The last time he was in Poland I was getting ready with my band to play the important festival gig in Weimar and just couldn't go, although I still regret it tremendously. I guess I gonna try to make it to Wien (I'm in Berlin). Any subscribers living there? john rust np: The Ex & Tom Cora "Figs" (Live in Nuernberg) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Matthew W Wirzbicki (S) " Subject: Used CDs for sale Date: 19 Oct 1999 23:22:23 -0600 I would like to sell the following CDs: Arcado String Trio - Live in Europe (avant) $12 Chick Corea - Trio Music (ECM) Mark Dresser - Banquet (TZADIK) Marty Ehrlich and the Dark Woods Ensemble - Emergency Peace (NEW WORLD) Marty Ehrlich's Dark Woods Ensemble - Just Before Dawn (NEW WORLD) Erik Friedlander - Topaz (SIAM) Bill Frisell - Nashville (Nonesuch) Fred Frith - Eye to Ear (TZADIK) Dave Holland Quintet - The Razor's Edge (ECM) Keith Jarrett - The Cure (ECM) Keith Jarrett - The Survivor's Suite (ECM) David Kristian - Cricklewood (alien8) Evan Lurie - How I spent my summer vacation (TZADIK) Lussier, Tetreault - Dur Noya Dur (AM) $9 Marc Ribot - Shoe String Symphonettes (TZADIK) Archie Shepp - Fire Music (impulse) Spanish Fly - Rags to Britches (Knitting Facotry Works) James Blood Ulmer - Harmolodic Guitar with Strings (DIW) $12 John Zorn - Bar Kokhba (TZADIK) $16 John Zorn - The Circle Maker (TZADIK) $16 All CD's are $10 unless otherwise marked. The cost of shipping (within the U.S.) in included in the price. (Canada = +$1, other countries = +$3). Check, money order, or cash (at your own risk of course) are acceptable. If you want to purchase any of these CDs or if you want additional information (ie. personel) please e-mail me at m_wirzbicki@coloradocollege.edu . Thank You -Matt Wirzbicki - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Paul Audino Subject: Thomas Chapin - Alive box set Date: 20 Oct 1999 07:24:26 -0500 (CDT) Does anyone have any information on the upcoming Thomas Chapin box set titled _Alive_ set to be released by Knitting Factory Works next month? Rather unsurprisingly, their web site contains no information about it. Thanks, Paul psaudino@interaccess.com GROOVE ---------- One Nation - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: sonny shine Subject: RE: RUINS in SF this Sunday! Date: 20 Oct 1999 06:13:29 -0700 (PDT) woah. yeah. i would be pissed, too. wow. stupid email server. kick the computer. son. --- "van Osdel, Eric" wrote: > > You want to talk about kicking yourself? I live an > hour away from San > Francisco, but I didn't get the message about the > show until *MONDAY* > because of Stupid Email Server Tricks. Gah! > > Man, was I pissed.... > > --evo. > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ken Waxman Subject: Re: Experimental segregation Date: 20 Oct 1999 11:01:07 -0400 (EDT) If they're "lucky" oriental jazzers like Toshiko, Sado Watanabe, Kobe Abe, Francis Wong, Fred Ho and south Asian ones like Vijay Iyer end up in the jazz section. If not they end up in the "world music" ghetto. Ken Waxman On Tue, 19 Oct 1999, Joseph Zitt wrote: > > It's interesting, though, seeing whether one lumps in "non-black" as > "white" or "non-white" as "black" or does something else. I wonder > where they file Jason Hwang and Toshiki Akioshi (now there's someone > I haven't thought of in a dog's age... and probably misspelled... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jason Tors Subject: CHAPIN ~ Date: 20 Oct 1999 11:47:39 -0800 Can someone suggest a good starter album? thanks! - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: Bklyn Composers Orch at the Brecht Date: 20 Oct 1999 11:34:42 -0500 The Brooklyn Composers Orchestra premier performance This Saturday, 10/23 at Neues Kabarett at the Brecht Forum. A new 17-piece ensemble, led by Charles Waters and Chris Jonas, will be presenting w sets of original works Saturday night, beginning at 8 p.m. The project is led by reed players Charles Waters and Chris Jonas, both of whom have honed their big-band chops working with William Parker's Little Huey Creative Music Orchestra, as well as numerous original and side projects. Waters and Jonas also play together in the Triple Threat Sextet, who performed over the summer as a part of the Jump festival. Waters also premiered compositions for chamber ensemble and dancer at the It's A Vision Thing festival curated by Patricia Nicholson at the Brecht Forum in June. Both players' compositions will be featured in this premier performance. Brooklyn Composer's Orchestra Oct. 23, 8 p.m. $8 at Neues Kabarett at the Brecht Forum 122 W. 27th St. 10th Fl. (betw. 6th $ 7th Aves) 212.242.4201 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rob Allaert" Subject: Masada in Antwerp ? Date: 20 Oct 1999 18:11:34 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01BF1B26.8AEC1C60 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0016_01BF1B26.8AEC1C60" ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01BF1B26.8AEC1C60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, The Zorn ensemble that would come to Antwerp in November is supposed to be Masada. They would play in the Bourla theatre, Antwerp city. But it is not totally confirmed as for now. Rob ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01BF1B26.8AEC1C60 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,
 
The Zorn = ensemble that=20 would come to Antwerp in November is supposed to be Masada. They would = play in=20 the Bourla theatre, Antwerp city. But it is not totally confirmed as for = now.
 
Rob
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Jennifer Choi - violin Erik Friedlander - cello Stephen Drury - piano William Winant - percussion ----------------- Isn´t Winant on tour with Mr. Bungle until the end of november???? If so, I don´t think he´ll be there... A ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: David Keffer Subject: MAZZACANE CONNORS & SUZANNE LANGILLE Date: 20 Oct 1999 15:14:05 -0400 I have a question about this duo. A few years ago I picked up Crucible by Mazzacane Connors & Suzanne Langille. I was a fan of Mazzacane Connors and knew nothing of Langille but the idea of Mazzacane Connors on guitar with female vocalist sounds good to me. Upon listening however, I discovered that this record was a disappointment for 2 reasons. (1) Mazzacane Connors and Langille didn't appear on the same tracks. They alternated tracks: one solo guitar, the next solo voice, etc. (2) The vocalist was reading some poetry, not singing. I am a fan of Mazzacane Connors so I enjoyed the solo guitar but advertising it as a guitar/vocal duet was deceitful, IMHO. Two questions: I know there are some folks on this list informed on this topic so now I ask regarding the quartet, Haunted House, on Erstwhile, with Loren MazzaCane Connors (guitar), Suzanne Langille (vocals), Andrew Burnes (guitar), Neel Murgai (Persian daf). Do Mazzacane Connors and Langille play together on the same tracks? Second, is Langille singing or speaking on this release? More questions: What is a Persian daf? Are there non-Persian dafs? Thanks. David K. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Pratt Subject: Re: MAZZACANE CONNORS & SUZANNE LANGILLE Date: 20 Oct 1999 12:28:07 -0700 (PDT) --- David Keffer wrote: > > I have a question about this duo. > > A few years ago I picked up Crucible by Mazzacane > Connors & Suzanne Langille. Upon listening however, > I discovered that this record was a disappointment > for 2 reasons. (1) Mazzacane Connors and Langille > didn't appear on the same tracks. They alternated > tracks: one solo guitar, the next solo voice, etc. > (2) The vocalist was reading some poetry, not > singing. I am a fan of Mazzacane Connors so I > enjoyed the solo guitar but advertising it as a > guitar/vocal duet was deceitful, IMHO. I like 'The Crucible' quite a bit. Langille actually *is* singing on her solo tunes. I love those tracks - the recording quality is so dry and reverb-less, making her voice sound really beautiful singing those simple blues tunes. She has a solo disc on Secretly Canadian (w/really limited backup from Loren) that I really want to hear. Regarding Haunted House: > Do Mazzacane Connors and Langille play together on > the same tracks? Yes. > Second, is Langille singing or speaking on this > release? She's most definitely singing. > What is a Persian daf? A percussion instrument. On the disc, Murgai uses it very sparingly to add texture, but at the groups recent shows, he's really been pounding out the rhythms. > Are there non-Persian dafs? Dunno. -Tom Pratt ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Daniel L Brown" Subject: Re: CHAPIN ~ Date: 20 Oct 1999 15:35:14 -0400 Menagerie Dreams has Zorn guesting on a couple tracks. I recommend that one. ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 03:47 PM > Can someone suggest a good starter album? > > thanks! > > > - > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Benito Vergara" Subject: RE: RUINS in SF this Sunday! Date: 20 Oct 1999 12:55:12 -0700 > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com > [mailto:owner-zorn-list@lists.xmission.com]On Behalf Of van Osdel, Eric > Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 1999 9:25 AM > You want to talk about kicking yourself? I live an hour away from San > Francisco, but I didn't get the message about the show until *MONDAY* > because of Stupid Email Server Tricks. Gah! Just don't kick yourselves for missing the Fushitsusha concert at the Bottom of the Hill, Friday night, November 12, in SF. Gaji and Subarachnoid Space will be playing from 10-12 or so. You've all been warned... Later, Ben http://www.bigfoot.com/~bvergara/ ICQ# 12832406 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rob Allaert" Subject: forget Masada in Antwerp Date: 20 Oct 1999 23:46:50 +0200 Hi, I guess that someone who told me he was close to the concert organizer, got it really wrong about Masada playing once again in Belgium. I would go for the Stephen Drury story. He should know, he's playing :-) Sorry about the confusion. Rob - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Aaron Chee-Kean Chua Subject: Re: CHAPIN ~ Date: 21 Oct 1999 11:04:56 +1000 (EST) my first experience with Chapin was Anima which i loved so much that i went back to get the Trio + Brass disc( which was on sale too!).the energy level on the trio +brass disc on some tracks is incredible. i think that disc was recorded live at the KF. the highlight for me perhaps on this discis Golgotham which is a pretty energetic piece that's nearly 20 minuteslong.( it's kind of weird how he's so out of breath and thanking the audiece but from the applause it doesn't sound as if there were many there on the night of the recording.) there are also a couple of short trio pieces on there too. Anima on the other hand is a studio recording (from memory).his flute playing on the last track Lift Off is pretty amazing. perhaps for sheer sweaty exuberance (+ the brass section gives you more bangfor your buck) start with the ...+brass disc. (mind you i haven't heard his other discs so perhaps take this with a pinch of salt...: ) ) just my 2 cents, aaron On Wed, 20 Oct 1999, Jason Tors wrote: > Can someone suggest a good starter album? > > thanks! > > > - > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Whit Schonbein Subject: FMP + coda magazine + accordians? Date: 20 Oct 1999 23:19:05 -0500 (CDT) hello every one, perhaps someone on this list can help me. the clues are: latest issue of coda magazine, one-page review of three cds on FMP, one of the cds may contain the word 'cowws'. this cd was made by having performers record snippets which were later assembled by the composer. there is a picture of the composer in the upper right hand corner with two accordians or accordian-like instruments. the question is: who is the composer (this is driving me nuts) and what is the album. Sincere apologies if this has been discussed recently, as i recall some talk going on about FMP (but wasn't paying much attention). thanks! whit - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: Re: FMP + coda magazine + accordians? Date: 21 Oct 1999 00:30:01 EDT In a message dated 10/21/99 12:22:21 AM, whit@twinearth.wustl.edu writes: << hello every one, perhaps someone on this list can help me. the clues are= : latest issue of coda magazine, one-page review of three cds on FMP, one of the cds may contain the word 'cowws'. this cd was made by having performers record snippets which were later assembled by the composer. there is a picture of the composer in the upper right hand corner with two accordians or accordian-like instruments. the question is: who is the composer (this is driving me nuts) and what is the album. Sincere apologies if this has been discussed recently, as i recall some talk going on about FMP (but wasn't paying much attention). >> I don't have the issue of Coda in question, but I'm sure this is it: OWN-90007/8/9:=A0=A0BOOK/VIRTUAL COWWS - R=FCdiger Carl=20 CDs 1 and 2: Bergisch-Brandenburgisches Quartett; R=FCdiger Carl solo;=20 Carl-Reichel duo; Carl-Thompson duo; Carl-Reichel-Altena; Carl-Sachse-Unruh;= =20 Carl-Schweitzer-Moholo; Carl-Schweitzer-Sommer;=20 Carl-Schweitzer-Dyani-Bennink; Cowws Quintett; Cowws Quintet + Lupa Herz;=20 Cowws Quintet + Mayo Thompson; Jailhouse; Main Quartett; Night and Day and=20 Lol Coxhill; September Band Recorded 1979-1996=20 CD 3: Cowws Quintet: R=FCdiger Carl: clarinet, accordion; Ir=E8ne Schweitzer= :=20 piano, percussion; Phil Wachsmann: violin, electronics; Stephen Wittwer:=20 guitar; Arjen Gorter: bass Recorded November 1996, Bern (173:00)=20 Own is a sublabel of FMP. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rob Allaert" Subject: Masada songs in Middelheim Date: 21 Oct 1999 10:54:03 +0200 Hi, This might interest some of you. These are the tracks from "Masada live at Middelheim" and from which Masada album they came: Nevuah M7 Sippur Issachar Hath-Arob M7 Kedushah M9 Ne'eman M8 Karet M9 Kochot M9 Piram M2 Paran M5 Ashnah M1 Tahah M1 Having an official CD release on my first Masada live experience, it's just too much :-) Rob - Belgium. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard@rcvs.org.uk Subject: Musings update Date: 21 Oct 1999 10:35:44 +0100 First of all, a note to let you know that (musings) has just been updated with reviews and MP3s of music from Peter Brotzmann to John Cage to Deplete Coitus. Pay us a visit at http://www.geocities.com/soho/square/6100. Secondly, it's always interesting to revisit the name game when it comes to genres. Personally I actually find it helpful when record shops have an "experimental" section. Usually it means there's someone there who's into the music and wants to promote it, and it does make browsing easier. FTR, when Richard Sanderson used to work in the jazz section of HMV on Oxford Street, London, he instituted a rather helpful "experimental" section which, on his departure, was promptly dismantled, and levels of stock for people like Derek Bailey have dropped as a result. Another anecdote: I used to shop at a place called Probe Records in Liverpool. It's not longer as good as it was for experimental stuff but it used to have a section headed "well weird" which I used to buy from almost blind, and discovered all sorts of people that way. My guess would be that, again, someone had an interest and wanted to help sales and that that person moved on. Probe is still OK, but not the bastion of avant oddness it used to be. Also, putting players like John Butcher in the classical section would be rather unexpected, and finding Braxton's orchestral pieces filed under "jazz" just feels silly. I understand Ken's points about possible racial undertones, and maybe the situations in the US and UK aren't directly comparable, but when a shop has a section headed "well weird" then I'm usually happy. Just some thoughts, Rich (musings): reviews (with MP3s) of new improv, free jazz and avant-electronic releases. http://come.to/musings.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Rob Allaert" Subject: Antwerp update Date: 21 Oct 1999 12:03:47 +0200 Ok, This is confirmed information: Zorn ensemble (17 Nov 1999 at 8.00 PM) Bourla Schouwburg Komedieplaats 18 B-2000 Antwerp A, B, C seats A = 900 BEF C= 400 BEF Reservations: ++32-(0)3-224.88.44 Payment : 402-8136002-27 Go for it! Rob. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: DR S WILKIE Subject: Re: Categories for Filing / Chapin Date: 21 Oct 1999 11:17:45 GMT0BST Not to rehash old ground (re: filing at home) but I was intrigued to discover both Ed Vesala's Lumi and Terje Rypdal's first ECm album filed under New Age/Relaxation in Cardiff Central Public Library. I'd recommend Anima as a Chapin start-up album, on the not- particularly scientific grounds that it was the first one i got, after hearing a trio concert broadcast, and I've never looked back ... it's raw and powerful, and also contains some particularly beautiful flautism (!?) - it's on Knitting Factory Works. Sean - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Simon Hopkins Subject: Re: Categories for Filing / Chapin Date: 21 Oct 1999 12:39:11 +0400 >Not to rehash old ground (re: filing at home) but I was intrigued to >discover both Ed Vesala's Lumi and Terje Rypdal's first ECm album >filed under New Age/Relaxation in Cardiff Central Public Library. hee hee. not that i want to out-do you, sean, but shortly after it came out, i found spy vs spy in the new age section of virgin records, marble arch, london. that'd spice up the average isolation tank session. simon np: univers zero: "the hard quest" simon hopkins is a member of the state51 conspiracy http://motion.state51.co.uk reviews | features | services - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu Subject: New Old Braxton on hatOLOGY Date: 21 Oct 1999 09:16:44 -0400 The hat webpage lists, as a release in preparation, a Braxton disc called, "Quintett [sic], Basel, 1977". Anyone have any personnel details on this? Francesco? Also due is the cd reissue of a fine Lacy solo record, 'Clinkers', from 1978. Brian Olewnick - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: kurt_gottschalk@scni.com Subject: chapin/connors Date: 21 Oct 1999 10:59:02 -0500 For Thos. Chapin releases, I'll go with Anima as a starting point, but just so that you know what you're starting from. The trio was fantastic, Mario Pavone is an excellent bassist whose own recordings (one with Braxton) are worth checking as well. Knowing the strength of the trio only adds to the greatness of my two faves, +Brass (already mentioned) and +Strings. On both discs, the added instrumentation is integrated very thoughtfully and plays an equal role in the compositions. Chapin was a fascinating composer. If, however, you think you might only get one, I'd suggest Sky Piece, what used to be his last recording although now the Knit has a new last recording coming out (maybe Sky Piece was the last one he'd intended for release?). The one I'm not too into, try as I might, is the Borah Bergman duet. Any other opinions on this? I finally picked up the Haunted House cd. I really like it, and I'm pretty sure I was at both of the gigs where it was recorded. But the band has grown so much in the 6ish months since those sets that I hope another recording is in the works (Jon?). I like Suzanne, although on some of the duet discs from a few years back she's barely noticeable. But I saw HHouse last night and they were huge, thunderous. Neel Murgai is incredibly sensitive and attentive and really propels the music. It's interesting to me, too, that LMC chose a second guitar rather than a bass. I wonder why? Last night at Tonic the quartet played a long, very fluid set, with about 30 minutes of playing before adding Warhol factory era photos and slides by poet/filmmaker Gerald Malanga (sp?). Then Malanga joined them and read a long poem remembering Kerouac but more just about NYC at the time. Then the quartet did one last song. It was all so beautifully seamless, and whether it was the guitars, slides or the poet, Murgai was right there and always supplementing the focus. His growth in the group may be the main thing that has pushed them forward over the last 6 mos. Then Zubi Zuva, Yoshida solo, Akaten, Tsuyama solo, Ruins, Ruins + Tsuyama. So much music last night. I like Suzanne, especially in HHouse, but I haven't cared as much for her discs with Loren's accompaniment (The Enchanted Forest and, I believe it's called Let The Darkness Fall). But then I'm not as interested in words as notes. I get enough words during the day. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Ken Waxman Subject: Re: FMP + coda magazine + accordians? Date: 21 Oct 1999 12:24:54 -0400 (EDT) Rudiger Carl and COWWS On Wed, 20 Oct 1999, Whit Schonbein wrote: > there is a picture of the composer in the upper right hand corner with two > accordians or accordian-like instruments. the question is: who > is the composer (this is driving me nuts) and what is the album. > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Nvinokur@aol.com Subject: Lounge Lizards Date: 21 Oct 1999 13:22:55 EDT LOUNGE LIZARDS CELEBRATE 20 YEARS The Lounge Lizards celebrates its 20th year with a series of November concerts at the Knitting Factory in New York. FULL STORY: http://p01.com/s.d?YECrec8 e=/cdnow.com/allstararticle/fid=20788 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: James Livingston Subject: Re: Wee Willie Date: 21 Oct 1999 11:19:14 -0700 (PDT) Willy is being replaced while he is away for the Zorn gigs by the formidible talent of Ches Smith (from Theory of Ruin, and the Contemporary Performance Ensemble @ Mills). Ches has been rehearsing with Willi and Bungle up until they split town a couple days ago. Theory of Ruin plays the Tip Top in SF tonight. Ches recommended earplugs in addition to ear muffs. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Theodorus@webtv.net (Theodorus Klaase) Subject: Taboo and such... Date: 21 Oct 1999 14:39:39 -0400 (EDT) What's the deal with the new Zorn album? It went from having a release date in October to having one in early November to now Mid-November (according to CDNOW)... What is going on? -Theodorus - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Theodorus@webtv.net (Theodorus Klaase) Subject: News for Lulu Date: 21 Oct 1999 15:08:17 -0400 (EDT) I've tried to order this album everywhere, and no one seems to be able to get it... Anyone have any suggestions? Email me privately, Thanks.... -Theo - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Paul Audino Subject: Re: News for Lulu Date: 21 Oct 1999 17:13:53 -0500 (CDT) On Thu, 21 Oct 1999, Theodorus Klaase wrote: > I've tried to order this album everywhere, and no one seems to be able > to get it... Anyone have any suggestions? Email me privately, > Thanks.... It's more than likely out of print now that HatArt has switched to their policy of limited-runs only. Cadence (www.cadencebuilding.com) still lists both News For Lulu and the follow-up More News For Lulu as being available, so you might want to try there first. Paul psaudino@interaccess.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Diego Gruber Subject: Re: Categories for Filing / Chapin Date: 21 Oct 1999 13:21:48 -0500 Well here on Tower thay have a couple of Filmworks, Locus Solus, and three copies of Spy vs. Spy filed under rock/soul, and they moved them because they had'em on the New Age section well after having them on the jazz section. They just don't know where to put'em. And besieds a copy of Spillane which someone bought a while ago i've noticed i'm the only person who's bought Zorn records since they opened like a year ago. I know because their stock is the same as it was on the beggining(taht isn't too surprising considering this is Ecuador i'm writing from), and they are so incredibly high priced. Same thing about Bill Frissel records, or even Ornette's. There are a coupl of other Tzaadik records but so few i almost didn't notice. D > > hee hee. not that i want to out-do you, sean, but shortly after it came > out, i found spy vs spy in the new age section of virgin records, marble > arch, london. that'd spice up the average isolation tank session. > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jeroen de Boer" Subject: NY Underground Film Festival (no Zorn content) Date: 22 Oct 1999 16:41:43 +0200 Hi all, The following email was forwarded to me by filmdirector Nathalie Beekman, who is a close friend of mine. Her film "Emergo" is featured in the below mentioned festival. Interesting for the members of zornlist however are the showings of three films by another promising director from the Netherlands: Ian Kerkhof. His films feature music by Otomo Yoshihide and Merzbow. If you have the chance to see one of these films, don't hesitate. I haven't seen the Merzbow documentary, but I did see Shabondama Elegy at this years Rotterdam Film Festival and it's rather controversial. Best wishes, Jeroen de Boer ********************************************************************* ********************************************************************* BAMcin=E9matek and New York Underground Film Festival Present XENO International Film Festival - Cinema from the New Europe XENO introduces the art of film to BAM's annual Next Wave Festival with ten feature films and more than fifty shorts from October 22-24 and 29-31 "XENO is not your typical survey of European cinema," promises New York Underground Film Festival Director Ed Halter. "We've curated an exciting mix of works drawn from the pulsating rhythms of European subcultures, the outer reaches of underground film and the adventurous realms of the avant-garde." XENO International Film Festival opens with the U.S. premiere of Austria's street-stylish youth drama, Slidin' Bright and Shiny World (1998), directed by Reinhard Jud, Michael Grimm and up-and-coming filmmaker Barbara Albert. Another of Albert's films, a 20-minute short entitled Sunspots (1998), will be presented on October 30 and 31. The closing film on October 31 features the U.S. premiere of critically acclaimed director Fred Kelemen's harrowing epic, Nightfall (1999). Shot with an expressive blend of 35mm and video, Nightfall comes to BAM Rose Cinemas straight from its world premiere at the Toronto Film Festival. Of the ten feature films presented, six were shot on digital video, the cutting-edge format that has been embraced by innovative filmmakers on both sides of the Atlantic. Controversial Netherlands-based underground filmmaker Ian Kerkhof is represented with three feature-length digital works and one world premiere via the Internet. XENO presents the New York premieres of Kerkhof's violent and erotic Shabondama Elegy (1999) and two confrontational documentaries, Beyond Ultra Violence: Uneasy Listening by Merzbow (1997) and Roxy: No Other Drugs Required (1998). Sonicfragments, a digital, long-form music short by Kerkhof will make its world premiere on the Internet's Ifilm network (www.ifilm.com). Other digital features at XENO include Spain's Blablabla (1998), directed by Juan Carlos Bonete; the Netherlands' Emergo! (1998), directed by Nathalie Beekman; and the UK's Goldie: When Saturn Returnz (1998), directed by John Akomfrah. Jeroen de Boer co-director Cyberslag Foundation music director Open Electronic Festival Munnekeholm 10 9711 JA Groningen, The Netherlands usva-th1@bureau.rug.nl J.T.de.Boer@let.rug.nl tel. 0031 (0)50-3637513 fax. 0031 (0)50-3632209 http://www.cyberslag.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "wetboy" Subject: sanders/sharrock reunion Date: 22 Oct 1999 11:00:07 -0700 does any1 have info (band, setlist, etc) re: a radio broadcast from frankfurt germany of this show from 11-1-92? (i guess the date is in american style, but i'm not sure). "and you, young skywalker. we will watch your career with great interest." criterion ld/dvd info: http://www.geocities.com/sunsetstrip/vine/9374 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: fas Subject: ruins dates Date: 22 Oct 1999 22:56:20 +0200 sorry for posting this late, but i just subscribed to this mailing list today, so... at least all you europeans can look forward to a couple of ruins concerts. this is from the official magaibutsu (= ruins' label) homepage: http://www.geocities.co.jp/Hollywood-Kouen/9347/ruins.html --Japanese New Music Festival -- USA Tour 10/16-10/20 (Ruins,Akaten,ZubiZuva-X,Yoshida solo,Tsuyama Solo) 10-16 Los Angeles (UCLA) ---canceled 10-17 San Francisco (Cocodrie) 10-18 Austin ---canceled 10-19 Chicago (Fireside Bowl) 10-20 New York (Tonic) --Japanese New Music Festival -- EUROPE Tour 10/27-11/29 (Ruins,Akaten,ZubiZuva-X,Yoshida solo,Tsuyama Solo) 10-27 Copenhagen (Vega) 10-28 Hamburg (Molotov) 10-29 Berlin (Maria am Ostbahnhof) 10-30 Hannover (Silke Arp Bricht) 11-01 Brussel (Ancienne Belgique) 11-04 Nantes (Pannonica) 11-05 Reims (Mjc Paul Claudel) 11-06 Valenciennes (Structure Ephemere) 11-07 Paris (Batofar) 11-08 Pau (Ampli) ---canceled 11-09 Bordeaux (Zoobizarre) 11-10 Toulouse (Izimobil) 11-11 Nimes ---canceled 11-12 Metz (festival des Musiques Volantes) 11-13 Villeurbanne (Pezner) 11-14 Berne (Reithalle) 11-17 Geneve (L'Usine) 11-19 Firenze (Flog) 11-20 Entracque (Cuneo) Capolinea 11-21 Rome (Brancaleone) 11-23 Milano (Tunnell) 11-24 Trento (Angi) 11-25 Zagreb (KSET) 11-26 Budapest(info:http://trottel.mentha.hu) 11-27 Wien (RHIZ) 11-29 Prague(festival altanativa) f. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: pm.carey@utoronto.ca (Patrick Carey) Subject: Mixed FS list Date: 22 Oct 1999 16:59:14 -0400 Hello ... I have items FS by the following artists (and many others) at the URL at the bottom of this message. Please check out the list and email if anything interests you. Anti-Group, Arsenal, Bernhard G=FCnter, Borbetomagus, Christoph Heemann, Crawl Unit, DJ Spooky, Eye & Otomo, Faith No More, Gold Water, Hanatarash, Jesus Lizard, Liminal, Masonna, Merzbow, Moonshake, Various Artists (Thorsten Profrock), X-Ecutioners, Zeni Geva. --- Prices are in _US $_ and are POSTAGE PAID within North America. Shipping on orders outside NA can be arranged. If you don't like the prices, please make me an OFFER. --- Thanks -Patrick pm.carey@utoronto.ca http://www.astro.utoronto.ca/~carey/sofa/muse.html - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: fas Subject: jz europe shows/vienna Date: 22 Oct 1999 23:22:09 +0200 here's the setlist for the upcoming vienna concert on nov.20th,1999: (taken from http://www.konzerthaus.at ) John Zorn Saxophon Jennifer Choi Violine Erik Friedlander Violoncello Stephen Drury Klavier William Winant Schlagzeug Music for children (1996) Untitled (for Joseph Cornell) for cello solo (1999) Le Momo (1999) Amour Fou (1999) Hockey / Game piece for 3 players (1978) Lacrosse / Game piece for 4 players (1977) Dead ringer for piano solo (1983) Carny for piano solo (1992) Composition for 2 percussionists Solo piece for saxophon f. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mike Chamberlain Subject: Re: winter & winter (no zorn) Date: 22 Oct 1999 19:57:53 -0400 Martin Wisckol wrote: > > anybody have a web address for winter & winter records? thanks. > > - Martin, Try this. I got it when I interviewed Mr. Winter a few weeks back. http://www.winter-winter.njetwork.de I haven't tried it yet myself. --Mike -- Mike Chamberlain Teacher, Writer, Broadcaster, Father, Farmer, Baseball Fan, Jazz Nerd, Sumo Nut, Bald Guy "I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused." - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: AlphaM11@aol.com Subject: Faust Date: 22 Oct 1999 20:43:34 EDT i forget who, but someone a while back asked if anyone was going to the Faust SF show. i am. guido -thefleshcoloredrobot - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Rich Williams Subject: Re: sanders/sharrock reunion Date: 22 Oct 1999 21:13:21 -0400 >does any1 have info (band, setlist, etc) re: a radio broadcast from >frankfurt germany of this show from 11-1-92? (i guess the date is in >american style, but i'm not sure). > > >"and you, young skywalker. we will watch your career with great interest." > >criterion ld/dvd info: >http://www.geocities.com/sunsetstrip/vine/9374 > The band was Sonny, Pharoah,Charnett Moffet, and Pheeroan Aklaff. The material performed included the Ask The Ages material, Aklaff's tune "Sonogram", and material from Pharoah's Tauhid and Message from Home albums. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Mike Chamberlain Subject: Imrov Nights in Montreal [No Zorn] Date: 23 Oct 1999 09:39:39 -0400 I know it's the same weekend that the Instant Composers' Pool is in New York and Boston, but this might interest a few people. (From the press release:) Productions Traquen'art will be presenting three nights of improvised music at the Biblioth=E8que nationale Du Quebec (1700, boul. St-Denis) from November 11 to 13. Opening this event on Thursday November 11 will be the European trio "Les Diaboliques" with Irene Schweizer (piano), Jo=EBlle L=E9andre (bass) and Maggie Nichols (voice). Friday will be the Vancouver quartet of "TALKING PICTURES" on Friday November 12. On Saturday 13, this event will conclude with the stunning trio of German pianist Georg Graewe, Dutch cellist extraordinaire Ernst Reijsiger and leading American drummer Gerry Hemingway. This promises to be a very special event for those who like their jazz to have a leading edge. Following these three main concerts, there will be improvisation pools taking place each night after the main act with most of the headliners plus locals performers, including, amongst others, Sam Shelabi (guitar), Alec McSween (drums), Alexandre St-Onge (bass), who will conduct these sessions. Tickets are $12, advance, $15 at the door on concert night, and $ 10 for students, seniors, people on social assistance. A festival pass is also available for all three nights, at the modest price of $25. All tickets can be purchased at l'Oblique (4333 Rivard, corner Marie-Anne), Cheap Thrills (2044 Metcalfe), le Rayon Laser (3656 St-Laurent), the office of Productions Traquen'Art (372 Ste-Catherine, Suite 124), or through all Admission Ticket counters (790-1245). Concerts start at 8:30 PM. --Mike --=20 Mike Chamberlain Teacher, Writer, Broadcaster, Father, Farmer, Baseball Fan, Jazz Nerd, Sumo Nut, Bald Guy=20 "I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused." - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: philz Subject: American Splendor Date: 23 Oct 1999 13:38:01 -0400 I don't recall seeing it mentioned here, so I thought I'd pass this on. The latest issue of Harvey Pekar's "American Splendor" comic ("Terminal" from Dark Horse publishing) features a two page article on John Zorn, drawn by Joe Sacco, talking about Zorn's relationship to jewish music and jazz, and Harvey's insightful comments regarding that relationship. It also includes a cameo drawing of my favorite record store owner, Bruce Gallanter of Downtown Music Gallery. The rest of the book deals with various jazz and blues artists (Lonnie Johnson, Arthur Whetsoe, the Hammond B-3) and then the usual rants and comments by Harvey. philz - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Orangejazz@aol.com Subject: Great American Mavericks + Question for Stephen Drury Date: 23 Oct 1999 20:05:05 EDT Zorn has mentioned the great American Mavericks in past interviews, articles, and that sort of thing..He's mentioned Cage, Ives, and I believe Nancarrow, does anyone on the list know of any of the other American Mavericks? I also had a question for Stephen Drury, knowing that he posts on the list occasionally. This seems to be fairly Zorn relevant. anyway, What sort of music shaped your formative years and how did those pieces/albums effect you on a personal level? from, matt - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: IOUaLive1@aol.com Subject: Re: free grass Date: 24 Oct 1999 20:03:46 EDT Sorry about the way late reply, but the band Free Grass is Tony Trischka, Gregg Bendiann, and someone else... I have not yet seen them, and as far as I know they dont have any recordings out. Email Gregg at Abbidoshi@aol.com for more info on this group. -Jody - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: IOUaLive1@aol.com Subject: Re: free grass Date: 24 Oct 1999 20:03:46 EDT Sorry about the way late reply, but the band Free Grass is Tony Trischka, Gregg Bendiann, and someone else... I have not yet seen them, and as far as I know they dont have any recordings out. Email Gregg at Abbidoshi@aol.com for more info on this group. -Jody - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Andreas Dietz" Subject: Re: sanders/sharrock reunion Date: 25 Oct 1999 08:57:34 CEST >From: Rich Williams > >>does any1 have info (band, setlist, etc) re: a radio broadcast from >>frankfurt germany of this show from 11-1-92? (i guess the date is in >>american style, but i'm not sure). > > The band was Sonny, Pharoah,Charnett Moffet, and Pheeroan >Aklaff. The material performed included the Ask The Ages material, >Aklaff's tune "Sonogram", and material from >Pharoah's Tauhid and Message from Home albums. > > This great show happened on November the 1st 1992. Here are three of the titles: Little Rock Venus Money Manners Andreas Dietz ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: =?iso-8859-1?q?A?= Subject: Merzbow documentary Date: 25 Oct 1999 12:54:56 -0700 (PDT) If anyone can in some way get a copy of the Merzbow documentary that just got mentioned, I´d LOVE to see that. This weekend I got the Gotham and Igneous Ejaculation clips, the Igneous one is absolutely incredible, gotta love an enema...I also got that Naked City at the NY Marquee, that is also great beyond belief, because I never expected a Naked City show to be broadcast on TV, not even in Japan so... Anyway, if someone can get that documentary, you know what to do A ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jason Walton Subject: Re: Merzbow documentary Date: 25 Oct 1999 16:14:07 -0700 (PDT) Id like to get a copy of this as well, as well as the naked city japanese broadcast. J --- A wrote: > If anyone can in some way get a copy of the Merzbow > documentary that > just got mentioned, I´d LOVE to see that. This > weekend I got the > Gotham and Igneous Ejaculation clips, the Igneous > one is absolutely > incredible, gotta love an enema...I also got that > Naked City at the > NY Marquee, that is also great beyond belief, > because I never > expected a Naked City show to be broadcast on TV, > not even in Japan > so... > Anyway, if someone can get that documentary, you > know what to do > A > > ===== > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com > > - > > ===== Nothing 801 University Ave. S.E. #23 Minneapolis, MN 55414 Nothing_grey@yahoo.com http://www.mythosmedia.com/nothing http://www.thais.it/eibon __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dan Hewins Subject: Re: oh yeah i should tell u where its posted Date: 25 Oct 1999 20:05:40 -0400 Hey, I checked deja.com for the newsgroup and I didn't find the dave douglas show. Is there somewhere on the web that it resides? Thanks, Dan Hewins At 8:51 PM -0700 10/16/99, wetboy wrote: >u c? the yankees get pummelled and i lose all sense of reality. the dave >douglas quartet mp3s were posted in alt.binaries.sounds.mp3.bootlegs > >whoops > > >"and you, young skywalker. we will watch your career with great interest." > >criterion ld/dvd info: >http://www.geocities.com/sunsetstrip/vine/9374 > > >- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dan Hewins Subject: Re: oh yeah i should tell u where its posted Date: 25 Oct 1999 20:05:40 -0400 Hey, I checked deja.com for the newsgroup and I didn't find the dave douglas show. Is there somewhere on the web that it resides? Thanks, Dan Hewins At 8:51 PM -0700 10/16/99, wetboy wrote: >u c? the yankees get pummelled and i lose all sense of reality. the dave >douglas quartet mp3s were posted in alt.binaries.sounds.mp3.bootlegs > >whoops > > >"and you, young skywalker. we will watch your career with great interest." > >criterion ld/dvd info: >http://www.geocities.com/sunsetstrip/vine/9374 > > >- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Zachary J. Griffin" Subject: Re: Merzbow documentary Date: 25 Oct 1999 22:13:49 -0400 To A: I also have a Naked City at the Marquee video. But mine has no indication of it being a japanese television documentary. Can you email me privately (when you have the time) about the show contents on your video? Thank you. To the rest of the Zornlist: I am also interested in that Merzbow documentary. Also, if this has been discussed before I subscribed to the list, then I apologize for bringing it up again. I came across a video titled "Jewish Soul, American Beat". It's a documentary about people in the Jewish men and women re-connecting to Judaism. The beginning and end of the video has a brief interview with John Zorn. As well as footage of a Masada performance. Zach Griffin A wrote: > If anyone can in some way get a copy of the Merzbow documentary that > just got mentioned, I=B4d LOVE to see that. This weekend I got the > Gotham and Igneous Ejaculation clips, the Igneous one is absolutely > incredible, gotta love an enema...I also got that Naked City at the > NY Marquee, that is also great beyond belief, because I never > expected a Naked City show to be broadcast on TV, not even in Japan > so... > Anyway, if someone can get that documentary, you know what to do > A > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com > > - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Zachary J. Griffin" Subject: Re: Merzbow documentary Date: 25 Oct 1999 22:22:12 -0400 The sentence was supposed to read: "It is a documentary about Jewish men = and women re-connecting to Judaism". Sorry for the typo. Zach "Zachary J. Griffin" wrote: > To A: > I also have a Naked City at the Marquee video. But mine has no > indication of it being a japanese television documentary. Can you emai= l > me privately (when you have the time) about the show contents on your > video? Thank you. > > To the rest of the Zornlist: > I am also interested in that Merzbow documentary. Also, if this has > been discussed before I subscribed to the list, then I apologize for > bringing it up again. I came across a video titled "Jewish Soul, > American Beat". It's a documentary about people in the Jewish men and > women re-connecting to Judaism. The beginning and end of the video has > a brief interview with John Zorn. As well as footage of a Masada > performance. > > Zach Griffin > > A wrote: > > > If anyone can in some way get a copy of the Merzbow documentary that > > just got mentioned, I=B4d LOVE to see that. This weekend I got the > > Gotham and Igneous Ejaculation clips, the Igneous one is absolutely > > incredible, gotta love an enema...I also got that Naked City at the > > NY Marquee, that is also great beyond belief, because I never > > expected a Naked City show to be broadcast on TV, not even in Japan > > so... > > Anyway, if someone can get that documentary, you know what to do > > A > > > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com > > > > - > > - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: new purchases Date: 25 Oct 1999 23:18:05 EDT there have been an whole bunch of great CDs released over the past couple of weeks. here are some mini-reviews, roughly in reverse order of how much I like them, although you won't go wrong buying any of these. Pita-Get Out (Mego) If you recall the discussion on this list a few months back about electroacoustic improvisation, you may remember that I said I felt this was a nascent genre in which the best performers were just coming into their own. well, this is Pita's (Peter Rehberg, from Vienna) second solo CD, and it's very accomplished. if you saw him perform his set at Tonic over the summer, it's very reminiscent of that, full of ideas and harsh textures. the one reservation I have, after two listens, is that I often have trouble finding much of a human element in his music. but this still stands as a very coherent statement from one of the most sophisticated electronic musicians around. ICP Orchestra-Jubilee Varia (hatOLOGY) Kevin Whitehead equates this band in the liner notes to the Ellington Orchestr a circa 1937-1944. now while that's a bit on the silly side, which even he admits, it is a crime that they have barely been documented on disc so far. this was recorded in late '97, and is the 9 man version of the lineup, with the only difference from the lineup that will be at Tonic on November 12 being Ernst Reijseger, who has left the band in the interim. this CD begins with three long pieces from subgroups of the band: an 8 minute duet by Mengelberg and Bennink, a 10 minute piece by the string trio of Reijseger, Honsinger and Glerum, and another 10 minute piece by the horn section of Moore, Baars, Heberer, and Wierbos. then the second half of the disc is the entire band playing together. while I'm sure it's no substitute for seeing the band live, it's a very satisfying document of an underrecorded band. Gunter Muller/Taku Sugimoto/Otomo Yoshihide/Masahiko Okura-Metal Tastes Like Orange (Amoebic) this is an improv disc, recorded in July of 1998, with Muller and Okura on all of the tracks and Otomo and Sugimoto on about half, respectively. if the only unfamiliar name here is Okura, he's an alto player whose most noteworthy previous work has been in the Dub Sonic Roots projects (documented on various Japanese labels, and some of the better attempts to fuse free jazz with electronica, although still not wholly successful). anyway, the tone of this disc seems to be set by Muller and Sugimoto, as most of it tends towards the subtly quiet, although Okura does go off a few times toward the end of the disc. not essential, but a nice document for fans of these artists, and maybe one that will grow on me with multiple listens. Fennesz-plus forty seven degrees 56' 37" minus sixteen degrees 51' 08" (Touch) Christian Fennesz is another of the Viennese Powerbook musicians who got his start on the Mego label, although this one (his second full-length) is on the English label Touch. it's in much the same vein as the Pita, but there's a warmth to Fennesz's work, even when he's filling the room with noise. also like the Pita, this one's short, 38 minutes, but I can't imagine it ending and someone needing more. very good, if maybe not the equal of his first full-length, Hotel Paral_lel (Mego). Jim O'Rourke/Loren Mazzacane-In Bern (hat Noir) this features two of the more prolific artists of our time in a guitar duo from 12/97, recorded live. it's a gorgeous record, with Jim bringing out the most subtle and delicate persona of Loren's. really pleasurable, and one of the better places to start delving into the Mazzacane catalog. Otomo Yoshihde-Cathode (Tzadik) now this is the masterpiece we've been waiting for (expecting?) from Otomo. four long compositions, only one of which Otomo plays on, totalling 55 minutes. each piece has very different instrumentation, but all seem to meld traditional instruments with the tone-based electronics which Otomo has been focusing on lately. one of my current candidates for record of the year, and maybe the best record yet from Otomo. I really feel like we're in a time where, if you're interested, you can watch the genre of electroacoustic improv mature before your eyes, much like rap in the early nineties. above, I've reviewed the latest releases by three contenders for the throne (Pita, Fennesz, Otomo), and in late November, the Erstwhile entry in this sweepstakes will be released, a double CD of German synth player Thomas Lehn and Gerry Hemingway, and you can judge for yourselves where Mr. Lehn fits in. pretty damn high, if you ask me. Jon www.erstwhilerecords.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Alexander Blok Subject: re: new purchases Date: 26 Oct 1999 01:53:26 -0400 Hi folks,=20 >Pita-Get Out (Mego)=20 (...) >it's very reminiscent of that, full of ideas and harsh textures. the one=20 >reservation I have, after two listens, is that I often have trouble finding= =20 >much of a human element in his music.=20 >Fennesz-plus forty seven degrees 56' 37" minus sixteen degrees 51' 08" =20 (...) >English label Touch. it's in much the same vein as the Pita, but there's a= =20 >warmth to Fennesz's work, even when he's filling the room with noise. also= =20 >like the Pita, this one's short, 38 minutes, but I can't imagine it ending= =20 >and someone needing more. very good, if maybe not the equal of his first=20 >full-length, Hotel Paral_lel (Mego). I think these are both great recommendations by Jon, but my reactions to them differ just a little. 'Get Out' for me is one of the releases of the year and a great display of powerful sonic disorientation. There's just so little to relate with on this disc, everything sounds 'negative' and treated to the extreme. Admittedly, it is very abrasive, turbulent, and disturbing; yet never less than utterly absorbing.=20 I think the new Fennesz disc is a solid step forward from 'Hotel Paral.llel'. The texture of the digital drone has become much more refined, but there's hardly a trace of the Techno element which used to motor some of his tracks. If you're looking for a more difficult and abstract 'Hotel Paral.lel' (i.e., strip away the already-sparse beats, tone down the variety, etc.), then 'plus forty seven...' is highly recommended. It's music of characteristic deftness, but at times I'm left hankering for a piece (or a type of sound) to take some leap in a new direction. For me, Pita wins this round for being more imaginative. Of course, anything negative I've implied here does not apply to the MBV-ish bliss-drone track, Track 5. An absolutely beautiful 8-minute treat for the senses, which sounds like Fennesz took his laptop into a carwash. Overall, it's a beautiful disc but it takes many listens to sit still for the imaging. Once again, Mego proves it's not just about the electronic music mothership spinning out of orbit.=20 Anyway, I just got back from a short visit to London, and am exhausted, so I'll end here.=20 Goodnight, -eric. -- $..:=A6=A6=A6=A6=B2 2933.43344Z=20 powered by caffeine=20 http:// - 10100 00000 10000 01011 011 000 - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "john rust" Subject: Re:Merzbow Documentary; Jewish Soul/American Beat Date: 26 Oct 1999 11:17:04 +0200 Hi, I've just read about this video: >I came across a video titled "Jewish Soul, American Beat". It's a documentary about people in the Jewish men and women re-connecting to Judaism. The beginning and end of the video has a brief interview with John Zorn. As well as footage of a Masada >performance. ...., which made me think about a film I found in the library here in Berlin, and I thought that it may be the same one.... but I'm not sure, there are some differences that can make one think differently... The one I'm talking about is called Sabbath In Paradise, and it was filmed in NY by a German director. The topic of the film is Jewish music and Judaism, the other stars except Zorn (man, I wish these guys would pay him more attention) are Anthony Coleman, Marc Ribot, Roy Nathanson and some more traditional musicians playin' klezmer. Some of the stars (although I made a copy of the movie, I haven't watched it recently, and not sure now whether I remember the details properly) are reading a story about a Rabbi spendin' a weekend in Paradise (was it Coleman), others talk and play. There are two pieces of Masada, featuring also a piece of the rehearsal, Zorn paciently explaining Baron how to play drums.... The soundtrack was also written by Zorn (possibly somewhere on Filmworks, but I'm not sure as I own not all of them). Well, now after putting down all these details i became pretty sure that it's a different documentary. BTW, anyone interested in trading for a copy ? John www.freespeech.org/unterwasser U N T E R W A S S E R Underground Russian/German band from Berlin - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jeroen de Boer" Subject: Merzbow documentary Date: 26 Oct 1999 13:06:31 +0200 Here's some info I found on Sweden's Popcorn Festival website, about Ian Kerkhof's Merzbow Documentary. (http://www.indiewire.com/film/festivals/fes_98Swedish_980612_Popco. htm l) Best wishes, Jeroen ********************************************************************* ********************************************************************* Kerkhof is a cutting edge filmmaker who perhaps encapsulated the more alternative edge of Popcorn by arriving with an experimental documentary about the likewise experimental Japanese musician Merzbow. "Beyond Ultra Violence-Uneasy Listening by Merzbow" is an uncomfortable portrait of a man who concentrates on making sounds to which few would ascribe the term "music". The video is a muddle of images and sounds that sets out to give you a feeling, not the whole picture, of a man who innovates the future. Ian Kerkhof wanted to make a video as rich and layered as Merzbow's work and says that it would be nonsense to make a BBC-style documentary about him. A scene where a girl cuts her stomach open leaving all her entrails on the floor certainly makes the video less accessible. Some fainted, some threw up and a few chose to trash their Popcorn card after the screening, deliberately provoked by Kerkhof. Jeroen de Boer co-director Cyberslag Foundation music director Open Electronic Festival Munnekeholm 10 9711 JA Groningen, The Netherlands usva-th1@bureau.rug.nl J.T.de.Boer@let.rug.nl tel. 0031 (0)50-3637513 fax. 0031 (0)50-3632209 http://www.cyberslag.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jeroen de Boer" Subject: more Merzbow info Date: 26 Oct 1999 13:10:45 +0200 Found some more info... Jeroen ********************************************************************* ********************************************************************* at: http://www.viper.ch/98/ip/ip08.html#2 Beyond Ultra Violence: uneasy listening by Merzbow Ian Kerkhof: NL 1998, 72' Inspired open form "documentary" and meditation upon the work, creative sources and ideas of the influential japanese electronic music composer Merzbow. Kerkhof works creatively to make a fierce hommage with a visual intensity and aggression that echoes the powerful effect of the sounds created by his subject. *1964 in S=FCdafrika, seit 15 Jahren in Holland. 1986 - 88 Programmacher im Amsterdamer Piratensender Radio 100, daneben Musik- und Filmjournalist 1990 Holl=E4ndische Film- und Fernsehakademie. The Mozart Bird (1993), The Dead Man 2: Return of the Dead man (1994), Nice to Meet You, Please Don't Rape Me (1994), Naar de Klote! (1996) Ian Kerkhof P.O. Box 18252 1001 ZD AMSTERDAM Tel.: 0031-20- 6720134 Jeroen de Boer co-director Cyberslag Foundation music director Open Electronic Festival Munnekeholm 10 9711 JA Groningen, The Netherlands usva-th1@bureau.rug.nl J.T.de.Boer@let.rug.nl tel. 0031 (0)50-3637513 fax. 0031 (0)50-3632209 http://www.cyberslag.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jeroen de Boer" Subject: Re: Merzbow documentary Date: 26 Oct 1999 13:13:35 +0200 Here's some info I found on Sweden's Popcorn Festival website, about Ian Kerkhof's Merzbow Documentary. (http://www.indiewire.com/film/festivals/fes_98Swedish_980612_Popco. htm l) Best wishes, Jeroen ********************************************************************* ********************************************************************* Kerkhof is a cutting edge filmmaker who perhaps encapsulated the more alternative edge of Popcorn by arriving with an experimental documentary about the likewise experimental Japanese musician Merzbow. "Beyond Ultra Violence-Uneasy Listening by Merzbow" is an uncomfortable portrait of a man who concentrates on making sounds to which few would ascribe the term "music". The video is a muddle of images and sounds that sets out to give you a feeling, not the whole picture, of a man who innovates the future. Ian Kerkhof wanted to make a video as rich and layered as Merzbow's work and says that it would be nonsense to make a BBC-style documentary about him. A scene where a girl cuts her stomach open leaving all her entrails on the floor certainly makes the video less accessible. Some fainted, some threw up and a few chose to trash their Popcorn card after the screening, deliberately provoked by Kerkhof. Jeroen de Boer co-director Cyberslag Foundation music director Open Electronic Festival Munnekeholm 10 9711 JA Groningen, The Netherlands usva-th1@bureau.rug.nl J.T.de.Boer@let.rug.nl tel. 0031 (0)50-3637513 fax. 0031 (0)50-3632209 http://www.cyberslag.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Theodorus@webtv.net (Theodorus Klaase) Subject: Taboo and Exile... Date: 26 Oct 1999 01:04:13 -0400 (EDT) I just got my hands on a copy of "Taboo and Exile".... First off, it's very diverse...even more so than Music for Children or Bar Kokhba. The opening track sounds like something that could've been from Filmworks 2... Track 10 has Zorn, Frith, Lombardo, and Laswell doing a kind of Painkiller thing. Mike Patton has a brief but memorable performance, backed up by Ribot and Quine... Two of the tracks, 4 and 12, are almost entirely percussion numbers, not unlike those featured on Filmworks 8 (Baron and Baptista)... Track 9, one of my favorites on the album, features a great Ribot solo that brings back memories of Filmworks 6.... All in all, a good Zorn record... His best, no... A must have, of course... Overall, I didn't think Zorn really broke new ground, but none the less, I love the album! P.s. How did I get the album so fast? Call 212 473 0043.... $17 -Theodorus.... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Zachary J. Griffin" Subject: Re: Merzbow Documentary; Jewish Soul/American Beat Date: 26 Oct 1999 10:45:11 -0400 john rust wrote: > > Well, now after putting down all these details i became pretty sure that > it's a different documentary. > BTW, anyone interested in trading for a copy ? > John, You are correct, it is a different documentary. Jewish Soul/American Heart deals with Zorn's music as only one aspect of the USA Jewish population returning to their roots in Judaism. And while it also features a brief performance by David Krakauer's (sp?) Klezmer Madness. It is not specifically a music documentary. > > John > > www.freespeech.org/unterwasser > U N T E R W A S S E R > Underground Russian/German > band from Berlin > > - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Stephen Fruitman Subject: Re: Jewish Soul/American Beat Date: 26 Oct 1999 16:54:18 +0200 >Jewish Soul/American Heart >deals with Zorn's music as only one aspect of the USA Jewish population >returning to their roots in Judaism. Could one get some specific info about this video - name of director, film company, addresses, websites with further information? Sounds like something I could use for teaching. All the best, Stephen Bj=F6rn Olsson, Inst. f=F6r id=E9historia, Ume=E5 universitet 901 87 Ume=E5 tel. 090-7867982 fax 143374 e-post: bjorn.olsson@idehist.umu.se - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: XRedbirdxx@aol.com Subject: mavs Date: 26 Oct 1999 12:21:28 EDT << the other American Mavericks? >> partch, antheil, robert ashley, perhaps varese - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Linares Hugo Subject: RE: Jewish Soul/American Beat Date: 26 Oct 1999 13:42:58 -0300 > >Jewish Soul/American Heart > >deals with Zorn's music as only one aspect of the USA Jewish = population > >returning to their roots in Judaism. >=20 > Could one get some specific info about this video - name of director, = film > company, addresses, websites with further information? Sounds like >=20 >=20 Seconded. The sooner the information, the better to get it. Thanks. Hugo Hugo. > -------------------------------------------------------------------- >=20 > Bj=F6rn Olsson, > Inst. f=F6r id=E9historia, > Ume=E5 universitet > 901 87 Ume=E5 > tel. 090-7867982 fax 143374 > e-post: bjorn.olsson@idehist.umu.se >=20 >=20 >=20 > - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Herb Levy Subject: Re: Great American Mavericks Date: 26 Oct 1999 17:26:59 -0500 Orangejazz@aol.com asked: >Zorn has mentioned the great American Mavericks in past interviews, articles, >and that sort of thing..He's mentioned Cage, Ives, and I believe Nancarrow, >does anyone on the list know of any of the other American Mavericks? American Mavericks was never any kind of official group, so there's not going to be total agreement on who is or is not a "member." In general, the term usually refers to composers who worked outside the usual styles, as well the more frequent teaching and/or performing loci, in the first half of this century, often with an ear towards continual experiment rather than narrowing in on a personal style. Many of these composers did not get to hear their works performed until long after they were written. In addition to the three you list (& whether Zorn mentioned him or not, I think Nancarrow's right in the pocket for this group), you might try checking out George Antheil, Johanna M Beyer, Henry Brant, Henry Cowell, Ruth Crawford Seeger, Lou Harrison, Harry Partch, Dane Rudhyar, Carl Ruggles, among others. Some of the work by some of these folks may not be of interest to you (for one thing, 50-75 years later, a lot of it may just sound like "classical music" to you), so I'd check things at a library before going on a huge shopping spree. But maybe that's just me. A book that may be useful, or at least interesting (though he gets increasingly idiosyncratic as he deals with more contemporary stuff & his very clear limitations in how he listens to improvised and electronic music make me hesitate to bring his name up on this list at all), is Kyle Gann's American Music in the 20th Century. Again, quite probably more likely worth looking at in a library. Bests, Herb Herb Levy NEW MAILING ADDRESS: P O Box 9369 Forth Wort, TX 76147 NEW PHONE: 817 377-2983 same old e-mail: herb@eskimo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: stephen drury Subject: Re: Great American Mavericks + Question for Stephen Drury Date: 26 Oct 1999 22:41:53 -0400 At 05:06 AM 10/26/99 -0600, Matt wrote: >Zorn has mentioned the great American Mavericks in past interviews, articles, >and that sort of thing..He's mentioned Cage, Ives, and I believe Nancarrow, >does anyone on the list know of any of the other American Mavericks? > >I also had a question for Stephen Drury, knowing that he posts on the list >occasionally. This seems to be fairly Zorn relevant. >anyway, What sort of music shaped your formative years and how did those >pieces/albums effect you on a personal level? Kind of a far-reaching question ... there's not really any club of American Mavericks, but other names that come to mind are Harry Partch, Henry Cowell, Carl Ruggles, Morton Feldman, Earle Brown, Edgard Varese; more recently one could include the first generation minimalists Reich, Riley, LaMonte Young, and Glass. I got a lot out of all those folks, and continue to do so, with the exception of Cowell, who seems more a technical innovater and general musical force than a composer of substance. But above all Cage and Ives, who between the two of them revolutionized the whole idea of what music is about, in terms of seriousness, connection to the real world, openness, and technique. Read Cage's "Silence" and Ives' "Essays Before a Sonata" if you want to see what I mean. Like most Americans, I've always had a (sometimes unspoken) mistrust of "culture" as high art, when it seems rarified or prettified, and Ives in particular helped me discover a spiritual urgency in music, which I also recognized immediately in Beethoven, Bach, Schoenberg, Mahler, Brahms, and more gradually in Mozart, Debussy, Chopin, Lizst, and others. Mingus, Monk and Hank Williams were tremendous revelations. I've come to dig the European moderns as well (Stockhausen, Boulez, Scelsi, Berio) and currently hear more of interest out of Europe (Ferneyhough, Sciarrino, Donatoni, Lachenmann) than over here. Always, the piano playing of Claudio Arrau. And, God help me, I spent most of high school listening to Emerson, Lake and Palmer and Blood, Sweat and Tears. I still listen to Blood, Sweat and Tears. --steve www.stephendrury.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeni Dahmus Subject: Re: Great American Mavericks/Glass & Carny Date: 27 Oct 1999 13:21:58 -0400 Since Philip Glass has been mentioned recently as one of the great American Mavericks, I thought I'd say a few words about his Dracula score. I bought the Dracula CD (performed by the Kronos Quartet) when it first came out. It's quite lovely like his other quartets--subtle but beautiful. Last night I saw the film at the Brooklyn Academy of Music, accompanied by Kronos along with Glass and Michael Riesman on keyboards. The ensemble was placed behind the screen in a circle; Glass faced the audience and Riesman conducted. Because the screen was slightly transparent (at least from my seat), the placement of the musicians created an interesting scenic design alongside the film images. I felt that the score followed the film well and was very moving. My friend hated it and found the music relentless. Perhaps it's a matter of taste... And now some Zorn content: When I was looking through Juilliard's Piano Century program, I noticed that Carny will be performed by Carl Cranmer on April 25, as part of the eleventh and final concert of the new twentieth-century piano music series. I recommend that Zorn listers in the NY area check out the series--plus it's free. There is a nice paragraph about the piece in the program notes (by Bruce Brubaker, Piano Century director). Since it's short, I'll quote it for you: "John Zorn's Carny (1992) is a true postmodern mélange. There are many, many allusions, and actual quotes from traditional and more recent piano music. What is the meaning of such disparate musical surfaces so closely juxtaposed? A carny does heavy labor at a carnival or a circus, a carny follows orders. Does that describe the situation of the concert pianist at century's end? In a single solo recital, a pianist might present music written in several wildly differing styles and stemming from divergent aesthetic intentions. Near the conclusion of Carny, there are numerous endings, one right after another. Zorn's piece is a twelve-minute museum of piano music, a summary event--the end of the century...the end of piano music?" Jeni - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: ctonelli@trentu.ca Subject: Ticket To L.A. Date: 27 Oct 1999 13:53:46 -0400 (EDT) Can anyone give suggestions of avant culture spots or events in the L.A./Hollywood area? Music, art, literature ect, stores, clubs, exhibits... Avant music obivously a priority but any other suggestions can be e-mailed directly unless related to the list. Thanks in advance, Chris - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu Subject: Ross Bolleter Date: 27 Oct 1999 14:00:23 -0400 Anyone heard anything by this guy? As near as I can tell (I may be way off), he's a contemporary Australian composer who, at least sometimes, writes for pianos which have been left out in the elements for lengthy periods of time. I suppose you could call it "cured" piano as opposed to "prepared". I think he also composes for accordion, straight or weather-battered, I don't know. We have an Aussie or two on board, eh? Someone must have heard him! Brian Olewnick (NYC Tower's downtown store actually has a vacant section for him in the classical department) - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Alan Kayser" Subject: Date: 27 Oct 1999 12:26:00 EDT SWEETNIGHTER PRODUCTIONS PRESENTS THE JOE MORRIS QUARTET TUESDAY, NOVEMBER 2, 1999, 8 & 9:30 NEW MARKET CABARET, 415 S 2ND ST, PHILADELPHIA featuring JOE MORRIS guitar, MAT MANERI violin, CHRIS LIGHTCAP bass, GERALD CLEAVER drums Tickets $12 Box Office 215-238-9488 Information 215-665-1170 (Alan) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: wlt4@mindspring.com Subject: Glass - Dracula Date: 27 Oct 1999 14:24:11 -0400 but beautiful. Last night I saw the film at the Brooklyn Academy of Music, accompanied by Kronos along with Glass and Michael Riesman on keyboards. The ensemble was placed behind the screen in a circle; >Glass >faced the audience and Riesman conducted. Because the screen was Does anybody know if the announced DVD of this is still in the works? It was to have the original film, the film w/the Glass score, the Spanish-language version and some extra documentary material. LT - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Jeni Dahmus Subject: Re: Glass - Dracula Date: 27 Oct 1999 14:42:13 -0400 wlt4@mindspring.com wrote: > Does anybody know if the announced DVD of this is still in the works? It will be released in December 1999 from Universal Studios Home Video. Jeni - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Alan Kayser" Subject: Date: 27 Oct 1999 12:26:00 EDT SWEETNIGHTER PRODUCTIONS PRESENTS THE JOE MORRIS QUARTET TUESDAY, NOVEMBER 2, 1999, 8 & 9:30 NEW MARKET CABARET, 415 S 2ND ST, PHILADELPHIA featuring JOE MORRIS guitar, MAT MANERI violin, CHRIS LIGHTCAP bass, GERALD CLEAVER drums Tickets $12 Box Office 215-238-9488 Information 215-665-1170 (Alan) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Caleb T. Deupree" Subject: Re: Ross Bolleter Date: 27 Oct 1999 18:29:18 -0400 At 02:00 PM 10/27/99 -0400, brian_olewnick@smtplink.mssm.edu wrote: > Anyone heard anything by this guy? As near as I can tell (I may be way > off), he's a contemporary Australian composer who, at least sometimes, > writes for pianos which have been left out in the elements for lengthy > periods of time. I suppose you could call it "cured" piano as opposed > to "prepared". I think he also composes for accordion, straight or > weather-battered, I don't know. He's got a selection on the excellent New Albion release, Austral Voices. And yup, it's a ruined piano, left outside in the outback for years. Most of this album is fairly restrained (including a piece by Alan Lamb), but this album closer will wake you up if you've tried to use it as sleep music. Haven't heard anything else by him, but this album is excellent all the way around. -- Caleb Deupree cdeupree@erinet.com It is pretty obvious that the debasement of the human mind caused by a constant flow of fraudulent advertising is no trivial thing. There is more than one way to conquer a country. -- Raymond Chandler - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Pratt Subject: Re: new purchases Date: 27 Oct 1999 20:13:06 -0700 (PDT) --- JonAbbey2@aol.com wrote: > > Gunter Muller/Taku Sugimoto/Otomo Yoshihide/Masahiko > Okura-Metal Tastes Like Orange (Amoebic) > > this is an improv disc, recorded in July of 1998, > with Muller and Okura on all of the tracks and Otomo > and Sugimoto on about half, respectively. if the > only unfamiliar name here is Okura, he's an alto > player whose most noteworthy previous work has been > in the Dub Sonic Roots projects (documented on > various Japanese labels, and some of the better > attempts to fuse free jazz with electronica, > although still not wholly successful). anyway, the > tone of this disc seems to be set by Muller and > Sugimoto, as most of it tends towards the subtly > quiet, although Okura does go off a few times toward > the end of the disc. not essential, but a nice > document for fans of these artists, and maybe one > that will grow on me with multiple listens. I've given this one a couple listens through and basically agree with most of what Jon says here. Just a couple things to add... I think Muller and Sugimoto work exceptionally well together here. Sugimoto's sparse and focused ringing tones/chords make the perfect compliment to Muller's heavy use of bowls, bells, bowed cymbals and other tone-oriented percussion instruments. Okura's sax is a bit of a sore thumb to the otherwise ego-less playing, but I think a large amount of that can be accredited to the nature of his instrument. It's incredibly difficult to really integrate a horn into electronic sound. Still, Okura does well here - especially on the second track (for me, the highlight of the disc) and the short duo with Muller towards the end. The only previous experience I've had with Okura is the "Dub Sonic Roots meets Nerve Net Noise" album on Zero Gravity which I thought was pretty mediocre (maybe just poorly recorded). Is there a much better Dub Sonic Roots album I should hear? All in all, I think 'Metal Tastes Like Orange' is a really good album but not quite on par with the self-titled I.S.O. disc (my album of the year) or 'Filament 2' on For 4 Ears. I haven't had the chance to listen to either the new Fennesz or Pita discs, but the favorable reviews here are making me really look forward to them. -Tom Pratt listening to: Jimi Hendrix - Band Of Gypsies ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Pratt Subject: Re: Great American Mavericks/Glass & Carny Date: 27 Oct 1999 20:52:47 -0700 (PDT) --- Jeni Dahmus wrote: > I felt that the score followed the film well and was > very moving. My friend hated it and found the music > relentless. Perhaps it's a matter of taste... Yeah, I gave the 'Dracula' disc a listen and was pretty bored. Ended up giving it to a friend... It's a shame, I think, the path that Glass' music has taken. His early work was so great. -Tom Pratt ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: s~Z Subject: Rob Blakeslee In Ventura CA Date: 27 Oct 1999 21:18:49 -0700 The new issue of pfMENTUM is available for free download at the pfMENTUM website: http://www.jetlink.net/~pfmentum It features an interview with composer/trumpet player Rob Blakeslee and info about his upcoming performance at City Hall in Ventura, California. There are also Real Audio excerpts of the new Jeff Kaiser/Woody Aplanalp CD (Asphalt Buddhas, pfMENTUM CD003) for your listening enjoyment. Thanks, Keith and Jeff pfmentum@jetlink.net - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: numbats@iinet.net.au Subject: Re: Ross Bolleter Date: 28 Oct 1999 14:17:43 +0800 hi, I am your token 'Aussie'. Ross used to live round here, in fact I am pretty sure he still does. Here is Western Australia, which is like Texas only without the people, and dare I say it, 'bigger than Texas. I will ask around and find out what he is up to and get back to 'y' all'. Musically I haven't seen anything for quite some time, but his stuff was usually on cassettes. Billy > Anyone heard anything by this guy? As near as I can tell (I may be way > off), he's a contemporary Australian composer who, at least sometimes, > writes for pianos which have been left out in the elements for lengthy > periods of time. I suppose you could call it "cured" piano as opposed > to "prepared". I think he also composes for accordion, straight or > weather-battered, I don't know. > > We have an Aussie or two on board, eh? Someone must have heard him! > > Brian Olewnick > > (NYC Tower's downtown store actually has a vacant section for him in > the classical department) > > >- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Richard@rcvs.org.uk Subject: Horny electronics Date: 28 Oct 1999 09:37:33 +0100 > Okura's sax is a bit of a sore thumb to the otherwise > ego-less playing, but I think a large amount of that > can be accredited to the nature of his instrument. > It's incredibly difficult to really integrate a horn > into electronic sound. Agreed. Those who have an interest might like to hear VHF's recent release on erstwhile (http://www.erstwhile.com) on which a classic sax-bass-drum trio take a lead from contemporary electronics rather than jazz to create something perplexing and oddly beautiful. The drummer uses a tone generator to add a pinch of electronics, but it really is mostly acoustic, notwithstanding what it sounds like. A review and sound clip will be in the next (musings) update. Rich (musings): reviews (with MP3s) of new improv, free jazz and avant-electronic releases. http://come.to/musings.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Pratt Subject: re: new purchases Date: 28 Oct 1999 08:04:53 -0700 (PDT) --- Alexander Blok wrote: > > I think the new Fennesz disc is a solid step forward > from 'Hotel Paral.llel'. The texture of the digital > drone has become much more refined, but there's > hardly a trace of the Techno element which used to > motor some of his tracks. Well, the thing is is that Fennesz is coming as much from musique concrete of the contemporary classical world as he is underground dance music of the '80s and early '90s. To me, the techno/dance element that occasionally emerges on 'Hotel Paral_lel' isn't a cheap way of motoring the more abstract passages but is instead a very natural coming-together of his influences. Still, I haven't had the chance to listen to the new one yet. -Tom Pratt ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JonAbbey2@aol.com Subject: Re: Horny electronics Date: 28 Oct 1999 12:17:06 EDT In a message dated 10/28/99 6:01:13 AM, Richard@rcvs.org.uk writes: << Agreed. Those who have an interest might like to hear VHF's recent release on erstwhile (http://www.erstwhile.com) on which a classic sax-bass-drum trio take a lead from contemporary electronics rather than jazz to create something perplexing and oddly beautiful. The drummer uses a tone generator to add a pinch of electronics, but it really is mostly acoustic, notwithstanding what it sounds like. A review and sound clip will be in the next (musings) update. >> the web site's actually at www.erstwhilerecords.com, in case anyone follows Rich's link and is confused. Jon - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: ALexander Blok Subject: re: new purchases Date: 28 Oct 1999 15:59:46 -0400 (EDT) > > I think the new Fennesz disc is a solid step forward > > from 'Hotel Paral.llel'. The texture of the digital > > drone has become much more refined, but there's > > hardly a trace of the Techno element which used to > > motor some of his tracks. > Well, the thing is is that Fennesz is coming as much > from musique concrete of the contemporary classical > world as he is underground dance music of the '80s and > early '90s. To me, the techno/dance element that > occasionally emerges on 'Hotel Paral_lel' isn't a > cheap way of motoring the more abstract passages but > is instead a very natural coming-together of his > influences. Hmm, well, I didn't mean to imply any sense of "cheapness" when I wrote Fennesz used Techno as a motor on HP. I intended motor to mean two things really. First, that he accomplishes, like you said, a coming-together of musique-concrete and techno (let's not forget rock). That is, as one component under the hood. But also, in the sense that "motor" implies movement ---> rhythm. Any feeling of rhythm one can derive out of HP for the most part points to...the obvious... -eric. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Orangejazz@aol.com Subject: RE: Jewish Soul/American Beat Date: 28 Oct 1999 16:03:29 EDT a bit more information : it includes some interview clips with Steve Reich, about his experience. from, matt - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Pratt Subject: re: new purchases Date: 28 Oct 1999 15:53:38 -0700 (PDT) --- ALexander Blok wrote: > > Hmm, well, I didn't mean to imply any sense of > "cheapness" when I wrote Fennesz used Techno as a > motor on HP. I intended motor to mean two things > really. First, that he accomplishes, like you said, > a coming-together of musique-concrete and techno > (let's not forget rock). That is, as one component > under the hood. But also, in the sense that "motor" > implies movement ---> rhythm. Any feeling of rhythm > one can derive out of HP for the most part points > to...the obvious... Ok, I'm a little confused... What is "the obvious"? Are you saying that the more techno/dance sections in 'Hotel Paral_lel' are predictable and uninteresting? What exactly are you saying? -Tom Pratt ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: numbats@iinet.net.au Subject: Re: Ross Bolleter Date: 29 Oct 1999 08:47:44 +0800 >hi, > I am your token 'Aussie'. Ross used to live round here, in fact I am >pretty sure he still does. Here is Western Australia, which is like Texas >only without the people, and dare I say it, 'bigger than Texas. >I will ask around and find out what he is up to and get back to 'y' all'. >Musically I haven't seen anything for quite some time, but his stuff was >usually on cassettes. >Billy hi, I rang him up last night. He is here in Perth, Western Australia. He has just returned from New Zealand where he has been teaching Zen, which is his other 'passion'. When he is not teaching, his music is what he does. He tells me he has just done 2 cds and will let me have details of them and other stuff from the past since "Austral voices" - a long time ago. Billy - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: e Subject: prelapse etc... Date: 29 Oct 1999 12:16:09 -0700 I finally got the new Prelapse cd from tzadik, really pretty amazing they truely do "shred" those naked city tunes, as well as their own. Mr. Wendell does a better Eye than...well Eye! o.k. well better than mike patton anyway, and all while ripping some pretty impressive bass. This cd definately fills a void for me left after the demise of that zorn project. If you liked Torture Garden, and Radio pick it up for sure you won't be dissapointed. On another note (shameless self promotion) our Cortex Bomb cd has been getting some reviews...we certainly count Zorn high on our list of influences, here is a review from Magnet's Fred Mills http://www.tucsonweekly.com/tw/current/qscans.html if you are interested visit our website for some freebies mp3 style, and other nonsense. http://www.mockbrawn.com/bands/cortex/ we welcome cd trades... pasta, Eric - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Handley" Subject: 99 Hooker (more horny electronics) Date: 29 Oct 1999 19:52:08 GMT Who is this guy/gal, and what has (s)he done outside Bible Launcher and the duo disc on Ltd. Sedition? What are the live shows like, w/ electronics, etc? I understand 99 Hooker has some interactive CDs out: what are they like and how can they be acquired? ---s, inquisitive/acquisitive ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Rich Williams Subject: Re: oh yeah i should tell u where its posted Date: 26 Oct 1999 18:47:46 -0400 >Hey, > >I checked deja.com for the newsgroup and I didn't find the dave >douglas show. Is there somewhere on the web that it resides? Most people who post mp3's, pirated software, or whatever, put an extra line in their header so that Deja news will not archive the posting. You need a dedicated newsreader that connects to your ISP's Usenet server, or a third party provider like Supernews. Good programs are Agent on the PC, and Newswatcher on the mac, though I'd bet that the Douglas mp3's have expired by now.....:-( - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Ljova" Subject: Intro Date: 30 Oct 1999 10:14:00 -0400 Dear Zorn List: Well, I've been lurking on the list for about two-three weeks now, and thought that it might be time for an introduction. My name is Ljova, and I'm a New-York based composer and violist. I was born in Moscow, Russia, and moved here 10 years ago. Currently, I'm a student at Juilliard (for viola), and will be graduating in May. As a composer, I write whenever I have the time, or the irresistable urge to do so. (School and freelancing take a huge bite out of my time.) My compositions are very diverse in styles, orchestration and concept. At the same time, it can be said that the majority of them are rather short. (Maximum duration is maybe 15 minutes; minimum 30 seconds.) Lately, I've been writing a sinful lot of New-Agey sounding stuff, but I think that phase is on its way out. As a violist, I've been freelancing in and around town (NYC, that is) for a while, and have done lots of really cool and interesting work. Of interest to the Zorn list might be my two-year stint with the Absolute Ensemble, as well as some appearances at HERE. Of the more "uptown" stuff, I've also played with the Orchestra of St. Luke's, and The Wild Ginger Philharmonic. I've also played some sessions... I've signed up to the Zorn list to see what is happening in "Downtown" music, and, thankfully, I'm receiving quite an education. It's wonderful to see concert notices, reviews, and discussions! Until now, I haven't seen many downtown events, but I am now making more of an effort. I'm good friends with Todd Reynolds (violinist), and generally attend whatever he recommends. It would be nice, of course, to have a greater familiarity with the downtown scene -- which is why I'm here. I own two of Zorn's CD's -- "Music for Children" and "String Quartets". They are both very interesting, and very varied. Some pieces I like a lot, others not as much. But that can change during years of repeated listenning, and/or acquiring his other works. If you're interested in knowing more, hearing my music, or just have some time to kill, feel free to visit my website, http://www.Ljova.com, which was just updated with some new stuff. Let me know what you think! Thanks for reading, please continue sharing! :) Regards, Ljova -------- Lev "Ljova" Zhurbin L@Ljova.com http://www.Ljova.com "Do not fear mistakes - there are none." -Miles Davis - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: infolit Subject: Jazz on CD-ROM Date: 31 Oct 1999 09:47:53 +0100 Hello! Who is interested in Jazz on CD-ROM? I am interested in various artists: from Louis Armstrong to Weather Report. For trading I have a small collection of CD-ROMs. If you are interested, please send me your lists, questions and offers. Igor Balenko Jazz_collectors List Owner Web-site: Mailing list: e-mail: - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Perfect Sound Forever Subject: Keiji Haino, Ganelin Trio, Charlie Mingus articles Date: 31 Oct 1999 09:59:47 -0500 Greetings, In the latest edition of Perfect Sound Forever , you'll find (among other things): * Ganelin Trio- Year Zero in the Soviet Union How this fierce jazz ensemble survived the Iron Curtain * Keiji Haino The mysterious sorcerer attacks with guitar mayhem * Charlie Mingus in the '70's The Taurus in Winter: the final years We're always looking for good material so let us know if you have any writing or ideas for upcoming issues. See you online, Jason Perfect Sound Forever online music magazine perfect-sound@furious.com http://www.furious.com/perfect - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Stephen Fruitman Subject: Friedlander Film Music Date: 31 Oct 1999 17:44:08 +0100 I just received a copy of an animated short feature entitled _Silence_, by Sylvie Bringas and Orly Yadin, from its Swedish co-producer. In a mere ten minutes it manages a brilliant and poetic description of a young girl=B4s grappling with her identity as a survivor from Auschwitz, rescued at the end of the war and brought to Sweden. Highly recommended. I have no idea if the film is available through any retail outlets yet, but I will get back to the list when I find out. Of interest to the list is the fact that the score features Erik =46riedlander on solo cello throughout. According to the credits, the text and music are adapted from a piece entitled "Through the Silence: Concerto for Cello and Survivor" by Noa Alin. If anyone has any further information to offer about this piece, I=B4d be grateful if you got in touch. Stephen Fruitman -------------------------- Bj=F6rn Olsson, Inst. f=F6r id=E9historia, Ume=E5 universitet 901 87 Ume=E5 tel. 090-7867982 fax 143374 e-post: bjorn.olsson@idehist.umu.se - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Stephen Fruitman Subject: Zorn "Defense" Letters Date: 31 Oct 1999 18:01:37 +0100 Someone (Steve Smith?) mentioned that the week after the Schatz article on Zorn, three critical letters to the editor were printed in the NYT, one of them by Dave Douglas. =46or my own research purposes, I wonder if there is anyone out there who could photocopy those letters for me (unless they are online, and you can point me at the right site)? E-mail me privately if you can do me that favour. All the best, Stephen ------------------ Bj=F6rn Olsson, Inst. f=F6r id=E9historia, Ume=E5 universitet 901 87 Ume=E5 tel. 090-7867982 fax 143374 e-post: bjorn.olsson@idehist.umu.se - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Caleb T. Deupree" Subject: ross bolleter Date: 31 Oct 1999 13:17:13 -0500 A big coincidence that after the recent discussions here about the Australian composer Ross Bolleter that a new album of his is reviewed in Cadence (of all places). Sadly they don't list it in their center section, but FWIW the album is called Crow Country, it's on Warps, it includes five pieces, including one pieces for ruined piano, two pieces with bass (different players on each piece), one piece for solo accordion, and one piece for ruined piano and live tape manipulation. They give it amazingly high marks, considering it doesn't sound like their usual fare. I'm looking forward to picking this up somewhere. -- Caleb Deupree cdeupree@erinet.com It is pretty obvious that the debasement of the human mind caused by a constant flow of fraudulent advertising is no trivial thing. There is more than one way to conquer a country. -- Raymond Chandler - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Scott Handley" Subject: haino/brotzmann: !#?* Date: 31 Oct 1999 18:21:44 GMT This is from the nice PERFECT SOUND FOREVER article on Haino, which seems like a nice, even critical overview of Haino's recorded work: "And perhaps, one day, the recording of Fushitsusha playing with Peter Brotzmann will see daylight. (Haino acknowledges its existence, but says it's not scheduled for release.)" Oh my god. Could this be? The end of the world? Or of global capital? Also, John Corbett has spoken of a Milford Graves/William Parker/ Peter Brotzmann trio which has played in the states at times. This is another grouping which makes me wonder why the label owners aren't chasing down tapes...alas, so much music, so little time... -----s, ruminatin' ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: bruce estey Subject: Hello. Cobra? Date: 31 Oct 1999 18:46:44 -0500 Hello and sorry if this offends anyone; I just joined the list and I am searching for a printable version of the "rules"(guidelines) for Cobra, zorn's musical game. I would like to start working with it with a few fellow musicians in my area, and cannot seem to locate anything more than descriptions. I could wing it, but if anyone can help me with this I would really appreciate it. Thanks ilbruce@lynxus.com -