From xmission.com!zorn-list-digest-request Mon Apr 29 18:08:06 1996 Return-Path: Received: from xmission.xmission.com by tfs.com (smail3.1.28.1) with SMTP id m0uE3ej-0003wlC; Mon, 29 Apr 96 17:51 PDT Received: (from root@localhost) by xmission.xmission.com (8.7.5/8.7.5) id SAA06466; Mon, 29 Apr 1996 18:38:00 -0600 (MDT) Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 18:38:00 -0600 (MDT) From: zorn-list-digest-request@xmission.com Message-Id: <199604300038.SAA06466@xmission.xmission.com> Subject: zorn-list-digest Digest V96 #15 X-Loop: zorn-list-digest@xmission.com X-Mailing-List: archive/volume96/15 Precedence: list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/digest; boundary="----------------------------" To: zorn-list-digest@xmission.com Status: RO ------------------------------ Content-Type: text/plain zorn-list-digest Digest Volume 96 : Issue 15 Today's Topics: Mike Patton cd [ Torsten Nielsen ] classic guides [ john shiurba ] Re: classic guides [ Egg1000@aol.com ] Re: Mike Patton cd [ chowdrhd@usa.pipeline.com ] Re: classic guides [ BarryGilb@aol.com ] New Jon Rose? [ BarryGilb@aol.com ] Re: classic guides [ john shiurba ] Re: classic guides [ "Patrice L. Roussel" ] Re: opinions [ "Patrice L. Roussel" ] Ikue Mori again [ Bob Boster ] ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Apr 1996 17:19:44 +0200 (METDST) From: Torsten Nielsen To: zorn list Subject: Mike Patton cd Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII How is the Mike Patton solo cd? Is there any overdubs or effects? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Apr 1996 18:29:38 +0200 (GMT+0200) From: Teemu To: zorn list Subject: Re: Mike Patton cd Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Sun, 28 Apr 1996, Torsten Nielsen wrote: > How is the Mike Patton solo cd? Is there any overdubs or effects? Hey wait! What Mike Patton solo CD? Tell me more! teemu from Teemu ----> tkorpipa@siba.fi ------------------------------------------------------------------ REASSURANCE PANEL In case of doubt, confusion of alarm, please touch this panel. ++++++++++++ + HI THERE + ++++++++++++ At times of stress it is often reassuring to make physical contact with friendly objects. This panel is your friend. - Douglas Adams - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Apr 1996 14:06:05 +0000 From: john shiurba To: zorn-list@xmission.com Subject: classic guides Message-ID: <31837B4D.23C1@sfo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i saw that the reissue of 'classic guide to strategy 1 & 2' is out. has anyone got it, and can you tell me what they have cut out to make it fit on one cd? shiurba ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Apr 1996 18:15:58 -0400 From: Egg1000@aol.com To: zorn-list@xmission.com Subject: Re: classic guides Message-ID: <960428181558_282750325@emout08.mail.aol.com> I've never seen (or heard) the original, so I can't say what might be missing from the original release, but the track listing on the reissue is as follows... 1. Part One 19:40 2. Part Two (Cartoon Music) 19:43 3. Aoyama Michi 11:10 4. Enoken 3:20 5. Katsumi Shigeru 6:28 6. Kondo Toshinori 5:55 7. Togawa Jun 8:48 8. Mori Ikue 2:28 ...nothing is mentioned in the liner notes about missing tracks, but I would be interested to know what, if anything, was actually left off. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Apr 1996 22:29:10 GMT From: chowdrhd@usa.pipeline.com To: Cc: zorn-list@xmission.com Subject: Re: Mike Patton cd Message-Id: <199604282229.WAA09198@pipe18.h1.usa.pipeline.com> On Sun, Apr 28, 1996 12.00.00 am, Torsten Nielsen wrote: >How is the Mike Patton solo cd? Is there any overdubs or effects? godhead. it apparently was recorded in different hotel rooms around the world and yes, there are overdubs and effects...basically, the thing is a lot of fun, if that's ok to say on this list--you might need to already have an affinity for patton- if you're not already into him, you may hate it. for instance, i mentioned the album to my roommate, who thinks "faith no more" when you say "mike patton" and even though i tried to tell him it was great, he wasn't even into hearing it...but he's an extreme case:) i don't know what he used for the effects, i don't have the album, another friend does. just wanted to let you know that it's great...i lack the vocabulary and musical education to effecctively critique or even describe the album, but thre are folks on here that can, and i'm hoping they'll speak up as well. any upcoming zorn for the west coast (more specifically sf) ? not that i could afford it... ciao, chowderhead ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Apr 1996 22:55:19 -0400 From: BarryGilb@aol.com To: zorn-list@xmission.com Subject: Re: classic guides Message-ID: <960428225518_480311511@emout08.mail.aol.com> In a message dated 96-04-28 18:22:17 EDT, you write: >I've never seen (or heard) the original, so I can't say what might be missing >from the original release, but the track listing on the reissue is as >follows... >1. Part One 19:40 >2. Part Two (Cartoon Music) 19:43 >3. Aoyama Michi 11:10 >4. Enoken 3:20 >5. Katsumi Shigeru 6:28 >6. Kondo Toshinori 5:55 >7. Togawa Jun 8:48 >8. Mori Ikue 2:28 >...nothing is mentioned in the liner notes about missing tracks, but I would >be interested to know what, if anything, was actually left off. That's the complete list of original tracks. The first two were from Vol 1. The rest are from Vol 2, named for Asian musicians/artists he's known. Th original of Vol 2 has their pictures on the back. Where did you get your copy? I've got mine on order from CDNow and expect it's arrival (along with Filmwork 2) within a week. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Apr 1996 23:00:34 -0400 From: BarryGilb@aol.com To: Zorn-list@xmission.com Subject: New Jon Rose? Message-ID: <960428230033_480314898@emout09.mail.aol.com> Has anyone heard the new Jon Rose release, _Eine Violine Fur Valentine_? It's quite twisted! :-) The lyrics are all in German, but they're translated in the liner notes. I haven't heard much else of his before; just a little of an early release with just about everyone from downtown NY during the mid-80's. If I'm not mistaken, he's also played a bit with E. Chadbourne. Any suggestions regarding further exploration of his recordings? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Apr 1996 23:12:28 +0000 From: john shiurba To: zorn-list Subject: Re: classic guides Message-ID: <3183FB5C.A11@sfo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > I've never seen (or heard) the original, so I can't say what might be missing > from the original release, but the track listing on the reissue is as > follows... > 1. Part One 19:40 > 2. Part Two (Cartoon Music) 19:43 > 3. Aoyama Michi 11:10 > 4. Enoken 3:20 > 5. Katsumi Shigeru 6:28 > 6. Kondo Toshinori 5:55 > 7. Togawa Jun 8:48 > 8. Mori Ikue 2:28 > ...nothing is mentioned in the liner notes about missing tracks, but I would > be interested to know what, if anything, was actually left off. > > thanks for the info. what's left off is a track from volume two titled "yano akiko" (5:20) shiurba ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 08:37:08 -0700 From: "Patrice L. Roussel" To: BarryGilb@aol.com Cc: zorn-list@xmission.com, proussel@ichips.intel.com Subject: Re: classic guides Message-Id: <9604291537.AA05743@pdx144.intel.com> On Sun, 28 Apr 1996 22:55:19 -0400 barrygilb@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 96-04-28 18:22:17 EDT, you write: > > >I've never seen (or heard) the original, so I can't say what might be > missing > >from the original release, but the track listing on the reissue is as > >follows... > >1. Part One 19:40 > >2. Part Two (Cartoon Music) 19:43 > >3. Aoyama Michi 11:10 > >4. Enoken 3:20 > >5. Katsumi Shigeru 6:28 > >6. Kondo Toshinori 5:55 > >7. Togawa Jun 8:48 > >8. Mori Ikue 2:28 > >...nothing is mentioned in the liner notes about missing tracks, but I would > >be interested to know what, if anything, was actually left off. > > That's the complete list of original tracks. The first two were from Vol 1. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Close, but not completely. > The rest are from Vol 2, named for Asian musicians/artists he's known. Th > original of Vol 2 has their pictures on the back. > > Where did you get your copy? I've got mine on order from CDNow and expect > it's arrival (along with Filmwork 2) within a week. > > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 08:29:05 -0700 From: "Patrice L. Roussel" To: Egg1000@aol.com Cc: zorn-list@xmission.com, proussel@ichips.intel.com Subject: Re: classic guides Message-Id: <9604291529.AA15428@pdx144.intel.com> On Sun, 28 Apr 1996 18:15:58 -0400 egg1000@aol.com wrote: > > I've never seen (or heard) the original, so I can't say what might be missing > from the original release, but the track listing on the reissue is as > follows... > 1. Part One 19:40 > 2. Part Two (Cartoon Music) 19:43 > 3. Aoyama Michi 11:10 > 4. Enoken 3:20 > 5. Katsumi Shigeru 6:28 > 6. Kondo Toshinori 5:55 > 7. Togawa Jun 8:48 > 8. Mori Ikue 2:28 One track is missing from the second volume: 5/ Yano Akiko (Zorn) 5:20 > ...nothing is mentioned in the liner notes about missing tracks, but I would > be interested to know what, if anything, was actually left off. > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 11:47:46 -0500 (EST) From: plantarm To: zorn-list@xmission.com Subject: opinions Message-id: <01I442IS6FGU001A83@WABASH.EDU> Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT hi, i'm looking for opinions on a few recordings. i figured this might be a good list to ask... painkiller "guts of a virgin" melt banana- anything by them ruins- their new one, i can't spell the title from memory! peter brotzmann "dare devil" and "machine gun" if you know these recordings, please expound in as much detail as you have time for. eric M. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 10:11:43 -0700 From: "Patrice L. Roussel" To: plantarm Cc: zorn-list@xmission.com, proussel@ichips.intel.com Subject: Re: opinions Message-Id: <9604291711.AA26766@pdx144.intel.com> On Mon, 29 Apr 1996 11:47:46 -0500 (EST) musalle@wabash.edu wrote: > > hi, i'm looking for opinions on a few recordings. i figured this might > be a good list to ask... > > painkiller "guts of a virgin" > melt banana- anything by them There is not too much by them. One CD on a US label (Touch and Go?). They play on CHIPFARM, a Hoppy Kamiyama project. They are (like any Japanese band) on numerious compilations. Their US CD is fairly faithful to their live performance. > ruins- their new one, i can't spell the title from memory! Get SAISORO, their "duo" with Derek Bailey (on Tzadik). It is not rock, it is not improv, it is something between. One of my favorite records of last year (one from which I did not expect anything). This collaboration is just incredible. Who could have imagine that Ruins and Bailey could have anything to say to each others? Zorn thought so; he was right beyond our wildest expections. > peter brotzmann "dare devil" and "machine gun" ^^^^^^^^^^^ A must! The equivalent of KIND OF BLUE for the modern jazz adventurer :-). An incredible record!!! One of my all time favorites. I used to play it a lot; I still do. And the CD reissue has alternate takes! You imagine that, alternate takes of Machine Gun!!! Could you belive the producer saying: "Hum... I think it was a little bit wimpy; could you play it again with more energy?". > if you know these recordings, please expound in as much detail as you have > time for. > > eric M. > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 96 19:20:58 CET From: Marcin Gokieli To: Zorn list Subject: Trade offer Message-Id: <199604291730.LAA15361@xmission.xmission.com> Hello, Is somebody intrested in getting Wayne Horvitz&pigpen 'Live in Poland' cd? I wo uld volountery trade it for some masada (except the second) or Dr.Nerve, or bar rondown (I've seen a GREAT show by them in Bydgoszcz, Poland), or something equ ally interesting. It's an semi - official release - it was sold with a jazz mag azine from here. It's long- about 70 minutes. Personnaly, i prefer the studio versions the tunes (not all of them- 'miss ann' is much better live). There' s also a number of good polish bands- if anybody is interested, i could tape a co mpilation( for exaple a great live cd of a band called 'Milosc' with Lester Bow ie) As the list in a kind of 'morals-ethics' discussion, i'd like to mention that m y offer is not ethicaly correct. I pay only few $ for the cd. But i think that compared to the sums of money we earn, it's Ok- remeber that we use to get 300$ a month here and a Zorn CD costs nearly 20$ here(if you can find it). And please, remember that not everybody on the list is from New York. You know, when i read stuff like 'masada with frisell was nothing special', when i can see each of these guys every two years, it's not a good joke. ;-) Keep on hunting for the snark, Marcin Gokieli Ps. I adressed my offer to Patrice, as we had a discussion about Locus Solus, a nd , of course, he has that album. (thanks for responding, Patrice!) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 10:42:06 -0700 From: "Patrice L. Roussel" To: zorn-list@xmission.com Cc: proussel@ichips.intel.com Subject: anybody knows the magazine CARBON 14? Message-Id: <9604291742.AA15379@pdx144.intel.com> I just got a copy of the magazine CARBON 14 (issue #7, with an interview of Elliott Sharp and a 7" with Wayne Horvitz, Zeena Parkins, William Hooker, etc). Two questions: 1/ when was this issue released? 2/ who else has appeared in the previous issues/7" (I also have the issue #4)? Thanks, Patrice. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 96 19:47:35 CET From: Marcin Gokieli To: Zorn List Subject: Downtown scene & King Crimson Message-Id: <199604291758.LAA24341@xmission.xmission.com> Hello, There is one thing i cannot understand. Why is there no connection (at least, i don't know of any) between Robert Fripp and Zorn, Frisell etc.? what is more strange (for me)is that there is practically no talk about RF&kc here, and not a single word on Zorn etc. on Elephant talk, the crimso list. Don't you find it strange? Does everybody here leaves a party when he hears, fo r example , 'discipline'(which is, btw my favourite record)? I can't beleive it ! Imagine a Fripp-Frisell Band!!! Keep on Hunting for the Snark, Marcin Gokieli ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 96 11:29:56 PST From: "Allen Huotari" To: zorn-list@xmission.com Subject: Re: Trade offer Message-Id: <9603298308.AA830802870@smtpgate.tais.com> well, unless someone else has taken Marcin up on this offer, I'll gladly arrange a trade Marcin, contact me off the list if the offer is still available allenh@smtpgate.tais.com ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Trade offer Author: zorn-list@xmission.com at smtpgate Date: 4/29/96 11:03 AM Hello, Is somebody intrested in getting Wayne Horvitz&pigpen 'Live in Poland' cd? I wo uld volountery trade it for some masada (except the second) or Dr.Nerve, or bar rondown (I've seen a GREAT show by them in Bydgoszcz, Poland), or something equ ally interesting. It's an semi - official release - it was sold with a jazz mag azine from here. It's long- about 70 minutes. Personnaly, i prefer the studio versions the tunes (not all of them- 'miss ann' is much better live). There' s also a number of good polish bands- if anybody is interested, i could tape a co mpilation( for exaple a great live cd of a band called 'Milosc' with Lester Bow ie) As the list in a kind of 'morals-ethics' discussion, i'd like to mention that m y offer is not ethicaly correct. I pay only few $ for the cd. But i think that compared to the sums of money we earn, it's Ok- remeber that we use to get 300$ a month here and a Zorn CD costs nearly 20$ here(if you can find it). And please, remember that not everybody on the list is from New York. You know, when i read stuff like 'masada with frisell was nothing special', when i can see each of these guys every two years, it's not a good joke. ;-) Keep on hunting for the snark, Marcin Gokieli Ps. I adressed my offer to Patrice, as we had a discussion about Locus Solus, a nd , of course, he has that album. (thanks for responding, Patrice!) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 16:06:27 -0400 From: Egg1000@aol.com To: zorn-list@xmission.com Subject: Re: Trade offer & Opinions... Message-ID: <960429160626_385848713@emout07.mail.aol.com> The Pigpen "Live In Poland" CD has been reissued here in the States... before its reissue, I had been searching quite extensively for it, so it is too bad that we did not cross paths earlier. I actually prefer the live versions over the studio versions of their compositions... Brotzmann's "Machine Gun" is absolutely essential, as it documents possibly the finest hour in the birth of the current European avant garde jazz mind set (which has since made its presence felt in any quality avant garde music)... likening it to "Kind Of Blue" makes sense, as would likening it to "Sgt. Peppers Lonely Hearts Club Band," or something else to that effect. One of the finest recordings of all time, in terms of its every aspect... the compositions, the musicians, the emotion, the artistry... don't pass on "Machine Gun" the next time that you have the chance to pick it up. Ruins, to my ears at least, have shown themselves capable of sheer brilliance as well... I regard their "Burning Stone" Shimmy Disc recording to be essential listening as well. Their Tzadik sessions with Bailey on "Saisoro" are amazing, as were the sessions with a Ruins side project (Yoshida and Masuda plus keys, guitar, and female vocals) called Hundred Sights Of Koenji (which were released last year on God Mountain). I pick up anything that Yoshida is involved with (a steadily growing and already expansive collection), and can honestly say that all of his discs are of high quality, and can only be judged in reference to one another. The one caveat would be for the recently released Tzadik CD "Jehova" by a Yoshida vocal trio called Zubi Zuva, which is truthfuly the first project of his that is less than sterling, and is something that I will probably not be spinning in the CD player again anytime soon. It doesn't matter though, as I'm still not through ingesting the other most recent additions to the Yoshida collection, which come in the form of his recorded output (three CD's worth) with the band YBO2. Painkiller are a pretty amazing bunch, in all of their various guises. Their first three, "Guts Of A Virgin," "Buried Secrets," and "Rituals" are all hefty doses of extreme terror jazz, with pounding bass, super heavy drums, and shrieking sax. Their most recent triple disc endeavor "Burial Ground" reveals a different side in that they employ many aspects of ambient and dub into their style, tone down on the harshness, and really just jam. The third disc of the set, a live recording, takes the new turn one step further by adding some rumble and nastiness to the ambient realms. Excellent stuff, all of it. Start with the live "Rituals" or the triplr disc "Burial Ground" (and be sure not to cheat yourself out of disc three by purchasing the American version). ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 14:45:09 +0000 From: john shiurba To: zorn-list Subject: Re: opinions Message-ID: <3184D5F5.6A58@sfo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit patrice: > > ruins- their new one, i can't spell the title from memory! > > Get SAISORO, their "duo" with Derek Bailey (on Tzadik). It is not rock, it > is not improv, it is something between. One of my favorite records of last > year (one from which I did not expect anything). This collaboration is > just incredible. Who could have imagine that Ruins and Bailey could have > anything to say to each others? Zorn thought so; he was right beyond our > wildest expections. > i'll second this recommendation, this combo works extremely well, and i was (like patrice) a bit dubious before hearing it. > > peter brotzmann "dare devil" and "machine gun" > ^^^^^^^^^^^ > > A must! The equivalent of KIND OF BLUE for the modern jazz adventurer :-). > An incredible record!!! One of my all time favorites. i'll second this sentiment, brotzmann's "machine gun" is certainly one of the all time classics. go get it, and turn the stereo up very loud. (if your neighbors are at all sane they'll probably call the police). shiurba ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 17:19:26 +48000 From: Bob Boster To: "Patrice L. Roussel" cc: zorn-list@xmission.com Subject: Ikue Mori again Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I posted on this a while back to no response, what's up with y'all? Tired of spitting out useful knowledge on demand... I'm looking for an Ikue Mori discography (with DNA stuff too, if possible). At the very least could someone mail me the title of her Tzadik release from last year? Thanks. Bob boster@ella.mills.edu -------------------------------- End of zorn-list-digest Digest V96 Issue #15 ********************************************